Welcome to a Meaningful Marketplace.I'm Sarah Missoni from Oregon State University's Food Innovation Center, where I've helped countless dreamers launch their new food products.
It's the science of taking a food delight from the kitchen to mass manufacturing and still keeping its great taste.That's what I do.I've been called the woman with the million dollar palate, although I haven't tried to cash that check yet.
Listen in weekly for real life stories.
I'm Sarah Marshall, owner of Marshall's Hot Sauce and author of Preservation Pantry, modern canning from root to top and stem to core.
I love inspiring business owners to get started on their journey, encourage folks to be part of their local community, and am excited to help business owners tell their stories. Hello and welcome to Missoni and Marshall, The Meaningful Marketplace.
We are here weekly to discuss the journeys of food entrepreneurs.We are glad that you've joined us today as we bring you stories of hope and inspiration.This is Sarah Marshall, owner of Marshall's Hot Sauce.
And Sarah Missoni of Oregon State University's Food Innovation Center.Hi, Sarah Marshall. Hi, Sarah, how's your week going?It's only Monday and I was I've literally been on a zoom call all day except for about 30 minutes where I got to have my lunch.
That's wild.I got to have a totally opposite day from a normal Monday of work, and I went and demoed at the zoo today.What?Yeah, it's very cool.So New Seasons, which is one of our local grocery stores, did an employee appreciation party.
So they invited all of their employees and their families to come to the zoo for the day and then they invited the local vendors to come and table for a few hours but then also would give the vendors tickets to go to the zoo.
So my family could come to the zoo while I was demoing and talking about sauce and then when I finished I could go hang out at the zoo and it was just a really
fun way to show both the employees of New Seasons and the vendors of New Seasons that they're valued and loved and important and we all got to hang out together.So it was super rad.I had a great time.
It's Zooper. And I wore, if you want to see my Instagram, you know, the new thing for the young kids are doing is a fit check to talk about your outfit.So I wore a snake themed outfit today.You did?
Yeah.I have snakeskin boots, a snake dress.You can kind of see it.
Oh yeah, I see it.And then there's a snake on your dress.
And then a snake necklace.So the kids were very into it. It was a fun day.So thanks, New Seasons, for doing that for everybody.It was very nice.
We have been partnering with the Regional Food Business Center to bring guests from our six-state region, and we're currently meeting with business owners from the great state of Idaho.
I would like to welcome our co-host, Jana, from University of Idaho.Welcome, Jana. Hello everybody!Hi!
I'm so glad that you've decided to be our guide for all things Idaho and I wanted you to talk a little bit about what you do at TechHelp and how you can help other people from Idaho, other food makers, the kinds of services that you provide.
Yeah, so TechHelp is Idaho's Manufacturing Extension Partnership Center, or MEP for short.Every state has an MEP.So Oregon is OMEP, Oregon Manufacturing Extension Partnership Center.Washington, it's Impact Washington.Idaho is TechHelp.
Colorado is Colorado Works.And Montana is Montana Manufacturing Extension Partnership Center, MMP. And so every state has an MEP.It comes out of the Department of Commerce, out of the Hollings Grant Partnership.
And what the MEP mission is, is to just help out manufacturers in the US.And so every state has one of these MEP centers.In Idaho, we specifically also, you're supposed to help out your economic.And so Idaho is an ag economy.
So we have people that help with food manufacturing.And so that is part of my role.And we have another position that has not been filled, but we'll also have two people for the state of Idaho to help with food manufacturers.
And really what we do is to help eliminate any kind of pain points.So we offer information on how to develop your food safety plan or how to meet regulatory requirements. how to be more efficient.
Think about like lean manufacturing kind of principles, looking at the wastes and how can we decrease those?We have resources to help with cybersecurity, with website development, with your business plan, pretty much anything you can think of.
If we don't have the expertise in-house, we have third parties or we have partners that we partner with throughout the state and the nation to help manufacturers with whatever is bugging them and what we can do to help with that.
So that's what your MEPs do.And so every, like I said, every state has an MEP.They're all, if you just go search with your state and type in manufacturing extension partnership, you'll find their webpage with their contact info.
And so it's always a good idea to reach out. A lot of times your MEPs have grants, they have those resources, and they have different ways they might be able to help you get to wherever you need to get to.
Perfect.Well, I feel like that will help people in all of our six-state region because now we know where all of those offices are and who to find.So thanks, Deanna.Thanks for being here and helping us figure out all the great things about Idaho.
Yeah, no problem.Glad to be here.
And we would like to encourage you to connect with your state by signing up for the Regional Food Business Center newsletter.It's a breeze to sign up.
You just go to the Northwest Rocky Mountain Regional Food Business Center dot com, hit connect with us and choose the button to receive newsletters.And we want to thank our sponsor for supporting Sonia Marshall.
Thank you for helping us spread the word about small business owners and entrepreneurs.Let's hear a word from our sponsor.
The Northwest and Rocky Mountain Regional Food Business Center is the proud sponsor of the Meaningful Marketplace podcast, giving a voice to food from across the six state region of Colorado, Idaho, Montana, Oregon, Washington, and Wyoming.
The Food Business Center supports Northwest and Rocky Mountain food industry makers as part of the USDA's National Network of Food Business Centers.
Supporting a more resilient, diverse, and competitive food system as a go-to source for small and mid-tier food and farm businesses with a focus on underserved communities.
Providing education in the form of technical knowledge, business programs, and industry news.
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So I would like to introduce you to our guest, Savannah.She's the co-owner of Humana Hummus, making hummus in Idaho.We're delighted to have you on the show today.Thank you for having me.
And we want to connect our listeners to you and give them the best way to follow your story.Can you tell us about your social media and where to find you online?
Sure.They can find me on gethummus.com.That's our website. And that'll take you to the locations that we currently have in Idaho.It'll kind of give you that.It's a simple website, not too complicated.
And then on social media, of course, we have Instagram and Facebook, and it's all under Hamana Hummus.
Perfect. And my first question to kick off the show is do you, I just heard you say it, but you say hummus and some people say hummus and I just want to make sure I say it right.
How should I say it for the show?That's a really, that's a great question.So I'm brought up around hummus and we said hummus in my household, right?But nowadays and being in America, we, we Americanized it.
And we say it to where everyone, you know, they, they're familiar with hummus.
Right.So, so that's how we pronounce it.
Yeah.I just don't want to be insulting anyone or saying things the wrong way.So from here on out, I'm just going to say hummus and you're okay with that.
Absolutely.Oh, absolutely.
I'm going to say hummina hummus.
Hummina hummina hummina.There you go.The hummina hummina hummina.Yes.
It's perfect.It's, it makes you remember it.You kind of have to sing it, sing it every time.
Now the question is, can you spell it?
It's like Mississippi. I was looking at that, you have so many yous in your name.Yeah, that's right.
And I would probably add extra yous and extra ams, because that's what I tend to do.I make things much longer than they need to be.
It's fun, it's a mouthful for sure.
But we always like to start at the beginning.So what inspired you to start your business and when was that?
Yeah, so Sarah in 2016, we decided to give it a try.So what I was a caterer before that, so I would cater lunches, dinners, it didn't matter what type of food I was catering, whether it was what my ethnicity, I'm Armenian.
So if I was catering Armenian food, they would want hummus.If I was catering a taco bar, they still wanted my hummus.And then, you know, shortly after that, my daughter, who is my middle daughter, became very gluten intolerant.
And I wouldn't say she was celiac, but she certainly couldn't handle gluten.So I found that she was buying a lot of hummus, grocery store bought hummus, and she would bring it home.
And for something that you think you're, you know, doing your body justice, you're getting something healthy.And I looked at the ingredients and I thought, you know, I don't want her eating this all day long.
So I decided, you know what, I make hummus.Why not? turn it into a business and let's see what happens.So we took it to the farmer's market, the Boise farmer's market.
It was there that Humana Hummus was born and it was there that I learned okay I'm going to quit catering and I'm going to concentrate on this product and that's pretty much how it started.So you can thank my daughter
who had a gluten intolerance for the beginning stages of this business.And does she thank you?Is she excited that you started the business?Absolutely.Absolutely.She is one of my biggest fans, for sure.That's great.
So I see that you have quite a few different flavors of hummus.Let's jump right into the flavors.I want to know what you're doing.
Sure. So we, you know, start out with the traditional that has the really very rich spices in it, Middle Eastern spices.So my parents are, you know, born and raised in the Middle East, so I'm very familiar with those spices.
So I decided to incorporate those into the hummus.So our traditional is very flavorful.And then from there, so that was week one at the Boise Farmer's Market, by the way, we only had traditional.Okay, week two, I added a roasted garlic, right?
Week three, we created a Kalamata olive hummus, which right now is on vacation.We're no longer creating that one.
Week four, we created what we called the Sicilian, which is, of course, our base, the regular base with sun-dried tomatoes and basil mixed in and a balsamic reduction that sits on top. Week five, we added a jalapeno hummus.
And yeah, it was spicy.And then week six, we added a curry. And so we had six flavors that we were bringing to the farmer's market.And every week we found that we were selling out.I started creating up to 12 flavors.
And before I knew it, the customers would come to our booth and their eyes would get too wide.And my husband finally said, you know what, I think we need to just knock it down to six flavors and be good with it.And so that's what we did.
And in fact, now we have knocked it down to four flavors.And we're doing really well with the four.
Yeah.Sometimes when you have too many flavors, it's just a lot of packaging to manage, isn't it?
I agree.I agree.And Jana can tell you that the labels alone, the nutritional facts alone can really make me go cross-eyed anyways.I'm sure Jana is nothing to her.She can do that in her sleep.
I notice your ingredient statements are really clean, though, so you're using the lemon juice as a way to keep bacteria from growing or acidifying it a little bit?
That is correct.So we use a lot of lemon juice.We use a good amount of salt, garlic. And so we're trying to keep it as clean as possible in our production center as well.
So we start out with farm fresh garbanzo beans that are actually from Rupert, Idaho.And the farmer, it's a fascinating story.She actually decided to create a business of cooking nothing but beans.
And so she has a, I believe, don't hold me to this, but I believe it's like a 14,000 square foot plant where she cooks all the beans and that's all she does.And so we get the beans fresh off the farm, already cooked and ready to go.
And then it comes into our manufacturing plant that is a cold processing plant.So we don't do any cooking in our facility, okay? So, and we keep it super clean.We just got our FDA check and we all, we checked out.We're very excited about that.
So your cold process and you keep everything really cold.And what is your shelf life with those very careful processes you're following?
That's a great question.It's not as long as what people might be used to when they go and pick up hummus from the grocery store.It's about four to five weeks in the fridge. However, we have tested our product to freeze up to six months.
Um, so it freezes really well.And I, I, my guess, my best guess is we don't add any oils.Okay. So my guess is that's why it freezes so well.
We're going to take a quick break.And when we come back, I'd like you to talk about your choice to not use oils in your hummus.We'll be right back.
Oregon State University's College of Agricultural Sciences and the Food Innovation Center are proud sponsors of Meaningful Marketplace.
With a mission to serve all Oregonians, we are committed to giving voice to those whose food and agricultural stories are not always heard.
by providing access and opportunity for a more diverse and just food system because food brings people together.All right, we're back.Tell us why you don't put any oil in your hummus.
Well, we feel that if there is the right amount, a ratio of ingredients, there really isn't a need to put oil in the hummus.And oil, you know, nowadays, people are so particular about the type of oils that they use.
And so we just figured if somebody wants to add oil, just put it on top.Saute some pine nuts, put it on top of the hummus, top it.But to put it inside of the hummus, like I said, my parents are born and raised in the Middle East.
I was taught not to put oil inside, rather to use it as a topping.Again, if you have the correct ratio of ingredients, there really isn't a need.You're gonna get that smooth texture without the oil.
I think that's really great too, because it gives people a greater avenue of ways to use it.It probably, I would guess, does make your shelf life a little bit better to not have the oil in there, don't you think?
Because sometimes oil, once you buy it, if you're buying things in bulk, a lot of times the oil I feel like that you buy is rancid already by the time you get it, if you get it from a food processing plant.
You know, I never thought of that.I always assumed it was kind of the opposite.If you put oil, maybe it lasts longer.Jana could probably speak to that a lot better than I can.But I also believe that oil is a texture.
It creates a certain texture that people might be looking for.And it also might serve as a filler as well. So, but you know, we just find that we don't need to use it in our product.
I know sometimes when I go and taste things with Sarah Missoni, she'll taste it and she'll be like, their oil's gone rancid.Yeah.She knows right away.Yeah.
And sometimes when you eat hummus it tastes like whipped oil, I'll be honest.
Yeah, I mean not to be mean to canola oil, but canola oil is an oil that people use in food processing a lot and it kind of has like this canola oil sort of, sorry canola oil, fishy taste.
It just isn't a Mediterranean flavor.I agree with you.I think the crushed sesame, the tahini is actually giving you the little bit of fat you need to make it taste great.
Do you still have your spicy curry flavor?That is also on vacation right now.So the Kalamata olive and curry, they're just on a little sabbatical.They may be back.
Well, it of course piqued my interest because I want to try anything spicy.I'll stick with your jalapeno.That seems like where I'd be happiest.
That sounds good. So you have a list of places to buy the product.Some of our listeners might want to order it.Can they order it directly from you?
You know, ordering hummus is a tricky thing because of the stability of it.It's not shelf stable.So yes, they can, you know, to give you a short answer.Yes, they can order directly from us.They can reach out to us.It depends on
where they live, how long it's gonna take.So what we would do is we would freeze the product, then pack it really well with ice packs and ship it that way.But it's expensive, I'll be honest.
If, you know, locals, lucky locals, they can just come and pick it up.
Yeah, I noticed that you have a lot of distribution in Idaho.So are you delivering it yourselves?Tell us a little bit about how you started and how you're distributing products now.
Gosh, yes, we used to deliver it ourselves and that was very time-consuming.
And careers out of the back of your car or how did you do that?
No, we bought a reefer, a very old reefer truck that worked well for a long time.And I would drive it from store to store, drop it off, drop off the product, shelf the product myself.
And then eventually we got connected with a distributor that would handle all of that for us.So honestly, I would not go back to delivering myself.That was quite difficult.
That's a whole different business, isn't it?I do have a question for you.So you're in Idaho, it looks like you're in Albertsons.
We are in two Albertsons here in Idaho.
They talked to you about the changes in the store structure of who owns who and all that stuff.Have they let you know anything about that?
I personally don't know.You know, I honestly haven't felt any of the changes yet.So no, I haven't heard anything that will be coming down the pike as of now.But I know I know that changes are taking place.I'm not sure what that's going to look like.
I don't think anybody's heard much either.
Well, I think we're going to be shopping at Piggly Wiggly in my neighborhood.
Oh, is that what it's turning into?
Rhianna, do you know anything about it?
There's still a lot of court cases where it's not being allowed.So I don't know that there is so much that they can put out publicly. because several states have sued to stop it, including Washington and Idaho.
I wish Oregon was, because I went in my, not to change the subject, but I went into our local Safeway and there were all these people dressed in black, like going through and counting all the items on the shelves.It was really weird.
Wow.Wow.Yeah, because Safeway was owned by Kroger before.
They probably just have to do an inventory to like do the bill of sale or whatever.
That's a really sad subject.Let's change it to something more happy.
Let's talk about something more fun, Sarah.
I know.Sorry.So tell us, where is your favorite place to serve your hummuses?Do you take them to parties with friends and family?Does everyone say bring your hummus?
Oh, absolutely.I made the mistake of not bringing it one time and it was like the whole world, the whole party was just like, what?How is this possible?The hummus lady didn't bring hummus.
But no, my favorite place I would say to serve it is honestly the farmer's market because I get to experience real truth and honesty from the customers.They don't hold back and I think that's really healthy for me to hear honest feedback.
And then it's, of course, always nice to hear the kudos as well that they can give.And I love that, you know, the beginning stages of starting at the farmer's market and then turning it into something where we can go into wholesale after that.
So I think the farmer's market is a great, great tool.And that's how we started.So it's always good to go back.
Do you also give people spoons in case they want to just eat it right there?
I have had customers ask for a spoon to take with them, yes.
So I have a question about other items that you've thought about to sell along with the hummus.Do you have any other ideas like pita chips or carrot sticks or things like that that you might add to your product line?
I do not, not right now.And part of the reason is because we're keeping our manufacturing plant gluten-free. and dairy-free and meat-free.So we're trying to keep it where we don't have any cross-contamination happening with our product.
We have great bread producers here in Idaho, so I do refer them to those local producers if anyone asks.
You brought up your manufacturing facility and it sounded to me like maybe you were running your catering business out of somewhere and then you started doing the hummus there instead.
So were you able to just keep your same space and transfer it over or did you move spaces?
Oh gosh, no, we've moved so many times.So here's how we started.When we decided to initially go to the farmer's market, we started in the back of a coffee shop in their little kitchen.
Okay, so I went to the owner of this coffee shop, and I said, hey, any chance you can rent me the kitchen, you know, after hours?And he said, well, what do you do?I said, well, I'm thinking about making my hummus.And he said, anything else?
And I said, well, I was a caterer before that.He goes, okay, I'll tell you what.He said, you come here, you bake my baked goods for my coffee shop, and I will give you a key to my kitchen.You come after hours and produce your hummus.
So that's what we did.We prayed it. And so my husband and I would go in 9 o'clock at night when they would shut down, we would be there until 2.30, 3 o'clock in the morning, just creating hummus.And that's how it started.
Then we went into a commissary kitchen.Probably four commissary kitchens later, we ended up at the University of Idaho Food Technology Center. And this is where we met Yana and what she does.And this is where I started learning about food safety.
So if you're in a commissary kitchen, there's really nothing safe about taking place over there.
I was just talking with somebody this morning about shared use kitchens and having to be really careful if you have something that's very sensitive.
Exactly.And I've always known how sensitive my product is, but you can't be safe enough.And when you're in a commissary kitchen, it's rough.So going into the University of Idaho Food Tech Center, they taught me how to keep my products safe.
And that's basically, you know, after the Food Tech Center, which kind of acts as an incubator, if you will, for businesses like mine, we finally got into our own plant, manufacturing plant.
You know, it's so nice to be able to go and produce whenever we want, number one.Number two, we know that the environment of that plant is gonna be consistent.Whether it's the temperature, everything plays a part in the food safety of our product.
So we're just really careful and really, for lack of better words, really anal about it.
How many tubs can you produce a day at your processing facility?
We can produce, gosh, in one day, we could produce well over 2,500 in a day.That's great.And so, you know, it's a matter of space as well.So I actually wish I was at my plant right now so I can give you a tour, but maybe that's for another time.
We'll have to come and visit you.
Absolutely, you're welcome to.
And Sarah and Jana, you are our food safety experts here.So when you see and hear about new businesses, starting a business, do you have any like food safety tips for people in general?
It doesn't have to be hummus related, just people with food products.What are things you want people to know?
Well, for me, depending on the type of product, I always talk about the three safety hurdles that are that we try and build into foods.One is pH.So we look at is the food acidified.
And once we add acid into the food, we create a hurdle to the bacteria that can't grow over a certain pH.And in this case, it's usually 4.2.So we say, hey, if you get this food product below 4.2, you'll really extend your shelf life.
In the case of the hummus, you're using lemon juice, but if you use lemon juice concentrate, you could probably have a little bit longer shelf life.
because for the amount you're putting in you'll be adding additional acid and it'll be the same amount of acid every time.So that's something to explore.Then the other thing that we look at is water activity.
So how much moisture is available for bacteria to grow?And in most cases for water activity to be a hurdle we're looking at water activity of below 0.84, but I always say 0.8, so that we don't get staph aureus growing.
And then we use a refractometer, which measures the percentage of sucrose.And the types of products where we look at BRICS, which is the refractometer, are jams and jellies and sauces where you're adding sugar.So kind of
Those are the three things, and then you can use them in combination.And maybe Yana can tell us how she thinks about the three hurdles.
So we, you know, as far as a food industry, there's a wide variety of kinds of food and the hazards associated with it.And so we always try to get people to start thinking about their HACCP plan or their food safety plan.
And we want to talk about biological, chemical, and physical and at least have an understanding of what all would be a micro concern, what all chemical, you know, it's amazing allergens.
People just don't think about allergens and how that can impact.And that's, that's a class one recall.If you have undeclared allergens or something or a cross contact situation.
Physical is usually a little easier for people to wrap their heads around, because you think about plastic and metal and rubber and things like that.And most people can figure that one out.
But we do try to get them talking about those three hazard categories and figuring out what is their product susceptible?Is it a high risk, medium risk, low risk?Where are they getting their ingredients from?Another issue that we kind of run into,
you know, is a lot of people will just buy ingredients from a local grocery store or something like that.And so they don't fully understand the difference between processing and ready to eat and raw and how that all interchanges.
So the food safety journey is, as Savannah can talk to you about, it's not an easy journey, but you've got to get it managed.If you're going to make a food product, you got to figure out your food safety characteristics.
It's not like you're making widgets or t-shirts.
Yeah, you're liable as a manufacturer.
Good point.To Jana's point, to know where your ingredients are coming from is also very important.The traceability.
So we have the Western Region, I always say it interesting, it's called the Western Regional Center for Food Safety, I think it is. It's housed in the Food Innovation Center, but they have a great website.
Anyone who has questions about food safety, they have a ton of information there.People from all over the world go to that website to learn about the requirements of food safety for their food product.
But we always said in production, safety is number one.There's two kinds of safety.There's safety of the human, make sure people don't get hurt.And then there's safety of the food.And that's typically talked about in quality.
And then third is production.So those are the three top things that a food manufacturer has to think about.
Well, we're glad that you found a nice new facility to be in where you can control all of the safety and things that happen.That's really wonderful.I've been in shared use kitchen spaces before and it's hard.
It's a great stepping stone.We do love our shared use kitchens.The way that our food systems are really building from rural economies have changed because of shared use kitchens.They've really changed the way that food comes to our table.
Yeah, I think it's a really nice way for people to transition.But I think after you're in them for a while, you do kind of want to have control over your own stuff, especially when you're putting out a lot more of it.I think it's just really nice.
So it's nice that you found a great new space.And so then you make all those products, you make sure that they're safe, and then you take them to your local markets and farmer's market.How big is the Boise farmer's market?I haven't ever been there.
The Boise farmers market is unique, number one.As far as how big, I believe we have about 80 to 90 vendors, if I'm not mistaken.And what makes it so unique is that we cater to the farmer.Okay, it's really about the farmers.
Whereas I've been to other farmer markets and it's really not about the farmer, you know.So that's what I love about the Boise Farmer's Market.And they try to encourage every vendor that sells there to use local ingredients from local farmers.
So that's what makes it really unique.But I believe we get about 6,000 to 7,000 customers walking through the farmer's market every Saturday.
Yeah, that's great, that's a pretty large size market.
Yeah, if you sell the 10% of them, you'll be selling to 600 people.
Yeah, that's wonderful, that's so great.And we love farmers markets that encourage people to buy from their farmers.I think that when you were talking about your beans coming directly from someone in Idaho and having them already cooked,
I haven't ever heard of that before.I don't think there's anybody that does that here in Oregon.So that makes your product very unique and hyper local, which is super rad.
Yes.And also again, going back to food safety, they're handling the cooking and the cooling process and they are regulated.And so I don't have to worry about that end of it, right? So, to me, I agree.Number one is food safety.
And that should be on everyone's list.And of course, it depends on what you're making.So, I do agree with you that commissary kitchens are a wonderful tool.
But if you don't have another kill step to your product, end customer, if the end user is not going, they're going to take your product and they're just going to open it and eat it right away.There's no kill step.
Then those of us who are producing food like that have to be ultra careful.
So I encourage anyone who's out there listening to this that if they're thinking about creating a dip or something to where there's no further kill step, no microwaving, no cooking, I encourage them to really look into maybe finding a facility like the University of Idaho, the Food Technology Center, where they can learn truly how to keep food safe.
Yeah.I think that's great advice.And unfortunately everyone, you know, I hate this part of the show, but we do have to end today.We're on a tight schedule.
So we, I want to thank you for joining us today and thank our listeners for tuning into the show.Can you tell one more time where people can get your hummus so they can buy it directly from you?
Absolutely.They can go to gethummus.com and hummus is spelled with two Ms.So gethummus.com.
Perfect.Well, it was great to meet you and hear all about your company and your product, and I hope that you keep on pumping out that hummus.
Thank you so much.Nice to meet you, Sarah and Sarah, and nice to see you again, Jana.
We record Meaningful Marketplace live every week, and you can find us on your favorite podcast platforms like iTunes, Spotify, and now on YouTube.We would like to thank our team at the Joy of Creation Production House.
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