This week, in episode 128, Shawn Busse, Paul Downs, and Liz Picarazzi talk about why it’s so easy for tension to break out inside a business. Liz sees tension brewing between her people in the office and her people in the field. Shawn often sees friction at businesses between sales and those who have to deliver what sales sells. Paul says there’s always the potential for tension when a project gets handed from one set of workers to another, and he’s created a very deliberate process to address it. We have, he says, “really tamped down the civil wars and started solving the problems, as opposed to letting them fester.” Plus: Are Shawn and Liz going to hit their numbers this year? And have the owners seen their health insurance rates for next year?

Founder of entrepreneurial advocacy organization Right to Start, Hwang suggests bipartisan policy changes that would help Americans build more businesses. He also talks about what he learned about entrepreneurs on his recent cross-country roadtrip, why funding of U.S. businesses is broken, and what Americans really think of business owners.

This week, in episode 127, Dana White tells Paul Downs and Jay Goltz how her move to Dallas is going, including hiring a manager, firing a publicist, tweaking her business model, and for the first time, confronting competition. Dana also explains the surprising way she managed to get the financing to open her first salon on a military base, Ft. Bragg, which she now thinks could be up and running by the end of the year. Plus: Paul has to make adjustments to handle a sudden influx of business. And Jay is still looking for a head of HR. Should he post the ad on ZipRecruiter or Indeed? Should he offer a salary range in the ad? And is it reasonable for him to expect a follow-up email after an interview?

This week, as many businesses find out what they’ll pay for health insurance next year, Gene Marks and Loren Feldman talk about how businesses can save money. Gene explains why self insurance has become more feasible for smaller businesses and why he thinks it makes sense to offer employees better health coverage instead of a pay increase. Also, it’s probably time to revisit your workplace drug policies. And Gene and Loren discuss why the concerns of small businesses often get overshadowed by those of big businesses.

This week, in a special bonus episode recorded right before Labor Day, Seth Goldman talks about getting the disappointing news that Honest Tea, the brand he built and sold to Coca Cola, was being discontinued—and how it took him about two weeks to decide to create another tea business, Just Ice Tea, to fill the shelf space that Coke was vacating. Along the way, Goldman talks about why it made sense to sell a mission-driven business to a soda company, what he wishes he had done differently in the sale, what it was like being a Coke employee, what he’s been doing since leaving, how the beverage industry has evolved, and whether he’ll end up selling this business to Coke, too.

This week, in episode 126, Karen Clark Cole, Jay Goltz, and Sarah Segal discuss whether their businesses are meeting expectations and how that’s affecting their plans for next year. They also talk about how to handle an employee who doesn’t deliver, whether now is a good time to hire, and—in an answer to a listener question—how to make the transition from using contractors to hiring employees. And Karen explains why employee utilization—that is, what percentage of her people are actually billing clients—is the most important metric she tracks and one she tracks on an hourly basis. Plus: Notebooks or Notion? All three owners tell us how they try to stay organized.

This week, Loren Feldman speaks with Tracy Bech, who is CEO of Starboard Collectives and who specializes in helping business owners who don’t have a financial background (she understands: she was once one herself). Tracy talks about the two most important ratios for business owners to watch if they think we’re heading into a recession. And she also talks about why she actually likes recessions—or at least sees opportunities in them.

This week, in episode 124, Shawn Busse, Liz Picarazzi, and Hans Schrei debate the merits and risks of taking outside capital. Clearly, it makes sense for some businesses. But what are the right circumstances? What are the alternatives? And what do you need to understand before going to the dance? For example, what are the dynamics of the entrepreneur-investor relationship? Are the entrepreneurs hoping the investors will bestow an opportunity upon them? Or is it actually the entrepreneurs who have an opportunity to offer? And who pays for the coffee? Plus: What do you do on those days when no one seems to be following your lead and the entrepreneurial loneliness sets in?

This week, Gene Marks and Loren Feldman talk about what business owners can do to protect themselves in the current environment of rising rents and increased volatility. Plus: What explains the recent boom in startups? And will it last? And what the Fed’s rate hikes mean for businesses. Also: you can’t just set your website and forget it.

This week, in episode 124, Karen Clark Cole, Jay Goltz, and Sarah Segal talk about hiring an HR person. First, how do you handle HR issues before you can afford HR people? Is software the answer? At what size does a business need a full-time person? Do you hire someone who has experience but who might not be used to getting his or her hands dirty? Or do you hire someone you can mold to fit the culture of your business? Jay, who likes to say the entrepreneur is often the worst person to interview candidates, is currently interviewing candidates to be his head of HR, and he’s a little surprised at how few resumes he’s been getting. Plus: Sarah’s looking for office space and not finding much that would be acceptable. And how are Karen and Sarah doing now that, technically, they have been employees in their own businesses for a year?

Signed by Governor Newsom on Labor Day, California’s new fast food law creates committees, among other things, to set an industry-wide minimum wage. The plan sparked lots of outrage, but Gene Marks explains why he thinks it’s worth a try. He also notes that it could well be coming to a state near you. Plus: Gene also makes the business case for paid parental leave while also raising some interesting questions, including this one: If you offer paid leave to new parents, is that fair to employees who don’t have children? Gene also explains why he says buying Salesforce’s new small-business CRM is like ordering a salad at McDonald’s.

This week, in a special bonus episode, Jason Fried talks about why things got crazy at software maker Basecamp and what it has meant for the business. As you may recall, in the spring of 2021, Fried, CEO and co-owner, issued a blog post edict eliminating a slew of benefits, shutting down a committee that had been attempting to address diversity issues, and barring discussion of all social or political issues on work forums. The email produced a backlash that culminated in a third of the company’s 60-some employees choosing to leave. The rupture was especially stunning coming at Basecamp, which has since re-branded by returning to its original name, 37signals, and which has long had a reputation for treating employees well, including offering remote work long before it was commonplace. When the story broke, some business owners applauded Fried for taking a stand. Others wondered how any policy that resulted in the departure of a third of a company’s employees could be worthy of praise.Show notes:Here’s the blog post Jason Fried sent out announcing the policy changes: https://world.hey.com/jason/changes-at-basecamp-7f32afc5Here’s a story that recounted the backlash as it was happening: https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/3/22418208/basecamp-all-hands-meeting-employee-resignations-buyouts-implosionJason Fried is author or co-author of several books, including, “It Doesn’t Have to Be Crazy at Work.” https://basecamp.com/books/calm

This week, in episode 123 and in light of reports that half of the U.S. workforce has “quietly quit” their jobs, Shawn Busse, Paul Downs, and William Vanderbloemen talk about the latest rage: Is quiet quitting something new? Is it just a media creation? Have Shawn, Paul, and William experienced it in their businesses? And who’s to blame? Plus, the three owners explain how they hire for engagement and how they’ve changed their hiring processes in response to the pandemic and the labor shortage. For example, Paul explains why, in this brave new world, he continues to flip conventional wisdom on its head: Instead of hiring slow and firing fast, he’s been hiring fast and firing slow. And he says it’s working.

How much control do you need? How much risk can you handle? This week, Ami Kassar, a small business finance expert, recalls feeling inadequate when he saw other entrepreneurs raising lots of money and going for broke (and sometimes getting there). He began to realize that there are different entrepreneurial personality types, and he’s developed a survey that can help you understand your own entrepreneurial instincts. The founder of MultiFunding also discusses how willing banks are to lend right now, what businesses should do to prepare for a downturn, why it’s important to manage your EIDL loan carefully, and whether it ever makes sense to turn to an alternative lender.

This week, in episode 122, Hans Schrei and Sarah Segal talk about what it takes to break into Costco. How do you get on their shelves? If you do get there, how do you make sure your product will fly off of those shelves? And if you succeed, will you have the financing you’ll need to ramp up production? Along the way, Sarah offers some tips on enlisting Costco influencers, and Hans explains the inner workings of Wunderkeks’ equity crowdfunding campaign, where you can invest as little as $150 and where the company hopes to raise $1 million. Plus: Sarah responds to a smart listener’s suggestion of how to avoid getting ghosted by potential clients after preparing elaborate and expensive proposals.Show notes:Here’s Wunderkeks’ investing pitch on Republic: https://republic.com/wunderkeks Here’s the episode where we introduced Hans and Wunderkeks: https://21hats.com/wunderkeks-has-two-daddies/ And here’s the episode where Sarah talked about being ghosted by potential clients: https://21hats.com/trash-rats-and-garbage-juice-a-case-study-in-pr/

This week, in part because Loren’s on vacation, we’re offering a replay of an episode we recorded more than two years ago. It was one of our early episodes, and it was recorded shortly after George Floyd was murdered. In the episode, Karen Clark Cole, William Vanderbloemen, and Dana White talked about how they viewed their responsibilities as business leaders at such a fraught moment. What, if anything, were they saying to their customers? What were they saying to their employees? It started as a conversation, but Dana took the lead quickly and powerfully. She talked about what it’s been like to so often be the lone Black voice in the room. She talked about what it’s like for African-American employees to come to work and wonder where their company and their colleagues stand. She drew a line in the sand. “Why is it hard,” she asked? “You’re either over here, or you’re over there.” Even if you’ve already heard this episode, we recommend listening again—especially given that business leaders are again being asked where they stand on social and political issues, whether it’s about race or abortion or the climate or democracy. If you haven’t already heard the episode, we doubt you will soon forget it.

This week, in episode 121, Shawn Busse, Jay Goltz, and Liz Picarazzi discuss their succession options and—if they could go back in time—what advice they would give their early-stage selves. Liz would tell herself to get some help with administrative tasks, Shawn would tell himself to find a mentor (although he’s not sure he would have listened to the advice), and Jay would tell himself that there’s an obvious solution to the chaos caused by fast growth. Plus: How Liz changed the narrative after Citibin’s bout with bad publicity. And we have suggestions for a listener who asks: How do you know when it’s time to quit the day job?

This week, Gene Marks and Loren Feldman talk about the rise of “quiet quitting,” the new term for when employees contribute the bare minimum. They also discuss the phenomenon of bosses who come into the office to set a good example even as their employees phone it in from the beach. But most importantly, Gene points out what few others have noted, which is that the Inflation Reduction Act extends a huge tax break for business owners that was nearing expiration. And that’s just one of many aspects of the bill that Gene applauds. So would he have voted for the bill? You might be surprised.

This week, in episode 120, Shawn Busse and Paul Downs talk about what they’ve learned from their worst client experiences. Shawn, for example, tells us that he’s come to think about taking on a client much the way he thinks about hiring an employee. And Paul stresses the importance of watching what he says about difficult clients to his employees, because he doesn’t want to encourage a cynical attitude. From bad clients, our conversation shifts to bad partnerships. Even though their own partnerships ended poorly, both Shawn and Paul emphasize that having a partner can be invaluable in getting a business off the ground. In fact, Paul says he might even consider taking on a partner again. Plus, both Shawn and Paul explain why all the talk of recession is not giving them second thoughts about their ambitious marketing plans.

This week, John Arensmeyer, founder and CEO of Small Business Majority, an advocacy group for entrepreneurs and businesses, talks about what businesses can expect from the legislation coming out of Washington, D.C.—not just the climate, tax, and health care bill, but also the CHIPS and Science Act. In many instances, the benefits to business owners will come indirectly, he says, but they will come nonetheless.

This week, in episode 119, Liz Picarazzi tells Jay Goltz and Sarah Segal about her first brush with bad publicity. Liz’s debacle started with a negative post that appeared in a prominent local blog. It was about a Times Square pilot program for which her business, Citibin, is supplying trash bins. The problem? The bins were not being maintained properly, and there were photos to prove it. At the time we recorded this conversation, Liz was bracing for additional stories in both the New York Post and The New York Times. Both of those stories have since been published—we’ll talk about them in a coming episode—and you can find links to all of the coverage in the show notes. For Liz, perhaps the biggest challenge was defending her company without trashing her client.Show Notes:Here’s the Streetsblog post: https://nyc.streetsblog.org/2022/07/20/gross-clean-curbs-bins-show-growing-pains-in-times-square/Here’s the New York Post story: https://nypost.com/2022/07/30/nyc-citibins-leaking-garbage-left-open-in-times-square/And here’s The New York Times story: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/06/nyregion/new-york-city-garbage-containers.html

This week, Gene talks about how he recently had a mild case of COVID but worked right through it, no problem, which got him to wondering why employees—in his view—do not seem to be similarly dedicated. In fact, Gene believes that employees are using “COVID hysteria” as a pretext to avoid work and catch up on their TV watching. Plus, Gene explains why he thinks Wawa, a chain of convenience stores, is a good model for his own business. And he tries to make sense of a recessionary economy that produced more than half a million jobs in July.

This week, in episode 118, Jay Goltz tells Shawn Busse and Karen Clark Cole about a dream he had recently. It was a dream, of all things, about this very podcast, and on it, someone—it was a guy—was talking about how his business was faring: “I think I’m screwed,” he says in Jay’s dream. But who was it? And why was he screwed? Jay woke up before those answers were revealed. So we did some interpreting on this week’s real podcast. Spoiler alert: It wasn’t that hard to interpret! Plus: Shawn explains why he thinks his website is no longer performing. Karen explains why she thinks it’s actually easier to onboard an employee who will work remotely. And Jay and Karen discuss whether it’s time to give up on things going back to the way they were.

This week, Gene Marks and Loren Feldman try to make sense of where the economy is headed and what it means for business owners. Plus, Gene explains why he thinks some business owners may be fooling themselves about whether their business is growing. He also talks about a CRM tool that Google is giving away for free, as well as what you need to know to start a business.

This week, in episode 117, Paul Downs, Sarah Segal, and Laura Zander discuss their daily routines, how those routines have been affected by the pandemic, whether they think they’re working too much or too little, and whether they would join a peer group where they would be exposed to owners who are working harder and, perhaps, having greater success. Plus: Laura places her bet on influencer marketing, Paul says his new marketing campaign has already paid off, and Sarah explains why none of her employees have ever asked her for a raise.

This week, Gene Marks reports back from a conference of funeral directors and debunks a silly survey that predicts a bleak future for small businesses. Plus: How the rules defining full-time employees and contractors could be changing, why some business owners are giving up on their CRM systems too soon, and how a relatively new law can help businesses save money administering retirement plans.

This week, in episode 116, Jay Goltz, Liz Picarazzi, and William Vanderbloemen discuss how their businesses are holding up and whether they’ve gotten past the labor shortage (short answer: No). The conversation veers into a discussion of how to finance growth and what to do when your bank is unresponsive (find another one!). And then Liz explains her intense distaste for dealing with lawyers, accountants, and insurance agents and how she’s trying to cope with it. “Believe me,” responds Jay, “I haven't paid enough attention to certain things that I should have, and it's cost me. But yeah, we can't every day just do the inspiring, cool, fun, oh-my-God, we-had-a-big-sale, look-at-the-problem-I-solved thing. It’s all part of the package.”

Dashboard: Something Is Going to HappenThis week, Mel Gravely, CEO of Triversity Construction in Cincinnati, joins Dashboard to explain why—even though he has an extremely healthy backlog of work lined up for 2023—he’s more than a little concerned about where the economy is headed. He also talks about how the labor shortage in his industry started well before The Great Resignation and why he doesn’t see it ending any time soon. And then there’s the challenge of bidding for future contracts without knowing what your materials or labor are likely to cost. Plus: He talks about what he’s learned in the year since he published his book, “Dear White Friend,” in which he sought to start an honest conversation with other business owners about race.

This week, in episode 115, Shawn Busse, Hans Schrei, and Sarah Segal explain what they would do if I gave them $10,000 a month to spend on marketing. As we all know, there’s a lot going on right now. No one’s entirely certain where the economy is headed, and no one’s entirely certain where digital marketing is headed. So it seemed like a good time to ask our regulars where they would place their bets if we offered them each an imaginary pot of money to promote their brands. Spoiler alert: Their responses gave us a good sense of what these business owners think is working right now—and it’s definitely not billboards.

This week, Gene Marks and Loren Feldman talk about the continued rise of text message marketing and how it can be integrated with your CRM system. They also discuss why Gene warns businesses off of Twitter—even though he’s a power user. Plus: How do you plan for a recession and a labor shortage at the same time? And is that $10 billion in SSBCI money flowing yet?

This week, in a special bonus episode, Kurt Wilkin talks about how he helped build several businesses, including most recently a recruiting business called HireBetter, and explains why he hates most business books. It has to do with the attention deficit issues he, like many entrepreneurs, tends to experience. So when he decided to write a business book of his own, he kept it short, and he structured it so that you can find the parts that are most relevant to you and skip the rest. It’s called “Who’s Your Mike?” and it features chapters on the kinds of hiring and management challenges all entrepreneurs confront, including situations involving employees like Mike. Who exactly is this guy Mike? Oh, you know. He’s the incredibly loyal and hard-working employee who’s been with you from day one but who isn’t necessarily growing with the business. Says Kurt, “We all have, or have had, or will have a Mike.”

This week, in episode 114, we welcome another new panelist to the podcast, Hans Schrei, who is co-founder of Wunderkeks, an e-commerce bakery in Austin, Texas. Hans tells Jay Goltz and Liz Picarazzi why he and Luis Gramajo, his husband and co-founder, sold a business in Guatemala, immigrated here in 2019, and started a cookie business from scratch, going from selling at farmers’ markets their first year to doing more than $5 million in e-commerce last year. Hans also explains why he doesn’t think it’s enough just to make a delicious cookie, why he’s trying to raise seed capital, and what would happen to his visa if Wunderkeks were to fail.

Gene Marks, our man in London (at least for this week), tells Loren Feldman that small businesses in the UK are doing quite well, thank you! Marks and Feldman also discuss how your CRM system can help you fight inflation, the good news about bankruptcy laws, how to increase profits without raising prices, and whether it’s now okay to swear in the office. Cheers!

This week, in episode 113, Sarah Segal tells Shawn Busse and Paul Downs why she’s never articulated a set of core values for her business and why she’s thinking about doing it now. But she’s wondering whether establishing her values will really make a difference. Do employees care? Do clients care? Both Shawn and Paul say they do. In fact, Paul says his core values have been extremely helpful when it comes to recruiting. And Shawn says he thinks sharing values can be the best competitive advantage smaller businesses have. Plus: We get an update on how Paul’s big marketing initiative is going, and we follow up on why Sarah feels compelled to participate in almost all of her firm’s client calls.

“I don’t have the time to deal with them because my resources are limited,” Gene Marks tells Loren Feldman this week. But he’s just fine hiring Millennials, and he explains why. Plus: The cheap money days may be over, but there’s a silver lining to that: Venture-backed businesses may actually have to operate like real businesses. And Chewy offers lessons in both customer service and social media.

This week, in episode 112, we welcome a new regular to the 21 Hats Podcast crew: Sarah Segal, founder and CEO of Segal Communications, a public relations firm based in San Francisco. First, Sarah tells Jay Goltz and Liz Picarazzi how she built her firm. Then, Jay and Liz ask Sarah all of their questions about public relations: How much outreach should they do themselves? Should they hire a PR specialist or a full-service agency? Should they approach journalists directly or through a publicist? And most important, how much should it all cost? Plus: Why Sarah’s still figuring out how to attract new business.

This week, Gene Marks and Loren Feldman talk about whether it’s time to panic about inflation and recession, how smaller businesses are managing their inventories through these unpredictable times, why businesses that take digital payments through a service like Venmo are going to have to be more careful, and what, if anything, the metaverse is likely to mean for the typical small business.

This week, in a special bonus episode, Greg Wittstock, founder of Aquascape, explains how he invented the backyard pond industry, how he improvised a business model, and how he almost lost it all. After failing at franchising, Wittstock decided to give away his pond building expertise and marketing to landscape contractors in what he calls “a franchise system without a franchise fee.” And it worked. Always candid to a fault, he recounts how the business shot to $59 million in annual sales, why it then stagnated for 10 years, and what he ultimately figured out about social media marketing. Plus: he also explains why his first rule of customer service is: Don't give them what they ask for. Give them what they want.Show Notes:Here’s Bo Burlingham’s profile of Greg Wittstock: https://www.inc.com/magazine/20031101/aquascape.htmlHere’s Greg’s video of Shaquille O’Neal’s pond installation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ti-k4LUQBNs

As listeners to this podcast know, Dana White has a remarkable array of opportunities before her, including company-owned hair salons, franchised salons, salons on military bases, hair products, and POS software. But especially since the pandemic, she has struggled to get traction. This week, in episode 111, special guest Ami Kassar, an expert in small business finance, guides Dana through a discussion of how she might prioritize those opportunities and get them financed. Ami and Dana consider such questions as: What should she do first? Should she continue to pursue franchising, where she’s already sunk a lot of money? Or should she focus on opening company-owned salons at Fort Bragg and in Dallas? And should she be looking for an investor? If so, how important is it that she maintains control of the business? Or should she try for a bank loan? And if so, what kind of pitch is likely to impress a bank? As the conversation continues, a plan emerges.

This week, Gene Marks talks us through the State Small Business Credit Initiative, or SSBCI, which is a tad complicated but well worth figuring out. While the actual offerings vary by state, as the name suggests, there is $10 billion on the table in the form of grants, loans, and venture capital that could conceivably help almost any business. Plus: the dangers of hitting customers with fine-print fees and surcharges, an assessment of New York City’s efforts to eliminate onerous regulations, and Gene makes the case for employee ownership—while explaining why he would never, ever consider an ESOP for his own business!

This week, in episode 110, Kelly Allan—a consultant who specializes in sharing the principles espoused by the late management guru W. Edwards Deming—returns to the podcast for a conversation with Paul Downs, Jay Goltz, and Laura Zander. After World War II, you may recall, Deming was sent to Japan, where he was largely credited with resuscitating the devastated economy. He of course went on to become tremendously influential here, too. And if you read his books or scan his “14 points” for management, it’s clear that many of his lessons are now widely accepted. But not all of them. For example, he encouraged business leaders not to set production quotas, not to hold people accountable—at least not without first holding the process accountable—and not to address employee performance and pay in the same conversation. Some of these issues came up in an episode that Paul, Jay, and Laura taped in December, which is why we decided to invite Kelly, who is chairman of the Advisory Council of the W. Edwards Deming Institute and has his own management consulting business, to join us. The goal was to see if we could figure out what Deming would tell Paul, Jay, and Laura, and whether the three owners would be open to his suggestions. Spoiler alert: Paul’s not really buying it.

“I see it, and I feel it,” Liz Picarazzi tells Shawn Busse and Jay Goltz this week, in episode 109, a conversation about the looming recession many are predicting. But Liz is not hunkering down. In fact, she has launched an ambitious marketing campaign that relies not on Google AdWords but on Google Alerts. She’s also taking some advice from Carey Smith, the founder of Big Ass Fans, that she didn’t want to hear when it was first offered. Plus: How some owners trap themselves in miserable businesses. And Shawn, Jay, and Liz suggest regulations that need to die—with Jay going off on the way businesses are compelled to pay for unemployment insurance.

This week, Lou Mosca, COO of American Management Services, which works with small businesses all around the country, talks about why hiring—and not recession or inflation—remains his clients’ biggest concern and what he and his clients are still learning about recruiting. Plus: Lou sees banks overreacting and warns about the dangers of online lending.

This week, in episode 108, Jay Goltz and Dana White talk about their employee handbooks. Do they take them seriously? Or is it just boilerplate? Has anything changed since the pandemic? Is the handbook the place to remind employees that they are hired at will and can be fired at any time with or without a reason? Are there issues that should not be addressed in the handbook? When was the last time they updated it? When was the last time they read it? “Me, personally?” responded Jay. “Actually picked it up and read it?” Yes, Jay, that’s the question. “Years.”

This week, Gene Marks tells Loren Feldman why he thinks investing in small business marketing is a lot like going to Vegas or Atlantic City—especially if you don’t have good data. But, he says, there are things you can do to improve your odds. Gene and Loren also discuss why Gene is rethinking the CRM systems he recommends, why business travel is coming back stronger than many expected, and why we’re experiencing both a labor shortage and a wave of layoffs at the same time.

This week, in episode 107, Shawn Busse, Jay Goltz, and William Vanderbloemen discuss whether the old line about hiring slow and firing fast makes sense during a labor shortage. As William puts it, “What if you do have to hire fast? How do you do that? What if you do want to keep people even if you might have wanted to get rid of them before? How do you do that without ruining your culture?” Plus: How do you know it’s really time for someone to go? And what happens when employees share their salaries with each other? Anything good? And as we all binge watch the real life dramas about WeWork and Theranos, the question inevitably arises: Is it still okay to fake it until you make it? And if so, where do you draw the line?

This week, Loren Feldman and Gene Marks resume their weekly conversations about the most important stories affecting business owners, starting with why Gene was ahead of his time in taking his business remote and why he thinks it’s left his company dysfunctional. Plus: what should owners take from the latest strong jobs report? And how will businesses be affected if the Supreme Court does indeed overturn Roe v. Wade?

This week, in episode 106, we start with an update of how 21 Hats has been doing since its sale brought new resources and new ambitions (Spoiler alert: It’s not going great!). Then, Dana White tells Shawn Busse and Jay Goltz about the progress she’s made on multiple fronts: attempting to sell franchises to revive her struggling Midtown Detroit location, to open new salons at Fort Bragg and in Dallas, and to secure financing. The owners discuss Dana’s financing options—venture capital, private equity, bank loan—assessing, in Shawn’s words, their “degrees of evil.” Plus: Shawn explains how his views on remote work have been evolving, and Jay explains why he’s tired of being called a tyrant (even though no one’s actually called him that).