Embrace who you are because we need to cast all types.
Julia Kim is a two-time RTS award-winning casting director and a champion for diversity in the entertainment industry.
Her impressive body of work includes critically acclaimed films such as Minari, which earned six Oscar nominations, and The Last Black Man in San Francisco, both in official selection at the Sundance Film Festival.
Now also casting massive TV, she has collaborated with major studios and her recent projects include Apple TV's Sunny and the international Amazon series, Expats, starring Nicole Kidman.
When I first started, if there was an Asian role, you knew exactly who was going to be on the list.And now the list is so much longer.
Hey, everyone.Welcome back to The We Audition Show.And we're here with Julia Kim, who I don't think we've seen each other since Sundance, probably like 2019, right?
It's been a minute.You were on our panel back then for the film The Last Black Man in San Francisco, I believe, right?And you'd just done Minari at the time. And now you're working on amazing TV as well.
Tell us about that, that shift from, from an Oscar winning film to what you're up to now.
The transition was interesting because there's just, uh, it was for a streamer, Amazon, and it was, um, a highly anticipated show with an A-list star, Nicole Kidman attached.And, um,
Lulu Wong, who's a filmmaker behind The Farewell, which garnered a lot of attention and awards herself.And so she was also making the transition to television and taking on material that was from a book, a very well-received book called Ex-Pats.
And we had the task of filling all the talent around Nicole, and it was a very international effort. as far as looking for cast.It was the expat community in Hong Kong, and so the fabric of the different types of people were vast.
And to add to the challenges, we had the pandemic hit, and so we were not We really needed to shift our minds to how we were going to accomplish seeing the amount of people and the types of people in a virtual way.
And so just when you think like, how are we going to do this?You look back and go, how did we do this?But we managed and we found such great people and the process is now, you know, has become so norm.But at the time it was really a learning curve.
you know, taking a leap of faith and also trying to convey the chemistry and the nuances of these characters. in a way that you and I are talking right now.
You guys and I just, you know, like we had their facial expressions on our laptops or our screens and body language.We tried to tell them to step back and, you know, show as much of their body as possible.
But, you know, there was a certain amount of leap of faith that we needed to trust our instincts and we needed to trust, um, We called them back.We, you know, served up different types of scenes to get different kinds of arcs of emotion.
We tried to check as many of the boxes as possible so that we could avoid any unforeseen surprises once they showed up on set.
And would you normally do that in person in Hong Kong?Would you have flown there to run in-person sessions on a normal day?
We had a local casting director who under, you know, who had the knowledge of the landscape there and, and the neighboring countries like Malaysia and China.And so, uh, we had a local person there, but you know,
The fabric of Hong Kong was changing as well.There was a political upheaval going on as well as their very stringent pandemic requirements.So the norm of the people that resided in Hong Kong it wasn't there.
You know, people had either fled or people were moving back with their families.The business sector had changed.And so the diversity had changed.
So I believe the local casting director had quite a challenge, but we worked very hand in hand with her, very collaborative because luckily, you know, there's a lot of expats in the U.S.And so we were able to tap into that world as well.
So it was very collaborative.
How are you able to sort of ensure a chemistry read when you're doing something virtually, and especially when you've got an A-list star?You can't put them in the same room.How do you do that?It must be hard.
It was hard.You know, thankfully, the way that the story was written, it was three lives that did intersect on occasion.Like, Nicole's character was close with one person who lived in her building in the story.
We found an actress, Sarayu Blue, who's very seasoned and she was beautifully making a transition into drama from mostly a comedic resume.And so we had faith that she was going to be able to hold her own against somebody like Nicole because she had
the experience, but we looked, it was an Indian character and a South Asian character, and so we looked in India, we looked in the UK, we looked everywhere, but right here in LA was where we found her, and she was fantastic.
When you talk about that, the transition from comedy to drama, even actors out there thinking, I always get cast for the comedic roles, I really want to do drama.Is that something that they need to take upon themselves to do that transition?
How do they convince casting or a director that they're right for that then?
I think casting directors and casting offices play a big role in showcasing somebody in a different light.
We relish that opportunity to take a fresh take on actors or a fresh take on the way a character's written and bringing in somebody that might be a little left of center or out of the box thinking.And so, Sari, you did, you know,
have the luck of a very robust comedic career, but it's opportunity.It's just being able to present an opportunity where somebody can pivot and showcase another side, because that's what actors do.
They have different facets, and you just need to nurture the different facets that they're capable of.And I think now I feel expats really open the door for other
creators, producers, shows to think of her in a different light because she had the opportunity to showcase that different light.
Hmm.Is it more challenging for you as a cast and director to understand what actors can do these days now with just seeing self-tapes, really?
I know from a lot of actors' point of view, they miss the interaction with the cast and directors, the redirections, but also that quote-unquote building relationships.How do you handle that from your side of the coin?
I look at the self-tape process as a time saver for both parties, because not everybody is right for everything, even if you're a great actor.
And so we, as the casting folks, have the advantage of really understanding through discussions with the director what it is, what are these little character traits that would really bring that character to life.And so we can't share all those.
It's just, unfortunately, we just know what it is that we're looking for.
And so I think the first pass being a self tape really helps help us find, even if it's somebody that we get surprised by, like, Oh, wow, that person, you know, brought something that we hadn't thought of.And then we always put
different, you know, ask them to retape with a certain, you know, second pass with notes.You did great in this section, but, um, a little more this in this section and, and actually if there's potential, then, um, we bring them in for a live zoom.
We always have a live zoom where it is more instantaneous and we can tweak them on the fly and not have so much back and forth.
Once they're in the realm of, yes, there's potential there for this character that we're looking for, then I think the live interaction, whether it's in the room or Zoom, is just the way to go.
And when you're casting, when you get a new project, do you feel like the actor sometimes where you get asked to do the same type of projects or do production companies give you a shot at something different as well?
I do feel that the industry has a pigeonhole quality.And so yes, I do get presented a lot of immigrant stories or coming of age stories.I don't mind because I love those stories.I think that there's a deep well there, but I do like to
find something about a coming of age story that puts a different spin on it.The immigrant story is vast.It's very relatable, but each one has its individuality.And so I'm looking for something that's not repetitive for me and for the audiences.
So I always look for something, a facet that feels unique, even if it's a genre that we're very familiar with.
And in terms of where those projects have gone and the awards that you've garnered, surely that must make people look for you for that even more.
And have you found that as you've been nominated for different things, that the incoming is a lot easier for you as a casting director? And do your DMs get hit up by actors all the time?
I love actors.I do love the nurturing aspect of finding new talent and also with movies like Parasite and then Everything Everywhere All at Once and Minari and shows like Pachinko and Shogun.
And those are all Asian centric shows and I'm an Asian American.So I do get presented that because they're, you know, the authenticity of somebody who understands the culture and has a firsthand experience being brought up in that culture.
is meaningful for them.And it doesn't mean that my non-Asian counterparts aren't capable.But yeah, I get presented those authentic, wanting authenticity projects.
And I do my best to bring my firsthand experiences to finding the characters and finding the actors that are right.And those shows and films need continued access to actors and new actors.
And so Invasion LA is something that I created because I got asked that by parents, like parents who wanted, who see Al and Kim and go, how do I get my kid in the business?And what are the pitfalls to avoid?
And, you know, they have a traditional Asian name.Do I change their name?Do I, you know, accept uh, this agent who's been wanting to, you know, sign my kid, can I trust them?
I mean, there's so many things that we take for granted when you're immersed in the business that are daunting for first timers to enter.And so I really wanted to guide them correctly and get them set on the right path and, you know, not get
led down because there's so many ways to be led down and so many ways to be taken advantage of.And so, and also to embolden our industry with great talent.
And so, you know, a lot, a lot of Asian people now are like, I want to be an actor because I see so much representation on screen, but you need to be good.You can't, being Asian is not just enough of a box to check. You need to have the skills.
You need to have the chops.You need to understand the way that the business works.You need to know how to conduct yourself once you're in an audition.Do I need to have my lines memorized?Can I hold the paper?Yes.Do I look directly at the camera?
When I'm auditioning, do I look at a reader?What's a reader?You know, how much do I rely on this reader?And if the reader's not bringing, you know, like if it's a woman reading a man's part, you know, like just, you know, how do I adjust to that?
There's so many ways that you need to be able to just fly with the moment.And so, um, I just, I just want to be there to get them ready for whatever opportunity comes their way.
Can you tell us what Invasion LA is for anyone that hasn't heard it?
It's a service really for people who want to better themselves and be ready for the opportunities, whether it's somebody who's wanting to get into it late in life, they're retired.We need elderly and senior citizens.
We need the mature actor that's looking for a second chapter.We need the young kids that are just coming into it through dance or school dramas and plays, and they got sort of the acting bug, but how do I take it a step further?
How do I find an agent?What do I do?Should I take acting classes and which one?There's so many out there if I Google.So it's a guidance, it's a handholding, it's a you know, ask me anything.
I've been doing this for two decades plus, you know, um, I come from an immigrant background and nobody taught me how to get into this business myself.And somehow I've managed to find a way in and I just want to share my knowledge.
I just want to share my experiences.I want to, um, get them strong and knowledgeable for all the different things that are going to come at them.
Massively useful.I feel like those stories, those immigrant stories have become more mainstream nowadays.I feel like everyone's seeing those movies and they're everywhere.Does that mean that you need more people?
You're looking for more talent and your job is harder?
And authentic talent as well, I think.Authenticity, right?Yeah.We hear that a lot.
Yes.Authenticity.I mean, it depends on what's on the page.You know, I'm reading scripts that are like tall orders. for these characters, you know.
I mean, like what's given an example of a tall order?
Well, I just, I just read one where these two women during World War II that are, I'm blanking on, it's basically a very small country that was caught up in World War II and they need to speak, they need to be bilingual because the British occupied their country.
They need to have a British accent.
We always do that.It's terrible.
So it's just the accents, the ethnicity, the look, the age, the believability from the region that they're from.I mean, it just goes on and on and on.
Just being good and knowing the camera and knowing how to audition.And I imagine that's a tool I can see straight away for Invasion LA.It's useful.Of course it is.Yeah.
So I read this and I went, oh boy.
Oh, everyone thinks it's easy.It's like directing.Everyone thinks it's easy. Yeah.
Well, when you're writing it, you're not thinking really about, you know, you're writing the most, uh, you know, um, riveting piece of drama or something.And you're not thinking about, okay, now you guys got to go find this, you know, but we do.
And, uh, I, I relish the challenge though.I really love the challenges because I feel like, yeah.
You must have that moment when you find that person and just be like, Oh, I found them. The needle.Yeah.Do you, do you know, do you like when you, when you've got a tool or like that and you deliver what, how's that feel?
Is it, is it, is it, you know, when, as soon as you see it often, or is it more of a process? We hear both actually.
Yeah.Yeah.I mean, it's, it's certainly a eureka moment when you find somebody that you think the director might get excited about.
One would be surprised sometimes when the director finds that it still fell short and then you need to go back to the drawing board.But, you know, I come from independent film and we are resourceful folks.
And so, you know, we don't always have the luxury to keep going.With expats, we did have the luxury of deep resources, a long runway to find what they knew was going to be challenging to find.
And then at the pandemic, we were given the graces of the time, but we don't always have that.For Minari, I had five weeks. And I hit the ground running.
And because it was Korean language and Korean family story, and I am a Korean American, I did know exactly what places to hit.There's a lot of Korean churches and Korean language schools in Koreatown right here in Los Angeles, which is huge.
And the population of Koreans in Los Angeles is huge.So I just kind of
wasted no time and I went right to the resources and I was able to walk into the Korean newspaper offices and say, I'm working on this film and could you put a little blurb out to, you know, let the parents of and people know that I'm casting this thing and it made a huge difference.
Do you ever keep like people in mind from previous auditions and save tapes and think, oh, they might be good if I have a blank?
Yeah, absolutely.Actors are like, how can I keep in touch with you?If I'm not working on something that's uniquely needing someone like you, I can't keep everyone in my head or have a file handy of everyone.
But I do have some people that have left an impression.And one day, I would love to circle back and find something for them.
And on a big show like Ex-Pats with a big star like Nicole Kidman, how much does someone like that get involved in the process of casting?Do they collaborate with you and have a decision-making process on that?
Her company was one of the production companies, and she was an EP as well as her partner.And so we did send them tapes to have her review, especially the key roles.There was the series regulars, per se, the main ones.
And then the supporting ones, I think she just really trusted Lulu.But certainly people that she had scenes with or
her love into her husband, you know, and it's one of the very rare pieces that I can think of where it was an interracial marriage where her husband was Asian.
And so that was a challenge to bring an actor that felt believable with chemistry, like would her character be married to someone like this, you know?And then, and the list isn't long.
Um, so we really did our due diligence and dug into every actor that was potentially a right fit for her and then finding the kids that were their offspring that looked believable to be their offspring of, of, uh, interracial marriage.So, yeah.
pieces of the puzzle thing that a lot of actors forget about when you're doing a tape, you're putting a tape in, it's like you think in terms of binary, was I good, was I bad?
Whereas it might be you are great, but you looked wrong for the other person that was already in mind or something like that.
I think it's important for us as actors to realize that we're just, we're a big part of a puzzle, but a piece of it nonetheless.
And with kids, you are essentially hiring their parents because you need to find a kid that's great and then come from a situation, because we go outside the industry to find kids quite often.
So they need to come from a place where one parent or a guardian can drop what they're doing and relocate to a set wherever that may be.And in our case, it was Hong Kong.
And if they have other kids or a job or other family members that they need to care for, I mean, you need to scramble to rearrange your life for an amount of time that's required for this job. Yeah, I mean, there's other things to consider.
You need to find someone great and they need to be in a situation where they can service the project for what's required.
And not be a nightmare on set, I suppose, like some showbiz parents possibly would be.We've seen those documentaries, right?Yes, we've heard and seen. Yeah, so that's really interesting.
That's why we're seeing lots of awards now, aren't we?Like the RTS Award for Outstanding Achievement in Casting.I think you won that for Last Black Man in San Francisco.And Minari.And Minari as well.
Oh, double.Clang, clang, double.
Are you going to win an Oscar, do you think?Obviously after the Oscars, yeah. Yeah.
Oh yeah.Oh, that, that let's, I mean, that's a major accomplishment and so long overdue.You know, everyone, you hear so many directors say casting is 90% of the effort to make a successful film.If you cast on point, then, you know,
you don't even have to over-direct or, you know, there's a lot of directors who say they just cast according to how they see the character and then they just let the actor fly, you know, and do their thing and not micromanage the performance.
So with those kinds of things in place that we've heard and seen written, just, it feels like it's long overdue for casting directors to be heralded.
I mean, absolutely, because as an actor, that's our dream is to go on set and be hired for what we bring to the table.And the director really provide us the vision without micro, oh, you cry here and you huff there and you look away there.
We don't want that as actors.And that's why I think we love having a strong relationship with casting who understand our abilities, because that director or producer is only seeing a tiny, tiny piece
of our performance, sometimes only a couple of lines.And, and so I think it's, it's incredibly important that casting knows our work.Yeah.Yeah.
I think casting is just a safe place for actors to try different things.And, um, we're always game to experiment.If an actor says, you know, can I try something Yes, please.We want to see what it is.Because it's such a weird thing to audition.
You are in this room and you can have an off day.I always tell actors, even if you've got it down and you have it memorized, if you go into a callback or an audition and you're faced
with all these people staring at you, it can throw you off your game.And so knowing your lines and really having your material down is step one.
And then it gives you the freedom to play and experiment and go a little off and try something different because you have the basic down, which is the language and the dialogue.
But that situation of having a room full of people is becoming more rare these days.
So for an actor that would love to get an opportunity to tape for you, talk about how the casting process works for you, because I know you work widely for certain things, but then are other characters only submitted through certain agents?
Does an actor have to be with a top agent to get seen for a series regular role, for instance, or is it through breakdowns?How do they do it?
For me, it does not.I mean, I do have trust towards the reputable agencies because they've done their filtering process and they've signed people that they feel are at a certain level and are reliable.So there's some trust there.
But I really gravitate towards material that is untold stories and kind of a new way of
approaching a character and so I go outside the usual databases quite a bit and that is those boutique agencies that see somebody you know early on something whether it's a showcase or a
theater piece locally here or somewhere that they, you know, and these student showcases, the graduating classes of every university's acting dramas department, I watch those.And I don't, you know, they have a long, it depends on the character.
I mean, it really depends on what's on the page. We work with people that are new.
I mean, like Noelle Kate Cho from Minari had never acted before, but she played the sort of dry-witted older sister and played it so beautifully and brought her realness that her own parents said, oh, is that acting?Because that's Noelle.And so.
Listen, we can learn from kids a lot.Kids just pretend.They just pretend.Exactly. Exactly.
And we did that pretend game with Alan Kim where he had to act like he was moving to the Midwest from a big city and moving into a trailer for the first time and looking at it all with wonderment.
And we were just in this very sterile conference room and he was able to convey exactly what we were telling him.
Act like you're looking at something for the first time and it's going to be your new bedroom and your new house and you're, and it's kind of weird, you know, it's on wheels, it's a trailer, you know, and stuff.
And he was able to suspend belief and understand and grasp that at age seven.And so some, some, you know, people just have that ability.And so that is what you're looking for.You're, You're trying to minimize the risk.
If you're looking outside of the database and you're bringing somebody new into the fold that doesn't have a lot of experience, you're trying to minimize the risk and see if they grasp this game of pretend that is our business.
And will they be able to repeat it?And will they be able to do it take after take?Will they be able to bring a freshness even after the umpteenth take? Are they going to get tired and lose interest?
A lot of parents bring their kids that say, Oh, they did it so perfectly in the kitchen.And then when it's in the audition room, they're no longer in the mood.
And they just drove from Orange County to try to, you know, wherever they were to, um, you know, bring that same magic and the magic's not there.And so you make a mental note like this. this person isn't going to be, it's, it's a bit risky, you know?
So you want to, you want to set the project up for success and we try to help do that.
You know, there's no guarantees, but you know, very, very minimal stories in my career of like an actor needing to be recast because they didn't, you know, rise, rise to the requirements on set, which is what is the worst call to get.
Yeah, I mean that magic that kids bring to stuff though, I remember watching one of my favorite audition tapes ever is Elliot in E.T.It's just, it's magical watching him perform in that audition.
And you actually, I think you hear Spielberg be like, okay kids, you got the job, which never happens to any of us in a room, right?But just seeing that level of pretend, I think is important for actors when we're getting our heads about stuff.
Sometimes, often I find with my personal auditions, my first take is the best because I'm not in my head about it.I'm just doing the thing.And I think we can overdo stuff and kids don't do that.They imagine and they do.
Yeah, I know, overthinking.I think we're all guilty of it because we're older now and we just think things to death.But it's true.The one out of the gate is the freshest and throw caution to the wind and just go for it.
And then when they say, we like that, now do it again and again and again, then you start to maybe start.And then you're like, wait, why did you just do that?No, you did it so great.
You're changing things and it's, it's, you're overthinking it, you know?So yeah, I mean, it does happen.
I think it's because once we do a couple of takes as actors, the getting in our head about it is we then start thinking, Oh, that bit was really good.I did this.And you self-examine in the moment and you can see that on camera.
Hit that mark again or hit that.Oh, I liked the way I said that.When really, no, you just got to live in the moment again, haven't you?A fresh go at living in that moment again.
It's okay to give the director choices.You know, I, you know, I work with directors that even though that's not how it's written, they just want to be able to test the range of an actor.
And so they'll say, you know, now just subtly make it a little angrier and edgier, you know, or soften it up and be the nicest guy in the world, you know, just, just so that we know the capability of range and that they can switch it up because a lot of actors who send multiple takes on their self tape,
I'm not really sure what those changes are that necessitated a second take, per se.They feel very similar.Maybe the second one feels like, oh, they warmed up a little bit more, and so they just wanted to add a second take for good measure.
But we need to whip through these tapes.And so unless there's a second take that feels really noteworthy, and I always encourage a little bit of
tip on what that second take is supposed to present so that I can say, oh okay, you know, because I think mentally actors may think they're adding something different but it feels very the same.
Do you mean like a file name or something or just a note in the text when it's delivered or something?
Right, you know, whether it's, you know, I paste it a little up, you know, and it's a faster delivery or this one's a little more slowed down or
this one's a little angry or this one I wanted to come across, you know, whether it's a distracted take or a present take, you know, I don't know, you know, just something that feels like why, what was the intention behind the multiple takes?
It's like actors that put their headshots up online and they say, which headshot do you like?And I'm like, that's exactly the same pose and exactly the same hair, but you've just got different clothes on.You literally just have different clothes on.
In which case, one headshot's probably good enough, right?
Right.Right.Exactly.And I mean, we all know each ourselves the best.So you could go, well, no, my head's cocked a little more this way, or my eyesight, you know, my eyeline is a little more, whatever it is.
It's very, you know, you know, the minutiae of the difference, but yeah, for the, for the people that are just watching or looking at the, yeah, exactly.
What makes a good headshot when you're scrolling through?Cause we all hear about these thumbnails are so tiny.What, what makes a headshot pop for you?
I always say to connect a connection to the camera.And so I think a really good photographer, when you're shopping for one, you need to, I guess there's no way to really preview a photographer, but the good ones are good for a reason.
They know how to bring out the best.And they, I think like people are, like photo sessions are a little awkward and you really just not sure what to do with yourself.You know, there's only so many expressions and poses you can do.
But I think when a photographer is giving you encouragement and saying, All right, that's great.Oh, yeah, do that.Okay, great.You know, I just having had a couple under my belt for professional shots, like, I hate being in front of the camera.And
the person that I shot with was able to bring out the best because they made me feel comfortable and they made me feel good about myself.
So I think start with somebody that makes you feel good about yourself and then just really connecting with the camera and having some thoughts in your head, you know, just not having a blank
just tilt this way, this, I don't know, something that gives you something behind the eyes, whether it's a moment that made you feel good, and so that's coming out in you, a moment that brought you joy for joyful photos, a pensive moment, something that made you have a second thought, you know, something, something that makes your face represent what's going on inside.
I think it's also important to be well rested before as well because these photography sessions can be, they can be long and arduous.Even a couple of hours of taking pics is exhausting.
And I think when you, when the photographers found your spot and everything, lighting's good and everything out, that's when the actor starts to be exhausted and the, you know, so you've got perfect lighting and you have an exhausted look on your face.
I know.And it sounds like wah, wah, wah.But it's so true.You need to be well-rested.You need to be hydrated.And you need to be ready for sort of the time, even for one hour, to constantly be on.It's exhausting.And these are your calling cards.
Your headshot is your calling card. to come across the best that you can.And so, yeah, well-rested, a great attitude.I always like good tunes to bolster the spirit.And then wearing your favorite.
I mean, and also you have to think about your attire, too.Even your favorite may not be the best on camera. So having some kind of consultation and maybe doing some test shots at home, just seeing if your collar sits right.
I mean, just things like that, you know, your favorite shirt might not rest well on your body.And so, um, colors and the way that a fabric rests on your body.
And just, I also find that a lot of actors, because it's a, a, a photo session, they, um, put on a lot of makeup. and do their hair in a way that isn't normally them.And I want, I like photos that represent them. in the way that they truly are.
And so, you know, it's like a bride getting overly dolled up for the wedding when they look beautiful, you know, every day and then they get an updo or some kind of crazy, you know, styling and you're like, Oh my God, you look so much better every day than you do look on your wedding day.
And so like, don't treat your headshot session as your wedding day.Like it come in like how you would want,
Like, know what kinds of roles that you think you're best suited for and that you would have a chance at getting cast for, and then lean into that.
Do not come in looking like, you know, a high society woman if that's not who you are, just because you have this special occasion of getting photographed.
Do you think when an actor is a little further on in their career, like they've got a few guest stars or a few recurring under their belt, should their headshot be a little more generic and adaptable versus, I see a lot of actors early on in their career, they have the, here's my pensive doctor look and here's my comedy look and here's my, but I see actors, the further they get along, they just have their look.
What's your advice there?
I think if you've kind of established yourself, people kind of are familiar with who you are and what your look is.And so you don't have to try as hard.And I think it's important to keep up a current.
And even then, I mean, you know, well-known people are not keeping themselves current because we kind of know what they're looking like these days because we see them enough on screen.
But I think for the person starting out or still having to prove who they are and get more people familiar with them, staying current,
if you get something like a haircut or you grow facial hair, although facial hair can be shaved, it's still, it's jarring when we pick a photo based on the photo you submitted.And then when you come on Zoom and you're like,
completely different, you know, whether you've gained weight or you've lost weight or you've grown facial hair or you look older than your photo, it's a disservice for both parties.
We see a lot of actual headshots on We Audition and I see a lot of people and talk to a lot of people and it is interesting how different people look when they're on video chat too because we're always told you've got to look authentic, you've got to look the same.
I'm always really keen on that when I do.Yeah. my headshots, but people do look different.And I don't know whether that's because they don't want to get new headshots or someone said to me once, well, I've got to look my best in my headshot.
No, you don't.You've got to look you're most like you in your headshot.
Right.Well, your best self.And also, it's not going to help you get the job if you're, you know, presenting a false version of yourself.
It's just not going to, you know, if you're not going to play the, you know, I mean, just who you are out there in the world.If you're not, you know, the hot,
you know, gal or girl at the getting, you know, dates that you have to just basically be who you are, you know, I just don't need a matinee idol hair headshot and then you show up and you're not that.
Um, be embrace who you are because we need to cast all types.And so if, you know, um, I just, I, and plus the leaning man has really changed.Um, I think that, you know, the quintessential good looking guy is not always the leading man anymore.
That's it for you, Rich.I'm taking over.That's why I'm not working so much.No, I mean, I love the fact that things are changing so much, like diversity and in terms of all sorts, not just ethnicity, diversity, but like you said, diversity in roles.
And one of the things when I speak to younger actors about, you know, any advice for the industry for them,
I tell them that, you know, stop focusing on the, you have to be this, this Hollywood thing that you think, because look at any TV show, look at any film, there's such a wide variety of cast in most things, you know, save probably some CW stuff or a superhero movie.
But generally speaking, most things represent all corners of life.And, uh, there's a place for all of us.
who's been in the press recently because she's doing a Matlock reboot and she says she attests to the longevity of her career because she wasn't a drop-dead gorgeous leading type that Hollywood used to embrace.
She feels that the longevity is because of her unique look and that she was able to play all these different characters and get lost in the character versus always be
have the audiences be aware, you know, who she is and that she's this drop-dead person, gorgeous person, or whatever.But I think she's gorgeous, so.
We're talking to the glam, like, how do you look differently upon actors if they've got a lot of press or social media following, or don't you?Does it not matter?
I think you just need to back it up.There's many entry points to the business and social media is certainly one of them.And if you've created a presence that has a lot of following because of
the content that you're clever enough to post or your charisma or dynamic qualities that seem to really resonate with the audiences and people out there, that's something to consider for producers and for casting.
But then when you are presented the material and you need to do the actual skill of acting and helping us believe you as this character, that's another hoop that you need to be able to jump through.And not everyone can make that transition.
But I mean, K-pop and that world, there's so many people who have the work ethic because it takes a lot to get there.And so right there, we know the work ethic is there.
and the onscreen presence is there, but they don't always have the acting chops, you know?And so we always experiment and deep dive into every arena that has potential, but whether they deliver is, you know, we need to put them to the test.
I mean, it's all about doing the work, isn't it?
Like we always say to actors, you've got to be in the actor gym, be reading scripts every day, be working with each other over and over so that you don't need to, I think as Will Smith said, stay ready so you don't need to get ready.Right?
Exactly.Yeah.It's a muscle.It's a muscle.You can't start, you know, running a marathon out of the blue, so you need to train.And so, There's plenty of ways to continue that muscle and have your reflexes be on point and fresh.
There seems to be no excuse to not continue practicing your performance skills even if you're not engaged in an actual job.
That's one of the reasons we built World Audition actually was because, you know, obviously actors can come on We Audition to find a scene partner for their auditions or to rehearse the scenes for the actual job.
But what a lot of people do is work on it in between the jobs.So they are flexing that muscle every day.They're reading for other actors.
They're just, you know, going over scenes as you would in a drama club or class, you know, which I think is really important.
We see a lot of that.I wanted to touch as well just briefly on short films as well because I know you're on a short film jury and you must have seen thousands and thousands of short films.Do you recommend actors do that?Is it useful for actors?
Is it useful for you?Do you like them?
I do.Casting one is just as much work as a long feature film.I mean, it depends on what's on the page.Like just because it says short doesn't mean the process is short for us, because short films can have all kinds of challenging characters to cast.
But I've worked on a couple of projects where a short film was sort of their calling card to the fuller length feature that they wanted to make.And so in order to
get the financing or to get people interested in the longer feature version of it, they made a short to kind of sample the tone, sample their skills as a director, sample the whole concept.And so I think short films are a great
place for filmmakers to get their feet wet.And for actors, for sure, because standing and knowing how to be in front of the camera, set placement, repetitive takes, taking direction, not sort of
being more firmly planted on the ground and not fidgeting on camera.All those things, those habits that you're not aware you have, you know, I'm not that short film, short film filmmakers want you to bring your bad habits to their short film.
But I think everyone is making it for a purpose.And so it's a great place for you to refine and, you know, get your skills ready for more opportunities.
And do you find those short film producers are good to you when they make their features?Do they re-approach you to cast a feature?
One would hope.There's no, there's no, I mean, you know, you can, that's, that's an individual negotiation.You know, I have to be available when it happens.You know, the budget may not be as, uh,
you know, they may not have gotten the kind of budget that they were hoping for, for the longer form.But yeah, most of the time, if I'm engaged in a short film, it's because I believe in the concept.
And so they, you know, just like the actors in the short film, they hope that when the feature length is produced, that they get to be in it.And that's not always the case.
Not always the case at all.Yeah.
So same with casting.I mean,
You would think if a casting director brought you the talent for the short film where the budget was really tight, that when you had more money, you would want to bring the same collaborators, but that's not always the case.
Right, but for any producers listening out there, it is a nice and ethical thing to do if you can.Don't forget the people that helped you on the way up is a good message, really, because I think that often does happen.
People's egos get ahead of themselves and they forget who it was that helped them get to that place in the first place.So we're all about collaboration here, really.Do you have any thoughts on what you would like your legacy to be?
Oh, God, I don't have. any thoughts towards a legacy, but I do love that during my active years in casting I have seeing the terrain of Hollywood change in such a positive way for representation.
As a casting director and as an audience, as a film and avid film and TV lover, I want to see different faces up there.I don't always want to see the same people.And so casting is a huge facilitator in bringing new talent into the fold and
talking to our directors and producers with passion towards an actor we really believe in, even if it might be a risk to take because they're somewhat unproven.They just need the opportunity.And so seeing that happen, because when I first started,
if there was an Asian role, you knew exactly who was going to be on the list.And now the list is so much longer, and I feel like it still needs to be longer.
But I love seeing that during my years of casting and then also seeing the award for the Oscar go to a casting director That's going to be a really monumental moment of pride and seeing my profession sort of be recognized.
It's just really lovely because I didn't get into it for recognition.It was just, I really enjoyed the actors bringing the characters to life as a film lover.And that's the part that I always was moved by the most.
Music and the way that it's shot, and of course, the beauty of how it's edited and all of those components are super important.But for me, it was always performance that moved me the most. am a nurturer in, I think, my basic personality.
And so I love being in a room with an actor and making them feel comfortable to be at their best.
Well, thank you so much.It's been so great hearing all these tips and advice and stories from you, Julia.It's been really wonderful.Are you excited for anything coming up right now?
Yeah, I can't talk about it, but I'm excited.I'm excited for the casting Oscar, really.I think it's going to be fabulous to see my peers and my colleagues get the recognition.And I think we're such a
I, we love each other and we are, I'm, I'm always reaching out to fellow casting directors in and across the globe.You know, if I see, I love international productions, I think hats off to them for
able for being able to cast actors in challenging situations where their resources are super limited, um, and they have, uh, you know, uh, unsupportive governments or who knows whatever it is that they're telling the story and putting themselves out there to speak
truth and to tell a powerful story of resilience, I really respond to that.
And so I always, if I see some piece of work and I can find their contact info, I will always reach out and say, Hey, I saw that work you did and I know it wasn't easy and I just commend you on
finding those beautiful actors to portray those characters and make this story successful.So, um, I just, I have a lot of pride towards our profession.
Wow.Who should have won the casting Oscar last year if it was around?Oh gosh.Give me a top three or top five, whatever.
Listen, I, I haven't done something like Game of Thrones Thrones scope or, you know, Oppenheimer's.I mean, it's mind boggling the amount of roles.
And I know they have a great team and I know that, you know, everyone all hands on deck, but it is dizzying the amount of roles and each role, whether they have
a line or, you know, something, a pivotal moment in the story, even if their lines are minimal, their presence is super important.So each one needs to not be a throwaway.They need to put so much thought.So, I mean,
I just thought the work last year was so outstanding from Barbie to Oppenheimer and to, you know, those are the ones that resurrected the industry.And I think the people behind them knew that there was a lot at stake.So hats off to them.
I couldn't choose.It's like choosing best actor.I was moved by all of them last year and the years before.
Yeah. That's amazing.Well, we look forward to seeing what you're doing in the future, whatever your NDA is, and seeing you hopefully in the Oscars audience, you know?
Thank you so much.Really appreciate it.
Bye.Thanks for listening to The We Audition Show.
Your hosts were Darren Darmborough and me, Richard Cambridge from We Audition, the leading professional actors community where you can connect, learn, elevate your career, and always get a self-tape reader on demand. We hope you enjoyed this episode.
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