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Let's step behind the counter for a second and into the fray of a busy kitchen.Can you hear the sizzle?Smell the charbroil?See that smoky haze?Well, today we're talking all about burgers.
A hamburger is about as American as it gets, despite its German name.The first burger was served at Lewis's Lunch in 1895 in New Haven, Connecticut.That's according to the Library of Congress.But the classic sandwich has come a long way since then.
For many years, bigger was better when it came to burgers.Bigger patties and toppings piled high.But recently, a new trend has been sweeping the nation.You know the one.The smash burger.
Devotees rave over its crispy exterior, which they say protects the juicy interior. Their chain Smash Burger led the charge in 2007, but it's taken a while for the technique to catch fire, if you will.
This thinner, crispier burger is now making its way into high-end restaurants, according to the Wall Street Journal.And another burger that's been trending?
the meatless kind, plant-based patties on the rise, popping up in everything from fine dining to fast food.And we are going to bite into all that and more and determine how popular burgers stack up in our very own Business Wars taste test.
We're joined by three guests who get to eat burgers for a living.Eater LA's Mona Holmes and Josh Scher and Nicole Aniety of the YouTube channel Mythical Kitchen.Hope you're hungry, because all that's coming up.
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From Wondery, I'm David Brown, and this is the Smashburger Smackdown.Today, you're gonna get hungry.Don't say I didn't warn you.We're talking all about burgers, and joining us, Josh Scher and Nicole Aniety.
Their YouTube channel, part of the super popular brand, Good Mythical Morning, where hosts recreate fast food dishes, among other things.Also joining us, Mona Holmes of Eater LA.All right, rapid fire round.Don't think, just blurt it out.
Favorite burger place in Los Angeles?Mona.
Chris's Burgers in La Puente.
Aha!Josh.Pie and Burger in Pasadena.Nicole.
Gold Burger.All right.I'm wondering if I should get you each to justify your answers.Mona, do you want to go first?
Sure.I have no idea how long Chris's Burgers has been there.Probably many, many decades.And also, anytime I go there, I ask them questions.They have no time for me.They just cook.And it's just a solid burger that is meaty. but not too meaty.
It's got a great ratio of lettuce and tomato, melted cheese.The fries are good.The ratio, yes.The ratio is amazing.And I truly love them.It's just one of those great independent burger stands.
Josh, what about you?So Pie and Burger is a super, super old school diner and pie counter in Pasadena.I believe they've been operating since 1961 or so.
They kind of half claim to have invented the cheeseburger, but I love them because they have the thickest, coldest iceberg lettuce in the game. Oh, that's nice.
And Nicole, how about you?
So Goldberger started during the pandy, also known as the pandemic.It started as a pop-up and they now have two brick and mortars.I think one in Highland Park and one in Silver Lake. And their burger is just phenomenal.
Their meat lace is unlike any other meat lace I've ever had on a burger.
I'm sorry, meat lace.What is that exactly?
So I'm so glad you asked.It's a delicious combination of fried lacy meat that kind of sticks together in this gorgeous pattern once it's like slammed on the grill.And it mixes with the fat from the cheese and that hot, hot griddle.
And that's what I call it. But they have a phenomenal sauce that goes on it.It's an aioli.It's like a mustard garlic aioli that they put on their burger.And it's just so phenomenal.The sauce is better than any burger sauce I've ever had.
And yeah, it's number one in my book.
Yours sounds like the most fancy pants of them all.I mean, gosh, that's pretty swanky.I want to ask you all about the more famous spots.
I mean, obviously, burgers are a big part of when someone comes from out of town, you want to take them to grab a burger, show them a little bit of the local action.Where would you take them for that classic LA burger experience?
Anyone want to volunteer?
Apple Pan.Tell us why Apple Pan.
There's something about sitting around the counter that makes me feel like I've been transported to another time.And I just love the little hats they wear at Apple Pan.And the burger's a really solid burger.I mean, you can get the Hickory burger.
What's the other burger called?There's the Hickory burger.
The burger.I think their burgers are solid.They're delicious.Surprise, their tuna melt's actually my favorite thing there.But I just think it's a solid, delicious burger, great produce, great vibes.
Josh, you mentioned Pasadena claims to have invented the cheeseburger.City of Pasadena actually says it dates back to 1924 at a whopping 15 cents a cheeseburger.You think Pasadena is still holding it down on the cheeseburger front?
I think they still are.And I think for the same reasons it was invented there.I believe it was invented at a place called The Right Spot.I believe it was originally called the Aristocrat Hamburger.But LA has actually invented a lot of burgers.
The Pastrami Burger was invented in Los Angeles.The Chili Cheeseburger was invented at Tommy's in Los Angeles, which is another classic spot I'd go to.I love eating out of the trunk of my car.Shout out to the original Tommy's.
But I think Pasadena, it's still where a lot of very old school stuff in L.A.lives.That's why you can go to a spot like Pie and Burger and still have that old school experience.
Mona, your job involves reviewing restaurants and staying up to date on everything in the L.A.scene.In fact, folks should know you were nominated for a James Beard Award for some of your culinary reporting.
So now I'm curious, how would you characterize the local burger space?I mean, it seems pretty iconic.You know, burgers, artangelinos, maybe what pizza is to New Yorkers.That sound about right?
Yeah, I would characterize it as that.I'd also suggest that it's big, it's diverse, it's dominant.That's what the burger scene is to me.And I think it's pretty telling that when people come into town who haven't spent a lot of time in Los Angeles,
that there are burger stands and donut shops everywhere.And mountains, and huge mountains.They get shocked.At the trifecta.
And it's like, yeah, we got all those things.I know you all thought that we don't eat meat or gluten.But we like our meat between buns and we like our deep fried dough.Or baked.
Take that.And also, as someone who grew up here, I just thought that burger culture that we had was everywhere.So I study it every time I visit a different city, and the levels are just not the same.
And, you know, which is why I lean towards these wonderful independent burger stands like Jim's and Tam's and Astro Burger and Super Burger, who all make solid burgers, you know?And they throw pastrami on top of it, too.It's like the best thing ever.
Josh, Nicole, I know y'all spend a fair amount of time in the kitchen recreating famous fast food orders, but also cooking up burgers.I understand there was a burger cooking face-off that went down a little while back, and Nicole has bragging rights.
What actually happened there?
That's right.We made an oxtail burger.So we made a delicious burger patty.We smashed it down.We added some smoked gouda on there, some braised oxtail, maybe like a 24-hour braised oxtail.
And then we made a scotch bonnet aioli in between a beautiful brioche bun.And I totally deserve that W. That was a good dub.
I agree because I remember what I made.
I flew too close to the sun.Yes, you made a wet dream burger.Please expand on that.
I won.Mona's talking about fried dough and burgers.I combined them.I made savory beignet buns.
And then I made like a Cajun seasoned pork patty and then put like butter and garlic sauteed shrimp and owed to the actual Viet Cajun classic of the shrimp oil.
There's definitely a lot more going on in this burger than the last one.All right.All right.All right.
Frankly, nine too many ingredients on that burger should have cut that at least in half.
Braised celery, right?Was that on it?There was something like pickled celery.
I don't even know anymore.Mona, I need you here.When you're judging burgers, what do you look for in the perfect burger?Because honestly, when you're talking about shrimp and all these other ingredients, when is a burger not a burger anymore?
You know, because I sit in a room with four other food writers all day, we've probably been debating that for about four years now, maybe longer, actually.But I am not picky.The criteria for me for judging a burger
is juiciness of whatever the protein is, because it can be beef or turkey.Turkey burgers are delicious.So are chicken burgers.The amount of fat that's in there is where most of the flavor is going to be and the juiciness.It's got to be tender.
No one likes an overcooked piece of meat.And then, again, the balance of ratio for condiments. To me, that's for a traditional thick burger.
For smash burgers, it does vary a little bit, and actually quite a bit, because once again, you know that, what is, how did you describe it again?The lacy goodness?Did I call it lacy meat?
I'm glad you asked, because that's freaking me out a little bit, I gotta be honest with you.
It's so good, but they just, what they do is they smash it on that griddle, And they have to be super careful.It doesn't take very long to cook, obviously, because it's super thin.But when it's overdone, it's overly chewy.It's rough.
And the flavor just isn't there.And then they've got to sprinkle whatever they've got to put on that.So it really does take some skill to put together the perfect smash burger.But you'll know because there's a slight crisp.
and just really good flavor and also really good quality ingredients.You can't go cheap on a Smashburger because you can taste it right away.It's the worst.
Speaking of Smashburgers, it's time for a break, but when we come back, we've got our very own burger taste test.Stay with us.
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Hey, welcome back to Business Wars.My guests are Josh Scher and Nicole Inayati, kitcheneers on the YouTube channel Mythical Kitchen and hosts of the podcast, A Hot Dog is a Sandwich, where they have spirited debates about your favorite foods.
We're also joined by Foodie Mona Holmes, an award-winning writer at Eater LA. Now, Mona, you gave us a great description of a smash burger earlier.When did these come on the scene?I'm trying to think the first time I ever heard of a smash burger.
And it seems like it was about five years ago or something.But maybe that's because I'm in Austin.I'm not in the burger capital of the country.
For us in Los Angeles, it started in 2017 with Burgers Never Say Die. And it started as a pop-up in a backyard, and then it became this permanent Silver Lake spot, and it just exploded.
And with every trend, of course, everyone wanted to try and mimic it or improve it.And in a city like L.A., that can happen really fast.
So it shows no sign of slowing, but you can go out in just about any part of the city and find folks that might be more established or on the sidewalk making truly excellent smash burgers.
Now Josh and Nicole, can you walk us through how a smash burger is actually made?I mean, how do you get to lacy meat?
It's actually really interesting.So most, if you're not making a smash burger, you would likely form the patty as it's raw and then griddle it and flip it with a smash burger.You actually want the patty to be a ball.
Now, a lot of people will take that patty, typically a 70, 30 lean to fat ratio.You need good fat to get the smash action on it.And you'll roll that in salt to get good seasoning on it.And then you will need some sort of patty smasher.
Now, the original patty smasher, according to legend, was a large paint can. But people have actually made, some chefs will stack two spatulas on top of each other, some will use jerry-rigged devices where they put a handle on a big heavy weight.
Wait a minute, can't anything smash a piece of meat, a ball of meat?Give me a break.Is there really a debate over this?
100% and I swear some are way better than others because what you really need is something heavy that you can press down on this ball of meat to flatten it completely evenly with force all around.That's how you maintain the circular shape.
And then what a lot of chefs will do is you have to twist your wrist
to create that circle, because the goal is to get as much surface area and force as possible on that meat to the griddle to create what's called the Maillard reaction, or effectively the browning of any meat.
That's where protein effectively turns into glutamate, which is the main flavor that we taste with umami or savoriness.And then you flip that lacy, smashed, crispy, fatty meat.
If there's enough fat in it, that's where the lace comes in, because the fat evaporates through the meat to create these little pores. flip that over, put some cheese on it to melt it, throw it in a bun, and that's a Smashburger.
I have completely underrated this.This is a science.This is beyond art.And they are hard to make, too.
Yes, they are, to get right.They've had plenty of trial and error.
Well, let's talk about how Smashburgers compare to the originals, and perhaps the best way to do that is with a Smashburger Smackdown.I gather that each of you have two burgers in front of you.
We have a Smashburger from Heavy Handed, which was shouted out in Eater's Best Burgers in LA Roundup.You've also got the Irv's Original Roadside Single Burger.
This was also featured on the Eater list, and that chain's been an LA staple since the 1940s, I think it is.
So you've got one smash burger, one classic, and we're going to have you test each one and give us the verdict on which you think is more satisfying.Team, you ready?
All right.Let's begin with the heavy handed smash burger.Josh, Nicole, maybe you can describe what you've got in your hands or getting in your hands there right now.
Well, it looks like we have a burger, a double, is this a double?Am I seeing, no, it's a single.It's a burger, I must be, I'm hungry.It's a soft bun, I'm thinking it might be a potato, is this a potato bun?
It looks like a potato bun to me.
Yeah, and then we have some caramelized onions a la In-N-Out, and then we have a smash burger patty and some American cheese, some burger sauce with a little bit of pickle, And it looks pretty damn good.Can, may I eat it?
Well, hold, hold, hold for just, I'm going to check with Mona.Mona, what are your first thoughts on the burger, the size, smell, all that?
Well, listen, I've, I've had both of these burgers multiple times, many times, and, and I, I'm actually a fan of both.And, and, uh, Nicole, your description is absolutely perfect.Um, you know, these are, these are made with short rib.
And they are juicy and super fatty.Like the last time I had one, I basically went home and took a nap.And caramelized onions, and yes, it's a potato bun.
I think there's butter pickles on here, if I'm not mistaken, because I believe they deep fry them.And yeah, they're a solid burger maker.
All right, moment of truth.Go ahead and take a bite. I'm not hearing any of that mm sound.You know how when you like something, you sort of involuntarily go mm.So what are we thinking?
So my initial thought is that the potato bun has a level of sweetness that really contributes to the whole bite.And then there's that savory funk with the onions that I think is really delicious.
Yeah, I mean the caramelized notes are it's like a funky oniony taste without that crunch and the pickles I'm not wild about these pickles Yeah, they're a sweet pickle.
I'm not the biggest fan.But if we're talking about the actual burger, this is cooked really, really well.Some smash burgers, they get so thin that you lose the character of the meat.But here you get the best of both worlds.
You get that lacy, crispy edge.Like Mona said, it's short rib.There's so much fat in it.But then there's still a nice meaty bite in the middle.Maybe my favorite thing is the way that the grease from the burger becomes a condiment.
It soaks into that potato bun.This thing is so soft that it almost eats like a dumpling, which I love.
Mona, you want to weigh in here?
Yeah, but Josh and Nicole, I love your descriptions.I'll say.
Adjective city.Good night.
They're pretty amazing.I mean, listen, well, first off, I'm not a huge fan of pickles in a burger.I don't say it either.I just I just don't.
But this combination with this bun, I think that there's a nice contrast that or an extra sweetness that helps make this bearable for someone who typically doesn't like pickles on a burger. But the sauce, the sauce is so yummy.
You know, it's just got, once again, the ratio is just right for me.
And what's going on in that sauce?Is that mayo or something else happening?What's happening with that sauce?
I mean, you would say, okay, this feels like a special sauce, but this is far better than a McDonald's special sauce.It's nice and tangy.It's just a really nice burger.And it's super awkwardly messy in a great way.I don't like my food to be perfect.
And this is, you know, it's ugly and it's perfect.
It's ugly and it's perfect.That is a quote right there.All right.Any other takeaways from burger number one before we move along?
What a lovely treat it is to eat a free hamburger.I'm having a good time so far.
Oh, that's great.It's great.Great.All right.Well, hearing no objection, let's move on to Irv's original roadside single burger.Now, Josh and Nicole, you may have to split that one.
We do, but it's bigger than two.
So, Mona, give us a quick description of Irv's.What you got in front of you there?This is a historic burger.
It is.I mean, like you mentioned before, they've been around since the 40s.And this is a place that's gone through multiple rounds of ownership that was brought back from the dead, effectively.And people have such a love for herbs.
And, you know, there was a new owner that brought them back in 2000. You know, I consider it one of LA's historic burgers.People often, in a city like LA, they go on a taco crawl.
I think that you could actually go on a burger crawl and Irv's would be a part of that tour.
Yeah.Josh, Nicole, how would you describe this burger and how it's different from the Smash Burger?
It's a big one.It's a big one.
It is beautiful.I mean, as an L.A.native, born and raised, I agree with everything you said, Mona.Irv's is iconic.It is delicious.And people will do crazy things to get an Irv's burger.It's just big.The bun looks toasted.
The cheese is covering all over that meat. There's veg in here, which I like.It looks like there's tomato and lettuce.What else is in there, Josh?
You got some chopped white onion.You got some proper dill pickles, which I respect.Also, interestingly, the lettuce and tomato are beneath the patty and the onions and pickles are on top.And I agree with that.This is architecture.This is history.
Right.Yeah.It's a well-architectured burger.
The Frank Lloyd Wright of burgers.
Part of this is where the tongue meets first, right?I mean, it's where the taste actually kicks in.That's part of the architecture of it, right?
Someone's eating their burger already.All right, let's go out and take a bite.How does this compare with the Smashburger, y'all?What's standing out?Anyone want to jump in?
This burger, it makes me feel taken care of.I feel safe with this burger.Hear me out.It's so big.That's a full meal, right?That's like you just left the Dodger game.You didn't want to pay $17 for a hot dog.You go to Herb's.
This is filling you up at 11 at night.This has such great old-school appeal to it.And I would argue, it is still a smash burger. You can see the lacy meat edge.It's not crushed, it's not ostentatiously thin, but this has an incredible cook on it.
You can taste the seasoning on that grill.I love this burger.
Yeah, I'd say it has.It's much more harmonious than the last burger we ate.I think all of the veg really helps.I think it eats really, really well.It's thick enough while still being thin enough.I think it's just perfect.It's really delicious.
Everything is seasoned to the edge.It's delicious.Nothing is offensive about it.You could eat a burger.You could eat this entire burger and not feel bad.With the heavy handed, I felt like it was heavy.It really was heavy.
as heavy, but it still feels like you're getting a full meal.I love this burger, man.
You know, I think I picked up on Josh suggesting that Irv's was the Smashburger before Smashburgers were Smashburgers.Is that about right?
Yeah, Josh is right.Josh knows his stuff.But yeah, this absolutely reminds me of my childhood.You know, a burger that you could find in many spaces in Los Angeles for sure.
Yeah, and listen, like I said, the last time I had a heavy handed burger, I went home and took a nap. I would be completely okay after eating an Erv's burger.I could probably run around the Rose Bowl if I wanted to.Same.Prove it.Meet you there.
Okay, maybe I'd take that.
I think I know how this is gonna end, y'all.All right, so final thoughts.Heavy-handed Smash Burger versus Erv's.Original roadside single.Smash versus classic, shall we say?Who reigns supreme?
I'm going with Erv's, baby.
Whoa!Hear me out, hear me out, hear me out, okay?I love the fattiness of it.It's so fatty.I love that.It's so juicy.I love that.
A single issue burger voter here.
Yes, that's me.That is me.Yeah.And I mean, and you know, that answer could vary through the day or the week. depending on what mood that I'm in.Because for late night hours, I tend not to eat super heavy.
I would totally go over an Herb's burger over a heavy handed, like at 10 o'clock at night.But yeah, that's where I'm at.
You are so bold.All right, let's settle a debate here or try to attempt to.Nicole, you and Josh got into this on your podcast, A Hot Dog is a Sandwich, over whether the Smashburger was overrated.And I think we have a clip from that here.
Smashburgers, are they overrated?No, they're so damn good.Thank God that we steered away from these thick burgers where they're pink in the middle and they're bloody and the blood seeps into the bun.
Whatever, whatever, heme, heme.Like, who cares?But I just don't love it.Like, I love the crispy, lacy edges of a smash burger.
Knowing what we know now, factoring in these taste tests, have your minds changed at all, Nicole, Josh?
Nope.They're so good.There's nothing wrong with a good smash burger.I think what makes a good smash burger is what it's built upon.I think the bun matters.I think the condiments matter.
I think there were a lot of smash burgers throughout history before we started using the term smash burger.And I think those tend to be my favorite.
But afterwards, when people really started, they started smashing burgers without thinking about why, Nicole.And that's where I draw the line.The intentional smash burgers of the 1950s.Shout out to King's Burgers out in Northridge.
Shout out to Bill's and Van Nuys.My heart still lies with them.
Mona, what's your take?Are smash burgers just a fad or something else?
You know, I mean, I mean, they're still around.There's still plenty.So I don't, I don't think they're going away.And I think they're an excellent burger.
I think that we could thin out the field because there are, there are so many, like I would rather just focus on the food rather than a gimmick.And so I would love for all of these extra ones to just go away for a while and maybe forever.
And, you know, so that the good ones can do their magic.
All right, well, this was absolutely delicious.And Josh and Nicole, I think something else is going on in your kitchen and this is where we have to let y'all go.
Thanks so much for helping us out with this taste test and sharing your fantastic insights.How can people watch your stuff?
You can head over to YouTube and check out the Mythical Kitchen channel and then also our podcast, A Hot Dog is a Sandwich, wherever you get your podcasts.
Excellent.Josh Sher and Nicole Aniety of the YouTube channel Mythical Kitchen, thanks so much for joining us on this special edition of Business Wars.It's been a lot of fun.Yeah, thank you.
Thank you so much for having us.
Coming up, Mona Holmes is sticking around to talk us through some of the biggest trends in the burger world, from the fast food OGs to plant-based meat.That's when Business Wars returns.
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Hey, welcome back to Business Wars.Let's talk about the next frontier of burgers.Here's a startling fact for fast food OGs like McDonald's and Burger King.
The chains pushing those smash burgers, you think Five Guys, Shake Shack, and of course, Smash Burger, are growing faster than the traditional chains, according to the research firm Technomic.
That led McDonald's to revamp its burger in 2023, adding a brioche bun to preserve heat, better storage for the lettuce, pickles, and onions, and a press that doesn't squish out too much of the juices, additional sauce, and a whole lot more.
Mona Holmes from Eater LA, do you eat at McDonald's ever?
Have you had the opportunity to check out the changes over at Mickey D's or no?
I keep track of them, but I don't try them just because I have a commitment to making sure that I stay within independent restaurants as much as possible.
And so McDonald's and Burger King, I do confess that I have not tried their new inventions and imitators of Smash Burgers, but I do believe that competition is a healthy thing.But one thing I do know about L.A.Diners is that
They're very similar to my practices, that they're not nearly as drawn to the big corporations when trying something like this.
You know, I often look at behaviors and what people are doing and what they're eating and what they're dining and see what they're posting on social media.
And they are as eager to share their new finds of something that's new and fresh and independent And that's typically not with a spot like McDonald's or Burger King.And I haven't heard a lot of chatter.
You have not heard, and I think that's probably telling, but at the same time, if you are with some of these big chains, I mean, how do you keep up?
And in fact, do you notice that they're even trying seriously to keep up with the indies by introducing some of these changes?Or is that happening at all from what you can tell?
I mean, you definitely see it.I mean, you even have with El Pollo Loco that they are now serving birria, which is something that is ubiquitous throughout Los Angeles.
And this very saucy, stewy way of preparing meat, typically on a taco or a burrito or just on its own with this really wonderful consomme that comes on the side. So, you know, I'll absolutely track them.
And, you know, and also truthfully that Pollo Loco, someone brought it over to my house.That was the only way that I really got to try it.And I have to say it was actually pretty tasty.It's not something that I'm going to try again.
But again, I believe that competition is a healthy thing.If the big guns, the big McDonald's and Burger Kings and Pollo Locos of the world can
can up their game a little bit and step away from their standard stuff that they've been doing for decades, I say let them go for it.
Well, you know, there's another tactic that fast food spots are using to get more customers in the door.Plant-based options.Burger King has an Impossible Whopper.KFC has Beyond Meat Chicken Nuggets.
Chicken spelled C-H-I-C-K-N, no E. Where do the Es go in these things?McDonald's has its own Beyond Meat McPlant Sandwich at select locations in Texas and California.What are your thoughts on including plant-based items on a traditional burger menu?
I love it.I live with a vegetarian.So I feel very comfortable discussing this.And the truth is that they're fine.These burgers are, I would never say that they're outright delicious.And they're not like anything like when I'm craving beef.
But as someone who has to watch what I eat, because I do eat out a lot, I might order a burger, a Beyond Burger or Impossible to see what it tastes like or if they have a house-made vegetarian patty, I would give it a try.
But I do see, you know, there is something within me that it doesn't sit well, you know, paying $17 or more for a plant-based burger like that.
But having said all of that, I brought home a burger from Easy Street Burger, which is in the San Fernando Valley here in L.A. a burger that was brought to prominence because a famous TikToker named Keith Lee reviewed their burgers.
And they used Beyond Patties as alternatives for customers to come in.And they were fantastic, truly delicious and covered in, you know, kind of defeating the purpose, but covered in American cheese and sauce and also smash.
But it was, I was really stunned.I brought home one for myself, a regular one for myself and a plant-based one for my husband.And we both loved it.
A smash burger that's vegan?How do you do that?
You gotta believe, I guess.But I can't, I'm having a harder time imagining it, to be honest with you.What's that like?
Yeah, I mean, you know, it tasted, they did manage to get some of that crispiness on the edges, and you know, and also too, your protein is as good as your cooking techniques and the seasoning, and they managed to balance both.
I don't know what they did, but it was delicious.
Is there a scene for meatless burgers in LA?Is it risen to that level of popularity or not so much?
Oh, for sure.We have 29,000 restaurants in LA County, and a huge percentage of them are vegetarian or vegan, where there's not a source of animal products at all.
And so finding more options on not just in vegan restaurants, but finding a Beyond Burger or an Impossible Burger at a restaurant that provides everything, that's not very uncommon.
But plant-based food and restaurants has been going on and innovating quite well for decades now.And honestly, a lot has changed.So it's kind of great to see everyone embrace all of it.
Well, I'm thinking there may be some people who are looking for standouts.Any names come to mind?
Oh, yeah, sure.I mean, you can go to a place like Crossroads Chicken, where at Crossroads Kitchen.
And I could bring someone who is an omnivore and not tell them that this is all vegan, where they'll sit at a beautiful table with white tablecloths and great food and great wines, and they will bring out some of the most stunning foods that you've ever seen that actually taste good.
El Cocinero is one of my favorites.That's in the San Fernando Valley as well.They make delicious Mexican street food.And I have brought meat eaters in there and just not said anything because we were hungry and it's grab.
It's pretty much you can sit there or grab and go.And they all said the flavors were delicious. You know, another place is Boulan Thai in Silver Lake.
They've been there for three decades now, and they make one of my favorite curries in town, and their food is delicious.
Now, we're way beyond burgers here, if you'll pardon the pun, an unintentional pun.But if we're talking about a plant-based patty world, I think most people think of Beyond Meat and Impossible Burger, which are the two companies leading the charge.
That's the basic protein that a lot of these places that are trying to do meatless hamburgers, they go for those too.I'm curious, I assume you've tried both.Do you have one you prefer?
Oh, I'm not a fan of black bean burgers.Not a fan of black bean burgers.Yes, yeah, they're not great.I tend to stay away from any type of, you know, where they're proprietary, where they're made with some kind of bean or legume.
You know, I just tend not to like those.
Not even the stuff that they sort of brag that it bleeds, right?The fake meat that's red, it doesn't look like it's made from legumes.
Yeah, you know, well, there's I mean, there's a difference between those the the ones that are house made with like, you know, very more natural ingredients, because there is a segment of plant based diners that doesn't really like to eat anything that mimics meat.
And so they tend to stay away from Beyond Burgers and Impossible Burgers, but they will have one that's full of more nutrient-dense food, so like lentils or black beans or garbanzo.
But if I had to choose between beyond or impossible as far as taste goes, I feel like they're very similar.Their consistency is slightly different.The fake little blood kind of action.I am not really turned on by that.
I don't know any vegetarian that would be turned on by that.But I would say that they provide for me a much more flavorful option than the others.
Interesting. What do you think the official next burger fad is going to be?I mean, where do burgers go from here?I don't think anyone really saw the smash burger coming and all of a sudden it becomes a ripe, proper thing.
So what do you think's around the corner?
I don't know, but I do believe that people at any time, because I comb the internet, I ask people all the time, I'll tell you what people are craving.They are craving the return of the thick, juicy patty.They are tired of the smash burger.
They just want a big, thick one that they can just tear into and just savor.You know, something that was much more standard pre-2017 in Los Angeles.So there's that.
But also, potentially, but places really upping their game with the type of beef that they use.I'm noticing that a lot of people are using regenerative beef.It's a practice, a land management practice.
that revamps how people manage livestock and produce to one that's more sustainable through restoring the soil, maintaining the ecosystem.It's a much more slow movement.And truthfully, it tastes better and is better for the earth.
So yeah, potentially those two could be some future trends.
Mona, this has been so much fun.Where can folks find your reporting online?
They can find my reporting at la.eater.com.I'm also on Instagram at MonaEats.And I'm also a regular contributor at KCRW.com, where I talk about food issues in Southern California and beyond.
Mona Holmes is an Eater LA reporter, KCRW contributor, James Beard Award nominee.You can follow her at MonaEats on Instagram.Mona, it's been a lot of fun.Thanks so much for joining us on Business Wars.
Coming up, the two dominant makers of fake meat, Beyond Meat and Impossible Burger, turn a fight for the environment into a fight with each other.
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Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey. From Wondery, this is the Smashburger Smackdown for Business Wars.
If you want to hear more from the Burger Wars, make sure to check out our series, McDonald's vs. Burger King.I'm your host, David Brown.Emily Frost and Kelly Kyle produced this episode.Our producer is Grant Rudder.Audio engineer, Sergio Enriquez.
Our managing producer is Desi Blaylock.Our senior producers are Karen Lowe and Dave Schilling.Our senior managing producer is Ryan Lohr.Our executive producers are Jenny Lauer Beckman and Marshall Louie.For Wondery.
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