Welcome to episode 6.4 of Solar Punk Presence, in which we talk to Rena Curtis about fostering rescue animals and why that is such a great thing to do.
Today, I'm talking with Rina Curtis about what turns out to be an extraordinarily timely, hot-button political topic, dogs and cats.And more specifically, what we do with the extra ones that we have.So welcome, Rina.Hello!
And she is coming to us from, is it Prescott, Arizona?
It would be if you are not a native, but as a native you are forced to say Prescott.
Oh, okay, that's good to know, because we always like to blend, or at least not stick out too much like a sore thumb.
But anyway, the reason we're talking to Rena today about dogs and cats is that she is the most enthusiastic rescuer, adopter, and fosterer of dogs and cats that I have ever known.
So my first question for you, Rena, is how many dogs and cats are you sharing your home with right now?
I am sharing my home presently, and these are all mine.I do not have a foster at this minute.I have eight dogs and 13 cats.
Wow.OK.So this is unusual that you don't have any fosters.
Not five minutes before we began here, I got a text.Can you take a foster?So I am about to be getting another foster.
So tell me, what does it mean to foster an animal?
So to foster an animal, you usually get connected with a local rescue group or your local humane society.I have done both. they will have animals that they want to put into a home.
Now with the Humane Society, they have kennels, but there are special needs animals sometimes that will do better in a home or they need that socialization.
And when I did it for them, we always had special cases, medical cases, biters, things like that, hoarding situations.With the group I'm with now that I foster for, There are no kennels, so they rely fully on fosters to take in their animals.
As a foster, the rescue owns the animal.They'll supply your food, your puppy pads, the things you need, and we rely on donations mostly for those things. Medical care is all paid for by them, but it's your job to socialize them.
And if they're puppies, body train them, teach them basic manners, do everything you can to make them appealing and adoptable because that's the ultimate goal is finding their forever home.
Do you have training?I mean, how did you learn to?
Our organization has put together a program where we have foster coaches, where some of our experienced fosters will actually coach new fosters.I've been fostering enough that I don't need much coaching at it.
But I'm not great at teaching dogs manners, mostly because I don't teach my own dogs manners.Oh, they seem pretty well behaved in the background.They're okay.All right.
But they're not, you know, they're not, they're not a sit on, they'll all sit, but they're not great, like trained dogs.They're pretty, pretty well behaved.But mostly I just kind of let my dogs be themselves within reason.
I like them to have their own personalities. But yeah, I do really well with the shy dogs, the dogs that are a little scared and nervous.Those dogs, I seem to be able to bring out of their shell.
That's just, I think, instinct, just talking quietly and being gentle.
So what do you get out of all this work that you do with fostering and actually just having so many cats and dogs?
I find it very rewarding to be able to help. I feel like there's not a ton of things I can do, because I don't have any special skills of any sort that I could go out and volunteer and make the world a better place.But I can take care of animals.
I can do that.And the situation is just, it's dire out there.And these animals, there's so many dying in shelters every day from overcrowding.And I don't know the statistics, but in the last, I think, couple of years especially,
And I think this has to do maybe a lot with post-COVID, right?Like people got animals and then went back to work and they didn't have time for animals anymore. But humans are really failing domestic pets right now.
And they're being turned out on streets.We get them dumped.There's hoarding situations, backyard breeders.And I can be someone.You see a post on Facebook, and it's always like, this dog is starving in this backyard.
And then you see all these people, and they go, can someone help?Can someone help?
You have to be the someone you can't just say can I get that not everyone can use circumstances don't do it but so many people just are quick to someone someone someone is that easy for me to take in a foster and do that integration process with my.
foster pack and but I do it and I can be the someone.I can do the thing.I can put a lost animal in my garage for the night if I can't keep it in the house because it might be sick or something.I can put it in a bathroom.
I can do something that might inconvenience me but will save a life. And that's what it's about, saving a life.
I live out in a village.I've lived out in a couple of villages now, and not so much dogs, but people dump cats.It's amazing.
It's really, you just think, do you think that cat's going to feed itself out here?
Do you know how many people think they will? There's this mentality about cats even more than dogs.They're cats.They'll take care of themselves.They're like little wild animals, but they're not.They've been relying on someone to feed them.
And not only that, but then you've got the predators.You've got the predators that'll come for them and the cars, the cars, the cars, the predators, the fact that they don't know how to feed themselves half the time.
And also cats are like perfect little killing machines.So when they do know how to feed themselves, they will decimate a population of birds or rodents.And they'll, they'll do that.
I mean, I read an article once about how like cats being allowed outside domestic cats being allowed outside is so detrimental to like the bird population or the small rodent population.And none of my cats are allowed outside because I've,
I've opened my door and seen a coyote go by with a cat in its mouth.So they're not allowed out there.And that's a common argument too.Well, cats like to be outside.I always tell people, well, toddlers like to stick forks and outlets.
So, okay.Well, I have to, when I had cats, I did let them outside because they did like to be outside.They also like to be inside, but, um, but I, you know, I, I, Then we got a dog and the cats died because they were old and diseased or whatever.
And I see now we have a lot more birds that are willing to spend time in the yard.And my cats were old and lazy, so they weren't.They were not.Our terrier actually kills more birds than the cats did.Oh, yeah.A little terrier will do that.Horrible.
The cattle dog behind me, Lily, she is a mouser. So she is far better than any of our cats.If I let her out in the backyard at night and a mouse goes through the yard, she leaps through the air like an antelope, lands on it and it is dead instantly.
Oh yeah.So I'm staying here at my mom, my mom's house, uh, at the moment in Los Angeles.And there's one stray cat.He's got a GPS collar, which is a whole other weird thing.
and who wanders around and I was in the backyard and my mom used to put peanuts out for the squirrels and the Jays and stuff like that.
And so anytime you're out in the backyard, they'll be, the crows will come or the J will be there like, hello, where's my peanuts?
And I was out there doing something watering or I don't know, reading and the J was there and suddenly I heard this shriek. And it was because Reggie, this cat who wanders the neighborhood with his GPS collar on, had actually managed to catch a jay.
And he just had this poor thing in his maws.I felt like such a jerk.I felt like it was my fault because the bird was like, Hey, where's my peanuts?
So I'm like, okay, I'm probably never going to have cats again because I would want to let them outside.And I see that it's a problem.
Yeah.They, they, they are a problem outside. They are.I only have one, one cat who tries to get out.Um, he succeeds.He actually succeeded the other night without anyone noticing and, um, woke up at five o'clock in the morning to start my dog routine.
And I heard his little meow and I opened our back door and he was out there.So he'd managed to stay out all night and he, cause he slipped out.He's the only one who even tries it.
But that's amazing because I imagine a lot of these started out as rescue cats or fosters or whatever, so they were probably used to being outside.
Yeah, a lot of my cats come from interesting situations.So I think only three of the 13 are like on purpose adoptions.Everyone else has been, three of them were a box of kittens left in the street at three weeks old.
So I had to bottle feed them, teach them to go to the bathroom.One of them was two weeks old and out on the sidewalk in front of my friend's work. Um, no mom anywhere around.So again, bottle feed, teach to go to the bathroom, the whole thing.
Some of them are from trash cans.People will be like, I found a cat in the dumpster.Can you help?But they all seem to be like, okay, cool.We live inside now.Totally fine with it.
That is really crazy.So I lived in France for a few years and they actually, they just generally don't like to fix the animals.They think it's unnatural.
But what they will do is perfectly, completely, perfectly reasonable people who have like, say, a female dog.And if it becomes pregnant, after it has a litter, they just bring the puppies to the vet and to have them euthanized.
I was like, wow, monsters.You're all monsters.
That's monstrous.Yeah.No, it's unnatural to fix them, but it's totally natural to murder the puppies.
Yeah.I mean, I presumably leave that with cats as well.I mean, I guess it's better than putting them in a, in a bag with a rock and throwing it in the water, but it's definitely better than that.But.
Well, and not necessary, right?
We have modern technology.
And it is dangerous to keep your pets unaltered.Female dogs will get pyrometra, which their uterus will swell to huge sizes and kill them.
Yeah, that happened to my mother-in-law's dog.And so, you know, in the last year of the dog's life, they had to fix the dog.Yeah.Yeah.Which, yeah.
And you just prevent that.You prevent it.With male dogs, if you don't neuter them, their rates of testicular cancer are way higher.Plus their drive to run away
is way higher because they, if they smell another dog in heat, if they get, they just have a stronger will to be out there being mischievous when they don't get their little ball snipped off.
In Europe, like I said, they don't really like to fix the animals.So we, you know, we have We have a terrier, so he got castrated because he was just unbearable.And people are like, why did you do that to him?Why did you mutilate him?
Or our neighbors, they have a really sweet teddy bear poodle and they had her fixed.I don't remember their reasoning.I think they just got tired of the little doggy diapers you have to put on them.And they apologized for it.
They apologized for having her fixed.They're like, we just couldn't deal with it anymore. It's okay.
It's okay.You're gonna, you'll have a healthier animal and ultimately a happier animal because they won't be driven to breed.They won't have that.
in them anymore and they get a little crazy when they go into heat or when a female goes into heat and unaltered males around, they get crazy trying to get to each other.And cats are demand ovulators.
So whereas dogs typically have a heat cycle, cats will just go into heat on demand.And that is why when you have two strays or two ferals that are unaltered, they just will breed and reproduce like crazy. Oh, I didn't know that about cats.Yeah.
Yes.That's why you end up with a colony of 40 before you know it.
Yeah.Cause it doesn't take them very long either.
So I'm, so you talked about this a little bit with your cats, but what percentage of the foster animals or animals that you foster, do you end up adopting? Most of them I don't.
So I am pretty good at it.I have never failed with a cat.I, well, we call it a foster fail, but a friend in the group says that it's better to say a foster fit.You're a foster fit.It sounds more positive.I have two
pitbull still alive one we lost last year who were absolute they was back when we were fostering for the humane society and we did keep both of those zina who is still alive she was one of our i think she was our second foster and she came to animal control with they brought her in with
six one day old puppies and she'd been she was living in an abandoned van or something they brought her in and she was so protective of the puppies that she would stand at the front of the kennel and just guard and bark and guard and bark and she wouldn't she couldn't relax to feed them it was
The end of October, and it was a very cold year, unlike today's 92 degrees, but it was the end of October and they had to move her to an outside kennel.And we adopted the foster that we had out on Halloween.
And so we were available and they said, you know, hey, no one wants to take her.She's not people friendly, but she's outside now with those pups and it's cold.And we said, sure, we'll take her.
And for the first couple of days, we thought she might kill us.She was not friendly.Then she just warmed up and we fell in love and we kept her. She actually did some local TV shows as a promotion for like, this is what fostering does.
Like this dog who just was ready to attack, look at her now.She's just happy and friendly.And then the second one, she'd actually been in the kennel.She'd been at the Humane Society for 221 days when we took her in.
She had been a surrender that a person said had bit someone.They could find no record of a bite anywhere.The person brought her in to be euthanized, and they said, well, we're not just going to do that.
We're going to substantiate what you're saying first.They couldn't.The person who brought her in had apparently had her on a rope in the backyard or chain in the backyard for five years. She got her at nine months old.Emma did not like children.
She didn't like children.And then she had a baby, the woman had a baby.So she just threw them away in the backyard and left her like that.So when we took Emma in, she warmed up to us fairly quickly.
She didn't really like other animals and she didn't like other people.She got attached to me and my husband Donald.
And when she would get meet and greets to meet potential adopters, she would be okay for about 10 minutes and then she'd start backing up and growling at them.So she kind of made herself unadoptable.
And so the Humane Society asked Donald if he'd stop by on his way home from work one day, they wanted to talk to him about it.
And they said, you know, at this point, this would be inhumane to leave this dog in a kennel because she was going out of her mind.She was doing the spinning in circles and she just hated it.They said, we think that we have to euthanize her.
And our humane society is like a no kill ethic.They will euthanize only in the worst circumstances. Donald said, they said, you know, you're going to have to go home and talk to Rena about it.
And he said, I can go home and I can talk to her, but you guys understand what's going to happen, right?And they were like, yeah, we do.We understand.
And they were like, we know that this will probably be the end of you fostering for us for a while because she's going to be a lot.And that's when we stopped fostering for them because she was.
she could only be with me and him she could not be with the other animals and it wasn't that she was aggressive like she was going to attack she was afraid and when people as long as people were ignoring her she would ignore them she was really cute and no one wanted to ignore her they all wanted to be like hey
and she would be like, no, no, don't talk to me.And the animals, when they would approach her, is when she wouldn't go after a cat, she wouldn't go after another dog, but only when they would come to her would she be willing to fight.
So we had, for many years, a very particular routine.Emma was a great dog, she was super smart, and she was very happy to be by herself.So she spent her day in our bedroom, and then at night when we would get home, we had baby gates,
blocking certain places.All the cats would go into particular rooms where we could just shut the doors.And then she could be through baby gates fine with other dogs.So the other dogs could still see us and we could still talk to them.
It was like they were in the same room, just separated by a gate, but she would get our time in the evening.She was amazing.She was the smartest dog I'd ever met.She was sweet.She was a good, good dog.We lost her last year.
Other than that, all of my fosters with the current group I'm with, technically Ollie who I showed you is a um He was a foster to adopt, but the intention was to adopt him immediately.
You can't finalize an adoption until you've had the certain amount of vaccinations.So I had to be a foster to adopt until his vaccinations were done.
But I knew I was taking, I mean, I had been waiting to adopt a dog from this particular group of hoarding situation for a long time.And when they put him up on the screen, I was like, please, I will foster to adopt him.
Back to people failing animals, the youngest bloodhound was a fairly recent adoption.He was found in September of last year at a new home construction site. eight, nine week old bloodhounds, all dying of parvo.He is the sole survivor.
He's the sole survivor of that group.Now, fortunately, someone had actually purchased a bloodhound from that backyard breeder who turned up sick.She was okay.
The woman got her treatment, but it gave us the ability to have all of the seller's information.So we were able to take it to the police and he's charged.He was charged.
uh, with illegal breeding or dumping animal.
Oh, right.Okay.Yeah.The animal cruelty debt, leaving them all there to die with Parvo.
And I mean, it's just amazing that there are a lot of people out there who consider animals commodities.
Yeah.It's just a way to make money.
Yeah, I see this.We live, you know, I live in the middle of nowhere.We've got some farmers up the street.They're nice people.They have lots of dogs, a couple of dogs.
In fact, we got our dog from them because they breed their dogs and they, but you know, they have cattle and they just, you know, they're nice to their animals.But at the same time, those animals are just a commodity.
It's such a weird mindset.I guess it's normal.I guess it's traditional.I don't know.
I think that's it.I think that it's just, um, you know, I think you get two, two kind of situations with, with people and animals.Well, three, but for the people that don't see them like the way I see them, it's the commodity thing.
Like this is, this is our livelihood and the working dogs are the working dogs and that's what they do.And sure, they might be sad when they go or whatever, but it's not, it's not the same.They're just, they'll replace them with another dog.
It's also kind of a luxury, it's a privilege to be able to care about animals too, because if you're in a really bad situation, if you're in deep poverty or in a country where it's hard to just eat or have a roof over your head, it's a lot harder to care about animals in that case too.
So it's a privilege to be able to feel the way I feel about animals in that respect.And I get that.And I wouldn't have it any other way.You know, I love them.I've always loved animals.
When as a small child, as a three-year-old, I remember being at a family function where there are lots of other kids and those kids all running around and playing and me being in a field with the kittens.
Yeah, I was just thinking, so my other half grew up in East Germany in a village and things were pretty old school there.
And I don't know if it was when he was growing up or if it was before he was born, but they had a German shepherd on a chain in the yard and it just ate scraps.
You know, so it's really, you know, his mom's now at the point where she lets the cat in the house, but the cat's only, it's got its room and it's not allowed to go anywhere else.
And she hates it when we bring our dog because, you know, the dog's in the house and you can see her gritting her teeth, you know, because there's this idea that they're not part of the family.Yeah.They're family here.
They're absolutely family here.I always wonder too, like, what's the point?Why get a dog that you're going to keep on a chain in the yard?
Well, to prevent people from stealing things from you.
Ah, their protection.Okay.Yeah.
You know, and I, you know, I've a couple, I don't know, it's about eight years ago, we were doing some walking along the former East German, West German border.It's pretty empty there.
And at the end of one of our trips, like one of the, on the last day, we walked past a farm yard where they had a German shepherd on a chain. And I had never seen that in real life.So I was shocked.
And then, you know, and they had, oh, they had farm cats and there was this little kitten and he had infected eyes and you could tell his growth was something that I really just wanted to be like for $60, you could have given him eye drops, you know, I totally wanted to steal this cat.
Yeah.I probably would have, but yeah.
Yeah.It's, it's hard.It's, it's very hard.I just don't, I don't know how you could look at. you know, a cat or a dog or a bird or a hamster, whatever it is, and watch them suffer like that.They suffer.They feel pain.They feel fear.
They feel those things.And it's very obvious if you spend any amount of time with them.
I think these people just don't feel responsible for that.
Or they think it's just a dog or yeah, I don't know.You know, I think these people have also had hard lives. And probably haven't been shown a lot of mercy themselves.
Yeah, and then that goes back to it's very hard to care about something else when you're just struggling to survive yourself. Although I have known unhoused people who have- They're very good to their animals.
And their pets are their life.I mean, their pets eat before they eat and they keep them sane and safe and healthy or people who've gotten clean from drugs because their dog needs them or their cat needs them.And they can be a motivating factor too.
And the love is so unconditional. especially when you're in a situation where society is judging you, you know, your dog is not.
Okay.So I have an off the wall question for you.I mean, it's totally off the wall, personal, your personal gut feeling, domestication of dogs, you know, domestication of wolves to produce dogs.Who did it?Men or women?
I think men.Really?OK, why?I think men because if you think about when it happened.So I think we know now that cats domesticated themselves.They chose to be domestic.And cats are kind of the same form that they were, right?A cat is a cat is a cat.
Right?They're pretty set in what they are.But if you think back to the domestication point, and you're talking about a wolf,
I think that it was probably, wolves are aggressive and imagine a snarly, aggressive animal coming into your camp or where you are to maybe eat food.Cause that's probably, I would imagine how it happened.
And then it became this symbiotic working relationship.I think that men probably felt more of a need for that. to that working relationship that they had.
So I think probably men, because women may have been less apt to see the snarling, fearsome wolf and be like, unlike women today who are like, let me pet your giant pit bull.
So that's interesting.Cause I, I would have had the exact opposite answer.I would have been like women, because, you know, I look at my mother-in-law, I look at, you know, my mom when she was still alive and,
You know, my mom was always putting peanuts out for birds and animals and like all the animals around here.They know her squirrels.They're all, you know, you know, my mom passed away recently and I go out in the backyard and they all come in.
They're like, where's Rosie? Who are you?Where's the peanuts?Yeah, exactly.
I think that women, you're right, that women probably were more apt to be feeding them.
But I think in their first original fearsome wolf transition state, women are probably the ones who then took on responsibility for the pets, as we do, and then made them nicer and became more a part of their lives.
But I think the initial domestication was probably between a man and a wolf. And maybe a man's ego who was like, I can dominate that.
Yeah, there's definitely a difference in how the dog has been trained, depending on if me or my spouse is in charge.
Yes.He's like, I will break the will of the terrier.Yeah.I'm a bit like, no, you got to work with them.Yeah.And also the dog also deserves, you know, you'd really want to suppress the personality of the dog.
You don't.You know, one of my fellow fosters, she has like five or six dogs of her own.
One of them is a permanent foster who was a permanent foster is someone who's got like a medical condition that the rescue will take care of for the rest of the dog's life if you will give the dog a home.
And she took in a little black terrier like four months old named Noodle. And Noodle was wild.She described Noodle as a little piranha.She just decided to adopt Noodle.And I asked her, you know, why, what made you decide to adopt Noodle?
You've got so many of your own.And she said, honestly, I couldn't stand the thought of someone trying to break her spirit because she's wild.And I love her just the way she is.The other dogs love her.
And I don't want someone to try to, you know, train the Noodle out of her basically. And so she kept her for that.Yeah.Yeah.And I think women tend to be much better at that.
Although my dog trainer, who I work with, she's a woman and her dogs, her dog Happy, her lab is He knows he does everything she says all the time.But she's a very positive reinforcement trainer.And Happy was very smart.
We took the Parvo bloodhound Jasper to her, because Jasper has been a challenge.He has been a real challenge.I don't know if the Parvo made him a little wonky in the head.We've never had a dog like him.
Our first weekend, we both were looking at each other like, what did we do? In the first week he was here, I think he took down a 65-inch television.He pulled up 15 feet of carpet.He started to pull apart a king-size mattress that was new.
He took baseboards off the wall, casings off from around the door, took down several lamps, window treatments.I mean, he was something.Wow.
I think bored.I mean, he was young.He was only six months old when he came to us.Our other bloodhound, our six-year-old bloodhound, he's actually a trained search and rescue dog.So he had a job.But Jasper's just a different breed.
Like, there's something about him. when you raise your voice or you get mad at him, he is not at all intimidated by that.In Jasper's mind, it's like, Oh, we're going, let's go.And he just amps up further.
And so we did puppy training with him individually and class and he has gotten better.But every night, you know, we've got about a half hour of him walking through
opening cupboards, opening drawers, where I have to just go stand in front of him and just, I physically use my body just to block his space and just say, no, I don't, I don't escalate.I don't get loud.And he will get bored of that.
He'll go sit down and he'll go to bed.So it's better now, now that he's, you know, a year and almost a half old, but, um, we'd never had a dog that destructive that just
defiant, just like, but then he'd go to class and he'd be a perfect angel at class.You have to show people how bad you are so they don't get more crazy.
But he's very sweet.He's very sweet.I don't have much dog experience.And so with our dog, it's like, I understand what most of the time, 90% of the time, what he's asking for.
And most of the time, he understands what I'm trying to tell him, whether he pays attention to it or not is another story.But then for a week, we had our neighbor's teddy bear poodle, looks like Chewbacca.
Also, the neighbors are like, our dog is so smart.
um but then i realized like i didn't speak the poodle's language and the poodle didn't speak my language and i was like oh i just thought this was a universal thing but no you really develop a language with your dog yeah you do and they get to know your words and you know the the cues you give
They get to know your body language, all of that stuff.And it's different with every animal.And people use different commands with, you know, different things for come, for sit, for no.Like some people don't say no.
I tend to just go, ah, ah, ah, you know, like that.That works.Yes.And they're like, oh, OK.
But you know what?Our terrier now goes, mm, mm, mm.
Yeah.Uh-huh.Yeah.Yeah.They're fun.They're a lot of fun. Yeah, I don't like to train the will out of my dog.I like their personality.I like who they are.
So why do you think so many animals end up in animal shelters?I mean, obviously dogs are a lot of work, right?And maybe people underestimate that.They do.
I think we have a problem with breeding.
I think that backyard breeders, every time a backyard breeder puts some cute little dachshund or Aussie or something out there, chihuahuas, they breed more than they can take care of and more than they can sell.
And if they don't sell when they're puppies, they're real hard to get rid of.So they get dumped or they end up in shelters.And also when you have people breeding and selling, that doesn't force people into the shelter, right?
If you want a dog, my thing is if you want a dog, because you really want the relationship with a dog and you're not just looking for some sort of status breed.If people stopped breeding, you'd go to the shelter and get your dog.
You'd find the dog that was your match.So breeding and there being no laws against breeding, I think we're trying to, we're working on passing something here in Arizona that forces breeders to register and stop backyard breeding.
I think that people do wildly underestimate.I think that people get puppies because puppies are adorable and they have no idea how destructive puppies are.And they really, really are.I was definitely unprepared.Yeah.Puppies are hard.
I would take an adult dog any day over a puppy.Puppies are very cute, but I often say the only reason puppies live to be dogs is because they are very cute.
I say, I really, I, you know, it was, it was interesting watching the brain develop, but you know, our dog for the first
at least six months, everyone we met who had a dog was like, oh, our dog had like one accident in the house and blah, blah, blah.And okay, our dog, okay, he spent the first three months of his life in a barn.
So he didn't get any potty training at all.But he really, it took until he was six months before he literally could control his bladder.And it was so frustrating.
People who say that are the same people who go, my baby slept through the night at two weeks.No, that baby didn't.
I was, I was ready to slap these people.Yeah.
Yeah.They don't.So I think that you get, um, puppies and then people can't handle the puppies or you get puppies.And then when they're not puppies anymore, well, they're not as fun.They're not as cute.
So then they go to the shelter, they get dumped and, and then, You know, you do have an issue of renters who will adopt dogs and then they can't keep them because they get caught or whatever the case may be.
Um, or they move and they move into another rental house where suddenly they can't find one who will rent to a dog.And then people, when they move, they do the thing where, Oh, I'm moving.I can't take my dog with me.Uh, I'm having a baby.
I can't take my dog.I can't, I'm having a baby.I don't have time for my dog. Having a baby, I don't think my dog will like my baby.You know, it's just, there's so many reasons.
But I think a lot of it is just backyard breeding, I think is the first, the first problem, the biggest problem that lends to this.
And that's because those dogs end up in shelters or they keep people out of shelters from adopting because they're just buying from backyard breeder. And then lack of education, just not understanding what it takes.
I mean, a dog is a, you can consider a dog a 15 year commitment.Sure, like my bloodhounds, their average age is 10.I'm gonna get probably 10 years out of them, but my little dogs, they could live to be 20. and so that's that's my commitment to them.
Yeah having been a cat person you know and cats like okay you know that you know they like they're cuddly they like to cuddle they like it when you're there but you know if I needed to leave for like 10 weeks which I sometimes had to do for my work I could leave them for 10 weeks it
If I just needed to leave for 10 days, I didn't even need a cat sitter.I just left the window open, lots of food and water and fine.Dogs, with dogs, like our dog, I'm like, oh, we've left him alone for four hours.We need to go home, you know?
Yeah.It's a much bigger commitment.The cats are way easier.Until Emma, the dog that required just being with me and my husband, until she passed, we hadn't gone anywhere.
together in years and years and years because some one of us had to be here to take care of Emma.We couldn't have someone else feed her.We couldn't have someone else take care of her.And even now, we recently went to California for a couple of days.
My son came and my daughter came and they took care of the pets and everything was fine.But I was stressed about it while I was gone.You know, it's like, okay, I know they know the routines.I know they know like you can't,
mixed dogs and you can't do these certain things with certain dogs, but I was worried about it.And honestly, it's easier for me to just be home.
What's it like facing down a defensive pit bull that you don't know very well?
So Xena is that dog.I mean, she was she was that dog when we brought her home.So we brought her home and it's scary.I mean, it's scary.She's not a big pit bull.She's a 50 pound what you'd call a pocket pity.You know, she's a little.
When we brought her home with her puppies, her puppies had upper respiratory infections.And so here we are with this dog who did not like us and six puppies that were a week old that we needed to administer medication to.
At that point in time, we had a laundry room off our bedroom.So we devised a way to turn the crate to the laundry room door with food in there.And then that laundry room had a door that went to the backyard.
So we could open the backyard so she'd have access to the backyard.We tied a rope to the door handle so that we could pop the crate open, then slam the door, then grab all the puppies and give them their medicine real quick.
She came home to us on a Saturday and the truth is it only took her two days to start warming up to me.The thing about her is she would come out.We had her crate in our room.She'd come out of our bedroom.She'd come out of the crate.
and she would walk through the room just glaring and growling at us.And she'd go into the bathroom and pee on the floor and then she'd go back to her crate.But she was very food motivated.
So on the second night, on the Sunday evening, we ordered takeout from somewhere and I ordered a fettuccine Alfredo with chicken.And I sat in the bedroom and I didn't look at her.And the thing about a dog like that is you don't wanna stare him down.
You don't wanna make eye contact with him a lot.
So I just focused on watching television and she came to the edge of the bed because she smelled the food and I took every piece of chicken out of that pasta and I fed it to her by hand without looking at her, without talking to her, just fed it all to her.
And the next morning I'm showering and I feel a nudge through the shower curtain and it was her. And I get out of the shower and she licked my legs a couple times.And I thought, well, she's going to eat me now or we're friends.
And she walked away and I came home at lunch to check on her.And when I opened the door, she came to me tail wagging and that was it.And it took about another week. But it was, it was quick, but I was just, I was, I didn't push anything.
And I think that's what it is.There are truly aggressive dogs out there that I am not equipped to deal with.
You know, I don't have that kind of training and those dogs can be much harder, but a lot of times aggression comes from just fear, from just trying to protect themselves.
And if you're patient and quiet and you give them the space and let them know they can trust you, they usually, they usually will come out of their shell. But on a big dog like that, it's a little scary.
On a dog who has a reputation for if they do bite, it's bad.I always tell people, you know, chihuahuas might bite a lot, but they're chihuahuas.
Yeah, they're not going to kill you.
They're not going to kill you.They don't do a ton of damage. A pit bull, like one bite can do a tremendous amount of damage.And I think the same thing about dog fights.So we are really careful with the pit bulls and who they like.
Xena, she kind of likes everyone.But my other one, Maisie, she is a weirdo and she only likes dogs that she met as a puppy. It could be two years between seeing them, but if she met them as a puppy, she's good.
She doesn't like any dogs that she did not meet when she was a baby.Oh, that's interesting, isn't it?Broken.She's a defective little dog.Aren't we all, though, on some level?Well, this one, she's a backyard breeder situation.
To put it into perspective, a friend took her sister.Her sister is 80 pounds.Maisie is 49 pounds. At eight weeks old, she had her first surgery because her intestines twisted.She'd nearly died then.
When she had her spay, she only sees the same doctor because her doctor knows her inside and out, literally.She said, I'm sorry, her scar is so large, but when I went in to spay her, nothing was where it was supposed to be.
So I had to open her up further.She has since had another abdominal surgery on her intestines.
Her, she's six, she has arthritis in her knees, arthritis in her spine, the pads of her feet are too big, her ligaments are soft, so her knees are wobbly, she's bowlegged, she is obsessed with eating soft things, cloth, she's so defective.
We've got to be $10,000 into surgeries on that dog. But she's so sweet.She's sweet.She's cute.She's adorable.She's smart, but she's broken.She's the product of backyard breeding and She shows it.
She probably never should have lived past eight weeks, but we saved her.And they didn't even know if they could.I mean, the day she went into surgery, her doctor said to me, I don't know if I can do this.
I don't know if based on where her intestines twisted, if I will have anything left on the other side to attach them to.And I said, just try.And if you can't, I'd rather her go while she's under anesthesia. And we can just let her go.
And three hours later she called and she was like, I did it.Yeah, she did it.And yeah, so Maisie is, she's, she's broken.She's very broken.But, um, yeah, so we're careful with them.
We're much more careful with the pit bulls because if my little dogs get in a fight, I just scoop each one of them up in a hand and they're, they're good.You know?
There's no damage done really, but if they get, if the pit bulls get in a fight with someone, it could be really deadly.
Tell me a little bit about these, you say you've fostered for the Humane Society and what was this other organization?
So the organization that I foster for now is called Yavapai Humane Trappers.A woman, local woman here, her name is Katrina Carr.She started in 2018.
She started working with our lost, we have a local Facebook group, Lost Dogs of Arizona, Lost Pets of Arizona.When dogs would be out, Katrina learned how to trap.
how to humanely trap she is amazing at it she's caught dogs who've been out for months and so in 2019 she got 501 3c status 501 is that right 3c so she's a registered non-profit
At that point, she started not just trapping for people who were looking for dogs or people who were giving sightings of dogs, but taking dogs into getting fosters, putting together the organization and developing kind of a network of fosters and foster coaches.
So I had been watching her do it for a long time and it's truly amazing.So a lot of rescues are just rescues, but this is her wheelhouse.
I mean, she will go out, she puts up game cameras, they set up feeding stations, they track, they know which direction the dogs are going in, they'll put up traps and then eventually they catch them.
Does she ever end up with like coyotes and javelinas?
Yes, it happens.That has happened.The coyotes, I don't think you've ever gone into a trap.Skunks, Things like that, that happens.She did a trap several years ago where she relies on sightings.
So flyers are huge when dogs are lost and tells people like, don't chase, don't call, don't whistle.There are all these like very specific shy dog techniques that you use.Sometimes you can hand catch them.
But when a dog goes out and gets lost, oftentimes they go into full survival mode. They will not answer when they are called.If it is their person calling them, it does not matter.They're just as senseless as lost cats.Yes.
They go into complete survival mode.So a whistle, a call, even a familiar voice.So when you get sightings in an area, and we're surrounded by national forests, so a lot of times it'll be in the forest.
One of the techniques is she'll have their people walk through the area just saying normal phrases that they would say in the house.Oh, did you want a treat?Is it time to eat?That kind of stuff.And that will work.
That can work because it's familiar without being aggressive toward them or trying to get them to do something, getting real low on the ground.
to them, not looking at them, those kinds of things, just tossing out things like McDonald's sausage, you know, is one of the things, stinky food, real stinky food.But she's phenomenal.I mean, she just, she, she catches them.She just does it.
And then she started bringing them in and then she started taking them in when they were lost and, and having fosters for them.We have a situation, the situation that Ollie comes from actually a,
Couple, we've taken in 156 dogs of these little shaggy, they call them Havanese.I don't think their DNA test has put any Havanese in these dogs.They breed them.
The woman, unfortunately, she's, you know, she's got a mental illness and she's obsessed with puppies.So they let these dogs have puppies, just tons of puppies.And then the husband, once they're not puppies anymore, he takes care of them.
And Katrina was able to win their trust. They live somewhere where they don't even have a fence, but these dogs are so people oriented because they get loved on so much as puppies that they don't stray like more than 15 or 20 feet from these people.
So we've taken in 156.When we took the last three, Katrina saw only 12 dogs left on the property at that point in time.And that's where Ollie comes from.There's a line of them that have heart murmurs.
genetically and they keep breeding and having them.
So they're very inbred at this point.Oh yeah.
We had a foster back in March that came from the last three that came in and Luna had fluid in her belly already so she was in heart failure.So Katrina takes them in.We've got a situation that we just found in Rimrock with 200 dogs
And we had one earlier this year with 40 dogs between us and the local rescues.She's, we can find, if she can find fosters, she's bringing them in.
And there are some that we don't even have fosters for and they'll stay in boarding at the animal hospital.You know, some of them come in very sick.We had one that came in who was just virtually a skeleton not that long ago.And he just got adopted.
He got the local, one of the local pet stores who specializes in organic and specialty food, donated the food.Through March, I think in the months of April and March, the organization's vet bills were $70,000.
And we rely entirely on donations and grants for that.So it's, it's rough, but she finds a way, she finds a way all the time and just get the local community gets really involved.
We do have a pretty good animal community here that really cares and they try to foster.And I, and then we volunteer like, so not only do I foster, but I'm the spay neuter coordinator for the group.
So all the animals as they need their spays and neuters, I set those up and
do that and then we have you know people who just do the vaccines and people who are the uh head of the foster department and then people who are head of the adoption department and then we have the foster coaches and katrina spends most of her time actually out on the road traffic she goes to the reservation she goes sometimes as far as new mexico border and she and um one other person jen they just hop in the van and they go with their traps and they stay in a hotel and
She never ceases to amaze me.She catches them.She catches them almost every time and usually comes home with more as she drives through the reservation because rez dogs are a real problem.There's a culture there too of not altering, not fixing.
and they just run the res and they just reproduce and so she rarely comes back from a trip up there with a specific trapping in mind without like 10 more dogs.
So does that cause resentment with the people who live on the reservation?It doesn't.
She's developed relationships with the animal control up there and
one of the local humane societies and they are okay with it because they're just dogs that are loose at that point and they just don't seem to be bothered when they get taken, disappear.
I think culture is changing a bit and I think with younger generations there's more of a tendency to want to alter and to take better care of the pets.With some of the older generations it's just cultural it's kind of like you're up you know it's
It's cultural and those things don't change quickly.
Yeah, I know.I think life was much harder in the past.Yeah, yeah, it was.And there wasn't as much extra money.I mean, it's complicated now because there's no shortage of people who don't have money, which is a whole other issue.
But if you have money, then you have enough money generally to do a good job, I think.
And to do the best you can.I've seen posts where someone's like, I need help, my cat's sick.And you'll get self-righteous, pious people who are like, if you don't have enough money, don't adopt the animal.And I don't feel that way.
That animal might just be euthanized or might just be thrown out on the street.And maybe someone who doesn't have a lot of means Like they can't afford the $10,000 surgery the animal needs because most of us can't.
I mean, most of the time that I've had to do big surgeries, I've just had to pull out a credit card and just be like, I don't care, you know, just here, fix my animal.But not everyone has that opportunity.
If they can take an animal in and love that animal and feed that animal and keep that animal warm, and then the big thing comes and they can't afford to do it, I'm not gonna knock them for that.
They did the best they could on what they had when someone else didn't step up for an animal.
I think people just like to be jerks on social media.Oh, they do.
It makes it so easy when you don't have to say things to people's face.When you don't have to say things to people's face, you can be as mean as you want to be, it seems.
Yeah.Well, I mean, that is also a whole other topic of conversation.So why do people hoard animals?
For her, for that particular group, That group of dogs, it's her mental illness.She just has the drive to just have puppies.
For the one that we had with 40 dogs, there was a situation where human beings really failed the group of people who had the dogs.It was three developmentally disabled adults.
living together and they each got a dog and within two years they had 40 dogs.
Okay.So they were just in over their heads.
There should have been a safety net there for those people as developmentally disabled people to help them through that situation.And someone failed them somewhere along the line.
Well, and with all the other things they're dealing with as well, I would imagine.
Yes.And my mom, she takes care of developmentally disabled adults.She has them live with her and she is their full-time caretaker. they're absolutely her family.
I mean, she treats them like she treats us as her children and takes care of all of their needs, but someone was not doing that for these people.And so there were 40 dogs, so they let them all go.
The situation further up north with the 200 dogs, they were breeding.They were breeding and they couldn't sell.And you'd think that when you had 10 that you couldn't sell, you'd stop, but they don't get them fixed.And it is,
One place that we could do better is some sort of subsidizing of fixing them because it is very expensive.And we had a local spay neuter clinic that ran through our Humane Society that closed during COVID because we lost our vet.
And it was very inexpensive to do it.But when you do it at the vet, it's like four or $500.And that will be a barrier for some people.
they'll have to save up the money and before you know it they didn't save up the money and then they're having a litter and then if you do not get rid of that litter and you cannot fix them then you have parent and child or siblings breeding and it just gets out of control.
If we could do better there that would definitely
how even if I mean it it seems like it would just save everyone money overall because a lot of these shelters are taxpayer funded anyway right so there are less of them in there there's less money spending there subsidize the spay and neuters so that would that would be a good way to do it but yeah other than that a lot of hoarding situations will start with some sort of mental illness if they are not breeders um the same way you'd hoard
items in your house, it becomes animals if you've got that border issue going on.I think if we learned to judge people less and try to understand where they were coming from and what was causing things,
we could fix a lot of problems rather than just being like, Oh, look at that hoarder, you know, or reach out to people, reach out.Yeah, absolutely.Reach out.
It's hard though, because you know, you don't want to cross a line and you don't want to insult someone.
I think you need some help, you know, that is very, it's a very delicate balance because you don't know what you're getting, like by offering the help, some people just have a lot of pride or, or they're embarrassed.
You know, the fact that someone looked at me and thought I needed help, how embarrassing.I don't want to, I don't want to address that.I don't want to deal with that.And.
Having relationships with the animals just seems to be such a fundamental human thing.Yeah.Yeah.I think it is.It's like what we do somehow, even if it's just the squirrels in the backyard or the Jays or.
I get there's that unconditional love.And I think people crave that.They, they like it.I think there's probably a little selfishness too.When we take care of animals, we feel a little better about ourselves.I feel good when I can save an animal.
I feel good when that adoption goes out and I know that animal's happy. But you know, I've read people say, and I think it might be true sometimes, is that sometimes losing a pet is harder than losing a person.
The reasoning that I've read people posit behind that is that there's no bad memories really with your pet.Like with people, there's always, there's always both, right?
You can, even with our parents, you remember the good and the bad and the times they drove you crazy and the fights you might've had with them along with good, but you don't have that when you lose a pet.
It's a much less complicated relationship.
Yeah, it's a simple, just a simple relationship about love and care.
You know, the dog just wants your time and your attention and yeah, and food. and walks, lots of walks, but you know, it's not judging you.Even cats don't judge you.They don't judge you.They look like they're judging you.
Cats look like they're judging you all the time, but they're not really.And they, you know, they don't reject you.And yeah, it's so it's, it's, it's, it is easier to grieve them because it is straightforward.
It's straightforward.It's, it's very straightforward.You know, they, they comfort you. even if they don't know they're comforting you, even if it's just laying on your lap and letting you pet them.
Our dog Emma, she was, if she had liked other people besides me and my husband, she would have been an amazing therapy dog because she was so emotionally intuitive.
if you cried she was there she was by your side she was there she would lick your face she would lay on your lap she knew she she knew every time if a voice was raised she would hide and it didn't have to be directed but she could tell that's anger and she was gone she was hiding um she just understood emotions so well our other pitbull xena
It's Xena's world.She just lets you live in it, basically.She's a princess.She's a diva.She's like, are you sad?That's very sad for me.Get my food.
Yeah.So if you had a piece of advice for someone looking for an animal, what would it be?Take your time with it.
Don't impulsively get an animal. Think about it.Don't get the animal because it's cute.Get the animal because you're ready to devote the time and the energy to it.And it's the right fit for your house.
You know, if you live in an apartment, don't get a Belgian Malinois.If you want to run all the time, don't get a bulldog or a French bulldog. Understand that for your lifestyle, there are animals that will fit better.
Take your time, meet the animals, adopt, don't shop.You don't need to, you know, there's so many great animals.
And if you're, if you're interested in a purebred, the shelters are full of purebred animals because again, people breed and they can't sell them or people adopt them and then they can't take care of them or they don't want to, they don't want the work that's in there.
There are rescues that specialize in very certain breeds, but really just don't do it impulsively and understand that it is a 15-year commitment.If you want a cat or a dog, cats can live to be 20.
That's my, I think the two big things, take your time with it, understand what you're doing and please adopt.And please, if you can foster, there's nothing more rewarding.People always say, how do you do it?
They ask me all the time, how do you do it?I couldn't do it, I keep them all.I couldn't do it, I keep them all. I cry when my fosters go to their new homes, but I get to pick their new homes.
Someone else in our organization vets the homes and they do the background checks and they do those things on the people, but I take the dog to the adopter.I do the meet and greet.
I decide if that's the right fit for the dog that I have been taking care of. And knowing that they're going to a good home means that I get to bring the next one in.When they go to a good home, I get to save another life.
I only take one foster at a time because I've got eight of my own. I get to save someone else.And even when it's a hospice foster like Luna was, I got to take her last two months of life and make it special.
She was in a home, she was warm, she was loved.And the day that we knew that she needed to be allowed to pass, we took her and my husband held her on his lap and I sat next to him and we cried the same as if she'd been with us for 10 years.
We'd had her for two months. and we cried the same because she had to go and it was hard but fostering saves lives and it can also be the last transition step when one has to go and it can be beautiful and you can do something special and then
bring the next one on and save a life because we are failing these animals out there, humans are, and something has to be done to stop the overbreeding, these animals that are in the shelters dying because they need room, you know, for no other reason.
Perfectly adoptable animals that they have to put down to bring in the next one off the street. And it's just tragic.
So there you have it.If any of you have felt the call to arms to adopt or foster a rescue animal, you know, maybe this will be the impetus you need to get yourself down there to volunteer.
Meanwhile, don't forget to support Solar Punk Presence on Patreon and subscribe to our YouTube channel.Thanks for listening. Thank you for listening to Solar Punk Presents, a podcast hosted and produced by Ariel Kroon and Cristina de la Rocha.
The audio for this episode was recorded in part on the traditional territory of the Neutral, Haudenosaunee, and Anishinaabe peoples. and in Germany.
The opening and closing music for this podcast is Water Cooler Gang by Monkey Warhol, available for use under the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 international license.Don't forget to support us on Patreon at patreon.com slash Solarpunk presents.
Every little bit helps us keep bringing you discussions and interviews.Until the next episode, keep dreaming and stay Solarpunk.
