I met my best friend Anne in 1985.
Then the Babysitter's Club kept her friendship alive.Then Emily was born in 1988 and she said, Thanks Aunt Esme, these books are great.Now we're all grown up and we're living our dreams.As a writer and a scholar and an expert on teens.
And we're gonna start again from the very first book because we're stuck.
Welcome to Stuck in Stony Brook, a podcast about the Babysitter's Club.Today we're discussing Stacey's book, the first book in the six book portrait collection.
That's gonna be a long, long little mini arc among the other books.Yeah.Are they all in a row?Okay.No, one comes out every couple months, so they'll be sprinkled in like the mysteries or the super specials.
But I think you know how we tend to like Stacey and Christy and Claudia's voices best?That's the order of the first three.It's Stacey, and then Christy, and then Claudia.And then we still got three more.Yikes.Yeah.Yikes, yikes, yikes.
I would have liked this better as a child than I did as an adult.But yeah, it's a little, we'll get into it.
We'll get into it.Shall we do one sentence summaries?Yes.I've thought about trying to get clever with like the format, but I've just, I couldn't, it didn't lend itself well to it.So I just went with Stacy's autobiography is 30% about Claudia.
As it should be.Mine would be 30% about Ann. 30%? Oh, she's putting a thumb up in the air.Gesturing higher, yeah.I mean, my hands would be at 4% about me.
Yeah, my summary, that's funny when you said the format, as you said that, I was like, when I was 46.But my actual summary is, I wish Anna Martin wrote this book. Because I do think Jean Betancourt.Who's that?One of the ghostwriters.
I don't think she's totally new.I can check.I think she's done another one or two.But I just feel like Anne would have given it a little bit more pizzazz.
Okay, here's my one sentence summary.It seems like someone old wrote this book. Right.It seems like a book like you check out from the library that's been there forever.And you're like, oh, isn't this quaint?
All these little things that happen that aren't that interesting.
Yeah.I mean, the and it's weird, too, because it's like the first chapter one and chapter 15 are like Stacey Metta explaining the project that she has to write an autobiography.And then the bulk of it is just the whole project.
But it's like 13 chapters long.Yeah.Which.Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.
Yeah, so hey, Anne, good scouting.Jean Betancourt is new.This is her first book, but we will get more of her.She writes most of the portrait collection, except she does not write Christie or Claudia.So maybe those will be different.
She writes three of the California Diaries, the first Super Mystery, and then her finest work is she writes four episodes of the TV series. Oh, wow.The 1990 TV series.Wow.
How do you spell her name?
J-E-A-N-N-E.Benning Court?Betten, B-E-T-A-N Court.
Oh, okay.I want to see how old this woman is.
Or how old she was in 1994.So she was born in 1941. Oh, so she was already 53 when she wrote this book.
So you're correct.Yeah.I knew it.Not old by modern standards.Very young.Right.But old in 1994.
Oh, boy.Jean.Jean.Okay.You guys, we should probably back up and tell you about the members of the podcast.I'm Esme Schaller, an adolescent psychologist.I'm kind of bossy, but I have a big heart.
I'm Emily Crandall, a feminist scholar.I'm a total individual, and I like health food.
And I'm Annie Chikawa, a freelance writer.I'm a mischievous pragmatist with a sweet tooth.Sorry, I laughed because I don't know why.I was trying to be a little sassy with my delivery, and then it just didn't pan out.
If you want to learn more about us and how we know each other, check out the prologue episode. Also, rate and review us.It really helps people find the podcast.
If we have any questions, comments, or commentary about anything BSC related, drop us a line at stuckinstoneybrook at gmail.com.You can also support us on Patreon at patreon.com slash stuckinstoneybrook.
No new patrons today.Wow.Rude.
Everyone should sign up so we can avoid Emily's ire.
Yeah.I'm filled with rage.
Okay, Emily, what do we learn about Stacey and the different stages of Stacey's life in this book?
Okay, so when Stacey, we learn Stacey has a handful of early memories that seem to be a little early from moving when she's like four.Oh, when she's like three?
Yeah, three and four.Yeah, but moving is a really big event.Yeah.So kids, they're just like little snapshots.
Yeah, most of her memories start around five.She tells a story about like the transition from preschool to kindergarten and being nervous, right?
So there's, I think basically it's like five, eight, 10 and 12 are the major ways, like subheadings of the way that she organizes her own autobiography. And then she tells sort of like one formative story in each section.
And then there's a light theme kind of connecting them, which is about really about like her how she has related to people kind of from a young person up into now super sophisticated and wise 13 year old. Yeah.
So the like kindergarten story is this whole thing about Cinderella.She doesn't know what it is.And Lane's like, why don't you know what Cinderella is?And then they go see a preview of the movie.
Yeah.Like the re-release.
Re-released in theaters.And then Stacy's mom has apparently just taken a job at Macy's.So Stacy gets to be in the parade and ride in the Cinderella float.And it's, you know, she's sort of overwhelmed the whole day.
And then the one section of the parade where they're in front of Macy's, Stacey isn't actually on TV because Cinderella's crown flies off and she's bending over getting it for her.So she saves the crown, but nobody sees her on TV.
But like, it ends up not really being that dramatic.
Anne's very upset by this somehow. What's the look of disgust on your face, Anne?
I don't know.I just thought this was like a leave it to beaver plot or something.It's like, oh, I bent over and whoops, no one saw me on TV.
Yeah, it kind of was like that.I mean, that's what happened, right? Yeah.And then what's the eight one?Oh, the eight year old one is Stacey and Lane or their moms are sending them to a ballroom dancing class.
But they're also in going through a phase where they feel like their mom's leash on them is a little too tight.They're not allowed to walk to each other's apartments, even though they only live, you know, however many blocks away.
They're allowed to go just outside by themselves to the ice cream parlor around the corner.And they're like trying to test their boundaries.So one day they go get ice cream.But they say last time the line was really long.
And we're going to eat there instead of bringing it home.So then they like go a couple blocks outside of the radius of where they're allowed.And they're like, this is great.We were totally safe and nothing went wrong.
So they don't want to go to ballroom dancing.So instead, they just keep every class that they get away with missing.
They keep pushing further and further of what they can get away with until finally they make the mistake of trying to go to FAO Shorts, which is too far away.They show up and the bus is slow.There's traffic.They show up back up to dance super late.
There's like a cop car there.
Yeah, they never even get to F.A.O.Schwartz.They realize they're not going to make it in time.So they get off and then they have to walk to Madison and switch buses.
And then their punishment is that they don't get to hang out for six weeks, except they have to still go to the ballroom dancing class.Yeah.
I was like, that's perfect, actually, I think.
That's like, well, yeah, like take away the one thing, which is their free time together.Right.And then they can see each other, but they have to do this thing that they committed to and then flaked on.Yeah.And lied about.Mm hmm.And lied about.Yeah.
The 10 year old story is they go to a very small island in Maine where there's only four houses.And Stacey's very upset because the last vacation they went to was like to Ireland and Scotland or whatever.
She really wants to go to Disneyland or something fancy.
She'd already been to St.Lucia before.Yeah.
So she thought an island like, oh, I get to go to the beach, blah, blah, blah.And she's like, like really judgmental about all the things that there are to do on this island.
There's one young girl who lives on the island who's the same age as Stacey and they don't really hit it off right away because they have a hard time connecting.
Stacey keeps asking her questions about like, what do you even do here that she interprets as rude questions.
I guess that's why you're so good at checkers because there's nothing else to do.
Nothing else to do.Yeah.So Stacy perceives her defensiveness as an insult and then just kind of keeps acting a little bitchy.And then her dad falls off a stool.
And this girl, Mara, turns out to be a sort of like a small child with an incredible set of useful skills.She can, for example, drive a truck and a boat. And like helps Stacy's parents get her dad to the hospital.
And there's also tension with her parents, right?Like he brought his briefcase and he was going to work on vacation, even though the whole point of going to this island was that he'd never takes vacation, blah, blah, blah.
So she's also like planting a lot of earlier seeds in her memory for their divorce.
And he doesn't just bring the briefcase.He makes Stacey hide it in her suitcase.So Stacey's complicit with keeping this secret from her mom, which is super yucky.
Yeah, not great.Not cool, Ed.Also, Stacey's first babysitting job is during this emergency.Mara has a little sister who's one, and Stacey's kind of jealous, I think, that Mara's parents trust her to stay home alone with the baby.And she's
finds it really fun and cute and imagines like, what if I had this little sister and I and my parents trusted me enough right to like, let me stay home and be the caregiver.
And then the 12 year old story is during the time when Stacy's back in New York, and Claudia comes to visit.So it's a separate time from the visits we've already gotten. Right.
Yeah.Right.Yeah.It's not Stacy's mistake.It's not New York, New York.
Yeah.Right.And so there and there's like some tension between them.Like anytime they're kind of out doing fun things, Claude seems like really quiet, withdrawn.But when they're at home, she seems normal and fine.
And yeah, she's like New York City, basically.
Yeah.Stacey is like, hey, do you want to go to Betsy Johnson?She's like, it's OK.
Yeah, yeah.It's not that cool.It's not that cool.I don't think I'd even like anything there.We have movies.Yeah.It turns out they both have a little bit of insecurity about the the status of their what's going on in their lives and friendships.
Right.Like Stacey really misses Claudia.She's like not super getting along with the people at school.They're all kind of like snooty or whatever. And she doesn't really have a core friend group.
And she's really stressed about what's going on with her parents.Right.And then Claudia is like, oh, I went from not having best in my whole life to having like a best friend.And now she's gone.
And so Claudia is like dealing with that and they work it out and they have like a good last day in New York.I think that's it.Right.Yeah.Yeah.
And then we get some reflection about what she learned and how she can see the things from different people's perspective with with age and wisdom.
Yeah, I felt like the Claudia plot was kind of weak.
Yeah.Yeah, it made some sense, but it also, I don't think they wrote Claudia very well.She wrote Claudia very well.And I think that Claudia is a little bit more direct about her feelings sometimes, not always, but yeah, I agree.Yeah.
Yeah, I think also it's a weird thing to try to write to like the concept is weird.Like I'm a 13 year old writing a book about memories I have from when I'm five.But like, it's also a real novel that's getting published.
So I think it like slips between conventions a little bit or like.Yeah.Yeah.
Yeah, I think that's true.I think if this was actually Stacey's eighth grade autobiography assignment, like A+, I think she did a lovely job.But do I want to read that?
And would I even necessarily have wanted to read it if I was still 10 when this came out?I think I would have.But obviously, this came out much later, and I were both deep in high school.
And I think I bought some of these, but I don't remember ever reading this.Did it seem new to you, Anne?
Yeah, I don't, I didn't even know these existed.
Yeah, okay.I don't remember reading these either.Yeah, for what it's worth, yeah.Yeah.So, well, I thought there were a few interesting things.
I'm a little nervous, because I think the stuff in my corner may apply to all the portrait collection books, so.
I know we may be stuck later, but I think what is fascinating to me is that this kind of assignment is very common in middle school and high school, this let's look at snapshots of your life and sort of think about how those were formative experiences for you.
And in fact, my 11th grader, Keely, has this assignment right now. at the beginning of their English class.And so I have the actual assignment in front of me because they were telling me about it.And I was like, wait, hold on.You have to what?
And it's literally, begin by brainstorming a list of the key events in your life.It can be quite brief.
Select eight or more events, put them on a timeline in chronological order, and then refine your choices and choose four events that have shaped you the most as a person.It's like literally this book.
Yeah, but also I feel like I don't know.I feel like it's a pressure to have these moments in your life.Honestly, I'm not like a big moments person.You know, it's I don't know.I can't be like this was something that really I can't.
I mean, I can't really.Well, I don't I don't know.
I would find it difficult.
I don't know that it's literal. I mean, I think you're picking a moment, you're doing the self-reflection to pick a moment that can be.Extrapolated away from.Yeah, it can be symbolic or metaphorical of a general part of you.
But it got me thinking about, you know, like the main developmental task of adolescence is identity development, right?It's like figuring out the building blocks of who you are as a person and who you're going to be in the world going forward.
And this idea that there are specific moments or specific events
that have an outsized impact on our personality is I think something that we think about a lot in reading other people's biographies and sort of creating a tale or you even just look at like a biography of a public figure, right?
If we think about like Kamala Harris running for president right now, talking about being in the first class of students that were bused into Berkeley schools to integrate the schools and that as a formative experience or talking about having two immigrants or parents and having to
you know, sometimes, you know, advocate for her mom because people weren't listening to her because she had an accent or those things.
It's not that like in that moment, you're necessarily like, oh, this is but that it's how people kind of explain how they've developed over time.And what's what What are the building blocks?What are the things?
But then I also think, you know, they contribute to personality, but I also think assignments like this, you know, prop up that idea, right?
And sort of encourage kids to do that specific kind of self-reflection to create a narrative, to create a story that makes sense. But it really, what it reminded me most of was Inside Out 2.So Inside Out 2, spoilers, listeners.Everyone should see it.
It's very good.One of the few, both of the Inside Out movies have really good psychology, have really good people advising on it.
But the thing that's different in Inside Out 2, where Riley is 13, like Stacey and the other members of the BSC that get portrait collection books, is they explore this idea that
our learning history and specific events create links to our self-concept and our overall story of who we are.And so in Inside Out 2, this is very literal for those that have seen it.
There's these like strings of her identity that go up from the pool of core memories, or not necessarily core memories, but all of the memories.
And I think that this is, that is how we make sense of the world and make sense of ourselves as individual people over time, because our, you know, not surprising as a behaviorist, but our learning history and specifically our social learning history affects
how we are and how we interact with people and with ourselves over time.And so I think that's really what this book is trying to lay out and trying to see.
But it's also taking the opportunity to fill in more blanks for us from what we already know about Stacey.I think Anna Martin certainly plotted this, right?And I think
you can see the seeds of, like, her rebellious streak, right, with the ballroom dancing story.
And there's bits of why she went surfing in Southern California when she wasn't supposed to, or why she has, you know, lied to her dad about Robert working on Fire Island or those other pieces.
And you see her longing for adulthood and sophistication and maturity from a very young age. And so I think they did a good job in that way of making it consistent with who we know Stacey to be.
But I also liked that it pulls, she's able to really only see it from her perspective in the moment, which is very common for younger kids, and then pulls for this self-reflection later.
I also think the book, you know, you mentioned the Claudia story was really weak.And I think the five-year-old story with the Macy's Parade was also pretty weak.
I think the book sort of followed an arc where the ballroom dance story and the main story were actually quite good and well-written.I kind of liked them as short stories, but the first one and the last one were sort of meh.
But they felt like necessary to establish some things about Lane.I think the first one planted some seeds for Lane that maybe she's not
always the most loyal friend and that she's also on the team of like, what do you mean you're going to be on TV and that kind of stuff.
And then also planting some seeds for Claudia later on with Lane being more concerned about getting invited to the cool dinner birthday party than spending time with Stacey and Claudia. So I think it fits with the flow of the series.
And by its nature, it's not going to be as plot heavy, right?Because it's about snapshots.Also talking about it, like Stacey really did get this assignment.Like they could have made the assignment different so that it could include some plot.
But I do think for, you know, the nine-year-old babysitters club obsessives to be able to learn more about what they were like when they were little kids is a fun idea.
And I can, I know that, and if these had come out when we were in like fourth grade, I feel like we would have been very excited about them and to get to see what it was like.
Like, you know, I'm curious, what was Janine like when Janine was a child instead of an older teenager?Like, we'll get to see bits of that when we get to Claudia's book, I'm assuming.And so I like the overall idea.
And I was trying to think as I was coming up with my analysis, if there's something I wanted different, what would have improved it? I kind of think I would like some lists, like Stacey's favorite things when she was 10 or I don't know.
Who remembers that?I don't know, but it just was hard to grab onto with just these four stories.Anne, you're the creative writer.What do you think would improve it?
I think the voice. I don't think it was, like, in Stacey's voice.It seemed very, like, like an author.I mean, I guess it was a book report, so maybe that could explain some of she wrote more formally.
She's, like, doing more professional, yeah.
Yeah, but I just, I feel like it wasn't in her usual, how she speaks in the other books.I felt like that's why I was like, did someone old write this?Because it sounds like an old person wrote it.
It seemed very old-fashioned, the way she talked about herself. Yeah, I agree.And not modern, which she is supposed to be modern and sophisticated and everything.So I think that would have helped a lot.
And things, I think, if there were moments where she could show off her personality more also.I mean, when you talk about yourself when you're a kid, I guess it's difficult, but I feel like there was no levity.It seemed all very serious.
right and i think like maybe she's too young to have that perspective you know at 13 writing about yourself for like five than when you're like much older because like if i was writing about myself as kidnapped i'd just be like making fun of myself all the time right you know but maybe she's too she's just was too young
But I just think the personality and tone of voice was kind of... Yeah, that's a great point.
I think I kept sort of waiting for Stacey to show up.And I think she was more there in the 10-year-old story, and that's why I liked it more.Because you could see her sassing Mara and making these assumptions about all the backward people in Maine.
And so that was a little bit where, by the time we meet Stacey, she's sophisticated and cool, but she isn't she doesn't put other people down.Right.And she's like been humbled by diabetes.
And so it's interesting to see the like earlier Stacey who like thinks she's got everything figured out.And I think that's why I liked that story the best.
I also do.I think it's tough because in Babysitters Remember, she also did a diabetes story.But I do think it's just like a little implausible that diabetes wouldn't feature more heavily in Stacey's own autobiography. No, that's ridiculous.
That's not a snapshot the first time she gets hospitalized or, yeah.
I'm fine that we didn't have to read about it again, but I just don't buy that she wouldn't have it be in there.
Well, and I'm sure that that was a problem that Anne and her editors puzzled over.I think you're exactly right that that's why we ended up here.But yeah, of course that would be in there.
All right, I have a question for you, Emily, and maybe this is something you're gonna talk about, although it's not in your extensive notes.What did you think of the ballroom dancing situation?
There definitely was still the remnants of this, of take some real dancing lessons when we were kids, but it was more like when you're 12, 13, not when you're eight. And is this just like a rich person thing?Or is this like super sexist?
What do you like that whole part?I was like, I get why Lane and Stacey were trying to ditch.But like, what is this?Like eight is very young.
I have no idea.My guess is that it was somebody who was out of touch with what it is that people send their eight-year-olds to do.
Oh, like somebody born in 1941.
Yeah, that's 100% what it read like to me.Like it had nothing really to do with anything in reality.
I don't know.I didn't grow up in New York City.Yeah.
Ann, do you have any thoughts from the prep school kids you worked with in publishing?
No, but I did read a little bit about Jean.Okay.And okay, so number one, she grew up in Vermont.And she grew up across the street from a dairy farm.
And she was a dancer.A ballerina dancer?No, but she like wanted to be a rockette and she took like- Oh, wow.There's like pictures of her dancing on her like website.That's funny.And she wanted, you know, she did tap dancing and that kind of thing.
So, yeah, it probably came from her.It came from her.Yeah.
But it seems at the very least like it has to do with their school, right?Like a lot of kids they know are there.Also, there's one kid that's the snooty kid and the other ones are just the regular kids.But I don't know.
I assume that they go to a fancy like Upper West Side prep school, right?
Like, yeah.Do they have like. you know, they're coming out debutante thing where it's like they have to probably.Yeah.
Yeah, I think probably.But that wouldn't again, they wouldn't be that young, I guess.Is this just the first of many ballroom dancing classes they're supposed to take?
Yeah.You got to start somewhere.Yeah.
I mean, I think this is another old-fashioned thing.It's, you know... For sure.I think that back in the day, you were like, you need to learn the foxtrot and the waltzes and whatever, you know, to be a proper person of society or whatever.
For sure.I mean, my mom and Emily's grandma had to do all of that, but I just, it seems implausible that this is happening in, well, I don't know if it's what year it actually is, but... I mean, they had to do it in the O.C.
But as high schoolers.Well, no, Ryan has to take a class as a high schooler because he's from Chino.So the rest of them have probably been doing it since they were in lower school, for sure.
Okay.All right.What else you got, Em?
I actually really liked the story set in Maine.I thought the dynamic between Stacy and Mara was really funny.And I think like the lesson Stacy learns there is cute, right?She's like, oh, she feels defensive about Mara's defensiveness, right?
But she sees her doing all these things that Stacy's like, I've never thought to do that or, you know, and says things about them that are sort of kind of derisive.But in her internal monologue is like, wow, I'm impressed.
And they their friendship then like.
blossoms from Stacey feeling so grateful for her that she had all these impressive skills that she learned on the island where there's, quote, unquote, nothing to do that, like rescued, you know, her dad and their vacation.
And even to an extent, her parents fighting, right?Like he can't do much with his leg in a cast for two weeks.And so and, you know, Stacey's mom feels bad that he's injured.And so like he does work a little bit and they don't fight about it.
But also like they still enjoy their their themselves.Right. Mara's parents let them use the truck so they can drive to the little cove that they like, and it seems like they still have a really nice time.
And then Stacy's like, oh, she let me drive the boat, right?And I worked up enough courage to sleep outside, and they plan this whole thing where they make the list, and they make their own meals, and they're going to cook over a fire.
And it's this first time she's really felt, I think, a satisfied sense of independence, and I thought that was really cute.But in the first fights, Mara says, Oh, I'm just a Hick, remember?Or something like that.
She uses the actual term Hick, which I thought was really funny.I was trying to look up whether the meaning of Hick has changed over time.And apparently in the 14th century, Hick was a nickname for the name Richard.Okay. Isn't that interesting?
And it wasn't like really, it didn't transform into like it's more closer meaning to the contemporary moment until like the 18th century.
So like the first kind of record of it, meaning something like how we would think of it now is awkward provincial person.And that's sort of like around the 1700s where that kind of appears.
I'm surprised that it's that old.
That's fascinating that we're still using it.
Yeah.And like, I think, you know, now people tend to, especially in American context, talk about it as like a stereotype, right.Of a person who lives on a ranch or in a rural area or like near a farm or on a farm.Right.
And the idea is that I think the HIC is like the antithesis to a sophisticated person.Right.Right.I think it tends to serve in her.
Yeah. So I think it's actually quite plausible that Mara would have used that word, given how long established it is in the English language.
I also was picturing Mara's life just living on this island and having a series of privileged city children come and stay for two weeks and like hoping that maybe it was a girl her age and then like seeing if it would be okay or not.
And so she seems to resign to some of Stacy's bullshittery that I'm like, she's like, oh yeah, I've been through this before.
Right, well, I'm sure it's like pretty common.Yeah.
What was that, what's that program called for like, kids go and rough it?Outward Bound?Outward Bound, yeah.
Oh my god.You go to an outward bound to Mara's house?
pick some blueberries, watch her one-year-old sister.
But yeah, I mean, like, you know, Stacey's like, what do you do on this island?And she's like, I go fishing with my dad.I pull up the lobster traps.We cook.Like, we pick blueberries.I go on walks.I sleep outside.Like, I don't know.
What do you do in Manhattan?Stacey's like, and the list of things that Stacey is appalled, the absence of which appalls Stacey on this island is like restaurants, movie theaters, and I don't know what else.The phone.There is no phone.Yeah.
And like, okay, if someone was like, what do you like to do?And you're like, Oh, I love to go to restaurants.And I'm 10, by the way, and movie theaters, and I love talking on the phone, you'd be like, okay, like, how are those like things to do?
Like, I don't know.Yeah, you 10 year old person.So I thought that whole thing was really funny.
Yeah, I would like to go to Big Pine Island.It sounds amazing.
Honestly, it sounds great.
Yeah, I would want to be able to swim.But yeah, that's the problem with Maine. That's also the problem with Northern California, let's be honest.
I mean, it's kind of too cold to swim in most places except for Florida.
Well, not most places.There's like a hole all around the world.
I know, but I feel like, oh yeah, in terms of just the US.
Yeah, in the US, yes.But that's not really true though, because like Long Island, the water's warm.As low as the mid-Atlantic, the water's warm.It's not Florida warm, but it's not Pacific Ocean or Maine cold.
Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.I found some lakes now and then to be suitable temperature for swimming.I was awake a bit cold, but it's perfect.It's perfect.Yeah.I think that's it.
Do you think, is HIC usually, are there regional ways that HIC is applied in the U.S.?Because when she said HIC, like I picture, like you said, like someone on a farm, or like I picture like grass and hay.
I don't picture like a lobsterman's kid, you know?
Yeah, but I think that's because we grew up in California.Oh, fair enough.
I mean, from like my very rigorous and thorough research that I did, it seems to me like one of the arguments that people have on the internet is like whether redneck and hicker are interchangeable words or whether they mean something different.
So I think like in the American context, it tends to be more associated with people who like what we're talking about, who like farm. But I think that like Mara's family is the main version of that, right?Like they're basically main farmers, right?
They're pulling up lobster trap.That's their primary.That's what they do to make money, right?They sell lobsters to local restaurants or whatever.Right.
And so I think in that sense, that's just the like their life is just the main version of the thing that we all associate with hay and other kinds of animals.Yeah.Yeah.
Fair enough.Yeah. Cool.All right.
What do you got, Anne?So in her eight-year-old story, they're talking about MTV and Madonna and Sting and how Stacey wanted to do the moonwalk and not ballroom dance.And Jean got her dance all mixed up.
So if she's eight years old and she was born in 1973, this would be- She was born in 74, but she's 13 now.
in 1993, in 1994.So then suddenly she's born in a different year.
Now she's born in 81 instead.
Yeah.But originally she was born in 70, in 73, four.Okay.So, okay.12 and 86. It was 81 or 82, conceivably, right in this book.Michael Jackson didn't do the moonwalk yet.MTV aired for the first time in 1981.
And Madonna hadn't even released her first album yet.So she didn't do the math or the research.
Well, that's why I assumed that she was working backwards from 94, since 8 doesn't change, which means that then Stacey's born in 81.So when she's 5, it's 86.And when she's 8, it's 89.
These are the hard hitting questions that we try to answer for you at Stuck in Stony Brook.
Yeah, but still, 89's still kind of early for some of that.
89's not early for some people.
Yeah, 89's not early.But I do think you, I don't, I feel like it should go by her like when the books first came out, not from whatever, when they haven't aged for like a decade or whatever.
I mean, I still think our conspiracy that someday they're going to realize they've been stuck in a time loop.
Yeah.Well, so what would it have been if it had been pitched back to when she was originally born?What do you think she would have been watching on MTV?
Well, she wouldn't have been watching MTV when she was five because it didn't exist.
It didn't.Yeah, it didn't exist.
She doesn't watch MTV in the five year old chapter, does she?No, it's in the eight year old chapter.Yeah.
So it existed by then, but it would have been pre-Michael Jackson, pre-Madonna.
Yeah.Yeah.Yeah.But MTV didn't air until 81.
Right.But she's eight in 82.Eight in 82.
So an eight-year-old would be watching MTV in 82 because it was still so new.
I mean, they could be, but still, the years are off. she would probably be listening.I actually did what was top of the charts in the early 80s, and it was like, Kool and the Gang, and Hall and Oates, and like, REO Speedwagon.
We hadn't quite gotten into like, the pop- The 80s.The 80s, yeah, yeah.
It's still 70s holdovers.
Yeah, yeah, so.I mean, yeah.Well, we'll see what happens in the rest of the portrait collection, I guess, if they stay consistent with that math.
I think they're probably going to continue to work backwards, because that's what we're seeing in the main series books, right?
We've been asking what's happening in 1994 this year, as we've been in that year, but they're not looking back in that way.
Well, I guess the thing is, with the regular series, it makes more sense because it's like, what's happening now?
now for us she's going back so it's like she made the choice to change her technical birth year because like with all of our birthday posts we go by we don't like subtract from whatever yeah but we don't work for the organization you know like i don't know what kind of instructions jean got yeah but yeah
Oh, all right.What else jumped out to you and other than her date confusion in terms of pop culture?
Like, I mean, there's some like, there's like New York stuff that we've kind of covered throughout all the New York books.
I think it's so funny how obsessed with the hard rock cafe she is.
Yeah, it was big.It was big.It was like the coolest thing at the time.
And in the notes at the front of the book, it's like Hard Rock Cafe logo used by permission for the little button.And then there's also like a Macy's disclaimer too.Macy's is a federally registered trademark of R.H.Macy and Company Incorporated.
Right.Oh, it's interesting also.So in the paragraph where she talks about MTV and they talk about like Madonna and staying But she says that hard rock videos are playing on MTV.
And like that, like early Madonna and like late 80s pop rock didn't really cross over.So anyway. Just a little note and yeah, that's about it.We've talked about Zabars before.Yeah.
I like Mrs. McGill clutching her Zabars purchases to me.That's just funny.She's been to Palm Court before too, is that true?Do they go to Palm Court in a different book?I think so.
Yeah, I just feel like it's, I mean, I guess, you know, she's 13, but it seems like she's doing sort of surface level New York stuff.
Like I would think she'd go a little deeper on this third of Claudia's visits, or second of Claudia, like this Claudia solo visit, than doing the same things again.
And like, I was really surprised they went to the zoo, because they go to the zoo with all the kids, in Stacey's mistake, so yeah.
Yeah, we want Stacey to go to 80s era Times Square.Yeah.
God.Scary.Well, but would it be 80s or 94?Either one's not great.
What did you guys think of Lane and Stacey's planning for their apartment with their list of things that they needed?
Yeah.Did you ever fantasize about stuff like that?
Neither of you?No.Lauren Cusick and I had a list of things that were going to be in our New York apartment when we moved to New York after- I'm not a person of hopes and aspirations, really.
I just kind of take it as it comes. I wasn't taught to think that way about life.I'm not a person with hopes and aspirations.
Yeah, but that's probably why I'm pretty happy all the time.
I mean, I'm pretty happy too.
See, we both turned out happy.
Wow.You guys should write each other's autobiographies, but write them as though you were... If Anne was going to have one, it would have to be written by me.No, no, write them as though you're 13 writing about your younger self.
As it would have so much more to say than me.
Yeah.No one remembers nothing about me at 13.
I remember nothing.No, I remember things about you at 13.
I remember... Watch.Watch watches.Yeah.
Converse.Rainbows.Yeah, exactly.Tigers.Yeah.Oh yeah.Super into Tigers.JD Salinger.Yep.
So you could make a list, which apparently I would like better than reading this book.
Yeah, exactly.Yeah, so it's perfect.Maybe we should, okay, maybe for, we can each write a list about each other.
What we think a 13 year old us would want to have in our future apartment someday?
A random list of things that like, I don't know, that would go.
Describe your personality.
No, just like our, if we had to write like a memoir, what would the 10 things in it be?
Like events, like snapshots like this, or just like one of the things on your list about me might just be swatch.
Yeah.I feel like you could weave in, okay, you could be, you could talk about all the different swatches you had and how each of them, like, paralleled the moment you're going through in life.Like when I had the, what's it?
You had, you had like that one that had like a lot of different photo printed things on them.What year was that?That was high school.That's your favorite one. I know.
I've had it more than once.I re-bought it.I also had it when the girls were babies.
See?Okay.Give me some credit.
So you had it when you were about to graduate from high school and when your children were babies?I don't know.Two kind of important moments.
I don't think I had it in high school.I think that's too early, but I'm not sure.
Those could be bookends to your story.
All right. Yeah.I didn't really think that Stacey would have, I don't think she would have a memory of seeing Pavarotti.Was Pavarotti, I don't know, I guess he was around, but that was weird.And the palm court.Yeah.Yeah.It was just a weird choice.
Again, old person wrote the book.Like what eight year old reading this in the nineties is going to be like, oh, she saw Luciano Pavarotti.
Yeah.Maybe this is what the three tenors were a big thing.Remember them?No one can ever name the third tenor.Try it.
I can't name the second tenor.
I mean, everyone usually is Palverati, Domingo, Placido Domingo, and then the third guy, who I don't remember.
I only know, you know why I know the name Placido Domingo.Why?Why?There's a Muppet on Sesame Street called Placido Flamingo.Oh, okay.That's odd.The only reason I know who that is. There's an opera flamingo.
But I think in the book, Stacey doesn't know who Pavarotti is.Yeah.
No, she doesn't know who he is, but I think it's still a funny reference to put into a book for children.Like the children reading the book are going to know who he is.
Yeah.I mean, no one would know.
No one would know.No one would know.
Okay.Candy.So there's actually some... Oh, there's a good candy scene.Yeah.Yeah.I mean, but I didn't... It's Stacey's candy, not Claudia's candy.
Yeah, but she gets it for Claudia to make Claudia feel at home.
Okay, hang on, let me scroll to that part.Okay, chocolate bars, peanut butter, chocolate bars with peanut butter filling, lollipops, M&Ms, gummy bears, three kinds of chips, caramel, popcorn, and jello bars.
Yeah, and then she hides it all around her room so Claudia feels at home.
Yeah, and then I play Hot Cold.But this is something we would play, probably.
Oh, for sure. played a lot of hot holes in our day.
But did you actually play or were you just trying to trick?
You haven't noticed that Anne likes to make up games.Like, yeah.
But I could also see Anne tricking you about whether you were actually hot or cold.Yes, that's part of the game.I thought you're like not supposed to lie.
No, you're not.But it's more fun for Anne if she does.
Interesting.So I'm right.OK, got it.
Yes, that's correct.Okay, the only Tali in this book is bossy.I noticed that there was no almond-shaped eyes.
Almond eyes, and less descriptions in general of everybody.
Yeah, that's true.Well, that makes sense.
Do they always describe Claudia as tall?No.No.I paused on that because I was like, whoa, I feel like that's a new descriptor for Claudia.That is a new descriptor.
I mean, she's taller than Christy and Marianne. That's because they're like, they- Stop.What?Stop.No, I was gonna say they feel like they're under five feet tall.
Marianne and Christy, you think they're under five feet?
I mean, possibly.They all said they're small for their age.
What is the average height of someone who is, how old are they?Thirteen.Thirteen?Thirteen.
Most girls at thirteen have gotten close to stopping growing.So it's pretty, it's taller than that.I mean, but they're, if they're late bloomers, it could be a little shorter, but I assume they were at least five feet, but could be wrong.
really hard-hitting content today you guys i'm sorry good luck with the rest of the portrait collection okay
Yeah, there weren't any really weird lines either, I thought.
Did you write down anything?
I literally looked and I was like, nothing is speaking to me as like a good weird line.
I have some, but I don't really like any of them.Okay, let's hear them.Go.Okay, I have old muddy feet Pete, who is the kid in her preschool or her kindergarten that gets his boots on her Cinderella book.
Oh, Eloise book, thank you.The Cinderella book comes later.Yeah, so it was preschool actually, not kindergarten. And then I have doing the waltz with sweaty palms as a description of the Bettencourt.Oh no, Beresford Ballroom Academy.
And then I have Stacey's dad saying skunks like candy too to warn Stacey about packing her sweets for Maine.They're fine.
I think mine might be better. Mine is the big Ds.
Oh, yeah.Actually, you know what?I'm really surprised I didn't write that down because it did make me laugh a lot, but then I forgot about it.I didn't even think of it.Yeah, we're definitely doing that.
Okay, but what did you write down, Emily?We could go with the big Ds, but what did you write down?Did you have any?Oh, no, you didn't at all.No, I've said that several times already.
No, I just can't believe it.Usually you find good ones.As we just pissed Emily off.I was like, did you not listen to me?I didn't do it.
I literally said that. But the big D's did make me laugh a lot.
This is a season where we're going to be recording in the afternoon evening, which is when Emily and Ann come alive and my brain shuts off.So that might be why I didn't hear you.
I have a pizza toast proposal.Okay. It's sincere.On page four, Stacey says, she's talking about Robert and she says, for me, having a boyfriend doesn't take away from my other friendships.
And I was excited to see that in there as a quote, because we've talked about this before on the podcast, though, that that's one of the biggest protective factors for teen romantic relationships is if they stay connected to their friends.
And so I sort of liked that in there as a message.And just I'm thinking about like eight or nine year olds reading it who wouldn't have even thought about that.
That's also a reason that it is like an older person writing the book, but I think it's like a neat message to hear before you're like romantically active that, oh, you should also keep close contact with the other friends.Yeah.
Don't ditch your friends for your boyfriend.Yep.Don't do it.But I'm open to like lobsters or blueberries or something else too.
They're like, how can we say this in a nice, succinct way?
Pizza toast to chicks before dicks?
Or don't be a bitch, don't ditch.I just made that up, by the way.
Oh, that's cold.That's really good, wow.How do we have you?I don't make sense.We're gonna get scooped up by some Hollywood agent.
Okay.Okay.So, okay, that's me.Choose how you would like to.
Pizza toast to don't be a bitch.Don't ditch.Don't be a bitch.This episode of Stuck in Stony Brook is now adjourned.
Thank you to Anne and Martin for everything.Stuck in Stony Brook is edited by Emily Crandall.Theme song written and recorded by Gary Schaller, performed by the band Kid Kit.
You can follow us on Instagram, at Stuck in Stony Brook, or find us on our website, stuckinstonybrook.com.Need some books that we mentioned?
Buy them from our bookshop and support both a local independent bookstore and your favorite series literature analysis podcast.Find us at bookshop.org, slash shop, slash Stuck in Stony Brook.
Lastly, if you're feeling deeply generous and you want to rate us and review us on Apple Podcasts, that would be super helpful.You're the best friends a girl could ask for.
Sign in
