Our world today is increasingly unanchored, where young people are constantly told by their peers, by their schools, by the entertainment industry, that they need to define themselves, that they need to give their own lives meaning and purpose.
And yet this lack of an anchored understanding of who they are, given to them first and foremost by a loving God, has contributed to the rise in anxiety and depression and confusion that many young people struggle with in our culture.
In my conversation today, I'm speaking with Christina Fox about kids' need for a strong sense of identity rooted in an understanding of God as our Creator, Sustainer, and Redeemer.
In an age that focuses more on achievement and self-determination than dependence and humility before God, Christina wants to help parents teach their kids the beauty of knowing our Creator and seeking to fulfill His purposes for us as beloved children.
Christina Fox works as the assistant director of alumni relations at Covenant College.She's also the author of a new picture book for kids called, Who Are You?A little book about your big identity from Crossway.Let's get started.
Well, Christina, thanks so much for joining me on the Crossway podcast today.
So a while back, you wrote an article for Crossway where you noted that today, kids are growing up and trying to develop their identities in a quote, unanchored world.I wonder if you could just unpack that a little bit.
What do you mean by an unanchored world?
Yeah, I think our culture really just isn't rooted in the gospel, obviously.And when you aren't rooted in anything like that, you're just following whether it's the trends or what other people are saying or what everyone is doing.
And I think we see that a lot in what's happening in our culture. People hear something, whether on television or on social media, and they just instantly believe it.They don't have any foundation to kind of filter that through.
And so I think our children are growing up in that kind of culture where there isn't any, this is what is right, this is what it's wrong, you know.
There's not even like, this is who you are.There's so much of it seems like, you know, those issues of identity are just, the push of our culture today is this individualism of you kind of have to define yourself.
Yeah, you be you, I guess.
Yeah, right.That makes me think a little bit of Carl Truman's book, The Rise and Triumph of the Modern Self, where he talks about that expressive individualism that is just kind of the air in which we all live and breathe today.
Yeah, definitely.A post-truth culture, I guess, is another way to talk about it.But yeah, and so I think whenever you are anchor-less like that, just anything goes, anything is okay, anything is right, And that varies from person to person.
And I think that's why so many people are just confused.
Yeah.So what do you think are some of the, I don't know, maybe emotional or psychological impacts on kids of trying to form their identities?Because that's so much of what childhood is kids kind of figuring out.Who am I?What's my place in the world?
What am I going to do with my life? What impact does it have on them to then grow up in this culture where there are no anchors?There's no set way of thinking about themselves.
Yeah, well I think one of the anchors that we're hearing though is how you are how you feel.So however you feel today is who you are.
And I think that's, I think a lot of the anchors they do here are flimsy and shifting and constantly changing, but people are really building, trying to build their lives on it.Like that proverbial building a house on sand kind of a thing.
And so I think that those are things that they're hearing.And I think that that causes a lot of confusion.I think it can cause a lot of anxiety, even depression in all of us, not just children.
When we do hear, we do read those stats about young people today with the rates of anxiety and depression really skyrocketing in scary ways.
And so you kind of see that maybe there's a connection there with this unanchored world in which we are growing up.
Yeah.So this new book that you've written is a picture book.It's aimed at kids ages three to five.And I think one question we might have as a parent is, do I really need to be talking to my kids about these questions of identity at that age?
Are they really asking those questions yet?Or are we introducing maybe concepts that aren't helpful yet for them?How would you respond to that?
I think we need to start as soon as possible.You know, a lot of our struggles with our own identity, we can trace them back to even our childhoods.
I know even myself, just not that long ago as we were moving and I was going through all these boxes of papers my parents had saved for me. And I included all of my report cards from kindergarten all the way through.
And every single one the teacher had written at the bottom, she is quiet and shy.She's too quiet.She never says anything.And so I grew up just that was part of my identity.That's just who I am.I'm the quiet kid.I'm the quiet kid.
And I think that had a big impact on on the things I pursued in life.So I thought, well, if that's who I am, that means I can't do these other things.
It's amazing how some of those things can have this, even things that, like you said, reach back to these early days of our childhoods, you know, we hear something described about us, or we kind of, we think of ourselves in a certain way, and it can only almost become like a self-fulfilling prophecy.
where then, oh yeah, I'm the shy kid.So that means I'm going to kind of almost be more shy now in the future because of that.Do you think that can happen for kids?
Oh, definitely.Yeah.And so I think a lot of as adults, our development of identity really does start when we're young and the why it's so important to, as parents teach our children from the very beginning who they are to give them that foundation.
So they are anchored in the truth when they go out into the world and they hear conflicting things and they know this, no, that's not who I am.
Yeah.One of the things that struck me as I read through your book is just, how common some of the identity markers that we often think about and refer to with our kids can be.
They're things that we're not really even trying to define them in a certain limited way.They're just kind of the way that we often speak to kids.
And one of those big ways, maybe one of the most common questions that we like to ask young kids as parents and as adults is, what do you want to be when you grow up? And I just wonder if you could reflect on that a little bit.
First, what did you want to be?How did you answer that question as a kid?Because I think you have kind of a fun answer.And then just speak a little bit about how even a question like that can at times maybe be unhelpful.
Yeah.Well, I wanted to be Nancy Drew.I just, I wouldn't want to be a detective.Yeah.I just thought it was super fun, especially when you have George and Bess to go along with you and, and you get to ride in a cool car and yeah.
So yeah, that's what I wanted to be.But of course she was a fictional character.
So hard, hard to pull that one off.
Yeah.I know as adults, when we meet someone for the first time, we often respond with the job that we do and say things like, I am a teacher.I am an accountant.I am a graphic designer.And that just becomes part of our identity.
But I think we see that struggle, especially when someone loses their job, for example.What happens when you're no longer that teacher or an accountant or a graphic designer?What does that do?
I mean, you feel unanchored because that's who you thought you were.
Yeah, and we kind of maybe subtly teach kids even to start to do that even at a young age before they ever have a job.We're kind of already saying this is going to be a foundational part of who you are.So how do you think about that?
Because I mean that it is true what we do for work is important, you know, it is for me as a I work full time.A big part of my life is what I'm doing for my job.So how do you think about that?
And same with kids, there's things that they're doing or involved with that do end up taking a lot of their time and energy and thought.How do we teach kids kind of how to think about that?
Yeah, I think, I mean, just for me, having learned the Westminster Confession growing up, that first question just always prompts me to remember who I am.And for me, that's that foundation of, what is the chief end of man?
It's to glorify God and enjoy him forever.And so I think that, and the Bible says that no matter what you're doing, whether you eat, whether you drink, do it all for the glory of God.And so I think that
whatever job we may have, because it changes a lot throughout our life.Whatever skill we have, whether we're an athlete or a scientist or whatever is our gifting that God has given us, our goal should be to glorify God in whatever that is.
And that's really our ultimate, I guess, purpose.And so when we teach children at a young age, wow, yeah, you're great at running.You're really fast. You're excellent at math.You're so smart.Yeah, but no matter what, you do it for the glory of God.
Even if one day you can't run as fast as you used to.
That's kind of the freeing, amazing thing for us as Christians is that if our greatest, highest purpose as creatures is to glorify God with all that we have, that what we have though could change.
You know, God might remove an ability for us or remove a job or And yet that doesn't actually change our ability to glorify him with whatever we have.And so we can kind of keep fulfilling our highest purpose even if the situations change.
So one thing that you know is that our children are being raised in a world in which identity and purpose are integrally connected to the pursuit of happiness.That kind of defines the world in which we live today.
And you actually reference in this article a couple different examples from some popular kids movies where we kind of see this message taught.I wonder if you could share any of those examples.
What are some of the pop culture type of influences that our kids are experiencing that reinforce this idea that ultimately your identity should be wrapped up in whatever makes you most happy?
Yeah, I think there's certain like words and phrases that we hear a lot of.I think I even mentioned one like you be you or what does your heart tell you to do?Follow your heart.Yeah.
It's a classic Disney theme.
Yeah, definitely.And when you hear things so often, it just becomes part of the background noise of your life and, you know, really does influence your, the way that you live life.
And so, yeah, the pursuit of happiness, individual happiness, seems to be what everyone is chasing after. And, you know, as I mentioned before, a lot of those things change.
How we feel about things change from day to day, moment to moment for some of us.And I think I talk about how, or I've often written about how the world defines our heart is different from how the Bible defines our heart.
And so that makes a big impact in how we interpret what the world is telling us.
Yeah.How would you describe that contrast between the world's understanding of our heart and scriptures?
Yeah, so it seems like, especially when you're watching things on TV or watching movies, the world seems to differentiate between thoughts and feelings.
Like our heart is our feelings and our head is our thoughts and they're kind of at war with each other and you need to follow what your heart is telling you to do or what you're feeling in the moment.That's the true voice that you want to follow.
according to the world.But the Bible, the way it defines heart is different.It encompasses everything about us.It's like our core self, including our thoughts and our feelings and our will, our motivations, all of that.
Yeah.Yeah.I was also thinking that it seems like for in the broader world, when people say, follow your heart, it's often in contrast to maybe
just living up to certain expectations that other people might have for you or desires that they have for you.And the encouragement is like, you do what you yourself kind of in your own heart know to be right and true for you.
And don't listen to all these outside voices that want to make you be who they want you to be.And it just feels like very, there's like the assumption that the human heart is this reliable guide to ultimate who I should be.
Whereas I think scripture would kind of say, your heart is not that reliable.Our hearts are deceitful, actually.Is that a factor that you think is at play here too?
Oh, definitely.Yeah.I think, you know, the Bible tells us that what we need is a new heart.We need a surgical procedure done to remove our heart of stone so we can have a heart of flesh, a heart that knows God and loves Him.
Yeah, yeah.So let's talk about the book a little bit.It's really fun to read, it's really easy to read, and the illustrations are beautiful and just kind of whimsical and just fun to look at.
And you hit on a lot of different ways though, a lot of different categories in which kids might be tempted to define themselves or identify themselves.
And as I read through it, though, I kind of noticed that it seems like there's maybe a few different broad categories or groupings of these traits, perhaps, that you were trying to hit on.So I wonder if you could walk us through that.
What were those broad categories?
Yeah, so I try to point out different things that I know kids can be drawn to finding their identity in.One is in the things that they do, the things that they're good at, the things that we say, oh, wow, look at you.You're amazing.
Run faster than your friends, or you're a star athlete.
Yeah, you win all the spelling bees, those kinds of things.
And as parents, man, we're on the lookout for those.We're on the lookout for ways in which our kids are performing above average.And I know for me, I want to call that out for them.
Yeah, and there's nothing wrong with encouraging our kids in the gifts that God has given them.And that, but that's, you know, just like so many good things in life, they're quick to become inordinate things.
And so it is important that we kind of temper or just be on a lookout for that in what ways might those things become idols, you know, in our own hearts about our children or for them as well.
So yeah, so I talk about the things that they do, the things that people say about them.
I mentioned, you know, my report cards, but children sometimes hear from all the teachers in their life, you never sit still, you're so squirmy, you know, those kinds of things.Maybe that is something that they take on as their identity.
Oh, I'm the troublemaker in the classroom, you know, for example.
I'm sure that even also what peers say can be such a, you know, as my kids get older, they're becoming more and more aware of what other kids are thinking and saying about them.
And those interpersonal relationships and reputation issues become such a big deal for kids.
Yeah.You know, the kids point out to each other the ways that they dress or the things that You know, the way their hair looks, I mean, they point out all sorts of things and start to make fun of each other about it.And that hurts us.
How do you, going back to the issue of what kids can do, whether it's academics or sports, how should we as parents think about mentioning those things, talking about those things?
Because on the one hand, we don't want to encourage our kids to root their identities in those things, but we also, if our kid works really hard and studies and does a great job on that science test, I want to be able to call that out and say, good job with that.
You did good work. So any advice for how we talk about that in a helpful way?
Yeah, I think the important thing is wanting our children to have the right heart posture toward those things.
And so teaching them from the book of Genesis about how God created us and he gave us, everyone, different gifts, and that's wonderful and amazing.But we use those gifts not for our glory, but for his.
And I think that as we constantly kind of root it in that, and that they're excellent math skills are to be used for God's glory.And so when they do well on a test, let's pray and thank God for that.
Thank him for giving you the knowledge to do well on your math quiz or thank God that you do so well on the soccer team and that you were, you know, that you helped your team win the game.That's awesome.But it was for God's glory and we need to
Acknowledge him.That's such a simple suggestion, you know, to actually just lead our kids in prayer to God, acknowledge his role in that, and acknowledge that, you know, he's ultimately the one that we're seeking to honor and glorify in all of this.
Yeah, because I think that over time, the more that becomes like a habit, then they don't think, oh, that was me.I did that.No, God did that through you.
Yeah.One other area or category that you hit on in the book is issues of how we feel, our emotions.And I think for kids, but also for us as adults, so often our emotions tend to drive and dictate
our actions and our words and how we even think about ourselves.And I think culturally, as we've already said, letting our emotions, our feelings drive how we view ourselves is such a big thing right now.
It's so encouraged in a lot of ways, even in very extreme ways when it comes to gender and sexuality.So how do you think about how we teach our kids how to rightly assess their own emotions and let those inform how they view themselves?
It's a great question.I think a lot of times it has to do with how we respond to their emotional expressions.If our kid is angry and has a tantrum about something or if that seems to be something they do a lot.
it's easy for us to respond and say, why are you always so angry?Or that kind of a thing where we are kind of lumping them into this category of you're the angry kid, or you're the kid who always cries at everything.Why can't you just stop crying?
Those kinds of responses I think does play a big role in that.So how we respond to our children and what we say to them when they're in that moment I think plays an important role in teaching them that.
And then in that moment also just helping them to learn to cry out to God with that and bring those emotions to the Lord and tell him, God, I'm really mad right now because my friend didn't invite me to the birthday party.
My sister stole my toy from me.Just being able to voice that to the Lord is a good habit for them to learn.
And so at each, at the end of each of these sections in your book, where you're kind of addressing different traits or characteristics that, again, kids can kind of identify themselves with, there's this recurring refrain, it's this question, and it's, is that what makes you, you?
You kind of ask that over and over again.Is that what makes you, you?And the answer is always no. No, that's not what makes you you.What were you getting at with that recurring question?
I just, I wanted them to really think through, these might be true statements or true things that- You are good at math.You're good at math, or yes, you might feel a certain way today, or you might love to wear hats.You're a collector of hats.
That's something you enjoy doing. But that's not really who you are.And so I just wanted them to kind of repetition is one of the ways that we teach things.And so, yeah, I wanted them to really kind of get that.
Well, and I think for kids and also for us as adults, we might think of ourselves through these lenses.I always wear hats, you know, or whatever that might be.I'm a manager at my job, and I have people who report to me.
You know, we think of those things about ourselves, but we don't often explicitly think, oh, that is my identity. but it kind of is operating in that way.
So that's one thing I loved about that refrain is you're kind of bringing to the surface, is that what makes you, you?And help kids and probably their parents as well really ask that question, is this how I think about myself first and foremost?
And then you're kind of teaching, that's not how we should root our identities.That kind of leads into a big area that I wanted just to hit on briefly here.
And that's that so often our kids pick up these habits of thought, even these habits of identity formation from us as their parents.And this topic of where are you rooting your identity is just as relevant for us as parents as it is for our kids.
What word of advice would you offer to parents as we think about questions of identity?
I mean, I struggle with it myself.I'm a mom, I'm a writer, whatever it may be.But those things change a lot.I mean, I'm entering soon an empty nest stage of life where my role as a mom changes significantly.
And that's really kind of, I guess, reveal different idols in my heart of showing how I have found my identity in motherhood, in my purpose.
feeling a bit unanchored as my kids don't need me as they once did and how one kid I almost hardly ever see because he's just gone doing all of his things he doesn't need a chauffeur anymore and so that can leave me feeling floundering what
What is my purpose today if I'm not doing this thing?And so, for me, it certainly reveals idols of my heart.
And I think that's kind of where our hearts naturally go, is to taking those things that we find our identity in and exalting them in an inordinate way.
Yeah, I think the best books, the best children's books, are books that you can read with your kid, but you're also kind of getting that same message.You're also being challenged and prompted in similar ways.
That's what makes a good Disney movie, as we referenced.They kind of work on multiple levels.I think that's true for kids' books, and I think that's something that your book does so well, where my guess is that as parents read this to their kids and
Again, help to shape how their kids think about themselves.They too will be challenged and pushed towards questioning, how am I rooting my identity right now?What am I putting maybe too much weight on in terms of what I can do?
Yeah, because I think that as we as parents find our identity in who we are in Christ, that makes it easier for us to train our children in that way, certainly.
Well, Christina, thank you so much for taking the time today to walk us through what you're doing in this new book and maybe help all of us think a little bit more carefully about how we view ourselves and then as parents, how we're teaching our kids to do that as well.
That was Christina Fox on teaching kids about their identity.For more, be sure to check out her picture book with Crossway, Who Are You?A Little Book About Your Big Identity.
Pick up a print copy of the book for 30% off directly from Crossway by visiting crossway.org.
If you liked this interview, check out another conversation I had with Kristen Wetherall entitled, Your Kids Are Already Theologians, So Give Them Good Theology.
To listen, click the link in the show notes or search for the episode in Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen.For more audio content like this, subscribe to the Crossway Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player.
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Crossway is a not-for-profit Christian ministry that exists solely for the purpose of proclaiming the truth of God's word through publishing gospel-centered content.Visit us today at crossway.org.
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