Remote work is here to stay long after the masks are gone along with the pandemic associated with it. In this episode Daniel and Pouya discuss the pros and cons of remote work as a permanent option for both employees and employers and offer their thoughts on how the process could be streamlined and made more productive.     Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript... ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS remote, home, industry, environment, employers, work, employees, literally, upper body, pandemic, online, office, hear, lead, certain industries, necessarily, mentioned, throughput, point, programmer SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:08 Hello, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to yet another episode of BTP podcast joined as always with Daniel Mulligan, how's it going, buddy? And my buddy   Dan  00:15 has one, how are you guess what it is the last day of the holiday for everyone, including those living in basically predominantly orthodox regions like Eastern Europe, Ukraine, Russia, Kazakhstan, and so many other countries, although I'm not sure if those those guys are Christians to ultimately, it's the end of all holidays. So if right now, you are not planning for some you know, going to work, chances are you're unemployed, because the pandemic, and therefore I'm really, really sorry to hear that.   Pouya LJ  00:43 That's true. That is a sad, sad reality of their current situation. And speaking of work, that's actually what we're going to talk about, but not just work, the future of work, which is, is the remote the future of work? Is that that's the main question. We were trying to ask him broadly, like, do you want to give your broad opinion? And then we delve into details after that?   Dan  01:03 Awesome very well, well, first of all, I do believe that the future of work is indeed remote. And the answer is very simple, because now we are already doing it at much lower costs. And then you have the governments who are going to incentivize this whole thing to protect the environment. So if you're an employer, you say, Well, I don't have to pay for the office buildings, or I can pay less, I can, I can hire fewer people. So I can actually pay for a smaller office hire fewer on site, and at the same time, the government is going to incentivize me to pay less in taxes. So why the heck not, let's try to do that actually, unless go for remote work. For that reason, I do believe that, ultimately, remote work is the future of the work, because it will be financially, basically practical. And at the same time, it is also going to lead to a better, you know, in revenue protection, which is definitely going to be important for most governments. So if the government's are going to lead people towards that direction, obviously, that will be the direction because nowadays, it's quite acceptable. I mean, if you remember, 510 20 years ago, this whole thing didn't even make sense, right? You you prove you did work, when you read the office, or you're the client, or if you wanted to set up a meeting on Skype or call, it oftentimes was a preparatory kind of meeting. So they actually set the real meeting later on meet the client in person, because it was kind of like, like a low value kind of behavior, if you did not want to show up like what there's something wrong with you want to steal my money or something or use like something cheating. So for that reason, the fact that this is now a complete norm, we are going to see a major increase in remote work, because now almost all companies around the world have tried it, they have gotten results out of it. And it's now officially a part of the culture, I guess. And for that reason, I believe it is going to be indeed the future of basically work for most of us.   Pouya LJ  02:53 No, it doesn't make a lot of sense. And I think there was a taboo prior to the pandemic about this remote work from all sides, not just employers with employees to thinking that you know what, it's not it's, I'm going to lose productivity. And that might have been true without prior proper preparation. And maybe in the beginning, people were thinking, yeah, this is not working, I'm working from a bit bed, and this is not. And then after they saw that, okay, they have to figure something out, set up the proper, you know, proper environment for themselves to work, maybe, I don't know, if a person who has kids now, that's annoying, because maybe that, you know, schools are closed, and you have to keep the kids to yourself, but if the environment is viable, I think personally, I experienced in many fields, it actually works out pretty great. Now I do teaching too. Now, that is not the best environment for online teaching. There's a there's, there's some degree to some barriers coming on, because of the lack of, you know, being in the same room physically together, perhaps, but generally speaking, in many of the cases, it does work, and perhaps there can be, you know, a hybrid of these two, okay.   Dan  03:59 That's the best I mean, because I really still believe if you make everyone work remotely, because I know a fair share of like programmers among my contacts. And I mean, their lifestyle is not necessarily going to be even acceptable by a lot of people who are more on the extroverted side, because it can be almost depressing. So I think a hybrid approach is probably a far better approach. Because in that situation, you kind of like spend, I don't know, two or three days at the office, and four days at home, and that way, of course, including the weekends, and that probably is going to be far more effective. Because you mentioned you know, working basically, and you're on your bed, well, there are a lot of things I want to do on my bed working is not one of them. Because I think I don't know, first of all, it's going to be very hygiene because you should probably see my bed. And secondly, it's going to lead to you know, from my point of view now, lack of focus because for me, the bad is a place where I do only one of two things and there's no other I mean like mentally that is there's an association basically with sleeping And the other type of sleeping, but so if you're, let's say, I don't know, bring your laptop and you're talking in a place that you bang your wife or girlfriend, I don't know, for me personally, that's not going to work out pretty well. Because it's going to create a lot of problems in terms of, you know, your mental Association. However, I do like the idea of working basically at home, if you create and designate a home office area, and if your home is small, it can, you know, allocate one entire room to your work, you can still assign a specific location in your home to, you know, basically work office, because there really is a psychological factor here. Because when you go to the office, you know, your brain has linked that environment to work. So your body is different, you know, acting differently, your mind and your focus is focused on different things and if you are in your bedroom, so even for those who work at home, they're definitely going to actually learn to come up with new ways to get ready to work at home efficiently. And I think that will then lead to creating a whole new industry that basically caters to you know, work at home and remote work, plus a lot of the training required for the staff to know how to make the most of their time at home, how to avoid distractions, and now is for someone reading a book called and distractible. And it talks about how, you know all the little steps required to make, you know, homework efficient. It's not that easy projects to work at home efficient, because it's so much easier to get distracted at home. And more apparently, there's less degree of basically control by the employers. Because you could say like, yeah, I'm online, I'm working. But you're not. I mean, as I've talked to a lot of my friends who have kids, and now almost all of them are sitting online. And I mean, you got to see what the mess that thing is man, like literally just keep things online. They pretend they're online, but they're not. Or they're looking at a screen with the camera and playing fortnight in the background. True story. By the way, I'm not just one of my, you know, friends, son just does this. But of course, if you are the teacher of that person, don't don't hate him. He's not the only one who's playing fortnight while looking at the webcam pretty like, Oh, yeah, great lesson. So for that reason, I believe there's going to be the need for a reform in the way we approach work, and extensive training and education for those who would like to work at home, both for the employers and the employees.   Pouya LJ  07:19 Really, what you're saying makes a lot of sense. Because yes, there are, you know, workarounds that you can start slacking and still not get penalized, perhaps, but then you can, you know, change how you're looking at. So for example, in a current situation, you're just, if, as a manager, office manager, whatever your method of you know, finding out if your employee is actually working or not, is just by looking at them. Maybe that's not the best approach anyways, because a lot of people don't respond to that. So maybe you want to look at their throughput, are they actually providing like doing the things that they're supposed to do? Maybe Miss metrically? Or, or just generally speaking? That's why perhaps in you know, software environment, like software development, it is much easier to actually assess these things. Because at the end of the day, you either push your code or you don't, you have to complete your project or you don't so it's so much easier to, you know, monitor those performances, wherever you are, you can be in Bahamas, I don't give a crap. As long as you do your work. Right. You know, so So yeah, you're absolutely right. And I think it's very industry dependent, perhaps hospitalities is not the best to be remote. That's the by nature, right? So   Dan  08:25 well, believe it or not, nowadays, we have seen almost all sorts of businesses going online. Sure, right. Having a much stronger online presence, even license. Nowadays, I've heard of like restaurants that are fully conducting things online, like you literally see the shift, so they send you the food, and then you'll log in with zoom, and you'll watch the chef cook things in front of you explaining things. So I mean, this is definitely going to affect even the kind of industry thought is almost impossible for it to be remote. But obviously, you're right, there are certain industries where that cannot necessarily work out well. But having, you know, experienced almost every business, pretty much move online or at least enhanced their online presence. I guess there's going to be a far more potential for remote work in almost all industries. To a certain degree, of course.   Pouya LJ  09:14 Yeah. And I couldn't agree more. And yes, my my point is that yes, some some, some industries are more acceptance and actually encouraging of remote work some less so. But it doesn't mean that they cannot look to industries that are less inclined to do remote work are not even possible for them. It doesn't mean that they cannot enhance their abilities. So for example, when even you went to the restaurant individually, like in person, you wouldn't get to see the chef necessarily some of them have open concept kitchens, but generally speaking, you wouldn't, right. So. So maybe that could be even for in person like that zoom or, you know, video stream can be on your table as well so you can anticipate your freaking food and get more hungry and hungrier.   Dan  09:57 That's possible to sell things I guess. Right, so   Pouya LJ  10:01 so I think it sparked a big, big, the whole, you know, pandemic and because circumstance sparked a big push for creativity in all of this, and which is a good thing, that's, that's the positive that can come out of all of this negative, I suppose. I don't know what your thoughts are on that.   Dan  10:17 I agree completely. Although let's be honest, personally, as an extrovert, who really loves going out, I really prefer, you know, a hybrid approach as you put it out yourself, because you cannot necessarily, from my point of view, go go on the either extremes, because if all work move fully online and fully remote, then yeah, this might literally change the way we approach work. And this could lead to its own problems. I mean, for example, now, social media is, you know, pretty much commonplace, everybody's on some sort of, you know, social media platform. And it is now the norm. So if you don't have a social media account, now you're a weirdo, like, 10 years ago, if you didn't have I don't know, Facebook, or Twitter, I don't know, let's say Instagram, or I don't know, something like that, you would have been quite okay. I mean, that was not like a necessity. So 10 years ago, many of my friends did not have I, myself was not basically on any Facebook platform 10 years ago. But nowadays, if someone is not on social media, you're like, dude, either you are weird, or you're cheating on somebody, and you don't want them to know about it. Like, it's just so like now a part of life. But at the same time, it's now proven that the more time we spend social media to higher our chances of you know, suffering from depression. So with every change comes a certain downturns and drawbacks that we have to deal with remote work has its own set of problems, it's going to challenge their problems to the employers, how are they going to be able to, you know, observe their employees in action? And how are they going to be able to judge and assess their performance to be able to, you know, handle this is just a result of deliver? How about in terms of safety and security, if you're working remotely, could this not easily be hacked, and then be used by others. There are many other, you know, facets when it comes to business and work in this situation that has to be literally addressed, which as I mentioned earlier, will lead to a whole new industry that offers services that, you know, somehow makes this whole process easier. And above all, as I mentioned earlier, it's really about us, are we the kind of basically workers who can actually work with discipline and regularity at home, or as you put it out, you're on your bed, and you're a programmer, and you start programming, and then the bag, you know, this whole bed reminds you of your last night and you start thinking like, that was very nice, and you look around and your wife lets her eyes and boom, before you know it, you're not you know, you're not making any basically coats, you're making babies. And that's not a good idea, because you're wanting to be working at that time, and not doing something weird. So for that reason, although not not not that we do not have cases of making babies at the office environment, as unfortunately, you've probably heard a lot, especially among the Wall Street staff members. But the point is you want basically to create the right education available for those who can actually work efficiently because my biggest issue with remote work is does it really deliver the same time? Yes, it saves on costs. Yes, it's a you know, protects our environment. But does it really deliver the same type of experience for both the clients and those who do the work? Or does it reduce the quality? And that for me is a big challenge.   Pouya LJ  13:21 That's a fair point. I think I think you're right on obviously, you want to have the same throughput you want their employer employees to you know, work as well. Maybe even better, perhaps if you can, but yes, you're absolutely right, that comes with a degree of education on both parts from the employers to employees all parties included even clients perhaps so that education doesn't have to be classroom setting necessarily, although it can be but culturally you know, as time passes, we learn how for example, if you're, if you don't have a good microphone and get a good headset for it, for instance, I mean, that could be one simple thing so we don't have to hear the sirens in the background whatever so I mean obviously there are you know, improvements that are going to be made in time and we can accelerate that by you know, organized education of some sorts from I'm right   Dan  14:06 now thinking about like changing fashion industry of those upper body only suits where you can literally wear your hands for anything and have like a suit like you're going to see like major changes like just imagine like the upper body only section like if you want to buy the clothes we haven't offered by the only for remote workers like literally and like they create this pajamas that are very comfy down below and like you will see a major shift in terms of how it affects every facet of and you know, every industry   Pouya LJ  14:34 I haven't been in by the way a pursuit only.   Dan  14:38 I mean, by the way, that's that's the patent idea. So if you want to steal the idea from us, you're gonna have to pay copyright. This is now any any any basically seller who would like to sell upper body only clothing must get a patent and recommendation basically from sorry guys just the way it is.   Pouya LJ  14:54 That's just the way this you know, intellectual property. It's not   Dan  14:58 It's not an upper body. Only suits and clothing, basically, work is for work is definitely a beyond the present podcast patent from now on.   Pouya LJ  15:08 No doubt, no doubt. No. But joking aside, I think I think you're absolutely right. It does make it does affect every single industry in the, in various different ways. Obviously some industries more so than others. But generally so for example, as you were mentioning, perhaps security could be more challenging because now you're, although we were always working on computers and networks, and they were all connected to the internet, but now you're transmitting everything through the internet. So maybe it's a little bit more challenging in that sense, maybe a lot more challenging, actually. So yes, of course, it's gonna affect everything. And perhaps in many cases, for the better, like, we have to improve our ways of living. And usually, it is hard to leave the status quo until you're really pushed out of it. We were, unfortunately by satins. And And typically, they are by sad incidences, so I don't I don't disagree with you. Now we discuss the pros and cons. However, now I want, we're coming to the end of the show, obviously, feel free to add anything that we didn't talk about, to, you know, gather everything together?   Dan  16:11 Well, first of all, it was a great topic about remote work, because ultimately, we've mentioned to our listeners, that remote work is the future of work, we should not look at this as a passing trend, I will that remote work is here to stay as is already demonstrated by many companies in Silicon Valley, who have already put this as a permanent part of their, basically human resource management. So they are definitely gonna implement this already as their permanent solutions. And of course, we're gonna see this happening all across the board. However, as you mentioned, yourself, certain industries are less compatible, certain types of careers, jobs services, basically are less compatible with remote work than the you know, certain ones that are a lot more basically compatible. But that doesn't mean that no industry is going to be spared from this trend, it is going to happen all across the board, basically. And we pointed out that the fact that this is going to happen, we are going to need basically a whole new industry, that is going to cater to remote work, offering certain types of, for example, home, basically work environments, how to create like a desk, that is not going to distract you at work. So maybe creating new ways of locking the sound for coming to the you know, the home office, or a lot of training to make sure that you know, the those who are working at home are doing so basically not on their bed, but hopefully in a place that is a lot more productive, basically, and to create that, you know, a culture of productivity at home, which probably needs additional training. But then again, in terms of the benefits of this, obviously, we're going to have, we're going to see a tremendous decline in traffic worldwide, which is then going to of course, reduce the carbon emission because the less commute we do, the less carbon emission we uncovered in our carbon footprint we will leave behind. So that's going to definitely improve the overall quality of basically our environment. And obviously, there's, there's definitely gonna be a lot of financial incentives to for both employers and employees. So whether we like it or not, I'm someone who's in the middle when it comes to remote work. I don't hate it. I don't love it in particular, either. But then again, even if you're like me, and you tend to be more on the social extroverted side, and you'd like to see a lot of people around, obviously, you still have to get used to this, you know, new way a new approach to work, because in the end, remote work is here to stay whether you like it or not.   Pouya LJ  18:37 Well said and I couldn't agree more, I think, one way or another, we're gonna see this more and more in the future, and perhaps sort of better. Again, I really do believe that. And thank you again, Dan, for joining us today. discuss this topic. And thank you. Yeah, it was amazing. And thank you everybody for listening in tuning in. And leave your comments. Leave your suggestions if you have any, and until later episode. Have a good one.

As we enter the year  2021 we do so with many lessons learned during the pandemic. In this episode Daniel and Pouya discuss what they learned from the year that went so that we could set the right tone for the year ahead.   Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript... ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS pandemic, people, life, year, personally, importantly, realize, situation, day, terms, pretty, eye opener, social, attention, panic, travel, colonoscopy, bit, pay, world SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello, and welcome back ladies and gentlemen to yet another edition of PTV podcast in the year 2021. Join as always with Daniel Mulligan, how's it going, buddy?   Dan  00:19 And man, buddy, how's it going? Happy New Year, it's great to talk to you. Now, of course, we just celebrated the new year, a couple of days ago. And it was super wonderful because personally for me, the new year is a big deal, because it's the probably the most important year when it comes to goal setting. As you probably know, I'm crazy about goal setting. So it's been a great year, despite all the limitations, the pandemic, which has made traveling or Party, which both of which I love a lot, a lot harder, unfortunately, still, we have to go through this. And fortunately, I managed to enjoy the you know, the New Year celebration, although on a much smaller scale, basically, to somehow make sure that I follow the health guidelines and do not end up you know, perhaps spreading the virus or something like this. But generally speaking, despite all the challenges, pretty happy to be here with you for the you know, our first less competition of the year 2021. So couldn't be more excited. Life is great, man. How about you? How is how's life basically, on your end?   Pouya LJ  01:18 Yeah, things are concerning everything things are going well, I think we have turned a new leaf by turning the page turning the chapter on to a new year, obviously, we still are having the struggles of COVID, whether directly or indirectly, ahead of us. I mean, not just me, everybody, really, but I think I think at least mentally, in terms of mindset, at least we're turning into a new year. So why not change our mindsets to? Would you? Would you agree with that?   Dan  01:49 Pretty good, pretty good?   01:50 Yeah, of course,   Dan  01:51 it's pretty good. And I don't know about the atmosphere, of course. But generally, in this situation, we gotta somehow change ourselves a little bit, although I'm not a fan of like, complete, like reprogramming our entire brain because it's not going to last forever, man. But we could change our way of thinking the way that we can take advantage the situation and not panic and wait it out until the storm passes.   Pouya LJ  02:13 know precisely that. And that is basically what I was trying to get at. Because the past year, I mean, in 2020, basically, everybody suffered a lot. And we experienced a lot of uncertainties on top of other, you know, stuff that were really annoying, and perhaps often for many people, outright upsetting, losing loved ones or whatever. So. So in that sense, I feel like coming to a new year, personally, I want to take a little bit of a more of a positive approach. Of course, it's not done with but as you mentioned, it will be at some point. And maybe for the better part of this year, we'll still deal with it, to some extent, all of us, but, you know, in terms of our mindset, I personally want to take a more, you know, assertive, proactive and positive approach to this year versus reactive, as the circumstances required, perhaps in 2020, which I was much reacting to the news or situation or the new guidelines and whatnot. So this time, this time around I this is this is at least my perspective, personally, I don't know about you, how are you dealing with the new year?   Dan  03:25 Well, first of all, I generally, as you mentioned yourself, being reactive is never a good thing, whether it is a bad situation or a good one. So as you pointed out, the best approach is to get ourselves out of that reactive mode. I mean, I personally don't think that panicking, or being concerned about all the latest things that are especially portrayed in the media is a good thing. Because the media thrives on these things, they would love to make things look so dangerous. And the worst thing is going to happen, because that's going to you know, make your eyes fixated on what they're, you know, showing that to people. So for that reason, generally speaking, I'm not a fan of even following you so much, except perhaps from very reliable sources. For example, Dr. Fauci is one of those. But in terms of the media and what they said, I was not necessarily paying so much tension anyway, in that regard, and of course, other than that, it is the fact that we've kind of gotten used to it. And as you put it out yourself, even though we're going to be spending, at least based upon the European estimation, at least, until summertime, in the same quarantine mode, if you will, or social distancing. Still, that leaves at least a couple of months, and I'm pretty darn sure that we're going to celebrate our next new year in a very, very different atmosphere and mood than then we did basically this year. So for that reason, I remain hopeful and optimistic. And obviously, I mean, some people were just reacting to the crisis. What what I was doing your in 2020 was how can I make the most of this time? That was the question that I asked myself every single day because I do believe that when one door gets closed, Other gets open. And one man's misery is one man's portion. And the other most important one, of course, is when life gives you, when all life gives you as lemons, try to make lemonade. And you should, we should believe that my vitamin C, basically, nutrition this year was pretty high, because all we got was, you know, basically were lemons. So I'm right now done with vitamin C. But quite frankly, that's exactly what I did. So I really believe that this pandemic was a great chance, at least for me personally, because it gave me a chance to really look deep into myself in basically social life, and what we can do with or without these things. But more importantly, because I'm very much interested in the concept of leadership, it actually allowed me to take a closer look at how some of the best leaders around the world tackle this issue and how they basically go about doing this as the primary crisis continues. Because for me, that was like the ultimate learning school the the ultimate School of leadership, if you will, both personally, I mean, how do you manage being in this crisis? Do you panic? Do you lose hope? What would you do if you realize that I don't know your restaurant, your gym, some other place going to be close? And if you are working there, you're gonna lose your job? Are you gonna panic? Or are you going to perhaps find out of the way, and more importantly, it made me think a lot about the future of humanity, which will heavily rely on technologies to reduce carbon emissions or reduce commuting around as somebody who is, you know, a, you know, constantly, basically, on the movement, you know, somebody who likes to travel lives, it actually makes me question a lot of those things I used to do, like, isn't really necessary to travel, for example, it is the number of times per year or because you like reduce it a little bit. And it was a very educational experience. Overall, of course, I'm not gonna deny the fact that it was hard as most tough love and tough educational situations generally are. But in this situation, I realized what it really means to deal with all the situations that somehow push your life out of control. And not only not panic, but to make the most of it. So, and a couple of my businesses, actually the, you know, our revenue went up during the pandemic, because we took advantage of the online technology and online communication, and it simultaneously actually cut back our costs, in terms of traveling flights, going to exhibitions, cost of hotels, and so on, because nowadays, basically, almost everything is done via zoom or online. So generally speaking, for me, it was a combination of difficulty, as well as achievement. But more importantly, it was perhaps one of the most educational experiences of my life. Because for me, because, you know, our generation, we haven't seen, you know, a very dramatic shift in the way people live their lives. I mean, my basically, grandparents had experienced World War Two. So for them, they saw what it feels like to be in a world that is normal, and then suddenly everything changes, right. But our generation of millennials, we never had this, you know, this experience, we never experienced a major, you know, war, whenever experienced, perhaps major famine or other issues. So this COVID-19 pandemic was kind of like the world war two of the millennials, and they saw what it feels like when the entire world order collapses, and everything changes. And so if you look at that, as a once in a lifetime experience, as you know, over to basically was for our grandparents, it's kind of on the same scale, and that it has tremendous potential for learning and self development.   Pouya LJ  08:32 Absolutely, it makes a lot of sense. And I think, I do agree with you in terms of Okay, so, there were a range of reactions from a variety of people, of course, to this whole year, if you will, in 2020. Excuse me, and yes, lots and lots of people have made so many good decisions and made actually the most of the situation maybe, maybe more than their regular here is if you will, so so of course that and that, that that is where the attitude comes into play, right? How are your attitude allows you to deal with a certain situation that is out of the ordinary, sometimes outright devastating. And, you know, learn from those devastations rather than just leave the score and nothing else. Right. So so i think i think you're right on, I think it makes a lot of sense. And I have questions a lot, a lot of things about myself personally, and the way we leave as a, you know, society as a world. Even so, so yeah, there has been definitely definitely many, many levels of, you know, education going on for me and I'm sure for a lot of other people. Although not not, not everybody saw it that way. Perhaps some just saw it as a misery but it's still like, you know, and the future retrospectively, they probably will come to see some you know, lights of education, those people who were mostly focusing Under disasters of today as well, so   Dan  10:03 and you put in a point out something about, you know, our societies, because in my life, as you probably know, I work with multiple nations and different cultures and languages, and I'm in touch pretty much with all five continents right now. And this pandemic, for me personally, as someone who is a basically a, you know, a proponent of globalism, seeing the entire world basically gets locked. And the entire international travel being basically severely hindered, not fully stopped, but severely hindered, was pretty a shocker at first, quite frankly, and more importantly, allowed me to be in touch with my contacts from around the world and see how different nations and different governments were tackling the issue. As I know, on the one hand, we had Sweden who had the most liberal approach possible, and I was in the entire time in touch with my contacts in Sweden. So how are people reacting? are they wearing masks? Are they happy? What about the death ways that I was in touch, of course, my contacts in China, the source of basically this pandemic, and how people are just, you know, going about their lives, having have already defeated basically, the pandemic, then we moved on to Europe. And unfortunately, I was very disheartened when I realized Germany, which was one of the best countries in terms of the way they handled, the pandemic went under full lockdown. Basically, in November and December, you can imagine the damage, of course, the German government offered tremendous, basically cash support for all of its citizens, and basically, business owners. But still, you would see how these developments are changing the International, basically, community. And for me, that was another level of basically education because I literally saw that leadership, culture, and the sense of unity in a nation can really help or hurt basically one's nation's quest on defeating the virus and the pandemic. So it was another layer, basically, I'm I'm pretty sure that in Canada, things probably were a lot, basically better handled than it was in the US, given the fact that we just got rid of Donald Trump. And now, hopefully, things will change. But in Canada, I'm guessing things were a lot better as people perhaps had higher trust in their government, and follow the health guidelines. But ultimately, what really matters, is just to realize that this challenge has been a source of education for almost all of us. And we could learn from that and use those lessons to make 2021, which we're in right now. A much better year.   Pouya LJ  12:34 Exactly. And that's where I wanted to get to looking back learning, you know, I mean, day to day we learn the 2020 on every day, I think I can talk about myself personally made better decisions, I'll have to deal with the new New World Order, if you will. So. So of course, it's an ongoing process, but now having this excuse of a new year to look back for over 2024 for a few minutes, and then look into the future and carry the lessons and put away the hardships perhaps as much as possible. To the interior. Now, what were your I mean, you mentioned some of them, what what were you if you if you want a bullet point that what were the top? I don't know, a few that you're taking to 2020 as our new lessons and new things you want to do in 2020 differently than you did in the past?   Dan  13:25 Well, I mean, you mean 2020 1am I right?   Pouya LJ  13:28 Oh, I'm so sorry. Yes, anyone? That's right, we're used to the ones I   Dan  13:32 got from Korea points to take 2021 basically, because I'm done with 2020. And I don't want to go back,   Pouya LJ  13:38 just don't make   Dan  13:41 one year too much. Even if there was a time machine, I'm not gonna go back 2020. Even though I love using time machines to go back to the past, not 20, I can go to 2019 or 22, but not 2020. But ultimately, from my point of view, 2020, for me, personally, was the year of looking at our values, and looking at our basically leaders for guidance, and to see how they can handle these problems in these situations that are oftentimes very tough and risky. And it also made me think about the impact that global commerce as well as basically, global community has on our very lives. So things like closing, for example, the borders isn't just going to affect the lives of those who work at the airport, or even like the airline companies. But this could have tremendous impact on a variety of industries. And as a whole, the entire economy actually come down because of this pandemic. More importantly, hischier really made me appreciate a lot of the things that I used to take for granted, mainly face to face, human contact, physical touch, and other things that we were deprived of during basically the year 2020 and we probably will still be for a couple of months if not six, seven more months and That really made me to change my priorities. And I literally made some promises, I would say that from the moment this pandemic is over, I am really going to take my social life more seriously. And I will make it less high tech and more high tech. Because that I think, for me is what a lot of us are missing. Now, being an extra that I am always looking to, you know, he around be social and to see basically people in action. For us, extroverts this crisis pose a much greater challenge than the introverts. I mean, I had a lot of friends who are introverts, it's like, man, I don't see any difference, really, I mean, except for some economic problems. And the fact that I can't travel, I see not much of a difference. I mean, I'm always social distancing in my home with my laptop, I say, Well, good for you. But that's not going to happen to all of us. So I'm guessing as somebody who is based upon my last personality test was basically set to be 99%, extroverted and 1%. introverted, which, unfortunately, is a little bit extreme. I know. And I wish it was a bit more balanced. For people like us, it was a little bit harder to, you know, deal with this aspect of social distancing, because extroverts are social by nature. So social distancing means simply stop letting do or stop being who you are. And that took a lot of getting used to, I mean, personally, for me, it took me no less than almost six, seven months just to get used to this the way things are. And even then, still, I haven't, like made basically peace with a situation, it's just that I have to go through with it, kind of like, you know, think of like going to a doctor or taking a pill or the dreaded colonoscopy. So it's kind of like that. But in this particular case, it's a rather two long colonoscopy. I mean, just imagine a colonoscopy that lasts for, I don't know, one and a half, two years, that'll be a very, very painful colonoscopy ambition, but it is really like that, in that, for me, personally, I am definitely going to take my social life a lot more seriously. I did spend a lot of time in the past years at work. And I would, because you know, to be productive, so I would tend to postpone a lot of, for example, social events, for the weekend times, or other places where I could, you know, be more productive at work. So I'm definitely gonna take my, you know, social life a lot more seriously, at this pandemic, probably a little bit too aggressively at first, and it is quite normal. But other than that, I also learned a very great lesson about what we as a species really need. I mean, we talked with this URL in one of our you know, very first programs you want in order, you know, first podcast is that like, all we need the things that we need right now like water, basically shelter and internet connection, something like this. I remember you said that. So it made me realize that not only internet and online technologies are an absolute necessities these days. But more importantly, a lot of the things we thought we needed, were not really needs, but preferences. I mean, you don't necessarily have to burn a lot of gas to go to the you know, movie theater, you really can enjoy chilling with Netflix at home, you don't really have to perhaps go to you know, spend hours in traffic every day to go to workplace, it is possible to conduct a lot of meetings online on zoom, or Skype or other online basically platforms without a lot of time wasted and commuting, basically. And of course, as somebody who's a frequent flyer, I also thought a lot about my, you know, priorities as somebody who flies in different countries, frequently on how important really it is, and how is it possible to reduce the frequency of basically flights in order to, you know, perhaps contribute a little bit to our basically planet in terms of carbon emissions, and so on. So those aspects of it actually taught me a lot about the fact that, really, a lot of the things we thought we needed, we don't need and the only thing that I realized that I really needed during this time. And a lot of the times capitalism does not want us to know, was human touch and human contact. And I think that's the one that we are not taught, we've taught, we've been taught a lot about spending money on a lot of brands, and we thinking or spending a lot of money, you know, for things we don't really need. While it you know, perhaps ignoring the most important thing that's human touch in contact. So for me, that really made me realize that the things that we really need are oftentimes the cheapest things that are always available. And the things that we think we need, and oftentimes, basically, carrying a heavy price tag are rarely the things that we truly need. So that for me was like a, you know, an eye opener basically to realize what really needs to have needs and have the Met and not confusing once with needs basically. And for me personally, that was a very big deal, because it allows me to then go ahead and somehow change my priorities in life in terms of how I should spend my money, how it should work, and how it should connect with who Around the risk level, of course, was a very great lesson. And the final one was about the difference that, you know, wealth and money can really make, I think, during this pandemic, the rich, the middle class, the lower middle class and the poor, they all pretty much had a similar lifestyle, and that a lot of the things that were not available to basically the poor people, were also not available now, for anybody else because of the limitations. So yes, you could no longer enjoy, I don't know, easily going to a golf club, or going to a, you know, a very cool place or a venue to chill. And those things made me think a lot about wealth gap in our society, and how this has increased so much, and how it's possible to create a more just fair society for everybody, where the 99% do not feel that their lives are any worse than that, you know, top 1%. So this was a humbling experience for a lot of the wealthy and the ultra rich, who used to think that they could just do whatever they wanted. And then they realized doesn't matter how much cash you got on the line, or how much credit you got, if literally, a simple virus can make all of those millions and billions seem like nothing. And it would not make any difference, which maybe you know, a lot about this concept. But what it really means to have value, is money going to solve all your problems and this penalty solve that the answer is a clear No, basically. So as someone who's an entrepreneur, it was also another great eye opening moment, basically, how about you projects? What are the things that you realized in 2020? That you basically want to take with you to 2021? Yeah, I   Pouya LJ  21:39 think leaving the specifics that you mentioned, which are some of them I didn't pay attention to, but then some I did. But generally speaking, I think the whole pause in the status quo, quote, and moving to something slightly off book, if you will, because of the circumstance was definitely an eye opener, in a sense that because when you when you're going with the status quo, it's sometimes when you're just moving with it, you're not noticing, you know, the goods and Bad's appreciating the things that are, for example, you were mentioning, you know, the socializing, I never understood how much I enjoy socializing with people in person, until this hit like you're much more extroverted than I am, of course, I think that's no secret. And you already noticed that before. Now, you appreciated it more, perhaps now. But I never even noticed that I knew I like hanging out with people, but I just didn't know, in how much depth that meant for me that the lack of it is, you know, in bolding, if you will. So in that sense, I think this whole pause, as you're mentioning, was an eye opener in many, many, many aspects. And of course, people with their own perspectives are grabbing different aspects of it and paying attention to them. And it's good to hear your perspectives. And I would love to, you know, bring our audience into it, if possible, if they would like to share it in a comment form one or two sentences to you know, what was the aha moment for you? Wow, we're doing this, maybe we should do that. Or maybe we should appreciate this. Oh, likes, like the things that Dan mentioned to us. But if you had something different that you it could be it could be good for us to hear. Because I was listening to you. And I was like, Yes, I paid attention to this amazing. But also I, I listened to you. And I was like, I never paid attention to, for example, this particular thing. And I was, that's interesting. I never, for example, international traveling like airplanes and whatnot. So that was not really on my radar, because maybe perhaps I wasn't doing it as much, obviously, as much as you I didn't. So so that was a that was a very interesting epiphany that I never had, and hearing it from you was, you know, very, very interesting to hear. So yeah, if the audience are willing to do that, leave a comment with your own epiphany during 2020. But yeah, going forward, but bottom line is, yes, I want I want to pay attention to these things. And I want to be more conscious of, you know, the things that we're doing on a day to day basis, either being more appreciative of the things we have, or paying attention that there are gaps in our current way of living, that we can improve on, and not just, you know, walk by them and not pay attention to them. Because you know, if you if you're, if you're moving past the garbage bin that is filthy, every single day, it becomes easy to just start ignoring it, right. But if you're forced to look at it, then you're like, you know what we got? We got to fix this. So he's, I   Dan  24:40 think they should force you know, you're forced to look at it. We kind of lost a lot of the distraction to see, I think, yeah, one of the biggest challenges of this pandemic was that a lot of us, we were so easily engaged with the things we used to do, that we somehow could put up with a lot more because we're not so much paying a lot of attention. But this pandemic really removed all the noise. And this somehow made us pay closer attention to things we used to ignore. I mean, a lot of basically couples, unfortunately, they lost relationships during this pandemic. And that was not because of any inherent problem with a pandemic, but the fact that a lot of people just were in relationship ever, not at the very beginning quite suitable for them. But since they had a lot of things to keep themselves busy, they could easily, you know, turn a blind eye to certain things. But in a pandemic like this, almost there's no noise distributed strategy by which means the truth somehow comes out. And the truth about everybody comes out. And it brings out the truth of our leaders as well. And if you saw what it means for someone like Trump to fully lose it, because that pandemic really took out all the noise and brought out the truth and a lot of basically people in various aspects of life, basically. And I think, for us, that was a great eye opener. But at the same time, if we learn those lessons, we can apply them and make far better decisions in the future, because pandemics like this don't happen every day, which is why we should take this as a, you know, a life lesson, if you will, in order to make us better at making future decisions.   Pouya LJ  26:15 Absolutely, it makes a lot of sense. And I'm sure, again, everybody's having their own perspective, and they overlap at times. But also there are unique mindsets that are out there. And I, I would love to hear about them. Is there any final thought that before we close it? Do you want to share with our audience? Well, first   Dan  26:33 of all, once again, I would like to wish all of our listeners a happy new year. And I hope that despite all the challenges we're currently facing in the world, we are going to be getting out of this pandemic soon. Now, the earliest estimates point out to summer, but that's only in Europe. As for the US, according to the prediction, by Dr. Fauci, we are going to be living in one way or another like this, until basically next holiday season, so probably life will only get back to normal around 2021 q4. So that leaves us with three months of normalcy, probably. And until then still, life continues on its current pace, basically. And that is both reassuring and a little bit, basically disheartening. But the fact of the matter is that we could make the most of this situation. So today, we talk about what it really needs to learn from the 2020 the past, and what lessons we can learn from the year itself, as well as the pandemic that caused tremendous trouble for all of us. And more importantly, we wanted to give our listeners the hope that yes, the pandemic was here. And we went through it one year, guys, if the pandemic took almost a year, out of our lives, but a lot of us during the same period, actually managed to take our lives to a you know, far better level. But even for those who managed to benefit financially, at least from this pandemic, nobody benefited from this pandemic emotional necessarily, because we're social creatures. However, it was good enough for us to learn from it. And please do know that the way we went through 2020, we can go through the rest of the 2021 during those periods where the pandemic still has to be brought under control, because unfortunately, the pace of vaccinations are rather slower than basically intended, thanks to the I don't know, extremely difficult means of logistics for the vaccine distribution. Thank you Pfizer for having finally a great way to make it easy. That was a joke, by the way. But overall, it all depends on you know, your perspective. And hopefully, if you have the right perspective, you can go through the rest of 2021 with the same level of zest and energy and enthusiasm as as you could have gone through 2020. And hopefully, more importantly, we have to stay hopeful that this shall pass. And we will get out of this hopefully, and we will move on to a life where we can truly appreciate and just imagine the feeling that you will have, let's say, according to what Fauci said, let's say it's q4, it's 2021. It's fall season, you're getting close to your new year, holidays, next New Year holidays, and boom, just imagine you can just go wherever you want no masks on, you can talk to anybody can shake hands, or use your hands in a variety of other ways, both appropriate or inappropriate in public. And all of these things are going to simply make it more enjoyable. Just imagine this man, just imagine the joy, the world will experience one's life goes back to normal. So a lot of the things that we used to take for granted now will become like blessings, and we can actually enjoy them. So for that reason, I'm tired. First of all, I cannot wait to be in a situation where I can experience all that, basically. And secondly, I want our listeners to imagine that that day will come the day where you your social life goes back to normal. We can go wherever you want no social distancing, and we can just truly appreciate the little things. We We thought we valued but didn't really pay a lot of attention to but now we can actually really enjoy them. So for me personally, it means another year of hustle, but with hope and basically just   Pouya LJ  30:12 perfect 21 for the win and pun intended, blackjack, forget it. All right. All right. Okay, thank you then, as always for joining us.   Dan  30:24 My pleasure, buddy.   Pouya LJ  30:26 And thank you everybody for listening to this episode. Again. If you want to share your own epiphanies or any comments, please feel free to do so. until later episode. Have a good one.

We begin the year 2021 with hopes for a better future and BTP podcast is here to accompany you throughout this year. If you have not subscribed to Beyond the Present podcast then head to iTunes, Podbean, or Stitcher and press the subscribe so that you will be among the first to get instant access to all upcoming programs.   Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript... ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS pandemic, year, life, stay, work, building, simply, social, podcast, great, understand, friends, social distancing, taught, zest, conquered, wonderful, energy, bright, whole new level SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:00 Hi, everybody, this is Val Margaret, and welcome to yet another great episode of beyond the present podcast, this one's going to be a very short one, because we have just started. The New Year, guys, the year is 2021. And we cannot wait to see all the challenges ahead. That'll be conquered, hopefully by our effort, and hard work. So guys, first of all, I want to thank you so much for being with us for one year, as we spent together discussing all the details of how to take your life to the next level and how to build a great future. And guess what, we have a lot of plans for you. In the coming year basically and beyond the president podcast team will do its very best to hopefully offer more quality programs in the coming days, weeks and months to make sure that you guys will always have your own great chances, as well as opportunities to realize your true potential. So now let's get started with one simple truth. And that is setting your New Year's resolution you guys if you're right now listening to us, you have to understand that you need to set your New Year's resolution in order to know what this year is going to bring to you. The last year unfortunately was a bit difficult, very strange and odd in many ways. However, it still taught us a lot of great lessons. But even if the whole world comes to a halt, we can travel, we can go to work, we can even touch our or shake hands with our friends and family members, we still can have a productive year. And the same thing can happen here. If we simply try to focus on what we need. And that is to take our lives to a whole new level to tell me Are you ready to take your life to a whole new level, because 2021 is definitely not going to be like 2020, we will get out of this stupid pandemic. And I promise you that 2021 will be a far better year for all of us only and only if we commit ourselves to really doing our best to simply set goals, achieve them and learn from all of our failures. Now, what's the first step very simple. If you're right now listening to us, just try your very best to stay optimistic know that this year will bring you closer to all of your goals. Because once you believe that it makes it more possible. Other than that, what's the next step, the next step is to simply focus on one thing, and that is the pursuit of your excellence, you have to focus on developing yourself. Understand, guys, if you want to make more money, if you want to have a better lifestyle, you need to work on yourself and 2021 will give you that chance to work on yourself with energy, zest and enthusiasm. So right now have your back in there laying on your sofa or in your car or somewhere like oh man life is step it up man and start living your life with energy and zest. And I hope that this program will give you that energy and that motivation to get off your ass and start doing something because the pandemic has taught us stay home, just be passive and watch Netflix all the time. That is wrong. The same pandemic gave a lot of us the opportunity to pursue our dreams, build new businesses from the ground up and work on developing our abilities. So 2021 will be simply another chance to continue on the same way to start building yourself up for a better you that's right for a better use. 2021 will make you a better you in this regard. And of course, that'll give you a great chance to work on building your abilities. And start right here right now. Last but not least, try to stay busy with your social life. You see, this pandemic has unfortunately made us a lot less social. Because now you can go out you can talk to your friends, you should wear a mask all the time, stay away social distancing, let that thing out of your head. Yes, we should follow all the health guidelines to make sure the virus don't spread out basically around us. However, it doesn't mean your social life is over, you can still be in touch with your friends with your contacts online or other places so long as you follow the health guidelines because ultimately that will allow us to make sure that those around us that we love the most our grandparents and those with health conditions will not suffer because of this pandemic. Then again, the vaccine is here, which means sooner or later, we will see a major drop in the case, basically where we see new infections and that will allow us to focus on building a brighter, better future. So yes, follow all the health guidelines but that doesn't mean that you should simply not have a social life. You can still be in touch with your friends, you can still see them if not in person online. But please do not fall in the trap of losing control of your social life because we are all social beings and we need to hang out with our friends around us. So please be social in 2021 All right, and that was it. I have this little short program gave me you know that motivation. To be on the right track, are you pumped up? Are you pumped up for a great 2021 because understand it's all in your head if you have the right attitude, year that is difficult, as difficult as 2020 can still be a productive year. So now guys, the year is here. I want to wish you all a wonderful, wonderful holiday time because of course we're going to celebrate this wonderful new year. But please do understand. If you are committed to making 2021 a great year, you will make it a great year. So stop with excuses. Start with negativity. And please do know that while we go through a dark winter 2021 will be a great, bright year that will teach us what it really means to appreciate all the things we have taken for granted for so long. That was it. This is Daniel Morgan. This was beyond the present podcast. Have a wonderful, happy, awesome new year and remember why we're here. We are here to make 2021 one of the best years of our lives. So go for it.

  Do you know the one trait that all unhappy and unproductive people have in common regardless of the reason behind their dismay? It is their inability to remain focused on what they do at the each and every moment! Your inability to remain focused won’t just erode your happiness, it also substantially reduces your productivity at work and in this program as part of the Entrepreneurial Edition of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel shares a new approach to staying focused that doesn’t require removing all the distractors in your environment, which is futile if not downright impossible, but rather promotes remaining focused in a proactive manner. 

The 2020 election was simultaneously historic, controversial, unconventional, and consequential. In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel and Pouya discuss the events of the election, shed light on some of the biggest myths and rumors surrounding the election and discuss its consequences for the next 8 years not only in the United States but also all over the world.    The material offered in this podcast solely represents the personal opinions of the attendants of the show and thus is not legally binding.      Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript... ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS trump, election, world, people, biden, america, president, joe biden, fact, vote, cycle, nations, pandemic, fortunately, years, donald trump, states, history, benefiting, terms SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello, and welcome back to yet another let's talk edition of the BTP podcast here with Daniel Mulligan. How's it going, Dan?   Dan  00:16 What a man, buddy? How are you how's it going live could not have been any better. I mean, we're just post the election and Biden officially won the election today. As of now all the basically almost all the votes have been counted. So life is amazing and more important, I'm so glad to be here with you, after a while because we were super busy involved with the election and a few other things. And now we're back for another let's talk edition at this, you know, amazing moment right now. So I'm pretty happy and couldn't be, you know, happy to be here with you talking about all the cool things when I share hopefully with our listeners.   Pouya LJ  00:49 Absolutely. I've been eagerly waiting to start recording this episode. And hopefully a couple of days after the recording, the audience will hear it. Maybe even sooner. But we we sit on this for a few few days, I think 11 days since the day of the election to to talk about it mainly because so first of all the few five for four or five few days, obviously nothing was clear. And there was a mayhem after that. So we're gonna talk about all of that, obviously. But now we got a chance. So yes, officially, Biden seems to be the president elect, although Donald Trump really doesn't like that and keeps coming up with excuses. So today, we're basically what the intention is to talk about one of the impacts of all of this around the world, and what are the impacts of Trump being Trump for, for democracy and the US political system as a whole? And who, who better than to talk about this with, then you? Okay, so what is your general take on all of this very broadly?   Dan  01:51 First of all, I think this was one of the best elections the US ever experienced, probably the most historic election that we can think of, because there was a lot at stake at stake during this election, not only for America, but for the entire world, including what it really means to, you know, live in a democratic society. So I think that this election also was, in a way, very unique in that it took place during a pandemic. Now, of course, there are states that has experienced other tough elections during even civil wars. But this one really happened at a time where America was the most divided, and the kind of was the most hurt. And the pandemic had damaged, basically, the economy far, basically too much for it to actually be ignored by the voters. But then again, America was also facing with a lot of other issues, including a racial, basically a crisis, where we felt that despite all of our advancements in the modern technologies, and in other areas of life, culturally, and educationally, we're still seeing this racism running rampant. And that's where the Black Lives Matters movement actually got started this year, along with a focus on bringing into awareness what it really means to be a black man in America, and what it means for other minorities, including, let's say, for example, the Muslims, let's say, middle easterns, let's say those who come from minority backgrounds, people of color. So this was a, I think, a turning point during this election, where Americans decided that once and for all, they're not going to stand for a lot of the values that they escaped from, they or their parents or their grandparents, when they moved to the United States, after all the US was this nation made by immigrants, and people who went there. Basically, generations ago, they all wanted one thing to live in a free society, where they are not judged by the color of their skin. But ultimately, having seen what has happened so far in this election, and all the ups and downs really was probably one of those dramatic elections, even more so than what we had earlier with george bush and Al Gore, and the year 2000, basically, and how it changed almost everything for the world. But fortunately, we did not engage with so much election fraud, because this time, fortunately, as was announced by almost all experts, this was indeed the most secure election because there were so many threats. I mean, Trump right now is accusing fraud for the election, not knowing that, basically, the US officials were quite prepared for this, given the fact that in 2018, or 2016, it was Trump who benefited from a lot of these, basically, voter fraud, if you will, in that many nations, allegedly, Russia especially got involved with trying to involve and influence basically, the election and the results in favor of Donald Trump, obviously. So now, of course, somebody who is accused of that background, obviously would then assume that yeah, this is like what however he does it, so probably there's got to be some sort of, you know, fraud going on. But the fact of the matter is that Trump like all the other basically Republicans and the right wing extremists will have to come to, you know, an agreement on this and to have to somehow acknowledge the fact that they were defeated by a large majority. As of today, as of right now, almost 78 million Americans have voted for Joe Biden, this is a historical number, this is unbelievable, unheard of, and just quite frankly, a clear sign of victory, not just by the left or by the liberals. But you know, I think by almost all modern population who are rather sensible, educated, and they understand that we need a change, and that by going back through time, and trying to legalize, I don't know, things like coal mining, getting out of, you know, very important. Basically, PACs such as the Paris Paris Agreement and other things, we cannot have a good future. And which is why I personally, think of this election be one of the best ever, because it really happened at a time where change was needed. And fortunately, the Americans will actually have decided, and they made their voice heard, despite the fact that this was a pandemic, despite the fact that Trump wanted to create so many limitations for those who wanted to vote by mail, given the fact that he could not leave their houses. Now, we've seen the results. And fortunately, we're happy to announce that as of now, Mr. Biden is no longer basically a former Vice President, but the president elect, unfortunately, by January 20, we're going to actually see a lot of changes that are currently being done gradually, basically, go out of the way as Joe Biden will hopefully on that day be inaugurated. And we'll we'll hopefully, we'll see a great future for not only America, but the rest of the world.   Pouya LJ  06:35 Wow, that's great. Yeah, I mean, there has been a lot of problems. But before we go further, we go into everything. But do you think you will, by Hammond, Trump, do you think he will ever officially concede?   Dan  06:47 Well, legally speaking, Trump is not legally obliged to concede, nor is he really obliged to attend the inauguration of basically, Joe Biden. So he's not legally obliged, and given the fact that he's not they live lives, and he's a businessman, which means he probably will not do anything that he's not legally obliged. Especially if it's not gonna, you know, serve him or serve his image, he probably will not. But the fact of the matter is that he cannot simply just barricade himself in the White House, say, Oh, I don't care, you guys, you all have the fraud. It's all not true. He can't do that anymore. Because I really believe that Donald Trump was a reality TV president. And we have seen in the past four years, what he's done was nothing more than just a traumatic experience that was in no way presidential. And he took his, you know, reality TV mindset from the, you know, the TV show, apprentice, you're fired, I'm gonna fire everybody here now. And he actually recently even fired Esper, which was just incredibly, you know, just preposterous to even you know, think about that. But ultimately, we have seen him as a man who was in deep need for attention to create this, you know, these series of dramas. And he literally, I think he even saw his presidency as a TV show. In many cases, he didn't, he didn't actually produce certain, basically posters and certain photos of him, showing things that were very cinematic and not so much political in nature. I mean, if you just take a look at the back of the past four years, who would have made to take all these photos that are so cinematic, like, Oh, yeah, the sanctions are coming baby, to be followed on the next episode. So like, he perhaps, you know, thought of that, basically, I don't know how he did it. I know that he's definitely, you know, was a probably a bug in the system. Because there was an I personally was so much involved in this because I really wanted some answers. Because if Donald Trump would have won another term, that would have meant that he's the kind of person that is fit, and ready to lead, you know, versus America. And that is simply from my point of view, quite frankly, unacceptable, because that's not the kind of man that represents anything American basically, especially in the, you know, global community that I am a part of. So for that reason, now that he's a one term president, this clearly shows to the whole world, that Donald Trump was not the system. He was a bug in the system that fortunately, was quickly removed, because if he would have won another term, he was no longer a bug in the system, but the system itself. But now the whole world knows that no one can lead, like Trump and get a second term. It's just not possible. Although given his background and what he thinks he could do with his power, he perhaps had his own delusions of what he could do as a dictator, as probably the first stickler in the US, you know, history. But fortunately, the Constitution is much stronger than that. And it's, you know, written in a way that makes sure that a president cannot be a king or a dictator. And fortunately, that's what we're going to see so far. And despite all of his allegations and allegations regarding what has happened, almost always legal experts have mentioned that the election was fully monitor. And for the two reasons, because number one, the US officials were on edge the entire time, because of the threat of hacking, that, you know, was basically, you know, always in the corner, as you probably know, the 2016 election was very, very, basically, you know, controversial and that we thought there were so many nations were involved with this, mainly Russia to try to hack the election and try to change the results. So for that reason, this time around, he was officials were quite aware, on edge ready to, you know, tackle the problems of any possible intrusion, which is why this was dubbed the most secure election in the US history, given the fact that we knew there were a lot of threats. We wanted to make sure that, you know, this is not going to be a, you know, major issue and that many nations do not influence the election, basically, which is why this was done. And obviously, even like, if you look at like social media, many of Trump's tweets were actually being censored for the first time in the US history. And I believe that where we're seeing a president's tweets are being actually censored by, you know, let's be Twitter. And the reason was because he was propagating certain, basically false information, and allegations that are simply not true, nor based on facts. So because of this, not only I would, this was one of the most secure elections in the US history. I think it's one of the best, I after few election, basically, I got a text from one of my followers, like, then I heard there were some dead people voting. Well, first of all, were you there yourself? Did you examine the votes? Did you check the names and the signatures, I mean, there were so many mail those actually got discredited because of their, you know, signature. I mean, let's be honest, voting by mail is not an ideal way to vote, because you actually have a much higher chance of not being able to vote than being able to vote. Because even if your signature does not match what you've already submitted, you are not going to be able to, you know, make your voice heard. So you're always going to be counted, it's going to be discredited. So in such a system where even a slight tweak in your signature can make your vote basically, dismissed, you think that's a dead person can vote, I mean, just really makes no sense, in my opinion. So all of these allegations are false. This was the most secure election, the US history, as proven by all the experts, and not by those who have won or lost, but by those who are in the middle, those whose job it is to control and, you know, watch over the election, basically. So there are a lot of rumors that that people voting, I don't know, people voting five 5000 times, as was mentioned by one of Trumps, basically lawyers, but as of now, almost under the legal cases have actually gone through. And I'm not even sure if Trump really wants to go with recounts, because if he does, yes, of course, spend a lot of don't, you know, donation money, although when my friend said like, Dan just wants to get the money and just, you know, keep it for himself. He's not gonna actually go for the recount. We'll see. We'll see how it goes. But as of now, everything is quite clear. And the whole world knows that Joe Biden is the 46th President knighted states, most statesman around the world have already congratulated Joe Biden. Though, of course, there are always exceptions, putting being one of them, for the obvious reasons. And even like many such leaders, who were vehemently against a democratic approach, and who were, you know, strong supporters of, basically, Donald Trump, including Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, and the King of Saudi Arabia, they both have already congratulated Joe Biden. This means that even those nations who are benefiting from those very few nations, because Trump has already lost a lot of allies, because very few nations who are benefiting supposedly benefiting from Trump's preposterous policies themselves have already congratulated basically Joe Biden, and have realized that Donald Trump is now going to be in the White House longer. So that is why it was that this election is pretty much, you know, a pretty much over and we know who the President is, we know who the next President will be. And obviously, we couldn't be any happier than this.   Pouya LJ  14:06 Yeah, well, make sense. Now, I you mentioned Yes. I mean, obviously 78 million people voted for Biden. But we also cannot really discount the fact that 72 million people voted for Trump, and maybe for good, you're right, that they had. And I think it's really Paramount that. I mean, you're obviously lots of speculation as why that is, I mean, some are his base, but I don't think like he has 70 million base. I think there's definitely some sort of other, you know, reasoning behind it. And a lot of people were attributing that to lack of appeal of the opposition, candidate, Biden to those specific people for various reasons from his political agenda, his age, etc. So I think first of all, it's Paramount that we, as you know, but I mean, liberals and democrats on their own, but as a you know, as a society, we need to understand that appeal that Trump had a lack of appeal, rather than the opposition had. What are your thoughts personally on that?   Dan  15:10 Well, first of all, please, you know, bear in mind that this election was one of the most, you know, perhaps one of the, if not the largest collection of the US history, and that we had the most number of participants, if you compare this to other elections, so once you have almost everybody voting in, especially, given the fact that there were, you know, mailing voting allowed on almost all states, there are, of course, exceptions, and there are different terms and conditions, but generally was allowed. So that's one of the reasons why Trump actually got more votes this time around, then, you know, there during the last election, but the fact of the matter is that America is divided. And I'm really happy that in this situation, Biden is going to be our next person, because he was actually not so much. So left, as opposed to many other candidates who are running the primaries, because Joe Biden stands for, from my point of view, middle slightly tilted towards the left, which is why we need him right now. to somehow people, you know, bridge the gap between the two sides. And he says America, because let's be honest, America is now very divided. It's a clear fact. But the reason that it is happening right now, it is not because of the government itself, or the system, but rather, because the fact that we are going through a transitional cycle, you see, the US has already gone through two major transitional cycles in his history. And because we are now entering a new phase in the American life, and of course, in the global community as a whole, because we are now at a moment where we have a major clash between those who have been left behind, and those who are making it, which is why states like New York, and California have generally mainly been blue states, you know, for the most part, because they are well off there, you know, they are quite rich and highly educated. But states basically where, of course, I was very, you know, surprised when I heard Florida actually went back to Trump again, but certain states, we are seeing, basically the quality of life degradation. So for that reason, this class is quite normal. And by the way, I don't believe that this division is going to go anytime, go away anytime soon, even after you know, Biden's the president, because this is a cycle that America has to go through. And I believe that this cycle probably is going to get a little bit worse. And I think that the worst America will not be even now in the next few years or after pandemic, but the US will be at its worst position, I believe in the year 2028. So the real challenge that we will be facing is going to be the next eight years actually. And only after 2028 as the US enters the next cycle, only then we will hopefully see more stability. Why? Because now we're living in a world especially like let's look into us right now, where we have so much basically, disparity, and there is a lot of problems with in terms of how we could you know, people could make a living. So the world has become more modern. But not everybody is necessarily suitable for a lifestyle that is designed to adapt itself with its technologies, but education. So now we are seeing a major fights among those who have been left behind, and those who are not financially as well off, versus those who are making it. And that's how, by the way Trump won the last election because he tried to appeal to those people who felt they're left behind. Let's say the guy says, I'm a truck driver, or I used to be a miner and I cannot learn how to use the computer, well, I don't want to go back to school, I don't care about America's commitment to global warming, I just want to make some you know, make some money and make ends meet. So for such people with a, you know, short sighted perspective, they are going to demonize those who are perhaps have, you know, got a little bit better. And they're simply not going to care about many of the US commitments to the international community, all they care about is to get their job back and to get back on track, which is why we are seeing this struggle. But if you look at history, not only of America, but the world, you realize that whenever we have this division among those who have been left behind, and those who are making it, history tends to favor those who are forward oriented, much more so than those who are backward oriented. Because in throughout the history, all civilizations, once one group took the sign of the future, and one too excited the past, it was always the one that sets out a future that was actually in the end victorious and managed to change society, whether we go back to the Roman Empire, whether we go back to, for example, Renaissance era in Europe, it's always been a force in the EU in the US, this has happened already twice, basically, as we've gone through this. So in the third, transitional secondary states, we inevitably have to face with that struggle. And that friction caused by the right mainly those who are supporting the right wing, for keeping America in its current position, as the rest of America tried to take America forward and the struggle as we've seen so far has been manifested in a variety of ways. And it will continue if you think that this election means it's over, you are mistaken, because this is just the beginning of a lot and a series of fights and struggles that us has to face as it has already faced twice in the past, to go through the third cycle. And once hopefully, through good leadership, we go through this third cycle, and the US is made more equal more fair, and people are ready to take part in you know, most of our rights to take part in a new economy and a new world, then hopefully, we will enter the prosperous United States, which hopefully will be around the year 2032 2032. And by then we'll see a very, very different world, both in terms of you know, what happens the US and geopolitically with our rivals, including China, including Russia, and Europe, of course, and many other things. So for me, personally, I don't see this victory as the end, I see this as the beginning of the end. And that end is the third cycle. And this is going to take about eight years. So if you think that things are gonna get easier, just wait a little bit, just a couple of years, and you're gonna see what tension really means. However, given the fact that this has been done twice already, I'm very confident this is going to be also eventually passed. And as we entered the 2030s, hopefully, the US will then be a far more unified nation. And that'll Of course, benefiting the entire world, I believe.   Pouya LJ  21:20 All right, so what I hear you say is buckle up. I'm just kidding.   Dan  21:24 That's exactly what we should do. Guys, if you think this is over. just just just grab some stuff. I don't know, get get ready, because this is just the beginning of the action. Actually.   Pouya LJ  21:33 That's a, that's encouraging. Yeah, especially   Dan  21:36 Well, certainly for those who are living outside the US. So for example, actually curious, because I'm clearly clearly sure about this matter that basically, Justin Trudeau was so much anti Trump, I mean, I love to analyze, like his body language and the meetings with Trump during the NAFTA agreements, and like the way he would like, yeah, thank you, Trump. So like, I would like I found there was just so much distrust, and so much, you know, even hatred towards each other. But right now, what is the perspective of let's say, I don't know, the Canadians regarding the American, you know, election? What are what are you guys saying? Actually?   Pouya LJ  22:16 Um, I don't know. That's a very good question. I'm, obviously I didn't survey people, but based on my personal experience, and things that I hear around, I think Canada, actually, obviously, very culturally, like the rest of the West, and even the world is very impacted by the US. But I think they're the divide, not to the extreme that the US is experiencing. But I think that divide along the cultural lines and thought process exists also in Canada. I mean, there were obviously people who were like individuals, not politicians, per se, but individuals who were in favor and define of Trump, maybe maybe less in terms of proportionality than in the US, but that clearly that divide existed here. But you're right, like, obviously, Trudeau is a different character. And he definitely didn't like Trump, especially because of his policies. I mean, I mean, I   Dan  23:12 named one international leader who actually like Trump, I cannot think of like maybe like one or two. And that's just probably because of luck. Because he almost literally dissed everyone, all the, you know, global leaders. So I'm very glad that he will be soon gone, because, as you probably know, I work in international community, I work in multiple countries. And what I've seen is the image of America being tarnished and damaged in the past four years. And, I mean, I was like, incredible. You see, you know, things like we go to Germany, you see, for example, are using Donald Trump's basically photo in their bathroom. And it's basically like, you pretty much have to, you know, do the deeds while looking at his face. And as you know, basically, you know, look around, so you're seeing that, and like in Europe, Europe was extremely against Trump, because of all the things they did against Europe. The same thing, of course, applies to the Middle East, although there were some exceptions. But mostly it was negative, basically, Canada was severely hurt, so was Mexico. And I cannot think of so many nations who actually benefit from Trump or even light him, which is why I'm so glad because of In fact, my major area of activity is International Business and Commerce. So seeing the fact that we're going to see a lot less tension internationally, although, of course, the episode with China, thanks to Trump will still stay there and probably will be here for the next eight years, until the US can first leave that, you know, third cycle. But still, I'm very happy to know that the international basically community will now be a lot more stable in the fact that the power that comes with the White House generally has basically white effects and it could reach basically almost all over the world and if you have an idiot as the commander in chief Things to get a little bit dangerous. And if you have an idiot as an international policymaker, that could lead to a lot of problems. So fortunately, I'm very glad that at least an international community, we're going to now see a shift in the way America is perceived. And of course, as the policies get enhanced over time, we're going to see hopefully, more improvement, although, as I've already mentioned, and I'm, I've already predicted the election correctly, almost everybody around me said that Trump is the winner. I've been repeatedly saying since July 3, and Vine is the winner, and he was my next prediction. Basically, first, number one, keep an eye out for who's going to be our next president. Basically, it's gonna be any transition between vice president or president at some point, perhaps, because I think that the United States, it's time for the US to actually have its first female president. And the second thing I would like to predict right now is about what will things what things will lead to because, as I already mentioned, we are in the phase, we have to go through this cycle. And that, you know, transition is going to be the most difficult that at this very moment, given the fact that now the division is quite clear. And because of this, we're going to see a lot of tension. So the US is going to be affected tremendously by a major inner conflicts for the next eight years, most of which will be caused by this division. However, for those of you who are perhaps going to listen to us for three years, five years from now, as the US will face with that crisis, like oh, my gosh, the world is coming to an end, just like the last election, you probably panic a little bit, I'm telling you, right now, if you perhaps got the chance to let us back in a couple of years from now. And you were in the middle of that crisis, please do enter, the batch shall pass as well, because this cycle is predictable, economically, politically, and socially. So we will go through that phase as well. And hopefully things will get better. Much better. Of course, by the time we reach 2028, and we're going to have basically the next election. So for now, just this is my prediction for the next eight years. Obviously, it's still gonna be much better. But there's a lot of work to be done. And of course, we will have to face with a lot of challenges ahead. But I'm pretty sure that America is fit to deal with that challenge. And hopefully, it'll be better for all of us.   Pouya LJ  27:11 All right. I know that that sounds interesting. And I mean, obviously, there's a lot to be said about all of this. And I'm sure we're going to discuss that maybe not not as my main topic, but as an intro to other conversations that we have a catch up on the world events. And we're going to talk more about this. But before we leave, is there anything that you want to talk about that we left behind, didn't talk about?   Dan  27:36 Well, first of all, Pouyjix is good, you know, talk to you, basically. And generally, today was a great topic. And I'm very happy that Joe Biden is now the president elect, because we could not have possibly imagined what damage he would have caused. If we had to go through that third cycle with Trump as the president, it would have led to disastrous consequences, because in that situation where the two sides are going at each other, we need a leader who can actually calm both sides down. And of course, Biden will be the best leader. Some people are talking about his age. There's a reason why he is the President is not just the fact that he's the Vice President of Barack Obama, that age will itself play a role in our next election in 2024. And hopefully, it'll lead to some further development in knighted States of America, in terms especially with respect to you know, female rights and what women can do in politics. But ultimately, we discussed mainly, the issue of whether or not this election was fair. And as we've said many times, that when the session was fair, it was the most secure and most reliable election, probably in the US history. So to Donald Trump's dismay, this election was fair, it is over it is done. Biden is the 46 presidents and Trump's right now, teams are trying their best are trying to fight tooth and nail to get this thing through. But that's pretty much from my point of view, it's nothing more than trying to say face, and I have no problem with that. I think everybody has the right to try to save their face. And I think that's precisely what Trump has in mind. It doesn't have to concede he doesn't have to attend the, you know, integration of Joe Biden, but for the American people, and for the, you know, international community around the world, for all of our listeners all over the world, they should know that this election was fair, it was secure, it was reliable. And it was a concrete message sent to the White House and to the world, that America will not tolerate dictatorial leaders or will not tolerate anything that is not American democratic, or that could somehow go against, you know, the well being of the entire global community because America has a has a role here. America has a responsibility. There are kids right now listen to us. We're living in countries that are ruled and governed by dictators. There are people in this, you know, in this world who are living in countries where they had their president for 25 years. There are now people in the streets of Belarus, who are still fighting for the rights to for their for their right to actually have their own president elected. There are people you know, in Eastern Europe, they're people that middle east there are people all over the world who look at America as an example. And it's America's job to show the world that democracy works. And that well as much as never, ever the best basically. And never a perfect system of governance is probably the worst except for all the others. And that is why it's best for us to adopt true democracy and allow the people at basically to make their voice heard and, you know, show and send the message of democracy to all over the world so that hopefully someday, we will not have to see things like what we've seen in Belarus or other countries where people are have no they can't, cannot rely on the results of their elections. And hopefully, this is going to be a good message for all of us all over the world.   Pouya LJ  30:53 And on that note, we come to the end of our today's talk. I hope everybody enjoyed and thank you, Dan, for joining us again, my pleasure, buddy. And thank you all for listening. I hope you enjoyed it and I hope you got informed. Please let us know if you have any thoughts or comments in the comment section. And until a later episode.

Going through an economic recession can be a daunting experience for all of us but relying on instinct during tough times can only sabotage your financial well-being. In this episode and as part of the entrepreneurial edition of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel will share with you the essential survival techniques to bring your finances under control and also offers some ways you can even profit from recessions!   Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript...   ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS recession, cash, economic recession, tough, property, tough situations, money, business, online, panic, pandemic, economic crisis, buy, situation, currency, investors, opportunist, call, lose, bad SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:11 Hello, welcome to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast, the entrepreneurial edition. My name is Daniel Morgan. And today we're going to talk about how to go through a financial crisis without getting a lot of damages on your bills, as well as your bank accounts, as well as in your life. And above all, on your emotions. See, guys, once you are going through an economic recession, the entire rules of the game of financial change. And today, I want to actually prepare you with certain basically, techniques and somehow abilities and skills and knowledge that will allow you to resist going down in tough situations. So for today, we're right now obviously, if you're in the US, we are officially in a recession, obviously. And this same story applies in almost every country I'm currently working in or I have a company in so think about the European Union, it's official in a very bad stage of recession, think about, basically China is already going down heavily. The Middle East is not doing far better, although things are still quite good in places like Dubai, Emirates, but still Middle East as a whole is actually experiencing a lot of shrinkage in terms of their economic development. The same story, you know, applies to Eastern Europe, Russia is not doing any better. So pretty much anywhere I know things are really, really tough economically. And because of this, we have to prepare ourselves for what is about to occur, hopefully after the pandemic is over, and the recession will then gradually disappear. So whenever you find yourself in an economic recession, the biggest problem is what cash that's exactly what it is, however, not in the way you think you see, many of us will still keep our jobs, they will still go to work, many of us will actually even be able to generate more income and certain businesses, let's say if you're especially in e commerce, or if you're working online, you probably will do much better during a recession like this. But in the end, we all face with economic uncertainties. If we are an investor, you see things are going down in the stock market. You see the Dow Jones Industrial Average, s&p 500, all coming down. If you're an import and export, you see that oh my goodness, this thing really is increasing the cost of delivery and shipping because of all the logistics of becoming a lot more expensive, because of a pandemic. And of course, if you have already lost your job, if you're working as a waiter, if you're working as I don't know, perhaps a trainer at the gym, you might say that, oh my goodness, actually, I'm not going to work at all. So in these tough moments, the first reaction of most of us is to panic. It's all over. I'm gonna go broke, I got no money, man. I'm so poor now. And this panic, and this, you know, fear will actually turn into a vicious cycle where you feel worse and worse. And guess what, end up spending more money on your credit card. That's actually you know, pretty amazing. When you're making good money, you actually spend less, because you have less time to go out and start doing shopping. But ironically, the moment a lot of us we lose jobs, guess what's the first thing we most of us, we actually tend to do? Yeah, let's go shopping, I got some free time. Let's enjoy this right, you would do the exact opposite. The very first thing you want to do when you face with a major economic recession be the loss of the value of your currency. Right now one of my friends actually just called me from Moscow. And as of now ruble is suffering heavily. And one of my friends, basically in Turkey right now said the exact same thing as happened with lira the Turkish currency. And other one of my friends in Brazil said, our currency right now is one of the worst in the world. So if you are right now one of these countries where the currency is dropping, you might start panicking, like oh my gosh, I'm going to lose it all. But please do understand that most currency trends are temporary, and that most governments actually will find a way to reverse that trend. So making very bad decisions about your money could lead to certain problems. So you're saying Well, okay, okay, I got some cash right now ruble is coming, I don't know ripples losing value. I don't know Leroy is coming down. What should I do? in these moments, understand that in tough economic situations, your assets become a lot less liquid. Now, what is liquidity? It's your ability to transfer and to basically exchange an asset for cash. So for example, let's say things are very fine and you are emits an economic boom. And you have a lot of cool assets, real estate, stocks, and so on and so forth. So now, you need the money. You want to paid for your, you know, kids college tuition, you want to actually travel. So if you're in a good economic moment, it's so easy, then go ahead and sell that property. And get the cash for it, or to sell for example your car and get the cash for it right. But the problem is, whenever you're facing with an economic recession, the first thing that happens to all of us is that we lose liquidity. So your property might actually go up in value, but you can't find a new buyer, because the property right now has no interested buyer for it, because people don't have the cash for it, they would actually use mortgage options, but because of the uncertainty, a lot of investors and not all, but a lot of investors lashley stay away from it all. And they find a more safe approach a safer approach towards their, you know, investments. So oftentimes, in these situations, investors tend to move towards what we call safety measurements, things like buying gold, things like buying certain types of currencies, and that reduces the liquidity of your basically properties, your assets, and so on. So in those situations, what you want to do is to make sure that you have as much cash set aside as possible, I repeat, guys, cash will save the day, a lot of us we say, well, but then I don't want to keep my money in bank of america, because I'm gonna just get what, oh, point 5% return on my annual investment, I understand this money in the bank is not meant to be an investment, money in the bank or in a let's say, CD, sort of go deposit, or and basically, other types of bank basically accounts. They're not meant to be thought of as investments. They're meant to be your security. And because of his he in these tough situations, the first thing you want to do is to increase your level of financial security. And that means having access to liquid assets or simply cash in your bank account, and saying, well, well, are you saying there should just keep I don't know, $5,000? In my bank account, yes, that's exactly what I'm telling you right now, the first thing you want to do in a crisis is to have cash ready to be spent, basically, on your MasterCard on your music, or whatever it is, right. So if usually, on average, you let's just say, you know, typically you keep about few hundred dollars on your debit card. And then the rest, you basically make expenses by let's say, your credit card. in a tough situation, I recommend increasing the amount of money on your debit card by at least five to six times. So if on average, you keep about $300 on your debit card, I want you to actually increase that number by somewhere up to 1500 or $1,800. inside of your debit card, you're saying well, why should I do that? The answer is the psychological impact that it will have on you. You see, I know so many investors, who made ridiculous mistakes, just because they needed the cash. I know a lot of property owners who sold their property at the worst possible time with major losses, because they needed the cash and they could not get it anywhere else. And some opportunist came along and said, Oh man, listen, this isn't a recession, I'm gonna buy your property, but 20% of the price of the market. And she's like, well, Oh, my gosh, what can I do? And guess what? That guy's not gonna see any other buyer anytime soon. It's a recession. So guess what he's sold the property below the market price. The appanoose got the property, waited for a few months or a years until you know, the recession was over and boom sold at a profit 20% above the market average. So that guy made 40% from that investment, while the other person lost all of that. In this case, the other person is lost was the opportunists when you don't want to make the same mistake, whether it is your stocks, just like dead men, I just bought all these stocks man and and they're coming down. The Dow Jones Industrial Average is coming down, man, s&p 500 is down, I'm looking my stocks are all red man. Well, in this situation, if you already have the cash in your bank account, you're not going to panic so much. And you can wait for the perfect moment. You see, most of the worst decisions we make during a recession come from us being extremely needy of some sort of cash basically help. And because of that, we end up making very bad decisions. We end up selling things we should simply hold on to we end up accepting projects, which are not actually accepting the business, because we somehow are not fit for this and was actually an end and the end ends up causing us a lot more losses than profits in the end, right. So because of is I want you from now to say okay, whenever I'm in a recession, the first thing I will do is to build financial defense. Now, what is financial defense simple, cash saved, not for investment. Not for some big purchase, not for some luxury purchase, not for a cool watch or a cool car. It's cash. Just to ensure that you will have enough money, if you happen to run out of cash, and guess what, you're very likely to run out of cash during a recession or a major crisis. And because of this, keeping cash on you is one of the most important thing you can do to prepare yourself mentally and emotionally for a recession. Other than that, after you've already put aside some cash, and now you have financial defense, the other steps are cutting back expenses, which is very, very important. Now, in a tough recession, generally, we have more free time. In the past, when we had to actually go to stores and starting to shop basically, in the stores, it was not as easy to actually spend a lot of money. But nowadays, you can just stay at home all the time, you got a lot of free time, because we're unemployed, and you're not working and the clients are not calling and there's none of this any sales being made. So you got the chance to guess what, look for some very good deals lucrative deals online, and start shopping it away. So you wonder the exact opposite. When things are looking tough, you need to remove as much of your consumers habits as possible, it might be a little bit difficult, because you know, you have a lot of free time. But one of the best ways you can cut back on your expenses, is to dedicate that time to some other productive pursuit, learning a new skill, or exercising, spend time with your family, do not spend a lot of free time randomly browsing the internet, because guess what's gonna pop up, you're browsing through the internet, and boom, another suggested post comes up on Instagram, recommending you to buy this and buy that. And if you have nothing to do, well, it seems like it's 30% off, why not? Let's try it. And you start wasting that money basically, without having anything to replace it with to the second part is cutting back on your personal expenses. And the same thing applies to your business. So if you are running a business, if you have some staff, it's Stop wasting money. I know a lot of my friends, when they're not making money, their business, they spent a lot of darn money trying to redecorate their offices or create new charts and put it there like they're actually spending more money even though they have no clients to serve. So you want to step on the brake pedal here and stop that, you know destructive behavior. When things are tough, the costs must be minimized as much as possible. The third element is actually becoming an opportunist understand, all recessions will bring the worst in people financially, this caused them that somehow panic, it causes them to somehow worry. And because of this, they're, they're very much likely going to make a lot of bad decisions. Remember that example I gave you earlier about that, you know, desperate gentlemen who wanted to sell his house because he needs the cash right now? Well, you could be the other guy in this situation, understanding in a very bad recession, most people are not willing to, you know, simply make purchases, or buy, especially assets, like real estate, and so on, like stocks, when the market is red, and everything is coming down. Most people are selling, that's why it's coming down. They're not buying, well, if you have enough cash to support you, and you feel emotionally and psychologically secure. Well guess what, now is the time to buy the stocks. If you have your mortgage setup, if you have a good credit history, and you see that you know that this guy is very desperate, he's putting an offer for real estate that is slightly below the marketplace. Why not go to his house, whatever offer he's got, reduce the amount by 10%. Make him an offer and say, You know what, buddy, I understand this. And I you just by the way, all the time, I'm going to give you a great recommendation to get good deals in real estate, far below the market. First of all, wait for a tough economic situation like this, or wait for any moment where the number of transactions come down. In this situation, people are not buying properties, you then look at all the offerings, and all the possible cases. And then you select whichever property you wants to, you know, basically purchase below the marketplace. So you kind of know the market price. And you said like this guy or this person is selling it at or below the market price. This itself shows that the seller is rather desperate is the kind of seller who failed to do his or her homework, who did not save enough cash for the tough moments. And now he's in need of money. And guess what? He's got nothing. He's got to sell the house. so in this situation, you think that gentleman or lady a call and say, Well, I'm pretty interested in your property, and I'd like to, you know, give you guys a visit. You go to the place, let's say the property, it's like, you know, let's say middle, basically a class type of, you know, property, three bedrooms, for example, and in a very good location and price approximately, let's say about $800,000 right. So, you know, the market value of this property is $800,000. However, you also know This is a very tough moment, and there aren't a lot of buyers. So here's what I recommend you guys to do. You go and say, Okay, I like your property. It's very nice. But I would like to buy it for $700,000. So you actually make an offer $100,000 below the, you know, the price they actually put on the website. And of course, we're going to say, Oh, yeah, for sure. Of course, I say No, man, I'm sorry, that's the lowest price possible, we can go below 800,000. It's a recession, there are a lot of buyers. So here's what you do. Grab your business card, write the amount that you want to buy it. So I grab my business card and write down $700,000 ready in cash right now call me hand that business cards to the gentleman. And then they might say like, well, man, let's negotiate. You say, Matt, no time for negotiation, man, I got to get going. You leave the place and you shut up. You don't call to say what's going on, you don't send a text message. Oh, by the way, you guys nothing. You hand out the card has got your number and the offers fixed 700,000 hundred k below the market price, give them the card, get out of the place and shut up. And wait. Ironically, in two out of three cases, you are going to be hearing a call back after a few weeks. Maximum one month, it's a recession. And you're gonna hear the call. So Mr. Molgan? Ah, well, you want to make the deal. And you say, Are you sure Sir, I give the price 700,000. I cannot offer anything more. Oh, sure. No problem, come over, boom, in the same period, that everybody is panicking, wasting their money, you will do the exact opposite. Because you're not panic, you got your you know, savings aside. So you can, you know, go through the, you know, currently this whole crisis without much difficulty. But not only you can survive through this crisis, why not thrive and get better. So guess what, congratulations, you just made a great purchase, in a recession, below the market price this way, a couple of years, four or five, six years. And you can sell it right back from my point of view with no less than 25% ROI. And that's pretty good on a property, you know, priced $800,000. So if you want to, you know, look at this perspective, you should become an opportunist in these tough economic situations. The same thing applies to businesses that are run online, e commerce, online sales, online consultancies and tutoring, various forms of online interactions, legal services, and as well as you know, anything that perhaps if you are into creating online games for your customers, if you're like a gaming company, anything that is online, will definitely go up in tough economic situations for a variety of reasons. And it's not just a pandemic. But if it's a tough situation, the chances are that illogical unemployment, and what do you think the unemployed do, sitting at home all the time, they're checking their phones, they're using the internet's So focusing your business and trying to make it as online as possible is another great way to not only survive through a pandemic or a major kind of crisis, but to thrive it. And the way to do so is very simple. You take your business as much online as possible, you're saying, Well, I'm selling chocolates, they got to come and smell it, no is not required to be smelled, just create that nice category on Instagram, perhaps start to promote that page, and then get the people to join in your websites to make a purchase online for you know, online delivery. Now it is pretty easy to deliver almost anything using a simple app to our customers, right. And if you are a consultant, if you are a let's say, you're a business consultant, so why not say From now on, we focus exclusively on doing sales via zoom, and then we deliver the you know, the goods on Skype or some other you know, online service, trying to take your business online will save a tremendous amount of time in transportation costs in traveling costs in case you have to fly to different cities or countries. And it allows you to make the same amount of money because nowadays, people are at home all the time, right? So the last stage, of course, was this one. And finally, I really believe that the biggest challenge of facing with an economic crisis is internal, it's psychological. It's that feeling that things will remain like this forever. So the biggest lesson for you today is to understand that in tough economic recessions, this too shall pass life, business and economies are all cyclical. So when one cycle ends, another begins and an economic recession will always see at the end, a turning point where things begin to get better. So please, no matter how how much your emotions are letting you down or saying Oh, things are gonna get worse. I know it's gonna get terrible. I know that all economic crises in the past were cycles, and no economic crisis lasted forever. It's just impossible by the very nature of Economics as well as you know, customer behavior, it's just impossible for any recession to last forever. It's just impossible. It's like it has to be somehow managed to be turnover, right? It has to somehow you know, for it to become a new trend. And then from then on, things get better, right. So, from now on, you heard a lot of great techniques about all these things. And you can use all of these, you know, techniques to get yourself to act differently in these tough situations and to hopefully not only manage to get through these difficult times, but actually profit and benefit from them in the long run as well. Alright guys, that's all the time we have for I hope you enjoyed the second basically entrepreneurial edition that we have offer for you here. And of course, if any other questions, you can actually contact me on social media on my website, or simply by sending me an email. That's all the time we have for I wish guys the very best. Let's go through this economic crisis. Not only safe and secure, but happy, probably a bit more profitable. Have a good one, and take care

Kanwar Gill graduated with a Master of Teaching from the University of Teaching and is an OCT certified teacher. He has been teaching for 10+ years, including being a Computer Science Teaching Assistant at the University of Toronto and tutoring students one-on-one. He has several years of experience as a software developer before transitioning to teaching. In this episode, Pouya sits down with Kanwar to talk about the impact of Covid on education and the path forward to a better future for education.   Kanwar's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/__kanwargill__/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/_KanwarG_ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gillkanwar/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript:----more----   Photo by Deleece Cook on Unsplash Music: Never Falter Written By Kevin Austin Graham Performed By Kevin Graham Produced By Kevin Graham   SUMMARY KEYWORDS students, parents, platform, teachers, learning, happen, education, school, kid, feel, online, big, home, uncertainty, impacted, situation, class, place, people, technology SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Kanwar   Pouya LJ  00:17 How's it going? Guys? How are you? Oh, pretty good. It's been a while we haven't had a podcast in I think a little over a year or about a year. I don't recall when it would leave.   Kanwar  00:28 So yeah, I think I should call it has changed a lot.   Pouya LJ  00:31 Yeah. And it feels long. Actually, I was thinking it's probably even less than a year. But you know, it feels much longer.   Kanwar  00:38 Yeah. Yeah, a lot has happened a lot for sure.   Pouya LJ  00:43 And, and a lot is going to happen, I reckon with the remainder of COVID with the US political, you know, weather election or whatnot. And who knows what else is 2020? Preparing for us?   Kanwar  00:58 Yeah, no, no, it's, it's, it's a pickle. It's kind of like not knowing what's going to happen, but just people still need to, you know, like, economy still has to go up. And it's, it's, I think it at this point, it kind of hinges on the vaccine, which we know a lot of companies are getting close to, hopefully, something will be done. And I think the vaccine would bring in some sense of peace and security for people as I go about, you know, their day to day tasks. True.   Pouya LJ  01:35 No, that's true, I think. I mean, until then, I don't I think that sense of uncertainty, as you put it is going to be, you know, having a lot of influence on on how people think and feel, and live decisions made politically by the officials. I mean, all of that are impacted by that sense of uncertainty. You're absolutely right. And with that, actually, that brings us to one of the fields that obviously, like everything was impacted by this phenomenon of COVID. But we're going to talk about today about education and how that's been impacted, because that's your wheelhouse. You've you work in that space, you read in that space, study, research, etc. So what I mean, obviously, a lot has changed. But if you were to, if you were to give us an intro to how education has changed, from your perspective, how would you describe it?   Kanwar  02:34 Um, good question. In terms of education, I mean, the instant need off, this is learning, online learning has skyrocketed, which has led to big changes in the industry. So you would have teachers, for example, in the public school, who probably don't, you know, they don't go towards online learning. But now they have no other option. And they have to, they have to get on it. And so that's one thing. Let's give me a second. Sure. So that's one thing for sure. That has changed. So you'd have these teachers who have to now understand how the online platform works. Zoom, for instance, you know, the US we're using zoom right now, for this podcast. We know how much the need for zoom instantly increased throughout the world. Right? Yeah. And not just in education, industry, but also in other from you name, small businesses, big businesses. Everyone has been using it. And that's a, that's a feel quite the nature of having something like COVID, which is an immediate, you know, like danger in a sense. We know that the death toll has now increased more than a million. So a lot has happened. And people you know, the second wave, as was announced by the Premier of Ontario, which has started officially. So, again, a lot of insecurity has led to online learning. That has been the biggest shift, in my opinion. And that's what I've seen as well. If you look at any sort of any sort of job postings, any sort of in the education field, any sort of hiring happening, there's some aspect of what you're learning attached to it now.   Pouya LJ  04:55 Oh, that's true. And I think a year ago, more than Have two people who are using the platform, let's say zoom currently haven't even heard of it. Yeah. And that shows you how much reliance it has. Because a lot of people who could work from home, they were working in offices perhaps and in different industries. Now, the the we're basically encouraged and forced to work from home. And while they are having to interact with each other holding meetings, perhaps, and how do you do that with tools such as Microsoft Teams, or, or Skype or zoom? zoom is one of the platforms is doing pretty great because of its quality and reliability, I suppose. And I believe that education, education, field also has came to embrace it, whether it's teachers from like holding their school classrooms at the end of the day. So at the end of last school year, which was the beginning of COVID, and lock downs, I suppose, in around March and April, I think everything had to move into online platforms, at least in Canada. Yeah. And I think, probably most of the world, I suppose, and, or halted, at least, depending on where you happen to reside. So did you did you have a first hand experience of how that affected students and teachers alike?   Kanwar  06:20 Um, definitely. So at the time, I was finishing my master's. Back in March, I mean, March, April, timeframe. And so I was working in a school at the time, as part of my program, doing some teaching, and also, you know, learning in that environment. And this was right, I got really lucky, actually. Because,   06:49 right,   Kanwar  06:50 before the March Break, is when I finished working in the school, and right, at the March Break, is when the premier made the announcement that the schools are not going to be opening again. So I didn't impact me, from that classroom experience point of view, I was able to have all of that done. But what happened is, schools did not go back after my trip. So they had it in, in theory, data, really extended mushrik now, and in this time, the, the province was figuring out what to do. Which means a lot of things were changing, right? So the parents, for instance, they couldn't, depending on where you work, employers were telling you to just work from home, parents were had to figure out how to do homeschooling. So there was no structure in place that Okay, these other resources, you can use, periods have to figure out, Okay, now I have to work my kid at home. And I was I also need to do my own work. So it's kind of like a pickle, right? That was a biggest change that happened. And I'm sure the students reacted a lot differently. Because now they're just home. Before there's something to look forward to, right in terms of going to school, they have this social circle, they interact, something to do outside of home, right. And that changed drastically for for everyone. And that was the immediate change that happened at the time. And that continued for a few weeks, before they decided they're not going to open the schools and online learning is the way to go. And at that point, teachers had to where they had to figure out in the current systems, a lot of teachers would be using Google Classroom. And there's another platform called Brightspace that is used, especially in the GTA area. And they have to basically figure out, Okay, now, you have to put everything on the platform so students can learn. And then some teachers decided to do online office offers where students could come in, ask questions, obviously, teachers would have started getting a lot of emails from the students now. Before that wouldn't be the case as much. So responding to that, I heard a lot of teachers in my own circle, who were definitely been bombarded with a lot going on. And it led to a lot of, you know, stress in terms of time management, okay. Like, there's the nine to five was blurry. It's not like you're working starting in the morning. It could be replying to emails in the in the evening. And you have to make sure you're supporting the students. So it was what it was. And that's how the school year continued. And now we have that's pretty much what happened during this summer. While the province was figuring out what to do with the entire city.   Pouya LJ  10:01 Right. Yeah. And so yes, that and that was probably the speed of onset uncertainty, that was the time of absolute uncertainty because we didn't even know what we're dealing with. Yeah, in terms of the virus in terms of how to and you were right, we, we didn't have resources in place, right. Like right now, there is a degree of preparation, even if the classes are in person, depending again, depending on where you are, maybe the classes are still online. But like, as of now, I believe nothing has changed. Because things changing very quickly, in Ontario, people are going in person with some consideration to schools, but there is a degree of preparation that schools, students and teachers, everybody has in their mind that they might even go back to fully online again, or right now, maybe part partially is online, like, for example, two things are happening online, most of it at least, at least as much as possible. So yeah, so there are the the speaking of uncertainty, that was the absolute of it, I suppose the or the maximum of it, as we experienced during these times. Now, we talked a lot about prospective teachers and parents and, and a little bit students. But did you did you hear any immediate feedback of how students were taking this? This this whole thing?   Kanwar  11:20 Yeah, it's, uh, you know, it's it's students for them, you could imagine that I'm just learning online, especially for somebody who was not engaging with technology or learning through technology. In the past, it was a big, big shift, right. And those students absolutely hated online learning, because part of it was doing something that was given to them through the online platform with their parents, and they absolutely hated working with the parents. Because they just want to get out of that kind of environment. And that was definitely a struggle, even at the time. I remember, Google Classroom, which is one of the big platforms, they even have a an app right on, depending on iOS, or Android. And at the time, back in March, April, and this was through North America, as far as I know. Lot of students started giving really poor feedback to that app on the App Store. So the actual star rating went down for Google Classroom. And students absolutely hated it. And that was, you know, quite evident of, Okay, what the students are feeling or they're feeling that this is something that is not a substitute for their experience, or the platform is just missing a lot, right? Like, I'm checking right now on on App Store, and Google Classroom has 160,000 ratings. And the rating that I see right now is 1.6, out of five. Oh, wow. So that's, yeah. And then this app is rated number one in education. So definitely, there's, I'm sure Google took a lot of that feedback, and started to make changes, because they're like, well, if students are really hating, they don't like how it feels. All that, but not to be honest, not much has changed the platform. So they just made minor changes. And students still feel the same. In terms of online learning. Currently, the students that are going to school, and parents realize that it's important for the students, you know, the kids to go to school, because even in the midst of COVID, as long as the safety protocols in place, right. And that's, you know, that's a good expectation to have. You can't rely on that expectation to be followed through entirely, right. So that's something it's it's you don't know what's going to happen. But you have good faith, and you're going to send your kid to the school. And that's what's happening. That's what happened when the schools open again in September, with safety protocols in place, but again, like I said, before, looks like and it's a little, again, create creates a bit of an E an ease, because what's happening again, is like, we feel the structure is missing. show their students in school, you know, the safety protocols, they say, but what's happening is if the students Feels a certain way, the teacher would typically just tell them that, okay, I can't I don't know what's going on. But you can be in the classroom. I see, though, what, what, what's happening now, speaking of today, what's happening now is, okay, we have a lot of influx of the students going to these COVID assessment centers and getting tested. Right, so the the, there's a influx, the load has increased, which means the testing before it was like, within one or two days has now moved to like five to six days. So, you know, and that is even upended by the second wave. But if ever, and added an experience recently, to check out a, you know, one of the COVID assessment centers, and in the line that I saw there, I would say more than 80% were parents with their kids. Wow. And that's just speaks to it. And I feel like that's, you know, it's, here's what's happening. So kids want to go to school. But if they get turned away for something, now, the kid is going to have a totally different experience, right? They're not in school, they're going to go through this COVID assessment center. And, you know, that's a whole different world, right? It's like something you wouldn't expect, that we kind of never went through that when we were their age. And for them to go through that. It's just I feel changes their whole entire perspective of their life and what, what, what is to come when they become an adult? Right. So that's, I think, one of the big changes that are happening for the students. This understanding the world we're living in, especially at the developmental age, right, where they don't really understand developmentally, what COVID means, how it affects everyone, they're, they're just kids they want to play, they want to have fun, right? We all went through that. And to to, to an extent, it's kind of unfair to see, okay, you know, what, they're missing on some things. But in the bigger picture, are we doing what we can to protect everyone around us?   Pouya LJ  17:16 Right? Yeah, no, that's, that's fair. And, yes, it is a bit unfair in that they have to, you know, deal with this through no fault of their own. And, you know, I, as you mentioned, especially as a younger age, where, when they're a little bit really not aware, or even care about what COVID is, they just want to do what they want to do and learn and grow and move forward. That's a fair point. Now, moving forward, do you? Do you see, so how do you see education, let's say a vaccine comes along, let's say the best case scenario, everything moves away? Do you see the education going back to what it was? And if not, what have we learned? What have you learned in this from from all of this? And how can we make education even better than the quote unquote, normal? How can we make it improved upon?   Kanwar  18:12 Right? So in terms of the education, a lot has changed, we've seen that in terms of, you know, the teaching platform, the experiences, what you're learning, one thing that I feel has been a, you know, big benefit of whatever is going on, is the fact that there, the need for collaboration has increased, which means you can collaborate easily on a global scale. Because everyone has a shared problem. So everyone wants to help each other out. So there are platforms, especially in the education field, you know, use certain platforms for say, you want to do an online quiz, you want to you want to have students create posters, there are platforms like canva.com or pictou chart that, you know, before COVID, they, if you had to use certain features, you have to pay for it. But what they did was they understood the need for helping everyone. And they read that entire fee on their platform. So as a teacher, you could just go there now.   Pouya LJ  19:22 And this again, is it can Canva canvas.com or, yeah,   Kanwar  19:26 cannot chart. There's another website called knowledge hook. Specific, specifically good for math in Ontario. And a lot of these platforms, you know, had some sort of features that a lot of features you get access to after you pay the premium, right. But they've waived that in the need off, helping each other out. And Nearpod was another platform that did that. And that was I felt a really good intention. Because you are adapting to this change. You're being flexible, and you are helping each other out. So these platforms, we're not really thinking from a monetary point of view, but really, from a point of view where they want to help the teachers out there. And that's what they did. And a lot of teachers made use of that. And I know for myself, I made use of it. Because I know for a fact that these premium features really give me a lot of flexibility of how I can create my content, how I can assess do assessments in the class. And that was a big, big shift. And so going back to your question, with education going forward, being flexible, or adapting to the change, even if you're not a person who likes change, and that was something that was, you know, in a sense, thrown at you, and you have to now change. So as a teacher, ensuring you know, you are flexible with whatever platform you're given. Now, obviously, look, we don't we can't have the experience you do in class, on an online platform. Okay. So that's something that would be different for sure. You can imagine from a, from a first day point of view, where you build class community where you build these relationships in the class, through the online platform, that would be way different. Okay, the student will still get to know you. But that relatability might not be to that personal level, as it would be in the class. Right, if you show care for a student in the class, they can see it, right? If you show care for a student and online platform, that means creating a safe environment, you know, not having any bullying or any foul language, and you can, there's tools that you can really control in the platform itself, to enable that, but like I said, you could have even face to face, like what we're doing with our video chats, and that would bring in some sort of relatability. But still, it's it's, as long as you don't see the person in actual life, you know, it's it's a whole different experience. And that's something that, you know, it's going forward, that's something that would be again, mixed together in like a hybrid model, to some extent, a lot of schools that have the resources they are doing in person, okay, we have private schools, independent schools, they have the resources, they have the funding. And they can, you know, create that six feet apart distance in the class, and also support students online at the same time, for the students who don't want to come to the class. For for other scenarios, such as public school system, that's a little different. Because what's happening now is more students, instead of coming to class, they want to just go online, because cases are rising again. So the need for online teachers of the game increased. And at the same time, we have teachers in class who are providing support. But again, like I said, the structure I feel is still not there completely, where the teachers are, you know, completely confident of being in the class and supporting the students in the class. Okay, so they still have that kind of uncertainty. And I feel going forward, that uncertainty will go down. Being that environment, it's natural for you to feel, you know, have that sense of being uncomfortable, because we don't have measures in place to protect against this, you know, novel coronavirus, and that will change going forward, there'll be more comfort in the class, eventually, there will be some sort of a hybrid model that will be put in place, obviously, online platforms will have changed drastically. Teachers will now not they will have if if ever they have to teach online, they wouldn't have. They will be there would be less resistance to that now. So that's another benefit. Technology definitely has. We, it's it's it's a perspective where a lot of, for example, teachers who would always say our technology has done this and this and this, you know, maybe having a negative point of view of what technology is doing. And now they see the benefits of technology that, you know, really makes a huge, huge difference. Right? If there was no technology learning would have stopped altogether. Right. And that's a that's a big, big benefit of living in this 21st century, even in the midst of a deadly virus. But you know, we have to tools in place that still make sure that we are connected and we don't lose contact and learning is still going on.   Pouya LJ  25:07 Yeah, it didn't. It. It helped to, you know, keep the momentum to a degree going, obviously, it, a lot of it got stopped and a lot of things got interrupted, for sure. But with a little bit of extra preparation and extra time. Yes, you're absolutely right. We got some of that momentum going. Online, he definitely online through technology. Yeah, absolutely. That's correct. And so speaking of So, I mean, obviously, the negatives are abundant and fairly obvious to degree, there were some that were not far off perhaps from somebody who doesn't have the perspective that you do. But nobody doubted that there is going to be a lot of negatives for students, teachers, the whole education system in the whole society, from every angle from this, but I honestly, I really like silver linings, I like to see things in a positive light and see what what positives actually came out of it. And part of it is what you said, We learned a lot, how we can mitigate technical use technology to mitigate the situation, whether this, and let's face it, who knows when the next pandemic hits, it could be 100 years, 200 years, it could be the next decade, it could be tomorrow, who hasn't seen after this. So point being we are living in a relatively new normal, even post vaccine, let's say there's going to be always that sense, at least for this generation that has experienced it. The sense that the immediacy of any kind of disaster, and how that can affect lives of people all around the world and education. So is there any positive we can take out of this? And and, you know, and improve upon it, make it better?   Kanwar  26:53 Yeah, definitely. Look. So with, we know, technology has been a benefit, we know that there are ways we can stay connected in terms of learning in terms of reaching out in terms of not losing contact, and that's a big, big benefit of in any industry for for that. And I feel going forward, one lesson that we have definitely learned is, you know, technology can really IID a lot of learning. In this case, it can actually even rip, to some extent it can replace, in class learning, and to a lot of extending can extend learning, right. So that replacement and extension is one thing. And again, everyone felt different with that. But the truth is, that is what technology helped us with. And we all feel really happy about that, because students are not like, they didn't feel that they're learning just stopped altogether. And that's one of the big lessons with, you know, this whole situation, how it has unfolded, we can still stay connected. Another big lesson, I would say is our reactions are adaptability to change. And that is something that you know, everyone has a different change threshold. Everyone can somebody can change. Within a day somebody can cheat it takes, you know, a year or two years to to make a big change. And with something like Coronavirus and with this whole situation. Now you don't have that flexibility to wait one or two years, you have to do it today. So it helped people push themselves. And you know, it's for some it would have been easy for some he would have been really challenging, but really walking through that. And really understanding Okay, this is for the betterment of the students, because in the education field, you always put the students first. They're at the center of everything that you do, and their needs come first. And that's really what it comes down to. Right. If you think about it from that lens. You know, I don't care about learning something new because I'm happy that and the students in my class are going to be not left behind. Right. And another big lesson with something like this, students now see, okay, the world is not full of bells and whistles its world is a nasty place to. And that's that is something that is you learn about in history, but now you're living it. And that's something that the students are experiencing for sure. And you know, there's a silver, big silver lining there because the students, the young generation, they have the capability to work in this industry where they can form solutions. There's a big, big research happening right now with the universal Right. And that's something that, you know, I'm I don't know how, what timeline we're looking at where this universal vaccine will exist for anything that would ever happen. You can imagine now, what was that ideology, we have these younger generation, who will, what, what's gonna happen is they will become more and more ambitious on, on taking on these challenges, and tackling these challenges because there's a immediate need, there's an actual need, it's not about making the world a better place. It's about protecting your world, it's about protecting and caring for the future generation, because the reality is, the virus impacts has impacted people across a whole different age group, right? It's initially was the older group, but now we have, we have seen trend where it's affecting everyone. And that's the bottom line. So everyone, if you think of it, from a humanity point of view, I feel like that's a big shift that will happen for the younger generation, because they would see the need, okay, you know, what, there is something out there and I can be part of the solution. Right, and not part of the problem. And that's, I feel it's a huge, huge silver lining in this whole situation. And I feel the students will really, and this is what we see all the time in the you know, we want to create citizens who are engaged, who are responsible, who are, you know, they want to make changes in their community, they want to make changes wherever they live, right, because change starts from your community, and then moves upward. But now, with the technology in place, you can really make a change through technology, and you can help each other out. So many possibilities has opened up. And that whole message of helping each other out and looking for each other looking out for each other. That's a big silver lining from this entire situation.   Pouya LJ  31:58 Yeah, that's very, very, very fair. And very positive. I liked the message. And I also want to for the last final point, I want to put the parents in focus, I suppose because I think from a very early on, especially, especially early on, and even now, you mentioned some of it, that they they're very engaged, very concerned, obviously about their children's education, their health and their family's health, etc. But on top of that, again, especially early on, and a lot of them still now have to enhance to, you know, handle the kids well, where previously they would send them to school, they would go to work themselves, now they have to work and at the same time, they have a kid at home and they're working at home or even if they're going outside to work if you're there, for example, first responders or what have you. Then what do you do with your with your child at home? Right, so that there has been a lot of challenges for parents. Obviously, the kids are not happy, they're acting up at times, they're, they're upset about the situation, you have to help them out. So there's there's, I think there were a lot of challenges coming our ways of parents more than ever before. Obviously, parenting is never easy. And number. Nobody ever said that. It's easy, but I think it was at a level up in the past few months. And I'm sure you had some experiences with the parents through their children that you're, you know, educating online or other ways. And did you have any? Do you have any words of I don't want to call it advice, but of consolation or anything that you want to talk to parents directly about or, you know, give them a message or give their message to us to the rest of us. Yeah.   Kanwar  33:49 One thing from I've just as a recent experience, where one of the parents, you know, that their child was sent back home, because their child was not feeling well. And, and the child shows up at home. And he says, mom, my stomach doesn't feel good, right? And my mother's like, What? Why doesn't few babies I got her. No, it doesn't feel good. And the mom said, Okay, did you go Did you poop this morning? And he said, No, I did not. And she like, do you have to poop? And he said, Yeah, I have to fuke and he goes to the washroom when it comes out and he's feeling finding starts playing outside. So the concern is in the air, okay. The concern is in the air. Now imagine from a kid's point of view, right kid, the kid is just being a kid. At their age, you know, they might have so many things going on, but we can't. We don't know for sure what we can pinpoint it on. Right. So there's that uncertainty from that point of view. And that applies to teachers. teachers could be concerned because they have kids at home. So the teachers who are parents, they are concerned, there's no simple answer to this, right? I can't, I can't say that no, if any, if somebody's feeling wonky, just let them be in the classroom. Because that I feel is, you know, we don't really know what it can be. And that would come down from the school, how the school is reacting to it, if the school says, okay, you know, this happens, it's okay, we can discount it. If not, then these are the policies we will have in place. Okay, and you follow that. And that's really what it comes down to is you'll have a consensus, everyone in the school agrees to what they're doing. And they have the parents on board. That's important, because the parents are not on board. Or, you know, it's not about putting parents on board, because you could have disagreements, but having ensuring the parents are communicated properly, so they know what's going to happen. And that will help parents really, you know, make arrangements to have to, because you don't The last thing you want is your kid showing up home and you have to go to work. Now. What are you going to do that? Right? It's a lot of uncertainty. You can imagine the pain on the parents behalf, like, what do I do now? And their frustration, right? their frustration with the school? Because they're like, okay, the schools open, and now you send my kid home, like, why would I send my kid to school, when something comes up, and you're gonna send it back to me. So if that was the case, I would have just kept mice tried at home. And that's really the unpredictability that we're seeing right now. Parents have to understand that if you're sending your kid to school, the intentions are, you know, the kid will get the opportunity to be in school in that environment. But there are a bunch of things that comes with it. And that's something that the whole family must be okay with. Because what happens if tomorrow, they say, the kid is having symptoms, and now you have to isolate? Right? The isolation 14 days, that means lost money, that could mean lost connection, it's so many things. And every situation is different, right? I can't I can't generalize it. Everyone have their own situation? And as a parent, if that's what you're deciding to do, you must have those things in place. Okay, what is my backup plan? What is plan? a? What is Plan B? If in the case that my child was to come home? Okay, can one parent be at home work remotely? Can we have those? some sort of a system in place? Or can have extended family? Can I give my kids to someone else? Who can take care? Or can I go, if I have a cottage, can we go to the cottage and isolated the cottage, a lot of those. Those are the important things that have to be thought before you make the decision of sending your child to school because I've have seen parents where they just get frustrated with the whole situation, because they had not expected the child to be sent home. Right. So you have to be prepared for that. And for parents, who are first responders, parents who are in the line of work where they protect people, you know, it's it comes down to what you decide as a parent. But the bottom line is this, we know the virus is deadly, we know the virus, you know, it's still out there, it's not completely gone off the face of the planet. So you have to keep in mind that we are living in a new world, which means that the kids still have to go to the school, they still have to do some sort of learning. But Add to that the fact that we are living in a different world now. Okay, so that's something because it could happen. And I've seen even for myself, where, you know, you can start to get more and more complacent in terms of Okay, you know, what, I don't see much going on around me. So I think I'm okay. You know, and but that's looking at your local lens. But if you really look at the global what's going on. Again, that is not the case. Right? And we have to always keep in mind that okay, we are living in a new reality. And this is what I want. These are my goals. I want my kid to get some learning, can I can I send my kid to school, knowing that they can be asked to be tested? And that means going to code center and you know, that's another four to five hours you have to wait in line. Am I ready to do that? Or am I rather me rather okay with not sending my child to school, having them stay at home and learn? And do I have something in place where someone else is at home? With the child right? So those Are the those are the two situations that all the parents are really dealing with right now, in addition to their own full time, whatever they do. So it's not easy. It's not it's definitely made parenting, I would say 1000 times more challenging.   40:17 And   Kanwar  40:18 especially when you have both parents as working, imagine both parents as first responders, it just changes a whole whole scenario what to do now. And that's really, I feel the pickle. But really, having those goals sorted out would make it much, much easy, manageable, in a sense to tackle with, okay, if this can happen, okay, that's, that's okay. Because we have something in place to manage that. Because that would bring a sense of comfort, less frustration. And at the same time, you know, the learning will go on. And that's really should be the goal, right, the learning will go on, and the learning should never stop.   Pouya LJ  41:02 Yeah, and let's hope that and let's hope everything improves, not regress, I suppose that's, that's all we can do. We can basically, this is a situation we have to deal with, at the end of the day, whether we like it or not, and that's a nobody likes it. And some have it worse than others, of course, yeah. And some have it better and, but at the end of the day, all of us have to deal with something new that mostly we don't want to exactly our ideal, but that's life. And then things happen. Obviously, we want to be proactive about these things and make sure they don't happen in the first place. But we also want to be prepared for the possibility of them happening. And that's the lesson we should carry on, I think, moving forward. But at the same time, we're not done with this. And we have to think about all aspects. And and I think one of the things that helps me a lot to deal when I'm dealing with other people especially is that I put myself in their shoes and understand their pain. And that helps me generate some empathy that otherwise I would not be able to where I would judge them harshly. Definitely unnecessarily. So yeah, let's let's hope for the better. And thank you, camera for joining us for this illuminant illuminating conversation.   Kanwar  42:12 Thank you for having me. It's great to have this really important discussion and the world we live in right now.

How many times have you set a goal for yourself just to see nothing happened after a few months? The truth is that you cannot achieve your goals, you can only come up with a series of habits that once repeated often and long enough would lead to the achievement of your goals.    In this episode Daniel will discuss system thinking as opposed to goal thinking so that our focus is shifted away from merely what we want and towards creating the systems that will lead to getting what we desire.    Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript:----more----   Music: R Naught Written By Kevin Austin Graham Performed By Kevin Graham Produced By Kevin Graham   SUMMARY KEYWORDS habits, goal, system, achieve, mandarin chinese, spend, pandemic, routines, social media, life, chinese, practice, income, morning, repeat, app, instagram, replacing, single, olympics SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:13 Hello, and welcome to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast, this solo edition. My name is Daniel Molgan. And welcome to this program where today we're going to talk about the issue of goal setting by means of creating a system. As opposed to just having our goals in our heads. You see, guys, traditional goal setting tells us that if you want to achieve a goal, just set a goal, I want to do this, for example, I want to lose weight, I want to run my own business, I want to run for the office, I want to get married, so on and so forth, you can you know, set all these goals for yourself. And that's, of course, all great. We have taught this to all of our basically graduates of our programs again and again. But the fact of the matter is that Unfortunately, most cases, having a goal alone does not allow you to actually achieve it if you just have that goal in your head and are not creating the systems required to make them happen. So we're actually going to talk about the issue of what it really means to put places basically, in your schedule, where you have certain activities where you are doing them again and again and again, to achieve your goals. So what is the difference between a goal and a system? A goal is what you want to achieve in your life. For example, I want to lose weight, I want to learn to speak Mandarin Chinese, I want to find the love of my life. These are sending them simple examples of having a goal for yourself. Now, what is a system? A system is what you should be doing regularly and repeatedly to achieve those goals. So think of for example, those three goals I gave you earlier, for example, you want to learn Mandarin Chinese, that's a goal. Now how can you actually create a system to make that happen, you may say, I will download this specific app with a reminder every morning, that will tell me to practice some Mandarin Chinese for about 15 minutes every morning, pray go to work. That's exactly one of my routines that I've done for him for many years now. And this is now a system. A system is a habit, and a process that you engage in regularly to achieve your goals. Unfortunately, most of us were not so good at creating those systems, we think about the goals like listen, I want to do this, for example, I wants to find the love of my life, right? That's a simple goal that a lot of people have. But people rarely think about what kind of system do I need to put in place, or I will engage in certain types of behavior on a regular basis in order to achieve that goal. So for this goal, for example, you can say, I will start talking to an attractive member of the opposite gender, once every day for the next 30 days, until I find someone that actually matches basically my desire as well as my criteria for a good partner. And this now is a system. So anytime you leave the house, the brain says, alright, I have a task today, I must talk to one attractive lady today. And hopefully, one of them will be the kind of woman that I want as my wife as a mother of my children, and so on and so forth. Right. So now you have a system. So you don't even think about the goal. And that's the beauty of having a system. You see, if instead of thinking about just your goals, you create systems that will lead to the achievement of that goal, you don't even have to think about your goals. So the man who says I will practice Chinese 50 minutes, basically every day using this particular app before going to work, he doesn't have to think about his goal of becoming fluent Mandarin Chinese in 234, or five years. If he just repeats that system regularly, he will get there. The same thing applies to the man who wants to find a good wife, the guy who goes and talks an attractive lady once per day every day for I don't know, 30 days or two months or three months, he or she will eventually find the right partner, even if he forgets about the original goal of getting married, and having a family because in the process of going through the system of meeting, for example, one attractive lady every day talking to her to see if she's a good match. And then perhaps inviting her asking her out on a date to actually see if she's going to be a good fit. He will eventually find you know the right woman for him. And it's just going to be part of the system, regardless of what the goal was originally, right. So perhaps, maybe the original goal was to become fluent and let's say Mandarin Chinese, and instead of actually studying Mandarin, he says I'm going to play this Chinese for example game every morning. And after a while, instead of focusing on the you know, learning the Chinese he gets hooked up on the game elements of that Chinese game. So the original goal is not forgotten. Completely. And now he's This system is focused now on getting good at this game, instead of learning the Mandarin Chinese. so in this situation since the system is, you know, inclined to focus on the game, rather than the language, in the long term, of course, he will fail to at the target of achieving that, you know, fluency, which means we never fail in goal setting. We all do it all the time. Now, some of us, we don't set them as often as we should. But you rarely if ever fail in achieving your goals, because you did not set the goal. That's just not going to happen. And unfortunately, in most cases, we fail to achieve our goals, because we fail to set the right systems in place that if we're good enough, would allow us to achieve those goals. So today, I would like you guys to think more about this issue. Think about goal setting a new way, as opposed to just goals and deadlines, which we use traditionally, ask yourself, instead of being obsessed with whether or not is the right goal, what kind of system can I set in place for me to actually work on those things on a regular basis? That's what you have to focus on most of the time. So when it comes to setting systems to achieve those goals, obviously the question is, what types of activities, if done regularly, will get me closer to achieving that goal, I've already given two examples, learning language, raising a family, but this could really apply to anything. Let's move on to business, you say, I want to increase my income by 25%. In the middle of a recession fueled by pandemic, that's right. During the same time, where a lot of businesses are shutting down, there are a few entrepreneurs who are actually increasing their income. Why? Because they have the goal to you know, make more money? I don't think so. You see, all businesses would like to increase their income. I mean, that's by default, no one business do you know, anyone business was like, No, I don't want to make money, I want to make less money. So it's kind of like you know, the Olympics, when it goes to the Olympics, and you look at all the athletes, one of them is going to be, you know, the gold medal winner, right. So one of them will be the number one top winner of that competition. So the person or the people who do not achieve that goal, and settle for the, let's say, silver medal or the bronze medal or simply cannot win any metal, do you think that those guys do not have the goal of becoming an Olympic champion. Of course, not. Every single person who takes part in the Olympics wants to be the champion, every business owner would like to increase their income. Every time you talk to basically an attractive member of the opposite gender, your goal is to hopefully have the best possible relationship with a suitable mate to raise a family with. Anytime you want to learn a subject you really want to get. I mean, you really want to get good. For example, at speaking Chinese you have the goal, you have the desire. So the problem here is not the goal. Because goal is there and everybody has them. The question is, do you have the right system. So the winner of the Olympic is going to be the person who has in basically in place, a system that allowed him or her to practice in the right way repeatedly, until having that body and that ability that allowed him or her to win the Olympics, the same thing goes with businesses who succeed in the middle of a pandemic, or those who are had with their relationships or achieve their educational goals. So from today, I'm trying to encourage you guys to look at goals a little bit differently, away from what is my goal, and focus more on what system do I need to put in place to achieve them? Now, systems generally, are links to habits, that means that almost everything we do these days, it's because of the habits that we have generated before. Most of us actually are running on autopilot most of the time. And because of this, you need to ask yourself, what kind of habits do I want to generate for myself, in order to achieve the kind of life that I have? So right now, every single one of you guys listening right now, you have certain habits, probably many of them that you repeat on a daily basis. Some of you wake up in the morning, and the first thing you do is to grab that phone and jump on social media. That's a very common habit. Some of you have a habit of wicked one morning and immediately, the moment you you know, you're afoot for example, such as the, you know, the, let's say floor, you start doing meditation. Some of you have a habit of wicked, I'm saying, oh, gosh, not another Tuesday. I'm so tired. You see, that's just one single habit. Maybe then you move on. Maybe some of you have a habit of waking up and just lighting up a cigarette. So these are all habits. And then we go throughout the day, repeating these habits, and thinking that this is just a habit. It's just too Aim. But ironically, changing your destiny and achieving the kind of goal that you really want for yourself is only possible if you start to look at the habits that you have every single day, and then try to, you know, change that. What essential aspects again, How the hell did you learn all these languages? Like, how do you do that? I say very simple. What do you do when you have your phone with you? They say, Well, I checked social media all the time. So I spell it, it's like, How much time do you spend on Instagram, for example, or on Facebook, and they say, well, three, four hours per day, I say, three to four hours. And there's a lot of good material in there, I just try to look at them, there's pretty fun. I say, Well, I spent about two and a half hours every day on practicing different languages. So you see, during the same time that you are browsing through useless posts, of celebrities, and like, you know, brainless entertainment on social media, which is a habit by the way for you every single day, checking people's stories, and all those things I am doing my flashcards I am practicing, you know, let's say my language is using my favorite apps such as Duolingo, memorize, and so on. So this is a habit. So when I work in the morning, the first thing I do is, as you already guessed, to do my Mandarin Chinese practice, because that's the hardest thing that I'm currently studying. And of course, I have to practice a lot, of course, then I move on to the other tasks. So I tell myself, if I have not done my Mandarin Chinese practice, which is, by the way, not that long, it takes no more than 15 minutes of my time, every morning, I'm not going to move on to the next task unless I have a very serious emergency. And then you ask yourself, alright, so I should probably cut back on Instagram, then I can do whatever I want. Not so much. So because if you want to get rid of a bad habit, you have to have the right again system in place to get you to towards what you want. So ultimately, it doesn't matter what your goals are, if you don't have the right habits, and the right routines, you can never possibly achieve them. You're saying well, then I want to be financially wealthy. I asked you one simple question. What are your financial systems in place? They're saying What are you talking about my financial system, a financial system is the way you approach your money. So right now, think about, you know, your income during the last month. Okay. Think of you know, last month, which for most of you guys, of course, if you're listening to us, you know, recently would be September. So think of your income in the month of September? How much did you earn? And then go back to your let's say, for example, of financial app, and then perhaps, or your bank app? And then look at your expenses? So how much did you basically spat using your master Visa card during the last month? And then compare these two? Did you make the same amount of money that you actually spent all of it? Did you perhaps managed to spend less than you earned? Or did you actually spend more than you earn, and added some credit on the side? So that's a simple habit, a very simple habit of not spending more than you earn. But guess what happens? Think of someone who has one simple system in place. And his entire financial system can be summed up by one thing. I look at my income during last month, that's a month of September. And let's say the amount was $6,000, for example, and I tell myself, that I must spend less than $6,000 during the month of October. So what do you think the future of this person looks like financially? do you predict him to go broke all of a sudden? Is that likely? Probably not? And what about the opposite? What if somebody actually is making $4,000 a month, and is just going to spend all of it? So what type of future will he have probably always dependent on the next paycheck, like most Americans, or think of somebody else who has probably made two or $3,000. And things are tough in the economy, and actually spent 5000 we're gonna future Do you see for him or her financially? You see, ultimately, your life is shaped by the habits and the systems you have in place that you repeat on a regular basis, because anything applies to your fitness. So how often do you go to the gym? How often do you care about what you're eating? How often do you, you know, take care of your basically amount of hours that you put into, you know, your sleep, having a good night, good nicely. You see, ultimately, once you try to look at your life and yourself as a series of habits that you have, then all of a sudden realize, oh boy, all I got to do is change a few of my habits, and whammo, my entire life will change. So today I'm actually asking right now, think about your life right now, at this moment. From the moment you wake up until you go to bed. What habits are you repeating good or bad? Think of some good habits that you can actually add to your life right now what could they be? Perhaps going for a jog every morning? Instead of letting a cigarette or having, you know, very heavy coffee? How about replacing the habit of social media as I have done, you probably have noticed this. After finishing the book together, I actually substantially I reduced my social media, basically usage to a very minimum, of course, in terms of usage, I'm probably close to zero. Now, I almost do not consume any material on social media. But of course, I've also reduced my postings as well, because I wanted to have that time available to do other things. Right. So how about replacing excessive usage of social media? with some other beneficial educational activity? How about replacing Instagram? Not completely, of course. But let's say you spend one or two hours per day on Instagram, how about spending only 10 minutes on Instagram, and then dedicate the rest of that time to studying a foreign language to learning a new trade, getting an online education, where there's I don't know, MBA, or whatever it is, what about, you know, putting that time for your health? How about using that time to exercise you see, by nearly changing these little things you do every single day, and then repeating those again, and again, and again, you will then change your destiny in ways you cannot even think of as possible today, because those changes are going to somehow accumulate, and they will exponentially change your life in the long term. So today, as you're currently listening, I want you right now, to go through your entire routines every single day. Maybe you spend a little bit too much time playing Dota. Maybe you spend a lot of time watching Netflix, even though you don't even like it so much. Perhaps you're not physically active enough? How could you change some of these things? How would you find ways for you to create and installed new habits in your life that will allow you to repeat good behaviors and avoid bad ones. Because ultimately, once you have the right systems in place, for example, for going to gym, you can create a system. And the system is anytime I leave work, I immediately go home, grab basically my, let's say, yours and run to the gym. That's one system. Or you can simply have a system that come You know, you come home, and you grab that beer, and you start you know, drinking beer watching TV, both our systems, but they will have dramatically different results in the long term. So having discussed all of these things today, I would like to now encourage you guys to take this very seriously and start looking at your life as a series of habits fueled by their own systems that you repeat again and again and again, throughout the day, day after day, week, after week, month after month, year after year, you are your habits, you are your routines. There are moments in the middle that you break all that routine, and you start traveling and you go to a party. But those are not what you do regularly unless that's your job or something. So for most of us, we have to look at the things we do on a routine basis. And now of course, thanks to the pandemic, a lot of us we have, you know, more time available to spend indoors. And this gives us a great chance to reflect again, you can go home during a pandemic and say, Well, I got nothing to do, let me just waste another two hours on the darn social media. Or you can take that time to start reflecting itself a system that allows you to make your life better and better by thinking about what you're doing right now and how you can take it to the next level. So ultimately, today, I wanted to encourage you to relook at your life differently, to see yourself as nothing more than a series of routines that you repeat again and again and again. And understanding that if you want to change your destiny, if you want to change your life, you don't just need to create new goals. I mean, that's just very obvious. But more importantly, than having new goals is to creating new systems and habits that will allow you to achieve those goals and get the best results possible. So overall, that's all the time we have for today. I really would like to thank all of you for your attention. The podcast, fortunately, is becoming more and more popular among our listeners. And we would like to thank all of you for tuning in for every single episode to check all of our programs. As you realize now we have a lot of new additions to our podcast and we're trying to offer you as much as possible. And obviously if you have any questions you can always contact us directly or simply wishes on the social media. That's all the time we have for my name is Daniel Morgan and this was beyond the present podcast.

Fuzzy logic is an approach to computing based on "degrees of truth" rather than the usual "true or false" (1 or 0) Boolean logic on which the modern computer is based.  It is a form of many-valued logic in which the truth values of variables may be any real number between 0 and 1 both inclusive.   Govind's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/gov218/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/govindmohan218/?originalSubdomain=ca   Deep's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/neuronsrcool/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Deepneuron LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/deepprasad/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Music: Parliament's Crisis Written By Cody Kurtz Martin Performed By Cody Martin Produced By Cody Martin   Episode Transcript:----more----       SUMMARY KEYWORDS reality, true, logic, people, thinking, idea, language, point, universe, objective reality, humans, thought, fuzzy, experiment, paradox, nature, question, probability, false, thoughts SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Govind, Deep   Pouya LJ  00:16 Hey guys, how's it going?   Govind  00:19 Nice, amazing. Toronto. Good weather.   00:23 Yeah, no, it's surprisingly hot. Yeah.   Pouya LJ  00:29 So it's been a while, since we talked. Let's see each of you. What's up with you. Let's start with you guff?   Govind  00:39 Well, for those that don't know, I have a startup called Virtual systems that focuses on network security using information theory, principles, and networking, to have a flat internet that's not built on data centers where data privacy can be controlled by the user, as opposed to any corporate corporation that is controlling your data, which is the case these days. So that's a little bit of my background. I like a lot of things like mathematics, philosophy, computer science, and software development.   Pouya LJ  01:11 Well, that's for philosophy. All right, I bet you the What's up? What's up with you?   Deep  01:18 Um, yes. First of all, I just want to say that just sounds like the life of a polymath, so I can really appreciate that right on COVID. Yeah, so I similar to COVID. I also run my own startup, we do quantum computing. Instead, we are looking to use quantum computers to accelerate the materials discovery timeline. Right. So right now we do a lot of things that are mostly trial and error based plus some compute, for doing materials discovery, let's say you want to discover a new cathode or new electrode material, right? How are you going to do that? We want to automate that process and and speed it up by thousands if not millions. That's our goal. It's pretty ambitious, but that's what we do you everyday, or try to do. Uh huh. Yeah. So that's what I've been up to.   Pouya LJ  02:11 Yeah. Thanks. That's amazing. Are you in Toronto?   Deep  02:14 Yes. Good.   Pouya LJ  02:15 Good. You're enjoying this weather?   Deep  02:17 Totally. Yeah. So nice. weather wise will enjoy it. Well, us.   Pouya LJ  02:21 Yeah. Well, that's true. That's going on soon. Probably next week. Still not that bad? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Okay. Anyways, so today, we are tackling a subject that I am very inept in? I have no idea. I mean, I know abstractly what it is, but I don't have any readings on it. I think you guys are more educated on this than me. But let's see how it goes. So we're talking about a bunch of different stuff. Actually, it's not one thing, but it's centered at logic propositions. And quantifiers. Do you want it? So this was the pathway was introduced to this conversation was introduced by golf? Do you want to start it off yourself?   Govind  03:06 Sure. Um, so when we think about logic, what comes to mind? Generally, it's things like, debate, you know, things that logic is associated with, or things like debate, and truth and false, maybe people who are in software development or would think of code. You know, there there are so many of these, these these concepts that come to your mind when you think of the word logic. You know, what, maybe maybe you guys can chime in with like, premium fallacy. When I say the word logic, one of the one of the things you think about,   Pouya LJ  03:35 no, I think I mean, I guess it depends on their perspective, as you were saying, but I think what you're saying it makes sense. I think, generally, people think about logic as reasoning, like step by step thinking. Thinking about, like, it depends, if you're asking a philosopher is a little bit different than a mathematician than a software, regular person going about their lives, not thinking about these things. But I think that just remains for most people.   Govind  04:05 Sure, what am I?   Deep  04:07 Yeah, when I think of logic, I think of two things, the more intuitive idea of logic, which is what I think every human has, right? We like to all believe that we're logical beings, right? What does that mean? We all know that mean something when I say it, but what does so I think, the intuitive idea that humans are logical insofar as they have a set of consistent rules that you can codify that have some sort of basis, right, you can derive next set of actions based on a set of let's say, axiom true principles, right. And they're logical in nature. For example, humans get hungry where you're cutting off I don't is that does that me or?   Govind  04:46 Oh, I can I can hear him fine. I think   Pouya LJ  04:48 that's me.   Deep  04:50 Do you want me to restart for you?   Pouya LJ  04:53 Okay, now that's better. Sorry. Okay. Sure. That's fine. Continue. Sorry.   Deep  04:56 Sure. So I was just saying that like from from the preset preset Something that's logical, or I would consider as logical is the idea of hunger, right? Like when a human is hungry? What would be logical next is that they're going to try to get food. Right? To me that's logical. And that and so that's an intuitive logic or system of systems are sets of logics that we just know from by nature. Then I think of the logic, when when when Govan asked me, What do I think when you know about logic, right? Like what comes to mind? Or how would I define it and whatnot. The second one is the formal, abstract idea of logic that we humans have that I think that maybe other creatures don't have. And and that's the mathematical ability or the mathematical perspective of logic, where you can look at, you can create systems like Boolean logic, you can generalize Boolean logic and look at how you can construct quantum computations in Universal computations. And propositional logic is totally different than what I just talked about. And so that's all these things are abstract logics, and it's different than the intuitive logic, sometimes.   Govind  06:07 Yeah, yeah. No, that's, that's a great way of like, you know, describing the entire breadth of what logic? Thanks. Well, I think it comes down to the concept of truth and false, right, because you have to start with things you know, are true. And then you string these things that are true in certain ways that allows you to create certain implications, right? You, you, you start with a few facts, like, as a classic one, all men are mortal. Socrates is a man. Therefore, Socrates is mortal, right? You know, you have these propositions you have you start with these facts, and then you put them together using some inference rules. But what I wanted to discuss in today's topic, as today's topic is this concept of truth and false itself. We really, as humans, we take truth and false kind of for granted as a discrete binary thing, right? You have something that's true, and it's not true, it's false. But is that really the case? And to further grounded discussion, I have a few quotes from this book. It's called fuzzy thinking. And it has it really explores this concept of how truth can be continuous or fuzzy, right? It's it's not it's not truth. It's like an on off switch. But it's actually like, on and goes all the way to off with like, several, maybe infinite steps in the way. So one quote I really like is, there was a mistake, and everyone in science seemed to make it. They said that all things were true or false. They were not always sure which things were true and which were false. But they were sure that all things were either true or false. So I thought that that is a really cool quote, because it points out this fact that this is really taken for granted, we don't really think about, you know, like, What is it? What does it mean for something to be true or false. And another quote, I think, would be interesting not to make this all the quotes I made this last one is a quote from Albert Einstein. So far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they're not certain. And so far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality. Because, I mean, if you say something is true or false, the universe does not give a shit, you know, universe is going to do whatever it's doing. And we're just we're just creating these models where we say, Okay, these things are true, these things are false. And, and we're going to construct our models of reality based on it. But these models of reality are pretty much mental experiments that we perform across humans right? Now, it just so happens that it happens to be incredibly good at modeling reality, to the point where people can get confused and say that reality works based on the principles that we create, and the facts that we create, the things that we assign as true or false is what is allowing reality to work the way it is. But it's it's always important to know that there's this detachment between what's reality and what's what's, you know, our our collective, our thought experiment, which is, you can call it mathematics, philosophy, whatever any anything that we have, when we come together, we have discussions, even discussions like what we're having right now. They're, they're just, like, there's a separation from this and reality. And this is kind of exemplified by what's known as the law of the excluded middle in, in logic. So where if you have a proposition a, let's say, let's just call it P let's let's work in the realm of the abstracts, if you have a proposition p p could be something like, this is a fruit or a gob is a person, you know, things like that things, something that I can assign a truth value to true or false. So the law of the excluded middle is that for all propositions P, P, or not B, that is something can either be true or not true. Now, this this sounds like stupid, simple, right? It sounds kind of like okay, sure, something can either be true or false. But now, what's crazy is that several mathematicians in over the 20th century, were actually pushing back against including this principle and logic, they were saying, No, I want to construct a mathematics which doesn't have p or not p that is, p or not P is actually not true. According to these people. They were called the intuitionists. And this cause Like a massive, massive debate back in the 20th century. But I'll pause here and I'll get some comments from you guys like what do you think such a mathematics could actually look like?   10:11 So   Deep  10:12 the first thing that comes to mind is the idea of structural realism. Structural realism basically posits that whatever scientific and mathematical understanding that we get of the universe, it does not necessarily reflect on the true structure and nature of the universe, right? So, if you have a quote, of creations that describe gravity at the macroscopic scale, that does not mean that those equations are the true structure and nature of reality. And that's important because when we're, as you sort of alluded to Govan, like when we define something to be true or false, nature doesn't give a shit. Right, so to speak. And that's like, like, interesting enough, there's a philosophical question right there. Because what if it happens that structural realism is false. And ironically, there is some sort of mathematical truism, at least in the physics perspective, that we can define, and that it is actually a true reflection of reality. It is objectively the truth. Right? Like, we may not, it may actually be possible, who knows? So there and because we haven't actually answered that, you know, what I mean, that that philosophical idea yet, whether structural realism, is true or not, is very hard to it. Yeah, extend or resolve the conflicts that have occurred in the 20th century from logic? Because this is just an extension of that. What do you think?   Govind  11:50 Um, well, I think this this, this time in history was very interesting, you know, because, well, maybe, like, some historical context would be that, you know, this is the first time you have like, several extremely smart people from across the world coming together and creating a global, you know, like, hey, let's tackle the biggest questions in, in humanity, like any point in your thinking, right? So like, and I think this kind of resulted in probability, right? probability is something that emerged from the 20th century, I mean, some could argue the roots extend way back, but you know, like the roots for everything, then way back. But the reason I bring up probability in this in this argument is like, as, as humans now in the 21st century, we, our process of science is so fundamentally grounded in probability, right? Like, to the point where our models of reality are the closest models of reality, we have use probability necessarily, right? Think of all the discussions you've had with your friends regarding COVID, or all these other things. Most people tend to make arguments related to probability and case fatality rates, you know, these kind of like, almost baseball statistics, right? Like I say, baseball statistics, just to kind of ground that and make it more like, you know, you see where I'm going with this, right? It's just that probability has created this kind of way that of making seen things our model seems so real, that you can actually see them and you can actually see their measure their impact on them. Right, this in fact, in mathematics, this the, let's call it the backbone of probability is called measure theory. Right. And I think this kind of lends itself to, well, some of the stuff you're working on, right, the quantum models of reality. So I think I think structural realism is something that is extremely effective, because it's, it's, it works on observations of reality, behind the scenes, and it actually kind of gets there. I mean, I'm using structural realism, maybe I'm, I'm conflating it with some mathematical context that are quantitation that it does not come with out of the box. I hope, I hope my point is clear.   Deep  13:51 Yeah, I understand your point completely. Um, quia. What do you think about this idea of an objective truth in nature? Um, do you think that it actually exists? And should we possess it? logic around that idea? Or the, or the rejection of the idea? Yeah. How important should that rule be?   Pouya LJ  14:12 Um, that's a very good question. Actually, I have started this long project, which is in the background for my own sake, I actually came up thought of this question a while back. I mean, everybody thought of thinks about these things, but more seriously started thinking about this insert. Getting onto some avenue to, you know, think about Yes. Is there an objective reality? And then that's literally the question to ask myself that started me on this journey. And you know, I I talk to some people from different walks of life, from psychology to philosophy to physics and what have you, some people who are at the top of their fields. I didn't. I mean, I did ask them this question, which is not the point. But from there our conversation, my conversation with them. What I got is that, no, from, from, from the real essence of the question, like the deepest sense of the question. And what I gather from all of those conversation conversations is that, again, we not the way we understand our world, our universe, maybe there is maybe there is a formalism that will get us there. But at least not with anything we have this, you know, far we've gotten discovery in science and philosophy thought. So. I, I think ultimately there is that's just a guesswork, obviously, like hypothesizing, but not in the sense that. So, let me put it this way. So for example, when GM Govan was saying that there's a spectrum of truth, I think that is, that is, that is true, until you get to the, to the resolution to the, to the, to the pixel of reality, essentially, at some point, it has to be one or the other. But we didn't get there yet. So that's my sense of it. That's my sense is that yes, it will eventually be some sort of objectiveness in reality, but it requires a better understanding of that reality that the fundamental laws of our universe, and that is not just gravity, gravity is, for example, gravity is emergent, from my perspective, and that that sense?   Govind  16:49 Well, I think you're gonna be happy, because initially, you wanted this discussion to be more about the nature of reality. And I think it's creeping into there. So I'll talk a little bit about the nature of reality as examined by Western philosophers. So there's a Descartes, notably, in the in the history of Western philosophy in like, let's say, the early modern period, which is like on 1600s, to like present day, or 1600 to 1800, is about the early modern period, we had these different movements, we started with rationalism, which is that, you know, like, we just, we just say things like, create these elaborate logical models. And then, and then we, we kind of examine, we use this as descriptions of reality. And then this kind of God rejects. And notably, Rene Descartes was kind of like a huge figure in this movement, because he said things like, the mind is its own soft, separate substance. And to tie that back to this discussion, what I was saying earlier about the realm of, of imaginary, thought experiments that we work with, in different fields like mathematics, computer science, and so on. He thought that it was its own separate universe that was completely detached from our, the universe that we live in. And he, I mean, these are the things he's saying, right? Like, I mean, he could be right, he could be wrong, but like, he's like, he's using logic as a means to tie together his his arguments. But at the end of the day, these are just things he's saying. And he's just using logic to create an elaborate story, an elaborate logical model. And this is the criticism that the next movement kind of gave to the rationalists. They were called the empiricist. People like David Hume, and I think mill or Locke, john Locke was in there. But they were like, hey, you're just saying things, you know, you're just you're just creating, you're just like, this is basically a story that I'm reading. And you're just like, Well, God is this and God is that. Savage. Exactly. And they're like David Hume, one of his famous philosophical quotes is like, you know, you can, you can't say for sure that the sun is gonna rise tomorrow, we see it rise every day. And we take it for granted, we have these explanations for it. But at the end of the day, these are just explanations, you know, I mean, at this point, they hadn't invented spacecraft and all that stuff yet, you know, they couldn't just go up there and see the sun.   Deep  19:09 Well, even then, like it did, there's still a philosophical point to that, like, even then we may not, despite everything we know, today, you know, I mean, the sun might not rise like there's   Govind  19:21 exactly that's, that's, that's   Deep  19:22 apparently physical reasons. I'm not even saying like magical reasons. But yeah,   Govind  19:26 So so they completely dismiss these, the rationalist arguments using this, it's like, if I don't see it, you know, it doesn't exist. So, you know, show me the proof, show me the reality of things. Got it. Um, and eventually, this kind of got resolved somewhat by Kant, Emmanuel Kant, who came in the, I believe, late 1700s, early 1800s. And he, he, he's like, Okay, guys, how do we resolve this? Because there's clearly some value in using logic to describe reality. And there's definitely value in talking about things that we can see and perceive and sense right. So his Way of reconciling this was to say that was to bring in the human aspect of things like how we perceive things. And he thought that that played an important role. In fact, what we call space time, were intuitions, he described them as intuitions. So humans have an intuition of space and an intuition of time, which is what allows us to perceive these things in reality. To make that more clear, he's he's telling the Emperor says, Hey, the things that you think you perceive, so clearly, maybe they're not that clear, you know, you are trapped behind your veil of perception at the end of the day. And again, like this is all to talk about the objective nature of reality, right? As humans, we can't help but be stuck behind the fact that everything we're perceiving is just what we're perceiving. There's another quote from Descartes, you know, it's, I think, therefore I am. It's one of like, the most famous quotes from philosophy, I think. But it's, it's basically that, for him thinking was such a rational endeavor, right? He thinks that just because he has this stuff running on in his head, like this voice that goes like, blah, blah, blah, and in his head, that's, that's why he knows for real, that He exists, like, no matter what, I have this thing that allows me to, like, perceive and like, you know, like, I don't know, if you guys are real, I don't know, my computer's I know, there's something going on here. You know, that's kind of his point there. And Kant was saying, you know, there's a human element of things you just can't strip away from, from anything real, right. So that's a little bit of a background in this in, well, let's say Western philosophical thinking about this, this this topic.   Deep  21:27 That's awesome. Um, and, you know, a lot of its circles, it's all circling and tying back in to itself in an interesting way. And here's what I mean by that. So, to your point about how deep you know, probability is in quantum mechanics, right? It plays a huge role, a fundamental role. For literally since the birth of it, you know, physicists both on the quantum computing and sorry, quantum physics side of things, and the classical physics side of things, believed that there should be some sort of a clear description of the wavefunction and information that we can eventually have access to and predict perfectly. So like, just, there's there was this idea that we'll eventually be able to predict the exact nature of the collapse, the wave function will know when it will collapse, and into what outcome it will collapse, rather than just knowing the probability. And you know, fast forward 100 years later, we've made essentially zero progress in making that stochastic process any less stochastic to us. And so it's really like sad react Sony, right? Like for the people who, who believe like, go when you and I've had tons of discussions about determinism and whether the universe is and Buddha unites was actually all three of us. And so quantum mechanics quickly touches on that. And then there's the objective reality question. There's the witness friend paradox. experiments, right that were recently conducted, again, two years ago, where you had two different labs instead, posing as a weakness friend, basically, it's a witness paradox is a paradox that was created in the 60s it was proposed by the famous physicist Wagner, and essentially, what he said was that if there are given the fact that the wavefunction encodes the all the possible measurables and observables, for a given observer, then the wavefunction is going to be different for different observers. And if that's true, then they're going to have eventually conflicting facts about the universe. And so he said, that's a paradox, right? And it turns out that it's true that two years ago, in those days, it is insane, because two years ago, we actually ran these quantum physical experiments where we took a well being split using beamsplitters, we essentially used quantum entangled photons. And we've been into two different labs, and you have people, you have what's called witness friends inside the lab, and then Wagner or like the observers outside the lab. And so all four people in this experiment, none of them can observe each other. We're measuring each other's photons directly, they can perform measurements to see if a measurement hasn't done, but they can't. Yeah, so that so if you want to think about it physically, they're splitting at the end of the experiment, one particle that was turned into four quantum entangled pairs, so through Bell state pairs and beamsplitters you really have these so if you want visualize that, so imagine, like I take a ball of physical ball, and I cut it in four pieces, and I give it right to four different people. Here's a weird thing about the huge We're gonna experiment what ended up happening is that Imagine if I asked those four people to look at, if I to record the color of their ball, right, let's say I cut up a red ball. And and I gave a piece to everybody, everybody has a red ball in theory right? v a piece that's red. What ended up happening is that these people, of course, were quantum mechanics, there's one caveat, right? You can expect the ball to change colors, that's fine, you can, you can expect it to change either red or green. So that's let's say, you can measure spin up, spin down totally fine. What and what what we did was, let's say I did this, I took a red ball, I gave it to four of my friends. And then they did measurements, knowing that it'll change red, green, red, green, sometimes. I, it turns out that when they did those measurements, and they all got back to each other, and they looked at their lists, and the measurements that they did on each individual piece themselves, the colors didn't add up. So So I so imagine this, like, imagine if I looked at my list, and I observed red, green, green, red, green, red, and you observe green, green, green, green, green, red. So you were looking at a different piece of the ball. How's that even possible? When I physically split the same objective ball? It's not it's, well, technically you shouldn't have been, but it is like, in fact, what's happening is that literal conflict and objective facts about reality, where you have people who participated in a physical experiment, use the same physical measurement tools and came up with different conflicting facts   Govind  26:31 that is completely wild. Yeah, no, that's physics anymore. You know, this is like something just so beyond anything.   Deep  26:41 Yeah, I mean, it is very edgy. Yeah. See? What we know, dude.   Govind  26:45 Yeah. Oh, my God. That's, that's insane. Everyone reminds me of the banach tarski paradox, right? Like, I mean, these kind of things happen on mathematics, and we're totally fine with it. Right. So the banach tarski paradox is like, imagine you have a sphere, a sphere that's composed of like, let's, let's call them like, an infinite number of droplets that are holding together this fear, right? It's like this basketball. So the banach tarski paradox says that there is a way to separate out, like, just choose all the points, like a whole bunch of these points that are in here, like these droplets, and then you take them out, and then you move them away. And these are just solely choosing the points, while granted infinite number of points, you're telling them to go somewhere else. And using this, you can actually create a perfect clone of the ball, right? You have two different copies of the ball using the exact same number of particles. So you can do all these weird things with infinity in the world of the abstract, you know, where we're fun things happen, and everyone's everyone's happy and dancing all the time. You know, like, yeah, they're like, we're okay with all kinds of crazy things happening. But man, when this spills over into reality, it's like, we all lose our shit. Because, you know, yeah, literally not believing.   Deep  27:54 That's right. That's right.   Pouya LJ  27:57 Yeah, and so, um, so what, what, what do you do, but especially because you're, you're actually very close to these experience. What does that what does that make you feel? What does that? What? What does that? Do you think it means? What does that say about that objective reality, if you will? What is your thought?   Deep  28:17 Yeah, it will, what it tells me is that there's likely some sort of, clearly a multiverse situation going on, where almost it's like, we're maybe that maybe each agent that can be concerned, considered an observer or anything that can be considered capable of measurement, right? We don't know how far that extends. We just don't know those answers. But I believe that everything that can is on some unique multiverse, and we all just have our own timelines intersecting with each other. That's what that told me. It no longer feels like, we share one objective physical space. It's like, you know, I mean, we just have like, the these rays instead. That intersect. So it, I found, frankly, I found it psychologically disturbing when I read the experiment and the results. And I don't think that there's no way around it. It's just but it's fascinating stuff. So yeah,   Pouya LJ  29:17 yeah, no, I, it does make sense. Yeah, what you're saying like, I mean, obviously, there has to be so that to me, either. There's another explanation such as the multiverse situation, or maybe there is no objective reality. Well, in a sense, at the end of the day, if you're living in a multiverse with different set of facts, and you're building all of your rules based on those axioms that you get from FX x, or whatever, a different set of axioms will say. Then, who's to say which universe is the reference universe, or the main universe or truth? So maybe maybe there isn't any objective reality which, which to me, And then that's my whole thing. That was my whole thing about this objective reality. I asked this question going in thinking, yes, there is, and we can't just find it yet. But let's pose the assumption that Yeah, no, there is no objective reality, then to me, it's a little bit more humanistic again, talk, but it just shows me how arrogant we've become of a thing called, you know, science and discovery. And we're just, we're just going forward thinking that we're supposed to know the answer to, to everything, we have to figure it out. And that and that's fine to try. But also I think it this whole phenomena should should give us some notion of Okay, there is there there should be a little bit a bit a degree of humility, in what in what we do as discoverers of this universe, which is, to me the most beautiful parts. Again, I'm like, this is being poetic as a human thing. But that's at the end of the day. That's who we are. And I think I think we should appreciate that part as well. Sorry, I'm just going to close this loop on this poem that I just composed here. But Okay, back to Golf. How does that make you feel? from someone who's a little bit more distant? Personally,   Govind  31:28 I think it's very interesting to use the word pool there because, well, since since this, this discussion has kind of been underpinned by logic and language and all that kind of stuff. There's this philosopher Martin Heidegger, his his entire take was like, we need to kind of escape from the confines of language and the kind of thinking that is inevitable, just because of language being the way it is, right? Because it's like, realistically, we all have our own personal language. It's like, I have my own language. And when I say that, I don't mean like my own version of English, I mean, my own, let's like, composition of thoughts, experiences, feeling senses, right? Like, if I remember, if I smell a perfume from my past, like, I'm gonna have like, these nostalgic experiences and all that stuff, right? And, and that really, that's part of that's a word or like maybe a phrase in like, personal language. And whenever I'm talking, what I'm doing is I'm converting from my, I'm translating from my personal language to English, right? In this case, and then and then you have to, like convert that back to your personal language. And men composition is really hard, like, how do we do it? Given this this context, but Heidegger, his his attempt to improve language, was by positing that we move to poetry as a way of expressing ourselves purely because he thought poetry had this innate ability to capture our personal language, right? Because when we write poetry, it's such a, like, poetry is a hard thing to understand, right? Like, sometimes you read poetry, and I'm like, What the heck is going on? But it's just because it's, it's the poets like attempt to try to bring out their personal language as much as possible, right. And I would argue that most of art is the same process. So I mean, in, and I want to tie this back to like, the point I made earlier about us trying to escape the confines of our own existence, right, like, the the confines of our of our human infrastructure, the way we do that, I think poetry is a very, very cool way of and it's kind of cool that emerged from this discussion as well. That's kind of a case in point.   Pouya LJ  33:23 Yeah. No, I I think so. Yes, I think I understand. So it's the least amount of filters like art, I suppose, like, closest to you as it gets, I suppose. So, so yes, I, and that's what I've been going back and forth a lot. Like I obviously, as somebody who cares about, you know, methodical thinking, logical thinking, and, you know, rationale, reason, etc. That is very valuable, especially if you if we want resolved in this in this world of ours, because at the end of the day, we can get a lot with the our version of you know, reality that we have in this very pocket that we are living in, in the whole the whole universe and in space and time. But going beyond that, I think there there has and that is where I think they kind of, you know, overlap the the field, let's call it science and art, if you will, I don't, I don't like to make huge distinction, like borderline distinction distinctions, generally personally, but I think in an entirety, society does make it very, like black and white distinction between these two, which I think there is a good amount of overlap, and that is, we're   Govind  34:44 talking fuzziness, right, it's all about being fuzzy and accepting it for what it is as opposed to what we want it to be that maybe seems more perfect to us, right? Like these molds seem more perfect to us. But the reality is, nothing is a mold like everything is fuzzy, right? Like I think the example is like such a mind. looming realization of that.   Pouya LJ  35:02 Yeah, no, that's that's true. And what one way one can raise a question. I suppose that what makes us want the I mean, I have I have one answer. But let's let me just pose the question first. What makes us as who we are humans, again, within this infrastructure, once this clarity of binary of, you know, not being fuzzy, but rather completely distinct or True or false? Well, what are your thoughts on that?   Govind  35:35 Well, I remember we actually think I think we did a podcast on this a little bit ago about like the nature of chaos, right? Some people, most people I think, are very averse to chaos, because they like things being simple and easy to understand. Right? What I mean, the more, let's say, foolhardy among us, for lack of a better word, like kind of naturally as gravitated towards chaos, because I think chaos is just such a good description of reality. But the problem is that chaos, by definition is incredibly, incredibly complex, right? So you don't you don't have the simplicity of like, you know, two plus two equals four, right? You're like, what's two? what's plus? What's four? What's the quality?   Pouya LJ  36:14 That sounds like you checked, you just say, yeah, smoke some weed or something? Like what is to man?   Govind  36:23 I thought this was Joe Rogan.   Pouya LJ  36:27 Oh, it could be anyway. No, I think so. Okay, let me go back to how about you do and don't share my thoughts?   Deep  36:38 Yes. So, first of all, it's super interesting about the nature of fuzziness, especially when we think about Zeno's paradox. Because even that is a great example. You know, I still contend that we have not resolved the paradox of why is it that we can make contact with anything, right? Why is it that I'm even touching the floor right now, despite the poly exclusion principle? And, you know, Zeno's paradox, right?   Govind  37:10 xenos paradox.   Deep  37:11 Sure. So So, so xenos paradox. It's really a family of paradoxes. But it all comes down to the fact that, I'll give you an example. Let's say that you want to reach the end of the hallway. And your rule that you impose on yourself is that you're going to have your distance in order to get to the hallway, and you'll have your distance, every single time until you get to the end of the hallway. And so let's say the, you're 10 feet away from the end of the hallway, then the next time the next move you make you're five feet away, then two and a half, then 1.25, and so on and so forth. And until you go to point 000000125, blah, blah, blah, but it'll never be zero, right? It never touches zero. So at no point, will you ever actually reach the end of the hallway. So Zeno's paradox, what basically asks, Why do you never, why do you touch the end of the hallway? Why is it that in real life, we end up making it to the other side, despite the fact that these infinite distances, you know, taking any slice of an infinite still infinite so so he just had all these questions about it. Yeah, spacetime. Very deep questions to the thousands of years ago on so and we still haven't answered them properly. And yeah,   Govind  38:34 well, I have a point about that. But I know if we are you're you're itching to talk about your, your perspective on it. Go ahead. Oh, you're on mute. Oops, sorry.   Pouya LJ  38:45 First of all, I want to say that I, I sent a photo and chat A while ago, and I think I diverted deeps attention to that kind of concept, which was I don't know if you saw the, the the rabbit or whatever it is. It wants to go get a haircut. I'll put this in the show notes, by the way, but it's a half off haircut. Did you guys see that one?   Deep  39:12 Right now? That is funny. Yeah, I'll put this   Pouya LJ  39:16 in the show notes. So that people who are listening to this, they can just find it out. But I know this is exactly what you're talking about. It'll gonna take forever. So yeah, you're right. But why do we actually get that haircut and the half of haircut eventually? No, I think so. First of all, all of these are exactly to my point that there's there's there is probably a sea of things that we just don't know about the nature of our universe, the one that even forget about objective reality, the one that we even perceive. And maybe one can make an argument that the reason with the fatalities of our of our views are the questions that we cannot answer is because of the fact that our realities are not completely overlapping the objective one, and that's where those those are the the edge cases that are actually creating these problems, perhaps. But true. Beyond that, I think there's a, there's a degree of obsession amongst many, many people, most people probably besides besides the ones who are embracing chaos, I suppose as go and was putting it, that we did a good good amount of like humanity essentially once a clear answer to two things and sometimes takes shortcuts through through, you know, ideologies that might not have, you know, rational rationale behind them. Just to get to those answer, why am I here? Why, like, because I have to be tested here to go to heaven, part of the some of the religious ideologies, or, or what is the nature of our unit? Why is the sun come up? I feel a first of all does is going to come up tomorrow or, and then we come up with these answers, and everybody through their own ways try to answer these definitively. And part of that is I think, now it's a little bit of more philosophical questions, I suppose, or answer rather thoughts, I suppose. But I think part of that is because we understand our own mortality by binary, which is the most did the deepest, probably driver of our existence, and that is either we're dead or alive, there's no, I'm half dead. I was like, well, maybe you're sick a little bit, but you're not half dead. So I and there is there's a degree that we and there's an understanding that when I die, I there's like, there's no coming back from that. I mean, I'm obviously there are exceptions, sometimes. Some people, some people, flatline they come back. But if you're flatlining for a week, you're not coming back from that, right? So so there's, there's a permanency to that experience that and and, and our deepest drive is to avoid that. So to avoid that clear, at least, at least from our mortal, mortal perspective, clear, true or false If true, being your dead and false being your life. That is clear that okay, if I'm, if I'm talking right now, as the card would say that I exist. In a more biological setup, sense, I'm not dead. And, and, and it drives all those questions, I suppose. But again, like, also going back to language as a logical tool, essentially. What do you think there's going to be a funny question, what do you think people before language would think? Would they have similar thoughts to these things? Now? I mean, obviously, in a simpler case, and not thinking like quantum physics, I suppose. But what do you think all of these are fatalities of language that we're carrying with ourselves? Or is it drive by language? Or is it more fundamental? So if we didn't have language for people who didn't invent language yet, back in? I don't know how long ago? Would they have similar thoughts? Do you think?   Govind  43:11 Well, I think we do have animals, right? Like, I mean, when we have these, you have any pets? Do you   Pouya LJ  43:17 mean no? Okay, before, but I know Okay, yeah. No, but I can understand what you're where you're going.   Govind  43:24 But when you have, like interactions with animals, I love animals. It's almost like you have this communication with them. That's that's not like you. I mean, I don't I can see versus and they probably don't understand me, unless all animals know English, and they just choose to ignore us. And they like humans are too stupid. There was a   Pouya LJ  43:43 cabal of animals deciding that this is not a good idea. Yes.   Govind  43:48 Lots of Rick and Morty episodes. But yeah, no, I think I mean, it's just that that awareness that being that's that's just there right? I think that is rooted in language fundamentally. Like I don't I don't know if we can actually get past this. This like our art like the language that we have developed evolved and developed is like it serves a very good purpose which is sharing thoughts with each other sharing these these like awareness experiences with each other right? But at the root of it all like I mean, it's all about that awareness and you brought up such a great point about death right? And how death is that binary which kind of makes us realize like you know, like there is such a thing as a clear like a clear line drawn in the in the northern sand like a line drawn in the concrete You know, this this is it like you know, there's life and then there's not life so so that that is actually such a such a great point about why negations work in this in this sense. I seem to have lost you guys   Pouya LJ  44:47 know, we can hear you. Okay. Oh, yeah, your picture froze, but I can hear you so that's good. Excellent.   Govind  44:53 Yeah. Well, yeah, that's that's the point I wanted to make. You know, it's a it's like these these ideas do exist, but I'm sure Animals have a notion of death as well. Right? And animals. Oh, yeah. Their their experiences and all that.   Pouya LJ  45:05 Yeah, no. And that's true. The notion of death is obviously at least in its more primal sense of obvious. Obviously, they're, they're trying to avoid it. But there are no but my point was, so so the rabbit holes that we go to and get stuck in it, then half of the way to the destination, and then half it, and then half of them and have it is this. My This is what is this? Now? Now this one is not as outside of language, actually, some, I'm kind of negating myself, but is a lot of these problems with language and and how we're communicating with each other. Because honestly, like, there are instances that I think I should have been thinking about this. Do I think with myself, like when there's nobody else, I don't have to communicate with anybody else. I don't need to use language, English, Farsi, whatever, to communicate with other people. But is there any any? Do I communicate with myself with my thoughts, in language or outside of language? And I've been thinking about this for a while and trying to observe it? And part of it is that, yeah, yeah, most of my thoughts are us using language. But yes, there are pockets sometimes that I feel like, there's a thought that I can't even express it to myself, using language. It's that the, maybe that that's the that's for, like, there's a fog. And I'm perceiving it. There's some sort of experience behind it. But I can't even describe that experience for us. Like, I mean, what what is like, so what is it sounds like an impression of a thought, right? Because a thought is a thought when you're able to express it, maybe? Yeah, so i think i think that that becomes super clear. Well, okay, let me let me give you so this is a, this is going to be a little bit of an exaggeration. Like, it's not what I'm thinking about. So the one that I'm thinking about is more of a thought. But think about this, when you're extremely fearful for your life at a very moment notice of, you know, hitting, you know, you have to you have to run there's there's a, there's a specific quality to that fear. And you're thinking, Okay, maybe there's a bear in front of you. And your thought is that we're going to grab this knife, but are you really thinking in terms of wars, I am going to grab this knife, you see a knife, you you want to grab it, you know what I mean? That's a thought that I'm going to grab this knife, but it's not really in any language. And that is really forced when I think I can see myself doing that, at least, when it comes to the precipice of like some sort of when it combines with some sort of very strong emotion such as, okay, I have to grab this knife or gun or whatever, shoot this bear, I'm not thinking to myself, okay, I am going to grab a gun, and I am going to pull the trigger at this. No, that's not it, you just know, right? That's a   Govind  48:01 possibility. It's like you're like, the way I think of it is like, it's almost like a design space of everything that could possibly happen given what's around you. Right? So it's like you're sampling from this design space. Like one of these events, for example, is like you picking up a knife or like, you know, you punching someone in the face. This is around you. Something like it's like these are these are just, I think the mind is really good at generating these kind of things, which is just sampling points from, from this design space of what's around us, right? Yeah. And then and then these are actions or like, these are these are impressions. Yeah. It's like, yeah, we just, we just like, we have all these things around this, like stimulus. And our mind is generating these things. And most of the time, it's like, it's pretty pragmatic. It's like, Oh, you have to put on your shoes to walk. It's like this thing you tell yourself, but you're not really thinking you're doing things. But like, sometimes it's just like random thoughts. Like it's our mind is a pretty interesting random number generator. Deep. What are your thoughts on that?   Deep  49:00 Okay, it really is. I agree with that. I mean, you can always say that, uh, you know, all of our output all of our, I've always wondered, you know, the, what is it the thousand monkey or the infinite monkey experiment or thought experiment where what would happen if you let monkeys play with a typewriter for an infinite amount of time, right? There's the idea that they would eventually create Shakespeare. And it makes me question the idea of creativity and thought, is it a linear combination of what you already know? Or is it truly something that will eventually appear emergent from random fucking monkey? Monkey actions, right? Like, what what is true intelligent creativity? So with that being said, I really had a I was thinking, though, you know, on that note about us looking at death and life is binary. That's true. We are classical creatures, like we observe the universe in classical sense, right? Everything is and so because it's macroscopic to us, I wonder, what if? What does life look like for, let's say, micro organism that doesn't experience the world classically like we do, right? What if there are, there are quantum organisms that are only experiencing the world and quantum mechanics? To them, there would be literally no such thing as a classical I am dead or classical life. What does that mean? What What does death for that organism look like? So yeah, I was just thinking about that. But you guys think,   Pouya LJ  50:34 yeah, no, you're you're dragging us into the pan psychism   Govind  50:41 the movie arrival, right? With the whole concept of like, circular time and all these things, right? Like, this is some I think, innovations of the 21st century like, exploring this, these kind of ideas. I see so many outlets for this in different TV shows and movies and all that stuff. Like this, this like convergence of everything, how everything is one and many at the same time. Right? Well, I guess the fuzziness of everything, right. Like everything is just really fuzzy. And we're, as humanity starting to accept it, which is, you know, really freakin cool.   Pouya LJ  51:12 No, no, it is. And you mentioned an arrival It reminds me of, so I think if I'm not mistaken. Okay, maybe I'm mistaken. But let me let me just make it maybe, you know, I think Stephen Wolfram was an advisor in that movie. I don't know if he really I don't know. That's that I I'm doubting myself now. So anybody out there listening. Please double check for yourselves. Don't quote me on it. But which reminds me he actually I don't know if we're familiar. Actually. I   51:40 don't know why I did a quick Google and   Pouya LJ  51:43 it is like it's okay. Yeah. And he came up with this new What is it? What do you call it? Geez. new stuff. Yeah, he is hypergraph.   Deep  51:56 Physics.   Pouya LJ  51:57 Yes. Yeah. Have you heard about that? Did you look into it?   Deep  52:01 Yeah, I   52:04 I liked it.   Pouya LJ  52:06 So what are your thoughts on that? But super quickly, I don't want to go to a different deep rabbit hole right now. But it reminded me of him when you mentioned arrival.   Deep  52:14 Sure. I mean, various.   Pouya LJ  52:16 I don't know, Dad Galvin. Are you familiar with what it is? Oh, yeah, sure. Sure. Okay. Okay. Cool. Cool. Good.   Deep  52:22 Yeah, just very briefly, I mean, the idea of like, Come complex, physical phenomena from simple rules is nothing new, right. Like that's been talked about for 100 years. What was really interesting was the idea of using causal graphs or attempting to use just like these hyper graphs to encode physical rules. Yeah, I think it's promising. I'd love to see experiments and math and more rigor. But the ideas are cool. Like Stephen Wolfram is really, like he has some fundamental thoughts there that are interesting, unique worth pursuing.   Govind  52:56 These are usually a pioneer of this kind of this kind of funky fuzzy stuff. Right, right. Yeah. Yes, geez theory so much with his work on automata and all that stuff. Well, this release. I mean, I wanted to bring back this point from about 15 minutes ago. We were talking about Zeno's paradoxes. Yeah, a conversation topic for a future podcasts definitely should be the nature of calculus, right? Because, yeah, the way we as humans, resolve Zeno's paradoxes was to create this notion of a limit, we just throw a limit on it. And we say, at some point, it does, it does converge on to this value, right? Like, and I'm like, okay, so you keep cutting the half of your hair. And at some point, you're, you're going to get a full haircut, right? Like, even if you get the convergence now that that notion of convergence, it turns out is not strongly understood by by humans. But I think that's something we need to discuss. And I it stands out for me, because this is one of the first discussions we ever had. Right? Exactly. Yeah.   Deep  53:57 Yeah, absolutely. Talking   Govind  53:58 about limits and how like, that's what I think I first realized I'm like, this doesn't make any sense, does it? It's just, we just put   Deep  54:04 it is it is a great because some that is it all stemmed from some Berkeley kid asking us like, like, about it, right? Like he's like, yeah, this like this. And then yeah,   Govind  54:15 yeah. Yeah. Cool stuff. No, but I think we should explore that in in the next podcast or though sounds good. Sounds good?   Pouya LJ  54:24 No, I think I think okay, well, we made the plan. I don't know about the dates. We'll talk about that later. But next sub subject of the next conversation will be calculus, and its origins, its fundamentals. axioms, I suppose. Okay, I think that's a good. Here's a good stopping point. We almost went full hour here. Is there anything else you want to, you know, close the loop on before we leave this conversation?   Govind  54:54 Well, for me, I think I learned so I mean, I had these thoughts about fuzzy fuzzy thinking and all that stuff. And it was Kind of like in the let's let's see the disk of my, the my external hard disk of my brain is just forgotten there. So it's great to brush the dust off. And I feel like I really kind of added to these models based on this conversation. So yeah, it was very cool. I think we achieved fuzziness today. Yes.   Pouya LJ  55:18 That's great. How about you?   Deep  55:20 Yeah, I would just say that I really appreciated the perspective of the history of history philosophy, with respect to logic, a super neat perspective that you brought to the table or Govind and yeah, just different perspectives that were shared today. Um, it's awesome. It does make things more fuzzy. And yeah, let's keep it going. Guys, I, I think that there's a lot of interesting questions. We post here today. So   Pouya LJ  55:47 okay, and if anybody wants to share their thoughts, feel free you can reach go in and deepen their respective social media, which I'm going to put in the show notes. Don't need to repeat them here. You can you can find them there.   56:01 And comment guys.   Pouya LJ  56:04 Make it make it dirty. No, keep it clean. And all right, stay fuzzy until later episode.   Deep  56:11 Cheers, guys.  

In this episode of the BTP podcast, Emaad joins Pouya in a free form conversation around topics such as Physics, world currencies, crypto currencies and a decentralized banking system and an idea of world UBI.   Emaad is an Astrophysicist with a passion for technology   Emaad's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/parachaexplores/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/parachuchutrain LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emaadparacha/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript:----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS currency, layover, canada, people, country, places, digital currencies, saskatchewan, money, picture, ubi, talking, notes, winnipeg, toronto, cryptocurrency, world, research, cryptocurrencies, thought SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Emaad   Pouya LJ  00:17 Hey, man, how's it going? Good,   Emaad  00:19 man, how are you?   Pouya LJ  00:20 Pretty good, pretty good. We're actually talking off off camera and not camera, but I'm recording about some stuff that is going on with you and your life. And I thought, you know what, it's actually quite interesting. Let's bring it in. Let's bring it in there according. Okay, so for sure. So let's, let's circle back to five minutes before our conversation go to. So you were telling me that you started a massive program? And you were telling the story of how that that happened?   Emaad  00:46 Yeah, for sure. So well, I was in touch with one of my professors, ever since I gave my final for that course, which I, if you remember, I was with you. Yeah. I was taking it with you last year in like, April. And I spoke to the professor and he was interested. And he actually followed up on email as well. And he's like, oh, like, you know, would you be interested in doing research, or a few other courses on side, and I think I discussed that with you as well, last time. Yes. Because it's always a good idea to take some courses, take some courses even after you graduate, because they're gonna help you with, they're gonna help you with your graduate applications. If you have a gap here, you can take one or two courses, put them on your transcript, and that's going to be helpful for you. So I didn't take that route. But I spoke to the professor, I met with him a lot, I read on his research, etc. And eventually, around November, that's when the time came to apply. So I went ahead and applied got a bunch of references. And all I had to do was wait pretty much until March, when I got my when I got my admission. And when I got my, I guess offer from University of Toronto. So right now it's a master's in physics that I'm doing at the University of Toronto. And what I'll be researching on is with Professor Barth, Netherfield, who is a pretty well known Canadian astronomer. And what he does in his lab, and the cool thing is he actually has his own lab. So it's a whole building that's dedicated for him. It's not an office, it's not a room, it's not a lab space. It's a whole building at the University of Toronto, um, I think it's a two storey building, but his his, so at the ground floor is sort of a lab or a huge space lab space. And then there's, there's computers and stuff upstairs. And what he does is he creates telescopes that are as they're trying to be as effective as Hubble. But at a cheaper cost. That's his ultimate goal to create accessible telescopes, accessible space telescopes. And then what he does is he launches them to space on balloons. So he goes to Antarctica, Sudbury or Timmins, Ontario. There's also New Zealand, where he goes, and then he launches them into space. He's trying to be as close to the north and south poles as possible. And what he aims to do is he aims to do similar research that can be done with Hubble, but at a much lesser cost, because you're doing balloon based astronomy. So, you know, you don't have to pay for thousands and thousands of tons of jet fuel to get the telescope up, like Hubble and maintain it with the International Space Station.   Pouya LJ  03:41 Yeah, well, that's, that's super interesting. And so what what got you? I mean, I know you wanted to do some sort of grad school program, but what got you to this specific program? What happened? I will   Emaad  03:55 be honest, I will be 100% honest, I wasn't really planning. I never thought that it would that I would be doing this last year. Especially when we were finishing our undergrad degree. I Well, I was finishing my undergrad degree and you're about to finish. We were taking the courses then. Yeah. And when I finished my last final, I think it was my second last final with you.   Pouya LJ  04:18 Yeah, sorry. My bad.   Emaad  04:19 Yeah, I thought you know what this is it. Like, I'm never gonna touch physics ever again. If you remember correctly, that week was probably the toughest week of our lives.   Pouya LJ  04:30 I I remember,   Emaad  04:33 there was classical mechanics. At at, at what time it was I think 9am 9am to 12pm. And then the next day we had electro mag. electromagnetism. Yeah. From 9am to 10 9am to 12pm. And then we had a one day break. Yeah, and we had general relativity.   Pouya LJ  04:55 Yeah, not not easy courses. Yeah,   Emaad  04:56 not even courses at all. Again from 9am to 12pm. And I honestly thought, you know what this is it like I'm done with everything related to physics. Yeah. And I wanted to, and then I worked in the cloud computing side of things. So I worked for a company called about extreme. And what I did with them was I helped consult for cloud based solutions on Microsoft Azure. And I helped build them as well. So I helped build chatbots, knowledge mining applications, more so towards the AI, more, so the applications that, that use AI, or more specifically Microsoft's own cognitive toolkit. But I was hoping to go more into that field. And I did look into some masters. But to be frank, I didn't have that much guidance. At that time with me, I didn't know which one to go for which one would be best. And I accidentally applied for a research based one. And the problem with that is that you need to have, it's very helpful to have a computer science background, if you want to go into a research based computer science degree. Yeah, that was sort of my mistake. But I did apply for a master's in physics as well. And I thought about it, I thought about whether it's a good idea to do it or not. And it is a one year program. And if I still want to apply for other graduate degrees in computer science, or data science, or artificial intelligence related fields, I can still do that, while I'm finishing up a Master's. So if I'm going to start next year, if I'll have to start a master's in computer science, or data science or something, next year for that might as well get a Master's, get another masters. Over with it, this is not gonna hurt. And it's a research based Master's. So the coolest thing about research based Master's is, most in most universities, in Canada, they pay you to do it, you're not paying anything out of your pocket, your tuition is covered. And on top of that, you're getting money for being a TA you're getting money for being a research assistant, and you're just getting grants. So that's one of the best things about about research based degrees. And this is applicable everywhere, around Canada, at least for whatever research base degree you have, whether it's a PhD or masters, you're going to be getting funding for it may not be obviously as much as you would get if you were doing the job or whatever. But I mean, look on the bright side, you're getting a degree out of it.   Pouya LJ  07:32 No, of course, that makes a lot of sense. Wow, that's a cool, cool, cool story, because we've been in contact through, you know, text messages and whatnot, but we haven't talked for probably over a year now. Yeah, or so. And I think   Emaad  07:49 some more comprehensive talk.   Pouya LJ  07:51 Yeah, like, exactly like catching up and stuff anyways. So. So it was it was a it was a shock to me, because I thought you're you're working for that company, that you were talking about classes. But   Emaad  08:04 the funny thing is, I actually might still be, I'm still debating on whether I should keep it part time or not. Because because of two main reasons. One, it's always important to get work experience. And even though this summer was kind of late for them, because of COVID. So there weren't that many projects coming in. Because our our main clients, the company has been clients are cities and governments in the United States, city government, state governments in the United States. So they've been more focused on COVID binding COVID. And they're less inclined on doing the projects that we've had in pipeline, I see. But now new things are coming up. And it's always exciting to work on these projects. That's that's one main issue. One mean, that's one main reason because there are upcoming projects. And the second thing is to further enhance my own learning. There's new things again, coming up. within Microsoft, Microsoft is releasing new products. And technology is a field where if you're not on top of it, you're gonna fall off the ladder very fast. So it's always better to be on top of it know your stuff. They still pay, they still help with certifications, the company helps it certification. So it's always better to get new certifications, because they also expired. Microsoft certifications expire every two years. So it's always good to have certification stay on top of things so that maybe when the Masters is over, if I don't want to pursue physics, then there's always this option of this option of cloud computing and AI.   Pouya LJ  09:44 No, that's true. That makes a lot of sense under what's good thinking. Thanks. No, no, that's true. Anyways, so we also had something else in actually we had entirely something else in mind to talk about which is fun. It's a, it's fun to talk about different stuff, too. You have some interesting thing going on which you actually got featured on a CBC article, I believe, if I'm not mistaken. Yes. So you like travel? I think a lot of people do. And you travel, you go round, you get their currency. And, you know, like, on the currency, there's typically a picture of something, your monument, a lot of times a monument and you go there with the currency and you take a picture, can you do you want to explain it better than I   Emaad  10:32 did? what you're doing, for sure. So a lot of a lot of listeners would probably know that. What a lot of a lot of different banknotes and a lot of coins, they occasionally have places on them. And that's representative of the country's identity. So if you look at the United States dollars, they'll have different government buildings on them. The five has Lincoln lincoln memorial in DC, the 10 has the US Treasury 20 has White House 50 has the Capitol building, and then 100 has the Independence Hall in Philadelphia. And you know, that's the same for a lot of other countries as well, they occasionally put a place in the country, on their banknotes just as a representative of their own identity representative of their own culture. And what I've been doing, this is a project actually started about, well, it's going to be it's going to be nearly five years, about five years back. And what I wanted to do was I wanted to travel to different places, would that would currencies of those places. So it could be where I'm from, I'm from Pakistan, so I could go, I could go there for Canada, US and other places as well, because a lot of currencies have places on them. So I made a plan to go to those places, travel to those exact spots that are on the currencies of those countries, and then take pictures over there. And it's been five years, I think it's I've taken more than 35 pictures more than 35 at least. And over the course of Yeah, over the course of five years in six countries. If I if my math is not mistaken.   Pouya LJ  12:23 I think you got it. You got it nailed down. Yeah. Well, that's interesting. So what inspired you to do that?   Emaad  12:32 That's, that's always a funny question. Because a lot of people ask that. Yeah. And I feel like part of me feels like, should I just make something up? That sound cool, because, honestly, speaking, there's nothing cool about the inspiration. All I know is like back in, I think five years ago, around November 2015. That's when I went to this place called mind Jotaro, which is in Pakistan. It's, it was part it was ruins from the Indus Valley civilisation, which is one of the three oldest civilizations in the world. Apart from the Egyptian, and I think the Mesopotamian. So that was actually based in around Pakistan, and there's a very big river in Pakistan called the Indus River was based around that. And I went there, and they remember, when I was growing up, I always saw the specific picture in my textbooks in school, and also on the notes. And I always thought about, you know, what a cool place that is, it's basically ruins 5000 year old ruins, or, and, you know, I want to go there and travel and see and see those ruins. And I always saw them on the back of the notes. So when I went there, I was finally able to go there on a family trip. I went there, and I asked the tour guide, I had an old 20 rupee note, which actually has its picture on it. And I went to, I went to the tour guide, and I was like, Hey, where was this picture taken? He took me to the exact spot. And I took a picture of it. And then what I did was, I put it up not just on Facebook and stuff, but also on Reddit. Because I thought this is something pretty cool. People would appreciate it. And it people did. People liked it a lot. I was received very well. And I thought, you know what, this is probably a really good excuse to travel to different places in Pakistan, at least at that time. And that time, I was just thinking of bugs. So I thought you know what, I should maybe do this. In Pakistan, I get a really good excuse to travel to different places, and the pictures would come out pretty nice. So that's sort of where it started. I've always thought about you know, I should make a cool story. I should just make it up and then just put that version out there but the origins aren't that amazing. No, no, look, it's actually pretty.   Pouya LJ  15:02 I don't know what you're talking about. It's actually pretty good. It's a very green coming about at a younger age. When you thought about this, it's actually I think, a very cool story on its own and beyond that, I think nothing, nothing beats the order, the honesty, the the originality and the truth and honesty of the story. Yeah, as boring as it sounds, I think. Yeah, back that is orange, that, first of all, is original. So it's not somebody else's thought, or somebody else might have thought it. But on the other hand, because it's truthful, it's genuine. I think that has a lot of value to it personally, that's it doesn't have to be extra sexy actually, now not to get to cultural issues. But maybe that's that's one of the problems with our culture, especially the online culture these days, because everybody wants to make everything extra sexy. And that's it. Yeah. Sometimes publicity is actually the sexy part.   Emaad  16:01 That is very true. Yeah. Instead of you know, making up something big. And in the story that could have lifted up so many holes and stuff like that. It's always better to just stay simple.   Pouya LJ  16:10 Yeah. Yeah. No, I completely loved it. And don't don't sell it short. It is more interesting than you think it is. Okay, so that's cool. Cool story. Now, that gets us to currencies. So I know you have interest in technology. We actually talked about it today. And there is a degree of Okay, so that those are like government backed currencies. Now, obviously, those are the paper ones. All, I mean, we always were backed by those, but we also are removing them from our day to day interactions more and more. Yeah, as you progress towards credit cards, or debit cards are basically becoming electronic, which loses a little bit of touch. So I think you're bringing out a little bit on the stalls, you're there to, to the to the people who have forgotten what their dollars or whatever currencies look like. Yeah,   Emaad  17:07 you know, there's a funny thing about that. I was I was meeting up with a friend of mine, a few days back. And we were speaking about this project and stuff because I met him after a long while. And he, he was telling me, well, I said he's actually from China. So I said, oh, maybe I should go to China next and, and take take pictures of Chinese currency. Yeah. And he laughed about it. He's like, good luck finding one. Oh, because China has basically moved on to digital currency they have I think WeChat and Ali pay. I think those are the names if I'm correct. But what they do is they it's all digital payments, they have QR codes, they just scan there, they just scan those QR codes so they can pay whatever they whatever amount they need to pay. And, you know, if I'm paying money to you, if I'm giving money to you, or anything that's over V chat, as well. And it's such a streamlined system that they've made, that they no longer have to use paper currency at all. So he was laughing about that. And that resonates with what you said, because so many people are just digital, they're into digital banking, there's no more paper currency anymore. There's no more paper currency. Because I mean, why carry it around? Why case so much of it around in your wallet, when you can just put one card? And that accesses all your money at once.   Pouya LJ  18:29 Right? Yeah, no, that's true. And it makes a lot of sense. But but but you're adding that value on a artistic and social level I suppose. To to your work, which is, which is very interesting. Do you have you have what are the next plans? Do you have any any plans? Now? Like concrete plans to go next country or city or   Emaad  18:49 whatever? I mean, how can you make it How can anyone make any concrete plan?   Pouya LJ  18:54 Well, actually, that's true. That was a stupid question. Over there, I totally forgot.   Emaad  19:00 It's a very tough time to create concrete plans. I mean, I've done a country's I've completed our Pakistan, my home country, the EU, the US, Panama, Canada, Oman, and the United Arab Emirates. And Funny enough, Oman and the United Arab Emirates. I've only done a couple of their notes, not all of them. And that was because I was only there for a very short time. I think I was in UAE for about like 15 hours. And I was in Oman for about like 10 hours. Was that a layover? So that those are layover? Yeah. So what I've been doing is I occasionally travel between Canada and Pakistan often. If I'm if I want to go back home, meet family etc. And what I've always been trying to do is trying to find cool layovers. So usually I fly through the Middle East. And that's that sort of that sort of normal, because there's lots of airlines that connect through the Middle East, and or it through Turkey or through other countries or through Europe. So what I try to do is I try to find a different layover, where I can not only visit a new countries airport, but also stay there for like 1015 hours. A lot of airlines will offer is they offered like, two three hour connection. And then they also offer a 15 hour connection. And usually, the 15 hour connection is much cheaper, because so many people are just hoping to get to the airport, stay there for one hour and then get on their next flight angle. But instead, what I try to do is I try to find like a 15 hour layover or a 20 hour layover, so I can actually see the country I can go out of the airport, get an excuse to see. Yeah, see places. And along with that, what I do is then I exchange some exchange some money to get their own currency. I'd well I do research before to see which notes should would make sense. And then what I do is I I try to see which notes would make sense which notes are within reach of where I am. And then I get those notes from a currency exchange at the airport. And then I just tried to go to those places. And that's sort of how I've done it pretty much for most of us. That's how much that's how I've been doing it recently. With the layovers, I've also done Canada. There's a bunch of places within Canada. Sorry, before you   Pouya LJ  21:32 go ahead, I have to add something. For those people who complain about the boringness of layovers, get creative people. This is how you how you make it worth your while I   Emaad  21:42 continue. That is That is very true. I mean, I I love layovers, because an excuse to you know, go around, go travel. Yeah, for sure. I know a lot of people for for a lot of people. I mean, I'll make sense. Yeah, maybe they're in a hurry to get back or get somewhere or something. And they just here to airports. It could be a variety of reasons, or they're tired. But I personally believe that if there's a layover, I should spend it. Traveling or, you know, looking at different things make the most of it. This summer, I was going to travel via Turkey, via Turkish Airlines. And I had the option of a five hour layover in Istanbul, or a 25 hour layover. So I opted for the 25 hour layover, which is actually much cheaper, of course. So I both saved money. And I talked to the airline. And this is something cool. A lot of airlines will do this for you. They will give you a hotel room, and they'll cover your visa costs. They'll cover your visit transit visa costs, as well free of cost. Turkish Airlines was doing that Turkish Airlines gave a free hotel. Free hotel for one night, which is very cool. I mean, I just I just go there and they will take me to the hotel. They'll give me a free hotel. And then I can just go and visit. I did this with Emirates as well. When I was traveling with Emirates, I had a 15 or 16 hour layover in Dubai. And all I had to do was just apply online, it takes five seconds. And when I get to the airport, they give me they give me a hotel voucher, and food voucher, and a couple of food vouchers. So my food was covered. They gave me a free hotel. And they gave me they transported me from the hotel to the airport and the airport and airport to the hotel. And this is all for free. And it's not something you need business class for is an economy class ticket. Right?   Pouya LJ  23:51 Yeah, you were you were going on to sorry, it took you off a tangent, but you were sorry. Originally you were going off to talk about your experience in Canada on what you did.   Emaad  24:00 Yeah, for sure. Um, I mean for Canada, the current notes are not super indicative of different places in Canada. Number of the $5 note, which you might have seen has space on the back has international has actually the Canadarm that is something that can be made it on the International Space Station. It has that so I think that's kind of tough. The $10 note has Jasper National Park that one I've actually done. I did that last year. I did a train going through Jasper National Park in Alberta. The $20 note has a memorial. It's still a place it's still a building but that memorial is actually in France, interestingly enough, and then the 50 and 100 don't really have any specific places on them. So what I've instead been doing is I've looked at older nodes in Canada. So there's the old one $1 old $1 notes old hundred dollar notes, a lot of old $1 notes are in Ottawa, they have a lot of government buildings on them. And the old hundred dollar note was in Lunenburg, which is in Nova Scotia, so I went there last winter, just on a road trip to take a picture of it there. Now, there's another one that I took, which is the newest note for of Canada, which is the new $10 note. And I went to Winnipeg, just for a two day trip, I was able to find a really cheap flight out of Hamilton, Hamilton to Winnipeg at fault places. I was able to find a really cheap flight. So I went on a weekend trip over there. And that is the one when you started the call when you started this podcast. That's the one that you were mentioning the that was the one that was featured on CBC. Nice. Um, so CBC took note of that, and they said, oh, wow, someone came to visit Winnipeg from Toronto to take a picture. This is something like that. And they should feature   Pouya LJ  26:06 Yeah, a little bit of caveat for anybody who knows anything about geography of Canada and especially in the wintertime. I don't know when you went there was it winter or I think it was winter because I can see some snow there or there's some snow anyways. So point being it like you from Nova Scotia. You know, the Winnebago, they have nothing in common like there's like to go out of your way to go there. It's not like you're having a layover in Istanbul or Dubai or something. It's a different game. ballgame. So just I have to add that caveat for people who are not   Emaad  26:41 Yeah. And they're and they're far like,   Pouya LJ  26:43 yeah, now that's what I mean.   Emaad  26:45 The province where Toronto is, it's Ontario, and Winnipeg is in Manitoba. And they're both bordering each other. But the problem The biggest problem is trying to so far south in Canada, as opposed to other places in in Canada, like Winnipeg, in Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver. They're very far up north. Toronto is very far south. Yeah, it was a two hour flight just to win it back itself. Which is mind blowing. Because you're going north, you're going north, Northwest a lot. Yeah. But it was pretty cool. It was a fun trip. My flight got canceled on the way back, which is very fun as well. Oh. But that gave me more excuses. You know, travel, pay my friend. We decided to go to CES Saskatchewan, just to the border of it. And Funny enough, now that I'm remembering it. Well, we decided to do was we had a rental car. So we just extended one more day. And he said, You know what? It's a four hour drive to Saskatchewan, which going back to your Canadian geography has nothing in it. There's nothing in there. It's a whole province with nothing in it. Yeah, it's it's just in the middle of Canada. It's just land. There's nothing wrong. I don't think anyone even lives there. And it's just a four hour drive just to the border of it and the border of it. Believe it or not, there was nothing there. It was just a sign that said Welcome to Saskatchewan. So we took a picture with it just to prove that we have been here. And then we went on a four hour trip back to Winnipeg. And on that four hour trip back to Winnipeg, my friend drove and I decided to I decided to finish my application for my physics Master's. And I submitted it that night while I was somewhere on the road between Saskatchewan in Winnipeg.   Pouya LJ  28:38 Yeah, that's that's, that's pretty cool. And I'm actually trying to figure out how much the province like the population of the province, but for some reason I'm failing. I think it's I don't know if it's the city of population.   Emaad  28:54 No, there's a city called Saskatoon. And there's two major cities and ask a tune in Regina. Yeah, but the population of Saskatchewan. I find, I think it's 1 million.   Pouya LJ  29:07 Yeah, it's a gigantic province, with 1 million population.   Emaad  29:12 I think it's the I don't know if it's the biggest.   Pouya LJ  29:16 No, it's not the biggest, like on the map is definitely smaller than Ontario, Quebec, even British Columbia, but it's close enough to Alberta maybe a little bit smaller than Alberta. But point being it's still a lot of land there. And the entire population is like 1,000,001.1. Just Just to, you know, confirm your   Emaad  29:40 identity is there's one there's 1.86. So basically two people per kilometer squared. Yes, a few. If you create a box that is a kilometer wide and kilometer, that is just to each each side of the box is a kilometre, which is a very big number. There's only two people who live in there.   Pouya LJ  30:07 Yeah, that's a very big house for you.   Emaad  30:11 And versus Ontario, if I'm correct, the density of Ontario is 15 people per kilometer squared. Right? So that's, that's the key difference.   Pouya LJ  30:23 Yeah, that's like, so unfolds almost. Yeah. I'm done by five anyways. Um, yeah, what? Let's, let's move on a little bit, because we want to talk about we got to, you know, more computerized digital currencies, not necessarily digital currencies in terms of cryptocurrency, which we'll get to but, um, so we talked, we talked about technology coming into disrupting really anything, everything, and currency being one of them. for for for many reasons, why, now that that naturally brings us also to the realm of cryptocurrency, which, well, what are you going to do? cryptocurrencies don't have monuments on them printed, that they don't print? But joke aside? What are your thoughts on the digitization of currency and maybe even you know, distributed currencies such as cryptocurrencies, Bitcoin, what have you? Do? Do you have any interest in them? Do you read about them?   Emaad  31:31 Yeah, I do. I do a lot. And I, I think it's very interesting, not just from an investing perspective, but from a practical perspective.   Pouya LJ  31:40 Well, investment can be practical if you do it right.   Emaad  31:42 Investing can be practical, but it comes with its own caveats, especially investing in cryptocurrency, it's a very risky thing to do. Sure. And you could, you could probably just lose a lot of your money. If you invest, without thinking or without, you know, without the right tools without the right resources. If you do that, then you can lose a lot of money in crypto, but I was talking more so the practicality on the practical side of things on the technology behind it. how they've made something open source, and decentralized. They've made something which no one can touch and chain, no one person can go in and touch and change. Its cryptocurrency and Bitcoin and those things, they they're the Ledger's. They're, their records, they're everything, they, they stay with the people. There's no one person who controls everything. And I think that's that's a beautiful aspect of the digital currency. Because its power comes in its numbers. If a lot of people use Bitcoin, then it's more strong. There's more, I guess records, there's more copies of everything. And that technology can then be applied to so many different things that can be applied to contracts. blockchain can be applied to supply chain logistics, to ensure nothing has changed to ensure there's to ensure the right tracing of materials that people are getting food, and so many different things. But just from a currency standpoint, this is a very tough debate. Because a lot of countries a lot of banks are against this because this is against what they've been doing throughout throughout, I guess, throughout the startup humanity, or throughout the start of banking, at least because the main essence of a bank and a central bank is in the name. It's centralized. Yeah. And if you decentralize parents, if you decentralize money, if you decentralize your own local currency, then how are you going to achieve anything? In terms of you know, regulating power, regulating finances, making sure money doesn't go into the wrong hands. Even the wrong may be a subjective word. But there's so many different things that come in with it, that I personally believe it would be a bit tough to move to it all together. In my opinion,   Pouya LJ  34:12 by altogether You mean like removing the central banks from the central, the regular currencies of countries? Yeah. And making it the dominant. Okay.   Emaad  34:20 Yes. But with that, I also think it is hard for them, the centralized banks to completely remove cryptocurrencies. I mean, a lot of a bunch of countries have made it illegal to have them. I don't know which countries are but I remember there were a bunch of countries that said it's illegal to trade it or have it even. But they're not going anywhere, either. Because they're a force to be reckoned with. They're they're not they're not just something small with banks and say, Oh, that's illegal. Get rid of them. You know, Pete, they're, like I said before, their strength comes in how many people hold it, and I think that's going to be interesting. Day by day. I was talking to a friend of mine who wanted to transfer money from, I think it was from the EU or not from. Yeah, it was from Pakistan to the US. And she was asking me, what's the best way to do it. And whether she should wire transferred, whether she should Western Union it or something else. And I looked at the fees and wire transfer fees were more than 1500. dollars, she would have to pay Western Union fees were around that probably even higher, that she'll have to pay. And that's a huge chunk of your money that they're taking. Yeah. But I suggested, oh, why don't you just buy crypto over there? over the counter crypto, which is you're just paying someone money, and they transfer cryptocurrency to your wallet. And then you just transfer that crypto to whoever you need to send it to in the US. And that takes wire transfers can take two weeks, Western Union can take like at least a day or two that can take like five seconds, maybe a bit more obviously be based on based on how much you pay for the gas, etc. so many different things. But it's still less than less than a day, you can get money from here to there. And then they can just sell it over the counter or cash it out. Or they can do whatever they want. And that's how you can just easily transfer money using crypto as well. So I think it is a force to be reckoned with, what banks would need to do is figure out what's the middle ground here? How can they eat, right? incorporate that into their own systems into their own, into their own platforms? Because Funny enough, the weakest. The point, the place where digital currencies are weak, is the fact that some people can't trust them because they're decentralized. So they're like, oh, then who's going to be taking who's going to be, you know, handling it, who's going to be in charge of dispersing it and stuff. So there's no trust there. But on the other hand, people have started losing trust onto central banks themselves. Because they don't make the best policies. So it's sometimes it's better to have something decentralized.   Pouya LJ  37:29 Yeah, that does make sense. So there is definitely I mean, as with a lot of things, there's there are weaknesses and strengths. And obviously, one of the strength of cryptocurrencies, is mobility of it, etc. Also, just just to close that loop of legality, so the three countries that are definitely illegal, and there's like, there are some countries that have greater areas, but in Algeria, Egypt and Morocco is outright illegal, just for closing that loop. And there's a lot of other countries that are like, somewhere in between. Yeah, meaning some restrictions. But generally speaking, it's legal, etc. So we can put this into notes. And,   Emaad  38:19 yeah, for sure. So now there is something interesting that I, that I came across, and I worked with, I worked briefly with, with the team behind it. There's something called UBI. This is just very generic. There's something called UBI, universal basic income. Yeah, and this is something that has been debated in a lot of countries attempted in a lot of countries and a bunch of places at least, I think Germany is trying that out right now. And just giving universal basic income to some of its citizens.   Pouya LJ  38:54 Andrew Yang is making a lot of noise,   Emaad  38:56 Yang was making that the biggest point of his presidency, there were a couple of places I think in Canada that tried it, if I'm if I'm not wrong, a while back. And there's I can't get much into the details of it. But there is a there is a there's a consortium that is actually based in Canada, that is trying to get together a lot of UBI experts from around the world and work towards creating a global UBI which is going to be a key Their aim is that it's adopted throughout the world. And everyone gets a certain UBI per month, per day, per hour per second. I mean, there's going to be one amount per month, but then that's going to be per week and then you get that every second of your existence. And that's going to be actually I think one of the smartest ways to go about it would probably be on blog. And that's something that that I came across. And I briefly work with them on some of their some and some of the technical side of their project. And that's something that's very cool because now it's using blockchain using using utilizing blockchain, which is, again, the technology that's been brought forward by these digital currencies. And that's where the practicality thing comes in. But now they're putting it into a very large scale where they're asking for global adoption and global adoption for it. which hopefully would replace the need for conventional currency, and create a global system where everyone can earn a basic income to live, essentially, to at least cover where they're living to cover their food to cover their health related things. Which is, I believe it should be right for everyone. Everyone should be able to do that.   Pouya LJ  41:04 Yeah. So now the natural question, especially for universal UBI. Being while UBI has universal and but my point is being like around the world, not just containing a country. An actual question is cost of living and the value of currency, etc. is completely diff No, assuming we still trading regular currencies, not just the crypto ones, that there is a degree of asymmetry here that so is the proposal of this team. By the way, can you can you mention them by name?   Emaad  41:41 I don't know if that's? I mean, the name is global UPI.   Pouya LJ  41:44 Oh, you mentioned it? Okay. Yeah. Anyways, so is the proposal a fixed amount for every single person on the planet? Or is it different, depending on assessment of what are your cost of living? Where you live? by country, by city by province by? I don't know, what have you? Is there a distinction? Or it's just a fixed amount?   Emaad  42:09 See, that's the the project is I believe in preliminary phases, or I'm not 100% sure where they are, and whether they're in testing or whether they're sort of just beginning to research on it. And I frankly, do not know the answer to this.   Pouya LJ  42:27 Do you have Do you have your own thoughts on the matter?   Emaad  42:30 And the thing is, if if it is a global currency, and if everyone is has sort of access to the same currency? Yeah, then there shouldn't really be a problem with cost of living?   Pouya LJ  42:46 Well, I think I think there will be still, what, two two folds for one fold. Is that, okay, if we only adopt, I would,   Emaad  42:53 my question is, why would something be why would like, let's go to the Big Mac index, which is something I promise economists use. If there's a Big Mac in the US for let's say, let's say the the UBI currency, the new currency for the world is world dollars. Sure. There's a Big Mac in the US, which costs one world dollar. The currency in Turkey is also world dollar. Why would the Big Mac there be less?   Pouya LJ  43:26 Yeah. Okay, that's so that's that's the first fold of the problem, though I was talking about. And that is, as if that's the, okay, if that's the dominant currency traded?   Emaad  43:39 Sure. Their goal is to have world adoption of this. Okay. So that   Pouya LJ  43:45 will solve   Emaad  43:46 the would give way to, yeah, it would give away. Well, digital and non digital banks, central banks would give weight, this currency to come in. And the main essence of this currency is to make sure that it's secure and no one person would be able to access everything and change everything. Does that compromise the security of it? Yeah. So if there is, again, like I said, if there's a Big Mac for one US dollar, one world dollar, then wouldn't have the same Big Mac, we won World dollar somewhere else, because there's no other currency to base it off of. Yeah. So where would the cost of living? How would the cost of living and stuff be compared?   Pouya LJ  44:32 Well, you when you're talking about stuff, like I don't know, franchises or something? Yes, you're absolutely right. That makes sense. But if you're talking about for example, cost of land. Well, that definitely certainly has differences as you do within a country. Let's take Canada for example. Obviously, the price of homes in the heart of Toronto is completely different than say Saskatoon, that was what we were talking about, right? So, so in that sense, I mean, you can argue that the cost of living within The cities also started within the country is also different, which is reasonable. That's   Emaad  45:05 that's based on demand. Exactly supply that's really based off of, I mean, what the currency is doing, but it's no normal. So there's more space here more people want to live here.   Pouya LJ  45:16 Absolutely, they're gonna be worth more. So the land was an example of a commodity or, or something that would have different values, depending on where you are in a country and more importantly, in a world, right, that has the certainly has different, different many things have different values in different places in the world. And that alone can cost per debate, the cost of living by a lot, depending on which part of the world you're living, the basic cost of living, let's say, shelter, basic food, water, clean water, and   Emaad  45:51 I get what I get the question that you're I get what you're saying. And I agree that other things could be worth more other things could be worth less. And you're right, there's places in Canada right now, up very north, where food is so expensive. Exactly. Because they have to transport it over there and get it over there. So the cost of living over there is high. Yes, I agree with you. I agree with what you're saying that. Also living can be different because of these reasons. But the thing is that the UBI that I mentioned, sure, it doesn't aim to fully cover everything in your life. Yeah, of course. Because if it does that, then yeah, there's no motivation to do anything, even though that's a completely different debate with UBI motivation. But it's more so meant as a cushion for you. In some places, I mean, you could move to Saskatchewan. And you may be able to live comfortably on a UBI. Yeah, there's rent, there may be cheap food, there may be cheap. I mean, they're farmers, a lot of farms over there, but everything maybe cheap over there. So you might save money with the UBI. But where it says if you're in Toronto, then if you're getting a certain UBI, you may not be able to cover all your expenses with a UBI, you might still have to work. But I guess that's just the that's that's how this is. That's how everything should be. Because I mean, if if you're going somewhere else, if you're going somewhere where there's a very, there's very low demand for something and things should be cheaper. Yeah, if you're going somewhere where there's more demand and things would ideally be more expensive. That's the main essence of sort of a capitalist environment. Yeah, more equals more money.   Pouya LJ  47:44 No, absolutely. That That doesn't make sense. My concern was, and you're right, within a country, etc. So the difference that I was imagining is that the Delta within a country is much more marginal than a Delta currently, at least in the in the whole world. Like, if you give the highest value and the lowest value cost of living in different parts of the world, the delta is much larger than within one country. Okay, that actually to be argued, depending on the country you pick, but yeah, but for most of the world, at least. But I suppose if you and part of that comes from the the big Delta around the whole world, perhaps comes from the fact that the currencies have different values, maybe if you actually do a flatten out everything, and everybody adopts a common currency, at least as a dominant chords, that the trade end, I mean, it doesn't mean that the rest of the currencies will be eliminated completely, but they're not the main one at least, then maybe there's Yeah, maybe there's a degree of flattening this. This Delta make it a little bit smaller. That could be argued, I don't know. But that was Yeah, I'm just trying to paint a picture of what I was   Emaad  49:00 imagining. No, yeah, I understand. I understand what you're saying. But like I said, it's not something that is meant to replace everything in your life, and give you access to everything you want. Because that's gonna lead into way many more problems, because then everyone has access to whatever they want, for sure. But it's more so a cushion for you to at least live your life, to not starve on the streets do not to have your basic necessities at least covered wherever you are, you can be in Toronto, you could be wherever. And obviously, for the economic system to grow, people would still need to work because to create a living they would need there wouldn't be innovation around the world. And none of that is in danger. Because of UBI   Pouya LJ  49:45 Yeah, no, no, that makes sense. I mean, obviously these topics especially the UBI and cryptocurrency have endless spanned, and we can spend hours and hours talking about them which we may at some point, but We've come we've come a long way. I think all we've done almost one hour right now. So, yeah, I think it's a good place to, you know, close the loop on everything do you have? Do you have anything you want to add to summarize? No,   Emaad  50:16 not so much. I mean, I agree. This is a good, some good point. Where to where to pause it. And I'm sure there's going to be way many more discussions about UBI. And I'd love to, you know, have more. You, of course, as I as I research more on   Pouya LJ  50:32 it, exactly how I think about it. Now, I think it's gonna be really good. These discussions are obviously always fun to have and a lot of times constructive helpful. And yeah, I enjoy talking.   Emaad  50:47 Yeah. And yeah, that's really good. So it was a great, it was a great time discussing all these cool things.   Pouya LJ  50:53 Yeah. Yeah, no, that's great. Okay, so we'll put your information in the show notes, too. But do you want to tell people where they can find you online?   Emaad  51:04 Yeah, for sure. I mean, I'm, you can find me on Instagram, which is pr racha explores. That's pa ra, ch, e XP l or Yes. Or you can also find me on LinkedIn, which is e mod beracha. That is e m, a D. and last name is parotta. Pa ra ch a, if you want to talk about anything regarding the currency project, which is going to be more on my Instagram, or more about physics, or UBI, or anything like that, and I'd love to talk more.   Pouya LJ  51:41 Yeah, that's awesome. As I mentioned, obviously, we're going to put this in the show notes, so anybody who didn't get that they can go and look it up there. Thanks again, Bob. I was really fun talking to you Jason

We kick off the newest addition to Beyond the Present podcast called the Entrepreneurial Edition with short talks from Daniel Molgan dedicated exclusively to business, entrepreneurship, real estate, stock market, Forex, and similar topics for those of our listeners who would like to improve their financial intelligence.   In the first program as part of the Entrepreneurial Edition Dan delves deep into the issue of Entrepreneurship and compares what it feels like to run your own business as opposed to working for someone else. The truth is that some will always be happier and more successful working for someone else while others will be the most fulfilled when they run their own businesses. This short program can help you decide which one is right for you!    Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript:----more---- SUMMARY KEYWORDS entrepreneur, business, entrepreneurship, people, work, run, clients, deal, life, prospective client, job, employee, wealth, solopreneur, edition, values, create, hours, decisions, certain types SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:00 Hello, welcome to the first entrepreneurial edition of Beyond the present podcast. My name is Daniel Molgan. And in this edition of the beyond the present podcast we are going to talk about all things business investment, as well as finances so this particular edition is designed exclusively for the entrepreneurs or those who would like to improve their knowledge of entrepreneurship, business, finance and investment. So this of course, was way back there was a request by one of our basically listeners who requested such a program, of course and now here we are, we have this edition added to our basically podcast series and today we will start our first episode of the Evernote edition of Beyond the present podcast and today of course, this is our first episode of like actually sort of ride by the simple question of what is exactly entrepreneurship and whether or not you the listener should consider becoming one. So, as you probably already know, the word entrepreneurship nowadays is such Big deal. I mean, like it's become almost a global phenomenon, as well as a trend. And quite frankly, I think it's partially due to, you know, the new changes that we're seeing these days and social media and the way many entrepreneurs are using the platform to reach a wider audience, which has made the whole concept more popular. So basically, entrepreneurship is nothing more than you being able to offer your product or service at a profit to a specific customer or a group of customers. That's entrepreneurship, whether you are trying to let's say sell your musical for example, and knowledge as a let's say, a musician or as somebody who wants to sell the product that your company is making, whether you are offering your consulting, coaching services, whether you are set for example, selling you know, certain properties in real estate, all of these things. These are some examples of entrepreneurship that is the ability to run your own business and offer your product or service to a customer or groups of customers who are willing to To pay for that product or service. Now, that being said, isn't really all that simple. That is, knowing the difference is all that it takes to become a business owner? Of course not. So let's now talk about what it really takes to be a business owner and to run your own business. So first of all, there are two styles of entrepreneurship, we have one called solopreneur ship, as you probably know, about 40% of all entrepreneurs are actually solopreneurs. And almost 35% of all the companies registered in the US are run by one person. Now, personally speaking, solopreneur ship is one way to go about it, especially if you're you know, getting started with entrepreneurship because you don't have to pay for your staff. You don't have to hire anybody to have to get an office probably. And this allows you to work wherever you are. And this is of course, very popular among will be called a digital nomad entrepreneurs, that is bloggers, writers, programmers, and so on who they somehow use their own time, or when they want and of course, they get the profit that way. They're set Taiwan commercial force is what we call teamwork. That's when you begin and establish a team could be a team made of only two or three, for example, people or, let's say, individuals, or it could be perhaps made of, I don't know, hundreds or thousands of basically people. But usually most businesses start off with very few individuals involved in the process to run that business, and of course, to work towards improving its profitability. Now, it all depends on your circumstance. Well, Dan, first of all, I'm currently working at a job I got, for example, you know, let's say boss, and he pays me every month and I do my job, and I have my nine to five and all that stuff. Why in the world? Should I consider becoming an entrepreneur? So let me first tell you right now at this issue, you see, becoming an entrepreneur is not an easy thing. Let me just tell you right now, because it was like, well, that way I can work whenever I want. As a matter of fact, my experience proves that basically, getting a job technically is easier, both emotionally, physically and in terms of your time. Then running a business, yes, the 905, you got to wake up early, and then go to the office, stay there until five or whatever it is, come back home. So it's gonna take a lot of time, I just want to work two or three hours per day and be done with it. Well, the fact of the matter is that when you started your business, especially in the first few years, you actually will end up working much more than an employee at the same time, the chances are, your income will be less than a full time job. You see, that's what I've heard from almost any entrepreneur that actually know or have met personally, that is, in the first few years, not only they worked more hours, they actually made fewer dollars for those hours. So because of this, you have to ask yourself, do I really want to be an entrepreneur? Do I really want to run my own business? perhaps be become a consultant, perhaps, I don't know. start investing in real estate. Do I really want any of these things? And to answer that question, you have to look at yourself and your values. What are your values in life? Now everyone was seems like what what is Value values are why you do what you do. You see, every decision that you make stems from your values. So if you perhaps are currently an employee, the chances are some of your values include security, stability, being able to rely on a stable income, and more importantly, not having to think so much about work when you're not working. That is you want you value things like free time, leisure and work life balance. So if you look at the lives of most entrepreneurs, they would tell you that, unfortunately, a lot of those things simply don't exist in the world of business owners. That is, most business owners cannot necessarily determine like, Okay, I'm going to work from this hour to this hour and that I'm going to be fun. It's it's not really that easy for most entrepreneurs, especially in the first few years of any of the business to determine which hours they'll be working, which I was able to not because problems will pop up. There's gonna be some issues documentations taxations. Some other problems the clients might call you Marketing, and so on and so forth. And all of these things will actually make it harder for you to actually work whenever you want to work. So that's one of the things that will, perhaps if you have those values, if you really value let's say, work life balance, or you want to have certain hours just for working from hours, not for working, probably being a business owner probably is not for you from my point of view. Secondly, of course, is about the manner in which you want to run your business. You see, when you're an employee, you have a specific task and responsibility. And oftentimes, your job is about doing whatever task you're responsible for. However, when it comes to running a business, it's far more about the human factor than it is about the technicality of what you do. Because as an entrepreneur, you're supposed to actually do a lot of things, especially if you have a smaller team or even if you're a solopreneur. You have too many things all by yourself things like marketing, things like sales, things like talking to your clients. For example, things like following up with those clients and Of course, dealing with all the headaches that come with dealing with bad clients, you see, when you're working for somebody else, your job is very simple. And it's very clear, do this and do this from this hour to this hour. But as an entrepreneur, there are no such clear boundaries as what you must do. Because sometimes your clients might actually have requests that you never thought perhaps would come up. Sometimes you deal with, let's say, clients that are not necessarily your best clients with all these like bad clients or clients from help, who somehow give you trouble and they have all these excuses for doing business or asking for discounts too much or this and that. So you kind of know that basically, right? So as an entrepreneur, you have to deal with a wide variety of people who are your potential customers. This is one of quite frankly, one of the disadvantages of being an entrepreneur, especially if you are a solopreneur. Or if you have very small team, we have to be involved with everything or with every client. And that's usually most basically often the case with those who begin their business. So just imagine that if you're employed employee, you deal with certain types of people from a certain social background, certain, you know, things that you have in common, perhaps your colleagues who are also in let's say, the IT sector or in the, you know, hospitality sector or in the, let's say, restaurant business. So you see and meet the same type of people, and you interact with them in the same type of basically way. But as an entrepreneur, you basically are dealing with all sorts of people, many of whom You will never ever actually want to meet in real life. I mean, like, if you are, let's say, an entrepreneur, you deal with all sorts of people that most of whom You will never ever be friend in real life, for example, right? This is just, you know, a fact, you might end up talking with somebody have almost nothing in common with, but he or she is a prey, you know, perhaps a prospective client who might actually order let's say a project or ask one of your for example, services or so on and so forth. So, because of this, the human element is very important. So as I was writing this question, how easy It is for you to deal with all sorts of people, many of whom probably will not have a lot in common with you. Because this is the biggest challenge of entrepreneurship, the human elements and the emotional elements. Because if you, for example, don't know how to perhaps deal with people who are, let's say, a little bit more strategic on the side, let's do some clients who use certain tactics to get a good discount, or certain clients who perhaps are not quite upfront with their desires about your products, so they end up for example, postponing or canceling in a way that seems believable. But of course, you know, that these guys are actually faking it. So you have to create, you know, have to create those, basically, patterns. But you know, okay, this client is a time waster these clients actually playing with right now. Oh, this is actually a very good client. Oh, this guy is actually very trusted, like, I should trust him, but this lady probably not so much. So you need all these social skills to be able to manage your time because as an entrepreneur You need to be able to make a certain quota, whatever it is for you, basically. And you have certain amount of time with you and your team and your, let's say, staff members. So the worst thing you can do as an entrepreneur is to spend that time with the wrong people doing the wrong things, or simply doing things that are not quite valuable for your time, which is why the second element of entrepreneurship is personal management and time management. You see how well are you in terms of being able to manage your time and your basically plans? Are you more disciplined or are you more spontaneous, the more spontaneous types? Well, from my point of view, unless you're involved in certain types of artistic career, they are generally better off working as employees because that those working hours creates that structure for them. So that okay, well, I got to go to work from nine to five, and then I'm free, right? And this allows our lives to be more organized. But if you are, let's say more spontaneous, I'm gonna run your own business. You might run into a lot of trouble because organization and discipline is very Are you critical in running your own business to know like, these are the hours, okay, I should do this, I should do that. That's the second element, you have to work on very well. The third element of entrepreneurship, of course, and the valley that most entrepreneurs aspire to, is freedom, and being able to make your own decisions. You see, that's perhaps the biggest advantage of an entrepreneur, again, you pay a lot for it. Let's be honest, because we're an employee, your boss makes all the decisions. It's very simple, or you're a supervisor. But when you run your own business, you get to decide what kind of job you will do, how you will do it, and with what types of people so you have this autonomy of deciding and making decisions about your business and the kind of people you tend to work with. I think that's, of course, very, very important score. Of course, it's totally worth all the effort and struggle, that have to go through to, you know, become an entrepreneur. But from my point of view, if you look at the values of entrepreneurs, they they seek freedom. They seek independence, and of course, In most cases, if you look around you, you realize that in most cases, those who are successful as entrepreneurs tend to create much more wealth than those who are highly skilled professionals who tend to work for somebody else. It's just a you know, a simple matter of mathematics. So if your ambitions financially is pretty high, the chances are you should aim for being an entrepreneur, but then please be be aware that the majority of revenue as of today, an average entrepreneur make makes about 40 to $45,000 a year in the US, as you probably know, the average income in the US is actually higher than that is over $52,000 a year right. So being an entrepreneur does not mean that you are going to be rich, because becoming rich itself is once you run a business and is very successful, and then can actually generate profit and then repeat that process. So if your sole motivation to get on hers to get rich quickly, the chances are you will be disappointed. Because in most cases, entrepreneurs, especially the first five to 10 years, you've actually do not generate massive wealth. If you look around you and like, you know, very famous top entrepreneurs, multi billionaires Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, you realize that they actually went through a very long process and it took them decades to accumulate their wealth, and the same thing of force apply. So all other entrepreneurs, so if your sole motivation to be an entrepreneur is to just basically have higher income, I got some bad news for you. If you really think that by become an entrepreneur, you will become a millionaire, I don't know in a couple of days or months or even years, but chances are you will be disappointed. So write and ask yourself, What do I value? Do I want to explore possibilities that are out there in the marketplace? Do I want to have the freedom to decide what kind of work I will do? How I will get them done? What kind of people I will serve? Or do you have the desire to perhaps be your own boss or make your own decisions, or instead you value things like security, you Think of work as a means of service, getting your money and then moving on with your life because let's be honest, I am not at all saying that everybody should be not Brunner. As a matter of fact, I know that most people should not become entrepreneurs, because that's what math says. Most entrepreneurs fail in the long run. Most businesses fail in the long run. So if you want to get in the club, you should really ask yourself is this for me or not? and becoming wealthy can be easily done by getting a job in a very high, you know, highly prestigious company or a corporation. So that's not the only path to wealth. There are many ways towards wealth. There's of course the path of personal investments, we're gonna later talk about hopefully, in other episodes, how you can actually invest in different things to increase your net worth. But ultimately, if you want to run your own business, you better have a very, very strong and you know, reliable reason to become the kind of person who will run basically his or her business because the the path ahead will be very difficult and it's not going to be an easy Ride, if you will, because you will deal with a lot of obstacles, the learning curve in most businesses is actually very steep at the beginning, so you have to spend many hours, days, weeks, months or even years, learn the business, and then you can actually move on to generating profits. So having said all of those things, now let's talk about what time people should not become entrepreneurs, and that they will actually be more successful getting a job. You see. Not everybody, from my point of view, should aim to be an entrepreneur, because doing so could actually push their plans way back. So the people who should not consider entrepreneurship, from my point of view, are those who believe in a clear work life balance and structure to see entrepreneurs that I know of personally. Generally, their lives are not as orderly and organized and a lot of people among us, we value organization in order. So if you want that level of order in your life, where things are happening in order Probably running a business will make you very unhappy. Even if you make more money you will be unhappy. I mean, do you really like to make more money and then be unhappy all the time? What's the point anyways? Right? So the second question, of course, is, Are you the kind of person who would prefer to deal with certain types of people, and do not really enjoy talking with people from all walks of life, that's very important, because as an entrepreneur, especially if you have like a big kind of business, or the kind of is that actually serve a mass audience, especially if it's like, you know, aimed at almost anyone who can come and become your client, let's say restaurant businesses, let's say I don't know health and fitness business, let's say coaching and consultancies, all of these things, you will have to deal with people, you know, people from all walks of life, kinda like you know, being a doctor where almost anybody can be a patient. So, are you the kind of person who enjoys dealing people from all walks of life, and not necessarily those who are like you are who share your opinions. Think about those who are completely unlike you, whose lifestyles are not at all like you, if you are the kind of person who prefers to only spend time with certain types of people, for example, those who are at your level of education, those who live in your town or those share your beliefs, ideologies, and so on, that again, better not information may be very unhappy, because you will end up dealing with people from many different walks of life, who you have to deal with, because they are your prospective clients or prospects. And because of this, you need to somehow feel but upset about this matter, because maybe you really don't enjoy dealing with somebody who is I don't know, perhaps 3040 years older than you or opposite 20 years younger than you or somebody who is coming from a very different background that perhaps is very radically different from your background, right. So if you don't enjoy that kind of experiences, interactions, probably it's better to get a job so you can actually have a smaller social circle made of like minded people. And finally, is About your major goal in life is C, running a business is pretty much a group endeavor. It's really about other people, it's about serving other people creating value for the society. And it's a very rewarding experience. But if you're the kind of person who values perhaps more deeper things in life, like you really enjoy perhaps discussing the details of nature's philosophy for hours, and you perhaps don't want to be, let's say, interrupted by a customer, talking about, oh, we have a problem with the piping of this house, for example, then maybe you should not consider working on your own and perhaps at least delegate those kind of tasks with, you know, for other people who are willing to be interrupted. Some of us we don't really like to be interrupted when we're doing something we want to like, focus on that thing. Entrepreneurship is kind of like being a fireman at any one moment. Something could go wrong. There's sort of problem right here. It should be addressed. You should always be on a standby mode, if you will, for your job and your business. And if you don't Like that approach again, there are many other ways to be wealthy, you do not necessarily have to opt to run your own business. Now, of course, was the beginning. And I really believe that becoming entrepreneur from my point of view is a very rewarding experience. And I think if you have listened well to us up until now, you probably have now a basic idea of what it really takes to be an entrepreneur, and whether or not you should become an entrepreneur. But don't worry, even if you don't want to be an entrepreneur, there are many ways to create wealth without running a business or establishing a group of people who serve customers. There are many simpler ways to become becoming wealthy, including invest in real estate which can be done all by yourself without running a basically a lot of businesses and without having to deal with tech stages, all that stuff or a team or so on and so forth. And in this series, hopefully the entrepreneurial vision of the podcast we will discuss them one by one. And of course, we will also at some point address other issues such as forex stock market, they basically investment as well as other types of business and And financial topics. So that's all we have for guys. I hope you enjoyed our first episode as part of the entrepreneurial edition of the enterprise and podcast. Of course, as always, you have any questions or you would like me to talk about a specific business or financial topic, just send me a message. You can reach me anywhere Dan Molgan and I will be glad to answer it. Hopefully they're on podcasts or face to face or live. Alright guys, that's all the time we have for Thank you very much. And let's see what it takes to become an entrepreneur. For now. I wish you all a wonderful day or night ahead depending on where you are. All of our beautiful planet. Have a good one.

It is said that words alone make up about 7% of our communication and the other 93% is made up of our tonality and especially body language. However, in the era of digital technology in general and a period ravaged by the coronavirus pandemic in particular we are seeing a dramatic increase in virtual forms of communication from text messages and stickers to audio and video calls.    In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel and Pouya discuss the main differences between face to face communication and distant communication made readily available by the internet and offer suggestions on how to use the new technology in order to make our communication more effective.    Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript: ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS communication, text, virtual, texting, person, body language, face, people, talking, tonality, energy, meeting, friends, teleportation, arranging, childhood dream, phone call, important, urgent, means SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to yet another episode of beyond the present Podcast. I am as always joined here with Daniel Mulligan How's it going, Dan?   Dan  00:18 Hey, the man buddy glad to be here with you the one and only paychecks to have another let's talk addition another great episode to discuss things that matter and life is of course, great as usual. We are trying our best to go through this situation. Fortunately, things are getting a little bit better in some countries have it worse than some others. So now things are quite fine. I from my point of view in the Middle East, things are also quite fine in Russia. The US is gradually recovering. Unfortunately I heard some bad news about Germany because they had a basically a protest the other day about this all these limitations against the coronavirus pandemic. Some people are saying this whole is just a hoax and all that stuff. And as you probably know, I've moved the headquarters of my European company from Finland Gemini and this was a little bit problematic, because this year, Gemini is going through a lot of changes in terms of perhaps we're gonna have a new election and Merkel is going to leave and somebody else going to come and now there's a virus. So a little bit of problems in the European Union right now. But everywhere else things are quite fine. Zoo usual with all of our plans.   Pouya LJ  01:18 Awesome. Good to hear that. Now, the progression of the Coronavirus is one thing but one thing that it did, it made a lot of real in person physical communication, move to a virtual space such as calls or a loop, right? Yeah. I'm here today we're sitting here to talk about that the difference between these two and the impacts it might have had or keeps having on our communications. So let's listen let's let's dig in. So what is the essence of a virtual virtual communication that is different than a physical communication and in person face to face communication, in your opinion?   Dan  01:58 Very well. So if anybody here Among our listeners, just from NLP or neuro linguistic programming, one of the comments on this field of endeavor is that communication is basically only about three to 5% made of words. It's almost about let's say 25 to 35% in terms of vocal tonality and voice and so on, and the rest of it the majority is actually body language. So, if you look at the indication for you know, from, from these types of words, which is voice and tonality, which is yet small, but important, of course, then just words and then body language as the most important element of communication, you realize that virtual communication especially texting is probably the least effective means of communication. Now, obviously nowadays we have things like stickers. And I don't know emojis and all that. But even those things still not fully help us convey our emotions well in our communication. So, because of this, you can probably guess, as an extrovert that I am how I personally feel about, you know, verbal communication. So I use it just like anybody else. As part of my business communications, I rarely use virtual communication, to I don't know, just to have fun or pass my time because for me, that's just strictly business or to be in touch with friends and basically, in different parts of the world. So if I'm right now sitting in one city, let's just say that right now, I'm in Warsaw, Poland, and I are going to be texting my friends in Poland or in Warsaw, I will be texting my friends in other countries. But if I am in Warsaw, and I want to practice my polish, I am only going to be meeting my friends face to face because I believe that effective communication requires focus and physical presence. That's my personal take on that. Now, of course I do know that there are some people who are not necessarily as extroverted as I am, and they're rather shy. So for these people, obviously, such means of communication, like texting can be very helpful because, you know, somehow protect them from that shyness. But for most of us, I do not see virtual communication, especially via texting and stickers and so on as anything more than just purely business and it's not really efficient. So, personally, I'm not a huge fan, but at the same time, I do know that in the you know, especially in my line of work, which I worked through from all around the world, it is but impossible to rely only on face to face communication, because I mean, the only case that that might be possible, if my childhood dream is realized, and humanity invents teleportation and I was in my childhood dream since a very young age everybody asked like what's like the one superpower you want to have? And it was like all things I want, like freeze time, all those things. That wasn't one thing instant teleportation to any part of the world that was like, you know, my childhood dream. So until and unless I'm I'm telling you right now, by the way, if if Sunday, there is I will perhaps abandon all virtual communication altogether. And I will simply rely on faces condition, all my interactions. But as of today, unless you're living in some fantasy world, there is no such thing as teleportation, which means we need to use and virtual communication to reachable from all parts of the world. And basically to communicate, this also saves a tremendous amount of time, as well as you know, it reduces our carbon footprint to the environment. If you want to always move around with your car or with you know, planes, you generally are gonna increase a lot of basically carbon emission, and that's bad for our planet. But if you look at this issue, at this moment, there is a you know, from my point of view, there's a great plus here for virtual communication and that it saves time and it you know, saves our planet. But other than that, there are so many disadvantages to you know, vertical integration that I personally can actually go In Depth to all of them, but personally, am I a fan of verbal communication? No. Do I use it? Yes, probably more than most people. And do I like it? Probably not. But I have no other choice because we don't have teleportation. Come on guys think of something.   Pouya LJ  06:16 So I was just when you were talking about   Dan  06:20 this job guys like you to make this happen.   Pouya LJ  06:24 Yeah. Well, working on it. No, but when you were talking about teleportation, the first thing that came to my mind was Dan jumping in and out of rooms and it's like, Hey, buddy, I have to go.   Dan  06:37 Of course, in your personal life, too. It's not just always about business. You can also do a lot of stuff with that stuff.   Pouya LJ  06:42 Yeah, the sky's the limit. Right. All right. Okay, so, so let's let's actually do jump into for some of the, I've analyzed the disadvantages one by one, but   Dan  06:53 go further because believe it or not, our listeners might not know this. I actually learned a lot a lot more about these things. And you are one of the I actually got me more hooked with virtual condition of all kinds because I wasn't so much into it, I would actually ask you yourself, which is so how much do you use it? How well to use of course, our listeners know that we have a difference in terms of our temperament. So I'm more extroverted and you're more introverted. So how do you use, you know, this, this form of communication? And how well and how much you actually use it? for what purposes?   Pouya LJ  07:23 Right? Well, I mean, so that's a very good question. But my attitude is slightly different. I do agree with you that nothing beats the physical in person face to face communication when it comes to stuff that actually do matter. By do matter, means I mean, that, you know, they're convoluted and complex enough that you require some degree of, quote unquote codebreaking to understand exactly what that person means. So if I'm having a debate with somebody on it, let's say an important issue, I don't want to do it on a phone call. I want to do it in person, preferably, but if not possible, the next best thing would be a video call. I don't even I don't even engage in such a debate in a voice, you know, stream of communication, which is I think, lacking a lot. However, like I do like it for a lot of scenarios, for example, if I'm scheduling something to for meetup, like the plan is clear what we intend to do, but it's just a timing that we're trying to figure out. I would like to use the text of course, because then that person can take the receive my text, take their time, go on their calendar, whenever they know if it works for them or not, give a give a text back to me and we can get to it can take as long as they can. It needs unless it's an emergency, like a meet up kind of situation in which you pick up the phone and call them and fix it. But my point is, there are scenarios that I think even a text communication can be quite useful or often often is not a communication but just a ping. Just heads up is like oh, I'm ready in five minutes done, you   Dan  09:03 probably the best usage of virtual communication anyways. Right?   Pouya LJ  09:07 Right. Right, exactly. So point being that, like, obviously, there's a lot of good things that come out of it. But if you unilaterally go on a text based communication, then obviously you're missing a lot and the you being the rhetorical unit, I know you don't do that. But, but But yeah, and I agree with you. So I cannot, I don't, I cannot think of a way that we can beat the physical face to face in the same room in the same place. Kinda kind of communication on on more complex topics that perhaps we are trying to convey to one another.   Dan  09:42 Absolutely, absolutely true. It makes sense.   Pouya LJ  09:45 Yeah. Now let's actually go into deep and say why this is actually what what what are we exactly missing? So obviously, there are layers. So we can go one by one or you can jump between them doesn't matter really. But obviously there's there's a physical thing in the same room, let's say Place, there's a video of the the video format of a video conference or video call, then we have the voice. And then we have the text combined with emojis or without emojis, what have you. Okay, so so let's go obviously physical things has a lot that is missing in a video format Can Can you can go deeper into what is missing exactly between those two.   Dan  10:24 So first of all, let's compare them in details we have facing this indication. Now it was once talking about this issue with one of our basically seminar attendance and I asked him So guys, do you feel right now there's a lot of you guys basically here and sitting here and next to each other and you feel the energy, right? And one of my basically seminar attendance was also a great friend of mine. He said, Listen, Dan, I think it's because of the soul of these people. So our souls come to one another and we create that energy or vibe. I don't know about that because science still has not proven the existence of solar. Spirit. However, we all know that once we are in the physical presence of other people, it always feels different. This could be the vibration they emit from the surface of their skins, as we know that in quantum physics, that everything is vibrating, and there's an energy level involved. So when you're talking to a real human being face to face, whether you call it spirit, or whether you call it the quantum vibrations of their, let's say, body or their energy level, or simply their heat and the temperature, they generate through, you know, their body temperature, whatever it is, there's always bigger impact in terms of what they do to you and how you feel. Other than that, it's about communication itself. So as mentioned, the biggest aspect of communication is your body language. Imagine I'm smiling first right now because we have a podcast that's nearly audio. Imagine I'm smiling, and I tell you like, oh, man, come on. Now. Compare that With someone changing his facial expression and tonality and say, Hey, come on, these two imply very different meaning. I can say, you idiot with a very aggressive, for example, tone, I can say, you idiot. These are very, very different meanings, right? So, because of the fact that body language conveys the majority of the meaning of interaction, because let's be honest, when you're talking to somebody else, most of what you are perceiving of that interaction is the body language. This is how the brain is wired, basically. And if you're saying things, are those things sincere or not, so for example, let's say you text your buddy or your girlfriend or your boyfriend in the morning, and what's up, she texts back. I'm doing fine, smiley smiley. But let's say you saw her in the same room The next morning and say, What's up, she says, another Monday. She Yeah.   Pouya LJ  13:01 So   Dan  13:02 you will perceive of these two communications the same even though they have the same verbal context, I'm doing fine. Which is why face to face communication, first of all conveys more information about the person allows us to understand whether the other person is being sincere and telling exactly how he or she feels. For example, lie detection itself worse only in person, you cannot, you know, use lie detection solely by texts unless you're making some very serious mistakes, right? Where they are saying things that are very contradictory. But in reality, you can understand people better face to face, you know how you're feeling, you understand whether what they're saying is like a let's say, sarcastic comment. It's an aggressive comment, you feel it, all of those, and you take it in, on a subconscious level. And by the way, you don't have to be a trained body language expert to understand most of these. Now it is true that if you have deep you know, studies and body language, you can do a lot of cool things like knowing for example with a person's language, not by opportunity. 95% accuracy, whether the person is sincere or not, whether what he or she says, will actually be done. These are all the things you can learn through additional study of body language, it can make you do some crazy stuff that seems like magic, but it actually can be done with body language. But even if you have no concept of what even what the word body language means, you can still by nature, the way we are our brains wired, we can understand other people's feelings and emotions. And because of this, we are missing out on all of these things when we rely on virtual communication. However, in virtual communication, we also have video calls, which is probably the best form of basically, virtual communication because in that case, you have what you know what they're saying. That is the words they're using. You hear their tonality, and you see their faces, but still, since it's not exactly 3d, it is it doesn't carry the same weight. It's the closest thing that comes to face miscommunication, but it's not the same actually. And if you add up On top of that, you know the connection problems. And let's say that light in the room and all those things, you will have even more problems. But overall, as I mentioned earlier, you can always improve the quality of our, let's say virtual communication if we try to model it after real face to face communication. So I mentioned earlier about emojis, that's a great inclusion, and will allow us to kind of get Is there like a sarcasm? Or is it real? So these are the things that can actually add up. But in the end, as I mentioned earlier, the major absence of body language, as well as tonality makes most text based syndications from my point of view, not efficient at all, and probably close to three or 4%. Effective.   Pouya LJ  15:43 Yeah, no, that that makes a lot of sense. Because as social animals, we're biologically wired to, you know, understand a lot of these things even though sometimes we don't know what we're understanding, really, oh, how are we doing it? Actually, there's a good book. I mean, not exactly on this, but talks about this blink by Malcolm Gladwell, which does talk about this a little bit if people are interested to read more, they're welcome Of course. Yeah. So I mean, especially the tech specs, or text based communication is too far from the physical one. Now when we got a voice as you mentioned for example, you were reading that sentence I forgot what the exact wording was. But no, you can you can imagine it with every kind of sentence What the hell are you doing? Or Oh, you said you idiot. Yeah, it could we could when you introduce it tonality becomes different. Now there's all from obviously, and the subtle subtle little ones which becomes more obvious when you see people now with the role of an eye for instance, now that you can again, get in a video setting, even body language to extent if the entire body is visible into camera, you can get Can you can you can you explain like in a little bit of a detail, maybe maybe that's the energy thing. That you talk about, but what is it exactly that we don't get beyond the video compared to physical?   Dan  17:06 Well, what you mentioned about energy. First of all, I believe in that energy part because that is actually proven by science. You're I mean, you probably know far more about this than I knew, basically. And it's called quantum physics. So basically, all living organisms are basically generating heat and energy is just quite normal, which is why we need to, you know, things like food and rest to be able to keep expanding, we lose cells and burn and burn energy to, you know, build new cells. So that energy asked me what I think it's very important. So real people, they are emitting energy. Now some get spiritual call of things like aura or spiritual energy. Maybe that's the case. I'm neither gonna basically confirm nor deny because in this regard, I will remain nearly agnostic, because science cannot prove it, but at the same time, science cannot disprove it. So I will not comment on that. But science has already proven that there is this thing called vibrations of basically organisms and the energy they emit. So that's one thing. The other factor is being with other people, you're not just seeing them, you are also smelling them even at a very deep, subconscious level. You see, everyone carries with themselves a smell. Now that smell could be very pleasant, like Anna, let's say and very nice odor they've added can be very unpleasant as you probably know, a few a few hours. If you're someone like me, who goes to gym frequently, and happens to be this god awful place called the locker room. And you probably know what, what I'm talking about. So people are also, you know, emitting a lot of smell. And when it comes to the cases, like, basically meeting or funding your partner has actually proven basically that people tend to release basically based upon their hormonal status, they send different smelling signals, that implies whether or not they are open for me. So believe it or not, maybe you're out there talking to someone and you suddenly feel a sense Of Attraction without knowing why you like that man or woman? And the answer is pheromones. So pheromones are now it's not just for humans it exists on all basically living organisms. So the pheromones exist only in face to face communication which is why I'm so against Tinder. Gosh, and I hate this but even more popular these days, just such a such a terrible way to meet someone. So pheromones are like this. So you tend to admit that smell to attract mates basically and all that stuff? Obviously, it's about the way you dress so as you probably have seen, there's a lot of you know, memes and jokes about this. People dressing top up very professionally while they're wearing their underwears below as they're looking at, you know, the laptop so that's like a new thing. And especially working remotely due to the coronavirus pandemic has made this even more popular people dressing all nice, they got the suit on on top and they're wearing their you know, mommy's underpants basically right there. So it's like a kind of like not the same thing. And more importantly, in person, you probably get the chance Yesterday will be called touch or because as you as you know, in NLP, we say we have five major senses. And all that we are is the result of those five senses. And one of those critical senses is actually the sense of touch. Things like a handshake things like a hug, things like, I don't know, tapping their shoulders or holding them or all of these things. These are going to also add a lot of meaning and emotional components to our communication that simply are not present in virtual communication, basically. So when you add these things together, plus that energy level, then you realize why it is a lot more efficient to perhaps communicate using body language and face to face then using the internet and virtually   Pouya LJ  20:40 not. So that's amazing now, now the natural question is okay, we try. We tried to do a lot of it in person as much as necessary. But obviously we're in it, especially now in time we're in a circumstance not just because of the enablers of the technology, but actually because of the circumstance. A lot of things are being done. Without the physical presence, like people are working remotely and having their meeting and what have you, or even texting each other for First off, I mean, one good example of a potential solution to use these visual visual forms of communication, but still convey the most that you want was to include emojis, for example, and text. That's a great example. Now, are there things that you can advise? On the for example, well, even text again, but voice and video specifically to convey your messaging better? as a as a messenger not receive? Of course? Yeah,   Dan  21:34 of course. Well, I think in this regard, you're definitely more experienced than I am because most of my virtual communication is strictly limited to business. I tend to avoid basically, communications that are on a personal friendly or romantic level via text or calls or these things because I'm a firm believer, especially when it comes to important emotional relationships. Let's say with your parents, let's say with your partner with your children. really believe that, for example, having these types of indications of via virtual, you know, virtually via text or these things, it's a lot easier but efficient, very inefficient. So most of my virtual communication usually occurs in my personal professional life has been avoided in my personal life as much as possible. So when it comes to professional, basically life, however, I really like to emphasize on being quite clear in your text, because one of the biggest issues of texting is that there are two major problems. Number one is that you might not imply what you're reading me. And number two is that time distance. So for example, if I'm talking to you right now, Face Face to face, and I'm saying like, so what do you think? And then you look at my eyes, looking at different distance, direction, and don't talk to me at all. In a real physics application. What do we assume here projects   Pouya LJ  22:56 was kind of insulting is to   Dan  22:58 you know, say not insulted. You feel like Excuse me, I'm talking to you, dude. Right? So you feel or if you don't feel insulted, you might feel like, what happened to me is he is he depressed? So this brings about basically, you know, some weird things. And we are, by the way, evolutionary wired this way. So because we did not have virtual communication that on a massive scale for about let's see, I don't know, for the past, we only had it for the past, let's say 1020 years. Now, of course, we had telephone before that. But even that was like, even if this whole thing begins with the telephone, which is, I don't know, about 100 years old or something that is still a very a tiny fraction of our evolutionary history. So that was more like, I don't know, perhaps, if our all of our evolutionary background was 24 hours, the invention of virtual communication, including Telegraph's and so on, is probably less than 1% of that 24 hours. So imagine, like, we are not wired emotionally for that kind of indication. So if I'm talking to you right now, and you're looking at this and you feel like Dude, this guy doesn't respect me or something like this, but in virtual communication, I mean, you can Do this, because maybe the person that you're texting, he's, I'm sorry, he's maybe he's using the bathroom, maybe it's an important meeting. Maybe he's trying to make love to his partner, maybe there's something going on. Maybe he's really is depressed and doesn't even want to meet. Because if you are really down and depressed, let's say, I don't know somebody is depressed or to have a health problem, you're not going to go out to meet your friend, but anyone can reach you. 24 seven, I was talking to a friend of mine, and she was a lady. And she really felt like I'm feeling a sense of April. I feel like very down and sad. So that person, if you text him or her, she's not going to respond to it because you're here she is feeling down. But in a real communications that will never happen because you will not meet her in the first place. Right? So because of all these challenges that you know the if you're occurs over distance, there comes a series of issues. Number one, the timing of the response. Someone might not respond to our texts for two days. And we assume, oh, this guy doesn't respect me. But in fact, the person is Perhaps really busy, or maybe in a bad mood, or you don't know what's going on, or maybe simply he did not even, he forgot to respond or you want to send a text or there was a connection. So all of these issues and get in the way, which is why I would like to create, basically, and I like to, you know, create a rule for texting that I personally use all the time. And my rule is very simple. I send a text to someone. And when I send a text to someone that I, you know, no, I expect a response. It's very normal. Everybody does that. Now the person might not respond to it. This means perhaps the person is not available or is not willing. Either way. I wait. Because, you know, we're not there. I'm not waiting for that person. Maybe he or she's in the middle of something important. Maybe he or she is not there. So I wait. And if I realize that waiting did not change and I have not so got my response. I'm not going to send the second or third message. Instead, I will simply make a phone call. Why? Because when you make a phone call it implies I we're discussing something urgent and important right? requires your attention. But when you're sending a text by its very nature text, which is what we call a low investment, social activity. So if I'm sending a text to you, it means what I'm saying is not urgent, and could be responded at any moment. That's what I assume basically, right? So, in all my business interactions, if I'm sending an email or a text, I not expecting an urgent response. If I do, especially in the case of email, I would instead prefer to make a phone call. Now if a phone call is for whatever reason not possible, I simply add over the text or email. Your fast response will be appreciate I usually answered about in my email, over text, I wouldn't do this because text by its very nature is what we call an on urgent form of communication. So I do not expect my texts to be respond too quickly because if I want a response quickly, I will make a phone call instead, for whatever but let's say I want to talk to my supplier and say I want to talk to my For example, security, but whatever it is, if it's urgent, I have to make a basically phone call instead. So anybody who's using texts from my point of view, they should use the same strategy. If you want to say something, something is very important and urgent, you should not use texting because texting is merely a text. It lacks vocal tonality. It lacks body language. And in many cases, even though it lacks Smiley's, especially in case of physical location. So, it almost implies that I'm just another text like all the other text, so you should not necessarily expect to respond quickly. And generally speaking, I also believe we should follow the pattern of the person. So if I sent a text right now, and the person responds after 20 minutes, that implies he or she might be very busy. But if he or she responds immediately, that means that he or she is available. So in that case, again, if finally the person is immediately available, I'm not going to keep texting, I'll just call the person. It's like, Oh, this guy's actually available. Let's call wine. I will use every opportunity Just stop texting and start calling speaking video calling because I want my communication to be as close to the physical limitation as possible. Because texting is a perverted version of communication, it's not the   28:14 field and the   Dan  28:17 and for that reason, if anything, if you're if you are upset about something you should not expect over text you should call the person if you want to clear something that has not clarified yet, you should call or you should have a video call for all these important issues, I recommend using video and voice voice calls and not text and I like to use text for things of that are either extremely the now like See you at this time or beer at this time or I will see you in front of this place like these you know, been there done that kind of stuff very simple telecommunication command based or for things that are not very urgent. Like if I really want to say like oh man, check this out very nice. This This does not require an immediate response right. So for that reason Save texting for things that are neither urgent nor very important. And the more important and the more urgent the text or communication is, I actually converted text to a phone call or a video call. And ideally, I don't do any of those. I just arrange a meeting if I'm in the same city, I will do all face to face.   Pouya LJ  29:17 Yeah, that's perfect. No, that's good. I think we covered a lot. Obviously, this topic is on exhaustible, you can keep going, so you have to come to a national halt. And that is, I think, a good place to do that unless you want to add something up or do a summary of what we talked about.   Dan  29:33 That's right, very well. So we had a great time. Today, of course, we discussed the issue of virtual communication. Now, as you probably know, I am a critic of virtual communication. I'm not a huge fan of it. And I explained all the reasons why and mainly is because first communication is not as efficient as actual face to face communication. However, there's a huge advantage to virtual mediation, that's there are no limits on with whom you can speak, when you can speak and wherever that person might be. Right Because the internet and communication were This is called communication at the speed of light. So we have no limitations in this regard. However, that lack of limitations also creates its own set of problems, which we addressed in terms of knowing how to respond and how to text someone. And more importantly, we emphasize the importance of trying to make our virtual communication as close to the real version as possible by including things like video calls, where we can actually see the person using our tonality. And, you know, we have voice calls and trying to use texts, not as a means of, you know, entertaining or just wasting your time, nor just trying to express the most important deepest thoughts. I mean, one of my friends said, like, I truly want to express to my partner how much I love her. I don't know how to write it on text. I said, Dude, don't text her. Just go tell her face to face, or even some people actually break up over text. It's just, it just boggles my mind. Unbelievable. So you want to use text as a means of reaching the person. And this is one of the things I learned from one of my friends. Basically. And he said, use text as nothing but a means of arranging a meeting. This is one of my friends who said that actually, and he's a great, you know, Jewish gentleman that I like and I learned a lot from. So he said, like, don't use texts for anything other than arranging meetings. Now, that meeting could be, let's say, a virtual meeting via Skype, or zoom, or, let's say messengers, or it could be a person, ideally, a face to face meeting, but ultimately, save texting, at least from my point of view, mainly for arranging real meetups. However, when it comes to these arrangements, these texts are very efficient. Are you available? Yes, I am, here and here at that time, let's see each other. So for that reason, I'm a huge proponent of not relying on texting as a means of communicating, but using text to arrange virtual meetings via zoom. You're saying like, but I don't want to do businessman I want to talk to my friend. Okay. You can text your friend or you can say you know, they Call your friends. Which one is going to be doing more effective? The answer is obvious video calls. So why don't you use text to arrange a video call instead of just texting to see how you're doing. That'll be a lot more efficient if you actually see him, talk to him and so on. So for that reason, that's how I personally like to use text as a means of arranging either a virtual or a face to face meeting   Pouya LJ  32:21 was amazing. All right. With that we're coming to the end of the show. Thank you as always, Dan.   Dan  32:27 It's my pleasure, buddy. Glad to be here with the one and only Pouyjix   Pouya LJ  32:30 Thank you. And thank you everybody for tuning in. And I hope you enjoyed this episode. I did for sure. And please, leave us comments. Let us know what you want us to talk about. And please, if you have time, then if you enjoyed the show, go rate it commented, let it grow. We would appreciate it and until a later episode. Have a good one.

One of the common issues of the modern world is experiencing emotional and physical burnout due to excess work and stress combined with lack of sufficient sleep and physical activity, many are told to put long hours in their work and study and ignore leisure but the fact of the matter is that we need to treat our bodies as just that, bodies in need of rest and recreation.    In this episode of Beyond the Present Podcast Dan and Poujix discuss the importance of having leisure activities and offer guidelines on how to pick the best means of R&R that are also in alignment with our long term goals and plans. If you want to learn to have fun and feel good about having fun the next day when you wake up then this episode is right up your alley!    Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript:----more----     SUMMARY KEYWORDS leisure activities, leisure, people, life, activities, day, languages, pandemic, work, subtitles, fun, body, run, goals, enjoy, talking, reason, occasionally, burnout, recreation SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast. Let's talk addition as always joined with Daniel Morgan. How's it going, dan?   Dan  00:19 Hey, man, buddy. Glad to be here with one and only Cujo likes to discuss a lot of great topics. So life is great. And fortunately, gradually the borders are getting reopen. Of course, again, I was very disheartened a couple days ago when I heard the news that Bali which was supposed to open its borders to all tourists around the world, on September 11, actually canceled the entire plan. And they mentioned that they will open you know, for tourists only in early 2021. And as you probably know, if Bali was going to open the borders, probably many other countries would follow because that's like a place for tourists. So people don't really have to wear masks winter on volume and let's say islands and that you're having some fun over there. So that was a sign Perhaps the world is ready to get back to normal. But the very fact that the government of Bali somehow did not agree with this and they postpone the plan to 2021 implies that we still have to wait for the vaccine, basically. And I also read an article by Bill Gates that mentioned if 30 to 60% of population in the US get the vaccine, the pandemic is essentially over. So we'll see how it goes. And so there are some good news, generally, although there was one disheartening, basically piece of news that I heard earlier from wh o world health organization that said, even a vaccine might not end the pandemic, but then again, I'm guessing that's more like politics, because as you probably are aware, Donald Trump announced that the US will no longer funds w h o from next year so I'm guessing that they will you should feel like they're left behind that Oh, by the way, you will never have a really from the virus if you want us to just start you know, refund this so maybe we'll find a way. I don't know. Perhaps it seems like you know, dirty politics because I don't think the world Right now needs bad news from especially who to tell them that even a vaccine will not end the pandemic, because that's from my point of view is very counterintuitive, because it is proven proven that it can actually end if a certain, you know, minority population actually do get vaccinated. So overall, things are fine. And we are hoping to hopefully see how things will change. I'm literally preparing all of my plans. Now, we are just waiting for the pandemic to be over. And as soon as you know, hopefully, life gets back to normal in 2021. I'm plan to actually initiate a lot of our projects in Europe. So I focused a lot in China and Russia in the past four years. So most of our focus for the next four to five years will be in the European Union. So France, Germany, Sweden, and a few countries like that. We're going to focus on these countries for a while. So we are preparing our plans, basically so that we can actually initiate a full fledged European campaign from next year. We'll see things things are really fine and we're doing our best to stay afloat.   Pouya LJ  03:00 That's, that's amazing. So you're on the slightly more. We call it optimistic camp regarding this whole pandemic situation   Dan  03:09 I have to be if you're an entrepreneur, as you already had this assertion earlier, if you're an entrepreneur, you have to be an optimist.   Pouya LJ  03:14 Fair enough. No, that makes sense. That makes sense. All right. I hope you're right. We're all really free, by the way.   Dan  03:21 perspective, are you on the pessimistic spectrum?   Pouya LJ  03:23 No, I'm not on the pessimistic spectrum. But I'm a little bit. I'm a little bit on the you know, I'm just I'm just, I'm just, I'm just concerned, mostly that the optimistic scenario might not know Yeah,   03:37 yeah, of course. Of course. Yeah.   Pouya LJ  03:38 So I mean, it will be what it will be and we have to cope with it. Of course. I hope you're right. And I tend to be generally speaking, optimistic, but about this particular one, I'm more concerned and optimistic. Anyways,   Dan  03:52 because the US now as you probably know, it's devastated by the virus and the sheer mismanagement and the idiocy of Trump but how things ended Canada. So have you guys managed to actually contain the virus? Are things better there than it is? I'm sure it is better, of course, but how to which degree actually, is it?   Pouya LJ  04:08 Yeah. No, I think it's great. I mean, at least in the Ontario in Toronto, the things are actually pretty good, relatively speaking. cases are, have been less than 100 and the whole province for the past few days, and it's spiked slightly over 100. Yesterday believe. But generally speaking, it's just running around 100 cases every day in the entire province that Toronto isn't, which is,   Dan  04:35 which is funny that Canada is basically nicknamed as Canada because of all the Chinese who are now in Canada, despite the fact that this hadn't, you know, let's say origin in China. And there are so many there. I think there are a lot more Chinese in Canada in the US, I'm guessing. And despite all that, still, we are seeing, you know, how well the Kenyan government managed this crisis so much better than the US so definitely good for the Kenyan president. And shame on Trump.   Pouya LJ  05:01 Yeah. And well, I mean, and the reopening has been done gradually but very, very successfully. So, Toronto has been pretty open for the past. By open I mean, like with with physical distancing, of course, but you can go out you can go to restaurants and whatnot. And still it no no huge spikes in numbers or whatever. So, yeah, that's, that's, that's good for them. For sure. Yeah. Anyhow, so that's not the topic today, but we had to catch up a little bit. So the topic today is, how to choose your leisure activities. What should your leisure activities be, depending on who you are, when what your goals are, etc. Now, so let's start with let's start with talking about what do you do for leisure on an on a day to day basis? I know I know, you don't have so much time for leisure. But anyhow, you do have some Well,   Dan  05:56 you said something very nice. You don't have so much time for leisure because that's As you probably know, we've already started earlier in front of our programs, you know, and beyond the present podcast. And the fact of the matter is that if you wants to, from my point of view have a very inspiring lifestyle, you probably wants to look at life a little bit differently than a nine to five for work. And then the rest of the time is for me for leisure. You see, unfortunately, we live in a world where it is quite normal to consider your work as something separate from your actual life. So that work is like that toil that you have to do to enjoy the rest of your day. So you go in or let's say you go to work nine to five, five days a week, in order to be able to enjoy the rest of your life, which is the other eight hours or 10 hours per day. And from my point of view, that's probably the worst formula you could ever come up with to live a life and it's definitely a recipe for disaster because if you want to live your life in a way that you live for, basically your leisure time, then you know, Gary Vee says your if you're living for the weekend, then your shit is broken. And he's right. Because if you're living A life where you have to suffer through work and suffer through your studies or your you know, professional routines in order to be late, enjoy the time that you're not working or you're not studying or you're not, you know, perhaps advancing your career, then there's gonna be a problem here. And that's, you know, the willpower. I mean, you can use your willpower to keep pushing and working harder and to use discipline to just say, you know what, that's just work, I got to get it done to feed my family, you could definitely do these things. But the problem is that willpower never lasts. At some point, you will run out of willpower, and then you become depressed like what the hell is wrong with my life? And that we call Of course, This usually happens for most people around the ages of 35 to 40 becomes like a, you know, a midlife crisis, which almost everybody goes through, except for entrepreneurs because their lives have been so much filled with crises. They don't even understand what a midlife crisis looks like as much for your question beforehand. But the fact of the matter is that if you really want to make the most of your life, you need to somehow find a way to eradicate that, you know, clear border between work and life. And then trying to mix them a little bit. So given that I have aspired to this belief, I would like to do the exact same thing. And then I will, I would like to involve my hobbies and my, let's say leisure activities into my work and make it perhaps, you know, capitalize on it and try to actually use it as a means of serving other people. So for that reason, probably the only times where I am not necessarily working or doing things that will perhaps lead to, let's say, my, let's say, professional success is probably maybe like, I don't know, it's very hard to find things, perhaps occasionally, some, let's say going out to nature occasionally to just rest for a while. But for the most part, I really believe that if you find the right recreational activities, they are in a sense part of like your investment portfolio because you're investing in yourself in your body in its well being. I mean, if you drive a car, for example, I think most will put more energy into taking care of their cars by going through the maintenance No changing the tires, the oil and all that stuff than they do actually with their own bodies. So, because of this I see recreation as a means of taking care of that organism, that machine that gets you through the, you know, the hustles and bustles of the daily life. And if you want to make the most of your, basically life and career, you have to you better have a body and a mind that is fresh, ready, and basically up for action. So, for that reason, I value recreation very much I value to you know, being rejuvenate yourself very much. However, how do I do this, there are many ways to go about it. So if you perhaps are tired of work, you can go right now and I don't know start doing online gambling, online poker, I don't know you can hang out with your friends, you can do pot, you can get drunk, you can hang out with your friends and I don't know play FIFA for hours. There are many ways to quote unquote, basically lit up some steam, but most of such activities will in the end leave you empty because you haven't done anything useful. And more importantly, in some of these cases, you actually have harm your body Especially with the case of drug abuse, alcohol, basically, consumption and access and so on. So for that reason, I believe that we can and should probably find a way to incorporate or choose certain leisure activities that are in alignment with our main goals and directions in life. So for example, if your goal in life is to be a successful business owner, perhaps you might choose social activities that allow you to network and meet other people. So instead of perhaps spending your time playing Dota at home, and being able to network with the little org that is playing on the other side, perhaps you should, I don't know decide to go to a book club or to a test seminar or some other social activities like a fundraiser or a charity organization or a charity event in order to meet people and expand your network. So here let's say you're on a let's say, you're now in a charity event, I don't know for to help the perhaps the those who are now in orphan orphanages basically right. So in this case, you are feeling good, you're socializing, you're having a good time you're chatting, you're alive. thing with kids, with people with parents. But at the same time, you're actually networking and meeting new people. So even though you are recreating in the background, you're actually expanding your network, which is an essential element for all entrepreneurs to know more people and be known by more people who like them and whom basically are liked by you. So because of this, the best one is a clear example. For me personally, as you probably know, I'm a polyglot. And I have been told that I speak a crazy amount of basically languages. And the answer is very simple because for me, language learning, which is nothing more than a pure passion, and basically, leisure activity is now a regular part of my daily life where I tend to, you know, go on, sometimes occasionally practice up to three, four languages per day, and then switch to either the next day. So by doing these things, even though I'm having fun, and I'm resting, I'm not working, I'm not doing business. I'm not trying to plan the next year or start, you know, talking things with my team. I'm simply sitting chilling and you know, perhaps doing some, you know, drills and Japanese or let's say I don't know in Hungarian, and I'm practicing these things just for fun. But that in a sense will then is in alignment, my ultimate goal, which is international business, and international education of languages for, you know, students from all over the world. So I'm having fun, but at the same time, I'm actually doing things that will be good for my career. So the same thing could be done for anybody. I mean, doesn't matter what you do, maybe you are an artist, maybe you are, perhaps more like a technical type. So perhaps if you are a computer programmer, maybe you want to try some digital activities online, but if you're not in the IT sector, perhaps playing Dota as your hobby will not be the best idea, right? So for that reason, I'm a fan of choosing leisure activities that are in alignment with your ultimate goals and values in life. That way, you will have fun and you also slowly but surely get closer to your goals because we need recreation. We can't just toilet the office from morning to night for 10 days and not you know see anything going go wrong because in that case, we will burn out and that will occur ironically Much worse because in the long term, in the long run in the long term, we will lose a lot more by demanding too much from our time and body. And we will simply stress burnout. And boom, it's kind of like the story of that, basically turtles and the hair. So that fast air just starts running and then gets tired of sleeping. Well, this little guy who's going slowly wins the race. It's kind of like that. So those who really want to go, I'd like to say, I don't want fun. I don't want leisure. Just work, work, work, work work. Bill Gates said that he never took a single day off and his 30s and I'm now 27 I want to kill myself. I'm 30. I don't know. So this is like the story, right? So yeah, you could try to do that. But then you will miss out on the long term, because you will then experience burnout. And then after a while, you get depressed and you wonder like, what's the point of it all? I mean, so what's the point of running your own business anyways? I need a gun. I better get a gun and then boom, something happens right. So because of this, I believe that you should think long term and to think long term means you should take care. You should look at yourself as a human being Not a robot, not a machine, but a human being who needs sufficient rest, sufficient physical activities you need especially we are social creatures, we need a lot of socializing, to feel happy and well. So going out with friends, trying to you know, have a you know, picnic outside or going for a barbecue with your basically colleagues, these type of social activities, especially when they are, you know, with people that you like, will substantially improve your overall well being. So I believe it is very important to put time aside for leisure and for hobbies. Again, that's not a common suggestion these days, because now we are in an extreme culture of work, work work all the time. But I think that's perhaps not the best approach to go about it.   Pouya LJ  14:42 Well, yeah, I mean, I couldn't, couldn't agree more, especially when you were talking about the burnout part. And you know, in the long run, you're absolutely right. There's no way in the long run with that kind of mentality and you know, habit. You'll get the most efficient output from yourself. It's impossible. And I agree with you and that's why I also practice the same thing. I, as much as I like, what I do, generally speaking, I still need some, you know, even even for the sake of stopping repetition, I have to just do something else even if I love what I'm doing, even if you if I, I love pizza, okay, no secret. If I eat pizza every single day, I'm gonna hating pizza. Right? So even even for the sake of change, I have to I have to do something else. Even if I love what I do, which I do,   Dan  15:35 for you should probably run a franchisee of Domino's Pizza.   15:40 That's a great idea for your future. I mean, that that could be on the agenda. Who knows? Right?   Pouya LJ  15:47 No, but but I taught so back to what we were talking about. Yeah, I completely agree and to give some extra examples for myself. I love reading and I adopt that as a leisure time activity. Whilst it helps me learn something, and he can help me Yeah, move forward in the world, which is, which is which is definitely a useful leisure activity in my favorite most   Dan  16:09 favorite leisure activity all is like reading books while eating pizza. That's like the ultimate   Pouya LJ  16:16 must be has to me. Alright, okay, so all right, that was a that was a good, good, good introduction to the whole thing. I mean, it was more of an introduction, but who's counting? Anyways? So, yes, leisure activities. We gave some examples we talked about we talked about how they can be catered and and adjusted towards our goals. While we're enjoying them while we're experiencing some change from day to day life. Now, I know you you you go to the gym, do you count that as a leisure activity?   Dan  16:51 Well, again, these are all typically leisure activities. I told you, I'm not somebody who's just working in the office all the time. People sometimes think about that. And then that like Yeah, Daniel is always working or studying. That's not true. I basically, that's like, for me personally, you know, exercising on a regular basis is just a necessity. So, I basically when I wake up in the morning, the first thing I do is I grab my gears and I start running, you know, near my house, I don't go to the gym, you know, first morning because the body's not ready for that. So I basically when I wake up, the first thing I do is I grab my running shoes, and I go for a job for about 10 to 20 minutes. And then after the shower, I will, you know, begin the whole day everything, let's say working on social media, answering my emails, messages, all that stuff. So for me that's like the starters kind of like people's, you know, for people who are lazy, they use coffee. For me my coffee is running in the morning because it's not as easy as coffee, but it's definitely healthier and far more effective. And of course, I usually go to the gym somewhere after working hours. So usually, after I finished my basically work, basically my company, usually I tend to go to the gym, about let's say, three or four times Depending on the local time, of course and the country as well as how far because in some countries, for example, the the gym is very close to my house, so I'm just not so I have to adjust that as well by the time but around three or four, maximum five. Usually, I even hit the gym to recharge my batteries for the rest of the day, which oftentimes involves seminars, workshops, or simply group gatherings. So I want to have a lot of energy throughout the day. So I basically recharge the batteries once after I wake up with a jog. And then after about 567 hours of work, I go to the gym to recharge again, the batteries, if you will to have full peak energy throughout the entire day. And I do not consider that as work because it's definitely not work. And I do not simply work. I don't answer phone calls. I don't answer emails. I don't accept meetings or any type of work during that time. And I never cancel it for any amount of work project doesn't matter if it's going to be a $2 million project. If it's going to be I don't know for example, a session with one of my students it doesn't really matter. Now my sports as well as my fitness will never be at the mercy of any work. So I will cancel my meetings or my sessions, but I will not cancel my you know, training sessions. And that's not because of leisure because it is fun. I mean, it's definitely leisure because I often do it with like very positive energetic music in different languages. And, but what I really do is it's it's going to allow me and enables me to work hard throughout the day. So even though it is leisure, technically, it actually contributes much more to my career than probably even working does because just imagine you're talking to someone in business and in sales. And you guys like Hi, my name is Tommy and I'm super freakin tired. Would you please, please man up time, you're having a good day, sir. But in reality, you're energetic. If you're charged, if you're you know, full of energy, you will do a much better job. So for me that's both a leisure activity as well as investment in my career because it allows the body to run well. As you mentioned yourself. I'm a huge fan of reading books, especially audiobooks because I'm a multitasker, I tend to commute a lot, especially I fly a lot because of my work. So as you probably know, flying is a very time consuming activity, you have to be at the airport three hours before the flight, of course the most, because I tend to be a little bit like later than that, but, and then there's perhaps gonna be some delays occasionally, and then you arrive there and there's gonna be a jet lag. So any flight, you know, especially if it's not, if it's intercontinental, like if it's between different continents, so you probably have to put aside 12 hours to 15 hours easily. And if it's like in the same continent, so it's gonna, you know, take about four or five, seven, sometimes eight hours of your time. So that's a lot of time that'd be wasted, which I use for listening to audiobooks, I can easily finish one audio book, which is on average, seven hours long in one flight. So it's pretty good for me personally, and even though it's leisure, I'm not working, it actually contributes to people to think better. And if you think better can like when you have more energy, you will make better decisions and of course, you will get better results. And I generally spend a lot of my time focused on learning Because my one of my biggest passions in life is learning different languages. So I use Netflix, but not the way most people do actually supposable. Netflix is entertainment. For me Netflix is nothing more than going to language school, because as you probably know, one of the best ways to learn a foreign language is through basically, movies. And Netflix gives me the ability to watch whichever movie or show I want, especially if it's like Netflix original, in a variety of up to 30 languages, like I can decide to watch it in Swedish or I can watch it in German, I can watch it. I don't know Italian and Chinese, Japanese and with the subtitles, because that's very important personally, because I think the importance of learning with subtitles is just you probably know more about this than I do. So Netflix, you know, the chance to watch whatever movie I want in whatever language I want with this subtitle in that language, which is probably the best way to accelerate your learning process, especially after the you know, you enter the b1 or pre intermediate level basically. So for me, even though that's technically I'm technically watching a movie, and right naturally these things I'm watching At the latest show called bio hacks which is like a German show on Netflix and I'm watching it you know with with German and German subtitles and it's just such a perfect you know, German classroom like I get all the words I listed my item to my flashcards. So yes, watching movie is a, you know, typical and very stereotypical leisure activity. But for me that's like going to a classroom. It is fun. Although it's not let's be honest, not always fun when you have to pause every 15 seconds to look at the word go back to Google Translate said to work Oh, Miss misspelling, boom, boom, come back. It isn't always fun. I do agree. But the whole experience is fun. So maybe watching a TV or HBO they only offer basically these programs in English. And since I only watch movies in four languages and are English, I cannot use them but Netflix give you the chance to you know, basically watch movies in a variety of languages. So that's another one that I use a lot. Again, you're saying like then your messages your activity, yes, but actually goes along with you know, one of the main activities of modern enterprises which is actually the promoting education of foreign languages all over the world. So this itself is helping my career, but at the same time, it's leisure. It's fun, and it's pretty easy. So for that reason, I'm a huge fan of picking such activities that while leisure in nature actually contribute to your main mission in life.   Pouya LJ  23:16 Yeah, exactly. So you answered one aspect of so the reason I asked this question about your working out well, I have two specific reasons one of them you basically answered and that was the investment part essentially. Now the second part I specifically mentioned working out because that's, that's a problem for me. What I mean by that is that I cannot possibly except that as a year because I don't I don't enjoy it by any means. And I know   Dan  23:41 I know about genetics background lifestyles. Exactly. introvert extrovert you're definitely right. For a lot of people. I think it's just God dammit, I have to sweat. Exactly.   Pouya LJ  23:53 So so for that very reason. I was thinking okay, maybe some other people that have the same attitude towards I don't know, like Learning or reading a book or whatever? Do you have any specific so is there is it? Is it something? Is it some sort of a, like a mindset you can get into and then it becomes a leisure, or you just have to find your own leisure that is also, let's be   Dan  24:11 honest, man, we're talking about leisure here, right? So, if your goal is to truly get a sense of, you know, refreshment, then you should probably choose activities that suit your temperament, biology, your values in life. So even though I like for example, intense exercise, for example, let's say a fitness, let's say boxing, jogging, maybe somebody else could get the same benefit through meditation, or through a fast, you know, walk basically in the park. So it all depends on yourself. However, as I've mentioned, repeatedly, you know, over and over again, I believe that half of your happiness is your biology. Now, the way you manage it depends on your temperament depends on your biology, your genetics, your background, your interests. So I don't think that everybody needs to do what I do. I don't think everybody needs to exercise twice per day, every day, 365 days a week, even when he or she is Sick. Unfortunately, I have been accused of that occasionally by my doctors, which is an improvement, but it's just you know, just the habits. But the point is this, you don't have to do that. But you can create other healthy routines for your body where it is to get enough sleep, for example, or you can begin I know a friend of mine who begins today via meditation. And it's not a girl, I'm talking to a guy here right. So he begins today by meditation, by deep breathing exercises. So, it all depends on what really, you know, makes you tick. However, as we have mentioned, many times you cannot promote one Have you fully eliminate physical activities from your basically routine and feel refreshed and energized. So whether it is just for a walk, you can just go for a walk in the park near your house, whether it is to meet your friends and don't go hiking or whether it is I don't know, there are a variety of activities, but I think that everybody should include some sort of physical activity in a leisure activity because that is the key for energy and happiness. I mean nothing saps energy out of your More than getting fat, or more than getting weak. So because you need, especially if you're an entrepreneur, you need a lot of physical energy, you have to be at your prime because you have to be with people. And people generally are not influenced by those who are weak or who are negative or who are low energy, it's just not going to work. So you need to work on that. So it depends on yourself, I don't think that everybody should do that. I don't think most people do that actually at all. And some who might even try this could find it to be very unhealthy for them, because maybe their body's not ready because I've been, you know, exercising like this for almost more than 15 years now, non stop. So maybe your body is not used to that kind of, you know, fresher physically. So for that reason, you can find something similar, though that was a great example of dancing is a great example. walking, jogging, simply traveling as a tourist and just walking around and looking at the places you enjoy it and you're Of course getting physically active as well. So there are many ways to do that. But ultimately, you are the judge and you should decide which one fits your character and your values.   Pouya LJ  27:00 No, I 100% agree like the physical activity is you can't just ignore it and that affects everything. I completely agree. It was just the point was I was trying to make was it's really difficult for me to counter especially especially   Dan  27:15 Yeah, yeah,   Pouya LJ  27:16 that's actually intense exercise. Yeah, like   Dan  27:21 totally normal by there's zero like nothing wrong with you at all. And that I think is an opinion shared by probably more than half the you know, the world population because it's just the way it is. And like, I mean, like not everybody is necessarily as intense or hyperactive as let's say Daniel, right? Sure. Reality speaking even you I'm pretty sure he can enjoy a nice walk when there's a good when there's a nice breeze and you're enjoying a red cup of coffee. Everybody can enjoy For example, some sort of activity.   Pouya LJ  27:47 Yeah, hundred percent biking. What have you Yeah, there's definitely something you can you can grab on doing. There's no doubt, no doubt. Anyways, so I just wanted to bring that up. Now we're coming to the end of the show. Is there anything you want? We left out that you want to talk about or you want to summarize, what have you, for sure.   Dan  28:04 Well, first of all, what a great topic you chosen projects for this session was pretty good. And as we mentioned earlier today, we talked about using your leisure activities in a way that make your life better and not worse. As I mentioned earlier, we all need leisure. Because some of us, unfortunately, tend to be extremist in our approach, especially among entrepreneurs, in that we want to just, you know, keep putting in if you put in the hours and and just putting long, hard hours, and we think that's good. But unfortunately, that's a very myopic approach towards making clients because even though working more and nonstop will get you ahead of your competition, and let's say in a couple of weeks or months, in the long term, you'll be like that fast day or just ran so fast, got tired, took a nap and lost the race to the turquoise. So you want to think long term and to think long term use you have to look at yourself as a human being, not a machine, not a robot but a human being with a biologic. logical being as well as a social beam, which means you have to take care of both your biological as well as your social needs, otherwise you will experience a variety of psychological and physical ailments. So for that reason, we said you need to choose your leisure activities, you have to pay attention to them. And then we discussed a variety of, you know, ways to make sure that your leisure activities are productive, we said that you could just you know, waste your time, I don't know, I play fortnight, you know, let's say from day to night, and you could just spend your time doing weird stuff. And we also mentioned some of the common ways of letting off some steam which I disapprove of, I don't getting super drunk or doing pot or whatever it is, which are unfortunately quite common among young generation these days. But these are not going to help you at all. However, if you choose leisure activities that will be in alignment with your main goals in life and will somehow help you push you towards you know, a better direction. Those are the best types of leisure activities because they will then allow you to become a better person, which is why for me for myself, Have you Travelling is one of the best leisure activities out there because not only it's fun, it also is very educational and makes you a better person. So you can ask yourself, what are some of the best activities leisure because I can do that are in align with my values and goals that can make me a better person, and then do those things more. And we also mentioned that you should never ignore the importance of adding some physical elements to your basically leisure activities because we are also biological, we need to use our bodies as much as possible. So combining those things and making our leisure activities as intellectually beneficial as possible, as physical as possible and as social as possible, will then allow us to have a life filled with happiness and on the way to success.   Pouya LJ  30:42 Oh, that's the that was great, like, perfect summary of what we talked about and love that. Thank you again, Dan, for joining us today. Always a pleasure being with you. Appreciate it. And thank you everybody for joining us and listening to us. Please if you enjoy the podcast go and rate and Put comments if you would like, and let us know what you want to what you want us to talk about next. And and by the way, oh, yeah, apparently   Dan  31:07 apparently it printed before you before we end the show. Apparently our listeners should be aware that now we have the scripts of all of our show. I forgot about that. Yes.   Pouya LJ  31:18 So yeah, from from the last few episodes, I don't remember how many the episode The the the episodes are being transcribed. And the and   Dan  31:27 they're not being transcribed by you know, people that are sitting, you know, painstakingly writing them down. Yes, dude. The AI is here. We are using AI to make the transcripts. Yeah, we lose a lot of jobs in the future. It's not perfect supports going back to making all of these things go back to coal mining, we don't have any problem. But the fact of the matter is, AI is coming and it's coming to our show as well. And all those transcripts now are being made by AI Of course, the mastermind He's always behind it was Pouyjix, who was the you know, the guy who founded about this and let me know. And I could actually use this myself in creating the subtitles for my videos. So I want to first thank you so much for just for your suggestion that was really helpful. I literally use this last night for one of my videos, and it was very useful. So I want to thank you and of course, a great addition to our show.   Pouya LJ  32:19 Yeah, it's a great, great addition, a lot of people might want to use it. And we're glad to provide that. It might not be perfect. So you might see some mistakes often, not often, but rarely, which makes sense. But hopefully, gradually, we'll recognize our voices better and we will become better. But until then you can at least enjoy what we have right now. And I hope you do. All right. Thank you for reminding me that I totally forgot about that. Awesome.   32:47 That was very good.   Pouya LJ  32:48 All right. Cheers. Thank you, everybody. Have a good one.

Working hard has been known as the main pillar of success but is working hard truly all you need to be successful? A quick glance at professions that demand intense effort and long hours such as construction workers and busboys shows that there is no direct relationship between hard work and success. In other words almost all successful people are hardworking but not all hardworking individuals are successful.    In this solo edition of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel will shed light on the other equally as important pillar of smart work that allows you to do better things, do them in a better way, and do them with better people! If you want to work both hard and smart in whatever you do to obtain the best results and improve them over time then this program is for you!    Daniel's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danmolgan/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Danmolgan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-molgan-41812352/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript: ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS work, customer, construction worker, hard, hours, day, income, increase, money, people, smart, bad apples, life, arrive, simply, business, success, thinking, higher, job SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:14 Hello, and welcome to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast, the solo edition. My name is Daniel Molgan. And welcome to this show where we're going to talk about the paradigm of smart work versus hard work. You see, guys, unfortunately, a lot of the times when we talk about success, people are asking me So Dan, I want to be successful. So the only way of course is to work harder. And guess what, I completely agree. I believe that hard work is the essence of success in all areas of life and anybody you look around who are truly achieved and accomplished individuals, you kind of realize that they are real hard workers. But here's the truth are all people who are successful, hard working, I mean, does being hard working itself lead to success or those who aren't are successful, they tend to be hard because that's very, you know, different. For example, think about construction workers think about busboys, think about, I don't know, those who tend to work day and night, basically very little. And they're always working, let's say farmers or working on the field, let's say I know, as I mentioned earlier, like construction workers, so these individuals are hardworking, but they're not rich. So this clearly shows that a relationship between working hard and acquiring major success in life, while that's very, very important, but there's no direct relationship here. Because if we thought that big, you know, somehow being hard working makes you successful, then perhaps the only option you would have is to simply work harder at whatever you did. But the fact of the matter is that that is not the way to acquire you know, major wealth or success. So today we're gonna talk about the other elements of basically success which are not necessarily just about working hard, but rather It's about creating a lifestyle where you somehow tend to get higher and higher on the scale of income as well as profitability. While Of course, from any hard work individual. You see, whenever it comes to any area of life, whether it is I don't know, learning a new language, whether it is to lose weight and gain muscle, whether it is to start your own business, ultimately, there is always going to be an element of what we call sweat equity. That is you have to work hard at it. And that is always there. But the question is this, you can work hard at a task that is inferior, or you can work hard a task that is superior. And it's quite obvious that once you work hard at a superior task, this will yield higher results. So let me give an example here. Let's say you're a construction worker, and you work very hard to work 12 hours per day, at the end of the day, you're going to get your minimum wage, which is about let's say 15 bucks an hour, right? So after having worked all day long and have only slept, let's say I don't know, six hours. So you have have spent a tremendous amount of time working almost 18 hours. I mean, like, that's a lot, right? And at the end of the day, what you end up with is not a lot of money, right? However, what if you know you were a, let's say, Elan Musk, he also sometimes puts very long hours at work. But despite the fact that he might spend sometimes what I don't know 16 hours a day working 18 hours per day working, does that mean that he necessarily makes this amount of money as somebody who was a construction worker? Of course not? And the answer is because Ilan musk works on higher value tasks that will then allow him to yield better results. So in whatever you do, you should ask yourself, first of all, what is exactly my major, basically, path in life? What is exactly my major goal in life? What am I trying to accomplish and what is my main direction? Once you know that you can ask yourself All right, I have this skill. I have this ability. I know what to do with this and that and I wants to build a lifestyle surrounding, basically success in this regard. And then he asked yourself, so how can I increase the value of what I do? You see, working hard is very important, no doubt about it. But of course, if you want to work hard all the time, at some point, you're going to face with some resistance, you're gonna be faced with some difficult because there's only so much time that you can have per day, there's only so much energy that can actually put into your work. And because of all of these things, you generally find it very hard to sustain that level of, you know, very hard work for many years. Because if you do so, then you will what perhaps we'll face with other issues like health problems, like family issues, relationship problems, because at some point, you just simply don't have enough time to actually dedicate to your basically, you know, career or your studies or preparations or all of these things. So, because of this, as you somehow you know, get older and as you go up through the basically food chain You want to focus on not only working harder, but working smarter. Now what is exactly working smart. Working smart can be defined as doing things more efficiently, or working on things of higher values. So for example, let's say you wants to arrive to your destination that is a few, let's say 100 miles away, you have a few options. You can go on foot, you can use a bicycle, you can use a motorbike, you can use a car, or you can use a helicopter. Now all of these options are going to allow you to arrive at your destination, whether you move from this place or that place on foot or on a helicopter, you will arrive there. The question is how fast and at what cost? So perhaps if you want to go on foot, you don't need anything. You don't need any instrument any equipments just you know, start walking, and maybe after a few hours, you arrive there. But if you want to fly there on a helicopter now you need to actually invest in it in advance a helicopter and a pilot's To try to arrive there on time. So this is the paradigm of smart work, which is cost and benefit analysis of what you want to get done in your life, and then trying to create new ways of adding value to your time so that the same amount of hours and days and months and years do you put into a certain you know, activity will then be spent on another activity in order to give you the chance to actually work harder and get better results. So because of this, I want to now start off with challenging the listener with one simple question. From your point of view. What do you think is the best approach and the most important thing to do when it comes to improving the value of your time? Now there are very, you know, various options because the simplest way to increase your income, for example, is to work more hours at whatever job you're currently doing. That's okay. But what are the other ways by which you could probably increase your income while having the same amount of workload? The first option would be to increase whatever amount you charge, you know, per hour, that's one option. Option two is perhaps trying to create a new business, and then having other people work for you. So you free up the time so that there are more people working now this way, you will be spending the exact same amount of time at the office. But since it involves the work of many other employees, you will then have a chance to actually increase the overall profitability. The last one, of course, is to dramatically change, you know, the entire field that you work in and start doing new things and new activism might actually be of higher value. But whatever you do, what truly matters here is how can you start thinking in terms of working smart, and then hopefully, that'll allow you to actually focus your attention on you know, more valuable activities and actually do for yourself in order to you know, gain the most results. So having said that, now let's think of your life. As of now, you might say, well, then you're right. I totally want to just start working smart because I do not want to work hard. Well Now think about three types of individuals in the modern world, we have the one time who is extremely hardworking. We have one type who is extremely, you know, focused on, you know, working smart, but they just don't really want to put in the work. So they are a little bit lazy, perhaps or they have this, you know, dream of those listeners call it the Tim Ferriss style of four hour work, basically, what kind of person and then you have somebody who's going to work hard and smart, so who in the end is going to smoke all of them? I think the answer is obvious, right? So, because of this, I believe that an ideal approach is combining the two because unfortunately, those who tend to you know, look for shortcuts and easy ways of earning, you know, an income. Unfortunately, in most cases do not achieve that. In most cases, they actually find themselves stuck in situations where they simply don't have, you know, an opportunity to fully fathom what they want nor achieve big goals because you know, if you are, you know, working in a marketplace, you're obviously competing with other people in it. And if you want to focus on just working smart, and not trying to put in the effort, then what happens here is you simply fall behind those who do especially if they are also smart workers, right? So because of this right now, I want to ask you a question, ask yourself how much of my time that I put into my work, I put in terms of trying to increase the value of my basically income and my work? Because once you increase your value in the marketplace, of course, you can earn higher income? Secondly, am I really willing to work hard, because unfortunately, laziness is one of those issues that we all have to struggle with on a regular basis, because we want to somehow get the job done, but Well, I mean, there's just the SPN on TV and I want to watch the match and I kind of want to also, you know, hang out with my friends. So I mean, life is short man. So I believe in you know, creating and striking a balance between Working hard and working smart in order to achieve, you know, long term, basically professional goals in your career. So if you really want to make the most of your career, then you have no choice but to combine the two. That is smart work and hard work. So let's talk about both Actually, let's talk about implementing both strategies in your career from today in order to actually make the most of them. So ask yourself, how many hours per day, not per week, but per day understands. Those who are successful did not think of themselves as working, you know, per week. In our society, those who judge their work in terms of basically, minutes and hours are oftentimes the highest paid and the most accessible. And ironically, the least successful ones. Oftentimes they judge themselves in terms of year like how much do I make per year. So just imagine like, for example, a very highly successful surgeon thinks about how they shouldn't how much he makes per hour while Unfortunately, let's say a truck driver might think of how much he makes per year. So you want to first change your time perspective, focus on the minutes and hours instead of months and years. That's number one. And number two, ask yourself, How am I willing to increase, you know, both the amount of time that I work more minutes and hours per day, as well as the quality of those hours, because that's really important. So right now, whatever job you have, you can just simply calculate your hourly rate just right now take your annual income divided by basically 12 to have your monthly income, and then literally count the number of hours you work per week. So for example, if you have a job and an office and you know you do that nine to five thing, five days a week, you can actually you know, calculate like, okay, so I worked for example, eight hours per day, and I work five days a week, so that's gonna be about 40 hours a week. So whatever income you got, you know, two by 40 and boom, you get your basically hourly rate. So that of course gives you a great chance to, you know, figure out, for example, how you can go around it, because let's say if you work for 40 hours a week, then it can actually even go further. So 40 hours a week is going to be 40 times four is going to be like almost 160 hours a month, and then divided by 60 even can get your let's say, you know, hourly or even minutes by minutes rate. And this will then allow you to know exactly how much you're worth. And ask yourself, alright, I make exactly this amount of money every minute, okay? Whatever it is, whether you work in McDonald's, whether you run your own business, whether you I don't know, are a creative type, you know, you're you know, minute by minute rate, and then you ask yourself, alright, so this is my minute by minute rate. Now, how can I increase that there are a variety of ways one, increase the type of work that you do, perhaps we have to move out of McDonald's and maybe start your own for example, restaurant, right? Or perhaps you have to work with better clients. One of the things I really like about working international businesses that it gives me access to a global market, because the same services offered in different countries have very different values. So for example, one service one consultancy service offered, let's say, and I don't know, let's say in Europe could cost you let's say, I don't know, for example, 100 euros per hour, while the same service could cost basically somebody else $2,000 an hour or less if you move to Dubai, right. So by literally let's just moving from, for example, Berlin, to Dubai, you can offer the exact same service and instead of being paid 100 euros an hour you are now listen, pay $2,000 an hour. That's a great move, right? So this is one of the you know, paradigms of smart thinking, How can I offer my service in the best possible location? Or this maybe it's also product depends on the situation, right? Because not all products are sold equal in different markets. And then you ask yourself, How can I find a better way to you know, serve better customers. Secondly, increase the quality of your current customers right now. So you might be dealing with a lot of, you know, bad apples, here's my advice, and it's always been the same, get rid of the bad apples as soon as possible before they spoil the whole pot. You see, there's nothing worse for your success and happiness than to work with people that you don't like. Now, obviously, I mean, we all want to be below you know, in a perfect world, you can always, you know, see a lot of great people great customers are coming, you know, in and out, and you're just so happy. But the fact of the matter is that ironically, a very small percentage of all of your clients and customers at a time will inevitably be those will be called bad apples. And also remember this customer that used to be a good customer could become a bad customer over time, by the changes in circumstances his or her lifestyle or situation in the economy. So just because a customer was the best customer does not mean that he or she will always be the best customer. And in most cases, the opposite also applies. So ask yourself right now, how much stress? How much difficulty Am I experiencing by having these bad customers? If you're working with somebody else, ask yourself in my office, which people are causing me the highest amount of stress could be your colleague, could be your boss could be I don't know, the Vice President. And you ask yourself, Is there any way I could change and not deal with these guys in my work, maybe we should change our department, maybe you should even change your job and get a job elsewhere. But the best thing you can do to increase your productivity is to actually stop working with people that drain your mental energy. And that makes you unhappy. Because the surest way to fail is to work with or for the people that you don't like. So, right now, ask yourself, whether you are working as a secretary and you know in a small company, whether you're working as a You know a doctor privately, whether you're running your own business, whether you are working I don't know as a waiter Do you really enjoy the kind of clients you're dealing with on a regular basis if you wanted to get you know somehow these bad apples if you will out of your life could you get started right away and do so because once you focus your attention on removing these bad apples, initially you will have less income it's true. For example, bad apple customer will make you very you know, feel very upset. But at the end of the day, whether you're a dentist I mean he or she comes to your clinic gets the teeth done and goes now you will be upset and probably even depressed after a while but you get the you know, get your money if the operation you know, the teeth are fixed and I got my money. So, you're saying Dan, okay, so I should tell my let's say, you know, customer from hell who happen to have bad teeth to go home and not come back. And that way I'm going to lose money today as true When you send your bad customers home, you're going to lose money for that day. But what this does is it creates a vacuum free time, and a drive to replace the lost income. You see nature's like this, when there's a vacuum created, this vacuum must be filled. So once you, you know, you know, by yourself and intentionally get rid of a bad customer, you create a vacuum, and this vacuum must be filled. Guess what will fill that, you know, vacuum, a better customer in most cases. So, the same thing applies if you have a job, you're saying, well, then I really feel stress in my workplace. I feel like that my colleagues are abusive, and my boss never understands me. I even told him yesterday that I had a problem with my family and I needed to have a day off and he said I don't care go back to work. So you're saying but then I need the money. I gotta make the mortgage payment. I gotta I gotta pay no. feed my family and I'm telling Right now to quit your job and find a better job, you're saying, but that doesn't make any sense because I have to, you know, feed my family, I'm not really sure about this. So you will end up putting up with the BS of your boss or your staff members, your colleagues trying to make the ends meet, but guess what happens, you will not be engaged at work, you will not be very happy, and your income will not increase. So you will keep accumulating those negative emotions inside. At some point, boom, it bursts. And you say, Oh, I quit. But by then it's too late. Because you have been working to that end job. It didn't like for three, four or 567 years. You did not work on improving your skills. Because whenever you came home, you were so depressed, just had to just you know, chill to get rid of all the stress. So you don't have the time to work on yours to improve yourself your abilities, learn new skills, and at the same time you had no energy or motivation to look for better opportunities. So years have gone by, you have lost your skills or at least you know, remain to the same level. And now have lost the motivation to even look for better opportunities and boom, all of a sudden you say I had it. Or worse yet, your boss says, You're fired. And boom, it's like, what the hell am I going to do? The problem is you are not prepared for it, you are not prepared for, you know, making these changes to make your work smarter to improve the quality of your work, because in the long term, doing the kind of work that you really enjoy, with the kind of people that you like to associate with, will lead to far better results than putting up with the bad clients, the bad colleagues, the bad bosses that somehow give you money in the present, but will then ruin your future and your growth perspective. So because of this, I want you guys to start thinking long term in your careers from now. Whether you are a you know, simple nurse, whether you are I don't know as I mentioned, it doesn't matter what your career is, you should think long term. Do I enjoy working at this hospital do I enjoy being in this Place do I enjoy the kind of people I serve? How can I improve the quality and serve better people? These are the kind of questions you have to ask yourself on a regular basis. And this will allow you to change the way you think, and hopefully be able to change the paradigm of your work that will then allow you to work smarter, those who work smart think long term, so they invest some money and effort at the beginning. so evident, they're actually losing a lot, right. But in the long term, they would be making a lot more than those who simply want to just get through the day and just get a paycheck. That is why it's very important, crucial to start thinking long term, planning ahead and beginning to combine smart work with hard work. With that being said, I will never underestimate the importance of working hard. That's quite important. And if I were to give one advice to anyone who wants to make their lives better, I'd say work harder first, but working hard first is just first There's a second element and that's called working smart. So both are important. And by doing the work on both simultaneously, it's kind of like the wheels can you like drive a car with only one wheel or like, I don't know, a bicycle, you need at least two wheels to get any vehicle running, right? So in this situation, you want to focus on that you want to focus on building the ability to somehow work smarter. That takes effort that takes time, but it is completely possible. Alright guys, that's all the time we have for I hope that this little short talk gave you the motivation to combine smart work with hard work and try your very best to hopefully make the most of your experiences in your workplace. Whether it is you working as an employee or running your own business. It's all the time we have for any questions, feel free to contact me on the social media anywhere you can find me at Dan Mullen and of course you can contact basically the person to show Pouya LJ as well, in case you wanted to discuss things regarding the topics of the show or any other ideas. And of course, I'd like to see you guys in person if you have the chance or simply send me a message and I'll be glad to answer all of your questions. Have a great one guys and take care

Your conscious mind is capable of processing no more than seven bits of information at a time but your subconscious mind knows no such boundaries  as it is receiving input 24/7 from all of your senses and as thus is influencing you in the process. That is where subliminal learning and influence comes into play as a tool to educate, influence, or even manipulate.    In this episode of Beyond the Present Podcast Dan and Poujix discuss how we could come to learn languages, master musical tones, discern color patterns, develop a sense of connection or familiarity with a product, or even downright be indoctrinated through subliminal influence.    You subconscious mind is learning and altering your mood and behavior all the time without stop, this episode will remind you of the importance of preparing yourself for the right types of subliminal learning and influence while avoiding the wrong ones.      Episode Transcript:----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS learning, subliminal, influence, background, language, people, consciously, form, coca cola, learn, matter, listen, commercials, trump, advertisement, impact, pay, billboards, behavior, audio SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to yet another episode of BTP podcast. Let's talk edition. As always, I'm joined with Dan How's it going?   Dan  00:18 What am I man buddy? How are you? Good seeing you. It's so glad to be I'm really so happy to be here right now and just to see your face. You've gone full nerd mode right now I love the background like literally you are now a total real physicist 100%. And I love you know, the background is pretty cool. So just can't wait to get started to share ideas with our great listeners.   Pouya LJ  00:39 Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, likewise, thank you first of all for the compliment. Yeah, so it's been going on for a while.   Dan  00:46 So one good question, by the way, Blue Jays. So now you've basically officially graduated, right?   Pouya LJ  00:51 Yeah, well, one more semester but yes.   Dan  00:53 Oh, almost there, buddy. Don't push, keep pushing. Otherwise, outward actions can be very, very disappointing people   Pouya LJ  01:01 Yeah, that's true. All right. Okay, so today's episode is about one of one of one of our audiences ask the question on Instagram from you and that was so as a response to our previous episode, which was about influence of audio on our lives day to day. He his question was the effect of subliminal learning and generally speaking effects on us. So for example, it can be used, as you mentioned in your response by Tony Robbins and your self education, but it's also used perhaps a little less known in advertisement often. Now, we want to address this subliminal learning. First of all, can you define what it is?   Dan  01:48 You see subliminal learning or any type of influence a similar nature is pretty much about you trying to influence people at a subconscious level and indirectly rather than directly and consciously. And ironically, it's a slower form of learning, because you're not actively engaged with that process. And also, it takes a long time to change someone's behavior if you want to use that as a form of influence. But ultimately, as you probably know, the subconscious mind is awake 24 seven, and it is far more powerful than the conscious mind ever will. And because of this, simple learning actually has been used throughout basically, you know, not only the modern world, but even in the past, to instruct people and to change their behaviors. And of course, it's a great tool for education. But as you already pointed out, it also could be used to alter people's behavior or preferences, the advertising and commercials.   Pouya LJ  02:40 Okay, so let's let's branch out into these two, kind of separate segments. And first, let's start with education. So how can one use it for their students or for themselves to educate themselves better?   Dan  02:52 Well, as you probably know, I'm a linguist. So we can learn a lot of for example, languages subliminally and you probably know there's a A lot of courses out of garlic, learn French wild sleeping or something. And, of course, I personally tend to stay away from those courses as much as possible, because in most cases, they're just pure branding and marketing, and there's no real value in them. But basically, anytime there's a form of audio or sound or music in the background, or there are certain types of visual basically pulses in the background, but let's say you're watching for example, something and then at a millisecond, there are certain basically images being shown. Now your conscious mind will never recognize that little thing. But your subconscious is actually reading on that and actually is changing and affecting your behavior. This is also used in a lot of research in labs as well as psychological tests. So it's a great way to influence basically now from my point of view, the most effective forms of subliminal learning when it comes to audio for us is generally for changing your mental condition and the way you feel because it's probably now as we're going throughout our day from morning Tonight, we're receiving a lot of input through our fire senses. And we have no conscious awareness of them because they're just too many of them because we can actually process them consciously up to seven bits of information per second. So that's not that much even though we have a lot of information coming in. So so what we're learning here allows us to improve learning by creating an easier way to have information fed to our mind indirectly. So as in the case of language learning for example, you can actually just sit back and have for example, as you're working on your let's say, I don't know laundry, you in the background, Listen to the music and sound of a foreign language and over time, this actually gives you a great idea of what it is and when it comes to money other material for example, so you want to, I don't know perhaps learn new, you know, chemical formulas or other ways. So you have the material in the background as you are going basically throughout you know your day and you listen that material and you hear it and after a while even though it is not a very efficient or fast way of learning since it almost cost you nothing, because it is subliminal, and you don't have to Spend your time. Because of this, it actually ends up becoming a lot more effective over the long term. Because even the learning is very efficient in the short term, when you are focused and you're trying to learn something by paying full attention. Once we have that at a subliminal level, now we have no time left. So all of a sudden, you can now spend hours per day learning for example, perhaps new words, let's say new useful, for example, material or let's say scientific journals or any type of learning because you know, it can be in the background. But from my point of view, of course, I intend to use simple basic learning mainly to condition my mind if you know no p&l conditioning is about getting your mind and your basically body a state of being oftentimes it is associated with peak level or peak psychology where you are at your best you're fully sharp, and you feel great. That is basically also another usage of simple learning when it comes to education and basically personal development.   Pouya LJ  06:00 That's, that's really good. So I mean, you mentioned in addition to your, your mind your thoughts, etc. That's great. Now, you are somebody who knows a lot of languages, and I suspect you spent a lot of time actively learning them. But do you also use subliminal methods and developing your language? Because I'm pretty sure a lot of people listening to this to this podcast are interested in learning new languages or are doing it. Is there any? Are there any ways maybe perhaps podcasts and different languages? I've heard you say, I play video games, for instance, in language learning. Yeah, of course,   Dan  06:36 of course. Now, playing video games per se would not necessarily act. So as simple as learning a foreign language because, again, you're fully immersed, you're fully engaged, because submittal is usually when it's in the background. So you mentioned audio, such as podcasts, such as, you know, just TV being turned on the back when that's true. So basically, before getting here, I was actually listening to some material, you know, in Arabic, so I was actually basically doing my stuff. And I was watching Dubai, for example channels to just hear some Arabic in the background basically as a form of subliminal learning. And I do that, of course with a lot of languages and different material. So in a language learning I personally believe that signal learning actually is very effective as a means of letting your brain rest because as you probably now, if you are trying to learn a language from morning tonight, at some point, you will have a burnout because it's gonna be just just too much for you know, Brady to take in at once. However, with the power of the signal learning, you can actually have that language fed to your mind subconsciously, from morning tonight without you actually working so much or pingan a lot of conscious attention. And of course, as I personally have experienced, it really works. Just having that in the background really works, especially when it comes to the musical language I should not long ago I basically published a funny video on Instagram. It was an HGTV exclusive about me mentioning different accents and who asked like, yeah, how did you learn all these things? And the answer is, of course in the mall learning because I literally have All of those basically in my back of my head, and I had no idea to actually learn to pick up their accents, even though I was listen to my clients and my students and my friends in different languages. And this actually got me that in the background, so for language learning, of course, it is very efficient. And anybody who wants to get, you know, take their language to the next level, they should definitely, you know, tap into the power of the normal learning and try to actually listen as much as possible in the background while they're doing other things. And this improves, of course, their overall level of basically fluency because the brain is always learning, even if you're not consciously aware of it, the brain is always learning. And that's exactly hopefully going to get us to the next part, which is why it can be used to change people's behavior, or preferences. And then I'm going to know why. And this is of course, used, basically, and let's say commercials, advertising and other forms, not necessarily Of course in business but also in politics and forms of propaganda, or mass, for example, indoctrinations these could be used and they have huge aquaforce   Pouya LJ  09:01 Yeah, so before we actually segue there, I'm wondering, I know it's Isaac igtv exclusive. But do you can you give us a taste of one of those favorite accents of yours?   Dan  09:12 Oh, well, I don't know, perhaps you could go for I mean, my first course is Russian. And I like Russian. Because like, you've spent a lot of time trying to them the language and like, you have to tell us that it's not very easy for me to do that. But when you hear this every day from different people, he helps you to understand what it is. And of course, that's just one of the things basically, because it allows you to learn it and to practice it, basically. And I hear this, of course, I have a lot of great content from Russia, do the exact same thing, of course, in different languages. But what really matters, of course, is trying to hear it in the back to a great perspective to learn about it, and then feeling somehow imitated, which is very important, of course, in language learning.   Pouya LJ  09:51 Okay, yeah, that's good. That's good. Appreciate it. Alright, so let's segue to the body. Yeah, thank you. So let's segue to the Other parts, which is mainly about influencing people without their knowledge without their perhaps consent, because if you're doing it to yourself if you're learning something language, whatever, it's probably intentional and you have consented to it, but a lot of times through advertisement, yes, political campaigns, propaganda, etc. You're being influenced left and right, without your consent or knowledge or even awareness, which is not later in two weeks time, not two weeks, probably two years time you see yourself a different person and you have no idea what that is why that is. So now advertisement, I guess it's a little bit more intuitive. People have seen these subliminal, you know, effects. For example, you know, Pepsi, Coca Cola, whatever, visually specially, obviously, x. Sure, let's, let's talk about that a little bit. But can you also segue to the political and PR pack for propaganda? Yeah,   Dan  10:56 well, they actually are very much linked because they're about Like you see, a perfect example of subliminal learning is actually billboards. Because when you're walking around the city as you're driving, believe it or not, you do not pay a lot of conscious attention to the billboards. And of course, billboards are designed like this. And of course, mainly not just build like all all types of commercials, the ones that you see pop in and out, for example, let's say on your browser, basically on your apps phone. So ultimately, advertising is designed to make you feel familiar with something without you putting a lot of time to learn to get you know, to get to know that thing, right. Because human mind is like this, if we are exposed to anything, whether it is for example, a new idea, whether it is a new product, or a new language doesn't really matter. Doesn't matter how strange or even alien that concept might be. If we are exposed to it frequently enough. Eventually we come to see that thing as it belonging to us like we feel a sense of connection to it. That could be a mere, for example, brands could be a product could be a drink. Could be, for example, a new gadget or a new system, a company or even sometimes a political innovatively way of running the government. So all of these things are subject to influence. And unfortunately, a lot of us we think, like, well, that's not for me. I'm a very smart guy. This is not about intelligence, it doesn't matter how smart you are we all right, no, you and I are sitting here discussing this issue. And we are consciously analyzing different aspects. You and I are as susceptible to this thing as anybody else. Which means it doesn't matter how much you know about this consciously, you are not immune to this subconscious impact that will of course have on you. So as you're driving to and from work every single day, and you have this Coca Cola has, let's say, logo in the background, you're saying like, well, that's just nothing. I don't like sugary drinks. It's not for me at all. I don't really care about these things. But you don't i don't know after a few weeks, you end up going to the grocery store. You just you're in your head like yeah, I gotta pay the bills and all those things and you know, pay the cashier and you do that Why do I just Miko cola. I don't know how it happened. And this is one of the you know, the impacts of this because, of course, it's a form of visual learning at a subconscious level auditorily of course, many other things could happen as well, in terms of using music, let's say in your commercials and other forms of giving you that basically immersion because the fact of the matter is, if you are exposed to anything, even if you are not consciously aware of it, you are going to be influenced by that doesn't really matter even if which is why I think the best way not to be influenced is to actually get away from that object that could actually influence you that's like the only permanent solution. It's kind of like you know, if you want safety of your, for example, data, just put a sticker on a duct tape over the you know, let's say your laptop's camera. This is kind of like that, like the only way not to be influenced by something or someone or some idea is to just simply be away from it and not paid any conscious attention. Nor receive any subliminal impact from that thing. And because of this, it's now being used openly, basically a variety of things. That's why advertising and commercial industry is such a big industry because it works. Because it persuades billions of people around the world to buy products. They don't need to impress people they don't actually like. And this is like the power of some little learning when, when it applies to basically business and we are all vulnerable in this regard.   Pouya LJ  14:30 Yeah, that's very true. And I suppose we're closing in on the US elections. I suppose we're going to see a lot of those campaigns. Well,   Dan  14:37 listen, as you probably know, I'm an endorser of basically Joe Biden. But the fact of the matter is, even Joe himself is very smart and he understands these things. So even though he I personally don't like Trump. You can see how Joe Biden is actually using a lot of great well designed, for example, attack ads that he's making against Trump like he picks up, for example, one four recently Trump in one of the interviews, he was saying, like, yeah, we have a lot of debt deaths, it is what it is. And we're doing our best. So Biden took that phrase, it is what it is, and then repeated like five times in one attack. And these things aren't being like what mom, voters will know. That's just one of the phrases that he said. But the fact of the matter is, those types of subliminal impact, especially when repeated again and again, via social media, of course, will have a huge impact on the voters. And now we're seeing this happening. Obviously, top politicians are experts at this type of influence, because they are oftentimes the kind of people who have paid a lot of money to their campaign managers to create such types of ads to promote their ideas, basically, and because of this, we are susceptible to that type of influence as well. And that is why I think that it's much better for society as a whole to be well educated and well informed about politics. Otherwise, most people could end up making decisions based upon merely ads and take a look at our last lecture. In 2016, and a lot of people simply voted for Trump because of these things, because they felt like he will make all these changes, even though they have no idea who Trump was. And because of this, of course, we have to know how we can deal with this issue and how to somehow keep ourselves immune against all of this negative impact.   Pouya LJ  16:18 All right, that's very great. I think we talked about most of the things we aimed to talk about, and this was supposed to be a shorter episode as a response to like a follow up to our previous episode, because we talked about the influence of audio. And we talked about a lot of the aspects that are conscious, but also a lot of aspects that are that were unconscious, like the subliminal impact. And yeah, so I think, I think I think this was a good sum up from my perspective, but is there something else that we missed out left out that you want to talk about?   Dan  16:48 Well, first of all, I want to thank our listener have actually gave us this idea to discuss this matter, but I really believe that if we want to protect ourselves against negative influence, we have to be aware of some of the learning of all sorts Now that's not always bad but I've actually personally make good use of this technology because it really is it's nothing more than a technology for influencing other people basically right so if you have the ability to use that for yourself that's great. Now we mentioned that we can use some learning for a variety of Thai you know, types of learning what be at Korean languages be for example, new concepts in school or in university and at the same time, we can use it for changing our mental condition. For example, ask yourself what type of sound is there in my background in my home most of the time is classic music is it death metal and dual metal is it's you know, Britney Spears, because all of these are going to change your impact if you're in the background with some you know, classic music most of the time, the chances are you're more introverted and very kind of soft and at the same time very well you know, where and probably very intelligent. If you have a lot of doom metal in the background that don't worry why you want to just paint somebody in the face. You don't know why this happens as well. Right? And of course, all of these things Depends on it. And now this could be not just coming to your, let's say your audio in the background, it could be also about the image you have in the background. So what kind of colors are you exposed to most of the time, that's going to make you you know, feel differently about that, you know, based on the color of your listening, that you're paying attention to, and you're listening to and all those things. And finally, it's about using it, unfortunately, to manipulate other people. So we're all vulnerable here. So if you're watching, let's say, I don't know sort of commercials, like that's not for me, I know that Coca Cola is just nothing more than diabetes, that so it is sold in bottles and cans, but the fact of the matter is, if you're exposed to it, and now, eventually you come to see Coca Cola as nothing, but a familiar product that you will actually pick up without even knowing why when you're just doing your grocery shopping. Of course, we also mentioned that this could be used to create basically a new approach to dogma by trying to create propagandas and influence voter behavior. And of course, we've seen this already happening. Our last election was This time, it'll be a little bit different.   Pouya LJ  19:02 That's great. Thank you again for joining us and talking to us, Dan. My pleasure, buddy. It's always a pleasure to be here with you. Appreciate it. And thank you everybody for tuning in and listening to our episode. I hope this was useful for you until later episode. Have a good one.

Having control over our sensory input insures choice over the outcomes that we achieve in life and while many of us are quite picky about what we eat or even see, a great deal of us are thoughtless about what we listen to! In this episode of Beyond the Present Podcast Dan and Poujix discuss the importance of being more selective about what we listen to from sound and music to podcasts and audiobooks.  You are what you listen to thus if you want to change the quality of your life you need to change the quality of your auditory input and this short program will remind you to do just that.      Episode Transcript:----more---- SUMMARY KEYWORDS book, listen, audio, podcasts, audiobooks, audio inputs, choosing, life, author, input, applicable, important, poker, impact, influenced, emotional state, music, importance, title, topic SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello, and welcome back to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast. Let's talk addition as always with Daniel Mulligan How's it going Dan?   Dan  00:16 it, man, buddy. How are you? Good to be here with you for yet another great episode of The let's talk edition, and couldn't be excited about this matter anymore because it's just so great to hear your voice after a while. And life is great. I mean the coronavirus pandemic is obviously not over at all, but we are still seeing some, you know, even spikes, basically that are going up in some cases now. Now California is ahead. But overall life is good. And life is somehow getting back to normal in some countries. And of course, generally, we're not complaining Life is good and we're going forward.   Pouya LJ  00:51 Let's pretty good. Good to hear that.   Dan  00:54 Now.   Pouya LJ  00:55 So today's topic, thankfully we're not talking about anything Coronavirus related for change And we are talking about. So this is a topic you introduce and you will you sort of use you mentioned, you are what you listen to. And it was a very interesting scenario. And I think we share similar thoughts on the matter. So we thought, you know what, let's go go ahead and give it a go to try about this topic. And so first of all, can you can you explain what you meant? When you said, You are what you listen to? What do you mean by say   Dan  01:26 was, it said that you are what you eat is like pretty common. But the fact of the matter is that a lot of us we pay up a lot more attention to what we eat. But we don't care so much about the other inputs, as we know we have, you know, five major inputs. Basically, one is of course, visual one is kinesthetic, the things that we touch or do physically. And one is of course, what we taste. One is what we basically hear. And unfortunately, that's what unfortunately gets ignored and neglected a lot. Because of this. I believe that we need to take care That aspect of basically our lives as well, if you want to, you know, take full control of our lives, because if you are not in control of what auditory input you have in your head on a daily basis, then of course, you will have some problems and your life will not go the way you want. And for this reason, I believe that the quality of your life really is determined by what you listen to.   Pouya LJ  02:23 Yeah, that makes a lot of sense, though. I want to also mention Yes, it's one of the things that the one of the downsides is that you can't really turn it off easily, like you can't shut your ear and not the best you can do is pluck your ear. There. There's a question how much the worst actually doesn't work that much does it? No, not really. It makes it dim, but still you can hear but there is a there is a there's a degree that you can also think of it as upside. And that is you can listen to stuff passively meaning web while doing other stuff. For example, you're listening to podcasts, perhaps if you're in the gym or commuting, driving. Whatever. So now, I want to talk about that. I want you to talk about that a little bit. And so what are so we met, you mentioned the downside, and there's an upside. What are the ways you can we can do to optimize the upside, but on the other hand, minimize the negative part. Do you have a   Dan  03:18 very good question. You see, when it comes to understanding the way the environment affects you, you have to understand that what you listen to has a direct impact on you. A lot of times people ask like, Dan, what do you get all this energy to be active all the time? And the answer is because I'm very much aware of what input I have throughout the day, not just basically auditorily there are many other ways to control it. But for me, audio is very, very important. Of course, I grew up as an auditory learner for the most part. So for me, that was always a thing which actually led to me becoming a polyglot. But the fact of the matter is that once you have control over what you listen to, it changes the way you think you change the way you feel the world around you. And because of this, I've always believed in the importance of looking at audio and your audio inputs very carefully. For example, most of us we don't care, some show will be listened to, we drive and we listen to random music. We listen to random radio programs, and we put all this junk into our head and wonder why life sucks. There's a reason if you're listening, you know, you're driving down the road, you listen to a song and says, Oh, my wife just left me. Life is all terrible. And I'm alone. And you start singing along with this crap. And you wonder like, Well, why do I feel so bad? Dude, you just listened to a shitty music and you wonder why you feel bad. So I believe that if you want to optimize the overall quality of your life, you have to take a look at what audio inputs you have at on a regular basis. And most of us we have a variety of basically forms of audio input. Namely, of course, we have the music, but that we all listen to on a regular basis. Then we have things like radio programs, podcasts, audio books, and so on. And I really believe that you can cannot really take your life to the next level. If you're not controlling basically the the type of audio that you actually listen to. And if you want to optimize it to the way you want it, ask yourself, what kind of state of emotional, emotional state or states of being I want to be in? And more importantly, what are my targets and the long term that I want to achieve? And once you know those, then you say what type of audio inputs will allow me to achieve that, so does listen to sad or doesn't seem to useless material or useless radio talk shows necessarily allow you to achieve that. If the answer's no, then you should probably make an adjustment here and start changing it for the better.   Pouya LJ  05:45 Yeah, that that actually makes a lot of sense. Lots of good points there. Now. So I have a question for you. Like let's say we have a goal we have a you know, we want to optimize that the listening passive listening skill, if you will. So one of the you mentioned these you have, we have audiobooks or podcasts that you can specifically pick and choose and listen to, to help you or you know, in your path, whatever that may be learn something new, helps you do something. So, I'm sure you use selectively go go about choosing your podcasts and audio, audible books or any kind of audio book that you listen to. Do you have any any specific methods of weeding out the use less than using the choosing the good ones to listen to? Or do you think it's generally? Yeah, go ahead.   Dan  06:36 Very good question. You see projects out when I want to make a choice here about what to listen to you. I asked myself, What will I get because I look at time as investment as money. And I asked myself, so I'm going to spend seven some audiobooks. I listen to where you know, more than 20 hours. I mean, for example, I recently finished a book called basically The room where it happens by john bolton. And that book was more than 20 hours. And when I finished that audiobook, I got a badge on Audible saying that this called the I don't know, Mount Everest band or something. I literally got a badge for the longest audio book I've ever listened to. And that was, you know, you can imagine that's a huge investment of time. And because of this, I asked myself, I cannot just skip through this the way I do this when I'm reading a book, you know, visually. So I asked myself, is the content of this book relevant to me or not? If the answer is no, I simply won't speak in listen to the audiobook, because what's the point of trying to read something or you know, listen to an audiobook that you simply will never use in the future? So it's not immediately relevant. I just don't do it. Now. The second layer filtering is okay. Maybe I think this book is relevant to me. For example, not long ago, I was listening to an audio book, basically a called the biggest bluff. It's about the journey. As a professional poker player, now in that audio book, and you know, the description, the audio books description was all about how the philosophy of poker, for example, can be applied to politics and to be applied to business. I mean, the poker face concept and putting yourself in the, you know, certain positions to make decisions, and so on and so forth. And I thought this would be applicable, you know, in business, and I actually made the purchase, I got the audiobook, I was listening. And after about a few hours, I realized No, man, this isn't really not at all about business or politics. It's really about pure poker. And it's talking about the journey of a professional poker player who went from complete newbie to I don't know, World Series of Poker tournament, for example, extraordinaire, and then I realized, well, do I really want to spend the next three, four hours finishing it? And I realized No, because unfortunately, you see projects, a lot of us especially guys like you and me, we tend to somehow detest giving out we say, like, you know, what if I if I don't finish this audio book that I'm giving up And therefore, I should keep listening to this garbage because otherwise I have given up. No man, this is not the case because in reality, you could spend that four or five hours, let's do another audio book that will actually be ethical. Because the fact of the matter is, if you just grind through the audio book, so you know what I got to finish this audiobook right now. So what happens? after about four or five hours, six hours, 10 hours you finish it, and then what happens? You'll forget about it. So if you're going to forget about it, then why spend that 10 hours listening anyways. And for that reason, I believe that it's better to go for that two layer method. So at first, you fully filter out the topics, and let's say, the titles that are not relevant to you. On the second level, once you read and start reading or listening, you ask yourself, Is this really helping me or not? If the answer is no, just abandon it and move on to another audio program, podcasts or some other source.   Pouya LJ  09:54 That's exactly that's exactly my that was my problem. And now isn't so much What do I mean by that? Is that you mentioned that if it's not useful, you thought it's different kind of audiobook, and it's not living up to your standards or your thought or your expectations. Yeah, I don't I don't shy away from dropping dead, which is a good advice, in my opinion, but even books, but specifically audiobooks because you have to dedicate that chunk of time, as you mentioned. And I used to think otherwise, meaning Yes, I can't give up whatever. And at some point, that is accumulation of thoughts. Give me this epiphany that, yeah, well, the not giving up scenario has a purpose because if you don't give up there is a gem at the end of all of that suffering that will you know, that will be that will be unlocked and you can access it. However, in the case of a audio book that is not useful to you, not interesting to you or not useful to you, not helpful to you. There's really nothing but for our statistics, which I read this book, too, which is, well, who cares? What is the result of that? So I I completely agree on that on that point. And I think I think just choosing is obviously requires some time and research, to dedicate to choose Good, good audio books, podcasts, what have you. And one one way, which is usually a reliable way is word of mouth from people you trust, and they can explain to you what the book is about to a degree. So you have a higher degree of confidence of purchase. But at the end of the day, there's always chance that, you know, I thought differently about this book, and it turned out differently. So, you know, no, no shying away from dropping the books. Do you have any other method methodology in choosing a books, podcast, whatever, like, for example, by author maybe I don't know, like, maybe   Dan  11:46 because sometimes a lot of the, you know, titles that I find, let's say audiobooks are certainly, you know, knowing the author, because I believe that sometimes you don't know the author, maybe it's like her or his first book. So in that case, you Need to actually give it a shot. For me it's more about whether or not the description of that audio material or the podcasts or whatever it is, if it be directly, that's, for me a lot more important than who the author is. Because sometimes very famous authors, just because they are famous, they just want to, you know, write more and make more money and just write more books. And a lot of you know, top authors books are total junk after about a few books, I mean, because basically, they just got to rights, and if you will, and they end up writing some crap. So for me, it's not about the author so much as it is about the top of the title, how relevant The topic is to me, and that's how I usually pick them. But of course, I usually go through the best selling list on Audible calm to see which titles are now bestsellers. Obviously, a lot of those titles are bestsellers because of the situation which might not be relevant to me personally. So in that case, I tend to somehow not care so much about it. But if I find a topic, or a title that is, you know, brand new or it's like a best Wunderland really applies to me. And of course I will take it and of course I will apply because in that case, the suit You know, going to be applicable regardless of who the author is. Sometimes I don't even know who the author of the book is. I know the title, but I don't remember the author's name. So that's okay, too, because what really matters is the content that you will consume in terms of audio. And that's for me, very, very important. And by the way, because I know you also listen to a lot of audiobooks, what is your typical audio routine these days? Like how much audio Do you listen to these days or in the past? What is your typical day like?   Pouya LJ  13:27 Right? Well, I mean, it's changed a lot since the Coronavirus situation developed because I used to do a lot more commute than I do now, due to covid. Or but I mean, still going so it's not to a halt and but it's much, much more reduced. And currently, I am actually reading, not reading rather listening to a podcast is always there. I have my own podcasts that I listened to whatever. But in terms of auto audiobooks, I am listening to one by this individual called Douglas Murray who's The book is called the madness of crowds. A and the author is a British journalist actually. So my vocabulary is much influenced by the fact that I'm listening to this. Yeah, we talked about the unconscious impact of audio, which we're not really aware of, perhaps, consciously, but it's always impacting us. And that's one of the one of the aspects of this like to listen, please   Dan  14:28 try the title myself, which is just double the deeper into what this thing is like the impact that we're receiving what the author exactly she's trying to say here.   Pouya LJ  14:38 Oh, no, but by the impact, I meant to impact the audiobooks itself. I already did this book. I was right. But the book is about a book it was about the well, the title is actually the subtitle of the title. Let me let me bring it up because I don't remember precisely, but it's very telling. It's basically about groupthink in a sense, so it says the madness of crowds crowds, gender, race and identity, the recent issues that have circulated around gender, race, identity, etc. orientation, all that, and the good the new groups that have emerged and the crowds that have started, you know, kind of like some eye movements anywho. So it's actually a quite a controversial book. But what I'm trying to say, regardless of the content of the book, his choice of vocabulary has influenced my choice of day to day speaking vocabulary that I use. I mean, I noticed that recently, but it does actually, even if I listen to podcasts, sometimes I see that, you know, sometimes my choice of vocabulary my own speaking, is changed or influenced, based on what I'm listening to. So when I was trying to highlight the importance of, you know, passive listening and what impact it can have on your mindset, Yeah, yeah. I don't know, do you feel you have the same?   Dan  16:05 For me personally, of course, I've been an audio learner myself. But I think that audio has a tremendous impact on us. I mean, think about this think of music, what is exactly music because music affects us emotionally, in ways that I don't know, speeches or even you know, articles, books or even masterpieces do not do it. And music has been with us since you know, our evolutionary background, which is why I believe that the impact to influence us auditorily is far higher than many other mediums. And other than that, of course, it's about you know, your own perspective. It's all about how audio affects you personally, not just in terms of like, what you listen to, but also how you express yourself, which is why in the, you know, in the area, for example, marketing and personal branding, recommend things like podcasts because nowadays, that's the one basically platform that never gets too old. People will can will always be able to find time to put in some listening time in their schedule, which is why I believe that not only is effective in terms of how it affects our emotions, but in all facets of life, whether it is branding or marketing, or whatever it is, you can always use audio as you as a major carrier of information that not only transcends beyond just mere words, hers emotions and the feelings and values of the person who's saying that So overall, I totally understand the importance of basically audio and how it really affects us the way many other basically inputs do not do it.   Pouya LJ  17:36 And Besant doesn't amazing now for the end part of the today's show, is there anything we didn't talk about that you want to address, or you want to summarize what we talked about?   Dan  17:48 Well, first of all, I really want to thank you for choosing this topic because I believe it's quite important for us to fathom the importance of the audio input that we have. So all listeners should now ask themselves do I Choose the music I listen to on a regular basis with care. Do I know the emotional state of my favorite for example, musicians? I mean, let's be honest. Many top celebrities, top musicians have serious mental issues. And a person with all that mental issues, the lyric and the music that will come out of that mind will in some way also be sick and not necessarily applicable. So ask yourself, do I really feel a sense of connection to these artists that I have around me? Have I selected these bands just because they are cool, or because I really feel that the message resonates with who I am, because unfortunately of us, don't do that. And be very selective of the kind of music you listen to because that ultimately reflects on many things and determines your emotional state. Other than that, we discussed the importance of audio and all forms, whether podcast, audio books, radio programs, and so on, because we believe that audio really has deeper impact on us as an input than many other forms of input and choosing the right basically audio format for us. And more importantly, the right sources are very important. We also talked about, you know, the whole concept of never ever give up, which does not really apply to audiobooks. And we mentioned, whether it comes to when it comes to audiobooks or podcasts. If you start listening, and you realize, well, this audio book really is not about me, or if you're listening to podcasts, and you realize that I don't know after about, I mean, we have some very, very long podcast goes on for hours. So after about an hour and a half, it's like, you know, well, it says two hours left. So it's a three and a half hour podcast. Do I really have to finish it? The answer is no, of course not. So do not apply the same thing if it doesn't immediately attract your attention. Then you are going to forget it. So why listen anyways, and that of course then allows you to choose the Write source of material, the right source of input for yourself that will also be applicable and you will remember it and you can actually apply it in your daily life. So, for that reason, it can actually be a lot more conscious of the content that you choose and the material that you actually try to listen to on a regular basis. And by doing so, you will then be able to control how you feel how you think and the results that you will ultimately get in life.   Pouya LJ  20:24 That's amazing. Thank you, Dan, for like, we appreciate it. And thank you all hope. I hope that we have influenced you auditorially well today and until a later on jatoi, auditory influence Cheers.

One of the best lessons that I learned from Tony Robbins is that the people who lack motivation don’t really lack motivation at all, rather they simply lack goals that are motivational enough! The first biggest mistake in goal setting is failing to set them in the first place and the second biggest mistake is setting goals that are too small and thus demotivating!    In this short talk Daniel introduces the concept of blue sky thinking and the importance of dreaming with no limits and then balancing it out with realistic and rational planning and execution. The truth of the matter is that your potential can only be revealed to you if you set goals that seem beyond your current ability so that they force you to grow and in this program you will learn how to do just that!     Episode Transcript:----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS dream, goals, planning, life, achieve, realistically, realistic, steps, set, pandemic, reality, people, business, true, motivation, execution, limits, potential, corona virus, details SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:12 Hello, and welcome to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast, the solo edition. My name is Daniel Morgan and today we're going to talk about the importance of setting the right amount of goals to give you the right level of motivation to say guys, we just finished a wonderful workshop and we were discussing the issue of goal setting, visualization, and even fantasizing and daydreaming about your goals. And it was just a very, very constructive workshop. And I really enjoyed this and I want to just, you know, share a few of the tips that we discussed during the seminar and what will you guys hopefully be able to use and apply to your own lives. First and foremost, we actually talked about what it really means to set goals and to have dreams because I am a firm believer in the fact that if you do not have a dream to aim for, then your life will be Filled with repetitive, meaningless moments of brainless entertainment, as well as, you know, disengagement life that you simply cannot get rid of, and you will never truly experienced a real joy of life. And what is the real joy of life, the real joy of life is about, basically, you know, there's a great statement about this already learned a while back and it says, happiness is the progressive realisation of a worthy ideal. And this was by Mr. Nightingale. And in reality speaking, I think this is what we need right now. a happy life, a life of basically contentment, a life of joy. And satisfaction is a life where you are taking progressive steps, small but progressive, towards all of your goals and ambitions and dreams. Now, the good part is, you don't actually have to arrive at your destination, to feel happy to feel basically satisfied. What really makes us all happy is that Chase is that pursuit is that effort that you're making every single day trying to get closer and closer to realizing that dream and I think that's really what we need to focus on and in the in the in the workshop we discussed what are our dreams and I think every listener that is currently listening to our podcast should understand that we only the dreams now your dreams might be very silly like I don't know, just I want to win five hands back in you know back to back or your dreams could be very, you know, difficult to attain perhaps world peace, perhaps equality, you know, fighting global warming. What it really is a dream is nothing more than a wish or a hope and something you really want to aim for in life. And while I'm a huge fan of basically making plans that are more realistic, and rational, when it comes to dreaming, I believe that we need the exact opposite because If you want to implement logic and rationality, in dreaming, you will fail and dreaming may explain why. You see, when it comes to making plans, you're saying well, I should first say what are the requirements? What are the steps that should be taken? And what should we do right here. So you think very logically, very linearly, and very realistically, because you have to make a plan. However, when you make the exact same basically approach and you apply it to dreaming, you will fail because dreaming is supposed to be and I'm certainly realistic. It is supposed to be irrational because it's supposed to excite your imagination. And Albert Einstein said that imagination is the most important thing of all, because he believed that imagination is what leads to creating new potentials. So the problem with realistic dreaming is that if you dream realistically, you are defeating the purpose of a dream which is that non basically Ending and continuous surge of energy and motivation to realize, you see, if you look at people around you who are highly energetic and highly motivated, and they're always going at it day in and day not. I've seen a lot of these people. I mean, I just talked to a wonderful athlete. And this guy is crazy about basketball, like, he just wakes up early in the morning. And he tries to find, you know, a gym even though nowadays, as you probably know, there's a major pandemic, and all the world's many countries and many cities are going back to, you know, quarantine and just like California, like right now many gyms are actually closed. So this gentleman literally goes out of his way to find another gym that is perhaps open in this situation to be able to pursue his dream of becoming a professional basketball player. You see, this is energy. What I mean just imagine, just imagine if you perhaps don't have a major energy and all the gyms are closed, what do you tell yourself? Well, you know what things happen right? mean we gotta just tolerate it, it's gonna just go away and you stop exercising, you stop practicing you stop training because for you, being a professional athlete is not a dream. But for somebody who believes that this is my dream, he will go out of his way to make sure that he actually achieves it. So for that reason, it's very important to have that dream. And the problem with that is a lot of us we believe that when it comes to having a dream, a major dream in life, then we should simply just dream realistically, this is a huge mistake. Because if you dream realistically, you will not accomplish much in life. Because the right approach here is dream irrationally and without any limits. But make plans and execute realistically and logically. Because in reality speaking if you want to dream realistically, you will never exercise and practice your imagination of what is truly possible for you and you will settle down for Whatever Cisco has told you that you are. So if today, you think that Well, I've worked in my business for a while now. And I think that's just I've reached my, basically maximum capacity. Well, what will happen here, you will reach a plateau that you cannot exceed because you have set a mental limits, your mind has now accepted that, yes, this is my limit. And for the rest of my life, I've been working as an accountant, as a lawyer, as a doctor, whatever it is, and this is my limit. And that's it. And guess what, you probably are not going to feel very excited to wake up the next morning and say, You know what, uh, well, I gotta go to my job to pay the bills. And this somehow fails to truly enrich you with energy and zest to achieve something. On the other hand, if you set a very huge dream, the kind of dream that people say like Dude, are you high or something or you've been drinking? Those are the kind of dreams that you need to have because ironically, those are the type of dreams that will give you the right amount of motivation to achieve big goals because once you dream without an limits. We call this the blue sky thinking. At that moment, there is nothing to stop you. So all you have is a vision of a possible future. And in that moment, your true potential is revealed to you. Because when you set big goals, you are telling yourself that I am capable of achieving this, your subconscious mind now makes that as a command to your nervous system. And now this almost a reality for you, even though you haven't yet achieved anything. And ironically, once you have that vision in your in yourself and you start thinking about that dream and that vision, things begin to change, and you start taking different types of actions slowly but surely, and you wait for a couple of years. Again, as Tony Robbins said, we tend to overestimate what we can do in one year, but we unfortunately underestimate so much what we can do and accomplish in 10 years. So what do you have that big dream for yourself? You might start taking some And after a few days, like, Well, my goal was to perhaps have a very, very fit body or run my own multimillion dollar business or perhaps I don't know, play the guitar, whatever it was. And then after a few days or weeks, you feel like, Well, I haven't made much progress, because that's the nature of all goal achievement. I mean, you can't achieve any big goal overnight. But once you have that dream, you see, that's when the difference is made. If your goal is just to make some bucks, after about a few days or weeks, what happens is that you tell yourself, you know what, I'm not making much progress. Are you sure the goal was worth it? And guess what the answer is going to be? Of course not come on man. Let's go back to the status quo. And you stop From then on, you're no longer trying your best to achieve that goal. However, what if you had a major big dream that you wanted to go for and you wanted to study and you wanted to practice and you wanted to learn more? How can I do this? A true what you know What I like to believe as a true obsession, that you have a dream that keeps you awake, to work harder during the nights and gets you wake up earlier during the day. These are the kind of dreams that we need to have as individuals who wants to realize our true potential. Which is why if you're now listening, ask yourself, what is my dream? And what kind of dreams did I have in my childhood that I later abandoned because it seemed to be just too difficult. You see, once you look at yourself, and you want to set a dream, please do set the kind of dreams that'll make anyone who knows you to say, Wow, are you crazy? This is I mean, if you really want to know you've set a good dream, just go around and ask people that you know, guys, here's my dream. If they're not saying, dude, are you crazy? You probably have not set a very high dream or at very high goal. You probably can do better. Because when you set a dream, you must set a dream that is beyond your current ability, knowledge, or basically chances you need to somehow go way above and beyond what you can realistically accomplish. Because once you do that, then you will have the motivation throughout the entire lengthy and slow and occasionally gruesome process of obtaining big goals because guys, the road and the journey ahead will not be an easy one, nor will it be short. It'll take a long time. It'll take a lot of work. And perhaps believable amount of failure and setbacks and difficulties and rejections, you got to go for a long journey. And if you don't have that dream, then what's the point of trying right? You just give up right away. And because of this, it's better to start dreaming big. And to do so you must pick a dream that you yourself want sometimes unforeseen. A lot of basically individuals certainly in their at a younger age, they don't pick their own dreams, they pick dreams that will make their parents happy or will make their partner happier will make their best friends happy or simply the kind of dreams that will get the most amount of attention from people. This is a huge mistake. If you're setting a dream just because it makes you super cool or because, you know, it allows you to have a lot of attention or even making you know, just just seeing money as your target, then the chances are you will not truly dream big, nor will you dream for yourself. You will dream to make mommy happy little dream to make your partner happy, you'll dream to get some attention. But you will not truly commit to your calling to your vocation to your inner desire that you've had. And because of this, it's better to really dream for yourself. Ask yourself if I had everything in the world that I thought or I should probably have. I mean a good home let's say a family all those things. What else What I dream because unfortunately a lot of dreams are forgotten because we just get busy with a daily you know, pursuits of the things we should have, you know, a roof over your head, a car perhaps or I don't know, being able to have a family. These are important. But ask yourself what is my real dream? Maybe your real dream is not necessarily just to, you know, make some, you know, let's say bucks. Or maybe you really want to actually make a huge difference in the world. Maybe you want to help people to eradicate, you know, let's say gender inequality or sexism or poverty, maybe wants to be a force for good. Maybe your real passion is to have a great family, and you want to raise lots of wonderful kids and your role isn't so much. I mean, you don't care so much about having a, let's say, you know, a Lamborghini. What you want instead is of course, perhaps having a lot of great children that you can raise in a healthy way. Maybe your goal is really to be a multi millionaire. Maybe your goal really is to be the best artist or the best in your field. See, these are the kind of dreams that will motivate you. Now, hear me out. Up until now you've been dreaming now is dreaming all it takes to achieve your goals and realize your potential. Of course not. The next step is planning and execution. And in this case, I usually like to change things I literally shift gears, here's when you need to start getting realistic, logical and rational. Unfortunately, most people do the exact opposite. When it comes to dreaming, they're all realistic. And they're all pessimistic when it comes to planning execution. They're all optimists, I am the exact opposite. I am an absolute optimist, when it comes to making you know setting goals and you know, dreaming really, but I tend to err on pessimism when it comes to planning and execution which is why one of my strategies, make Plan B before you make Plan A I've lived by this for my entire life in my business and all areas of my life I worked with a plan B. And I designed and complete act like I designed my exit strategy and my plan B before I'm actually putting the details of Plan A. That's called realistic and logical planning. There's no dreaming here. But guess what? I've done the dreaming beforehand with the goal with the dream that you will then think about on a regular basis in your life and that's exactly what you need to do. So you want to start thinking using the blue sky method and just dream What do I want if everything were perfect? They never are, but just imagine if everything were perfect. What kind of dream would I set for myself? You're saying, but do there is the corona virus pandemic, people are dying of the corona virus and we're where the economies are coming down and we have a lot of difficulties. I know. That's the reality. When you're dreaming you don't think about the Coronavirus panel. endemic, you don't think about the economic recessions that have followed or the close borders, you think about the dream. That's the issue. You see, you do not want to concern yourself with reality when you're dreaming. Only then you will truly pick the right dream for yourself. Because if you engage in rational thinking and dreaming in this as you're dreaming, you will not pick the right goal. Nor will you pick it at the right size or volume or scale because you are being extremely pessimistic because you're not going to realize your true potential. However, after you've done that, it's okay Dan is okay Dan is right. No problem. So I'm going to start I'm going to pretend there's no coronavirus pandemic. I'm gonna pretend the borders are all open. The economies are running everything's okay. Now what is my dream? Oh, can you start planning I want to be the best photographer. I want to be the best fashion designer. I want to be the best athlete, the best dancer, whatever it is, you start dreaming. You dream big dreams without any limitations. Then it's time to shift gears and become realistic. And basically, I'm not going to say being pessimistic but like, a little bit more rational here. Now you say, Okay, okay, so now let's come back to the reality, things are not very easy. Now, what are the first steps that I should take to become the best basketball player to run my own business? To find the right partner? To learn to play the guitar? Whatever it is, what are the first steps I should I should do this or should do this. Now it's time to think rationally because guess what? When it comes to execution and planning, you need to be realistic. Otherwise, you will, in most cases failed. And if you ever when it's because of chance, pure luck. It's not because of effort. That's when you say, all right, so if I want to run my business, how many years do we have to work as an apprentice or some other business to learn it? I see and which countries will offer me the best opportunity to you know, practice entrepreneurship, if your goal is to be the best hockey player, so What are the best nations that truly promote hockey? For example? What are the best nations that truly allow me to be in touch with arts and fashion or whatever it is that you truly desire in life? Now you get to the nitty gritty and you start to think about the details. Okay, I'm gonna do this first, and I'm gonna do this one second, and oh, boy, there's gonna be a problem. How can I get that, for example, I don't know the permit to run that company. Oh, and one of the organizations we should call you see, now here are the details. You've found the dream. And now it's time to get down to business, and to get realistic to look for the real sources of basically, issues and problems that you have to deal with and overcome in order to achieve your goals. And by combining blue sky thinking, with realistic planning and execution, you tremendously improve your odds of actually achieving your goals and realizing your potential because now all of a sudden, you're no longer shooting for an easy goal that probably will cease to amaze you after a while, but you're now working on your life's mission. And that motivation will never disappear. So, because of this, I believe that if you want to make the most of your life, start from today, too, and start asking yourself, what can I do to truly achieve my dreams, that's when you start getting into details. And please, while doing so, try to not just think about them. And my friend, basically, they say, don't think it and get now get down to business. Start writing down your goals, plans, gather all the phone numbers to the start, you know, surfing online, go to Google and start googling all the details. That's when you have to then hopefully start putting in all the missing, you know, pieces of the puzzle, so naturally, hopefully, in the future achieve all of that. And ultimately, once you have both the blue sky thinking and you know the spirit of hard work and you paying a lot of attention to details. Now your life will change and everything will get better. Because of this, I really believe that it's important to focus on doing your best, it's really important to try your best to focus on combining these two approaches. And eventually you'll have the opportunity to achieve almost all of your goals without, you know, compromising your true potential and abilities. And that's, of course, my hope and wish for you to listeners of the show to truly not settle because life is too short to settle for something that is just a mere, you know, miniature representation of your true potential or your true desire and it's best to aim and shoot for the stars, while at the same time trying to build foundations. You see, you imagine, you know your castles in the sky, that's wonderful. The castle that you imagine in your head should be in the skies, but now start building foundations under them step by step rigorously. and methodically. That's all the time we have for guys. I hope that this short talk inspired you to set and achieve your goals, and of course to dream big and take a lot of action. If you have any questions or comments, please feel free to contact me. Or, you know, PLJ, the producer of the show directly on the website or on social media and glad to actually help you answer all your questions and that's all the time we have for how to go on and take care.

The word diplomacy brings into mind images of politicians discussing comprehensive deals among nations but the truth of the matter is that diplomacy is not something that happens only in politics, rather, it is an essential component of every human relationship that includes peace, cooperation, mutual respect, and understanding among in a group of individuals as small as a newly wed couple and as large the United Nations with all its member countries. In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Dan and Poujix discuss the issue of diplomacy as it applies to our personal and professional lives and offer ways to avoid diplomacy being replaced by fights and arguments.   Episode Transcript:----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS diplomacy, diplomatic, relationships, practicing, emotions, fails, act, punching, deal, feel, influence, books, people, business, grabbing, talk, means, long term, traveling, life SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast, joined with me as always, Dan Molgan, how's it going, man?   Dan  00:17 Hey, man, buddy, how are you glad to be here with you life is wonderful. And of course, we're back on track, working very hard and trying to make sure that things remain upbeat. Despite all the challenges of your hand. Of course, I'm very happy to know that there are some improvements. Now in terms of traveling around the world, some boards are getting actually opened. And of course, it's not going to be as I really wanted. I think that the true summer will be experienced, hopefully, next year, but it's better than nothing. And let's see what happens. But for now, life is great. And I'm waiting to see hopefully how, for the rest of the summer we will see some changes in terms of traveling in terms of the orders in the European Union in Asia and the Middle East, and hopefully things will get better. We'll see. We'll see.   Pouya LJ  01:00 That's good. So they were talking about some topic regarding how to what is the art of being a diplomat. So first of all, the first thing comes to anybody's mind when you're talking about the word diplomat or diplomatic is the, you know, international relationships, which is very true. Of course, that's part of the whole part of the whole deal. But I wouldn't really put a stop to the definition of the word there because you can apply diplomatic behavior and being being diplomatic, as an art form in your life and your business and your personal life. So how do you how do you see it? Do you see it that is contained within the EU between countries when they're negotiating, for example, trade deals or whatever? Or do you think it applies to personal individual lives as well?   Dan  01:42 Absolutely, very well put out and such a smart statement. Diplomacy exists, whether someone wants to buy a candy as a five year old, or whether somebody wants to negotiate I don't know, for example, a major trade deal between three or four countries to see when, for example, a five year old goes to, for example, His mom and starts looking in his eyes and says things like, Oh, Mom, Hey, Mom, what's up? Do you see that candy over there? Well, this little five year old is actually engaging in diplomacy. Now depends on how he does it. If he says, Mom, either you buy me the candy, or I am not going to talk with you anymore. We call this emotional blackmailing. That's one of the strategies of, you know, diplomacy. If, on the other hand, he tries to get the candy by being very nice and kind with the mom and trying to, you know, be very attractive. We call this enticing, which is a very democratic approach to towards diplomacy. But diplomacy Simply put, is about reaching agreements, and avoiding conflict, especially when it comes to physical conflicts. Diplomacy basically is what prevents wars from happening and where we see worse across nations, or fights would be verbal fights or even physical fights. That's it. happens when diplomacy fails because diplomacy is that glue that holds the societies peace and stability together. And without diplomacy, there's nothing left but arguments. So imagine that child who did not get the you know, candy starts smashing things around anyhow basically and starts punching, for example with his, you know, his little hands punching the man, I want the candy. That's when diplomacy fails. So whenever we hear verbal fights, people start using strong language Oh, you this and this such and such a person. That's when diplomacy fails. When we see physical fights. That's, you know, when diplomacy when you suddenly see somebody grabs, I don't know, I don't know, some brick and or some stuff, start pushing somebody or punching somebody. That's when diplomacy fails. And of course, when you see troops landed, and boots on the ground, that's also when diplomacy fails. And obviously, as we know that, you know, in the modern world, we want our societies to the modern, in the very sense of modernity with itself brings about diplomacy because different policy itself is what led to modernity, because if we did not have diplomacy we would have no civilization would be still cavemen, wha, moving around and grabbing stones, all those things, but we have our technologies, we are capable of sitting in two different countries and having this you know, live conversation or traveling very, you know, fast between different countries, or, for example, using AI or using modern technologies and medicine, because we had diplomacy, because when diplomacy fails, progress halts. And every every side loses basically, right. And because of this, I believe it is very important for everyone to learn the art of being, you know, diplomatic, and it is hard to fully, you know, articulate what it means to be diplomatic and all you know, things and all relationships, you know, in a short period of time that we have on our podcast, but if our listeners pay attention to it, of course, it'll be very, very important and we see exactly why it is important to learn the art of diplomacy.   Pouya LJ  04:59 That's good to know. I mean, Again, we're not going to delve into the political aspect of it from a negotiation between countries because first of all, people tend to have some ideas of what it is and how people tend to do it. But let's, let's make it more personal. So it's my, I suppose it's more useful to with our limited time. So let's talk about how you employ diplomacy and diplomatic approach to negotiating Say, say with your let's let's talk about first class of businesses so that your business partners with your customers, whatever. So how do you how do you go about So first of all, are you going to establish a rapport using a diplomatic approach? Or what is the first step in your in your guess? Right?   Dan  05:41 Well, you know, usually diplomacy basically is what I call when diplomacy is about creating a relationship that is founded primarily on offering value to both sides. You see, a diplomatic relationship, for example, is a relationship where A certain degrees of logics and strategy is involved. So for example, if you see someone, and then you start jumping up and grabbing them and hugging them, this is not necessarily a diplomatic relationship. So if I, for example, go to a business meeting and I say, Hey, man, what up buddy? And I, you know, start, for example, rapping a little bit graph is, hey, what up, buddy? How's it going? Now, that's not exactly diplomatic, I'm probably going to call this security and they're gonna have to kick somebody out. Right? So diplomacy is basically being able to create a professional as well as mutually beneficial setting environment where both sides win and get value. So when you are being diplomatic, you're not trying to be friendly necessarily. When you're being diplomatic. You're not trying to be sincere necessarily, because, again, we're looking at politics here right? Now, unfortunately, politicians are accused of being extremely, you know, dishonest. That's an exaggeration, but diplomacy itself is about being able to control your emotions in the heat of a debate. So firstly, To see your intuition you feel the guy says, Listen, I know you've traveled along with this deal. But guess what? I'm offering nothing less than this amount for example. Now, your natural emotional tendency is to stand up on your chair and say you something, something, something. I just traveled this distance to do this. And now you ever meet this price you something something that's like the natural, you know, cavemen mind tendency. But diplomacy here says, alright, take a step back. Take a deep breath. Again, this all happens, you know, very quickly, you know, in the subconscious mind, let's just calm down and analyze the situation. So then you start to move on to their person, what are your conditions? What do you want to do with this? Why do you offer this so you start asking questions, and more importantly, you try to come from the frame of cooperation, rather than elimination or competition. Because this is the major factor diplomacy works when both sides understand that the other side actually isn't Just looking for his own interest. When this happens when this is, you know, thanks. For example, this guy only wants the lowest price he can get. Then automatically here there's a sense of animosity. This happens a lot, unfortunately, in business, where it's like, either you take them or I take them. And I've heard a lot of great books in sales. Unfortunately, a lot of them teach you a lot of unethical practices, things like when you are selling, you must be selling at the highest price no matter what, because of this, and they justify that with saying things like you're selling it for your team, but in reality, it's very unethical. So diplomacy is about trying to understand what the other side once trying to explain clearly what you want, and explain why especially to deal in a different way. That's called diplomacy. This happens a lot in business. But then again, it's not just in business, we can use diplomacy in all relationships, friendships and partnerships could be with your partner, spouse with your children, and this applies to almost everything. However, personally speaking The closer you are in a relationship, it's best to be more sincere, because, you know, if you're extremely strategic in all relationships that also, you know, quality relationship, but being diplomatic is not the same as being a liar. Whereas being a cheater, it's simply a matter of having strategy and relationships. And if you look at those who are very happy and have maintained long term relationships, you realize they have actually noticed some degrees of strategy and their encounters and have learned to be diplomatic.   Pouya LJ  09:31 So, from what I'm hearing from what you're saying, it seems to me I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, obviously. But it seems to me that it's from your point of view, at least, this whole diplomatic approach to say business or even in personal life. We'll get to that in a second half, but at least for the first half business side, it seems like it's a it's a it's a structure. It's a foundation. It's a framework that defines some boundaries, some helps you guide and navigate your relationship. With the third party or second party, that is that would that would you say that that's   Dan  10:04 exactly a great point, I mean yourself right now. I'm gonna give you right now, three situations and describe for me how you feel in each of these situations. So put yourself. So we're going to use three cases here. One is going to be business one is going to be personal, and one is going to be basically friendly, not extremely close, like let's say for example, a wife or a child, but also not very distant, like, for example, business. So imagine the first case in business. So you go to a business meeting, and you ask for something. And the person says, Listen, projects, we got this price right here, it's $2,500 per staff member, and we are the only company that supplies it. So take it or leave it. How do you feel in this situation?   Pouya LJ  10:51 I was definitely not comfortable. I'm not, you know, comforting,   Dan  10:55 but you really don't necessarily have any other options. So there's no other option and you told me been told by your boss to make this purchase? What will you do?   Pouya LJ  11:03 So, so? So assuming they're correct, actually. So there's there's no competition or only choice. Right?   11:09 Exactly. There.   Dan  11:12 They have their monopoly. So I mean, in a sense, you have to give in, don't you? Exactly. Now, here's the next case. Imagine after literally a week after that deal was done. And another company comes along and offers the same service slightly more expensive. So, for example, this service to $500 per staff now is 2700. And then you go to the, you know, office, would you be interested to even negotiate in this case, or you want to go back to the same guy who pushed and shoved into your face the last time?   Pouya LJ  11:43 Yeah, of course, if I could make a better deal with the second guy, and that's   Dan  11:46 not a bad deal. Technically, it's not a better deal because it costs more, but you know, this might have a chance. So you go to his office, for example. He says, sir, here's our price is 2700. But the reason that we offer For a little bit more expensive than this competitor is because of this and this and this and of course, we're glad to help you in terms of long term payments and certain other things. So they are very polite. They ask you a lot of questions they understand who you are and what you want. So are you more likely to pay a little bit extra and work with this guy that he actually like then to keep working with the monopoly guy who apparently right now has   Pouya LJ  12:22 still a lower price? Right? Well, no, I mean, definitely with the new guy even if it's more expensive because not only because it's at least they they opened the door for negotiation you never like with an ongoing especially if it's not a one time sale, maybe it has some sort of maintainence or something. And definitely the the guy that is more approachable, more. Listening better, is definitely a better choice because at least we can negotiate terms and conditions and you know, problems occur, we can solve them and talk. I think that conversation that the channel conversation being open is definitely comforting. The second   Dan  12:59 take exactly See, that's the point. So diplomacy, it actually leads to a better long term relationship. Now let's move on to the pharmacy and personal relationships. I really believe that the foundation of diplomacy and personal relationships, speed friendly family and other comes down to long term thinking, you see, it's much easier to do certain things to have certain reactions, especially negative ones in the short term because of some emotions you're feeling, but that could in the long term, jeopardize our relationship. So diplomacy is about this. So for example, right now, I'm gonna give you two cases. Imagine you're talking with your girlfriend. And your girlfriend basically guess is obviously very stressed very, you know, angry because she has perhaps missed her deadline for the university and she got fired from her last job because she was very busy or just she's very nervous right now. So in the first case, she comes home and says, Listen, Pooh, chicks, the cool guy with a cool suit and the cool beard look at look at me right now. Well, you feel like life is so cool. And like, look at me. So in this case, when she acts all nervous, obviously is not activated automatically. And you have two choices. You can sit back and say now You shut up your little which you're not supposed to talk to me like that. So this is when exactly diplomacy fails. But here's the question. If this really happened to you projects, do you think you would necessarily react aggressively?   Pouya LJ  14:30 Not necessarily. I mean, depends on what mood I am personally. And if.   Dan  14:35 So, if you make decisions based upon your mood, then you are not being diplomatic. This is the exact difference between diplomacy in relationships versus winging it or acting your feelings out, right. So if you're imagine you had a very good day, I mean, you had a wonderful day life is great. Everything is going well. And then of course, you're going to be like, understand like, yeah, nine out laid on me. I'm your man just keep punching, keep jabbing no problem. But if you had a bad day, what do you do? Yeah, cannot I had it, I'll do it and you start fighting and boom, diplomacy fails. So diplomacy is about acting and doing the right thing. He irrespective of how you feel. So sometimes diplomacy dictates that you must back off, even though you might need something, sometimes it implies going forward, even though you don't feel like it. So diplomacy is about managing putting a distance between your emotions, and what is right to do to save the relationship if you get the results. So people who are again, that's how politicians are generally those who are good politicians. I mean, if you look at you know, for example, the idiot Trump, who called Joe Biden sleepy Joe, I'm gonna call them idiot Trump. So this is a great example of when diplomacy fails and you just start bullying right? Now this is not just in politics, I'm sure you know a lot of people like that. You know, a lot of people who are using aggression as a means of getting results, they want to bully and all those things. But aggression rarely leads to long term results, not just in politics, but in business and in all relationships. So diplomacy is putting that distance between your emotions and your mood of that moment. And the long term longevity of the relationship and acting not based upon the feeling, but doing what is right. And that by the way, pooches is not easy at all, it requires a lot of training, which is why this, you know, show today is just a means of inspiring our listeners to start putting more time learning the art of basically diplomacy, to know that yes, a girl can start fighting, but if you know and have a good, you know, basically a diplomatic mindset, he can easily turn it around. So the same angry girl who starts shouting and all those things and you feel like oh, you feel like angry right now. say okay, let's be diplomatic here. So, how does she feel? You see, practicing empathy? How does she feel? Hopefully she's very, probably very angry. Why does she feel this way? You see, you're literally putting yourself out of that, you know, situation and inside of her basically mind within a person. And then you try to see the world as they so probably, she is very nervous. Probably she has lost her job and that for her, maybe that time of the month. I mean, you never know. But there's gonna be a lot of things right now, basically. So you put yourself in her shoes. And you say, Okay, what is my objective here, I can fight, I can start slapping her. And then we're going to break up, and then she's going to grab her stuff. She's going to leave and then I'm going to cry. And then I'm going to basically call her she's going to block me, then I'm gonna go back to her home, that's going to come kick my ass. I'm gonna go back home basically, again, and you can imagine that there's no good ending for that. Or I could try to keep it cool. And try to let her express her anger. shouted Little bit and then calm her down. And this is an example of diplomacy. So she started like, Yes, I know very tough for you, I understand totally. Now understand here, you're feeling all the pain that she does. But you are using diplomacy here, right? And in the long term, this diplomatic approach, actually, she starts shouting for a while, she starts screaming, and then after about 25 minutes, she's all done. And then she says, so how was your day, and boom, now you got to go, right here, literally, after all that stuff. And guess what someone's gonna get late at night. And that is because you have managed to be diplomatic. So whether you want good results, whether it is to have a good evening, whether it is to, you know, seal a deal, to get the paycheck to, I don't know, make the alliances or in large scales politically, if you want to build the alliances, then having that diplomatic mindset is the key to success in all these areas because of simple look at politics, and, you know, successful politicians or those who work in business. For those who have good relationships always shows that these are rarely the people who act out their emotions. Because let's be honest, you don't need any education to act of your emotions. It is natural to feel aggressive, it is natural to feel upset or hurt. It is natural to want to punch someone or kill someone these are you don't need any skills to do that. That's all ingrained in your DNA. Anybody can do a five year old can do it and 10 year old you what takes a lot of effort and education and eventually wisdom is being able to control and of course I personally spent a lot of time studying the Chinese culture to practice this for myself and everyone's relying on my friends as well because this thing able to take yourself out of the situation and out of your emotions and towards a you know focused direction we can actually make strategic decisions in a diplomatic way rather than emotional way ultimately yields the best results in all relationships.   Pouya LJ  19:54 Perfectly what we already discussed the personal side like a personal relationship, side of There's two. So we're gonna blow past that. And because we're getting to the end of our show as well, now, it's for the people who want to continue educating themselves getting better at this learning practices that they can, you know, do to develop this skill and art form. Are there any books or videos or people who have worked in the space and have material in this space? Do you have any recommendations for further studies?   Dan  20:28 Well, of course, there are a lot of great books actually, in this regard. But I really believe that diplomacy itself is not a subject that is linear in nature. That is, yes, there are many books on the subject. For example, I recommend a great book, for example, the psychology of influence, which is a very, very useful book, and has been a bestseller for decades now. And one of my most favorite actually, which talks about what it really means to influence someone basically the psychology of influence, you could try to actually by Dr. Cialdini wonderful book. And but apart from the books itself. I don't think people actually start practicing because diplomacy needs to be practiced in real relationships, not just on paper. So try to look at all of the relationships in business at school at home, and ask yourself, how much of the time am I acting out my emotions? And how much time am I actually trying to act in a diplomatic way that allows the other side to save face to control or his or her anger, to do these things and to get the results and more importantly, to be strategic in my approach, and only then you can actually improve it. But if you want to get a head start, before you practicing these things, I recommend, of course, the psychology of influence. Other than that, there are a lot of great tools and great ways to improve your knowledge of basically diplomacy through learning sales. So I recommend a lot of basically, scripts right now is available in terms of sales, you can actually find online, basically becoming better at selling up anything of any kind itself can actually prove your ability to be diplomatic, because by the very process of doing that, you will eventually Yes, of course, finally, it is experience by having a lot of experience by meeting a lot of new people. Because in order for you to get good at diplomacy, you have to have a lot of social interactions. So you can get good at diplomacy if you only know how to influence your mom, for example, or your best friend. So you want to have a wide basically range of contacts, you know how we can influence because you will then eventually over practice, you will find the patterns that, oh, it doesn't matter, like in most cases, but if the person is black or white, young or rolled tall or short, Asian, for example, or Middle Eastern doesn't really matter, you you can influence them this way. So you eventually get patterns. So the last one, of course, is having a lot of reference experience to improve your overall diplomacy.   Pouya LJ  22:43 Excellent, perfect. Thank you, Dan, for today's episode. If you have any final thoughts on the matter, please go ahead.   Dan  22:53 For sure. Just I want to thank you again for this great topic you've chosen for this session we talked about, you know what it means Used to be diplomatic, we described the diplomacy as about putting a distance between you and your emotions in order for you to be able to create, influence or save a relationship. And more importantly, we talked about the fact that it can be applied to all facets of life. And everybody can learn to do that. We also discussed that if you want to act on your emotions solely, that's not diplomacy. If you want to know why. And what happens, just take a look at you know, the current recent political events that are happening in the United States and around the world because of the analysis, of course, then you will realize this is what happens when diplomacy fails, results simply vanish and disappear. So ultimately, by knowing this and learning to do that, you can actually become better and then we talked about how we can actually work on it. And he said, other than Of course, certain books that we recommend, there's obviously the the act of practicing, you want to actually start practicing using diplomacy and salesmanship in all your relationships. So we want a couple of books, when of course the most useful right now will be the psychology of influence, but after Cellini which talks to you detail about what it means, of course parchement himself was a salesperson before he actually became a psychologist. So he talks a lot about how, for example, His, you know, brother managed to sell, for example, very good cars at very high prices. So it's a very great book to start with. But then again, practice makes perfect. So try to use those and your daily practice. Well,   Pouya LJ  24:19 thank you again, Dan, for this episode. My pleasure. And thank you, everybody for joining us today until a later episode. Have a good one.    

 As we celebrated Father’s Day the issue of masculinity has been brought back to spotlight. If you are a man then answer these questions:    1-Are you in a relationship with a woman who is in control of the relationship?  2- Do you feel like other people don’t understand you or don’t appreciate you?  3- Do you prefer yoga and massage over weightlifting and aerobic? 4- Do you lack self confidence, dominance, and assertiveness?  5- Do you feel like you lack goal orientation, focus, and persistence?  6- Have you experienced serious depression caused by an emotionally triggering event that lasted for a very long time and didn’t go away naturally or with the help of mental health professionals?  7- Do you prefer crying about a problem instead of channeling your aggression to solve the problem?    If you answered yes to any of these questions then the chances are you are involved with masculinity crisis that has alas gone rampant in the modern world. Young men in these days spend most of their primitive years until the age of 12 with their mothers and their female teachers at elementary schools as often their fathers are out working and later in life they also spend most of their time at home with their girlfriends or wives and at some point they look back at their lives and wonder why they lack masculinity! In this solo edition of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel explains the reason behind the spread of masculinity crisis among men and offers the guidelines on how any man can deal with this crisis and reclaim his manhood.   Episode Transcript:----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS men, spend, male role models, young man, masculine, masculinity, father, crisis, women, problem, oftentimes, mom, world, means, lack, issue, people, modern, school teachers, male SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:11 Hello, welcome to yet another episode of beyond the present podcast, this solo edition. My name is Daniel Morgan, and welcome to this episode dedicated to the Father's Day and of course, the issue of masculinity in general. So first of all, I'd like to congratulate this wonderful day to all the fathers around the world, because obviously, it's you know, their day and I would like to somehow congratulate all of them, and to thank them for the effort that you make to raise the families and to contribute to their families. And today, of course, the major topic of our short discussion today is not so much so that, you know, the Father's Day itself, but the issue of masculinity and the fact that we are unfortunately, in a world right now where masculinity is under attack, and let me just explain that a little bit what that means. You see I have a lot of students friends, contacts, Basically, and staff members who come to me and asked for certain questions regarding how they could be a good man. I mean, this is a serious problem like imagine young people, man after man, they come and ask you listen, Dan, I got a problem. I don't know what it means to be a man anymore. And I don't even know should I do it right now? What's the manly thing here to do? And this clearly shows a certain crisis that we have entered into in the modern world. And that is the masculinity crisis. Now, let me explain what that means. You see, unlike the ancient times, where perhaps a young boy was born into a tribe, and then he would immediately have male role models everywhere, so he would go hunting, he would go fishing, he would go, I don't know, perhaps work with the blacksmiths and the men would oftentimes spend a lot of time with other men. And this way young men would have been learned how to be a man by simply learning from their male role models from their peers that essentially A lot of time with, unfortunately, in the modern world, things have changed a little bit. So most young men in their basically, critical, early years, they tend to spend most of their time with their mothers and not their fathers. Why? Because the father is out working, and making, you know, making money and trying to support the family. So oftentimes, in early years, especially into the first 12 to 15 years of a boy's life, he tends to spend a lot more time with his mother than his father. And this is, of course, one of the side effects of modernity, which unfortunately, has had a negative impact on most basically young man's sense of masculinity and manhood. And that is why we need to address this issue, of course, in this program, like to talk a little bit about, you know, this issue and how it will impact the young generation of men and what we could do about it to somehow resolve the issue. So first of all, when a young man spends most of his time Either at home, I don't know behind computer or playing video games and then physically encountering and you know, in talking with basically his mother, then he will simply not learn to think like a man, he will simply not learn to be a man because he does not have what we call a male role model. You see, oftentimes what I mean, if you look at like role models or mentoring, what it really means is to spend a lot of time interacting with asking questions and being in touch with a role model to ask questions to learn from them, and to emulate their behaviors. But unfortunately, model world that's not possible because these men, these young men tend to somehow spend very little time with their fathers. And you know, what they do instead is to just go to school and then oftentimes when they are young, most of their teachers are also women. If you look at like elementary school, the majority of elementary school teachers are women. So just imagine a seven year old and eight year old, a nine year old who is at home Most of the time, the father is outworking so he wakes up. Hi Mom, how are you and he's tends to spend a lot of time with his mother. Then he goes to school where he's been taught even more by other female teachers and no elementary school. And like he's, you know, at his prime like he's 789. This is this is a time when he is forming his personality, his basic behavior, and he's spending most of his time with other women. And this creates a certain problem and that is lack of male mentoring, lack of male, basically role model. so in this situation, what happens is, this gentleman will then grow up not knowing how to think like a man acquiring a lot of feminine characteristics. That's why a lot of unfortunately men these days, experienced tremendous issues psychologically, they said things like, I don't feel very confident or they call themselves super sensitive or they say things that if you heard from a guy, for example, 300 years ago, you would perhaps say like, what's wrong with this guy? Right? And the answer is very simple because this person has no other, you know, way. Any man, any young man who at the age of 789, spends most of his time interacting with a woman will lack, you know, the skill and the ability to think like a man because he has no ability. And then guess what, father comes home late at night, or maybe in the evening after nine or no, let's say 10. Eight, and then they start talking a little bit while watching TV. So yeah, there is a father here. I mean, we're not even talking about you know, single parents, basically, who, you know, single moms are raising their kids all by themselves. But like, if you look at the amount of time that this young man is going to spend with other women, that is primarily his mother and then his school, school teachers and elementary school. It's basically far more than the, you know, little time that he spent with his father. And this unfortunately, Tails this out. of balance. Because of this in the modern world, a lot of men are dealing with masculinity crisis. And this is the route people have asked like, so what is the source of masculinity crisis, the source is childhood. Now it is true that as these kids grow older, and become teenagers and go to school, eventually they will spend more time with other men. Again, unfortunate doesn't always happen. But it happens in many cases, but by then it's probably a little bit too late because these early primitive years that they've actually gone through, were spent mainly interacting with women. So they have acquired a lot of these traits on a subconscious level in their, you know, their personality, and now they lack a masculine attitude towards life, a masculine way of thinking. And because of this, we are now seeing this crisis happening. So, as we've discussed the source of this problem, basically, now it's time to find a solution. So yes, this is the reason why men in the modern age generally lack clear sense of masculinity. they acquire a lot of things feminine characteristics that are oftentimes not associated with men, and more apparently make most men miserable and unhappy. So next time you saw a young man who seemed to be extremely sensitive, or who seemed to care so much about what other people thought of him, or who seems not to have that level of confidence or assertiveness, or more importantly, if you saw a young man who was in a relationship with a woman that he's not happy with, where the woman just runs all over him, and just tells him to what this is what you do and all that stuff, I'm sure you know, such people around you the kind of men who are in relationships with women who basically are there second moms that they sleep with, which is just really, you know, unacceptable. In this situation, you are seeing the result of masculinity, basically, that is being rubbed off, erupt away from these people and are not unfortunately there. So because of this, we need to solve this issue by teaching these young men what it means to be a man and that requires many That requires them to actually spend time with other men. So, when a man is in a relationship, where he's basically controlled by his wife, let's say, what does that mean? But he's not a man. It's just very simple because our true man gets into a relationship that is winwin productive, where both sides make their voice heard, and where he plays a dominant male role. But in the modern age, when that man has grown up, and as in a society where he spends, perhaps spent most of his childhood with his mom, and then school teachers who are also female, is there any doubts that he grows up, he becomes 25 3035 gets married and then sees like, Oh, I'm so unhappy. My wife is controlling all the time, and I didn't know what to do. It's very simple. It goes back to your childhood. Now, this is of course a, you know, a serious issue. I know. And it's not just about your marriage, it about it's about almost everything else. As a man. It's about your sense of masculinity, your sense of dominance, your sense of self confidence. The kind of goals that you set for yourself, I mean, is your goal, you know, more masculine, for example, in terms of achieving things, getting results, and realizing your potentials or you have more feminine, basically goals of being approved and being light. And we're seeing a lot of these things happening these days in the modern world where people are trying, men especially are trying to act like girls. So instead of trying to be focused on their financial success, they're focused on how well they are basically liked by others. Instead of trying to focus on really developing their abilities and their skills and becoming something more they are concerned about whether people understand them or not. You see, these are all feminine qualities they've learned as a child, you know, as a child with their moms, because it is women who care a lot about being understood and appreciated. These are all feminine qualities, and men doesn't need to be understood. Amanda's needs to be appreciated, he needs to get results and that's what makes him happy. But unfortunately, a lot of men don't do that. So they are imitating the same behaviors they saw from their, you know, moms and from their, you know, Earth school children and are acting like whiskies. And that's exactly why we need to address this issue by helping these men to have male role models. And by letting them know what it means to be a man to be masculine, to have certain qualities that we consider to be masculine in nature, qualities such as goal orientation, persistence, self confidence, equality, such as independence, it's very important. Oh, I don't know. I think my, my, my best friends don't understand me, dude, please become a man. You don't need to be understood. In order to be approved. What you need is to get results. And trust me, once you get the results, you will also get the approval. But that's not what most men have been taught to do. Because there has been no man around to teach them these things. So that we know the source of this problem and this crisis, what remains to be done. Obviously, it's For us, to help these men to learn what it means to be a man. And that is why fortunately, we have nowadays a lot of mentors and a lot of programs designed exactly for this because a lot of men, they have to understand what it means to be a man. Now, Society of course, we just celebrated, you know, Father's Day, we would like to actually talk a little bit about this issue. And that is the first and most important thing that any man any young man can do is to strengthen their relationship with their father, and to learn what it means to be a man because unfortunately, most men in the modern world do not have a very close relationship with their father. In my seminars. In my workshops, I ask oftentimes, like the young man, so to which one are you closer? arguably, in most cases, most men say I am closer to my mom and my dad. This is a problem. You see, I'm very glad that you love your mother. And it's wonderful because I mean, I really believe that you know, a mother is the first love so I am Love My mother, and I'm sure that you do as well. But as a man, if you only love your mom and you spend less remember your mom, what happens? You become a mommy's boy. And that, unfortunately, is what's happened these days. So the first step that most young men could do in the modern world is to strengthen their relationship with their fathers, and to spend more time with their fathers. Now, you're saying, Well, what if I don't know my father passed away, or I have no axe to my father? No problem. The second best, basically, a way to do that is to start spending more time with other men, especially more masculine men, or mentors, who will then help you to think like a man to act like a man so spent, ask yourself, how much of my time do I spend with males and how much of my time to spend with females? If you're a guy just asked this question, how much of your time do you spend with men and how much do with women and if the number is not balanced, that is you do not spend at least as much time with men that you with women, then there is a problem. You're saying? Well, I spend most of my time with my girlfriend. But with my wife, well, I'm sorry. So you spend most of the time as a seven year old with your mom, as a 10 year old with your school teacher, and now as a 2030 year old with your wife, so you're spending most of your time with a woman. And you wonder why you lack masculinity? Well, what is what a difficult riddle to solve? It's very simple. It's the simple math dude. So what you got to do now is to spend more time with other men to balance this thing out. And to realize that, yes, I probably need to spend more time with men to learn from them. Now that again, maybe you don't have a lot of male friends right now because you've, you know, perhaps been a bit more introverted, or you have a lot of middle middle role models. Don't worry, there are a lot of great sources also available in forms of books, seminars, workshops, you can actually use to you know, learn more about these issues. If you just sit near search on Google will reveal lots and lots of resources for you actually to learn from and to study and To be able to somehow know what it means to be a man because ultimately, in the modern world, we're not taught most of us men, because this program, of course, is aimed at men. And of course, we love our ladies, I truly appreciate all of them. But this program is designed specifically just for men because of the Father's Day. And if you're a male listener, please understand that you are living amidst a crisis, which is called the masculinity crisis. A lot of your unhappiness and emotional instability is rooted not in your problems, but in the fact that you think not like a man but a woman. And guess what happens when a man thinks like a woman he will experience tremendous psychological pain and problem because he's thinking in a way that is not in alignment with his body, with his mind with his genetic code, and with his inherent instinctive desires as a man and of course, that leads to permanent. So if you are a man right now, and if you feel that you're one of the many Guys who have lacked a male role model since a young age. And don't worry, you're not alone. There are many such men out there. And what you got to do from now on, is to be able to balance this thing out, through mentorship, through studying and reading, and more importantly, by spending more time with other men, and learning from them, and imitating them, and understanding that, ultimately, a man should be a man and that's an issue that, unfortunately, has not been taught so much. Because in our totally correct world of feminism and modernity, which I am a fan of, by the way, we have then somehow gotten a little bit out of balance, and we don't understand anymore. Yes, it is true that men and women must be treated equally. They need equal rights, they have to have equal basically pay for their work. equality is what I stand for, and I support this is exactly what it is. But being equal, does not mean being the same. being equal does not mean that every man should live like a woman. And every woman should live like a man, no men should live, you know, live their lives according to certain masculine principles, which unfortunately, now our long forgotten model, especially in the Western world, because I travel a lot. Now, in certain countries, when I traveled when I work in, I see that still that, you know, male role models are still out there, and men tend to act more like men. But in the Western world, primarily, we're seeing this crisis right now. And of course, for all of those men, I'd say, start spending more time with men, get male and masculine mentors, start reading and studying and that will then allow you to hopefully get the most out of your experience. So this is all the time we have for today. Once again, I'd like to actually congratulate the you know, the Father's Day is really wonderful. And I really hope that this short talk will then inspire the men to not only spend more time with their fathers just spend more time with their numbers. One male role model that is their fathers, but to also take this issue seriously and start to invest in themselves and to know what it means to think like a real man. Thank you so much guys wish you all the best. If you have any questions, you can reach me on my website or on the social media and I'll be glad to answer all of your questions. Until then, have a good one.

One of the common divisions in our modern global societies is whether a community is resistant towards change and innovation or accepting of it. What do genetically modified food, children adopted by LGBT families, and abandoning coal mining for renewable energy have in common? They are all progressive plans that require a society that is open to new things; however, is accepting all things new necessarily the key to progress and life satisfaction? In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Dan and Poujix discuss this issue in depth and explain why the optimum approach is the moderate one that is open to new things but is still rooted in the tried and true methods of the recent past.   Episode Transcript: ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS nations, world, conservative, approach, religious, tend, generally, terms, risk, wealth, impose, life, ideas, trump, people, europe, point, principle, precaution, traditions SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Dan   Pouya LJ  00:09 Hello, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to yet another episode of beyond the present Podcast. I am as always joined here with Daniel Mulligan. How's it going down?   Dan  00:17 Edwin man, buddy, how are you going to be here with you for yet another great episode. And of course life is great. The world is gradually getting out of that crazy quarantine mood. And since you know, of course, we're now officially in summer.   00:31 So think   Dan  00:33 about the second way but for now we can actually breathe a little bit, go outside, go to the parks and even have business meetings and stuff while maintaining Of course, social distancing. So life seems a lot better now than it was like a month ago but for now we have to force remain hopeful and see what happens. The other Front Of course, we had a major protests following the death of George Floyd and the world is now expressing and condemning this action And I'm very happy about this matter of fact that this voice being heard, and all minorities around the world will now have their voice heard. So they can actually understand there's no place for racism in our modern world. And most recently, I heard that Joe Biden actually exceeded Trump in terms of his popularity. So now, as of now he's about 30%, popular, much higher than what Obama actually had a while back while Trump's dropped to 43. So basically, on the political front, on the business front, and on the social front, things seem a lot better, more positive, hopeful. And of course, it couldn't be any better right now, because now I'm feeling great. And of course, being here with you right now is just a great testament to that feeling and expression.   Pouya LJ  01:36 Appreciate that. Likewise, it's a it's a complimentary situation going on here. And yes, I think things are, again, if we don't jinx it right now, I'm not superstitious person, but you never know. So anywho. So, today's topic is not too distant from this conversation that we've been having until now. And that is about this thing called the precautionary principle. Which basically, I mean, in a nutshell, it means that if, you know you attack problems or or if you're unsure, you go with the most extreme precaution possible, and default to that status quo, essentially. And we're going to talk about the problems that can come up that actually there was a article motivating our conversation, which we're going to definitely put on the show notes people can read for themselves for their pleasure. However, we're gonna we're going to talk about that from our perspective. So what do you think about this, this principle and and what how do you look at this? Well,   Dan  02:43 I think before we actually express you know this to our audience, I think they should first know because you and I both we know what it means, but maybe our audience don't know. So right now, go ahead. First, tell our listeners a basic definition so they know what we're talking about here.   Pouya LJ  02:56 Of course, no, I definitely as I as I mentioned, so procrastinating is okay. I can actually I can bring a precise definition up here.   Dan  03:06 That's right, of course.   Pouya LJ  03:07 But in a nutshell, it means that you're, you're attacking problems from the point of view of being cautious. So okay, this is a this is the Google definition of it. The principal the distraction. Yes, the principle that the introduction of a new product or process could be also a legislature, whose ultimate effects are disputed or unknown, should be resistant. It has mainly been used to prohibit the importation of genetically modified organism and food. Well, that's not just the thing we're talking about, but   Dan  03:40 just the GMOs as well. Yeah, absolutely. It's about being prepared, you know, having precautions for anything new and strange or not tested before try and but frankly, speaking, as you already you know, gave our listeners definition. As you probably know my attitude towards life, I believe in balance. So if you want to Create a lifestyle where you are resisting and you know, somehow going against the new, then there will be no progress. There'll be no development, there'll be no innovation. And I'm against that because the world needs to move forward. And if we're not moving forward, then automatically we go backwards and take a look right now the current world, you know, affairs right now, since we did not maintain our forward movement that was actually initiated. Now we are seeing in some parts of the world and gradually going back, they're going back to the values that we escaped from in the 20th century, and are now being repeated in the 21st. And this is, this goes back, I don't know two things like, you know, not caring about the environment. And making gold for example, I don't know coal mining a particular job again, despite the fact that there's history and and there now, there are nations around the world who have abandoned this completely, there are now two nations in the opinion that do not allow, for example, coal mining anymore right now, because of this, you know, forward momentum and these future orientation obviously, that we have obviously, we need to steps on new, B. Since at the same time, if you wonder, you know, animate everything and all the time, then there will be no sense of security, there'll be no sense of control over what's happening. And that's also chaotic. And as you probably know, I'm a fan of balance in all things. And, and, of course, as I mentioned, you really have to focus on, you know, creating that balanced approach in this situation. So am I against it, you know, trying to somehow prevent the new ideas to come in through? Of course, not because we need them without those, you know, there will be no moving forward. And if we don't move forward, we will automatically by default, go backwards, at the same time to allow everything right away. Probably not. There needs to be some, you know, research some testing before, you know, these things are actually gone mainstream. So as you probably already know, my preference, of course, there is a middle ground approach and a balanced one, basically.   Pouya LJ  05:55 Yes, exactly. And, well, of course, nobody expects to you know, I plan things and go go about them hey wire without any testing or anything but there's also a degree of risk taking that needs to be because ultimately there's nothing going to be absolute especially before trial and error you need some some degree of trial and error and some degree of it you can do in lab and you know make sure okay this is clearly crazy or this idea seems to be okay we don't know for sure we need to we need to go back and try and you know small scale and then see what happens. So, ultimately lots of things that we do are basically experiments and solve some of them are you know, scientific experiments on social experiments etc. And like, this whole democracy is a really a or or even or even Marcus ideas or communism, whatever all of these are. theories. Nobody tested them as lab and prove that they 100% word. At some point, we just accept that. Okay, let's give this thing a try. That's how, as you mentioned, progress comes about. So now, let's talk about. So I think the benefits are quite clear of tests of research or, you know, making sure everything works. Well. Now, let's talk about the downsides of doing it too much. What are you thinking? What are your points of view and when this thing is overdone, then the balance goes out the window, and we're overdoing it and real over concern? And what could go wrong? If we are?   Dan  07:29 Well? That's a great question. And, of course, if you you know, take a look at the world right now, we do have certain nations that are extremely on the side of, you know, innovation and trying new things and taking those kind of risks. A clear example of that, if you just take a look, you know, the COVID-19 crisis, you saw how, for example, Sweden, decided to actually go on the experiment of testing this, and they actually did not impose any of the restrictions that almost every other country was imposing on their citizens. They allowed everything to live allowed life to basically go on as usual, with some force levels of precaution, but not so as much as the other nations. And then we had, of course, nations that went on complete lockdown. Think of like China, for example, or a few other nations who impose very strict limitations on their citizens. And of course, you can see the results. In the end, if you take a look at it. Both extreme approaches, from my point of view, were not the most successful if you were unethical, like, you know, all the results that have come so far, in terms of the rate of fatality in terms of the actual life satisfaction and economic damage. Ironically, the best nation industry or one of the best nations who truly handle this well, was neither Sweden nor United States or China, it was actually Germany, Germany came as one of the top nations in terms of how well they handle it, how their medical system actually handle the situation, how much restrictions on their people how soon they got it out, actually, Germany was on First Nations in Europe that actually opened its theaters and opened basically its cultural centers long before all the nations rationally Gradually opening their businesses. So this showed a great, you know, balanced approach to this issue. And a while Sweden did not impose any restrictions on their people. And they wanted to stick to this, you know, new liberal, basically attitude towards life, they did a lot, you know, bottom line as of today, they did suffer a higher fatality rate. And then, of course, the other members of the European Union. And of course, the US story was not caring at all, seeing what Trump did now led to the US being the number one hazard in the world. So, because of this, I'm a fan of, you know, looking at the examples, because the best way to know which approach works, we call this modeling, you know, in NLP and various basically schools of thought modeling, not the career modeling. As you know, for example, a hot girl going for a catwalk but like modeling the behavior of someone who has achieved the kind of success that you have achieved is the foundation for true success that anybody can actually replicate. And just a simple Example, when it comes to just handling the, you know, the COVID-19 crisis shows that by looking at which countries got the best results, we can then somehow repeat that behavior to get the same results. This was of course about, you know, the COVID-19 crisis. How about other areas economically, again? Well, Germany perhaps is was one of the best nations in this regard was also the best in terms of state economy and entrepreneurship, probably not one of the best in Europe, for sure, but not globally. For that we have other nations who exceed this, us being a force, mainly one of them. So the point is this in all areas of life, we have an opportunity here we can look at patterns of excellence in terms of their decisions. And if you look at those your oftentime realize most of those nations or groups that are getting the best results are opting for that, you know, basically minded approach. Why is that because both extremes will have problems. So let's go to the fundamental issue here. Whether it is to be extremely conservative and reject all new ideas. I mean, we all probably know some of these people that are select Well, I got my bias That's the only book I ever need to read for the rest of my life. So these are like great examples of those who will fall behind, many of whom are probably are Trump voters. And this is a great example of going backwards, closing your mind and not paying any attention. On the other hand, I'm also not a fan of being extremely open to every new idea, we have to experiment things. And I think gradually we have to towards them. So right now we are seeing this as in a during the same period where Trump basically is trying to impose, you know, terrorists on international business and promoting, I don't know, coal mining in the US, we are seeing basically a lot of changes in all across Europe, which is right now, as of today, I find European Union to be you know, perhaps a leader in terms of futurism, which is why I actually made, you know, my company's headquarters for Maldon enterprises, basically in, you know, the European Union and is now forced to move to Berlin, Germany, because I wanted to be a part of that formula. Because I, you know, our podcasts called Beyond the present. So you and I both you're a physicist, and we care about the future. We want things to be better than the past. We want progress. And of course, that's why I feel like you're seeing that Europe. Now, I'm not saying that the European approach towards progress isn't sort of the best approach. And there are some tips for dealing with strain as we saw, you know, in this crisis that just happened to us. I believe that when you when you look at, you know, the issue of progress, you need to accept certain degrees of risk, and not all risks will necessarily pay off. But if you're not willing to take that risk, you will automatically reject change, you will reject progress, and that's not good. So, while you should not necessarily try everything new, because by doing so, perhaps you will have to lose a lot. At the same time. Being resistant towards any change just proves your close mindedness. At the same time, of course, we discussed earlier about this matter, which is why I'm a huge fan of embracing global Islam as a means of not only fighting racism, actually appreciating what it means to be more moderates what it means to be a bit more open minded, and to not resist every change the moment we're here to actually let the voice be heard and give it some positive consideration before we decide to say yes or no to that new pattern, basically.   Pouya LJ  13:21 Yeah, absolutely. That makes a lot of sense. And Okay, so now. So I have two questions. I think their follow up, one is follow up with the other but so what makes what do you think makes a person inherently conservative or more risk risk risk taking? And if you are one or the other, and you want to hit the balance, what can you do to get there? How can you? Wow, I mean, it's really a hard hard thing to say. Because if you really have that mindset, the change is very hard for both cases, I suppose. Maybe that's rare for the risk taking kind of because he's already trying different ideas, but generally speaking, okay first, well what makes some person more risk averse or risk taker? And how can one change themselves about that?   Dan  14:11 Fantastic, great point. And the first question of course, what are the you know, the factors determining whether we are going to be more resistant towards it or more accepting of it, there are certain elements that tends to make us more conservative by default. First of course, being religion. So, if you are a religious person, therefore, you must adhere to your, to your religious principles. So, generally secular people are a lot more open minded to and they're open to new experiences, whether it is to try even like, no genetic modification than those who are religious or believer. So, religion by default, if you find nations, like the US, which is pretty religious, compared to most other, you know, developed nations, you see a higher degree of conservatism. So things like abortion, things like gay marriage seem like oh my gosh, way out at the same time where, for example, European nations are openly promoting, for example, gay couples having children. And we are seeing them in their sitcoms, where they because, of course, I tend to, you know, to improve my foreign languages, I tend to watch a lot of European shows, to practice my languages. And it seemed like in Europe, it's very common for them to demonstrate like, for example, lesbian couples where a son comes home and says, Hey, Mom, Hey, mom to two girls. And that's a family. But such a thing probably will cause a lot of taboos among the conservative Americans if that were to become a very major show, for example, right. So because of this, I believe that religion is one of those factors that tends to, you know, make a person more conservative. The other element, of course, is wealth, again, the use of also the wealthiest nation on Earth. And, unfortunately, it's not just about nations, it's about individuals as people become wealthier themselves as their net worth goes higher. I have seen among my own contacts I've seen in my own life as well as you basically as your net worth and your wealth increases over time, you generally tend to To be more conservative to because now all of a sudden, you don't want to lose your money. So you're gonna be a lot more careful to keep doing what has worked to generate more wealth. So generally among business, basically communities, those who tend to be focused on wealth, entrepreneurship, we see higher degrees of basically conservatism among those who are rather less capitalistic in nature, if you will, and more on the side of socialism. The third element, of course, is age, which is, of course, linked again to both wealth and religion. As we know, the higher the age, the likelihood that you will be wealthier or more religious. So as you get older, you tend to be a lot more conservative, because you've been around, you know, let's say a lot longer than a 19 year old or a five year old. So you tend to be a lot more grounded and rooted in your beliefs like I've seen the world and this is the way it is. So influencing somebody who is for example, I don't know 19 years old will be a lot different than somebody who was I don't know 75 right. And because of this, you need to understand that age itself. is a major factor. And finally, and perhaps most importantly, is the culture. certain cultures by nature, allow open mindedness and allow experimentation. Again, we see this mainly in Europe right now. Whereas some other cultures, or on the more traditional side, be it for example, China beat south, for example, East Asia, being the Middle East and Islamic nations, you see, of course, a lot more tendency towards, you know, accepting traditions and traditions and religions are not the same things, they tend to have a lot in common, but traditions could be quite separate could be very non religious, as we see it, for example, in China. So, these four elements of religion, wealth, age and tradition tend to make people more conservative and less open minded. Now, I'm not saying these are bad because they definitely are not examples are bound we can know that that there's nothing wrong inherently wrong with being wealthier or aging or having traditions or simply having a you know, a specific Basically religious belief, this, these are all fine and everybody's right to pursue their, you know, goals. But generally speaking, when you look at the opposite of you know the exact opposite. So, as we mentioned religion so those who are more secular, those who are generally more middle class, or upper middle class or lower class, and those who are generally on the side of basically, let's say modernity and modernism rather than tradition, of course, generally, they tend to have, let's say, higher level of openness towards new experiences and trying new things. And once you put it all together, you realize that it's best, of course, to opt for something in the middle, because nobody wants to certainly be go bankrupt, because they're trying new things all the time. And holding on to your millions and just rejecting the facts also, is not good, because in the long term, it'll actually harm the future generations. Think of those, you know, billionaires who are now denying global warming for example, they will definitely Maybe they will enjoy their you know, money but their grandchildren probably won't. And these are the facts that I think we have to consider and have to ask ourselves, where am I on this scale of religion, wealth, age? And basically, culture? Am I do I think of myself to be basically more religious or less religious? Do I think myself to be older or younger, within myself to be basically a middle class or more like the upper class? Or do I think I must be more traditional or more modern and this will then determine, of course, your initial position.   Pouya LJ  19:31 Absolutely makes a lot of sense. And so I think we're, we've covered a lot here and we're coming to the end of the show. So I want to give you the time at the end of the show to either you know, review things for for us or basically sum it up or if there's anything missing that you want to talk about, go ahead.   Dan  19:49 Very well, but before actually, I go for the, you know, the whole thing because I would like to, you know, summarize the point to yourself projects, to which guild if you will, do you belong or are you in the middle of Like, what is your own perspective here?   20:02 Yeah, I think I find myself a tad more on the risk taker side, but I am   Pouya LJ  20:10 true, we're very much towards the center. But, man, it's very   Dan  20:14 Yeah, and this exactly should be all of our goals. I mean, like right now, once you look at your goals right now, all of your goals should be mainly centered on basically this balance in the middle basically. And you of course, you have all the characteristics of being more on the right side. That is your, of course young, you tend to basically from my point of view, be more on the, let's say, open minded side more on the secondary side, you of course have that approach of, you know, embracing, embracing modernity. You're an immigrant yourself, you've moved, you've moved around the world. And obviously, you know, you are an academician and you're focused on your work and your studies. So this shows why you are a more balanced individual. And of course, the same applies to me as well because we obviously share the same beliefs here. But for those of our listeners who find themselves on the extremes of conservatism or basically open mindedness, as we just mentioned, I think the best approach is in the middle somewhere, whether you are religious or secular, whether you are older young, whether you are extremely wealthy, or just getting started, or whether you come from a, you know, very traditional background, or from a modern background, you want to find that middle because that's where the best stuff is basically. And that was exactly we talked about today projects, we talked about how we can actually understand the principles, this precautionary approach towards, you know, making decisions or embracing new things. And we discussed that there are two major approaches those who support it, those who are more on the conservative side, who tend to reject new ideas, or they are very skeptical of them. And then we have those who are embracing them all the time and without any problem. And we discussed their features. We mentioned four elements that determine whether or not you'll be on either side. And those four were of course, your age, your wealth, your basically Culture and background with traditional or modern? And of course, it comes down to your religious beliefs. Are you more religious? Or are you more secular? And once you put it all together, you realize it doesn't really matter where you come from, it doesn't matter if you go to church every Sunday, or if you perhaps, I don't know, spend most of your time, I don't know, just on the couch, enjoying a, let's say, the TV series on Netflix, and just having a good time and perhaps doing some pot every now and then what really matters is how can both sides bring themselves to that center, that sweet spot in the middle, where they do have certain beliefs that they hold to be true. But at the same time, they're always willing to reconsider their beliefs, should they prove false or wrong? And of course, that's what we are promoting here on our podcast. And, of course, our listeners will listen to that as well.   Pouya LJ  22:48 Excellent, no, that makes a lot of sense. And thank you for joining us today. As always,   Dan  22:53 my pleasure, buddy, and thank you for a great topic and great, all the great questions you asked, actually.   Pouya LJ  22:57 Oh, I appreciate it. Thank you all the time. And listeners for joining us for yet another episode. I hope you enjoyed this. Feel free to give your topics that you want us to hear us talk about or you want to, you know, as the research about because obviously not all of the topics that you might introduce, we might not be familiar with them, but we do all of our best to research and talk about them as best as we could. And until a later episode, good luck.

 Enough is enough! Those are the words shared by the masses not only in the United States but also all over the world following the unfair and unjust death of George Floyd that once again reminded us of the presence of racism in the modern world despite all the progress that we have made in all other areas of life. In this short talk Daniel will discuss why it is important to take a hard look at the issue of racism and he goes on to offer two major solutions to gradually reduce and eventually eliminate racism once and for all!    Episode Transcript: ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS racism, minority, issue, world, education, people, empathy, friends, globalism, happen, indians, communities, mistreated, understand, black, awareness, ethnicity, traveling, violence, talk SPEAKERS Dan   Dan  00:12 Hello, and welcome to yet another solo. There's no beyond the present podcast. My name is Daniel Morgan, and welcome to this episode dedicated entirely to the issue of racism. You see, unfortunately, I don't have to remind you about the damage that has been caused not only you know communities all across America but all over the world after the death of George Floyd and we are all sorry and we just can't believe the harsh reality that we are currently now dealing with. So today I would like to talk about racism from a different angle. I'm talking about how we can actually eradicate it once and for all I'm not gonna dive you know, deep into why we have racism why we have this issue, right? And because we all know, the reasons go back to our history. We all know that this is not just the first time that we've seen member of African American community has been mistreated by the police officers. And I don't know how long will this continue. But this is simply has gone on for far too long. And we are now at a point where we have to say that enough is enough. And from my point of view, what really are is currently happening right now all across the world is a new level of awareness. We are seeing that people around the world are now waking up to the harsh reality and the consequences of racism. And the death of George Floyd hopefully will teach us to look at this issue a bit differently, and more importantly, to take it very, very seriously. So as of today, we have seen people all across the world stand up to this issue, and they're expressing their anger to the governments around the world, to authorities and of course, to anyone who harbors such racist beliefs. And I believe that they are doing the right thing and I'm totally with them in this regard. But for now, for today, I would like to basically talk about a solution. I believe that we should focus less than 10% of our attention on the problem. And about 90% on the solutions. And that's what I learned from my mentors. And I would like you guys to have the same perspective. Yes, we can talk for days, for weeks and months about how horrific what happened, George Floyd was. And that's so true. And we are all very sorry to have lost another black person just because of the mistreatment of the near the police, basically, and law enforcement, but talking about the problem, will not solve it. And I'm seeing this right now all across the media, people are talking so much about why it happened, how it happened. What was what were the details of that situation, exactly. And who was to be blamed here, and we need to find justice. These are all important. And I'm pretty sure that hopefully justice will be served and the officer or the officers in charge of this situation will be punished. But the real problem, the real underlying cause. That's what nobody's talking about. Because Racism needs to be eliminated in the modern world. There is no place for racism and it is my best, deepest wish and hope that at some point we actually stop somehow paying so much attention to details and instead focus on the real underlying cause. Why is it that the world of the 20th century, we had a major, major war, the war, the Second World War, of course, caused because of a racist person who thought that Jews are out there to you know, get the world we've already seen the damage done to the world. We've already seen what that does. We've already seen what fascism and racism does to the whole world and we aren't somehow you know, turning a blind eye to other issue. There's now happening with the black people and understand this. Today's racism is not just about the black community. It is also about anyone who comes from a specific ethnicity there's thought to be inferior in some way or some force some reason it could be, you know, easy to refer to certain Jewish backgrounds could be referred to certain Muslim backgrounds, people of certain nationalities, Indians, and many other types of people who are now being harshly judged purely, because they happen to be born in a family with that specific ethnicity. And that's just, you know, beyond me. So, the horrors of the 20th century, I believe, should act as a reminding lesson for us in the 21st to change the way we look at race, not only in America, but all over the world. And that requires us to actually understand what could be done about this issue. And I personally have two solutions. I believe that racism cannot be fought, especially using force. Now, we've seen certain demonstrators are now looting, for example, or using violence. Now, personally, I'm against that why I do that we should actually express our resentment towards the authorities who've allowed these things to take place in the US and all over the world for so long. But using force and violence will not solve the problem of racism, we need to actually address this issue fundamentally. And I believe that the best way to do so is through education and globalization. So why are these two very important because unless we, you know, improve the level of awareness of the majority, we simply cannot protect the minority. You see, I repeat one more time, unless we, you know, bring into awareness, the issue of racism for the majority, we simply cannot protect the minority. And that is why education is very important. Now, I'm very happy that now in the media, almost everybody talks about this issue and it must be talked about because the voice must be heard. We have seen this happening again, and again. And again. People have you know, color they have to actually worry about their well being just because they're going to you know, do their grocery shopping. What if us, you know, a cop stops by and asks, you know, for my, let's say ID and I'm trying to grab It and the guy thinks I got a gun and they start shooting. This is just horrific to be mistreated and mistrusted. Just because you happen to be black, or you happen to be Jewish or you happen to be, I don't know, Muslim or you happen to be Indian, or whatever it is, it just makes no sense. And because of this, I believe that education is the foundation for you know, solving this issue to help others realize what damage could be caused if we do not take the necessary steps required to actually resolve the issue and to make sure it never happens again. Other than that, of course, education is about being bringing to your awareness what it means to actually be a good citizen, what it means to make a contribution to your society and what it means to actually cause harm. So by understanding our past, and studying the history of humanity to see what racism and slavery have done, basically to our past, we will then understand the consequences of an action and then we'll have the motive Just start doing something. So you're single, then this is very important I get it, we need to educate ourselves about, you know, the issue of racism. So how are we going to do that? Exactly. Of course, now you're listening my podcast, that's just the first step. But that's not enough, this very short talk is not going to change anything unless you actually use this as a stepping stone to begin, you know, improving your level of awareness about the issue of racism. There are many great works right now, basically, and after this issue. Now, a lot of you know, great books about this subject are now bestsellers, again, which is, I think, something that I personally find fascinating, because that's really what we need right now to improve the level of awareness. And why is it that the issue of race is not taught directly by the white, you know, communities, and what we can do about this matter? That's education. And more importantly, we can also improve our knowledge about law about the legalities and the various political aspects of racism and why is that still as of today, we're seeing so much discrimination. Again, this is not just about race, we're seeing the exact same thing across many other issues we're seeing, you know, people who are being mistreated just because they happen to be LGBT, or they happen to be Muslims or they happen to be Jewish or they happen to be, I don't know Indians or even in case of sexism just because they happen to be a woman. So treating someone differently just because they happen to come from a different background, or different ethnicity or even different gender or sexual orientation. All of these things are the result of a closed mind and a, you know, way of thinking that belongs to the stone age's and not the modern age. and education of course, is the key to opening our eyes and becoming more open minded. But then again, becoming open minded itself isn't enough if you lack empathy and personal reference experience of dealing with the minorities because I've had the you know, the privilege of being around the world and having different types of friends and kids. context, I happen to, you know, be friends with those who come from certain backgrounds, African Americans, for example, Jews, Muslims, Indians, of course, I do have some, you know, friends who are from the LGBT community, and I've seen firsthand their struggles. And what we can, you know, you know, talk about here is what is the right way for us to be, you know, experienced what it means to be a member of an African man community. And for us, those of us white people who do not have this, you know, chance for him to have this first hand experience, then, obviously, we need to interact with those who are, which is why the second key is globalization. I really believe that without globalization, it becomes almost impossible to truly talk about racism to truly solve the problem because if you are living in your own country all the time, and if you're just you know, hanging out with those who belong to your background, from the same community, the same background, the same religion, the same color of skin But of course, it just makes no sense for you to go out of your way to resolve the issue of racism because you don't have any experience. And once you have no experience, you're lying. What? That's right stereotypes. So African Americans, well, be careful, they might be criminal. I don't know Jews, well, there have to take the world. Muslims out there all terrorists, women, oh, you cannot trust them. LGBT Oh, they are going to destroy the value of marriage, and so on and so forth. But once you open up, and once you actually try to have many of these so called minorities in your own life as colleagues, coworkers, students, friends, let's say, neighbors, only then you can begin to realize the truth. And the truth is very simple, that we are all people and that most of our assumptions about other people that you know stem from their background from their race from the color of their skin. They are all rooted in misinformation. Which is simply not at all true. And I believe that's why we need to look at this issue very seriously. You see, we need to start to open to people from different backgrounds, that itself will build our level of empathy for those who come from the, you know, certain minority groups. And more importantly, it'll allow us to truly feel what it means to be a stranger in your own land. Just imagine, just trying to practice some empathy. Just perceive of yourself as a black person walking down the streets of whatever state or city you're walking in. And then just think about it. Anytime you see a cop, you feel that sense of fear. Oh, my gosh, another cop. They're gonna start questioning god dammit, I'm late to work and I gotta, I gotta waste my meeting because of this guy. Because Because I'm black. Just imagine what it feels like to be rushing towards work. Just because you happen to be a black person, the moment you see the cops, you can no longer rely on your plan, oh my goodness, I could just be stuck right now. And I lose another 30 minutes of my time, just because I'm black. And this issue, of course, can be resolved once we practice empathy. Once we white people put ourselves in the shoes of these black individuals or other minority groups, only then we understand what it means to suffer and to feel the pain that they are feeling, you know, feeling this issue requires empathy, not violence, violence will not solve our problem. Empathy will, violence will not solve our problem, but education will, and more importantly, the ultimate solution. And the best way to, you know, somehow find a solution to resolve this issue is to actually know what it means to you know, be a member of, you know, minorities and one of the best ways to do so actually One of the perhaps the most educational way to feel like a minority is traveling, which is why I'm so much against that, you know, the current plan that we have in our society where like, we have to work very hard until the age of what 5560. And then you're gonna start traveling, it's too late. It is too late. Because when you're traveling age of 60, again, that's great. Once I am 60, I will definitely traveling as much as I'm traveling right now, perhaps even more, but that's a little bit too late because you are now missing on the education that comes with being a foreigner in a strange land and feeling like a minority only then you realize, oh, my goodness, that's how African Americans feel when they're actually walking on the streets of Chicago. The same way I feel when I'm walking, for example, as a white man in Tanzania, or I don't know in Paris, or whatever it is. So you you feel that you develop that sense of what it means to be a minority. And then you will develop empathy for those who are real minorities in your own system. It. More importantly, it expands your perspective about life. It makes you more open minded because as you're traveling, and you realize, well, not everybody in the world is like us. Not everybody in the world has American values. Maybe they are even against some of our values, but in reality, I can appreciate them. I can understand them, I can befriend them, I can work with them, or even I can marry them. These are all the things that you will then start developing as you begin traveling. So part of that, you know, education that you want to have for yourself is being able to travel, especially outside of your own country. That's called globalism, you need to you know, feel that there are many other ways to live your life and the way you're doing right now. And by embracing globalism, it becomes almost automatic to reject racism, dogmatism, patriotism, and all the other isms that unfortunately have poisoned our society today. Cuz we are not taking the time necessary to understand what it means to be a minority. And I believe that hopefully, this, you know, major movement, the Black Lives Matter movement, hopefully will bring into awareness, not just for us, but for the whole world. What it means to care about one another what it means to actually take this issue seriously because this is not just about black people, the same people who have a negative perspective towards black communities. They harbor the same beliefs towards other minorities, towards Mormons, towards Indians towards all the others. And we need to stop that, because I myself as a supporter of globalism, and liberalism, I believe that we need to instill these liberal ways of thinking, which is why then again, we need to put aside violence and embrace education, as well as globalism to understand what it means to actually grow resolve this issue and we're all disheartened by this issue right now, and the protests are currently continuing on across the US. And I've realized that some of the countries actually they're following up with this movement as well. And that's really wonderful. Because I would like this to be heard worldwide and for this issue to be resolved, globally, and not just in the US. But ultimately, I think that what we need right now the most is empathy, education, and embracing globalism. And that I think, is my wish for all of you listeners to figure out a way to do that, how could you practice more empathy towards those who might not necessarily have you know, the widest skins out there, or from those who might not, you know, share your beliefs and you're saying, well, Danna, I'm pretty okay with it. But can you actually do you find it easy to talk to someone, work with someone cooperate with someone who does not share your beliefs? If you are religious? Could you have a good dialogue, a constructive conversation with somebody who is an atheist If you aren't atheists, can you have a friend who is a firm believer? If you are straight? Can you actually tolerate having a friend who is part of the LGBT community? And vice versa? If you are American Can you tolerate or deal with those who are supposedly, you know, the political, basically rivals of your country? Could you make friends in China? How about Russia? How about the Middle East? So ultimately, you want to figure out a way. And the way is how can I start embracing the communities all over the world as a member of the same species, we are all humans, and it just makes no sense for us to create so much disparity, and to believe in certain stories and narratives that are not founded in reality, and it's my wish to you listeners, to start embracing this attitude to Expand your horizon, become open minded and understand that it is possible To have very good and productive relationships with members of all communities, ethnicities, races, religions, or non religious and because of this, you need to practice that open mindedness. And as I mentioned earlier, you cannot change your belief through education alone, you need reference experience. And that comes not just from traveling, but by embracing globalism. And it's my wish to all the listeners that this will happen. So thank you very much for this very short cop, you know, short talk that hopefully brought into your awareness to the importance of dealing with this issue. And it is my deepest of all wishes, that the death of George Floyd will not be forgotten as just another headline, and that his death will begin a new movement that will then try to eradicate racism once and for all, not using violence, or mere protests, but by changing who we are And the way we live and embracing education and globalism, as means of fighting this disease and to curing it from our species, once and for all. Thank you much, guys. I wish you guys the very best. If you're any question please feel free to contact me on the social media or directly on my website and we'll be glad to answer all of your questions. Have a good one and take care

The latest development in the research done regarding the coronavirus has proven that the virus was not as deadly as initially thought and in the world of politics new allegations against the government of China have been made. In this short episode we bring for you the latest update on the COVID19 pandemic and how it might change the world in ways the we could initially imagine. 

Image by Barbara A Lane from Pixabay  In conversation with Deep & Govind entertaining thoughts on Fractals and the nature of reality.  Deep is a quantum Computing and UFO researcher, avid participant of Reality and CEO of ReactiveQ, VP AI UAPx. Govind has interests in computation models of cognition, using fractals to model dynamic systems, logic programming and fractals in number theory. Projects he is working on: 1. SecureDLT 2. Rabbithole 3. Legal Hackers at UofT Law This episode was recorded in March and all mentions of COVID-19 are quite irrelevant to today.   Episode Transcript and Show Notes: Download Show Notes ----more----   Episode Transcript:   SUMMARY KEYWORDS fractals, mathematics, deep, reality, predict, mandelbrot set, emerges, measurement, physics, hilbert space, similar, model, universe, question, idea, talk, multiverse, super, stock market, measure SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Govind, Deep   Pouya LJ  00:17 Okay, now we're live guys. How are you? Good. How are you? Pretty good. Pretty good. Thanks for asking. Going. Ah, we're going to go one by one. So how's it How's it going? How's life going with you? COVID   Govind  00:29 life's going good. I'm out in Washington, DC and it's been a while since we did some of these podcasts. So it's good to be back into this.   Pouya LJ  00:37 Yeah. Awesome. So yeah, it's been a long while and you have some exciting stuff later on. And in few months to that is going to be out of maybe even sooner. We'll see. Well, we'll just keep it at that. It's gonna be a secret for now. How about you day deep. How's it going?   Deep  00:52 I really good man. I'm enjoying the fact that the weather's getting better. I'm out in Toronto for the time being Yeah, I can just like the opportunity to reflect and stay indoors.   Pouya LJ  01:07 Awesome. Yeah. Well, so it's a good idea to probably stay indoors. Although it's a very nice weather. It's a little bit cold but it's very sunny here in Toronto. country I don't know. How's the weather in there? Govan in Washington?   Govind  01:21 Oh, well, it's it's better than Toronto to start, but it's also a warmer now and the trees are blooming again, because I used to thinking it's spring. So, you know, you know how weather is weather is fractal.   Pouya LJ  01:37 Now, why don't you tell us why you mentioned fractals right now.   Govind  01:41 Oh, well, because you told me Hey, let's talk about fractals in a podcast. No, I'm joking.   Pouya LJ  01:46 Well, that's actually literally why this   Govind  01:48 is what this is. But apart from that, well, weather itself is composed of many tiny micro processes that have an emergent macro phenomenon. Right, which is what weather is, the micro phenomenon is like how, how gases move with against each other. Like, like in the atmosphere and pressure differentials that happen due to various like micro conditions like, maybe something gets moved, you know, and then there's something that emerges out of it, which is which is what climate is. So that's kind of really the theme of what fractals are. fractals are something that have that are composed of many self similar pieces. So there's, there's like a large thing, like you're gonna think of it like a square like a square is self similar, because if you cut up a square into four tiny squares, you have each of those squares are just a quarter of the size of the actual square. But then you can you can extend that to something like a cube, which is like you can cut up a square a cube into like, four tinier cubes, each of which is an eighth of the size of the original cube, right? So you can also extend this to something like that. A weird funky curve, you know, like the coast of the coast of Britain, there is a factor by which you can reduce the, the size of the coast of England, and end up with some self similar replicas of the coast of England within the coast of England itself. And that's what's called the fractal dimension.   Pouya LJ  03:21 Wow. That's very interesting. And I always have been fascinated by fractals, which you basically give a broad definition of what they are and we're going to talk about them, not just them, but we'll get to a little bit depth and details of these things. Right, so so I'm going to ask deep so what deep Where was the Do you remember the first time you came across these fractals? fractals like as like, as general? Yeah. As a concept. Yes. So I would say I was in either grade eight or grade nine. Okay, you were early bloomer. I was. It was a little Whatever the leader later for me,   Deep  04:02 like, I understood the deepest mathematical aspects, but I knew what they were. I love them. So like a quick, like 10 second background, I was like a, I was a huge user of the internet, like from an early age. I'm sure both of you were to like, Haha, yeah. Yeah, that's what it seems like That's out of the question. So, um, so yeah, but I So, apart from playing a lot of runes game, I used to troll around on physics forums a lot like, around like grade seven, I got really obsessed with it. And through that, like these researches, just reading people's thoughts, eventually I came across fractals, so that was around grade eight, grade nine. It's amazing   Pouya LJ  04:43 now, for people who are like, well, what the fuck are these guys talking about? Why is it so beautiful or amazing or whatever? We're gonna just definitely put these in the show notes. Just go look at us on pictures, google it yourself, whatever is more accessible to you. But there is some beauty in these and the fact that we perceive them. As beautiful as it could actually be, has have some meaning behind it. I don't know. Have you have any of you thought about that? Why do we think of these things as kinda like beautiful or mesmerizing? Which I do and I know a lot of you do.   Govind  05:13 Well, I can start that one off because I think just the hyper fine structure and symmetries to fit is almost incomprehensible, right? There's like, no matter where you look in the in a fractal like a canonical fractal is the Mandelbrot set, which I'm sure we can include that in the show notes. If you look at it, and you stare into it, there's even some videos on YouTube of of like zooms into the Mandelbrot set. It's just no matter where you see there's just like these hyper structural patterns that are just so symmetric and so perfect that it's it's like hard to comprehend something like that can exist, right? I think I think that's what makes it seem so beautiful. In fact, well to answer your earlier question of where you encounter the fractals first and you ask the deep but I was raised as a Hindu. And my, my mom always used to draw these little pattern things out of flowers out of rice, flour, wheat flour, whatever. And this is like a big thing in Hindu culture. And I'm sure it is in other cultures too, right? Like, you just have fractals ingrained within us something that's beautiful. Yeah, you're   Pouya LJ  06:21 interesting. Actually, that's true. If you look at culturally, you can see these patterns emerging in a lot of cultures as an active components of, I don't know, symbology or whatever. Now let's get a little bit deeper. So about I don't I want to say about two years ago, or one and a half, or maybe one. Anyways, what somewhere between one or two years ago, you came to me with the notion of these fractals and you you were working on something specific and you mentioned that I'm doing this do you want to jump in we're well, deep is going to jump in as well. That's actually quite interesting. Do you want to Tell us a backstory of what that whole thing was and how you came to contact with it.   Govind  07:05 Yeah, for sure. That was the Mandelbrot set again, a little bit of foreshadowing here. And the project was to do machine learning on the on the Mandelbrot set and see if we could use something like saying you will network to learn the layers to learn the different resolutions of a Mandelbrot set and see if you can actually predict what a Mandelbrot set zoomed in is going to look like. Based on the training data. I thought that would be super fascinating just because we can that gives us more insight into something that's not really well understood in mathematics, which is fractals, right? Especially the Mandelbrot set. It's a class of functions known as iterative functions. And those produce very strange behavior. Because, well, for one, the Mandelbrot set is just composed of the root x squared plus C in the complex domain without wanting to get too technical and in the weeds, it's a pretty simple equation that generates something just so chaotic, which is a common theme in modern Mathematics and Computer Science or something very simple, like a very simple rule can create something so complex, like, infinitely complex even.   Pouya LJ  08:19 Yeah, no, that's, that's great. And then we jumped in, we started working on some aspects of this, this project, we were struggling with so many so much details that are redundant here. But for the for the, for the fun of it, we had trouble computing, large amount of basically large resolutions. So when you were trying to compute large subset of these numbers, it was becoming very time consuming. And we had a lot of those challenges which was, which was fun, very rigorous, and, and just just mentioning that as somebody who's not if you're listening and you're not familiar with these, there's like a lot of heartache and headache and never sweat goes into these things just for the appreciation part of it. But eventually, they, the beauty emerges. And that's where you're rewarded. And you're like, Ah, it's totally worth my time. And that's how I look at it at least now. Okay, so at the beginning, we, we started generating these so deep. So I'm going to go to the application a little bit. Each of you had some aspect of how you can apply us. So the question is, why do we even care, right? Why are they important? So each of you had an application in the real world for these for these patterns. Now, I'm going to start with you you had something I think in in fluid dynamics.   Deep  09:43 I yeah, that's right. So with fluid dynamics, there's actually different applications that we can use fractals for. My favorite one is more of like, it's more of a meta statement of how we can use practicals in physics in general. So not just fluid dynamics, but other times. Which is the idea of taking the very strict approach that if we're to study the universe and the physicality of the universe, then then the rules are the same no matter where you look. So it's just a matter of knowing where you are. And that fractal layer, right? The depth, that infinite recursion, knowing where you are in there is the question that we're trying to solve at any given time. So one example that will give to you is that consider the common problem of classical physics and quantum physics that are always brought up how the world when we zoom away, we aren't looking at each individual particle. It follows this classical rule, right? All these different subsets of classical physics instead. And but when you zoom in enough and you zoom into the universe's fractal real life fractal, you see that different rules apply quantum mechanics applies instead. So I like the idea When we take the fluid dynamics example of applying the fractal mentality to whatever object it is that we're modeling. So earlier, I brought up an example when we were discussing offline of the plane where different parts of the plane are experiencing different physics that we're interested in modeling at the surface layer at the boundary layer, which is the sub couple millimeters thin layer at the surface of the craft, and forms when you're at hypersonic speed. So five times the speed of sound when you're traveling at that layer or more, so it's a place where eventually air goes from very still in calm and fluids and the gases to extremely turbulent. And in doing so, you have all this chemistry that you want to predict, like how will the change in the temperature of the air here and the chemistry of the actual atmosphere affects that The let's say the paint or the heat of the craft at the surface layer. But then if you back up and you want to look at the physics of the shockwaves, which is around the craft instead, that's following slightly different physics. We're not interested in the chemistry anymore. Yet, when you take a step back further and look at the whole plane, it is just one system that we're that is just unique and unified that we're interested in. So it makes sense to apply fractal theory in that respect. Yeah.   Pouya LJ  12:32 Cool. And so Govan you have some application in cryptography, I believe.   Govind  12:40 Yeah, that's cryptography. But um, well, okay. So in the in cryptography, there's the idea of private and public key pairs. So there's the one idea that seems interesting to me, which I think has been explored in academic literature. albick not much is being able To use different uses of scale invariance properties of fractals to generate, generate a key pair where your scale for those of you that are familiar with private and public keys and encryption using those or rather unfamiliar, a public key is what is presented to the world. So you can lock up your, your data or your information that is secret or using your public key. That is your private key. And then that can be used against your public key to generate to regain that information. So think of it as like a lockbox where you lock it with one of the keys and the other key can open it again. So typically, this is done using using large prime numbers like RSA, RSA encryption, but using fractals The idea is that you can you can encode the like say one Part of the a fractal like if you're thinking of the Mandelbrot set, you can think of the big bowl of the Mandelbrot set. And you can encode information with that. And then you can transform your scale to find another one of the big bugs within the Mandelbrot set, which we know is possible, right? And then that the transformation that you used to get to that point would be your private key. Well, yeah, this is getting like pretty complicated. But now it's supposed to be easy, isn't it?   Pouya LJ  14:29 Exactly. I mean, I'm happy. First of all, I'm happy that complicated but no   Deep  14:34 easy stuff has been done. So   Pouya LJ  14:37 now, but it will also include some people who are just listening to this, we will include more details stuff in the show notes. So what Govind is basically explaining with some graphs or or explanation will make more sense to you. So continue, please.   Govind  14:52 Yeah, and I also wanted to talk about less complicated while still pretty complicated application. In which is the stock market? Well, the idea of using fat or the stock market is by no means new. In fact, Renoir Mandelbrot, the namesake of the Mandelbrot set that has been repeated ad nauseum in this podcast is, is famously, like one of the notable things he did was try to predict the fractal dimension of various indices in the stock market. This is a technique that's still used and widely studied in, in, in modern mathematical finance. Yes, that's, that's definitely a very, you know, out there application of fractals, right. You mentioned   Pouya LJ  15:39 before, briefly the fractal dimension, but can you reiterate what that is?   Govind  15:45 Yeah, for sure. So just how, if you're able to, if you take a square and you're able to cut it up into four pieces, and each of those four pieces is still a square, right? It's a square but like it's a scaled down version of a square, it's like magnified a little. It's like A quarter of the size, right? So if you, you can abstract that concept to a cube. But then you can also take that to like the jagad. Coast of the United Kingdom, right like this. This sounds like it's coming out of left field. But just Just think about it like the coast of the United Kingdom is like a bunch of squiggles, a lot of squiggles. So if you take that, and then you try to find some little tiny squiggle within that big squiggle that resembles the bigger squiggle a lot. It is basically a scaled down version of the bigger squiggle, right?   Pouya LJ  16:34 Like the smaller cubes and the bigger cube basically.   Govind  16:37 Yeah, exactly. That's the analogy, right? So we're in four squares, it's two dimensions, four cubes. It's like three dimensions. You can you can have like, weird like, like rational number dimensions, where you have like two thirds of a dimension like a 1.6 dimension. So that's the real intuition behind practice. To fully understand it is the fact that it's you're not working with like, dimensions that are easy anymore. You're working with dimensions that are just weird, completely weird, right? So how does   Pouya LJ  17:09 that non natural number perfect dimensions work like the 1.6.   Govind  17:16 So it's exactly what I what I explained earlier. So maybe in the show notes, we can include the definition of a fractal dimension, which is the number of self similar pieces within the within the curve or the object. So again, in a square, you can you can cut up a square into four pieces, and then the number of self similar pieces is four, and then you can divided by the magnification factor, which is which is a quarter.   Pouya LJ  17:41 So I see Okay, fair enough.   Govind  17:43 That's that's literally how you get it. But if you use a log, you have to use the log function. So it's log of the number of salsola pieces divided by the log of the magnification factor. If you're being precise.   Pouya LJ  17:56 Yeah, yeah, no, I got it. Okay. So so you remember So these are useful also in. So when you mentioned markets, so are you talking about predicting the markets?   Govind  18:08 Yes, exactly. To give you a little bit of an explanation of how this could work, if you see the stock market curve, maybe in the show notes, we can put the Bitcoin curve because it's, it's very easy to see these kind of self similar shapes. Okay. You can see how there's like a huge peak, and then it goes down, and then there's a huge peak again, and then it goes down. So intuitively, it is kind of self similar right there. There are these chunks where you like, again, if you think of it as a big squiggle, there's this tiny squiggle where it goes all the way up, and then it goes down. Right? It's like it's kind of like a sine wave. It's like, it's like a curve that goes in it reaches itself again. So it's kind of self similar in a sense.   Pouya LJ  18:51 Would you agree with that? No. Yeah,   Govind  18:53 yeah. So the idea is that you would use the point where it seems to match Like one of the ends of the curve, and then you can say, okay, based on my fractal model of the stock market, it looks like it's going to repeat at this point. And then you can, you know, make your investment based on that decision.   Pouya LJ  19:13 Right. And the rationale is that so, so I don't know if we discussed the model that our project is creating the machine learning model on the when we were online or offline, but did we mention it online?   Govind  19:28 I'm not quite sure actually. Okay, let's   Pouya LJ  19:30 reiterate. No, otherwise, let's go for it. Okay, so So what are we doing in our project basically.   Govind  19:38 So our project is to better understand the Mandelbrot set and how we can apply it for for use cases such as, I think the basic first step is to actually just see what happens can we actually predict layers of the Mandelbrot set right? Or is it gonna get hairy is something like is the best thing Yeah, that we have currently not able to learn the Mandelbrot set or like fractals in general.   Pouya LJ  20:06 You know, I think, what is it? Guess? If you had to take a guess Yes or no? Uh, you can you can explain why briefly by one yes or no.   Govind  20:16 My disclaimers? I'm not sure, of course. But I want to say no,   Pouya LJ  20:20 because I can't predict that's what you're saying.   Govind  20:23 Yeah, just because it's so computationally intensive. That I think there's something deeper mathematically hidden within these, these curves that simple statistics will not be able to help us get there.   Pouya LJ  20:40 Okay, what do you think the same question? Yeah,   Deep  20:43 I couldn't agree more. I think what we'll see if we're lucky is some kind of like Kwazii you know, like a five year old trying to recreate a drawing of a dinosaur like we might get something of that kind, but to truly capture the underlying mathematics or current regime of machine learning is just not there yet. Okay,   Pouya LJ  21:03 fair enough. Now,   Govind  21:05 I just want to see if I if I'm wrong. Hey, like, I think that'd be pretty cool. That in itself was a good discovery.   Pouya LJ  21:12 Yeah, no, I'm gonna be rooting for you to be wrong, honestly. So so don't worry about it. If your rock no but so as we're so basically as So, if we do train some AI that looks at these, these layers and tries to predict them and say they're successful now. Excuse me, how do we so it seems that if you're able to predict the the market, the economical market, you should be able to predict any anything else with any kind of self replication or self similarity. Would you agree with that?   Govind  21:54 Yeah, because, well, if we do predict the stock market successfully, well apart from being insane Rich, we also have predicted human behavior because that's kind of the underlying, you know, that's that's how the stock market works, right? Like, that's how economic models work.   Pouya LJ  22:10 And do you   Deep  22:13 need your to get a two for one deal? That's all I want to say. Haha.   Pouya LJ  22:17 No, actually, I was gonna ask you further. Do you have any other similar applications in your mind that is, like stop for you there or do you? I'm talking too deep actually. Okay. Do you think it has potential to go further in terms of what you can predict with these things? Do you have any examples?   Deep  22:34 Yeah, so one thing that and again, it's maybe less so about predictability, but we'll see is let's go back to quickly quantum mechanics and the fundamentals. So wait, let's so when we look at a system and we want to define the measurables of the system, what we're really saying is that this system has these kinds of measurements we can make and these are the five values that you can measure the system to be in. And that's all defined in the wave function, right? It's all encoded in there. And so you'll never, in theory, measure anything outside of that wave function. The wave function is supposed to contain everything about a system and the measurements you can make. So if you want to, but then if you dig a little bit deeper, you see that the actual definition of a measurable is that the value maps to the eigenvalue which maps to the eigenvector of the Hermitian operator, which is acting on a quantum state. So let's say that I have some sort of qubit, superposition or some sort of system, forget a qubit, any system physical system that's in a quantum superposition and I want to make a measurement on it. The way that I would define the state of that system is using Dirac notation. It would be a vector in a Hilbert space. Sometimes it's finite dimensional, sometimes infinite dimensional and there are different kinds of Can you super quickly explain what Hilbert spaces the Hilbert spaces, think of it as a generalized Euclidean space. So it's supposed to represent a more abstract vectors like complex vectors, while it also defining certain functions that the normal Euclidean space does not, I believe that includes the inner product. There's a specific kind that you can do quantum mechanics. So beyond that, the the whole idea though, is to keep that idea of conserve that concept of Euclidean spaces just at much higher dimensions, because keep in mind, we're representing quantum states in those dimensions where your, your actual vector is represented by a complex number, or it can be like your, the elements of your vector. So and so the more let's say entangled systems, you have the higher dimension, Hilbert space you're dealing with. So in the quantum computing regime, if you take, let's say, three cubits and you entangle them, then you're dealing with a Hilbert space, that's two to the three or eight dimensions large, and so on and so forth. So, so yeah. Does that make sense? So like the Hilbert space is really just a fancy Euclidean. Awesome. Great. So So and also, one thing about the Hilbert space is that it lets you using the vectors you can represent superpositions, which is insane, right? That's what we really care about. And so we so going back to the system that we haven't measured yet, it will be represented by this state function or this vector in the Hilbert space, right, let's say it's in a superposition. And the vector accurately reflects that. Then the measurements the possible values that we can measure in that system depends solely on the operator, the measurement operator that we're applying to that quantum state. So if we Apply, let's see your position operator where we want to measure the position, what it's going to do is it's going to apply that operator to the quantum state, and map all the possible states of that quantum state to the possible eigen states that consists of that operator that we just applied it to. So that's how you're able to kind of force these values, right? Of like measurement and, and all that stuff. And you know, you're constantly doing this mapping, like you either did a unitary action, which means you did disturber make a measurement to the system, or you did a measurement action. Now, why is that related to fractal theory? Like why am I rambling about the specifics because of the 10 Martini problem. And so the 10 Martini problem is looking at addressing quantum mechanics and operator logic and the spectrum of observables and all the mathematics that goes into that, right so now, rather than having a finite number of observable What happens in vivo continuous model? So what they deal with one thing that xR t looks at is the application of fractal theory applied to this, the problems that we come up with, and we find it in measurement, like quantum measurement and operator theory and operator logic.   Pouya LJ  27:19 Right. Right. And and for those who are not familiar with the martini problem, can you quickly give a gist of it?   Deep  27:27 So I'm gonna divert that to go, Vincent. All right. Yeah, he was the one who had sent it to me, but I have my own interpretation for what it's worth.   Pouya LJ  27:36 Okay, so go and give it give a brief on the paper description of what it is and then deep you can interpret all you want.   Govind  27:46 I have to confess I don't fully remember it.   Pouya LJ  27:52 So we'll put it in the show notes if you don't remember.   Deep  27:56 Yeah, yeah, yeah, we can. So all I want To say about it was that is the fact that, like, for me, it was the spectrum of the matter you I can never pronounce his name but like Matthew operator, they found that it's a cantor set for all nonzero values, right for all these, the coupling of all irrational frequencies. That's like the formal definition. What they found, and I think it's like, that's why it diverted to go in because of the whole idea of the cantor set showing up. But um, yeah, I think what we should do is, it's almost worth talking about in a different podcast, but let's just go knows for now, yeah, no,   Pouya LJ  28:39 that's good. Yeah, I don't want to, like confuse people, like a, like, you know, like, we need to be super rigorous in what we're saying. So you know, okay, so we actually do have plans to do another in depth podcast so we can mention the details of the 10 Martini problem   Deep  28:57 would be the perfect place to do it because like we're we're learning really getting into the deepest parts of like, this stuff is not   Govind  29:03 easy to talk about. And then with quantum and well, there's of course, like the whole cliche Fineman quote of nobody in quantum really knows what they're doing what quantum is. They don't understand it.   Deep  29:13 Yeah, for good reason. Like I was actually what we were talking about with like the quantum theory with free join. We'll talk about that more after but yeah, well,   Govind  29:21 one fun fact about the 10 Martini problem is the guy who came up with it. He said he'll give he'll buy 10 martinis for someone who can solve the problem.   Deep  29:31 Oh, that's amazing.   Govind  29:33 Yeah. Another fun fact is the solution was given by a fields medalists from, I think like the middle of last decade. I think somewhere on 2015 or 2012. I turn Villa and he's the one who actually discovered the fractal implication for the the problem that was you know, didn't seem to relate to fractals at all, which shows how deeply embedded fractals are. Mathematics. Yes, again, I think this this, this scan should be covered in a separate podcast just because you know, like, we don't want too many icebergs floating around here. Yeah, no,   Pouya LJ  30:09 no, I agree. And they will do that. So for now, anybody who is wondering what, what the heck this thing is just look at the show notes. You'll get the idea but Okay, now, if any, if you don't have any specific like nooks and crannies details, Oh, actually, let's before that. Do you want to talk about where the project is going in the future that what are we try aspiring to essentially so right now we're basically developing the training these models to see whether we are we are able to train them and they are able to predict rather. So what's next?   Govind  30:45 Well, we have mind a an actual fuck ton of data. I'm not kidding. Nearly one terabyte of data. That's just sitting on a drive somewhere. The next step is to actually do the machine learning, which we've already kind of kicked off, we have our general model architecture that is derived by beak over here. And we need to actually do some batch machine learning over just tons of cross sections of data. Because we have such a huge data set. I live in safe if there's anyone listening who would like to join, you know, just shoot, shoot us a message, and we'd be happy to have you on that project.   Pouya LJ  31:23 Yeah, absolutely. It's a it's a completely open. So we're looking forward to hear from different people. Yeah,   Govind  31:28 it's open source. And it's a it's a really interesting problem for for machine learning in general. It's a very cool role.   Pouya LJ  31:35 Certainly. Now, if you don't if either of you don't have any specific thing to our project and these applications, I want to abstract out and talk about fractals a little bit broadly. You have anything to add at this point? I know I'm good. Okay. No. So what I asked you these before any steps into more philosophical realm a little bit, but again, as we talked in the fractals seem to be completely available, like existing in the background of the entire universe. If you zoom in, in any specific part, you can see them when you zoom out, you can keep seeing them, again, like galaxies that they're essentially these. So, in a sense fractals themselves. But then even even if you zoom out further, you can see super close super clusters or other clusters of galaxies that again, are self similar, fractal in a sense, so why does it why in Europeans does this fractal behavior exist? It seems inherent or maybe even fundamental in the universe, or maybe it's American that actually let's talk about that. Is that religion is a fundamental Yeah.   Govind  32:50 A few years ago, I remember there was a picture floating on the Internet of something like what you said like a cluster of galaxies, and also compared with a protein picture of a protein which which has, you know, like proteins look all squiggly and weird and stuff. Yeah. And most of my friends that I like and then there was I think inevitably it was some relation to how like intelligent design and all that stuff was there, which is not the focus of what I'm trying to say is this Mr as complete bullshit, but, you know, like, that's kind of what I'm trying to get at with the deep embedded nature of fractals and everything. I think well, since in mathematics, we generally deal with a lot of spaces right like I mean Hilbert spaces an example of one there are spaces of fractals themselves, right? spaces are fractals being in the complex plane, you can you can actually create, like use iterative functions on every single point of the of the complex plane and you end up with a unique fractal for each of those points. And those points are known as Julia sets. So each of those, those those fractals are called Julia sets. And what's really interesting is if you put those As a side note, if you arrange all those Giulia sets into different points, what emerges out of that is a Mandelbrot set. And that can we can add on the show notes. That's just that's just a really wacky, cool thing in mathematics. But I think it's, it goes to that, like, I mean, there is there's this debate in mathematics of whether mathematics model is just the best approximation of nature or on the on one side of the coin. And the other side of the coin is, well, mathematics is nature. And we're just trying to understand nature better by understanding mathematics better. So it's a I think it does come down to this, this, this two sided coin and this debate that's always going back and forth. But either way, I think nature is just really well approximated by fractals, I think it's the these like, Who's to say maybe we can even come up with some kind of super fine structure that we can use to approximate every single curve that we ever see. To an infinite degree, like now we can use calculus and we can get there to, to to a similar degree, but not quite there, which I'm sure we can explore at a later conversation. But I think I think fractals might actually help us get there.   Pouya LJ  35:16 Okay, and as to the question of whether in your I mean, I know it's purely an assumption, but do you think they seem to be more emergent or fundamental at this point?   Govind  35:28 I think it's a it's emergent like, because, again, most of these things have to do with I mean, it's always like, I mean, even the definition of a fractal dimension is is the number of self similar items that are there within an item and then their magnification factor, right. So like the, you start with the most basic unit and then the fractal emerges out of it, right? You have like you start with like this super tiny self similar, like seed, and then the, the rest of the fractal emerges out of the seat by the end and the way you operate it right, the way you magnify it. And the way you arrange it. And to make that clear, think of again a square and cutting up a square into 444 pieces. And then you see a bigger square emerge out of that, right? Your unit is a square. So it's kind of like that. But yeah, you don't know. Like, as with most of these emergent phenomena, you don't know where one ends and the other begins, right? Yeah, no,   Pouya LJ  36:19 that's fair. How about you? Did you have any thoughts on the matter?   Deep  36:24 Yeah. I mean, I agree with Govan, that it's fact matter is we're we're touching the deepest, one of the deepest questions about nature, which is, is math discovered or isn't invented, right. So like, so but that being said, like I've always, not always like recently concluded that. Going back to like the definition of superposition, I really like what it says about reality. Because when something's in a superposition of, let's say, two states, it's never saying that it's in either that state or the other state or both states or neither the states, it's saying it's in a superposition. Which is, which means that we can't physically say anything about its current state in any logical manner. That makes sense. But when you measure that superposition, you might get one or the other state, depending on the probability and what kind of superposition was so. So you'll get different answers, varying answers every time you make a measurement. And I feel like that's what happens with this. Of that is what's happening with this question of the dualistic sort of divide we take with ascertaining whether the universe is mathematical or whether we invented because it might not be either or it might just be a superposition of the two. So sometimes, factor like behavior we observe in the universe is truly just emergent. Sometimes it's the other way around. Maybe that's what I think.   Pouya LJ  37:51 Fair enough. Now, I want to throw out two other concepts that we're going to talk about in detail later, but I want your feedback like a short feedback. At this point and mentioning all of these mathematics being either developed or discovered or invented or discovered now, so I'm not sure if this was Lee Smolin, but I believe it was that was talking about possibly the laws of physics and the laws of the universe being being not constant, rather not fundamental right and evolving. And I again, I'm sorry if I'm misquoting him for somebody else, but so what are your thoughts on that?   Deep  38:38 So I love that because I love that. We're still thinking about that, because it's important for you to question right, but like, okay, I would like to know if the physics, you know, right outside of the Hubble bubble completely changes, right? That's important to know. So, that being said, so I believe the term is isotropic and anisotropic. Right. So like, So when something is added to tropic just for the listeners, what that means is that when you measure it from different, it likes physical angles or just different ways it has different properties. So the measurement, the type of measurement you make affects the outcome. And whereas with isotropic no matter where you measure it, or how you measure it, you will get the same result. So, physical example is, let's say like I take a sphere, and it's a perfectly like cut, you know, Diamond sphere. And if I wanted to measure, like, let's say the diffraction at a specific point on the sphere, it's going to be the same angle wherever I go, right? So that makes that property diffraction, in this case, an isotopic property of that diamond. Whereas with and so when you look at the universe, we're constantly asking you're likely Smolin and others is the universe isotropically When you look far enough, or is it anisotropic, where we have different physics when you measure it from a different place? And I think it's inevitably the latter. Even if it's not like, in our universe where we experience different laws of physics, it has to be the case. I think that there are other laws of physics out there. Because like, the fact that we exist means almost for sure that reality has existed before. And it does, like in other ways, but again, that's just another guess.   Pouya LJ  40:31 Right? Yeah. First, how about you? What are your thoughts on this? Oh, well, it's uh,   Govind  40:40 yeah, it's, I guess it's kind of this is regarding the invention versus discovery right of mathematics.   Pouya LJ  40:47 I think we I mean, so if we tend to accept that the laws of the universe are not fixed, evolving, or rather existing completely differently in a different unit. Reverse like now, will the same math explained both of them? Or rather, you have to modify it. So that maybe speaks to if you have to modify it, or there's a different math this might speak to, it's being invented to explain something rather than discovered. Or you can say, Well, that was different law. So it's mathematics. But they're the two different maps because they're two different laws. So in that sense, I want I'm thinking about it.   Govind  41:29 Well, I think, Well, for me, the core of mathematics has always been logic and logical inference. So if a different math had a different conception of logical inference, or maybe didn't even have logic at all, I think it would really be inconceivable for me, almost literally, I don't think I'd be able to conceive of a mathematics that's not I mean, maybe you can think of it as having different rules of Like rules of truth and assigning truth assignments to statements like or assumptions right, because most, most like I mean all models in mathematics are axiomatic you know, you have set theory, which has the set theory axioms, probability theory has the probability theory axioms and then you derive the theorems from all of them, right. That that is kind of the the heart of mathematics in my opinion, at least, if we if there is a different kind of mathematics, I'm not sure what would follow, but, that aside, I think, what the purpose of mathematics is, at least for the broad case of most humans who just want to you know, find out how the world works, and manipulate it according to what we want to do. I think, any form of mathematics would, would would serve that purpose, give some kind of objective script on causality objective as objective as possible. script on how we can reliably understand and abstractly understand and manipulate how the world works.   Pouya LJ  43:07 Okay? All right, that's fair now. So I'm going to throw a different question. Now if if the laws of physics, universe do in fact, differ in different either different times, or different realms or different universes, whatever you want to call them, would you think would you say either of you in throwing it out there? The same mathematics that we have can construct similar? I'm not like my details like what you said, actually, Matt. So maybe with a different set of axioms, well, essentially with the same logic constructor, we can come up or we can   Govind  43:39 not complete care.   Pouya LJ  43:41 Exactly. Can we can we describe those set of rules with but with the same basics of mathematics as we know it today? I know it's incomplete, but I'm just talking about philosophically speaking.   Deep  43:52 Hmm. So let's look at the idea of different infinites first, because   Govind  43:58 when we're done Good one.   Deep  44:01 So, so think about the multiverse for a second. And you know how there's different kinds of infinite, right? Like from zero to infinity, and just the whole numbers, and then all the integers and all the rationals. And all that stuff in the set keeps getting bigger and bigger, right? So think back to the multiverse. We don't know what kind of infinite it is. We don't know how large that set of infinite multiverses might be. And we don't know how large the number of people, or we also obviously don't know the anthropic principle, but we also don't know the number of inhabitants or life forms that exist out there in the multiverse. And that matters, because what if the Infinity for the multiverse is larger than the infinity of sentient beings out there in the multiverse? That means that you have leftover multiverses right that aren't inhabited, then in that case, if we're going to take physics as we approach it from the measurement, Problem approach, then we have no way of saying that there even is a physics in those multiverses where there is no one to make measurement. So my answer is that we would need a different kind of math and different kind of physics to address the physics of other multiverses that don't floor   Govind  45:23 Yeah, I mean, I think it's good that we are we're at least someone who's talking about these these these questions really, because it's, it's it just gets so hard to even talk about these because you you need to be at the highest level of abstraction at so many different fields. Stephen, this is kind of an emerging field like even true multiverses right.   Deep  45:44 Yeah, it totally is, like we, I feel that this century in this Millennium general will be a millennia of probing the multiverse and empirically proving it and just going farther and farther even trying to make like portals and ways to go, you know, travel until the multiverses I think we will do that at some point. Not in our lifetime for sure. But I eventually.   Govind  46:06 Yeah, I mean, let's hope it's in our lifetime. That'd be pretty cool.   Deep  46:09 Yeah. Make it happen. Yeah.   Govind  46:12 And I hope fractals will get us there.   Deep  46:16 Totally.   Pouya LJ  46:17 Now another thing that I want to throw at you, so two things. I mean, this is again, we're coming to the end of the show. So I want to basically make it very short, but we're going to talk about it in depth later on. But that is the I think I shared the book with you. I don't know if you have the author in front of you because I am blanking on his name. But the the book that he has is the case against reality of Donald Hoffman. Hoffman. So So once again, I I didn't read the entire book yet, but based on me hearing him talk in other people's talk about his work. Now his point of view, is that okay, reality as we come to define it, however you want to define it. It's not really Really, really the deepest of the realities that you can possibly think of. And it's the it's evolutionary, with. So this is what his saying it would be evolutionary, against our interest to actually understand reality as purity, because then we couldn't function in the world as we do. So for instance, he gives the analogy of computers and let's say you're moving objects than on your desktop to different folders to the recycle bin, whatever. And now, this is not literally what is happening at the low level of the computers. But it's a good approximation for us to understand and and us to do our things in the computer. Now, what are your thoughts on that? either of you can go first, maybe?   Deep  47:47 Sure. So, first of all, like I really like the idea that he's taking the evolutionary approach of like, okay, maybe it's not even worth knowing the true nature of reality because maybe That's why we don't have like natural intuition for quantum mechanics. Right? It doesn't make sense to us. It's literally literally not logical, the way that it behaves and simplifications for sometimes. So, I wonder, though, like, and is it? It depends, but I wonder if we can like, train the next generation of, let's say, children to have a different intuition. Right. And to have a better deeper understanding of reality. Would Hoffman consider that as going against? What is in our evolutionary benefit? Right.   Pouya LJ  48:34 Yeah. Right. So based on what I understand of him, I don't want to butcher his point of view, obviously, but this is just my interpretation of what he's saying. And that is, well, maybe not in one generation. And it doesn't mean that we cannot develop tools that help us understand the nature but that's not so that's not really natural to us, but so we have to put a lot of work to actually duck deep so he's not imposing that it's always like it, like, absolutely impossible. And there's no way we ever can do this. That's not what he's saying. But he's saying maybe maybe that's the case. But I'm more optimistic. And I think we can like develop tools like we have to both science to further understand the reality like at least closer realities of the universe rather than some further approximation of them and get keep getting closer and perhaps getting to the, to the, to the thing, whatever that is, but, but I don't think he's just going to accept the training of a next generation as enough of a step. Awesome.   Deep  49:39 Yeah, that's good.   Pouya LJ  49:40 Yeah, you go and what do you what do you think about this whole   Govind  49:44 thing denying of reality, okay. So   Pouya LJ  49:48 so his book is called the case against reality in that okay, like, actually, I don't know why he names that book. As it as he did again, because I didn't read the entire book. I've mostly heard him talk about that. The book. So it's not a fair assessment, but essentially so. So do you think there is a complete like, again, going back to the analogy of the computer, so when you're moving icons on the folder, two folders and from the folders, that's way far from what is actually happening, and there's a bunch of electrons moving around, and there's nothing, you have no understanding of those electrons when you're moving into computers. So do you think we're stopped Far from it? absolute reality, if you will?   Govind  50:28 Well, I mean, this is this is a question of philosophy has been trying to address this specifically metaphysics for like, hundreds, thousands of years, right? Where we started out with, like all our ancient, like rationalist philosophy from Aristotle. And then we end up with empiricism. And then we have Khan who's like, hey, why not both, you know, I don't want to go too deep in that in that rabbit hole. But, um, well, the fact of the matter I think, a good philosopher to use for this discussion is Charles Sanders. appears you know, if you take if you take, you know, the blind spot in your right, right? Yep, like we got a spot where I think the optic nerve passes through. So it seems like there's like I mean, when you put something there just doesn't show what that what that is you can directly look at anything that's in there. Well, what happens is that your your eye kind of fills up the gap with something else like I mean, the experiment that Charles Sanders fear said is like you take a little Penny, and then you You look really you put it on a piece of paper, and you look really close at the penny until it goes into your blind spot. Your I won't even look at process depending it'll just it'll fill up the gap with the paper that's around it. So I mean, a lot of reality is just our cognition being projected onto it. But that isn't to say that we are we're, you know, we're tripping on some you know, acid reality. Completely. I think most of what our body does is to just enhance our experience and make sure that we're always alive and aware of what's going on. I'm making an evolutionary argument, I guess, in this case, yeah. But to say that we're separated to such an extreme degree from the actual objective reality seems a bit of a stretch to me.   Pouya LJ  52:24 Mm hmm. Okay, cool. We discussed this definitely further. Because again, it's a whole topic on its own. We can separate these. I just wanted to throw them out there because they're quite related in this in this realm. What we're talking about all of them can come together, essentially. Yeah. So thanks, guys. This was awesome. We are going to definitely deep dig deep in all of these subjects that we talked about 10 Martini problem and what do you got these two that I recently introduced and basically bring everything together at some point. If you have any final words, go for it. Otherwise, I think we can adjourn here.   Govind  53:00 Well, I'll say that I'm, I'm very excited for the fractal project, and to see what kind of models we can come up with, and we'll be sure to keep you guys posted on what we make of it.   Pouya LJ  53:13 Awesome, YouTube.   Deep  53:15 I just want to make one final comment. And also Yeah, I echo Goldman's thoughts. I think this project is going to be super cool. It's going to reveal a lot of things about reality that we all care about. But speaking of reality, my final thought was that we definitely need to get better with and we'll talk about it more next time. But, um, so one of the best philosophers of all time and especially of the 20th century, who's also logician his name was Ludwig Wittgenstein. He had a bunch of he made a couple of breakthroughs in philosophy and logic, and one of the ones that he did in philosophy, like the general idea, came down to him showing debunking the use of language and how we don't use it properly. And even when we do, it still isn't good enough in the way that we use it for what we are trying to approach and accomplish and tackle. So he like really emphasized the use of language. And when it comes to the idea of reality and objective reality and how far we are, we definitely need to agree on definitions better and have super precise, rigorous, you know, wide varying definitions of reality and just super nuanced looks on what we mean when we say that.   Pouya LJ  54:32 I couldn't agree more. That was actually well said and awesome. Alright guys, thank you   Deep  54:37 for the awesome chat, by the way, very engaging.   Pouya LJ  54:39 Thank you. Yeah, definitely. I always enjoy having a chat with you too. It's amazing, either online or offline doesn't matter. I hope our listeners will enjoy again we picked this up later with more depth and until later episode, have a good day.

  Your behavior in a personal or professional relationship ought not to always remain the same and implementing a reward and punishment mechanism is the basis of relationship management at home and at work. In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Dan and Poujix discuss this aspect of relationship management and describe in detail the three stages of polite confrontation, warning, and punishment in a relationship and offer all the options that should be exhausted before one has to end a personal or professional relationship. If you want to know when to reward and when to punish your staff, business partner, or significant other then this program is right up your alley! 

From Napoleon Hill to Robert Greene many mentors have recommended opting for focused pursuit of our skills in one or few areas that we are excellent at by calling them specialized knowledge and mastery respectively. Yet, taking the path of mastery seems quite old fashioned in the modern age when google can do almost anything for us. However, this could not be any further from the truth! Winning the future in any career or profession requires competing not only with other human players in that field but also with artificial intelligence and robotics that are being rapidly developed to put the majority of average performers in almost all fields out of job, from business and finance to medicine and healthcare and even in arts and humanities! However, committing to developing mastery level skills in your chosen field makes you immune against being outperformed by others or replaced by technologies. In this short talk Daniel will tell you why it is important to commit to excellence, how you can become a master in your field, and how you can make changes to your social circle so that mastery can be maintained and developed.

  There is no denying the damage caused by the coronavirus pandemic and any single one of the deaths caused by this incident is one too many. However, just like the lives lost on September 11th 2001 led to the operation Iraqi Freedom and the formation of a new world order, Covid19 has been used by world leaders in a manner that has undermined liberalism, human rights, and privacy of people all over the world. In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel and Pouya discuss how world leaders have gained an upper edge over the people they are elected to serve by being given the right to lock down entire cities, enrich their facial recognition databases to recognize people even while wearing masks, monitor the movements of citizens, use smartphones to openly track their movements 24/7, and above all show complete disregard for free enterprise and entrepreneurship. Suddenly an overly exaggerated virus has made it seem normal or even legitimate for modern governments in the developed world to undermine liberty, a value that the entire modern civilized world is founded upon. Make sure not to miss out on this episode to find out how the pandemic could have been managed differently!  

Steve Joordens is a professor of psychology at University of Toronto and chief science officer at Cogneeto Inc. and the instructor of the free Coursera course titled "Mind Control: Managing Your Mental Health During COVID-19". His research interest includes but not limited to Consciousness, memory, attention. In this episode of BTP we bring to you our conversation with Professor Steve Joordens regarding mental health during COVID-19 pandemic, its implications as well as ways to manage it. This conversation does not, by any means, exhaust the material in the course and you are encouraged to take part in this free course on Coursera. Coursera course: https://www.coursera.org/learn/manage-health-covid-19 Website: https://stevejoordens.ca/ Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/stevejoordens Show Notes 00:21:00 - Leon Festinger: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leon_Festinger

  Steve Joordens is a professor of psychology at University of Toronto and chief science officer at Cogneeto Inc. and the instructor of the free Coursera course titled "Mind Control: Managing Your Mental Health During COVID-19". His research interest includes but not limited to Consciousness, memory, attention. In this episode of BTP we bring to you our conversation with Professor Steve Joordens regarding mental health during COVID-19 pandemic, its implications as well as ways to manage it. This conversation does not, by any means, exhaust the material in the course and you are encouraged to take part in this free course on Coursera. Coursera course: https://www.coursera.org/learn/manage-health-covid-19 Website: https://stevejoordens.ca/ Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/stevejoordens Show Notes 00:21:00 - Leon Festinger: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leon_Festinger   Episode Transcript: ----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS people, anxiety, learn, feel, extreme, fight, body, talk, virus, pandemic, day, mind, isolation, control, flee, understand, strategies, world, person, anxious SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Prof. Joordens   Pouya LJ  00:17 Hello, Professor Jordans. How are you?   Prof. Joordens  00:19 Good, good. Nice to be with you.   Pouya LJ  00:20 Thank you. You too. Thank you for taking your time and joining us here today.   Prof. Joordens  00:24 Yeah, no, it's fun. I look forward to it.   Pouya LJ  00:26 This will be good. Awesome. Now this whole COVID-19 is grand, taking everybody away from different aspects. Now obviously a lot of people are concerning about the physical aspect of the health. You know, getting dividers not getting the virus is quite definitely quite lethal for a lot of people, which is unfortunate. But I've been always quiet for a long time I've been thinking about this from the aspect of mental also health as well, which you're an expert here and yeah, I mean, it I this is my perspective, this is me thinking out loud, basically. But I always feel like, as unfortunate as this whole thing is, eventually we'll for a matter of months, whatever, eventually it will find its own equilibrium, whatever that is. But I'm worried that the mental aspect of this will outlast the pandemic itself. And, yeah, I can transcend that time. And also, you will have a potentially individual, obviously, but potentially societal, and, you know, maybe world impact, and later on how we are going to think about things.   Prof. Joordens  01:32 Let me stick a hint of optimism in there. So So, you know, yes, I think that these are extremely challenging times. Psychologically, the the optimism, I'm all about silver linings these days where the optimism is, you know, if you're not anxious right now, you're not paying attention really. So mental health is no longer or mental unease, let's say is no longer just something certain people experience we are all very anxious. So the potential silver lining is that We actually take the time now we have the time to learn what this anxiety response is, and to learn some relatively simple coping strategies for dealing with it so that, you know, maybe that lingering effect is a bunch of people who have now a better ability to kind of take control of their mind and, and be driving their psychology a little bit. So that, you know, that's the hopeful side of that opportunity.   Pouya LJ  02:26 Yeah, well, so the lines are great. I think they're great. We need the switch is we do. Alright, so let's get started with Okay, so why do you think from your perspective, that this COVID-19 has has been more disruptive than previous pandemics in our recent history?   Prof. Joordens  02:43 Yeah, I mean, it really is amazing. And it honestly took me a while to kind of understand why so many leaders were willing to take such extreme steps at a time when it was, you know, admittedly a little ambiguous what the right thing to do was and so totally shut down. The economy seemed really extreme. However, you know, once we kind of understood at some point that this pandemic, unlike others had the ability to completely overwhelm healthcare services. And as many people say, that would have taken down the economy anyway. So if we had just sort of allowed it to go, but the funny thing is, psychologically, it's not funny. The odd thing is the the prescription that we all are being asked to take, you know, the isolation really goes against our primary coping strategy, which is, you know, when we suffer anxiety or stress or grief or anything like that we reach out to other human beings and emotionally connect with them. You know, the, the strongest version of that would be a hug, reaching out to hug someone. My dog is upset by some animal.   03:52 Welcome to the new world. So, you know, oh, it's a squirrel. Yes.   Prof. Joordens  03:59 She's loving So yeah, that I'm completely confused now what was?   Pouya LJ  04:06 Actually I lost the two. I think you were talking? Yeah, yeah. I think you were talking about the economy after that. Oh, yeah.   Prof. Joordens  04:18 So So, yeah, I mean, I take issue with the term social distancing, because that's not what we need. Right now. We need physical distancing. It's the disease travels through space, not through our social networks. And so, in fact, we need to come socially together. But I think that is what's made this such a difficult thing for us is, you know, we're saying people are saying, here's what you have to do. And by the way, what you have to do will deprive you of your primary way of coping with what we're telling you to do. And so I think we all now have to And literally, I'm pretty heavy on this where we have to learn how to control our anxiety, because if we allow it to continue for too long, there's a lot of great work by Hon. So years ago, for chronic stress or chronic activation of this fight or flight system, which is what it is, it eventually wears down our immune system. So if we allow the anxiety to just rule, we will eventually become compromised and our immune system and and therefore wide open to catching the virus ourselves. So, so you know, we really have to take the time now. And the good news is, it's not that complex a system, and it's not that hard to learn to control it. And there's certainly no, you know, Freudian Voodoo involved, what we're talking about is physiology, it really comes down to our basic physiology and being able to control it much like, you know, a guru, although they're, they're more extreme, but we hear the stories of a guru who could slow their heart rate down to the point where they're almost seemed like they're, they're dead, you know, using the mind to control the physiology of the body. That's an extreme case, they spend years learning how to do that, but a much less extreme case can be learned much more quickly.   Pouya LJ  05:58 Okay, and so What do you think is the primary reason for this whole psychological toll we're experiencing?   Prof. Joordens  06:05 Yeah, well, let let me give you just a taste of the the, what the system is supposed to do. And then we'll talk about why this is so nasty. So it's really meant, you know, most of the time our bodies are in this what we call parasympathetic mode, which, which is when the body focuses on things like digestion, getting nutrients out of food, separating the waste delivering the nutrients to the body, kind of like maintenance on our on our body. But let's say a predator, suddenly, you know, jumps out of a bush, our bodies can go into the sympathetic mode, and when it goes into the sympathetic mode, digestion stops, and the body is prepared to either fight or flee. So we breathe faster, our heart beats faster, that's getting blood all through our body, it's delivering oxygen to our muscles, it's making us very strong, but it's also giving us that sort of energy. And the idea is we're supposed to use that energy to either fight this predator or get the heck away from it. Either way. Whatever happens is usually over in like 10 minutes. And when it's over, then the system can relax again. The problem is the predator nowadays is COVID. We don't even really understand what it is we know it's very dangerous. We don't know how long it's going to be around, and it ain't going nowhere. And so we can't flee. It seems impossible to flee. It's unclear how to fight it. But I think we are part of my advices we have to realize that some of the things we're doing is fighting it, we have to tell our body because this fight or flee system kind of comes up with this imperative do something. It's like we're driven, we have to do something. And so one of the parts of the psychological well being is is convincing yourself you are doing some things that certain things like staying home is actually a very powerful way to have an effect here. But yeah, that's the feeling. So that's what we all have is this chronically engaged fight or flee system and it's expensive. bad because of all the ambiguity, you know, we'll hear it's going to be over and if the worst is two weeks from now, and then a little while later you hear well, we could be doing this till you know 2022 so this is ambiguous stuff that our brain does not like, our brain likes to predict the future and it can't right now.   Pouya LJ  08:20 Like Yeah, and the fact that the active fight thing that that we can do is to remain passive kind of Yeah, yes, kind of paradox that we don't appreciate, I guess.   Prof. Joordens  08:29 It is and I actually highlight when it when I talk about you know, how family should talk to children. I think it's very important to you know, not say the following do not say, you know, we're hiding it at home because there's this evil virus and we don't want to catch it. It sounds sort of like a hiding away thing. Instead, it's much better to say to children, you know, you are not at risk, probably heartland at all. And even we, the parents are probably not at that much risk. But there's all these other people in the community that are and there are these healthcare workers that are on the front lines that are working really hard. And so what we're doing here by staying home is is sort of actively doing our part to keep the viruses small, kind of like we're all fighting to keep the sucker as small as we can keep it. And people do have to play that mental trick because this as you said, it feels passive. But you have to convince students this is active, the more active you can make it, the better. By the way, I also suggest things like, if you have a young family, and if you know somebody who's older, who maybe alone, and maybe isn't very tech savvy, if you could adopt a person or two, and just commit to calling them every day, and tell your kids you know, we're doing this for these people, they need some social support, they need to know we care. So we're going to do this that feels more active. And you can tell the kid you know, this is part of how we are fighting the virus as well. So yeah, if you can come up with active things that feel like you're doing something because that's what your body is screaming, do something. If you feel like some way to do that, then that's very powerful. Hmm,   Pouya LJ  10:00 interesting. Good to know. And now there's the all of this raises the question, is there any direct, indirect, some sort of link between how deadly this pandemic is? And how, how much panic people get? And like? Yeah, so nearly otherwise? Yeah, I'm sorry.   Prof. Joordens  10:17 Yeah, no, absolutely. So one interesting, I'm going to pick on a word you said, because I think it's an interesting word. That's something I'm thinking about quite a bit, which is panic. We actually haven't seen you know, it's, we can talk about how horrible this isn't. It is horrible. From a psychologists point of view. I'm amazed at how compliant people are and have been, you know, we see these people who aren't physically distancing and they annoy us and they should, but they're actually a minority. The vast majority of people have have agreed to this, you know, extreme extreme change in their whole life, lack of finances, in some cases, you know, losing their their money. And so by and large, the lack of panic is impressive. Other than toilet paper, and We haven't seen a whole lot happening. But it's something we have to keep our eyes on again. And you know, when I look at the whole world, I heard a story, I can't remember where it was, there was some place where there was a riot in response to the government telling people to stay home. And I think it only happened a little bit, and it fizzled out. But yeah, so so we're not seeing that. But, you know, I think with respect to the, the chance of death, I worry about older people in that regard, that that people who are younger and relatively healthy, don't feel a fear that they are personally going to be impacted. But if you're 70, or 80, right now, I mean, it's another level, it's a whole, like know that. Most of us will say, we don't want to catch it, because we'd hate to give it to somebody else or something like that. We're not so worried about ourselves, but if you're 70 or 80, and you catch it, that could be it. And so for them, the the threat is far more real, far more of a mortal threat. And so there's is a chance that that could really psychologically be, you know, a harder stone to carry for a lot of older folks, and they may be the hardest ones to reach through social connections and other things, too. So, I am concerned about about a lot of older folks for that reason.   Pouya LJ  12:17 And do you so specifically to those people? Do you have anything specific that you are otherwise to, like you mentioned that younger people can call them that's good. But specifically, if you're just talking to that group of people, is there anything you wouldn't want to say to them,   Prof. Joordens  12:31 I mean, I would say don't be shy on your side to call other people. You know, if you have a little if you're like most older people, you probably got a bunch of numbers written in a in some sort of flip thing or whatever. Go through the numbers at different days, pick two or three people and and maybe old friends and maybe people your age who may be in your situation. If you can get a sort of buddy group going where you just agree. You know, you're going to touch base with each other now and then through the day that can Really kind of give some of these people something to think about something to look forward to. And it can make them feel less alone while they're alone. So those social connections are great. The other thing I would say for these people and I say this, in the course I have about managing anxiety, I talked about strategies. And one of the things I claim is you have to get away from the anxiety you can't, you can't just have running away all the time. And there are easy ways to get away you can distract your mind. And for an older group like that, especially if you have somebody in your family maybe that's like that, find the music that was, you know, popular when they were in their 20s you know, somewhere from 16 to 26 or something, if you can figure out what music you might not have heard of any of this stuff, but you play that music for them, create a little playlist do what you can to get that music into their environment. It will transform them, it will make them smile, it will make them sing, and those are all positive. They release things into the body. endorphins that are that are fighting the anxiety response. And so those people need a break from the anxiety and music is just all powerful in that regard. And if you can find the right music, the music they know and that they haven't heard for years, that will light them up. And so that's just one little strategy, I would toss it there.   Pouya LJ  14:17 Okay, that's actually great. I never would have thought of it. Now, you mentioned that sometimes we need to get away from it and distract ourselves. Now that brings me to my next question, actually. Is news helping us like is it making it worse? And if so, should we stop or limit? I mean, I guess to a degree, you can't stop because you have to know what you should comply with and not. But should we limit our exposure to news media and others? Yeah,   Prof. Joordens  14:41 absolutely. So that's exactly when we talk about the simple strategies. What ends up in your mind gets there two ways, either internal thoughts, something internal pushes something into your mind or the world, you know, bring something to us. And so we can use the world to change our mind, so to speak, so So yeah, if we look at, I guess, the negative side, so the news I would put on the negative side, and it's a fascinating thing at a time like this, because there's so much uncertainty, we become information addicts. And I mean that in the in the same way you're addicted to your smartphone, if something delivers you rewards on a sort of random basis. And so you know, somebody just shared your post, which makes you feel good. And so that's great, you put the phone down, but somebody might share it immediately right after you put the phone down. So maybe you better check to make sure somebody hasn't just shared it again. And if you never know when that's going to come you keep checking in Yeah. And so now we have, we want information, we want to know what's going on. And the news delivers us that information. And so we will have this natural tendency to want to keep checking and keep checking and keep checking like our phones. But every time you look at the news, your brain is getting this message you are under threat. There is this nasty thing out there. And so it's feeding the anxiety and is getting you anxious. So but as you say you want that information, so what do you do you budget. What I claim is, you know, maybe a couple times a day, you actually budget times in your day where you say, Okay, I'm going to consume the news at that time. But do things like if you have any news apps on your phone, turn off those notifications, like don't let the news control you and get you, you know, control your mind, you say, Okay, I am going to allow you into my mind for a while. I then claim once you're done watching the news, you should use what I'm now calling a sort of cognitive palate cleanser, kind of like when you eat some food, and then you will eat something neutral to kind of get that taste out of your mouth. After you watch the news plan to watch something else that will engage your mind and that'll be different for all of us. But But if there's something that you watch on TV or something that you know, playing a video game or whatever, if it pulls your mind away from anxiety, learn what those things are, you know, pay attention to those that whole when I was like, for me, it's Garage Band and playing with, you know, musical stuff in the basement. When I'm doing that everything else goes away. And so if you learn those things, those things become powerful leavers. For you watch the news, do one of those so that you know, you let your head go there, but then you pull your head back away from that. So that kind of thing can be how, you know, when I talked about living in isolation, that's the sort of trick is that's budget your day, schedule your day, and and put in good stuff along with the anxiety stuff because we're not going to get rid of the anxiety when the goal is to manage it, not to lose it, you'll   Pouya LJ  17:27 never lose it. Okay, fair enough. Now, we mentioned the old people like, age groups aside, are there any types of people that are more susceptible to being more struggling with this?   Prof. Joordens  17:38 Yeah, so I get asked this question a lot. And I mean, the truth, the absolutely 100% truth is, we've not done any psychology experiment, anything like this. You know, when when we look at isolation, we look at things like solitary confinement in prison, which is very different than what we're all dealing with. We'll also look at social isolation, so people who have trouble you know, being played heard of any group and we know what that does. But this kind of isolation is something brand new. And so I get asked by reporters if people are already anxious or depressed, or if they have, you know, issues, are they going to be double hit? And I don't know, I've, I've asked some people that I know. And there are some surprising anecdotes the other way where, you know, one of the things I was told by somebody is I'm not alone anymore. I felt like I was the only one suffering for this anxiety thing. And now I have all these friends who understand how I feel. So from one perspective, that was good, and I heard from another person that, you know, they are they had already learned some of these coping strategies as part of managing their own mental health. And so now they felt like they were kind of equipped and that there's all these other sort of naive people who suddenly are discovering what anxiety feels like and don't know how to manage it. So it's possible that some of them are better equipped and that it's not hitting them, you know, double hard as we might think. But we're not seeing you know, nobody's collecting a lot of good data right now, which is probably a shame. Probably would be good be collecting some good data. So I don't know if we know, we know things like abuse is up, you know, a lot of that kind of, so there's stresses that come with being stuck in a place with a person that may exacerbate any anxiety or depression, but I don't know if the isolation itself. Yeah, we just don't know.   Pouya LJ  19:25 Okay, fair enough. Now, that's good. That's good. Actually, I admire that. And that's one of the things I admire in science. We don't know we just say we don't know. We don't know figure it out soon, hopefully. But yeah, I do the hand as you mentioned, there, bunch of people like group maybe minority that really don't take this seriously. And another question arises, why is that and is it just because they don't believe in danger? Or do you think they're immune? And is it as bad as before?   Prof. Joordens  19:50 So there's, there's some psychology we can bring to bear on that which is, which is kind of interesting. And the first thing I want to I want to sort of throw out there is I think for some for some People it is sort of a macho thing and I can't wrap my head around that to be honest. Like I think of our hurricanes bearing down and you see those people who are out in the beach even though hurricanes coming down. That's kind of okay, I guess because it's you're risking your own life. And if you want to be an idiot and risk your own life, that's that's one thing. But the problem here is, you know, I really think of this virus as a monster that's, that's growing, that the healthcare community is trying to fight but if it grows too big, they're not going to be able to fight it. And so most of us are doing our best to try to keep the monster small, where these people are feeding the monster and they're feeding the monster themselves, their families, their friends, families, and I almost think they need an image like this. I'm a big fan of you know, rational argument doesn't work sometimes with people but just depicting them as the person feeding the virus and making it bigger while the healthcare people are getting you know, attacked by it. That's how they should should think of it. So why you know, don't they get there, there's a there's a really funny set of a Psychology experiments that were started by someone called Leon Festinger, and it's come to be known as cognitive dissonance. But the first the story of his first study is a good one. I like it. He was doing his daily thing. I think it was in New York. And there was somebody who was gaining some prominence who claim that the world was ending. She knew this because she was in contact with aliens, she would go into a trance, and the aliens would speak to her and she would write with her non dominant hand stuff and whatever she wrote that that came from the aliens. And so the aliens basically said the world was coming to an end, they gave an exact date. But of course, they were going to bring a spaceship down and save a few people who followed her. And so a bunch of people did this is what Leon Festinger was kind of interested in a bunch of people sold all their stuff, and you know, went to hang out with her and waited for this date. And Leon, being a good psychologist said, wonder what they're gonna think about the day after. I want to talk so he figured out who these people were and he made a point They after the world ended to go seek them out. And the question was, would they all say, Oh, I was an idiot. So let's imagine, you know, the people who said, Oh, it's not going to be that bad, this pandemic isn't gonna be that bad. You're all overreacting. What you found when you talk to these people is that they after they did not think they were idiots, they in fact, felt like something had gone wrong. Of course, the person was now in touch with aliens and aliens had postponed the date or something wouldn't have. But they were very willing to believe all of this stuff. They were very unwilling to accept that their original position was a stupid one. Humans don't like telling ourselves we're stupid and will twist the facts and will twist all sorts of things to do that. And so I think for a lot of people, you know, back when we were talking about how extreme that that choice was to shut down the economy. There's a lot of people that were obviously very personally affected by that. And who probably felt that was just too extreme that it was too extreme. For the For the actual danger. Now, of course, since then we've seen like New York healthcare system, basically almost on its knees. And so the vast majority of us who had any doubt about that are now on the side that I guess it wasn't too extreme. I guess it wasn't necessary. But if you were loud and vocal early in the days, if you were someone who said, you guys are all idiots, this is too extreme, blah, blah, blah. Humans have a hard time walking away from that, once they take a position. They have a hard time flipping it. So I think some of these people are, are still kind of hanging on to that notion that no, it's not really that bad. And you are still all being too dramatic about this. But I don't know. I mean, as they do that they're feeding the monster. So So to me, it's almost that's why rational thought like trying to speak to these people, rationally. Sometimes it's hard because they'll they'll listen to what they want confirmation bias and they'll hold on to the things that fit. And that's where I think a good image can go a long way. A good little graphic or cartoon that kind of says, You This new this slimy guy in the head. You want to be up to you your goal,   Pouya LJ  24:06 maybe maybe knocks them out? Who knows? Yeah. Now I had a friend of mine actually heard about this conversation that I'm going to have with you and asked this question that I want to ask on his behalf? And is there such thing such a thing as types of anxiety? And if so, is it important in this scenario? Or is it just anxiety?   Prof. Joordens  24:22 Well, I mean, there's that basic anxiety response that I talked about, which is basically just the fight or flight reaction. There are people. So right now this is being triggered by a real threat. So So in fact, this is a very natural reaction. For us all to have. It's just not good when it's extended, as I talked about, in the pre COVID world, other you know, people who suffered from anxiety issues, there would be triggers and the triggers could be very different. For a lot of people, for example, what we can all relate this on the small scale, if you've ever had the network, there's there's what we call social anxiety. Right? You know, if You ever had to go and talk to a bunch of people you don't know and try to represent yourself? Well, in a networking kind of event, any of us find that stressful, we all find that anxiety, anxiety provoking, we can learn strategies, and we can figure out how to do it, we can see the value in doing it. You know, for some people that can happen when it's one other person they have to talk to, and not a roomful of strangers, so it can be any there, they can start to think. I'm going to say something stupid, I'm gonna make a fool of myself, this person isn't gonna like me. And so they can start worrying, you know, before they even open their mouth before they even have a conversation, they can start having these negative thoughts about consequences that can happen and that could make them literally fearful and invoke that so depending on who you are different things. It's the same basic response, but but it can sort of play out in very different contexts. Here's another funny example. I'll throw just to, you know, give the sense of the importance of thinking as we go. So UT Scarborough, we're, you know, our home. One of the things they do At the exam time, that I find kind of humorous, knowing how multicultural UT Scarborough is they have a room full of puppies. And there, the idea is, while you're all stressed out for exams, you know, this would be a great go hang out with the dogs and puppies, and this will make you feel better. And I think Well, yeah, for some students, that's the most terrifying idea in the world to go walk into a room full of dogs and puppies. So you know, it's not the dogs or puppies. It's the way you think about them and the thoughts they put. So if you think they're all cute, and that's putting you into one state, if you think they're potentially dangerous, and you know, and could bite you at any moment that's putting you into the other state. So it's really about the sort of thoughts that come along with these activities. And if those thoughts trigger, our amygdala, which is like our spider senses, the thing that centers senses potential danger, then we go into that fight or flee response. In an extreme case, by the way, let's mention this one other situation. There's They call the panic attack. And a panic attack is sort of a different kind of anxiety in the sense of, it's kind of that amygdala, that spider sense going off for no reason. So some people, it's just a little too sensitive. And so it's like your brain senses danger. And it's telling you, you're in danger. And you're looking around and you don't see the source of the danger. You're not sure why your your body is readying you to fight or flee. That can be double terrifying, because now you don't know where to run away from you don't know where the danger is. And so some people in those situations really it can, it can sort of cycle and they can get really, really, really scared. And, you know, imagine you're on a subway train, so to speak, and this starts happening. When those train doors open, somebody with a panic attack, which is both out of the train, both out of the train station go out in the road somewhere and we just be sort of running to get away from something. And that's a very sort of extreme version. Those those people feel like they're going to die. They literally have this sense that I'm about to die. And I don't know why. So that's that's kind of a special form. It's still the same basic mechanism. But when you can't find the danger, it's almost worse.   Pouya LJ  28:12 Now, have you do do you think it will relate to the situation? In a sense that okay, we know what it is, but I don't know. Like, you know, yeah, I can't see it. Yeah. Is that is that something that might happen to people? I've heard   Prof. Joordens  28:24 of all of this uncertainty, yes, that you can't see it. And by the way, there's a really weird almost getting back to your psychological impacts thing where we're starting to we're starting to have a disgust reaction towards other human beings,   Pouya LJ  28:38 which is yes.   Prof. Joordens  28:40 That's all you know, I'll be walking my dog. And if someone and the paths are only so wide, and and if somebody I just see somebody coming, just the fact that somebody is coming my way, makes me know. It's like, it's like suddenly humans are being, you know, this source of distrust and disgust and potentially dirty, maybe carrying the Maybe not. And I don't know how that will play out, like how we're how we're going to carry on with that afterwards. Yeah, it's a weird, fascinating world.   Pouya LJ  29:12 I heard different things about this actually. So like in terms of predictions, yeah. Not from experts, but random people and hypothesizing and some people were like, yeah, this is gonna be devastating. People are gonna hate people for a long time. And then other people are like, no, people are gonna be wanting to hug people. This is   Prof. Joordens  29:29 I'm on both sides of that too. I said to my wife last night that one of the things that I thought might be fun for some people to start doing is planning what i what i call Liberty day, you know, when the day when we're all free of all these restrictions, and you can imagine a big celebration of some sort, you know, think Raptors parade but but bigger. At some level. We're all free. But that is the interesting question. So if you had let's say, we took Toronto Island and we made it into this Party Central. Would people come with the idea of being shoulder to shoulder with a bunch of people, you know, even on a ferry or wherever, yeah. Are we mentally able to do that? Right? How long will it take for that? to come back? I've heard some people talk about the economy. And I wonder if it's similar where they say, you know, you're not just going to turn flip a switch and the economy is going to be back what it was that businesses will have died, there will be a period of time when it will probably come back, but that period of time is probably yours. I wonder, you know, if we defeat the virus, if it hasn't become a seasonal thing or something, if it suddenly we're gone, let's say tomorrow or next month, I think human interactions would similarly take a while to come back. I think if the threat was really gone, they would come back. I don't know but a hand shaking. You know, I don't certainly not hugging strangers like we used to at some point in time. But, but I think it will come back we'll be slowing. It would be funny to see if people are willing to just suddenly like do we feel like we need them. To be together, because that's a very psychologically normal feeling to, but we've had all that disgust on top of it, and you know, steering away from crowds, and it's becoming habit. Right. And once it becomes habit, then then it's pretty ingrained in our body and it takes a while to undo.   Pouya LJ  31:16 Yeah, for sure. No, it's definitely I initially, I didn't tend to do that. But I feel like if I don't do it, it seems like something's wrong with me because everybody's doing it, I guess. Anyways, so I think it's as good a time as any so for those people who don't know you have a course that is free on Coursera called mind control managing your mental health during COVID-19. Now, do you want to? Why don't you like just tell us a little bit about what's show? I mean, I guess people have a good idea what this course is about, but yeah, coming from you.   Prof. Joordens  31:44 So the mind control part. I always like these weird twists or words and I have some sort of Jedi references all through and you know, I have this image in my mind of this may be going back for for some people but, but Luke when he's finally been all trained, and then he's going to Jabba the Hutt. To rescue Han Solo, but it's this period where he's actually confident and competent. And he's learned all these these mental skills, these mind tricks, and then he can just waltz in and he's kind of the Jedi warrior. Well, you know that that's sort of in my mind is you we need to learn that sort of ability to control our own minds. And it really isn't that tough. So the big idea of the course is to empower people with knowledge to make them, you know, really understand what the anxiety response is. And then when and then to give them some tips about managing it tips that will make sense once they understand it. So I think, you know, I've told reporters, here's a tip, here's what happened, and they get those little tips and that's fine. But when you really kind of get it, oh, yeah, that's why that works. It's important because sometimes the tip isn't exactly perfect for you. But if you understand why it works, you can find one that is, oh, you know, he talked about singing karaoke, I wouldn't do that. But I would do this and it's the same idea. So the course is essentially It's called three weeks, although people are binge watching it, so whatever but but it's broken down to three weeks, each week has about maybe an hour of videos, three or four short videos. The first week is really about understanding where anxiety comes from, and why it's so important that we learn to control it. And I end that week by telling them about guided relaxation. So basically, you can't be both anxious and relaxed at the same time. It's sort of two different modes our body can be in. So if you want to stop being anxious, the best way to do it is to learn how to be relaxed. And if you can invoke some kind of summon relaxation, that will get rid of the anxiety and it's something you can learn to do but it is a skill. It is you know, mental mind tricks so to speak. And so you begin by I give them a little audio tape that just kind of what they just lay down and it walks them through the process and just to demystify it just so your listeners understand. It's just something Like we start at your feet, and we say clench your feet as hard as you can, like it's a fist, like clench that foot as hard as you can make that muscle hurt, and keep clenching. And make it really, really, really, really hurt. And we say that for a little while, and then at some point, that critical point, we say, Okay, now release that tension. And while you release that tension, feel what it feels like when the tension sort of bleeds away, when it's just sort of, you know, drains out of your body, like it's going down the drain, and then feel that relaxation that's left in your feet after that, and then we go up, and we do it with your calves and we do with your thighs, and we work all the way up through your body. And the idea is just it's kind of is my sci fi references again, it's like the teleporter and Star Trek where you want to go from one place to another. It's kind of like you can do that pretty well with your mind. If your mind knows that location you want to go to and has to be very familiar with that location. And if it is, it can transport you there. And so doing the relaxation you become familiar with. That's what relaxation feels like. That's what it feels like the drain stress. And at some point, it can become a Jedi mind trick where you can literally, you know, someone says you're a jerk, and you're about ready to come back at them with some nasty words, but you can just go No, let me pull them back. And let me be rational and and that is I call the psychology of being cool in my class that's that's learning how to kind of be in control of your motion. So that's a very sort of direct way. In the next week, though, I talk like we've been talking about a little bit more about how you can use distractions. So I talked about the news and why it sort of like we did like it's, it's not not necessarily good for our state, but it's something we kind of need now. But how you can now change the channels on your mind, through the activities you engage in, that certain things will be good distractions for you. Other things will actually be like aerobic activity. We've never understood this in psychology, or aerobic activity makes people more positive emotionally. You don't know why. We just know that's been shown over and over again. So if you can factor some of that into your day, That will help your mental health. So I give a bunch of strategies like that in the second part, we talked about the importance of social connections, things like that. And then finally, in the third week, we focus really on isolation, this new like living in isolation and what that does to a person. What we know from the psychological literature, what we don't know yet, as we've talked about, there's a lot we don't know about this situation. But then I then I give some advice about sort of configuring your life in isolation and how to kind of, you know, have the use in there. But as we've talked about a little budgeted bits and use, you know, follow them with some sort of palate cleanser, cognitive palate cleanser, have other ones throughout the day, have social interactions as part of what you do find ways to have control. One of the things I talked about, by the way in, in that third section is if you can accomplish something, if you can be spending this time, and maybe bettering yourself, so maybe taking courses online, if there are certain skills you always wished you had or whatnot, you can Get some certificates or you can just learn about something you always wanted to learn about. If you wake up in the morning with something to do, and you go bed at night, having accomplished something that makes you feel a lot better too, and it's less that you're just kind of hanging out. So I'm talking about things like that little things you can do that will literally answer your body's call of do something, and, and also kind of give you escapes from the anxiety at times, give you things that work against the anxiety. And the whole hope is that these become things that people just have in their back pocket. So I love the idea. I don't know if this is happening, but I love the idea of a family going through this. And literally, you know, involving kids at a very early age in terms of hey, here's how you can kind of control your mental states as well. And then maybe you know, six months from now that kids being bullied or something and and maybe they feel a little bit more in control of the situation and control of their emotions and maybe that allows them to, you know, come up with some strategies they might not have thought about. This is another thing. By the way, it's an interesting thing about this fighter Felice system. It's all about activating the body to respond. And it actually drains blood from the frontal lobes. It's kind of like your your body is saying, This isn't the time to be thinking it's a time to be doing something, just do something. Which makes sense if it's a bear in front of you, right? But, but otherwise, it's very hard. So if somebody was being bullied, for example, kids being bullied, usually they're going to have an emotional reaction. And it's very hard for them to think strategically about what what are the options? What's the best way to respond? Well, what could I do? Instead, they just let their emotions take control. But if they can push back that emotion, and get cool, and kind of think their way through, they may actually, you know, have a tool that they can use all their life. And so that's that silver lining I told you about before. I think we all have to learn these tricks now. But I think they will serve us well in our life going forward, too. So so it's an opportunity in a sense,   Pouya LJ  38:57 fair enough. Now why is this a perfect time? Well, Right time rather well, I think   Prof. Joordens  39:02 it's the right time. I think one of the great things but this is so strange these words that but as we all are all are feeling the same thing. You know, I literally tell people, if you're not anxious, you're not paying attention right now like, you know if you're clued in at all to what's going on. So it's no debate and it's not a mystical thing. So let me say it this way there, there are still a lot of pockets in the world where mental health is not spoken about where it's seen, as you know, if someone's having a struggle, that's something you want to hide, that's something that shameful, that's something they shouldn't be able to control themselves. So we'll say to somebody, like stop being anxious or stop being depressed, but we don't tell them how to do that. And we just don't naturally know how to do that. And so when we're talking about mental health, we're talking about going public even if you feel that way, like this person should be able to do something about their depression. Well, okay, but at least let them learn what they can do, but their depression, like don't just deny them the opportunity to actually figure out how to do that. And so I think we're in a case now where we're all feeling it and so it's not awesome them, it's us. And it's absolutely critical again, actually, for two reasons. One, the one I told you about that if the if the fight or flee system stays engaged too long, we become immunocompromised and that's not good for the virus. The other thing though, is and it worries me. Anxiety is better than depression, which sounds kind of odd, but anxiety is your body screaming at you do something. Depression is your body's screaming at you don't bother, it won't make a difference. Nothing does. It's not worth the effort. So depression is a real, you know, bad state that leads to suicide and leads to a lot of other very dangerous things. And if we don't learn to manage our anxiety, we may end up feel feeling at some point like nothing we're doing as much as helping, there's nothing we can do this is just going to ruin everything. And that's sort of the path that is something called learned helplessness, we can start to feel like, we can't control the situation. And that can lead to depression. And so that that worries me more than anxiety. It's an anxiety is uncomfortable, but it's an activating kind of state and so activate people to learn how to manage their mental states and to learn that it's not Voodoo. You know, I think Freud kind of did a disservice to psychology years ago, he's fascinating to read, but he you know, gives this impression of little demons in your head doing various kinds of weird stuff. And that's not modern psychology. modern psychology is much more about habits. And you can have habits of mind just like habits of body and and sometimes biases and the way you think about things the way you weigh things. And all of these things make sense when you hear them and their their approaches to, you know, sort of rebalancing the system and now As Voodoo, none of it should be seen as weakness. Any more than, you know, somebody jogging, we don't think someone's weak because they're jogging. We think they're actually taking the time to, you know, take care of their body. And you know, that's what I kind of hope people will start to see here that this mental health stuff, it's not about fixing a problem. It's about being fit, being ready for challenge, being able to take things on and not having them crush you. And so yeah, I think we may have the opportunity where enough people are motivated to learn about that, to actually kind of see what mental health is really about.   Pouya LJ  42:35 Alright, fair enough. Now, you mentioned the structure of the course being separated week by week. Yeah, actually, I did not. I started a course by I didn't finish it. One of the reasons was because I wanted to ask you this. Yeah. Is there do you recommend to go through that week by week or bingeing is okay, too?   Prof. Joordens  42:51 Yeah. I mean, obviously, I recommend you go through an order because I do build on some things later on. But, I mean, generally so let me Let me put on my geeky cognitive psychology hat. If you really want to remember it, there is what's what we call spaced learning leads to the best memory. So to learn little chunks and think about those and then wait to learn the next chunk, etc. So generally bingeing or cramming, that can get you the information for now, but it doesn't hang on is long. So generally speaking, anytime you're learning, it's better to distribute then to binge. However, you know, in this case, I've had a lot of people do the binge eating thing, and they say they've learned lots of great tips. And that's exactly what they wanted to get out of it. The good news about this, I mean, as an educator, the good news about this course is it's it's relevant. You know, students are taking this because they want to know these strategies, and they want to understand and so they're it's a very motivated, engaged student group. And in that case, all you really need to do is give them what they need to learn. And you know, if you wanted to binge it, it would probably be fine as well. Yeah, but the one the one thing I would mention, though, Then I want to highlight is that learning to relax, I highlight the suit, of course, but I can never highly enough it's like learning to play guitar, you know, you don't just pick it up and do it, you literally have to. So I recommend things like, like twice a day you do that guided relaxation thing, it takes 10 minutes. But you know, revisit that place called relaxation a couple times a day, and then keep doing this for a week or two weeks. You know, it takes a while before you can just mentally put yourself there. And so there are parts of the course like that, that if you if somebody just listens to it once and gets the concept. Well, that's great. They have the concept, they're not going to have the skill, skills only develop with practice. So everything people learn. It's less about how you learn and more about do you take what you learned and use it? Do you start using it in your life, and if you're using it in your life, it's going to stick and so that's what that would be my big recommendation to people is literally leave the thing saying, Oh, I know three ways I can do that and then do that.   Pouya LJ  44:57 Now that's fair. I think that anybody who's done Any kind of learning, especially with instruments or whatever it can, yeah, I can relate to that. Definitely. It's it makes a lot of sense. Now we're coming to the end of the, the episode here and I want to see if there's anything we missed that you want to talk about any final advice for the audience?   Prof. Joordens  45:16 Wow. I mean, there's there's so many angles on this I have reporters called me and asked me all sorts of questions and so many things. So there's, there's probably things we haven't discussed. But I think we got the, the main gist of and I think the things you know, I would really like the listeners to, to kind of grasp on is, is, this is a relatively quick experience. I can go through that. No, if you think of it in that Jedi way, you know, how long did he spend in a swamp with some great little green guy learning to do stuff. There's a whole lot less time that you'll spend and I really think it will be valuable. I really think there are tips in here that will make you feel better and that's why I'm trying so hard to kind of get it out there. So yeah, I just People listen to it, use what they listen to. And I really, really hope that it gives them a little bit of peace of mind a little bit more control over their mind. That's what it's all about.   Pouya LJ  46:09 Yeah. And I, from going back to the silver lining that you mentioned, I think, actually, and as I keep telling myself, I was like, I always thought to myself, there's so much books I want to read or whatever that never get a chance to. And now, this is a perfect chance, but like, I have a friend who was telling me that now that I have the chance, I'm just like, No, I was like, was that just an excuse?   Prof. Joordens  46:33 So I think Yeah, in a sense, it's a great opportunity for those of us who are staying healthy. I mean, obviously there are those who are impacted very badly, but it's an opportunity for other people other that are not so impacted. That too, yeah, pick up on those and these skills, specifically this that you mentioned, and that and that will make you feel a lot better in and of itself. Just Just because i mean it's it's a anti victim kind of, it's not like you're a victim of the situation. It's like you're someone that's like okay, this The situation how can I use this to my advantage and that's a very different place to be psychologically and a much more healthy place to be psychologically. So, you know, sometimes the way we frame things to ourselves makes a big difference. And I think that's a good example.   Pouya LJ  47:13 All right, thank you. Thank you for your time and agreeing to come come up here.   Prof. Joordens  47:16 Yeah, no problem. Thank you for the invite. We and yeah, this has been a lot of fun.   Pouya LJ  47:20 Yeah, remember? Yeah, me too. Me too. It was awesome. And hopefully, we're gonna hope that this thing goes away quickly, but I'm assuming it doesn't. I hope we can count on your expertise. Further.   Prof. Joordens  47:30 No worries.   Pouya LJ  47:32 Cheers. Thank you. Thank you for your hard work.

The world has already headed towards a massive economic crisis fueled by the Coronavirus pandemic and people in all countries and continents are now concerned about the future of global markets. In this episode of Beyond the Present Podcast Dan and Poujix discuss the upcoming financial crisis, explain what caused it to happen in the first place, and offer solutions that can be implemented to survive through such tough fiscal times.  

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It does not matter how good you are unless others know how good you are! Promotion and self-presentation is an art that is absolutely necessary not only in the world of business but also in every facet of life. From getting your dream job and obtaining a customer to winning fans and votes, you are at the mercy of how well you can present yourself and your ideas. In this episode of Beyond the Present (BTP) podcast Daniel and Pouya discuss why you need to learn the art of self-presentation and offer some tips to help you get started. 

One of the biggest distinguishing factors in our approach to thinking and strategizing is our mental focus which can be divided into micro thinking, or paying attention primarily to the details, and macro thinking which is all about looking at the big picture. In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Dan and Poujix elaborate on both notions and offer tips on how to divide responsibilities in a team made of both micro and macro thinkers. A successful team needs both micro and macro thinkers and in this episode you will master this subject and insure the success of your team. 

Successful individuals are often referred to as lucky and many ascribe their achievements and fortune to luck failing to take into consideration that luck, while quite important, is but one of the contributing factors to the results that we gain in life.  In this episode of Beyond the Present Podcast Daniel and Pouya shed some myths on the issue of luck and describe the most common attitudes towards this concept. Do you want to know whether you can become luckier or not? If so then give this program a listen. 

The World Health Organization has announced that more than 300 million people around the globe suffer from various forms of depression which happens to be the leading cause of disability worldwide!    Despite the prevalence of this mental health hazard many individuals go about their lives not noticing that some of the closest people around them may suffer from depression. In this episode of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel and Pouya discuss this issue in depth and point out not only the common signs that someone near you might be depressed but also offer tips on how to help them recover from their affliction.    Link to the previous related episode: https://btpp.podbean.com/e/the-missing-piece-social-media-modern-era-and-depression/

The year 2020 is here and the crew behind Beyond the Present (BTP) podcast is here to celebrate the first day that marks the beginning of not only a new year but also a new decade. As is common at this time of year many of us write our New Year’s Resolutions, however, the unfortunate fact is that most of us abandon the goals that we set at the beginning of the New Year by January 15th of that same year, but why is that?  To answer this question Daniel and Pouya sit down to discuss goal setting that lasts so that we can keep all of our resolutions and realize them in the fullness of time. Happy New Year to all of our listeners and we are happy to share with you this program to make 2020 the best year of your life! 

There is no denying the fact that our environment, situation, and the events in our lives all have an impact on our emotional state and sunny days, lucky wins, and happy endings can make anyone feel positive. But what if the weather is too cold and snowy, the day is filled with one unlucky event after another, and your efforts seem to yield no results! How could you remain positive in those situations? The answer lies in having an internal locus of control and generating a positive state from within. In this program as part of the solo edition of Beyond the Present (BTP) podcast Daniel shares with you how to become a source of positivity in a world that thrives on negativity. One of the most important skills in leadership is the ability to motivate and cheer up those who have lost hope, this short talk will show you how to do just that!

On our 100th episode we are here to answer a few handpicked questions by our listeners as part of the Ask Dan Anything edition. Join Pouya as he asks the top questions from Daniel regarding a variety of things ranging from personal to esoteric! 

We all know that we got to risk it to get the biscuit but why don’t we actually do it? In this program as part of the Let’s Talk edition of Beyond the Present podcast Daniel and Pouya discuss living life on edge vs playing it safe and articulate the importance of taking risks to achieve greatness in any facet of life.  You will also be introduced to the concept of risk mitigation through the creation of options so that you are more willing to take bigger risks that can take your personal and professional life to the next level. Stop playing it safe and start listening to this program!

Why do most problems remain unsolved? Why are most dreams not achieved? Why do a lot of us don’t get what we want? The answer will surprise you: because most people do not even make one attempt to achieve them as they are afraid of being rejected.  In this solo round of Beyond the Present Podcast Daniel shares his personal motto of “no inner limits or outer borders” and discusses how we can live without any internal or imagined barriers and learn to never reject ourselves in attempting to get what we want. If you feel stuck, this short talk will hopefully make you unstuck!

Kanwar shares with us what being a Plurilingual means, how it has shaped his identity and in what ways it can help him become a better teacher. Enjoy! Download Show Notes

Your ability to effectively deal with the emotional ups and downs of life is not only essential to your happiness, it is actually a vital factor in achieving success since nothing reduces your overall motivation and hinders your progress more than having to constantly stop or slow down due to having gone through an emotional roller coaster. In this program as part of the Let’s Talk edition of Beyond the Present (BTP) podcast, Daniel and Pouya discuss emotional resilience in detail and offer key steps to take so as to boost one’s emotional resilience in tough situations.   

Your self confidence is nothing more than your psychological immune system that protects you from negative emotions caused by facing with setbacks, failures, and rejections and by taking the right steps to boost your level of self confidence you can insure your emotional well-being irrespective of the situations that you find yourself in. The latest solo edition of Beyond the Present Podcast will help you distinguish situational confidence and fake confidence from authentic confidence and offers tips on how to build and boost true confidence. 

The Matrix is not merely one of the most renowned blockbusters of all times, it is also one of the deepest and most philosophical movies ever made to not only entertain the audience but to make them ask key questions about life, freedom, autonomy, and free will. In this program as part of the Let’s Talk edition of Beyond the Present (BTP) Podcast Daniel and Pouya discuss both the movie as well as the matrix of life that is kept hidden from the eyes of most of us. Understanding the matrix behind most social events can open up the gateway to the knowledge that very few possess and if you want to have access to this secret gateway then listen to this program to see how deep the rabbit hole goes!

Anyone who has ever changed the world did so by first coming up with a dream and then acting on it until the inner world of desires and ambitions gave their place to the outer world of reality for everyone to see and cherish. In this episode of Beyond the Present (BTP) podcast Daniel and Pouya join Olga and Ilya to discuss the importance of discovering our dream, coming up with a plan of action, and then getting busy working on realizing our dreams and achieving our goals! Life is too short to live without a dream and if you want to get started on the journey of goal setting and goal achieving then let this program show you how!   You can listen one of Olga's music here