You're listening to the Bolt Floats Podcast.Your number one resource for everything Bolt Freight Trucking.
Hey guys, Jared Flynn with the Bulk Loads podcast.Got Tyler with me.What's going on?I'm going to let you kick it off with this amazing truck feature.
Yep.Today we have Jason Sally with Sally Farms Trucking out of Warsaw, Missouri.And Jason and Crystal, his wife, they have been Bulk Loads members with us since 2013.And they have been also a Smart Freight users since the beginning as well.
Yeah, Jason and I go back.Actually, Jason, Rachel Biesterfeld, who is our CEO on Smart Freight, we go back to the Bartlett days and I can specifically remember meeting Jason.I forget what year it was, but it was in St.Joe, Missouri.
It was at Lifeline Foods.We were up there and he was up there, I think loading out some DDGs, but got to meet him for the first time.But then since then, met his brother, Jeff Sally.We actually did, I think it was our second
truck feature video was with Jeff Sally.He drove down here because they're just north of here in Warsaw, about 40 minutes north and did that one.It was pretty cool, interesting to say the least.
We were still learning how to do these truck features and he graciously came down, but yeah, cool rig.
Yeah, very cool.Uh, Joe actually went out there and took this picture.Um, but yeah, it's just so cool.I mean, it's a work of art and I think, uh, if I remember right, Joe was telling me that Jason is actually getting this truck ready.
Um, he plans to actually take it to shows, um, and enter it in, um, truck shows and stuff.So hopefully we can get out there and we can record a whole video just on this truck.Um, and Jason kind of walking around and talking about it.
Yeah. Cool.So speaking of cool photos, you asked last week about the Idaho trip.I said, let's wait till this episode, but yeah, I wanted to highlight just some photos.Joe was with us.
We did some really cool videos, which he's going to release soon, but I wanted him to throw up some of these photos, but We got to go out there and meet with John Pocock and his family.
The guy was just immensely humble and hospitable for us, but yeah, I got to go out and I'll let them throw some of these slides, but everything went to go out and witness potato harvest and watch them actually harvesting.
So my son came along and got to ride in the tractor while they were harvesting, but got to go to see where they go for storage, but then even got to go to the manufacturing warehouse where these things are getting cleaned.
and process all the AI automation.And again, it's just cool.We deal with so many types of commodities and products in bulk trucking.So it's awesome to see everything from not just grain, but potato harvest.
Joe and I, we were up in Pennsylvania where we saw
The wineries and even that's there's a huge amount of bulk that's involved with that So yeah, just cool experiences with that said we are we have I think four more videos lined up But we are getting more and more interest of that to be featured.
We want to feature you in one of these videos It's twofold We get to share it to our audience.So they get to know about you.We get to use it as advertising for us.
But again, it really gets to promote your company and hopefully allow more businesses to see what you do, both from hiring standpoints, but even customers.
Yeah, exactly.And all you have to do is just drop down.If you're on YouTube or wherever you're listening, actually in the show notes, there will be a link that you can fill out.It's not much.It's just asking just about your operation.
And anything unique that you'll be able to bring to the table and then it allows you to schedule some dates that maybe you can work for you to where Joe and Possibly Jared if you're available to go out to your operation spend some time with you.
We'd greatly appreciate it Yeah, we're gonna be in Lancaster PA coming up the end of this month So if you are up in that area reach out to me We'd love to stop meet you.
We'll be up there for three four days doing some video shoots out there So super excited about that.Awesome.So awesome.
Well today getting into the podcast We're gonna bring back Rick Johnson and Kirk Erickson if you remember we had them on a couple months ago talking about their lease purchase program and got to talking with them they live here in Springfield and wanted to dive in a little bit more and talk about
You know, a lot of times, sometimes we talk macroly about these subjects, but even talking in the details when, if you're in bulk and there's all different ranges of bulk, but specifically, how do you make sure and spec out a truck?
So you're running the most efficiently and really affordably for those clients.
Right.Yeah.It's a it's a great episode where they dive deeper in to this whole lease purchase thing.But they also point out some practical and impractical things in trucking.
One of the things they mention is like, you know, these high cost show trucks.A lot of guys are driving, you know, sometimes those are impractical. especially for new guys getting into the industry and starting in this business.
There's no need to try to go after that show truck and, you know, spend all that money, even though they look cool, Jared, and I would probably drive one.But they just touch on some of those practical tips.
And it reminded me of, you were just at Fultz Trucking.
Speednet their forum and you know, they're the largest hopper bottom specific company in the u.s And I think how they got there is by you know A lot of people give them grief for all the Volvos and everything they run But whenever you look at the operation the efficiency that they're able to bring to the table with running those certain types of truck for bulk freight I think it shows for itself, you know how they've been able to grow like that and
Yeah.And I always think I have to give a disclaimer because we love all trucks.We love the show trucks.We know that operations are different.So we're not for against other ones.Our goal with this podcast is to bring all different sides to the table.
And then you, uh, as the company can decide what fits your operation.So again, love the, the, the decked out show trucks.We see companies, a lot of those are working class trucks, but also we know that there are some companies that focus on more,
technology and efficiency and run those trucks as well.So there's a combination of both.So hopefully we give you the content for you to make the best decisions on that.
So, and I also say some of the things Rick and Kirk say, they've been in this business for 40 plus years.
So there's a lot of knowledge and wisdom may not match up or align with yours, but we want to bring both sides so you can make the best decisions. I wanted Garrett to, when, uh, and again, maybe I'm poking fun.I'm not picking fun.I was just funny.
But like, when I see that their older guys have this wisdom, but they remind me of like, you're too young to remember like the Muppet characters, the two older gentlemen, like the presidents, like they would always kind of be like jamming, like blah, blah, blah, blah, back and forth.
But maybe Garrett will throw up a photo of those.But like, I was like, that would be them, but I'm not making fun of them.It was just something funny.I like to, I like to, uh, have humor with a lot of what we do.You know me for a little bit.
So I always think when I, when I saw that video of them together and there's one that they have where they were turned around looking at this truck behind you and just remind me of that.So cool.
Well, with that said, here's my conversation with Rick Johnson and Kirk Erickson. Kirk, Rick, thanks for coming back on.Good morning.
Good afternoon.I'm sorry.
Yeah.Well, we had quite a bit of reactions from our last show, so we wanted to bring you back on and probably get a little more gritty in what we talked about.Because when you talk about lease purchase and financing trucks,
Man, there are so many sides of the aisle.There's so much debate going on.Even before we hit the record button here, we were just talking about some of those details.So, man, hopefully we can keep this in 30 minutes.We want people to stay tuned.
I think we're going to get really exposed some really good information out talking about trucking.But Rick, I want to point this to you first.Talk about, I think from when we talked about
this lease purchase program, putting these guys with a good company.And I think about if I'm a driver, company driver, yeah, I like this program.
It sounds like this is a good way to get started, but am I going to haul for somebody that I really want to work for?I think that's the really big, important question.You all really kind of point or guide drivers to companies, right?
Well, We have, well, I have trucks at 28 different companies and we don't know what their gross settlement is because we don't ever get involved in their personal money.But what we do know is when they struggle to make their payments.
So typically that is across the board.If you have a flatbed carrier where you've got, well, I got one right now that's got 19 trucks. There's only five of those guys that are doing really well.So I don't direct anybody to those folks.
I don't, I don't de-sell them.It's just a new guy.If he asked me, what about so-and-so?Well, I've got five guys there that do pretty good and the rest of them don't.I'd be happy to give you their numbers.You can talk to them.
So I don't bad mouth any company, but I want to see them do well.Yeah.Typically the higher paying companies have higher standards.So the higher the standard, the better quality of driver, the lower the turnover.Same way with a truck.
You got to have a support system.You got to have it decently priced and you have to stay with him, cradle to grave.
Hey guys, many of you all know, but we created a collection of children's books called Semi Sam.These books were spurred when my kids were little, my boys, we couldn't find books on trucking and on agriculture.
So I got together and thought of this idea to create a fictional character called Semi Sam. and really encompass the storylines behind agriculture.Since we've started, we've created four different books.
We're about ready to release a fall book called Semi Sam and the Pumpkin Harvest.
If you haven't yet, you can find these on Amazon, but also if you're a member of Bulk Loads or you have resources that you want these to go to, we love to gift them out to people.We send them to a lot of our clients that
Give them out in parades, at other different events, conferences, and we would love to do that just as a thank you from us.Reach out to us.You can contact us at support at wholeclothes.com.
You can go to any of our social media, or you can go to amazon.com and find the Semi Sam collection.We hope that you enjoy these for your kids and grandchildren.Thank you very much.God bless.Talk about higher standards.
What do you mean by some companies have higher standards?For example, Oakley.
Yep. Bull collar.Yep.Big client of ours.960 trucks.They want to be at a thousand trucks by the end of the year.In January, we had two trucks there and we did it as a test to see how well they do.They did very well.So I added four more.
They did very well.So I added four more.They did very well.I got 13 there today and two more going.So we began to direct guys in that way because they have high hiring standards.If you've had over two jobs in five years, they don't want you.
You have to be a single owner operator with a truck five years or newer, and it has to be PTO compatible. And that's a big deal when your predominant used truck dealer specializes in used mostly Freightliner fleet trucks.
A Freightliner fleet truck is not a PTO compatible truck. Those automatics don't come with the PTO feature unless you order it that way.I mean, we've known that for years because we were in the tank business.
So we try to point them gently in that direction.And if they qualify, their chance success is twice what the next guy's is.If he hears, oh, so-and-so, I got a buddy that told me he's doing really well over there. I don't know what really well means.
I've never been able to put really well in the bank.It's just like putting miles in the bank or whatever.I need to know the dollars and you need to know the dollars.So do your homework, just like do your homework on us before you buy.
You want to know who's my trucks?I'll give you any names you want.You can call. So, we try to help them be successful.Because if they are, we are.
So you said right now, obviously, and I know this, the flybed market is tough.There's been some local companies here I know of, specifically in the Springfield area, that have went out of business.
So in like today, and we know the market's changing, but like today, where are you pointing guys that are interested?Like what type of freight?You don't give me specific companies or you can't give us specific companies, but what type of equipment?
The two that we recommend the most is Bruce Oakley and Little Rock for in-dump hopper, or they have a few pneumatic tanks.
So it's going to be bulk stuff that a lot of our listeners are already used to.
And the other is Keenan Advantage Group, which is tank freight. Because typically the same qualifications apply to both.Both sides need mid-roof trucks, 15 liter or better power, good warranty, very reliable, less than five years old.
And that equipment fits.Their need fits our equipment and our concept perfectly.
Where specifically here in the U S or region, are they looking for trucks?Cause I think that's a big question.Our podcast covers all 48 States, Canada and all over.
So we got guys listening to California and New York wherever, but for this example, again, for the listeners, cause I want to get really gritty.Where would, where would these guys need to be located based out of?
Cause I think like the guys living right now in Columbus, Ohio, is there an advantage to this?There is.
We have trucks based in Louisville, Kentucky. I mean, right now we're in 28 states.Predominantly Midwest, Southeast.That doesn't mean we can't be, it's just that's our breadbasket.And they're scattered all over.
We have 12 in Gainesville, Georgia that run out of a Keenan Advantage group.Hope Hall, Alabama, Decatur, Alabama, Loudon, Tennessee, Baton Rouge, Springfield, Jacksonville, Illinois.
Where they live and where they work out of, we don't really care, except we have yet to reach out to California because our safety net doesn't reach that far.
In other words, we don't have a good maintenance network there to help them to get repaired.So we try to stick to essentially call it the Colorado line east minus the northeast.
Yeah, sure.You said maintenance.I want to go down this and Kirk, if you can even elaborate on this as well, because man, I've recently in, there's going to be a show that's coming out soon talking specifically about maintenance and software.
But this guy was talking about, especially when you deal with maintenance, first off, people are always behind and they don't take maintenance as serious as they should.And secondly, a lot of people don't even know what's covered.
Like when you have warranties and stuff going on, like it's like this, again, it's open my eyes.Like it's the wild, wild West when it comes to people not taking care of equipment.And that can be this, this company I was talking to.
they preach that they can almost save $7,000 a year in maintenance costs by using the program.That's the debunk.
We'll talk about it later, but talk about maintenance because you said that's a scary one for new owner operators or lease purchase because, you know, versus other programs, you get something, something breaks down.
Then all of a sudden, man, you don't know what to do, or now you're stuck with the bill, but talk about how you all help in that regards when you're dealing with maintenance.
Rick, go ahead.Really good question.
This is a big one, I think.I mean, this is the main reason.
This is a 300 pound elephant in the room.We have a guy right now that's a 2024 Lone Star.He noticed his wheel seal was leaking.I said, well, there's a problem.And he just happened to call me because he couldn't get all the maintenance.
He was in Glenwood, Arkansas. And I said, well, you better get it to the dealer.Something fishy going on here.This is a second wheel seal I've heard going out in one of these trucks.Same mileage, same truck, two weeks ago on the front axle.
So I sent him down to Texarkana, which is the international deal, 85 miles away and it was raining.By the time he got there,
They said that the vent plug was leaking on the front differential and it allowed rain to get in and dilute the oil in that front end.It was going to be $16,000 to fix it.I had a cow. Well, maybe a calf.And so they're not one to board.No.
And they're warranty.Yeah.So is that falling on you or the driver?
Well, we've accepted responsibility of that first, because that rear end has a half million mile warranty on it.What do you mean you're not gonna honor it?So their excuse was, because it let water in there.
I said the reason the water got in is that valve on top of the front differential.
come in screwed enough and it was in a heavy downpour on his way to Texarkana, your valve on the front of that thing was loose when he got there and it's on the report.That let water get in that front differential.That's where the water came from.
And that's a big issue.Well, that's a fluke.I said, tell you what I'm going to do.I got 10 of those trucks, all of them within 30,000 miles of one another.I'm going to be on the phone to every one of those drivers for the days out.So
And this is you talking to the International Service Department?No, me talking to the driver.To the driver, okay. And he was there at the repair shop.I said, I'm not gonna let this stand.This truck, this guy's a runner.
And he'd been in a year, about a year and four months.He'd run 180,000 miles.Great driver.He paid off his first truck, got that one.So I had our, Doris, our maintenance lady, help me.We called all 10 of those drivers.
Nine out of the 10 of them had the same problem.They didn't realize it.They got out and checked that little, It's like a hollow bolt that screws into that housing.There's a fault in it and it was backing out.
And when it backs out and it rains heavy enough, it's spewing some of the fluid out and it's causing water to get in.And so I called them and they're like, well, that's a fluke.So driver's supposed to catch that.I said, it's on the front axle.
It's on the driver's side.You know all that junk that's around there?If he's got a trailer, he can't see that.
This is you talking to International.Yeah.
So they said, we're still not going to do it because Spicer says so.I said, well, I'm not going to let this go.You get your donkey at International on the phone because nine out of 10 of these trucks are that way.
I've got five of the same and we're going to call Kirk.
I said, you got five, check them out.
Yep.We're going to go in on the same.
We're escalating it to them.And the guy said, well, it's on the driver.I said, no, it's not.You're failing to uphold your warranty because you just want to give somebody a no and push it off on me or the driver.And that's not going to stand.
So he said, I still don't think I'll do it.I said, tell you what, I'm represented by louder Johnson here in Springfield.They have 200 attorneys.You're going to meet one of them next week.
So either we can work this out or it'll get real ugly because it's not right.All I'm asking you is the right thing.It's a brand new truck.And you got nine out of 10 had the same problem.
The drivers caught two of them and fixed them themselves, but they thought it was a minor thing.But the fact that it's loose, it's a bad setup.And they come with a, All that little, what do you call that tape you put around?
they had a little bit of orange teflon on those threads in that factory one but it was very small and it was allowing them to vibrate loose and the front axle is where your differential is where your power divider is so there's a little more vibration there and typically those will run maybe five to ten degrees hotter
than your rear axle.So the combination of those things was causing those to back off.And you're telling me that a driver should be able to crawl under there and check that and know to look for that?And what maintenance manual is that?
What alert did you ever put out of that effect?So, man, we can talk about this forever.
I want to plow through, but like, so this is, as we speak right now, this is still ongoing?
And I told him to check all his trucks.
But for that driver specifically, he's not going to worry about that bill.
He didn't do anything wrong.
And that's kind of awesome.I think that's how you're doing the right thing.Well, it is.It's not a question of the money. It's just doing the right thing.If you do the right thing, the money will fall.It's just that simple.
Whereas if that driver was out, got his own, got a loan.He'd have been with the bank and got that truck.He has no power whatsoever.
How's he going to pay for that?He would have never known.And nobody would have ever gone to bat for him.He'd have just been out there.
He lost $16,000.$16,000 fix.And the worst thing is, this was Thursday of last week.That truck won't be repaired until Tuesday of next week because they had horrible quality parts.
So you said this morning, last podcast, I don't want to speak for you.You guys do provide trucks.If a truck's down, that's part of your program.
So he can get another truck and run and keep going.He can get a loaner truck.I said, look, Cedric, his name is Cedric Gibbs.He lives down in South of Jackson. I said, you can do one of two things.
Can you find something to do for, cause it's going to take them a week while we fight over this.Or do you want to come and get a loaner?And he goes, well, it's six one half a dozen the other.Could you help me out with some money next week?
And I said, call me today and tell me what you need.And he called me today.He was practically in tears.I gave him 1500 bucks.I'm in tears thinking about it.Well, I gave him 1500 bucks. And he said, well, what do I need to do?
I said, he said, I'm not, I'm not asking, I'm not begging for this.I said, Cedric, if you do the right thing, the rest of it will take care of itself.You didn't, you didn't create this mess.
You're just the guy that got caught in the middle and you're saving us hundreds of dollars down the road by finding this.And it's a relatively easy fix.Had we known about it up front, all this had been eliminated. But they did.
So, told him it's the best $1,500 I've spent today.
Yeah, that's, man, that's great.
You can't go home and tell your wife, gee, honey, my truck broke and they hung up on me and I'm out.
That's about what they would get probably 98% of the other places.They would say, sorry, it's on you.
You can't do that.I ain't doing nothing wrong.
Talk about, just to finish this conversation on maintenance, we'll move on to a couple more topics before we run out of time, but what do you all do to help make sure that these drivers have a good maintenance program?
Well, we have two full-time people that assist them.Where we're going eventually is to get the online, what do you call it, where you get the check engine light?You can read that check engine light.The codes?Yeah.
Um, we run only diagnostics and all that stuff.
So that if there is a problem with the truck, we know about it probably as quick as he does.We can already start working on it, but that's, that's a year down the road.
Um, in the meantime, what we try to do is we require, they have the truck service every 35,000 miles. and they're required to send us a copy of that receipt.
The reason they have a maintenance account is so they take the money out of it and pay for it.
That's right.You guys pull, they have a reserve or maintenance account.
And that maintenance account- That way it's automatically, it's not just- It's 4% compounded interest weekly.Now, you don't get rich off that, but you're keeping their money in a separate account.
And if the money is there, they're more likely to service the truck.If you say you're on your own maintenance-wise, money gets short or they forget, they're gonna run it too far.
We have a record of every truck and we have a program that uploads those miles regularly.And we know when the last service was done.So usually we'll get a story of, well, I did it myself.
Well, fine, send us some sort of receipt for the oil and the filter.
Yeah.We do a set amount.So a lot of companies do it on cents per mile basis for maintenance.We do it normally around $200 a week.And that's in their account.And that is for tires mainly and bigger expenses.
But if they need it, it's there for their use.
OK.Nice. I'm going to move a little bit away from maintenance, but also talk about, you know, earlier in this conversation, I mentioned, we've seen some companies go out of business.
Some, some fleets that quite frankly, I didn't even, I would never thought that this would be happening.Um, there's one then locally flatbed carrier that, uh, that went out.
Maybe that you've encountered this, but say you do have a lease purchase driver there with the trucking company that goes out of business.What happens next?I know you can't be the saving grace for anything, but like what happens to that driver?
Cause he's still gotta find a place to make money.He's still on the hook for the purchase of the truck, right?
Sure.He is, but those interim payments, we've waived those until he gets square. The only thing we don't do is if he quits without something else lined up, he owes the payments.You shot yourself in the foot.
But let's say that he just noticed this Friday or whatever that they're shut down.He's got to figure out something else to do.He calls you, Rick or Kirk says, hey, this company, they close their doors.I don't have a job.
We suspend his payments until such time as he gets the new job.
We'll help him.And then you all, I mean, he, it's on his, on him to do him or her, but you all will help facilitate, see if there's other options for him to get a place.
Cause I mean, see your advantage too, that he gets back to work is sure.We'll have ABC.You can go check out, let us know which one suits you the best that you think.And we'll look at it.
We, we don't want to take money out of their personal account.We want to, we want them to pay their truck payment out of what they've earned. And so the only exception to that is, don't call and say, I went fishing with Uncle Joe last week.
I want you to waive a payment.They can't make my payment.That little click you hear, that's me hanging up.I can't fix it.
Sounds like you've done that a 10 or 10.It's got to work as a business for both parties.
But if your intent is there, and you didn't do anything wrong, then you can't punish the guy.What could he have done?Could he have known that was going to happen? Typically, when they're going to do that, you're the last one to know.
Or could it be getting noggon fishing with Uncle Johnny?
Yeah, you're stuck out in the world and you can't even buy fish.
And we've had that happen a time or two, but we've got one right now on a watch.And we're like the buzzards sitting on the fence.They know it too.They know it.Your whole situation is a little suspect. And they're a flatbed carrier.
I've got trucks and trailers.I mean, we have 50 flatbed trailers.
Yeah, we've got I've got tanker.I'll rent you a go cart if you want one.Tanker and flatbed trailers.So does Rick.
So we've got one on a watch right now. Because we can tell that it's shaky.
Is that just information you're getting from the drivers?No.
Yeah, some of it.At the end of the day, there's It's kind of like figuring out your wife's cheating.You may not have a car yet, but you've got a pretty good idea something's going on.
He's a little closer to the fire than I've been, but he's got some pretty good intel.
These guys talk, and a certain amount of it is BS. You know, you hear it from one guy, you kind of discard it.When you hear it from six.
Yeah.Well, you can tell also by how their payment stream has been when they quit paying on time and next thing it turns into Monday and then maybe Monday turns into Tuesday.And then, you know, a little cashflow problem, you know what I mean?
And you visit with a company and say, oh, is there a problem with this guy?No, no, he's a good runner.Right.Well, why didn't he make any money?Well, you know, it's been tough.Well, I'm sorry.This is not a business for the weak.
That's one thing we often don't know is what they are able to take out before we see a settlement, what the company maybe is taking from the driver.That's something that's a little bit of an unknown that we have to watch real close.
And to be clear, Because I thought maybe I had this wrong, but I thought sometimes the company itself pays you all, and then you all settle with the driver.Is that not the case?Or how does that work?How does the payments go?
I don't have any like that.He has a couple.
Some like that.But generally, we like to have the company break it out to where we get paid separately from the driver.Some of the places actually do pay the driver in full, and we have to take it out of their bank account.
But then some companies will just pay you directly, the driver versus the driver paying you.
I have one like that, but that's really not a very optimal program.
Okay.Yeah.Yeah.Kind of the last question, and we'll kind of camp out here a little bit.We talk about kind of who this program's really a fit for, but talk about who it's really not for.
I think that's more important in a really transparent way, non-biased way.Now, this isn't from Rick Curt as owners of the leasing companies, but who doesn't really fit programs like this so you know this isn't going to be a long-term lasting thing?
A guy that wants a show truck, or that wants to spend a quarter of a million dollars for a truck, and wants to- And does finance it, right.Yeah.That's a high risk proposition.You don't start a taxi cab company with a Porsche.
Yep.I remember you saying that in our last podcast.
Well, it's true.You don't.If you're looking to make money in the business, you don't want that expensive a truck.
What's that balance?I'm going to cut you off here because I believe you.I mean, we've got a show truck right up here in the corner.
Yeah.Oh, it's great if you can afford it.
But yeah, what's the balance?Because I do know though, a lot of these owner operators want a nice truck.They do.I mean, it's like, just like the house that you live in, the house I live in, like, I want a beautiful house to live in.
If you can afford it, do it.
That's right.If you can't, we're going to know.We're going to know.And it all depends on If it's a dream for them and some guys it is.It is.It's your totally.That's what they got.
I mean, that was one of the reasons they got into it because man, I grew up watching these trucks.
If you want to hand me 20 grand, I'll order you one of those trucks.Yeah.But I'm not going to order one based on your say so.It's too risky.The turnover rate in those trucks are twice as high as the others.
Well, your payment's going to be maybe $700 or $800 a week more for that fancy truck.That's a lot.
And I guess I know the answer to this, then why do they keep making those trucks?Why do they keep people buying if they know that's the higher risk?
That's a good question.Well, do you know the difference?That's a good question.
And again, I'm not, I'm going to get some flack from our listeners because they're like, you don't know, you're like, well, are you going to drive this car?Would you drive this?
The trucks we have over, by and large- It's like the great debate in trucking.We've got beautiful trucks.
Seven years ago, you could buy a decked out 389 with APU and everything on it for about 152,000.Today, those same trucks are 257,000.Almost $100,000 more?
It's a simple matter of math.
But the freight rates haven't justified that.
No.And do you think it costs that much more to build that truck?No, absolutely not.Yeah.There are 40 to 50 grand more than a 579.Now,
If you want to pay that and you can demonstrate that you can make that much money and all, and you're willing to put some skin up, we got something to talk about.
But if you want me to take all the risk, I'm not going to do it because I'm not going to help you fail.I don't need a show truck. I need something you can make money with.
So figure out what you want to do and if that's your long lost dream and you want to pursue it, I can help you.But you have to have skin in the game.Don't put that burden on me because I won't do it.
There's a reason why you don't see fleets, I'd say a hundred trucks or more. any of them that have a fleet of 389s.You just don't see it, hardly ever do.I mean, can you think of any place?There's a reason why they don't have those for fleet trucks.
I mean, those are a special owner-operator truck for one guy, one particular deal.If he can make it work great, most often not.
And they are literally highly desirable.That guy that powder-coated his purple?Great day.Awesome truck.It is awesome.Yeah. Oh yeah, I see it right there.I saw it on the podcast.He has the gear shift even.
I mean, I think he said in the podcast, he's going to have to get with his powder coat guy and he needs to take another part off and send to him.
No, tell him what just the fenders cost on it.That is his pride and joy.
Oh, look how proud, he's proud as he can be of that truck.
He is living his dream.And if he can do that and make a living with it, my hat's off to him.
I guess the difference now that I really dissect this, it's you're talking about that entry level guy that's getting into it and the success rate for him.
Now, if that entry level guy grows into another truck or man can start running his own fleet and then one day wants his own personal ride to be. kind of that show quality.Go for it.
Yeah.Sure.I mean, I think, I think the same thing when I meet young employees or people that want to get on the business and they like, they already want to be, they already want to be at the penthouse.It's like, guys, you guys are down here.
There's a growing process to doing that.
You got to earn it.Nobody's going to give it to you.
How long do you think he's been doing that to get to that stage?I bet he's been doing it his whole life.
Yeah, probably.Look at Robert Lowe.He started with one dump truck, what, 40 years ago?Didn't do too bad.
Yeah, I think that's the heart of it.It's just like that great debate because I think there's so many guys like even when we do those videos like that video there generated 20,000 views versus in the truck because of the truck.
Yeah, I was in the truck and there was another one that dreamsicle one that was 17,000 views.I mean just a guy. If you had like, there's just, there's just so much interest.
So, I mean, I don't know if it's even a false narrative about like, Hey, you can get into trucking and you can be driving one of these tomorrow versus like, Hey, the real reality is, is you probably need to be driving something, you know, that's more economic, more affordable until you grow into a point where you can crunch the numbers and make money.
He carries a portable washer in that truck with him. And that thing is clean all the time.Yeah.
Now, unfortunately, we don't get much of a discount on a truck like that.It's a one-off.Right.Is it just because the demand is so stinking high on those?It is.And that's why the price is so high.But the turnover is just as high.
It is because the guys get in over their heads.See, that truck right there is probably six mile a gallon. Maybe if he drives it, he probably treats it like a child.I mean, this is baby, but these new trucks, nine miles a gallon loaded is nothing.
Do the math on the difference.That's 400 bucks a week on 2300 miles.Yeah. You want to give up that much in fuel economy because that's your square nose.It's your money, but understand the math before you do it.
And if you've got a wife, explain it to her because she's going to be all over you when your paycheck's not good.
Unless she's riding in the truck with you.
Besides the actual price of the truck and the debate on the classic versus the more economic ones, who else isn't a fit for this type of program?
Well, entry-level drivers can get started with this program.If they have decent credit, they can get in a late model reliable truck without coughing up 20 or 25 grand.That's the hurdle that most of them can't overcome.
And if they could, you better off sitting on that 20 grand.You'll need it someday for something.Don't spend it on your first venture.
They go to a dealership, they're going to be at 20% down, probably interest rate of what, 20%?
It all depends on their credit rating.I've got a guy that claimed today, he's one of our owner operators.He's not in my truck, he's on, he claims, and he's got a 767 credit score.And he claims with 25% down, he can get his for 12 and a half percent.
It's the best deal I've heard.12 and a half percent.
And that's the best deal I've heard yet.I mean, trust me, it's not uncommon to hear numbers starts with a two.
Oh yeah.I assume some of these big dealerships though are working directly with these truck lines to help establish those or create discounts.They say they are, but what do you think?
If you're a first time buyer or 10th time buyer and you go to Truck dealer X. On a one-off.On a one-off.And you buy that truck.Does he care if you fail or not?He's got his money from the bank.He's done with you.
It's one and done.He's got your money, and it's up to the finance company to get the rest.So his interest in your financial future just isn't there. I mean, why would it be?He's a one and done.We look for repeat buyers.
The same guy that starts with a four year old used truck.If he does well, he's going to come back and want to order a new one or upgrade or whatever.That's why our number of trucks actually paid off by the original guy.
is not that great, probably 20, 25% maybe, because they upgrade.And we tell them, start small, show us you can do it, you know, get your cashflow going, learn the ropes, and then start chasing your dream.
You know, right now talking about some of these big trucking company failures and just freight still being a lot of capacity, a little bit of freight hauling rates down,
I guess, should drivers maybe be thinking about waiting to do a program like this, or is there still enough business out there?I guess the question is, there's never perfect timing, but should we wait after this election?
Should we wait after the year?Should we see how things are faring?It just seems like, and I don't want to create panic with this podcast, but man, there's still a lot of instability.
We still don't know where interest rates are going to go, when freight's going to turn. I've been in this, you guys have been in this longer than I have, but 20 years, I've seen these cycles, they come back out of it.
You know, you get... Every time they come back.
When is that time?When should they be looking at it?With all these trucks in the market, I mean, is the price of these trucks going to go down?
No, you're getting ready to see a big increase, probably 7,500 bucks a truck, January one with the next level EPA requirement.
No, what you talked about in the last one, that new.
So you need to get in, if you're going to jump in.
When should a guy be looking at this?Like if he's living on the fence for the past six months.
Don't do it between Thanksgiving and say the end of January.Why is that?Well, think about it.You're in the South.Between Thanksgiving and New Year's, you've got six holidays.
Right.And freight is a mess.
Oh, you're trying to get off your face giving Christmas New Year's.Yeah.
And their season and their season.That's a real thing.
That's I'm serious.I agree.I'm one of them.All right.You can come in my backyard and shoot that one.It's eating my trees.
They will budget their time around deer season more than they will around Christmas.
But the point is, freight is disruptive.And you don't know when Christmas and New Year's are gonna fall.Have it fall on a Wednesday, and you've destroyed two weeks in a row.
So the worst thing you can do is jump into this during that time, stick with what you got, and wait until after the start of the year.Now, the election will be over too, but at the end of the day, Election worries, so-so.Holidays are real.
I don't know which one of those fools is going to be in the White House, and I don't want to waste my time talking about it, because I can't announce that.
I would probably steer almost anybody off a flatbed just in generality right now.Because they get slaughtered worse.
That's one place I'd be real leery of.They're all struggling.
If you're in it now, save your money and ride the storm out.And if you survive to the second week of January, you'll be fine.
And if you're sucking up all your maintenance money now and you got a hold of a truck, our highest turnover rate in flatbed is between Thanksgiving and the first of the year.Just like clockwork.Yep.I mean, the herd gets thinned every year.
My guys at Oakley, not a one of them missed a payment between on any of these holidays.Not one guy.
Yeah.We're pretty excited about that opportunity.
Yeah. Very cool.Um, man, that's all I got for this show, man.Appreciate you guys coming in.Just, uh, I'll, I'll start with you first, Kirk, any final words as we close out of here.
And again, if you listen to the podcast, we're going to put all their information in the show notes.
So you'll just have to click down below and you'll be able to get in direct contact with either Rick or Kirk, um, and their program specifically, but Kirk, I'll throw it over to you.
The only thing I'd say really in parting would be, right now would be a good time in general for a driver, I think, to get involved, especially on a new truck.They're less expensive now than they're ever going to be.
And like Rick said, they're going to be at least 7,500 bucks next year.The year after that, I hear even more.I just, I think it would be a good time to try to get into it now before they do get very expensive.
I'd say tell them, do your homework. Don't believe any one source.Do multiple sources.If you're thinking about going to X, find some actual drivers you can talk to, not one.Same way in our business.Don't judge us by what one says.
Call four or five of those other guys and find out what they have to offer.Do your homework.Don't go into it blindsided.
Nice.Awesome.Well, Rick Johnson, Kirk Erickson, man, appreciate you guys coming back in.I'm sure we'll probably spin out another, uh, show down the road as you guys kind of keep this evolving.I'm excited.
I know you've already had some interest from our last show.Um, and that's been cool to hear that, uh, some people are and, uh, man, it's crazy.We're just, uh, we're a little bit in uncharted waters right now, but you guys have been here.
I've been here before.We know that, Hey, there, the man's going to pick back up every time. There's going to be need, there's going to be people that need to get this freight moved.
And man, if you're out there and looking to take that move and become a driver, man, I think this is just a really good program to step in or at least have a conversation with these guys.
And that way you're kind of a little bit, uh, hedging, you know, your bets versus just going in and taking everything at risk.So Rick and Kurt, man, thank you guys for coming in again.God bless y'all.Thank you.
I think they said this on the last show, but they spec out a lot of trucks for Bruce Oakley trucking.Yeah, which most people know they're one of the larger dry bulk carriers.
I think if I remember right, 800 plus trucks today that they have in their fleet and they probably have doubled that in the last four years, which is crazy, but they, they actually spec out trucks and have lease purchase guys that go on and haul Bruce Oakley's freight.
And it's cool that, uh, Kirk, uh, and Rick both know the, um, basically the requirements that these guys, um, have, I think he was saying, you know, a lot of these, um, companies that whenever you lease onto them, they require that your truck be, uh, you know,
So many years old and they have all these requirements.So It's cool that they help these guys spec out to be able to lease on to different companies.
Yeah, it's really a plug-and-play It's not just riding the lease purchase but finding that the matching you up with the company that can use that equipment Most efficiently and put you on the right track for hauling freight.
Yeah, so cool and they I just thought it was interesting like man just we you all know this as listeners, but the price of trucks have, I mean, almost went up a hundred thousand dollars.Um, it was interesting.
John Pocock even said when we were out there that just a lot of that had to do with even right, wrong or indifference.
Some of these tariffs that were put on on steel just raised the cost of a lot of things that steel goes into trucking manufacturing and all that.
Um, so there's just been a, yeah, cost of went up on all this, but I guarantee we're gonna probably gonna see these set back a little bit.
Yeah.Andy was saying that, you know, freight rates haven't kept up with those increasing costs.So, um, yeah, hopefully we see that those both freight rates going back up and costs going back down.
Yeah.Cool.Awesome.Well, Kirk and Rick, thank you so much for always coming on and, um, just giving us your wisdom and knowledge in the industry.A couple of things before we head out of here, we finally have the bulk freight conference dates.
Yeah, we are getting everything lined out slowly but surely.The dates that are set in stone right now are April 16th through the 18th in April of 2025.
It's going to be in Branson, Missouri, so just right down the road from Springfield where it was last year.This conference is going to be bigger, better.There's going to be better content that's provided.
There's going to be cooler stuff that's happening.You know, maybe get some of those show trucks inside the building.
And we're also able to do just a multitude of just cool things for the attendees that are buying tickets We're able to offer discounted hotel rates and do a whole lot of other things So it's gonna be really cool.
If you want to know more go to bulk freight conference comm you can also enter your email I think ticket sales if everything goes accordingly.
We're going to get those live in the next week or two but what you can do right now to make sure that you reserve your spot is just go ahead and into your email and This is not saying that you for sure are going to purchase a ticket.
It just lets us know, hey, you want to be the first person to get notified whenever ticket sales go on sale.
April 16th through the 18th.I know that's a busy time for some people.I will say this.We've kind of looked at all these dates.This is the best one that really fits the majority.
But I'll say this, even if you think it's going to be tough or can't make it for all of it, man, come down for a little bit.There's direct, I mean, there's flights that come into Springfield.
Man, would love for you if there's just one day that you can show up.I know there's been some guys that I've talked to that have said, Jared, that's just absolutely like, that's the busiest time of my season.
Man, if you can get away for 24 hours, have somebody fill your role, I guarantee it'll be worth it. you will see the rewards from it, not for our sake, but the contacts and networks.
I hear from people all the time that were there and continue to develop new relationships and contacts with those people.So make sure April 16th through the 18th, Branson, Missouri, 45 minutes, just South of here, tons of fun stuff to do.
If you've never been to Branson, Missouri and want to bring the family highly recommend it.There's just, I mean, the golfing, the lake, all the Branson shows.
It's really, they, uh, they've characterized it as like an inner Disney world, like Brandon, like Branson.Now it's kind of that inland or Midwest Disney world.
I mean, there's different attractions and shows and silver dollar city and all those you can do.So man, mark your calendars today, April 16th through the 18th, 2025 bulk freight conference in Branson, Missouri.We want to see you there.
It's going to be awesome.Yeah.So. Cool.Um, the last but not least, before we head out of here, we just finally got this.You've been hearing me talk about it, but semi-same and the pumpkin hall is now available.We have copies in here.
We'd be happy to send you, you can actually just go to Amazon drop down below.You'll see a link and you can click on them and get the mail to you again.
The goal with this book has always been to promote trucking and agriculture for children out there for them to see the values of it.Obviously all of our guests,
are, excuse me, all of our listeners are in the trucking and freight industry and what better way to promote them and let kids see what we're doing.
This is a, I think some people have said this is probably the best one yet because who doesn't like fall number one and then we have some really good humor in here. that just makes it a fun book.So man, get a copy of this.
Reach out to us at Podcasts at Bulk Loads.We'd be happy to send you a free copy or you can drop down to Amazon.If you have a classroom or a church or community sports team, anything like that, reach out to us.
We would love to get this in the hands of those children out there.And we see that as a thank you from us to you.
Yeah, and I will say you are correct.Fall is the best season, which we are entering in now.If you think the fall is not the best season, you're wrong.That's just fall is the best season.I will say you gave me one of these books.
I took it home for my boy and he's four years old.I don't think he's read it yet, but we're definitely going to read it this week.He loves these semi-sam books, so I'm excited to read it to him.
Yeah, actually when I was one of the trips, the son who has kids was saying that they love these little books they read through them.So it always just warms my heart.
So yeah, we'd love for you to get these in your home and reach out and be happy to do that.
Cool.Any last things before we head out?I think we covered it.Okay, cool.As always, when we close out of here, we want to extend the opportunity to pray for you and your family and your business.
We know the couple of examples just this morning we were praying. the hurricane and what that's done.Again, personally, I don't believe, I mean, it just, it seems like it's not getting the attention that it deserves.
Man, it's still just a lot of families, people not accounted for.We are praying for those down there.Also, we still know that we are in a slump.We know that there are companies struggling out there, both
business wise, but then just enter in the family and we want to be a resource for prayer.So if you'd be willing, send us an email to prayer at bull clothes.com.We would love to take that and share that with our team here.All it's done internally.
We don't do it outside of here.We don't broadcast anywhere.Um, we would love to pray for you and your family.And, um, man, we consider that an honor and privilege to do so.So awesome.I'll let you close this out.
Lord, we come to you today just to simply spend time with you, Lord, and talk to you.We ask that you just continue to bless us and watch over everything that we do, Lord.
We know that all of our blessings that we receive, Lord, is nothing by our works, but, you know, everything that you've been able to give us, Lord.
We ask that you just watch over all the victims of this hurricane, Lord, and all these natural disasters, Lord.We ask that You just be with them and give them hope.Show them that there is hope.And Lord, we ask that you just keep everybody safe.
Anybody that has missing family members, Lord, you just be with them in this time.Lord, we also ask that anybody going through any financial disasters, Lord, we ask that you be with them as well.
Show that there is light at the end of the tunnel and to persevere, Lord.We ask that you just be with all of our drivers. you know, delivering goods across the country, Lord, that you just be with them.Keep them safe, Lord.
And anybody who's going through anything, we ask that you just give them the courage to lift that up to you and put you in control, God.Lord, we love you and thank you.Amen.
Amen. As always, thank you for listening to the Bulk Loads podcast.If you haven't yet, please subscribe.
And if you know just a few people that can find value in this, maybe they're getting started in trucking and just trying to figure out those next steps.
Maybe they can't go out and just purchase a truck, but a lease purchase program would work for them.And we'd love for you to share this episode with them so we can help those companies start a business and thrive in life.
So thank you so much for listening to the Bulk Loads podcast.And as always, God bless.
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