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That's code vine 299 at everyplate.com slash podcast.I'm Caitlin Bristowe.Your session is now starting.
I'm just really excited because this is a very niche, unique role that you have.Yeah.How would you explain yourself to somebody and what you do?
You know, I don't like I, I have, I have had these discussions with my friends where I'm like, I don't know.I choose one thing and then I go with it.Okay.So I'll be like, I'm a writer or I'll be like, I'm a therapist.
That one gets me in trouble every time though.Cause then people do you ever tell somebody that on an airplane and then all of a sudden I actually kind of stopped telling people I'm a therapist. Why do you think I have you on the podcast?
I'm going to tell you all my problems, and you're going to help me, and this is going to be just an hour of free therapy for me.
Yeah, free therapy.I love giving free therapy.That's actually my business model.That's my business model.So you do it all.I do a lot, I would say.
But what does it mean to be an existential psychotherapist?
I know, it sounds a little made up.
It sounds made up, but in like a really smart way, like it sounds really smart.Thank you.
Every therapist has a modality through which they practice.What that means is like they have a theory.
And so when they look at someone, they'll go, OK, if I practice from attachment, they'll go, oh, I wonder if this person is securely attached or avoidant or what is it to conceptualize the client.
And what I'm looking for, like themes of responsibility, authenticity, meaning, death, isolation, all the super fun kind of existential stuff.And I help people figure out who am I and why am I here.
whoa just that that's like my question i ask myself every day who am i and why am i here right i 1000 have anxious attachment yes like i go to doomsday with everything like i think the people that i fall in love with are gonna leave me or die or oh wow so i so i like pull back
Okay, how would you explain anxious attachment?Maybe I'm wrong.Like I'm a thousand percent, but how do you explain it?
And I was like, I am not an attachment therapist.But you know?Of course.Okay.Of course, Jesus.But I mean, come on.No.I think people who are anxiously attached, they tend to get closer to individuals as a way to... Okay, that's not me.Yes.
So as a way to kind of hold on to them. their partners tend to feel a bit suffocated sometimes.And so when someone pulls back, they move forward.Avoidant attachment is individuals who are like, shit's going to go down.This is not going to be good.
So I'm going to protect myself by moving back.So you hurt someone.
I'm 1,000% avoidant.That's me.
And so there is obviously more nuance to it.But it sounds a little avoidant.You can be both, by the way.
I'm definitely not the other one.Unless it's with my dogs.
oh yeah i have anxious attachment with my dogs avoid an attachment with humans i feel like i used to have both which is hella confusing for my partners yeah because i'd be like oh my god i need you the second you pull away and then the second you don't pull away i'm like oh my god you're suffocating me funny how do you work through that um years of therapy no um well yeah yeah so like how do you have
a therapist for yourself?I used to have a therapist for myself.And then do you have like certain ones?Because I know there's talk therapy, I know there's like EMDR therapy, there's so many different types as you obviously know.
What kind of therapy helped you the most?
So I did a lot of somatic therapy.I held a lot of things in my body.And for example, I was born in the Balkans.Yes.And I lived through like two wars by the age of nine and then immigrated to Canada.And I didn't.
So you have trapped trauma in your body.Yeah, but I didn't realize I was traumatized.Right.And which is so embarrassing to say because I was in grad school the first time, like grad school to become a therapist.Yeah.
And it didn't hit me that these experiences weren't quite normal and that they probably impacted the way that I was relating to other people, obviously.
And so when I started to develop this panic disorder in my 20s, because I was getting a divorce and all this stuff was happening, I then went to a therapist and she's like, you know that most people didn't have these experiences and potentially you are storing trauma.
So we did a bunch of somatic work and then existential therapy, which saved my life.
Wow.I mean, yeah, I was doing my research.I'm like, you were born in Yugoslavia.Yes.Raised in Canada.Yes.Love that.
And you've just kind of lived all over the world, like Europe, like you said, Middle East, Australia, like that is a lot of life changing experiences that people don't do.
So that does that have everything to do with why you are where you are today?
Well, I mean, I think it has everything to do with with who I am.Yeah. I think first I started traveling as a way to escape.
If I'm being super honest, I think it was like I can't be myself in the context I'm in, so I need to be in a context where I have that space and that freedom and there aren't people pressuring me or expecting things from me.
And then slowly it was such a cool experience because I was bopping around and I said, well what is the one consistent thing?
and it was the way I behaved and it was who I was and so that was a cool way to kind of like test myself and figure out who I was and then I got exposed to a lot of different cultures and a lot of different experiences and then I use that to kind of inform my work.
So one of the things you talk about is how relationships especially romantic ones can sometimes feel like a threat to our sense of identity and not just me I think so many people can relate to that especially when we're just wrapped up in a relationship and you know it's just like this
honeymoon phase of like euphoric bliss and you start thinking this is what it is and this is real when it's not and you lose sight of who you are because all you want is to hang on to that feeling.So what is it?
What do you think happens in that state?
So many things.So I think first of all we have crazy beliefs about relationships.
We have the most warped views of relationships from TV shows, from Disney movies, from our parents pretending things are okay, to music, yes.
Yeah, to our friends lying to us, being like, no I'm happy, and they're not.So I have a lot of clients that go, Sarah, I don't think I want to date ever again.And I'll go, why?And they'll say, because I can't protect myself.
I can't preserve my sense of self when I'm in a relationship. And I think that's because we have said okay you can have autonomy and freedom or a relationship.We never talk about having autonomy and freedom in a relationship.
And that's ideally what you want.So the reason we lose ourselves is because we go okay this relationship is more important than the relationship I have with myself. And for some reason, we're like, it's OK that my freedom is taken away.
My freedom for self-expression, preference, whatever it is.And so my values, my boundaries, we just kind of surrender it all because we're so hyper-focused on this individual, hoping that they're going to fulfill a void that's within us.
And chances are, if you aren't happy without a relationship, you're not going to be happy in that relationship. And so I just think we go in expecting way too much of the other person and then also just surrendering way, way, way too much.
And it's why we lose ourselves.It's like this gradual, I don't know if that happened to you, but no one's just like, I'm going to stop being myself.It's like these gradual circumstances where you're like, oh yeah, I guess I'll do these things.
Or like, yeah, I'll compromise on this.And you do it enough, you'll wake up one day being like, I have no idea who I am outside of this relationship.
yeah yeah how do you think we can protect our sense of self while still being in a relationship and kind of surrendering to the love aspect of it being in love being happy going through the ups and downs while still keeping like how do we do that yeah
Solve all of our problems right now in one sentence.Go.
Amazing.I honestly sometimes think it can be down to scheduling.It's like schedule time to hang out with just your friends.Schedule time to just hang out with yourself.
Schedule time that's meaningful, intentional with your partner even if you live with them.You have to give all of that space to breathe.
Your relationship should not be the only romantic relationship, should not be the only important relationship in your life. The second it is, it's way too much pressure and this is where we invest too much.We invest in a wrong way.
We end up getting hurt.It's too much pressure for the person.It's like, what are the things you value and how can you make sure you continue doing them?
continue evolving as a person expressing yourself as a person and it's hard when we're infatuated like oh my god i want to be with you 24 7 all the time please love me please hang out with me and i think it's literally just having those boundaries so you can keep the consistency and keep like checking in with yourself and doing things that matter to you outside of the relationship i have these thoughts all the time about the beginning of relationships because
people want to hang on to that so badly and it is so fun and it feels so good and everything's just so and you're just like it's just like love yeah everything's so great how do we accept that that isn't reality because it's like you have to enter this next phase of love or like yes the honeymoon phase is there but how do you enter that next phase and just understand that that's where the real love is and that it's not exciting like that every day like
It's kind of the same thing that I think when people are like, are you happy?And I'm like, well, it depends on the hour.We're human beings meant to feel every emotion.I've felt 30 already in the last three hours.I love that.
So how do you just answer, are you happy?But it's going into that next phase for me in a relationship where I'm like, is that when you really need to evaluate if it's real?Yes.
And what time frame do you think that is when people come out of a honeymoon phase? Is it different for everybody?
It's different for everyone.I think infatuation can last from like 7 to 24 months.Sometimes it can last a really long time.And so I think it's important to wait that period out and not make drastic decisions while you're super infatuated.
And you know you're infatuated when they're perfect.
Right?When like all the red flags are beige.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.Everything is just you're like they're the one I can't see a single flaw in them and if you can't see a single flaw in them it means you're not seeing them.Yes.Because everyone is flawed and that's okay.Yeah.
And so I think you have to go through this phase of acceptance of like being willing to see them for who they really are for who they're showing you to be.
A lot of the times while the infatuation is happening people show us who they are and we just don't want to see it.
Yeah and so it has to come to this moment where you're like I am now open to actually seeing you and taking your behaviors and words very seriously and I'm either going to accept that or I'm not.
I think it's so wild in this day too with social media because
I think that's why I'm so I'm so protective now about a relationship like if I'm in a relationship now I do not I want to keep that so special and close to my heart and like not share it until it's like past that you know what I mean like I'm treating dating like uh if I like the internet are my children like I will introduce you to them once I know they're around yes so what do you think of you know how social media has an impact on relationships these days
Honestly, I found a trend that the more someone posts, the less happy they are.
Yeah, I also saw a meme that just came up literally this morning and it said happy people don't need to show off.
Yeah, you know, and my question is, why do you want everyone to see that you're in a relationship?And that goes for anyone.And maybe you're like, that's really a part of me, an important part of me, and I want others to know.
I've always been incredibly private about my relationships.I also have friends who are super vocal, and I love that.But I think having boundaries in terms of like, why am I really doing it?And what is my expectation of it?
Am I trying to prove that I'm happy?Am I being responsible to my future self? For me, it's not that there is a wrong or a right way to approach social media, but it's more checking in as to what the incentive is.That's so fair.
And some people do it as a way to really mark their territory.Especially if they're dating someone who's incredibly hot or famous or whatever. They belong to me, and there's something really nice about being able to do that.You're right.
There's probably so many reasons people do it.Yeah, and it's like, oh, OK, cool.But was that worth putting your relationship on blast?Right.Are you stable enough?Do you guys know each other enough before you get commentary?
Like, I'm not famous, and that's nice in terms of people don't have much to say about my relationships.
Well, it's nice because you're known for something of your profession.A lot of people, for example, who come out of the bachelor world, a lot of people feel entitled to have all the information about your relationship.And I understand it.
But yeah, I think you're right.And I think that can go for every part of social media.Why am I posting this?I was getting really irritated at trends for a minute because I'm like, why are we all copying each other and doing the same thing?
but then my girlfriend made me literally film like 20 TikToks she's like this this is for business like yeah i want to grow my wine label so badly i want it to be people's wine of choice i want to make it relatable and have fun around it and not snobby and she was like this you have to do some trends that's just where social media is at i'm gonna order some i'm gonna send you some
and so I think that's now how I need to think of it.
Okay, this is to grow my business, this is to like make it fun and relatable, this is to show that my wine is inclusive and for everybody and there's no snobbiness around it and it's supposed to be fun and that's where I can have fun on the internet.
Like if I'm in a relationship, I want to keep it private right now. If I want to blow up my wine label, like do that.So that's why I'm starting to think of what my intentions are around posting.Am I posting this for attention?Maybe.
Maybe sometimes I am.Sure.Maybe sometimes I'm posting it to bring brand awareness to Spade and Sparrows.Maybe sometimes I'm posting it because I think it's hilarious and people will relate to it.Like it really is knowing why you're posting.
I think so too.And I kind of, I started off, people didn't even know what I look like because it was just word content.And then I was like, I actually, sometimes people would be like, have you heard of the millennial therapist?And I'd be like, yeah.
Oh, that's cool. And I'd be like, uh-huh, I hear she's the worst.They're like, really?I'm like, no, it's me, hi.Nice to meet you.Nice to meet you.And that was really fun for a long time, and it really preserved my privacy.
And then there was a moment where I was like, I actually, this means so much to me that I want people to get to know me for me, and I want them to know the source of the content that they're ingesting.
And so I'm kind of on this journey of actually putting my face out there. and connecting in a really new way, which makes me super excited.So I know a lot of people are trying to sort of post less, and I'm like, I'm trying to post more.
I think I have a weird relationship with it, because I'm like, I want to post less, but I know that posting more is going to help me achieve certain goals that I want.Of course.
So again, it's like, I don't want to use something to monetize in a phony way.But I want to make people laugh.
you know just grow the things that I already have so it's so social media is such a confusing relationship for me like it's for everyone yeah like if we're being honest and I think it's just people are talking about oh it really bothers me or my mental health suffers when a post doesn't do well right or you know and I always ask why did you post it
And if your why is not bigger than just pure likes, you're in trouble.Like your relationship with media is going to be a really toxic one, an abusive one almost.
But if there is like, hey I wanted one person to relate to this or I wanted to get someone to think about something or I wanted to show that I was human and express myself, then I think it can be a really beautiful thing.
I want to talk about self-esteem versus self-confidence.
yeah so you mentioned an important distinction but between self-esteem and self-confidence which is something i think a lot of people don't realize that they're two very different things it's kind of like when i said to my therapist i'm like at least i'm self-aware right and she was like you're self-reflective
I'm gonna use that.That's so good.That's good.So can you explain this a little more the self-esteem versus self-confidence to me?
Sure, yeah.Self-esteem is the value that you think you hold as a human being.Yeah.Right?Self-confidence is how competent you are and your skill set to do something.
Yes.I am self-confidence.I have self-confidence and I lack self-esteem.
yeah and most people just complete the two they're like and so for me your self-esteem is worth a lot more totally you can fail and still be like i have value as a human being oh yeah i fail and i go you loser yeah yeah no it's so hard and you're like you're worthless nobody loves you no one wants to be around you whatever the narrative is and it's such a harsh thing but i think self-esteem is something we need to preserve and our output is not our worth
And we just need to remember that, that we have value outside of whatever we're trying to achieve.And we need to remember that in our relationships, at work.You're a human being.
You're a precious, unique, wonderful, complex essence that is gracing this earth for, what, 80 years?How cool is that?And nothing can take that away except you.You're the only one that can really take away your own value by the way that you.
How crazy.We're the only person that can take that away.
doing it to ourselves and we're taking it away i always say like you don't need to earn your value yeah you just need to recognize it yeah that's our job is to recognize the inherent value confidence comes and goes yeah and it should not be connected to our self-esteem and it's like wow i suck at this great it's a skill i need to learn it has no reflection on who i am as a human
um and i when i started having that like differentiating these two things it really helped me because i was like okay my confidence is really lacking right now but that doesn't mean i have to attack my esteem and so i think we need to talk about it as two different things it's it's so interesting that you say that because it's like i know that but just hearing it said and spelled out like that in front of me i'm like that's so true because that's why i love doing inner child work that's why i've
done so much inner child work is because i want to find my self-esteem and i've slowly but surely been just making you know like over small shifts making massive shifts yeah but it's because i do i i go if i have this i have this and i do this and i look this way and i get this then that i'm worthy yeah when really it's like i'm already worthy but period
imagine period yeah imagine if we thought that way when we're talking to someone we're interested in someone we're dating someone we're in a relationship and just having the sense of like i'm enough i'm worthy it would change our dynamics so drastically do you think that's possible yeah i think so you do you think it's fully possible for someone to be like i am enough i have like fully and believe it i don't think they'll be consistent forever but i think we'll have those moments yeah
Okay, that's fair because I've had those moments.
I've had those moments too and they feel freaking good.
They feel so good.So good.Oh, they feel so good.
And we need to remember how good they feel because it's like something we can give ourselves.We actually can't really get self-esteem from others and that's also an important thing.No one can make you love yourself.Right.
yeah so let's stop trying we all think that too we all think that we can like love ourselves if the internet loves us if our parents love us if the best friend loves us the relationship it's like the public loves us like it's it just doesn't work that way it actually works the opposite like you'll go you'll be in a very dark place if you rely on that okay we all know how hectic the grocery store experience can be especially during the holiday months oh my gosh we're gonna hack the busy season and let every plate save you time and money with
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Let's talk about breakups and existential crisis.It's something that I know so many of my listeners will be interested in and is breakups.You know when I do like a Q&A on Instagram, people are always curious.
I think they just know like I've gone through enough of them now they're like give me advice.You say that breakups can trigger an existential crisis.I know firsthand how true that is.
So why do breakups feel so painful and life-altering even when we know the relationship wasn't right for us?
A lot of it boils down to us losing ourselves in that relationship.So what happens is it becomes so threatening to break up.It becomes so hard because you're not just ending a relationship with someone.
It's you don't know who you are outside of that relationship and it's so incredibly scary and it also alters like the way the person you thought you would be.
So for example, for me, I remember getting a divorce that was huge because I was like, I thought I was going to be a wife.Right.Being a divorcee in your mid 20s was not hot.Right.Like it was not it was not hot.
And I remember everyone being like, not everyone, a couple of people being like, you know, you'll probably never date again.Oh, my God.I know.They said that to you?They sure did.And I was like, wow.OK, thanks for that.Didn't end up being true.
But I think there is this shift of like, I thought I was a wife. I thought I was someone who was just gonna spend the rest of my life with this person.
I have edited myself so much to fit into this relationship, and now without it, I don't actually know who I am.And so being alone makes you face a lot of hard things, and it's why we spiral.
And so I think it's threatening only when we didn't have a healthy relationship to begin with.If we had a healthy relationship where we preserved our sense of self and autonomy and authenticity and freedom and choice and all these wonderful things,
I actually think you'd be less painful.Then you would just have to mourn the person, the connection, the future you saw with them.You're right.
I always think of it as just grief, but it's so much more than that.
Yeah, it's actually a threat to your existence.Damn.It's why breakups are so painful and so hard and when people boil it down to like you're grieving someone or it's just letting go, it's like no.
That is not, you have now deconstructed your identity.Whoa.And that's huge.Just got chills again.
That's crazy because I always like a deeper something.I'm always searching for deeper something, deeper meaning.
And I've always thought that the grief of it was so much deeper because I'm like, you're grieving this person, but you're right, it's even deeper than the grief. Holy shit.
Yeah and I mean grief is present I think with the deconstruction and the threat.Grief is there all the time but I think it's why it's so intense and we don't even talk about that in terms of breakups.
To me it's such an existential question of like who are you now?
Yeah because even when you spend let's say you spend two years with somebody You've adapted so many of their beliefs, their thoughts.
We take on so much more than we think we do.And I remember I was in two relationships.I've always known I wanted to get a doctorate, for example.A silly example.
And I had two relationships with people that were like, you only want to do it because you're stuck up and pretentious.And one person went as far as saying, you can only get your doctorate if I get mine first.
And I remember going through this crisis of like, okay, education is a huge value of mine.I've always been an academic.I care about it, but like, are they right?Should I not care about it?
Like it was just, it sounds silly now, but in retrospect, I was like, I had people who were like, you're not allowed to do this if you're going to be in a relationship with me.And that's such a wild thing that you bring on.
And then in your next relationship, you're like, I'm scared to tell them I got accepted into my doctoral program, which is insane.
If listeners are going through something like a breakup right now or getting out of that rut, what would you say to them?
Rut in which way?Because that's a really general question.How do you define a rut?
As I said it, I was like, that could mean anything.Yeah.Let's just go with breakup.Like if they're in the breakup right now, they're in that rut of like, who am I?
I've lost myself.What do I do without this person?What advice would you give them?
Be super patient.Be gracious. You might not know who you are and that's okay.I think there's also an obsession.I mean I literally wrote a book on how to figure out who you are.But I think that is a fluid process.
I don't think the sense of self is ever static.And so you're constantly, if you're an aware individual, going to be asking yourself that question almost on a daily basis. And that's great because that means you're going to be more intentional.
I don't think the self is something that we find.This is important.I think a lot of people are like, well, I need to go back to who I was before this relationship.Or I need to find myself.Or maybe my inner child has the answer.Sorry.
And sometimes, she does.Yeah, she does.And she has so much insight.And yet, I think the self is always becoming.And I think it's something that we create, not something we find.And what I mean by that is, if you don't know who you are right now,
try things.Have you watched Runaway Bride?This is the example I love.Do you know that scene where she's fighting with the reporter, Richard Gere?He goes, you're so lost you don't even know what kind of eggs you like.She goes, I'm not lost.
It's just called changing your mind.He's like, it's not changing your mind.You just don't have one of your own.
and she's like super offended but then a couple scenes after she's at home the reason he said this is because she always pretended to like the type of eggs that her partners liked right there's a scene that's powerful in her kitchen where she made dozens of eggs and it's just at our kitchen table by herself trying them figuring out what does she actually want and so whoever is like feeling really overwhelmed at this time and feeling this existential dread after a breakup it's like just try the eggs
I like that.Test, trial, you'll know what feels like you.And you'll know what, you'll be like, do I want to be this person?If the answer's no, don't do it.But sometimes we just have to try.
We think we're going to know miraculously who we are without any failing.And to me, that's too much pressure.
just try the eggs yeah just figure it out be like am i a morning person am i do these beliefs suit me is this representative of who i want to be is it going to get me there we all have this i feel like we all struggle with this thought of who we want to be instead of who we actually are and
owning that like exactly kind of that example from the movie they like whatever the partner likes yeah it's so powerful to actually just sit there and think of what makes me happy what do I like am I like you said a morning person like what there's so many things that we could just get to know about ourselves and it's just who we are and that's and if you don't like like it
change it change it yeah the thought of going back to who i want to be who i was before the relationship you're never gonna that's not gonna happen no that's not how life works yeah so what have you learned from that so you don't want to be that person you actually want to be a more evolved version of yourself and you only will be by going through what you've already gone through so lean into that and what do you do next that person got you into that relationship
Yeah, you don't want to be hurt.And I don't think the solution's ever in the past.And I think when we think that, it's such a dangerous mindset.So it's like, try it.
If you don't like what you see, if you look in a mirror, you're not proud of that person, you don't like that person, own it.Be like, this is me right now.It doesn't have to be that way.
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I feel like all brands and companies do their sales at the end of the season just to get rid of things, but Macy's is offering to us from October 28th to November 4th. Thank you.So let me tell you, I'm already getting my shopping list ready.
So as the leaves are turning and the weather is starting to cool down, I just start dreaming of cozy fall outfits and stylish updates for my wardrobe.Even if it's still hot out in Nashville, I still want my home and wardrobe to be feeling like fall.
And Macy's, of course, always delivers.This year, I've got my eye on a few key pieces.Now, first on my list, a chic new coat that is going to make me look like I stepped out of a fashion magazine.
You know the kind like the soft luxurious and perfect for those crisp autumn days and then you pair it with boots and oh maybe a beanie.And speaking of autumn days let's talk about sweaters.
I don't think there's anything better than slipping into a cozy sweater when the weather gets chilly.Macy's has a fabulous selection and with an extra 30% off I am Definitely picking up a couple of new favorites.
So I don't know whether it's a like chunky knit or a sleek turtleneck.Those never go out of style.I'm all about comfort and style.So now let's not forget about accessories.Very important.
I'm a firm believer that accessories can make or break an outfit.A statement handbag or a stylish scarf.And of course some standout boots.Essential.
Macy's always has the latest trends, and with this Friends and Family event, I'm so excited to find those perfect finishing touches.They just really pull everything together.Oh, and the beauty discounts.I will not forget to tell you about those.
I've been wanting to try out some new beauty products, and getting 15% off the best brands is the perfect opportunity.So from luxurious skincare to that must-have mascara, this is my chance to stock up on everything I need to look and feel my best.
So here's how you can make the most of this event, okay?Head over to Macy's.com to start shopping now or visit your local Macy's store.
And trust me, there's nothing like the in-store experience where you can like touch and feel the products and try things on.Plus Macy's always has the friendliest staff.
I don't know if you've been, but literally the friendliest staff ready to help you find exactly what you're looking for. And if you're like me, you love a good deal.I really do always have, always will.
And this event is all about savings with discounts available on both regular and already reduced prices by getting a little bonus shopping spree with all of the fabulous finds that you have been eyeing.
Okay, before I let you go, I have to share a little personal shopping tip.
when i am out shopping i always set a budget and then i stick to it and it helps me focus on the pieces that i really love and need rather than just grabbing everything that catches my eye and with macy's fantastic discounts you'll be able to snag those top picks without even breaking the bank so mark
Mark your calendars, right now, do it.October 28th to November 4th, get ready to dive into Macy's friends and family event.
Whether you're shopping for yourself or getting a headstart on holiday gifts, literally the perfect time to find incredible deals on everything you love.So let's all enjoy these fabulous savings together from the one and only Macy's.com.
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Wash your way to healthy hair and get a hair routine that's made just for you by Waze.Go to theouai.com and use promo code VINE for 15% off any product.That's theouai.com, code VINE. We really are all feeling lonely.Yeah, I think so.Yeah.
Because I feel like we're all just moving into this phase in our lives of knowing there's something greater, like more to be learned about ourselves.And like, we're really questioning existence.And I feel like that could be lonely.
super lonely especially if you're not bringing that conversation up chances are most people are having an existential crisis yeah we're just not talking about it because it's not sexy it's not positive it's not yeah all these things we think we should be doing or a lot of us feel shame we're like we're journaling and we're reading self-help books and we're meditating and i still feel this way and i want to be like yeah because that's being human i think psychology has kind of set an unrealistic expectation lately like pop psychology
And I think it's an issue where, this is why I love existentialism, because it's like, life is kind of absurd, kind of sucks, what are we going to do about it?And I'm like, I'm so much more comfortable with that.
That's so true.Gosh, the amount of times that people, it's like, and I do all those things.I journal, I meditate, it helps, I get it. But we are putting, like, and I love that we're all talking about mental health and all of these things.
But now we need to stop, like, we always overdo it as a society.We always take things too far, don't we?It's become, yeah, like, overcorrecting.
Now we feel shame when we don't do these things and don't have these, like, 17-hour morning routines.And people are like, what do you do, Sarah, in the morning?I was like, I don't have a routine.And, like, the shock and disgust. that people have.
Do you know what I mean?I'm like, I travel so much.I'm in different time zones several times a month.I do things that ground me, but the expectations are too high.We're hurting each other.We're misusing terms.We're putting pressure on.
Let's just stop.Let's be in the gray.Let's just know we're all kind of suffering and trying our best, and that's probably OK.
could you imagine if we all just owned that oh my god imagine if you're like I'm not perfect I want to like I want to the like t-shirts reddit community to like understand that and be like you guys are hurting hey guess what we all are like how can we support each other instead of tearing each other down
yeah and let's stop like putting people on a pedestal oh like over analyzing and studying and if that's how much time you're spending on someone else it means you're not spending enough on yourself a hundred percent like people like did you see this so and so and i was like no yeah no healthy relationships let's talk about yes the three main ingredients that you think is for healthy relationships which is responsibility authenticity and freedom
yes preach yeah like those three things i've never thought of the rest of responsibility aspect of it but like biggest one authenticity freedom and and responsibility like how can we make sure that we're incorporating these elements into our own relationships
Yeah so I'll often hear one-sided stories from girlfriends, guy friends, clients and I'm like this is what happened and even if it seems to me at first glance that it's a hundred percent someone else's fault I have done this job for too long to truly believe that's true.
Of course.And then I'll go.It can't be.No so to a client or a friend I'll be like depends how direct I am, depending to who I'm speaking with.
But I'd be like, if you had to assign yourself responsibility, I call it the 5% responsibility rule, even if it's half a percent or 5%, what would it be?Because chances are you're not at 0%.
So tell me what are you responsible for in that exchange, in that breakup?People don't think that way, right?People often don't go, oh, how did I contribute?Even if it's half a percent, how did you contribute?
Now, of course, I'm not talking about like abusive relationships.Of course.That is not what I'm talking about.But everyday dynamics, it's like, check yourself.
And when we start to take responsibility for our relationships, it's when we start having healthy relationships.And the fact that you can go to your partner and go like, hey, I really, can I swear?
OK, I f***ed up.Yeah.This is what I'm owning.Yeah.Then they are more likely to do the same.
And blame and responsibility are not the same thing.Responsibility is empowering.It's ownership. I think it's sexy.I think it's amazing and it's the only way to move forward.And so it's like, what are you owning?
It's so hard.Why is it so hard to do it in the moment?
I think because often what happens is when you take, let's say you're like, I'm 30% wrong.When you take the 30%, sometimes the other person wants to give you the other 70.And then we're like, or maybe we've never seen our parents take responsibility.
or you know we we have an aversion to responsibility as a society almost right because it's like we feel like that's blame and so I think it's modeling the behavior we want to see and it's also going like you are part of the problem yeah so if you want a healthy relationship change right you're part of it
yeah i find it empowering and authenticity is a huge one we compromise that we're like who do we think they want us to be yeah great i'll become that person yeah that's the self-esteem issue a little bit that's also the expectation and so i think if you preserve your authenticity they're gonna have such a better time otherwise who are they having a relationship with right like
with an illusion, with a projection, with a what?And so genuine relationship has to be between two authentic individuals.And then when you feel like you're becoming more yourself through the relationship, beautiful.And you are going to evolve.
It's actually really tricky because if you think about a relationship, it's like two cars that need to move at the same speed in the same direction.
That is incredibly difficult to achieve and you can only achieve that with communication and taking responsibility. and giving each other the freedom to actually evolve.Because a lot of people are like, well, you're not the person I married.
You're not the person I started dating.It's like, thank God.That was eight years ago.Do you want me to be that person?I don't understand.So also having this expectation that we will change and evolve.As long as it's in the right direction.Exactly.
And if it's not, then that's when you're like, hey, we're no longer moving in the same direction or at the same speed.We call that out.We honor it.And we go, I want you to pursue that if that's who you want to be, but just not with me.
I wish we could all have your brain. You're so sweet, what?No, I'm serious.I wish, like, could you imagine if we all could think that way?
Like, in the world, in relationships, it's just, I mean, the whole, you know, kind of idea of this podcast has been the, who am I?Why am I single?Why am I unhappy in a relationship?Why am I this?Why, why, why?
And I think a lot of people do struggle with those big questions.Those are big questions.Of course.So the, who am I?The, why am I still single?Or even the, why am I stuck in unhappy relationships?
How do you help guide people through finding these answers?
So the who am I, I don't think can be answered verbally.Let me explain.
That's something I talk about in my book actually because the second I ask someone who are you, they're going to tell me about their habits, their roles, their accomplishments, and for me the only answer to who am I is how you show up in the world.
That's it.You want to see who you are?Watch yourself.That is who you are in this moment.You like it.You don't like it.I don't care.That is who you are.And you're like, but deep down I'm this other version.It's like, no, no.That's who you want to be.
But in this very moment, you are exactly who you're presenting. We like that sometimes, we don't like that sometimes, but there isn't an alternative you, I don't believe.
There is a perpetual you, there is a you that will come after this, that maybe you like more, but unfortunately in this moment you're exactly who you are sitting on that chair.That's who you are.
so that's the answer to kind of that question because I think it can be quite simple I like that and then like why am I single I mean that's it's I would say what is your role in being single and I don't know why you're like also people have this expectation that they know that was a really elegant answer
feel free to cut that out or keep it in i'm like why are you saying i don't know let's talk about it like i mean again that's a very personal question yeah i'm like i don't know there's literally a million trillion reasons why somebody could be yeah but maybe you're avoidantly attached right no it's something that like people need to sit with with themselves to ask and i i think a lot of judge yourself well yeah that's it i think a lot of people think single bad
I don't know.Thank you for bringing this up.I don't think romantic relationships are the most important relationships we'll ever have.And we need to stop that notion.Otherwise, our friendships are going to suffer.
Our family relationships are going to suffer.And it just doesn't make sense.Second of all, why do we have this notion that single people aren't happy?Some of the happiest people I know are alone.
truly intentionally truly and i love that and i'm like maybe you don't want to be with someone that's also okay so let's start talking about it i think it's so interesting and i do think it's i do think it's a generational thing of what parents have you know their beliefs or
certain things but I and I do think people are you know starting to figure it out freeze your eggs choose yourself find out what makes you happy like I do think there is something to be said about that happening but it's just you know you've got that older drunk uncle who will say something at dinner about why are you you know like you just there's the family dynamics of people or like you can't possibly be happy yeah yeah right like I have like I have people like how much and they're like you didn't remarry like are you okay right like yeah thanks
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Compounded products are not FDA approved or verified for safety effectiveness or quality prescription required restrictions apply. Okay, talk to me about your book.Sure.Where can people get it?What can they expect when they read it?
Okay, so I would say it has a little mirror on the book.I love that.And it's titled, It's On Me.So what you can expect is a lot of hard truths. in a very loving way.And I think it's about self-loss.It's about what happens when you lose yourself.
And there's a bit of my own journey of looking in a mirror and literally not recognizing who I was and being so incredibly miserable when everyone thought I was very happy.
And so if you're someone who is like, I don't know how to answer who am I, and I'm not really sure how to get in touch with that person, that's what the book is about.Genius.
thank you yeah i feel like when people listen to this podcast they're gonna be like yeah i need more so book is a great great way to do it yeah great night so where can people get the book and when is it coming out the book is out you can literally get it anywhere books are sold um and you can get a kindle you can get an audio version if you want me like talking in your ear oh that sounds nice
yeah just like you have a pleasant voice oh thank you so yeah it's out in the world and it's something i'm really proud of i was gonna say you must be so proud of it i am very proud of it and i think it's the book i wish i had that to me is the way i want to show up in the world like even for myself for other people i want to be an act and and have discussions like this to be what i would have wanted
yeah to show up now even on this podcast i want to be able to have conversations with people like yourself with people that you know come off reality tv and they didn't really actually get to decide on what their voice sounded like they have an edited version of themselves and they get to like explain themselves i just like anything that's feel good and every single time let me tell you this every time i talk about somebody else in a negative way
it somehow comes back around and it either makes a headline or it doesn't feel good or it's I leave being like, oh, I don't like talking about other people in a negative way and I feel like that's really hard to do.
But do you have any proof almost that gossiping is bad for your mental health?
I mean, the shit you say about people says more about you than them.
Yeah.Like, because I, and correct me if I'm wrong, once in a while with your girlfriend to just have a little vent session, people love to bond through gossiping.
Yeah, they sure do. They sure do, because it's like, ooh, we hate the same person.It's almost like triangulation.It's like bringing someone else into your relationship so you can feel closer together or to each other through hating someone else.
And for me, it's like, if you don't want this shit said about you, don't say it.Why are you saying it?It's usually jealousy, insecurity.
maybe you just want to project onto them you had a really shit day so now you're going to bitch about a celebrity right just because you need to get it out of your system so a lot of it is like why and sit there and venting fine but venting is like something is happening it's your experience yeah
if it's not your experience then it's gossip yeah and i think it's really important to be like why am i doing this and what am i trying what need am i trying to fulfill i always think about the moment that people get like let's say i make it to 100 and i get on my deathbed yeah i wonder if i'll be like i think i've got it figured out now or i'll still be like nope i think at that point i'd be like i don't give a shit like that literally was like
do i do i not none of this matters bye 40s a new 30 50s the new 40s because you stop giving as much of a shit this is actually so true you know i see 20 year olds and i'm like thank god i'm not there anymore like 30s feels so good because the amount of that you give is so much less oh i turned 40 um in well so it'll be next year technically because june
and i'm not this is so exciting i'm not even dreading it why would you be dreading it because people make me people make you believe that like oh you're not married with babies and you're almost 40 they make and i'm like i'm actually excited because i think that will be the year that maybe i you know that might happen for me or that's what i'm striving towards like i'm excited for it i think that's the next chapter of my life i'm very excited for your next chapter thank you whatever that is
I'm excited for your book, and I'm excited to read it.And tell everybody where they can find you.
You can find me on Instagram.Millennial.therapist is my handle.Amazing.And then Substack.It's called Notes From My Phone, because I'll often pick up my phone and write down notes and things I'm thinking about.So that's the longer form.
If my phone ever got broken into and they saw the notes.Oh, no, no, no, no, no.Yeah, same.Please don't break into my phone.Oh, gosh.We're like inviting people to break into our phones.I know.I'm like, oh, god.
I'm changing every password.
This is a terrible idea.Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Let's cut this part out.Just kidding. Well thank you so much for coming on the podcast.
Thank you for having me and also I know you talked about the impact you want to create.This podcast is it.It's doing so much.It's giving people a voice.It's giving people information.
It's making people like me fall in love with everything you're doing and it's just
it's an honor being here thank you thank you i i truly like i when i meet somebody i was just in niagara and i these two girls were sitting at the bar and they're like we're vinos and it's those words come out of people's mouths and i like instantly feel love towards them because i'm like you are why i do what i do
this is my favorite thing to do.
I love meeting people because I usually just get to stare at a couple cameras and I have this, you know, intimate conversation where we don't have our phones and we're just in the moment having this, like, amazing dialect.Dialect?Dialogue.
Why would dialect?I knew that I said it.I was like, that ain't right.You were so close, though.That ain't right.
Dialogue.And to meet people, I'm like, oh, right, there's other people on the other side of this.And I just hope I'm, like, bringing some sort of joy to their day.You are.I really do.You are. And to my day.Thanks.Well, thank you.
I think the community that we've I don't want to just say me that we've all created and brought together.I feel like they this stuff is important to them.So thank you.
Thank you.I'm Caitlin Bristowe.Your session is now ending.And if I'm being honest, I wouldn't mind a rating.
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