Welcome to Stuck in Stony Brook, a podcast about the Babysitter's Club.Today we're discussing Super Special 12, Here Come the Bridesmaids.Oh, I did not realize that was the title.
How are you not reading the titles lately?
I don't know. Well, I'm mostly reading on my Kindle.You still have to look up the book, don't you?Yeah, once.But when you read a hardcover book, you're looking at the cover every time you pick it up.
I see what you're saying.When you open your Kindle, you're like in the middle of it.Yeah.So you're not looking at the title.Yeah.
Well, but would you have guessed the title was?
Something about a joke on bi, coastal, bisexual.
Sure.Sure.I don't think this bit is as good as you guys think this bit is.
Do you guys have your one-sentence summaries?Yes.I mean, sure.
Yeah.Emily, what's yours?The babysitters are all weirdly over-involved in these somewhat random adults' second weddings.
I know.Yeah.Mine was just adults get married again and Jesse has to play Santa Claus.
That was mine.I was like, Jesse's a mall Santa and there are two weddings.Yeah.
Nailed it.I think we all nailed it.Because that was the most bizarre plot in this book.I feel like the fact that we know Peter Laurentiis wrote this, he thought it was funny to do that, which makes it a little cringey.
Well, no, I mean, Anna Martin plots them, so she decided the plot.
Uh, we'll see.I mean, do we know that for sure?
We'll see.We're not gonna get any other information about that.
I feel like it's more like maybe the Ghost Rider outlines it, and then Anna Martin is like, yes or no.
Is yes or no.Yeah, she was out of town when this one got put across her desk, yeah.
No, I don't, to me, it's, we should, I don't know if we want to get into the mall Santa thing yet.It was very believable to me that she would be good at it.
Well, you guys, we should probably back up.Back up! I tell you about the members of the podcast.I'm Annie Chikala, a freelance writer.I'm a mischievous pragmatist with a sweet tooth.
I'm Esme Schaller, an adolescent psychologist.I'm kind of bossy, but I have a big heart.
And I'm Emily Crandall, a feminist scholar.I'm a total individual and I like health food. If you want to learn more about us and how we know each other, check out our prologue episode.Also, rate and review us.It really helps people find the podcast.
And if you have any questions, comments, or commentary about anything BSC related, drop us a line at stuckinstoneybrook at gmail.com.You can also support us on Patreon at patreon.com slash stuckinstoneybrook.
Yes, yes. More places that you can rate us lately.Pocket Casts now has ratings, which it didn't before.So you can rate us on Spotify or Pocket Casts or Apple Podcasts, as far as I know.
So do that.So that we pop up.Pop up.
Pop up.Emily's friends who haven't reviewed us in like five years or whatever, review us on Pocket Casts, please.
They're never going to.I don't think they listen anymore.Rachel listens.Shout out to Rachel.I'm going to get a text about this.
Great.So the recap.All right.Can you do it all?No.Well, Dawn is the high level point of view of this.Yes.She is in California still.Her dad's getting married to... Carol.Carol.
I wish, I wish it wasn't an audio medium sometimes and just made the most pained face that she couldn't remember Carol's name.
And then somehow a bunch of babysitters have to come to California to help get married, including Claudia for a lot of the wedding planning.It seems like most of it.Yeah.Artistic consultant, whatever.
Photography, flowers, uh, other hair, hair and makeup.Yeah.
unclear what Christie's role is, but she ends up taking on.Just being bossy.Yeah.
Jack specifically gives her some bossy roles, though.He wants her to make the aisle and organize the people at the actual ceremony.
But that's not a reason for her to fly out in the first place.No.
And then Marianne's there because she's John's sister.
Yeah, Marianne makes sense.
Yeah. Meanwhile, back in Stony Brook, there's another wedding going on.And this is Ms.Barrett.I always forget all the adults' first names.Barrett and DeWitt.Natalie.Is it Franklin?Mm-hmm.And Franklin.Franklin and Natalie are getting married.
So then the other half of the babysitters are still in Stony Brook dealing with that.
Also working.Mm-hmm.Right.And yeah.And then Jesse Santa Claus.And that's it.
Well, and also the Barretts and the DeWitts are moving into their new house.So there's a plot about we get some perspectives we haven't gotten before.We get Susie Barrett as one of the chapters.Have we had Jeff before?
I feel like maybe we had Jeff back in the first Super Special or something. But I thought Peter Loran just did a nice job of Jeff's voice.
And yeah, Susie's worried that Santa won't be able to find them at their new house because this is all happening at Christmastime.Oh, and Mallory is in a fight with Ben because they're going to take kids caroling.
And then she takes a job helping out at the Barrett-DeWitt wedding.And Ben gets mad at her for not having integrity or something.
How bad Mallory is at singing is like a central plot line.
Yes.Yeah.Also true.Also true. And Dawn's moving back.And Dawn's moving back after all of this happens.Right.Yeah.So what'd you guys think overall?Did you like it?Did you not like it?
I was a little bored, but also I think I cried.I might have just been tired.
Yeah, I cried in the chapter where Dawn describes the wedding and how she realizes her dad is happy.Yeah.Yeah.
Is that when you cried too, Emily?
I don't remember.I was just sort of like low-key crying.Just through the whole thing?You just wept?No, like in the end-ish.Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.But like, I wasn't moved particularly.I just was like involuntary.You were just weepy, yeah.Yeah.
Fair enough.I like that Christmas was in the background.
I like that.I wanted more of that.
You wanted more Christmas?
Yeah, I wanted more Christmas.
Yeah, fair.Yeah, the weddings are like super close to Christmas though.
I also was thinking about like who plans a wedding around the holidays?
Eight days before Christmas.
Well, maybe eight days after Christmas.
I'm assuming for both of them, since these are second weddings, speaking as a person with kids, that's a good time to deal, like for the Barretts and the DeWitts to have some extra time to move into their new house and get the kids settled over the holiday break.
And for Mr. Schaefer to be able to have Don and Jeff flying back and forth and stuff with the school holidays getting out and all of that.
So there may just like summer also works, but a lot of people get married in the summer and it's more expensive.
And so I think the Dewitt's and the Barrett's were just like, let's get this over with and get it now that we have a house, we want to plan it as soon as possible.Right.That was sort of what they implied in the last couple of books.
Yeah.That makes sense.Yeah.There's been a lot of buildup to this.
I did not realize until like four books.Yeah.
I also didn't realize until this book that not only are there two DeWitt families on each coast, but there are two Ryan DeWitts.
Weird.I feel like this is a mistake.
Yeah.They acknowledge it, though.They're like, yes, and there's another Ryan.They're not related.So weird.Yeah, it is weird.Agreed.
Agreed.But that's like the central plot.Yeah.
Yeah, I mean, we've already established, yeah, people do like weddings.There's a reason they always throw them in sitcoms and it makes sense to me that we would have a couple more later in the series.
We've already established that this is irritating to Emily and that while I know all of the reasons that it should be irritating to me, I'm a wedding person and it is not. that I am a shameless wedding liker.
I really liked how like confused Marianne was by the beach wedding and how- The whole chapter was just, I'm like, how old are you?No, this is literally how Gary responded when I said we should get married outside.
There is a certain kind of person who is raised in certain parts of the East Coast who the only way they can picture a wedding is like, inside the place of worship and or in a hotel ballroom.And that's like the only template they have.
Like we are very biased as Californians.This is a thing that a lot of people in a lot of places don't do.Now people do it much more.But that was very believable to me in 1994 that they would be confused by that.
Have you guys been to more inside weddings or outside wedding?
I think mine's pretty equal.I guess I've been to a lot of weddings here, but I've been to some outside weddings here.
Yeah, but this is 30 years ago.Yeah, yeah.I'm just... I thought that was California mythbusters thing that is not actually mythbustery.
I think that that is like much less weird, especially to Southern Californians than it is to people in a lot of other parts of the country.
I mean, the barrier to having your wedding outside is worrying about weather, right?Right.
But you have to do a lot less in Southern California than you have to do in New York.Yeah.So made sense.But yeah, I sort of liked hearing about the two very different kinds of weddings and picturing them and seeing sort of the
more casual approach that Carol and Jack took versus, it sounds like Mrs. Barrett did the whole thing up again.Like it was like, you know, Carol didn't wear a white dress, even though it was her first wedding, I think.
Yeah, that's what I was gonna say.Is she like Cindy Crawford?Like just like whenever they like talk about her.
Honestly.Like she is like the most beautiful woman in the universe.Natalie?Yeah.Yeah.
Yeah, I was kind of surprised she had that gown at her wedding with her seven children.
Yeah, I'm telling you, people in the 90s were talking about that.That was gossip in Stony Brook.Like, can you believe Mrs. Barrett wore that white wedding gown?Yeah, not done.
That's the kind of thing that my mom would have talked shit about after going to a second wedding.Really?Oh, yeah.Wow.
Like, she shouldn't have worn a white dress.
No, just not like, it could be white.
She's not a virgin, Anne.She has three children.
I know.No, it's okay with her if it was white, but it shouldn't be like a big ostentatious gown with a train if it's your second wedding.Like, get over yourself, basically.I'm not saying this.I'm quoting my mother.
I know, but I just, some things about our family's past just clicked for me.
I don't know.I'm with your mom.Anne's going to take a strong stance.
Yeah. You already had your shot at the train.Just make it a smart little number and let's move along.
Yeah.How embarrassing for her.
Yeah, but like also, Marianne packs a plaid dress.
Hilarious.Why is it so funny?
I literally did a spit take.
Even at a winter wedding in Connecticut, you wouldn't wear a plaid dress, would you?
I mean, I think that would be fine if it's like a night, you know, if it's like a holiday, you know how the Bowdoin puts out the like holiday dress and it's maybe satiny or something like, I feel like that would be fine.
But on a beach in Southern California, it's preposterous.
It just reminds me of like the Christmas dresses the kids wore when they were babies.Sure.She's also a child.Yeah. Yes, but she doesn't want to dress like a baby anymore.
Yeah, but I think that you can have a sophisticated plaid dress in the 90s for sure, but not that you would wear on a beach.Right.That's the part that cracked me up.
Yeah, and the way Marianne describes the dress that Dawn picked out for them, which is like, she said, I hated the way my shoulders looked, like big white slabs of beef.
I was gonna propose big white slabs of beef as an episode title.
Oh my God.I've got, there's a lot.I don't know if we're done.There's a lot of good, good, weird slides in this book, but that is a good one.
Did you have anything like cornery as me or mostly just like nuggets and stuff?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.I have something cornery.Well, I, you know, we've talked about this a little bit before, but I haven't actually looked at the literature.I was just thinking, you know, Dawn's arc in this book is,
being glad that she came and spent the six months in California and built the community and being glad that she's there for this making official of her dad and Carol's relationship, coming around on Carol.
She gives this lovely toast about how she knew Carol was lucky, but now she can see that her dad is lucky.The chapter of her observation of their wedding, I think, is quite beautiful, and I'm willing to bet that's where Emily cried.
And then she sort of ends it on this, and now I'm kind of feel whole and I'm ready to go back.And I've like grown as a person, I've learned something about myself.
And it's like, she's very self-conscious about her identity development and the way being Bicoastal, Bicoastal Bells, one of the proposed names for this book they've written, how that has affected her and her identity.
And we've talked before about how in most divorces, Mrs. Schaefer wouldn't be allowed to move Don and Jeff 3,000 miles away, and that that is more unusual now.And granted, that first book came out in 1987.
But I realize I haven't really looked at the literature on effects of parental relocation. of divorce on teens and kids.And so that's what I looked into this week.And it turns out there's a lot in the legal literature, and it's pretty complicated.
And there's not as much data in the psychological literature.And as is often the case, legal precedent does not necessarily adhere close to the science.It adheres to previous legal precedent, right, and people's opinions.
And so there's a bit of back and forth about that. And I'm just making sure I do these in order.The big paper I found was from 2003, and it's by Braver, Ellman, and Fabricius.
And it's called Relocation of Children After Divorce and Children's Best Interests, New Evidence and Legal Considerations. So basically, the trend has gone back and forth over time about whether or not people are allowed to relocate.
And this was the first study.
It was a cross-sectional study looking retrospectively at college students' experiences after divorce to actually look at the impact on children and teens of a parent relocating, whether it's the primary custodial parent or the other parent.
And it's interesting because there was some judge, well, I'm not sure if it's a judge, somebody named Wallerstein filed amica curiae, which is a friend of the court brief in 1995 that was referenced a bunch of times.
that said, in general, what is good for the custodial parent is good for the child, which led to a lot of opinions of like, well, if this mom has this wonderful new job and these other opportunities, that's definitely going to be better for the kid, even if it's six states away from the father.
So we should go with that.And so there was a spate of those kinds of decisions. from around this time into the early 2000s.And this was the first study to actually look at outcomes for people.And in the case of this study, on most outcomes,
kids whose parents moved were significantly disadvantaged in a bunch of different areas.
So more depressive symptoms, poor academic achievement, more hostility towards both parents, poor relationship with multiple parents, even if parents remarried, it was indicative, if one parent was living farther away, it was indicative of a poorer relationship with any step parents.
They made poorer relationship choices, they used more substances, and they had lower scores on general life satisfaction.So this was all for if a parent had moved more than, I think it was a two hours drive away.
So this caused a big splash because, again, there hadn't been any data.It had been all these legal opinions back and forth. And this doesn't come out for another six, seven years after this book.
But it just made me think about what would the impact be on Dawn?And given how torn she's felt, we get this nice closing chapter, which is sort of like, I don't feel torn.I feel lucky.I have two real homes, and isn't that great?
And I just kind of don't trust it because of how torn she's been.
You know, and even Jeff is like, maybe I'll do what Don did and come back for a semester.You know, hanging out with the triplets was pretty fun.And it's like it was so traumatic for him in the first place.Right.Yeah.
It does have a little bit of like a, I don't know, happy go lucky, happy ending sheen.Yes.
Yes. So yeah, so that's just a little bit of a bummer.And then more recently, in 2018, two of the same authors, Fabricius and Braver, are at Arizona State.But along with Stevenson and Cookston, there is a study that's actually longitudinal.
So my guess is they started working on it right after that cross-sectional study.So this is associations between parental relocation following separation in childhood and maladjustment in adolescence and young adulthood.
So they followed 81 kids who were starting around age 12, so starting at Dawn's age when they divorced, right?And 38 of them had been separated by more than an hour's drive, and the rest of them hadn't.And so they were able to look longitudinally
across five different time points from ages 12 to 22.
And they found that long-distance separation from biological fathers was linked in adolescence and young adulthood to serious behavior problems, anxiety and depression symptoms, and disturbed relationships with all three parental figures.
And these associations held after controlling for a lot of variables that you would think might explain those things.So they controlled for mother-stepfather conflict, domestic violence, mother's family income,
and the relationship quality between the biological parents.So even controlling all those things, the thing that seems to have the biggest impact is that geographical distance.
Wow.That's kind of crazy.
Right?I was surprised it was that strong.And it's a pretty well-controlled study.Again, it's hard to do longitudinal work. You have to follow up with people over a long period of time.
And as you might imagine, there's not a lot of money in this type of research.So it's not like you can pay people thousands of dollars to stay in contact.You're relying on the goodwill of the teen and at least one parent.
So it's kind of remarkable they actually had even that high of an N. But all the associations are like B less than 0.001.They're statistically quite significant. So I was surprised at that as well, just at how severe an impact it has.
And obviously, this is looking at kids who have some contact with both parents.So I think it's a different situation when it's a Christie situation.
Obviously, there's other ways to look at it, but this is for parents who at least have some custody and some contact.There's just the impact of them being geographically far away.
And then I also looked at one that was specifically about non-residential father engagement six years after divorce and the way it predicts long-term outcomes.This is by Medecky and et al.And it came out in 2015.
And they actually found that the best, they looked at
In short, they made models of how involved the non-residential dad was, so this is assuming Dawn's in Connecticut, right, in Jackson, California, how involved he is in her day-to-day life, and how much conflict he has with her mom, okay?
And so they found three or four different categories, like high involvement, high conflict, moderate involvement, low conflict, and low involvement, moderate conflict.
And they actually found that the best situation was moderate involvement and low conflict.So conflict seemed to carry the weight.Even being more involved is not better, even if it was moderate conflict.
The group of kids as they did this factor analysis and the group of kids that was doing the best, the dad was moderately involved and there was low conflict with the parent that he had divorced.
So in that group, the academic achievement was the highest. And it had the lowest number of externalizing problems, which is like rule breaking behaviors up to nine years after the divorce.
But all of this is still just indicating that really big impact that I think was surprising to it sounds like was surprising to you guys, too.But it was certainly surprising to me.
So I just it made me think about, like, what is the impact of Don and Jeff over time?And how would we see that differ from, say, Stacey, who's an hour train ride away? and can easily see her dad on an evening.
He could come watch her be in a play or whatever.It's not the same as having to get on that plane.
When does she move back to California?
In like five more books. I mean, there'll be some mysteries in there too, so it might be like eight or nine books.
Yeah, 85, I'm looking at it.
Interesting.Well, that's interesting because she's definitely more like in the California Diaries.
Oh, I'm sorry, 88.88 books?Yeah, book 88.We just finished book 80 recently.Okay.
I was just going to say that's interesting because I know that the these books are pitched for a slightly older audience, but in the California Diaries, like all the girls engage in some of that stuff that I would imagine is correlated with some of those outcomes, like kind of higher risk taking behavior, like breaking rules, that kind of thing.
Yeah.Yeah.I doubt that was a motivator for this.
No, I doubt that was a motivator, too.And in my tracks.Yeah.Yeah, yeah, yeah.Yeah. So that was what I was thinking about.Yeah, I have other like dumb little nuggets, but they'll probably come up as you guys are talking about your areas.My areas?
Yeah, which get them.I mean... Other than being annoyed at compulsory heterosexuality and marriage.Always.
Yeah, it's just this idea that like, you know, we were sort of poking fun at the difference in eventness between the two weddings.Right.
And it's like Carol's it's not even Carol's second wedding, but like the idea that you have to have a wedding at all.Right.
But that it needs to be this kind of like elaborate, extravagant thing that where you do all the customary stuff, even though you've already been married, it's like the kind of funny the kind of funny thing, I think.
But it was interesting to me that Carol and Jack, is his name, all their scripted little fights in the lead up to the wedding were super gender normative too.
Carol has a moving truck full of furniture that she's gonna bring to the house, which also, by the way, gets stolen, the whole van, the whole truck.I think it's stolen. She's like, it's okay.Yeah.
She's like, I actually didn't like that furniture anyway.I just didn't like you telling me what to do, you know, which is just like so funny.And are we supposed to read her in that moment as like being feminist leaning?
It's like a rebellion against his like patriarchal status as the like head of the family.Or is she supposed to be like read as like a ditz? You know what I mean?
Yeah.I thought it was the former.Yeah.And we don't certainly could read it both ways.
But we don't really get any inkling into what her internal life vis-a-vis, like having some step kids now or like what investment she has in like the the norm, the normal institution of marriage or whatever.
You know, we just get from Dawn that she's this like she's cool and she's fun, but she's like a little wild or maybe a little crazy, like I don't know.It's weird.
Is she ever get pregnant in the California?
I don't remember.I don't think so.Yeah.You look it up, but I want to be surprised.Okay, well, I'll look it up and then I'll forget and then I'll still be surprised.
And how old is she?Do we think she is?
She's younger than Sharon, that's, I don't know, 30?Yeah.Maybe.
Only because I feel like they were like painting her as this like ex-tippie or something because- No, that's Sunny's parents, right?
No, but they're- Do you mean because of the lava lamp?
Yeah, and also the lava lamp and like they're talking like old like Afghans she had over.So I think it's all very like.
Yeah, but it could have been her parents.No, I think those are signals of her proximity to college.
Oh, geez.Yeah, that's the idea.
That she like still has stuff that she collected in college because she hasn't actually been out of college all that long.
Yeah, that's what I thought it was, too. Yeah.So maybe she's like 25.That's what I think.Yeah.
But we know Jack is pretty young because Don talks about like he looked like he was in college again, like when they when they first got together when we were really little.So I think Jack was like I think Jack is only like 36, 37 at most.
I think he and Sharon were right out of college because they met in college when they had Don.
Babies having babies, you know, for real.
I thought the weird fights between Dawn and Marianne were a little confusing.Oh, yeah.
Can we get into this?This is so dumb.
Yeah, so Dawn, in her chapters, she's like, I'm so excited for me and Marianne to be bridesmaids.So she buys two of her dress as their bridesmaids' dresses, because bridesmaids wear the same dress.
I gotta say, even in that chapter, I was like, when did we learn that Marianne is gonna be a bridesmaid?Okay, is this, usually they're more didactic in a babysitter's club book.Is this true?Why would Marianne be a bridesmaid?
That's a weird choice for Carol to make.
I did not interrogate it at all. So Marianne packs a dress and then Dawn is like, surprise, I got you a bridesmaid's dress because we're supposed to match because we're bridesmaids.And Marianne was like, what do you mean I'm a bridesmaid?
And gets upset that she didn't know and she doesn't want to show her big white meat slabs or whatever on the beach because she's going to get sunburned.
Well, and she also doesn't want to be the center of attention in any way, which tracks completely.
Yeah, she doesn't want people to look at her.Don's like, they're not going to look at you at all.And then she gets offended.She's like, well, what do you mean they're not going to look at me?
And then when they're all they're all together talking about plans, Don says, what about the rest of the wedding party?And Jack says, there is no rest of the wedding party.And then they Marianne's like, ain't upset again.
Like, oh, I just got used to the idea and now I don't get to do it.Nobody cares about me.Just taking it to the darkest place possible.And then they get in a fight over it.
And that to me was somewhat indicative of some of these problems that Dawn may be experiencing given her bi-coastalism.I don't know, was that believable that she would just assume?In what world do you just assume?
At 13, I knew that you have to be asked to be a bridesmaid.
Also, this is very much out of pace with the, Dawn is actually not like Sharon, right?
And at one point, Miriam, in her trying to make peace with the situation, says, you know, I forget sometimes that Sharon is Dawn's mom and she must have more in common with her than I think.Dawn's being spacey, it must be her genes.It's so weird.
It does not track with Don being the one who writes the ship, you know what I mean?At home, before Richard moves in.Although I guess, I don't know, maybe you're right.It's this impact of the... I don't know.
What did you think, Anne, from a writerly perspective?
I mean, I just think he likes, I feel like this is like some form of like comedy slapstick or something.
It's like Lucy and Ethel or something like that, like fighting in an episode or it's like- They didn't rip the dresses.
Yeah, but it's like they're supposed to be fighting but it's also supposed to be funny.
in this way.Yeah, I can see that.So weird, though.
OK, they I'm going to change gears here a little bit.Great.In the chapter where they're describing everyone, it's not a proper chapter two, but there is like a bit of a this is who everyone is, at least of the babysitters.
They Peter Lourandus differentiates that Jesse is black and Mal is white.He describes Mal as white.I feel like we've not had that before.
No, we've had it.Have we?Yeah, a number of them say, Jesse is black and Mal is white.
I thought that they didn't.I thought it was always like, they're really similar, except Jesse's black.
But they do do that a lot also.
They do that as well.But they've definitely called Mal white.They don't call anybody else white.They only call Mal white in contrast to Jesse being black.
Yeah, it just stood out to me.Much like many of the other girls. Um, but the, but the other funny thing is that is like the inner motivation that Jesse summons to become Santa is that like, I could inspire young black kids.And it's like, so funny.
Black girls can be Santa too.
I don't think that's what she meant.I know, but... Black girl Santa magic.
Yeah, like borderline.I just thought it was a very amusing way to bring the racial identity politics somewhere into this story.
Yeah.And there's the one scene where there's a little boy who's Black who like stays by her for a long time while she's at the mall.Yeah.What were you saying?
Oh, I think it's funny how everyone else is like, you're going to be great.And Jesse's like, am I the only one who thinks this is weird?Like, you know, it's like, why is everyone around?Yeah.Like, uh, this is weird.Right.
And everyone's like, you're going to be great.It doesn't matter.And it's like, what?Yeah.
He's literally like a old fat guy.Who's like, has a white beard.
Like maybe I could teach classes for other teenagers who want to be mall Santa.
I just, like, absolutely killed me.I thought it was so funny.And the description, or the explanation, too, of, like, why it's not weird is, I thought was really funny.
It's probably kind of true that, like, the kids who believe will just invent whatever excuse that they need to, so that it doesn't, you know, like, contradict their worldview.
I feel like if I were a five-year-old and I went to the mall and there was an 11-year-old black girl dressed as Santa, I would pick up on it.It's not that she's black, it's that she's 11, right?
Well, exactly.Yeah, yeah.
I think at first glance, you're like, why is there a child dressed up as Santa?Yes.And then maybe it's somewhere along later, like, oh wait, she's also black, which, you know.
i've seen like black santas who are like adult men adult men yeah exactly yes and who like have real beards underneath the fake beard right yeah who are plausible as old jolly souls yeah yeah it's funny yeah yeah that's funny yeah killed me there was one other thing i was going to talk about and i forgot it left my brain well i have a question for you that might maybe it was what you were going to talk about maybe it'll bring you back to your brain
So the thing we didn't talk about is that Stacey is one of- Oh, yes.
Go on.Why is Stacey Natalie's bridesmaid?Also, she has like six young bridesmaids and Stacey's like chatting with them in the bathroom and she's like, oh, it felt just like a BSC meeting, but like older.
And it was such a weird choice and like a funny scene.
I wanted to get your take on that.So they're cracking up, they get in trouble with the old woman at the church, and they have the giggles, and Stacey's just hanging, and they're also like, oh my God, I wish I had your skin.
Oh my God, I wish I had your hair.Yeah, it's horrifying. She's 13.Yeah, if Mrs. Barrett was going to have one of the BSC, it would be Dawn.Yes.Very obviously, right?So the reason she has Stacey is because someone gets sick, right?
Someone has to bow out or someone has to can't travel.
One of her roommates can't come at the last minute.But she says, you've been so helpful lately, right?Because Stacey was the one babysitting when they were going house hunting or whatever.Yeah.
and thus, I want you to be in my wedding, small 13-year-old person who I pay to watch my children.
Do you know the reason why?I know why.
Is it because they need to match up with the groomsmen?
Obviously. Traditional weddings like this are about symmetry, and Franklin still has his, like, six dudes, and she can't only have five, it won't look good in the pictures.That's a thousand percent.And then Stacey is the hottest member of the BSC.
I was just gonna say, does she pick Stacey because he looks the oldest and he's the hottest?
Yes.One thousand percent.
Also, what would your mom say about a second marriage where a woman has six bridesmaids?
She would also not be okay with that. Also ridiculous.
The only exception is if the first wedding was like a shotgun annulment or something, and you never had a wedding at all.But if you had a real first wedding, then all this is bullshit, according to Lexi Landahl.
I have been to and in several weddings where there were uneven numbers.
Yes, because you're a millennial.This is 1994, Emily.It was not done.
None of these bridesmaids have tattoos. They're all just very plain and boring.
Now I'm thinking about the movie, what's, oh, 27 Dresses.Yeah.
Yeah.Yeah.So that is a thousand percent why she picked Stacey, because she looks the oldest and is the prettiest.I am convinced.
They're all like, I want to cut off your skin and wear it.
But I did like that.It was silly, but I also liked that line.It was like a BSC meeting, but older.Because I liked that little peek into adulthood.It seemed like a moment... Huh?Adult friendship.Yeah.
It seemed like a moment for Stacey to be like, oh, I don't have to leave this all behind.Adult women are friends.We're friends.
Yeah.Adult women can hang out at weddings together.Be bridesmaids.
Aw, we're gonna all be each other's bridesmaids.
Yeah, I thought it was cute, but I did also have that same, like, this is bullshit, oh, I know why she picked her.
Yeah, it's kind of gross.Michelle would have been picked, not us.Oh yeah, for sure.For sure.
All right.Anything else in your nuggets, Em?
The only other nugget I had Anne's going to talk about.
Yeah.We can just segue into that really quick.
Really quick.Okay.Okay.My last nugget is one of the We Love Kids Club members has dreads.
I mean, it's just, okay. It's the early 90s, alternative stuff is big.By this point, Lollapalooza has started, and white people have dreads.I try to do a little bit of research about just different opinions of white people with dreads or
And some people are like, okay, like, I read an essay by a Black woman who seemed okay with it.And other people are not okay with it.You know, it's just a matter of opinion.
But it is interesting to look back at that time in culture where it was just a signifier of being alternative. Or like you were like different and like you weren't mainstream.You were part of a subculture.Yeah.
And Maggie's portrayed as like edgy and like ahead of the right.
Right.Well, yeah.I mean, for non-blondes have been out for a while.Is Linda Perry the most famous white person in this period?
Oh, right, Ani DiFranco, sure.
Ani DiFranco, let's see.Who else had dreads?Well, back in the early 90s, it was probably, well, oh, the guy from Counting Crows.
I thought he was half black, half Jewish.
Oh, that's possible.I thought he was just Jewish.
Maybe he's just Jewish.No offense to anybody, I just like Adam Duritz.Adam Duritz ethnicity. Oh my god.He's Jewish.
He's Jewish.Okay, so he's a Jewish guy with dreads.
He just convinced me with his dreads.Oh my god.
Well, see how that happens.
Okay, wait, also- I'm so deeply about it.
Okay, when I just Google Adam Duritz, just his name, and how Google pulls it, people also ask, okay, this is what it says.Does Adam Duritz have multiple personalities?Oh my god.And is his hair real?
And did he date Courtney Cox, which he didn't, I guess.Wow.Yeah.He got a lot of, he dated a lot of hot women for not being, for being a Jewish guy with dreads.
People really liked that band.
Oh wait, it says he has a longstanding battle with dissociative disorder.
Yeah, but that's, let's do that another time.No, no, I'm not going there.Go ahead.Go back to the white people with dreads.
Yeah.Where I grew up, a lot of the white people with dreads were Hare Krishnas.
Is there, hang on Google, Hare Krishna dreads.
Um, uh, Jonathan, well, Jonathan Davis from corn was good.Lady Gaga had dreads at some point.This isn't in the 90s anymore.Justin Bieber, Chris Kirkpatrick from Backstreet Boys.Oh, right.Yeah.
Lots of, lots and lots of people have, lots of white people have dreads.
Oh, Christina Aguilera had them for a while.Oh, right.
Yeah.We didn't even think about it back then.
Yeah, it's true.It's true.
The conversation about Linda Perry was not about that she had dreads.
But it was a conversation.
I mean, I feel like that song was polarizing even as it was totally popular at the time.
Yeah, I really don't.Whenever that song comes on on karaoke now, I can't listen to it.
Oh, okay.I still love it.
Remind me to do that song next time I'm at karaoke with you.
Yeah, well, I'm going to do All Star next time I see you.Touche, bitch.All right, what else you got, Anne?OK, so when the babysitters were flying to California, they watched an in-flight movie.The in-flight movie ended our conversation.
It was a comedy about a dog, which we'd all seen but watched again anyway. Can you name that movie?
I think it's Beethoven.Because that came out in 1992.I'm so excited.Yeah.But did you know that John Hughes wrote that movie?
I did know that.No, I did not.
He wrote that movie under a pseudonym.And the pseudonym was Edmund Dantes, which is an homage to a character in The Count of Monte Cristo.And he used that name to also, he wrote Maiden Manhattan too, apparently.
Yeah.And one other movie, it was called something I've never heard of, but it was like a Judd Apatow movie.Oh, Joel Bitt Taylor.So he also wrote that movie under the pseudonym.
But have you, have you watched, I watched Beethoven recently, like within the last year.Emily, have you ever seen it?
A really long time ago, I don't remember it at all.
Esme, have you seen it?Same.
But a long time ago?Yeah.Okay.So the plot is very weird.So it's obviously- Charles Grodin?Charles Grodin and Bonnie Hunt are the parents.
And basically, there's this St.Bernard- St.Bernard.A puppy.They find it and they just keep it.And Charles Grodin plays this very cranky, typey, very neat dad.But they're like, we want the puppy, we want the puppy.So yeah, there's just a lot of
comedy with that, with Beethoven just being destructive, but the kids love him and it brings the family closer together.But there's this vet they go see, and the vet is actually the villain.
He is somehow being paid by a bullet company to conduct an experiment on pets with large skulls. So like, it's like a test to test these bullets.So like, oh my god.
Yeah, so the vet like shoots, like he's looking for like, he wants, he wants Beethoven because he has a big human sized head.So he's like, wants, yeah, so he likes, he's like, lies.He like pretends Beethoven bit him.
So he's like, oh, you have to give up your dog.So then Charles Gordon's like, well, he's not, you know, he's gonna like hurt us.We have to give him up.So he takes him to the vet.And then the vet like tries to like shoot him with a gun.
But then Beethoven gets saved by the family.It's very strange.
What the Fuck.That is more of a jolly family comedy.
It is.I mean, the thing is, if you watched it, you wouldn't be like, this is, you just kind of go along with it.You're like, yeah, that makes sense.But then after you finish watching it, you're like, that was really funny.
Right.Cruella de Vil wants to make a giant coat out of puppies.
Exactly.Sure.Yeah.Yeah, exactly.Same thing.
Anyway.I'll put it that way.You guys know what movie about a dog I watched the most?
I loved Air Bud.I watched Air Bud 2.There's so many Air Bud movies.
Big fan of the franchise.Don't talk to Keely about it.
No, there's like some dark background stuff on the Air Bud franchise.
Oh, I'm sure.Yeah.Yeah, that's not surprising to me at all.Yeah.Very sad.
Eh, it's fine.Anne, there's someone worried about us getting canceled.
No, Anne wants us to get canceled now.I can't help things that have happened already.We might as well enjoy them.
That's a better way to live.Oh my God.All right.Okay.Also, my one last gripe is that, so in Claudia's, like one of her entries, which she misspells everything, she misspells chocolate.
What?Okay.She knows how to spell chocolate.Chocolate's kind of hard to spell.No, but she sees it all the time.
Yeah.Chocolate's not something she struggles with sustained mental effort.
Yeah.Anyway. I'm over these writers making Claudia look like an idiot.
I mean, the spelling is so bad.
You guys have to get over it.
Do we know anyone who is dyslexic who can write something for us?
She's not dyslexic.She has ADHD.She does not have dyslexia.That's been established.She was tested.
God, you don't even pay attention, much like Claudia when she's writing words.
Yeah. And quick, how do you spell chocolate?
She spells it a crazy way, though.I'm trying to find it.Oh, wait.Also, can you talk about the household help and how Jeff is worried she's going to get fired?Oh, my God.Yeah.
Yeah.He's worried Mrs. Bruin's going to get fired.
That's cute.I thought that was cute.
Yeah.I thought it was really funny when Mrs. Bruin is like, actually, Carol's even messier, so they're going to pay me more.
I know.I doubled my hours.
What does Carol do? Great Q. No idea.Yeah, we don't know anything about her job, huh?
No, I don't think she does anything.But this is what I mean about how are we supposed to read her vis-a-vis, I don't know, her orientation to the world.Anyway.
And did you have anything else?
No, I mean, there's little things.
I remembered the other thing I wanted to ask you about, Emily, which was in Stacey's epilogue, when she starts getting all of the bridal male, like the sheer capitalism that comes at Stacey because she registered her bridesmaid's dress.
I know.Well, actually, I was thinking about looking something up, and then I was like, I don't want to go down this rabbit hole, but I'm curious about the degree to which male, the scam, the grand scheme of the scam of
Like you sign up for one thing thinking it's something and then all of a sudden you're inundated with it.
I mean, it makes it like is reminiscent of like, Oh, your passwords were found on, you know, 25 websites because something sold your data or whatever.It's like, I like when, what is that?What's the beginning of that pattern?
You know what I mean?Oh yeah.I don't know, but it was definitely happening in the nineties.Yeah.
I just didn't want to get bummed out for once.
Yeah.Fair enough.That's a brave life choice.Listen,
It's better if you just don't know it.
It happened before.We can't do anything about it.
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la.Did Claudia have candy in?They got candy at the airport.They got Goobers and Heathfires.All right.Could be better, could be worse.That's weird airplane candy.Yeah. What's the best airplane candy?
Criteria for airplane candy, things that are like they will last the flight and you won't get tired of it.So something like air patches, something gummy.
Yeah, I always get gummy bears on a flight.
But Goobers are just chocolate covered peanuts, right?So that's like you get a little protein and they're individual.The Goobers make more sense to me than the Heath par.
It's a flight snack.It's satisfying.Peanuts are traditional flight snacks.You don't have to think about nutrition when you're eating on a plane.
Oh, is that?That's the rule.I'm learning all kinds of life rules from Ann today.
Yeah.I mean, okay.When you get on a plane, you get tomato juice or whatever, right?
Yeah, unless it's one of those fucking airlines that just serves Bloody Mary mix.I'm real mad.
Yeah.But do you drink tomato juice normally?
No, it's a special plane treat.
I would, if it just showed up in my house, I would happily drink it.I just never think to buy it.
I'm just saying the plan is where you just let yourself do what you want.
I'm sorry, are you equating my tomato juice with Sour Patch Kids?Tomato juice has so much sodium in it.
No, with not worrying about a snack with protein.
I need sodium.My doctor tells me to increase my sodium intake.My blood pressure is getting lower as I get older.Increase your sodium intake.Literally, literally, my doctor just told me to do that two weeks ago.
She's going to start producing her own salt, like her sweat.She's just going to like harvest her own sweat and it's just going to be salt.Throw a little salt lick around.
Everything that's happening right now is gross.
All right, not a lot of tallies.Almond sticks around, and we got a shy, and I think that was it, yeah.
I liked the, what was it again?
But also, what is the description on the tag of Don's bridesmaid's dress?It's like from the beginning.
I don't think it'd work for an episode title, but I thought it was really silly.
You know what I'm talking about?Radiant and luminous. Is that what it is?Yeah.Yeah.It says a radiant, luminous, and up to the minute bridesmaid.Yes.
Yeah.Up to the minute.I was like, what the fuck?
I liked a lot of lines in this book.I liked all of their proposed names for the book, like East West Marriage Fest.I liked that the store in the mall is called Health's Angels.
Yeah, I like that one too.
And I also like that they got takeout from a place called Body Soul Joy.
I know.So bad.Also, the description of the food they get there is like unhinged.
Also, when they went to the mall, they tried to go to Health Angels twice, by the way.
And then I also liked Jeff saying to Mr. Schaefer, I gave it the trough to tell him, but yeah, but there's a lot of good ones.I don't know.
What did you have?Well, besides the meat slab, what about when Shannon says, who says Santa can't be black?
Oh my god, that would actually be such a good title.All right, are we going with that?Yeah, we're doing that, because, wait, the title of the book is Here Come the Bridesmaids.Who Said Santa Can't Be Black?Perfect.
Wonderful, wonderful.OK, so what should we pizza toast to?Health, body, soul. Body, soul, joy.Oh, God.Oh, I don't want a pizza toast to Madame Noelle's yikes comment that no one wants to see dancing hippos.I was like, oh no.Yeah, pretty bad.
No, no, no.Claudia's fine work at the wedding and her collaboration with Lyle the Flowerist was another one that I had written.
Wait, sorry, back up.I forgot I wanted to talk about how Claudia's parents wouldn't let Dawn's dad pay for the ticket.
Oh, I was like, that is so Japanese.
I was like, okay.Okay.I see you, Peter Laurentius.
You got it.You win.They're like, no, no, no.We'll take on credit card debt and then you can earn the money and then you can pay us back.
It's true.Should we pizza toast to that, to the accurate representation of the Kishis?Sure.All right.Pizza toast to Peter Lorange's doing his Japanese-American homework.To accuracy.Yeah.Accuracy.
This episode of Stuck in Stony Brook is now adjourned.
Thank you to Anna Martin for everything.Stuck in Stony Brook is edited by Emily Crandall.Theme song written and recorded by Gary Schaller.Performed by the band Kid Kit.
You can follow us on Instagram at StuckinStoneybrook or find us on our website, StuckinStoneybrook.com.Need some books that we mentioned?
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