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Episode: "Alicia Keys"

Author: Jason Bateman, Sean Hayes, Will Arnett
Duration: 01:05:59

Episode Shownotes

Listener, if you please: it’s Alicia Keys. Stride piano, a concrete jungle, the audacity to write a song, a double negative, and a double positive. “That’s the vibe right there…” on an all-new SmartLess. Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ on Apple Podcasts to listen to new episodes ad-free and a whole

week early.

Summary

In this episode of 'SmartLess,' hosts Jason Bateman, Sean Hayes, and Will Arnett engage in a delightful conversation with Alicia Keys, exploring her remarkable music career, including her 16 Grammy Awards and the Broadway show 'Hell's Kitchen.' Keys reflects on her New York upbringing, her musical influences such as stride piano and jazz, her songwriting process, and the emotional significance of her hit song 'Empire State of Mind.' The dialogue seamlessly weaves humor with insights into the challenges of performance, the importance of emotional connection in storytelling, and the broader artistic evolution within contemporary music and theater.

Go to PodExtra AI's episode page ("Alicia Keys") to play and view complete AI-processed content: summary, mindmap, topics, takeaways, transcript, keywords and highlights.

Full Transcript

00:00:04 Speaker_02
Hey, guys, so I go back home tomorrow to Los Angeles. I've been in New York for quite some time. I've really missed my dog, Ricky. I haven't seen him in... Sorry.

00:00:17 Speaker_01
In a while. Sorry. Sorry. And I'm really excited. Sorry. Really excited to see... Really excited to see him! Does it not sound like I'm crying? Should it sound like I'm crying more? No, it was great. Welcome to the New Smart List.

00:00:56 Speaker_03
What is that, like, peanut butter toast?

00:00:58 Speaker_02
Rice Krispie treat.

00:01:00 Speaker_03
So, dessert.

00:01:01 Speaker_04
Wait, wait, wait, wait.

00:01:03 Speaker_03
It's 15 minutes shy of 10 a.m. and you're eating dessert. Well, it's my breakfast, really.

00:01:11 Speaker_04
Okay. I mean, Rice Krispies are a breakfast cereal, but when they're baked with marshmallows, I guess it kind of takes away... And chase it with some cow pus. That's what I... So, walk me through just a little bit.

00:01:26 Speaker_04
Walk me through this morning, because you've been out of town for a minute, and you came home and there was a fresh pan of Rice Krispie Treats?

00:01:34 Speaker_02
Oh, my God. Yeah, there was, actually. Did you make it? No, I didn't make it. Somebody else made it. But it was there.

00:01:43 Speaker_04
Was it a request, or did you say, hey, when I get home, I want a full pan of Rice Krispie Treats ready to go?

00:01:48 Speaker_02
No, there is a person that I know that That was what I like.

00:01:52 Speaker_03
When you say no, do you mean to say paid? Maybe just a little bit.

00:01:57 Speaker_04
Is this a good friend who just does it out of the goodness of their heart?

00:02:00 Speaker_03
Do you doctor up the Rice Krispies? Some people like to drop M&M's in there.

00:02:04 Speaker_02
Oh, M&M's are great. No, this is done regular. It's like breakfast, though.

00:02:09 Speaker_03
Except for the marshmallows. Will mentioned a really good point. There's no difference between this and this.

00:02:17 Speaker_02
this in the milk.

00:02:18 Speaker_03
Except for the melted down marshmallows into a glue situation. Yeah, a little bit. All right. Yeah. Well, we got through that. Well, should we start the recast process? I don't know how much longer we're going to have Sean with us, you know?

00:02:32 Speaker_02
What a wonderful ride home we had together. What a wonderful time spent we had in New York together.

00:02:36 Speaker_04
We did have a nice time in New York. It was so fun. We got to see our friend Robert's play, which was amazing. Yeah, McNeil. It's called McNeil.

00:02:45 Speaker_03
Go see it at Lincoln Center. Yeah, it's really good.

00:02:47 Speaker_04
Robert was so good. Robert Downey was so good in that play.

00:02:52 Speaker_03
Yeah.

00:02:53 Speaker_04
How cool was that to go there and see him do that, just excel and be... It was a lot of work.

00:02:59 Speaker_03
It was very admirable to see. Oh, anything on stage is just nuts. Sean, you should try going on stage somewhere. You'd be showing people what you can do. I think you do.

00:03:11 Speaker_01
I eat some Rice Krispies if I go on stage.

00:03:13 Speaker_03
If your colon lasts long enough to book some sort of a Broadway gig... Has anybody ever done a Broadway show wearing a diaper, do you know?

00:03:22 Speaker_04
Hey, Sean, you know, I will say one of the things I enjoyed about going that night was before and afterwards with a very sort of New York theater crowd, seeing how many people you know in the community. Yeah, it was really fun.

00:03:36 Speaker_02
Oh, thanks, man. Yeah, it was, um, it's good to see all those people. It's just like, you know, just like this coast. Everybody knows everybody, you know.

00:03:43 Speaker_03
I really want so badly to do that, to do something on stage.

00:03:48 Speaker_02
Well, you better be careful, because somebody's going to hear that.

00:03:52 Speaker_03
No, I'm screaming it. I just don't know when the time would be the best time, the right time with the kids and the other stuff that I'm working on.

00:04:04 Speaker_04
It's a full... I almost, as you know, I almost pulled the trigger this fall to do something.

00:04:08 Speaker_03
But you've done a bunch in the past, right?

00:04:11 Speaker_04
Yeah, but not on Broadway. Off-Broadway. But some New York theater, yeah. Yeah, but I mean, god damn, a million goddamn years ago. But I really was like... You know what, Sean, I was inspired by you and how great you were. Oh, you're very sweet.

00:04:26 Speaker_04
And it's true. And I thought, God, that really looks like a lot of fun, and seeing Robert do it looks like a lot of fun, but I... It's you have no life.

00:04:34 Speaker_02
You literally go from the apartment to your theater.

00:04:36 Speaker_03
But that's part of the thing that appeals to me, too, is like, you know, New York City's one of my favorite places in the whole world.

00:04:42 Speaker_03
I've always wanted to live there, but I worry that if I just picked up and moved there, I would be like, well, okay, what do I do all day?

00:04:49 Speaker_03
You know, because as an actor or a director or whatever, you know, before you're working, you're not doing anything. Right, you have to.

00:04:55 Speaker_03
And doing a play would give me rehearsals all day, and then once the rehearsals are done, now I've got something to do at night, and then filling a day is, you know, rest.

00:05:05 Speaker_04
And I think a lot of the day, Sean, it feels like a lot of the day, and correct me if I'm wrong, is...

00:05:10 Speaker_02
taking care of your health. Yeah, it's PT, physical therapy, because you're like, what do you mean? I got it. But it's, it's the repetitive motions, day after day, every single day of like, repetitive. That's why, and the play.

00:05:20 Speaker_02
Pizza from off the plate into mouth, off the plate into mouth. Rice crisper. Shoulders. But in the play, in Robert's play,

00:05:28 Speaker_02
If you remember, there's this one moment where the guy playing his son pushes him on the couch, and the first thing I thought of was, oh my God, his leg must be killing him because his leg hits the arm of the couch and he falls on the couch.

00:05:41 Speaker_02
Falling on the couch isn't horrible because you get cushion, but when his leg hits the couch, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, twice on Thursday, Friday, and then twice on Saturday, you have to go get that PT, a physical therapy.

00:05:52 Speaker_02
Figure out how to, or wear like a- You think he's wearing a pad? Pad or something. Yeah.

00:05:57 Speaker_03
The people with incredibly admirable true labor situations, they want to come through the microphone and blow your brains out. Oh, is he banging his leg on a couch once a night? They're like, these fucking clowns.

00:06:19 Speaker_03
These guys building buildings or fighting wars.

00:06:22 Speaker_02
I know, totally, I get it. I'm just in our little, you know, privileged world.

00:06:28 Speaker_04
How many of our listeners are operating a jackhammer while they're listening to us?

00:06:33 Speaker_02
By the way, I got home from New York to, you know, to our house here in LA, and I forgot that I stopped using a sheet under the under the big comforter. Yeah, under the comforter. And it's great. Like, yeah. Yeah.

00:06:47 Speaker_02
So I have you guys, do you guys still sleep with a sheet and then a duvet? No. Yeah. I can't do it. It gets in your legs and you get tangled.

00:06:54 Speaker_03
I go one better. I go one better. Amanda and I have two separate duvets so that there's no, Midnight, mid-dash night fighting over the duvet. I can cocoon myself, she can cocoon her. You can knock on the door and enter her cocoon if it's a special night.

00:07:14 Speaker_04
That's how the kids are made. You ask to enter her cocoon.

00:07:17 Speaker_03
Knock, knock, cocoon, enter. You're very traditional that way. Permission to board. Well, it's permission to board is the language she prefers. And then flutter in like a butterfly. Permission to board.

00:07:31 Speaker_02
I'm sorry, you're in the back tonight. Wow.

00:07:34 Speaker_04
Wow.

00:07:35 Speaker_02
That's really funny.

00:07:37 Speaker_04
I stole that trick from you, JB, with the separate duvets. It's very helpful. Works, right? Yeah.

00:07:42 Speaker_02
Oh, God, it's so good. But don't you agree that the sheet you get tangled up in... That's nonsense.

00:07:47 Speaker_03
I don't get it. It's not the classiest transition into our classy guest, but it's gonna have to do. Gang, what is an impressive number of Grammys to win? Sean, you go first. Any more than one. Will?

00:08:09 Speaker_04
Yeah, I would say one is very impressive, one is amazing, but two, like more than one. Right, it wasn't a fluke.

00:08:18 Speaker_03
No, no, exactly. Yeah, correct. Exactly. Well, three would definitely... I feel like you're going to go higher. I feel like you're going to go higher. What would 8 do for you? That would be impressive.

00:08:28 Speaker_04
That's a bounty.

00:08:29 Speaker_03
Right. If you doubled that, it would be outrageous, right? So that's what she's gone and done. She's won 16 Grammy Awards. What? She's also a best-selling author, New York Times list. She's a producer of film and television and Broadway.

00:08:45 Speaker_03
She's an entrepreneur, a force in the world of activism. She has sold over 65 million records and has had over 5 billion streams. What?

00:08:55 Speaker_03
We can talk about her music, her skincare line, her art collection, or her new Broadway hit, which has received 13 Tony nominations. I've seen it. It's incredible. Please welcome the one and only Alicia Keys. Oh my God.

00:09:10 Speaker_01
Hey. That was good vibes. This is amazing.

00:09:15 Speaker_03
That's a very impressive intro. I didn't embellish any of it.

00:09:20 Speaker_02
Wow. Hi. Oh my God. It's so nice to meet you.

00:09:23 Speaker_00
I'm so happy to see you.

00:09:25 Speaker_02
Jason texted me or emailed me like a couple months ago or I don't know, three or four months. He was like, You're the Broadway king or queen?

00:09:33 Speaker_03
No, I think I said queen.

00:09:36 Speaker_02
Tell me what show to see, and I told him to see your show.

00:09:39 Speaker_00
Yes, you're coming to see Hell's Kitchen?

00:09:41 Speaker_03
Oh my God, was it good. My goodness. I went with my 17-year-old daughter, and we lost our mind.

00:09:47 Speaker_00
That's the vibe right there.

00:09:48 Speaker_03
So damn good. Remind me, I apologize, I should know this. The actor that plays you, or the version of you, she was just stunning.

00:09:59 Speaker_00
She's amazing. Her name is Malia Joy Moon. She's just turned 22. This is her very first kind of foray into this world and she's the protagonist of Hell's Kitchen named Allie. So it's awesome.

00:10:15 Speaker_02
What is that like?

00:10:16 Speaker_02
I mean, the most obvious dumb answer opener, I mean, dumb question, sorry, is what is that like to have gone through that process to go, wow, this phenomenal talent is singing my songs and like playing a version of me-ish kind of, but what was that like?

00:10:35 Speaker_02
That must be crazy.

00:10:36 Speaker_00
Right, so Hell's Kitchen is definitely, it's not autobiographical, but it is based on my experiences growing up in New York.

00:10:42 Speaker_00
And so finding that power, that girl, that young woman who's on the precipice of kind of, you know, finding who she is and rebelling against all the people that want to confine her and keep her safe in a box and all those things, and especially based in New York in the 90s,

00:11:00 Speaker_00
it definitely required a certain energy. And that was actually really tricky to find, because, you know, you can't act certain things, you know?

00:11:09 Speaker_03
Yeah, she did have this intangible sort of swagger and comfort in her skin and this presence that was just magnetic from the very start, you know? And she just took you the whole way through it, as did the rest of the cast.

00:11:23 Speaker_02
Yeah, it's gonna be hard to find that person. I mean, yeah.

00:11:27 Speaker_00
You know, it definitely, you know, we workshopped, we developed this piece for 13 years, so it definitely took quite a long time. But I think that the coolest part is really, you know, when you do find those spirits and that energy.

00:11:43 Speaker_00
Same with the mom who plays Jersey, Shoshana Bean, who is just like, she's exploding your brain. You can't even. So it's thrilling.

00:11:56 Speaker_03
I would imagine that maybe at the beginning, 13 years ago, you might humbly say that you're not young enough to play that part right now, but I would disagree with you.

00:12:05 Speaker_03
But certainly 13 years ago, it must have been a conversation at some point that you might play that part, maybe?

00:12:12 Speaker_00
You know, I really... I didn't plan to play the part. I mean, maybe there was conversations at times, or maybe it would be like we could do some fun limited moment of it or something.

00:12:27 Speaker_00
But I realized that it really is so, it's so cool to be able to just come to the theater, watch the show, you know what I mean? Like not have to deliver.

00:12:36 Speaker_02
It's a lot less work to watch it than to be in it.

00:12:39 Speaker_03
Am I remembering correctly that you did perform with them at the Tonys?

00:12:44 Speaker_00
I did. I did. I did, you know, just harvest the New York energy for the moment.

00:12:49 Speaker_03
That must have been exciting to be on stage with them and do some of that stuff.

00:12:55 Speaker_00
And that was my first Tony's ever, you know, so that was a unique experience. Super cool. That's great.

00:13:02 Speaker_03
Have you done a musical or a play or anything as an actor?

00:13:06 Speaker_00
As an actor, I have not. As a producer, I did a play called Stick Fly, which was one of the most, written by Lydia Diamond. It was one of the most unique, incredible pieces about a family, a black family in Martha's Vineyard. And it was stunning.

00:13:23 Speaker_00
It was really, really unique. That was one of the first ones. But this would be my first musical.

00:13:29 Speaker_03
Would you, do you have any design, like what we were talking about earlier, um, to, to go on stage and, and, and do a play as either as an actor or, or a dancer singer, you know, in a musical?

00:13:39 Speaker_00
You know, I have to say that I have the utmost respect for these artists. I think that artists in musicals are by far the most talented. You have to be a triple threat at all times. You have to deliver every single part of it.

00:13:57 Speaker_00
I don't know if I would have that stamina and that capacity, to be honest.

00:14:01 Speaker_03
You seem kind of limited in what you can do. Good for you for knowing your ceiling.

00:14:07 Speaker_04
No, but I was just talking about, like, we were talking about it before you came on, Alicia, that this, the stamina of it, you hit it, which is, the stamina of it, not just going and being amazing, performing and singing and doing all that, but doing it night after night, it's mind-blowing to me.

00:14:24 Speaker_02
Yeah, but you do it, Alicia, when you go on tour.

00:14:26 Speaker_00
You do it on tour, yeah.

00:14:28 Speaker_02
It's kind of like a...

00:14:29 Speaker_00
It's totally like tour, for sure, and tour is hard. Tour is not eight nights a week, eight shows a week. This is true. Or nine shows a week. It's not. You know, I'm probably doing five shows a week, maximum.

00:14:42 Speaker_01
Yeah, but still.

00:14:44 Speaker_00
But I definitely, and I think that's what, as the lead producer of the show, and also just the, I think me having that experience is definitely

00:14:52 Speaker_00
different for them because they know that I do understand the rigor and the power and the energy it takes to harness to bring that together. So they definitely feel like understood by me and I totally understand it.

00:15:06 Speaker_00
So, but it's, it's incredible watching them work. And, and so yes, could I do it? Yes, I could do it. But I actually haven't, I haven't done it yet.

00:15:14 Speaker_03
Right, well, maybe you and I'll do a two-hander. I'll find something we can work together. This is a great, this is, we're making news. Yeah, we're making news today. We're gonna do it together.

00:15:24 Speaker_03
All right, so Alicia, so now, speaking of that, of Hell's Kitchen, is the part you say it's loosely based on your upbringing or inspired by. Tell me about the early part of that story with the influence of the mentor and the piano playing.

00:15:51 Speaker_03
How did you find the piano? Is that true to story there? Take me through that start of the musical sort of, fascination for you. Music fascination, sorry.

00:16:04 Speaker_00
Okay, just music fascination for me, separate of the musical.

00:16:08 Speaker_03
Correct, correct.

00:16:09 Speaker_00
Okay.

00:16:09 Speaker_03
How'd you start playing music?

00:16:11 Speaker_00
Right, how did I start? Thank you for a direct question.

00:16:14 Speaker_03
Yeah, I do tend to flower. How did you do music first?

00:16:21 Speaker_00
Well, I guess I started playing piano around six or seven years old.

00:16:28 Speaker_04
Were people playing piano at home? Were your mom and dad super into it?

00:16:32 Speaker_00
No, they weren't. I was raised by my mother. She was definitely an artist, but not necessarily a musician.

00:16:40 Speaker_00
My grandmother, her mother, did play piano, so I do remember when she would come watch me when my mother would have to go out of town for work or whatever. She would play the piano if we visited her. And they grew up in Toledo, Ohio.

00:16:54 Speaker_00
So if we went to Ohio to visit grandma, she definitely would play piano. So she was a person who played piano in my life. But the obsession with piano felt kind of natural. I was drawn to it in this very natural way.

00:17:11 Speaker_00
I would pass the Steinway store on 57th Street. nose to the window. Really?

00:17:18 Speaker_04
I love that. I love that story, too, and I don't even play piano, and I've always been fascinated with that story.

00:17:22 Speaker_00
Yeah, I love it, too.

00:17:23 Speaker_04
But did you sit down, and so you started taking lessons, you were, how old did you say you were? Like, you were little?

00:17:28 Speaker_00
Six or seven.

00:17:30 Speaker_04
So did you sit down and were you like, yeah, I get this. Like, they're like, this is this, and you're like, yeah, I kind of got this.

00:17:36 Speaker_00
It was definitely not as, learning an instrument is not natural. It's difficult, you know.

00:17:44 Speaker_00
It's not, and especially as a young person and you're kind of trying to find your focus and how do you like put it all together and the ambidextrous, you know, using both hands at the same time, two different things.

00:17:55 Speaker_00
I remember when I first started playing Bach, who's one of my favorite composers, Bach, I just, I love the way like the right hand will take it and then the left hand will grab it.

00:18:05 Speaker_00
I'm righty, so my left hand is not as strong as my right hand, so the practice that it would take to kind of be able to find the fluidity was really, really hard.

00:18:14 Speaker_00
So I definitely didn't remember being just like, oh, poof, I can play anything at any time.

00:18:20 Speaker_02
But how about the Bach impromptus and the fugues where, like you're saying, all cylinders have to be firing with the left, but the right is trained.

00:18:30 Speaker_02
It's easier to play the right because the right always plays the melody and the left is the foundation, the bass. So there's very few composers that write as intricately as Bach for the left hand. So it kind of screws with your mind.

00:18:42 Speaker_02
That's why I look at a drummer and I'm like, okay, I thought playing piano was hard. All limbs going all the time. Like, I don't understand that.

00:18:51 Speaker_04
And independent of one another.

00:18:53 Speaker_04
There's a drummer, I don't want to just sidebar, there's this drummer, I swear to God, he's a Spanish drummer and his name is like, Estapio or something, he's made his name for himself, he's become quite big on Instagram. Oh, I know this guy.

00:19:04 Speaker_04
Do you know that guy? Yes, yes. He's the most incredible drummer. Alicia, you can't believe this guy, what he can do. It's unbelievable.

00:19:12 Speaker_03
Send me one of those, because I love drumming. Oh, I will.

00:19:16 Speaker_04
And there are people out there who have Instagram accounts that are almost based solely on watching him play on his Instagram account. And then they just spend... There are drummers who are going like, -"What the hell is this guy doing?"

00:19:28 Speaker_01
-"How did he do this?"

00:19:29 Speaker_04
And he's like, no, it's really easy, everybody. And he does this, and then all of a sudden the left leg... And then he's got like a triple bass pedal sometimes going at the same time, like it's... Anyway.

00:19:38 Speaker_04
But so you learn... So you're learning that stuff, like you're... And then... But there's a moment where, what, it just hits you?

00:19:48 Speaker_02
Yeah, one of the crossover from classical, like, when we were kids, we all kind of took those classical piano lessons.

00:19:54 Speaker_00
Right, that's true.

00:19:55 Speaker_02
I stayed on that path for many, many years, and you went, wait a minute, what's this? This isn't classical, this is much cooler.

00:20:03 Speaker_00
I think that, well, at first I started to really discover, I discovered jazz and, like, unique, I really discovered stride piano, and that was actually really cool for me. Scott Joplin. What's that, stride? It's like...

00:20:22 Speaker_00
And so the way you play is like, it's a lot of jumping, and striding, and you're doing... So it's a whole other way.

00:20:30 Speaker_04
It almost sounds like boogie-woogie, like a little bit. You know what I mean?

00:20:34 Speaker_00
It's the beginnings of it, for sure. Because it was like the 20s, and you know. And so it's really cool, and I remember my piano teacher used to make me play it.

00:20:43 Speaker_00
blindfolded, and she was really trying to make sure that I could get out of, like, trying to look and just try to find it. And it was terrifying. I was like, I can't.

00:20:53 Speaker_04
How can I reach?

00:20:54 Speaker_00
You're like Luke Skywalker, right? What can I... And she was big on, like, never apologize. Oh, I'm sorry. I messed up. Don't apologize. Do not apologize.

00:21:03 Speaker_02
And if I made a mistake, she's like, I would go back. She's like, never go back. Just keep going forward, right? Don't acknowledge the... The mistake.

00:21:10 Speaker_00
Just go. And I think that taught me a lot. I think that taught me a lot to just, like, just keep rolling. Just keep trying to find your way through it.

00:21:16 Speaker_03
A great life lesson.

00:21:18 Speaker_00
Didn't always work, but just try to keep going. Yeah.

00:21:23 Speaker_05
We'll be right back. And back to the show.

00:21:31 Speaker_04
So you end up going, what, through high school?

00:21:33 Speaker_00
Did you go to like a performance arts type school? I did. I went to a performance arts junior high school, like 7, 8, 9, and then all the way through high school, professional performing arts school.

00:21:43 Speaker_00
It was like a small version of the FAME school, so that was cool. Nice. But there, it was more music. It was more vocal, singing, arranging. And that's where I met my teacher, Miss Aziza, who actually

00:21:59 Speaker_00
The character of Miss Liza Jane in Hell's Kitchen is based, is inspired by Mrs. Ziza, that teacher, and my grandmother, kind of a mixture of the two of them.

00:22:10 Speaker_00
And I met her there, and she was a big influence just on kind of like arranging and singing and harmonizing and creating and producing as a woman. And also when I put my eyes on Nina Simone, she was a woman that truly like just blew my mind.

00:22:23 Speaker_00
I was like, oh. She's great. Oh, this is crazy. And that was the mixture of classical and R&B and soul and blues. And that's where I started realizing, oh, you can merge and fuse these sounds.

00:22:37 Speaker_00
And then hip hop was a big inspiration for me just on the streets of New York. So it all kind of came together.

00:22:43 Speaker_03
It's such an exciting sound. We hope it works out for you. Thank you. Is that woman that was your mentor there at the performing arts school, is she still with us?

00:22:54 Speaker_00
Yes, and believe it or not, she plays piano for the Miss Liza Jane character in Hell's Kitchen. Oh, my God, no way. For real. That's so cool. It's insane. It's so cool. How cool is that?

00:23:07 Speaker_03
That was going to be my question, like, did she get to see any of your success? So she's still here with us and is a part of it.

00:23:14 Speaker_00
It's a blessing.

00:23:15 Speaker_03
How rewarding is that?

00:23:17 Speaker_00
Very, very. I mean, when that was a conversation, and you know how on Broadway, it's like quite,

00:23:23 Speaker_00
Like all industries, it's quite institutionalized, and there's kind of a way that things go with the thing, and you hire the people that are always hired in the thing, and you do the thing that's always done in the thing, and so it was really a big thing.

00:23:36 Speaker_00
really a big part of it and I think everything is evolving now to really start to break through those traditions that are now ready to evolve and so to really bring people into the mix that maybe aren't normally in it really creates just another energy and I think you feel it.

00:23:54 Speaker_03
It is an interesting medium, right? Talking more about theater and Broadway specifically, the backbone of it is supported by the folks that have been going there for years and years and years, the subscription audience.

00:24:09 Speaker_03
And I'll bet that it's a very complicated and disciplined process to try to transition that somewhat conservative audience into the more modern takes on art and what qualifies as entertainment nowadays and all this sort of atypical stuff.

00:24:26 Speaker_03
It's really a lot of interesting things going on there right now.

00:24:29 Speaker_04
Well, I would imagine, but what do you think, I wonder if a lot of those people also, what percentage of them When you do sign up for that, when that's your thing, you're kind of saying to a group of artists or a group saying, take me on a journey.

00:24:45 Speaker_04
Like, open my mind to new stuff. I'm here, I want to see what is new. Like, it's a little bit of both, you know what I mean, probably? Yeah, you hope.

00:24:53 Speaker_00
I think people want a great... story. And I think that what happens is when you're able to deliver a story, if it's a song, if it's a play, if it's a musical, if it's theater, if it's a film, if it's a piece of art,

00:25:11 Speaker_00
Like if you're able to create this emotional connection, I do think that if you do it in a slightly different way, but they can follow the emotional arc of it, then people are open. I think that's at the heart of a lot of things.

00:25:28 Speaker_00
Even with a great song, you might completely create a new genre, but when you have that song that you know you can sing and you feel it emotionally, it really doesn't actually matter ultimately. So I think there's something that people are looking for

00:25:42 Speaker_00
connects to them.

00:25:43 Speaker_04
Jason's a real storyteller. I think he was about to say that.

00:25:49 Speaker_03
Can I ask you about that? This is a little off topic, but like speaking of drums, I always listen to like just the drums in a song. Most people listen to the lyrics.

00:25:59 Speaker_03
I've tried to listen to the lyrics and train myself to be that kind of music and enjoy music in that way. but so often I can't hear what they're saying.

00:26:10 Speaker_03
And so to go to your point about if you're telling a story through lyrics and through a song, do you ever battle with that when you're recording and it just sounds better to kind of not enunciate a line, but then do you battle yourself going, yeah, but if they miss that line, they kind of miss a part of the story.

00:26:25 Speaker_03
Do you ever have that struggle as a singer?

00:26:27 Speaker_00
That's a good point. I mean, there's definitely lines that just because of the emotion of it or the way that you want to deliver it, it might not be as clear as ever.

00:26:37 Speaker_00
And definitely that's more, even now, there is this way of delivering that, not necessarily clear, but as the songwriter, because I am the songwriter, I do feel connected to wanting the lyrics to connect to each other.

00:26:55 Speaker_04
I want them to like... And to be clear so that people can kind of follow. Jason, you used to always think that song was, I wanna know who Doug is, right?

00:27:06 Speaker_03
That always happens. We'll be honest though, one of the last times I looked up lyrics, because I was a part of a song I just couldn't understand, and now feel like an idiot that I didn't, was Concrete Jungle Where Dreams Are Made Of.

00:27:19 Speaker_03
I was just like, oh yeah.

00:27:21 Speaker_00
No, no, no. People have all types of, they say, concrete, jungle, wet dreams, tomatoes. They have all kinds of crazy interpretations.

00:27:32 Speaker_02
I have one. It was an old song from the 80s from a group called Till Tuesday, Amy Meir. And it was hush, hush, hush. And the lyrics are, hush, hush, keep it down now, voices carry.

00:27:46 Speaker_02
And all through high school I was like, hush, hush, we go downtown, it's so scary.

00:27:54 Speaker_04
Wait a second. Wait a second. I want to say, because JB, you brought it up, Empire State of Mind. I mean, that song is... It must be kind of... It's an anthem.

00:28:05 Speaker_03
It is an anthem.

00:28:06 Speaker_04
It's such an iconic song. An iconic song about New York. It's so emblematic of a time. I love that. I don't think that there's anybody who hears that song who doesn't turn it up and get and feel good.

00:28:25 Speaker_04
And even those sort of like, you know, millennial white chicks are like, that's my fucking jam.

00:28:32 Speaker_03
I think it's replaced. It's the modern day Frank Sinatra version of New York, New York. Like it's like, that's the new anthem.

00:28:39 Speaker_04
Alicia, it's incredible. Do you feel, not even, not a burden. I don't want to say a burden, but...

00:28:44 Speaker_04
But like, just, not a burden, that's a, because that has a negative connotation, but do you, are you able to appreciate or understand how meaningful that song is?

00:28:54 Speaker_00
I feel so, like, stunned by many of the songs that, like, become a soundtrack to people's life. It's, like, crazy. And for it to just live and evolve and continue to be, like, a staple like that, particularly for my hometown.

00:29:13 Speaker_00
I mean, that is my home town. And the craziest part is, you know, there was a moment where that song wasn't even going to happen.

00:29:22 Speaker_00
Or it wasn't going to happen with me, because there were some things at the time, and Jay was kind of trying to get in touch with me about doing the song, and at the time, the people that I was working with, whatever happened, it just didn't get to me.

00:29:36 Speaker_00
And he was going to have to move on. Because he was like, I don't know, it's not working out. I can't get a response. It's not going to happen.

00:29:44 Speaker_04
Literally just because he couldn't get in touch. I find it so hard to believe that Jay-Z couldn't get in touch with Alicia Keys. You know what I mean? Your reps were putting up too high a wall.

00:29:53 Speaker_00
It wasn't progressing in the way that needed to happen to make it happen. And I wasn't aware of that. Fortunately, he was friends with a friend of mine, and that was kind of how we got a chance to connect. And I was like, what?

00:30:05 Speaker_00
What do you mean you haven't heard from me? Here I am. What do you mean? Isn't that funny?

00:30:09 Speaker_02
Everybody from the outside, like my idea, is like, oh, everybody in the music world must know each other.

00:30:14 Speaker_00
Everybody.

00:30:15 Speaker_02
Yeah.

00:30:15 Speaker_00
You know, we know, we definitely, you know a lot of people and you connect in a lot of ways and then sometimes you don't, you know, so.

00:30:22 Speaker_03
Yeah, there's no hotline. Right, let me call the.

00:30:26 Speaker_00
So thank goodness that happened because, man, it would have been crazy for it to not happen. And so that and hearing the way that song has taken, you know, just its own place in the universe.

00:30:38 Speaker_04
What was that process like recording that song as much as you're comfortable talking about? Like, how did that sort of... So he gets in touch with you and he's like, what, how's Tuesday at 11?

00:30:48 Speaker_03
So was it his song that he brought you into or vice versa?

00:30:55 Speaker_00
He had begun the song, so he was like, here's the vibe of it, here's the beginning of it.

00:31:00 Speaker_04
Because you're a songwriter on it as well.

00:31:02 Speaker_00
Correct. And there are also other tremendous songwriters on it. So it's one of those songs that had that right collaboration of all the right people together.

00:31:13 Speaker_06
And so...

00:31:16 Speaker_00
And so it had the beginnings of it, and it was starting to really take shape. And when I heard it, I was like, his lyrics weren't even completely finished. He maybe had like a beginning of a verse. But you could tell, you could just feel it.

00:31:29 Speaker_00
All the parts were just... incredible. And so I was like, man, we got to do this ASAP. And I remember the soonest I could do it, I was in LA. And so I was like, all right, I'll cut it while I'm in LA. And I was there and I wasn't feeling the best.

00:31:48 Speaker_00
I was a little bit sick. I was on tour. I was a little bit run down. So I sing the song. I gave it my all. I sing it. I send it back. And he's like,

00:31:57 Speaker_03
Hmm, yeah. We'll be in touch.

00:31:59 Speaker_00
Do you think you could sing it one more time? And I was like, what? Like, what do you mean, sing it one more time? What do you mean? Why do I have to sing it one more time? But I was sick. I mean, we can't sing a New York song in L.A.

00:32:14 Speaker_00
It's just like, you gotta be in the space.

00:32:18 Speaker_04
I've said that to Sean so many times.

00:32:22 Speaker_00
So we were able to take it back again. He was like, could you put some of that, like, when you go, uh, yeah, uh, can you do some of, like, all that? And then do it one more time.

00:32:31 Speaker_00
He said that he had to, like, he had to think about how he was going to call me and tell me this for, like, a decent amount of time. He's like, how do I say this? in a way that feels encouraging. But sure enough, I got back to my studio in New York.

00:32:45 Speaker_00
It was the right time. I felt much better. We delivered the whole thing. And that's when it really got that magic. And that's the version that you hear when we re-did it again. It's pretty funny. But it was great.

00:32:56 Speaker_03
Have you guys performed it together? I think even at the Tonys, I feel like he was on a different stage maybe.

00:33:03 Speaker_00
Uh-huh, we performed it at the Tonys together. We performed it at the World Series of the Yankees, the Yankees World Series. That was one of the first plays we performed it.

00:33:14 Speaker_03
Oh my God, I gotta look that up.

00:33:15 Speaker_00
And then we did another one, maybe it was like the AMAs or something like that. So it may be three times, like three or four times we've done it. We did one where I took over Times Square

00:33:26 Speaker_00
and the whole Times Square and every, like, building had... Oh, I'm gonna look that up, too. Was that shot?

00:33:32 Speaker_03
That must be on YouTube.

00:33:33 Speaker_00
That was insane.

00:33:35 Speaker_04
That must have been... I mean, by the way, also, not just in New York, if you're in Times Square, you're blocks away from where you grew up. Like, you're right there.

00:33:43 Speaker_00
I remember getting off a stage that night, I was like, if I... if this is my last day, I'm good. Like, I'm good. I feel like I'm good.

00:33:52 Speaker_04
Well, like... That's what Sean said when he walked out of an Arby's once. And they had all the horsey stuff he could handle.

00:34:01 Speaker_03
I stole some of that sauce. Did you ever allow yourself to even dream of things like that when you were, is this true, when you signed your first record with your first record label at 15? God, that's crazy.

00:34:16 Speaker_03
Did you think, well, I am starting nice and young here, things are looking good, something like performing in Times Square, Getting Tony's Grammys all that stuff that is possible. Did you allow yourself to dream that big?

00:34:29 Speaker_00
I feel like there's things that you definitely dream of, and I do feel like the big stage, singing in front of the mirror, like, one day they'll all sing my songs.

00:34:40 Speaker_00
I do remember having those moments, because you were, you know, you're looking at a Whitney Houston or a Michael Jackson, and you're like, man, maybe one day would it be like that? I remember feeling like that.

00:34:51 Speaker_00
I do recall that when we, you know, speaking of the Times Square, when we did take over Times Square, I remember feeling like I never dreamed this big before. Like I never even thought that something like this.

00:35:04 Speaker_02
So what does that do? Does it make you nervous when it hits you like that? Do you get like, does it, are you like, gosh, I don't know if I'm deserving of this. This is weird. This is freaky. Or did you like, you know what? I worked hard.

00:35:15 Speaker_02
I deserve to be here. Like what was the emotion behind that when you first felt that?

00:35:20 Speaker_00
I definitely have gone through my don't deserve this phase for sure. Had plenty of that. I wake up that way.

00:35:25 Speaker_04
All of us. Get in line, yeah.

00:35:27 Speaker_00
But I think that in that moment, I felt like this adrenaline, this like unbelievable adrenaline. I'm like, we shut down the entire Times Square. 2,000 cops out here making sure that all the people have their place to be. We have every screen.

00:35:43 Speaker_00
We meticulously chose how each screen is gonna reflect the songs we're singing. I was like, this John Mayer's coming out. Jay-Z's coming out. Questlove is playing drums. I'm like, this shit is out of control.

00:35:57 Speaker_00
I more felt like a disbelief, like an adrenaline excitement. Pinch me. How did this happen?

00:36:04 Speaker_04
So you were there, you were present. I bet because, like you said, having that moment of saying, like, I never dreamed this big, this is beyond what I thought.

00:36:14 Speaker_04
You almost don't have a chance maybe to be nervous because you have no preconceived notion of being in this situation.

00:36:22 Speaker_00
That's a good one, I mean, You feel nervous because I feel like that's a healthy emotion. Like, you know, you, you feel those, that's why I guess it's adrenaline more because you feel like that energy and you feel like, whoa, let me, let me.

00:36:36 Speaker_00
And I think what I do remember, though, especially during this time, I remember feeling like I was starting to talk to myself about being comfortable being great.

00:36:47 Speaker_00
I wanted to become comfortable being great and not somehow kind of getting in my own way for it, you know. And that's actually a conversation that I have to have often with myself, like,

00:37:02 Speaker_00
you're going to take this moment and you're allowed to execute this moment to the highest capacity, as opposed to like, I'm gonna fuck this up. This ain't gonna go right. You know, all these things that we allow in our head. Playing defense.

00:37:14 Speaker_00
So I just like, I remember I was talking to myself in that way. So I was like, go, like go, go, just go. And I felt it. That is so evolved.

00:37:24 Speaker_04
That is...

00:37:26 Speaker_00
I just wrote that down.

00:37:27 Speaker_04
I don't need to write it down because I never... I want to tattoo that somewhere. I never have to worry about it being great, so I don't have to worry about it.

00:37:35 Speaker_03
Will, don't you say that, Will. No, it's okay.

00:37:37 Speaker_04
William, get over here right now.

00:37:38 Speaker_00
Wait, is that a double negative or like a double positive?

00:37:40 Speaker_04
No, I know. I'm just leaving the door open for all you guys to go. Compliments and stuff like that. Alicia, where did you, you know, I mean, we're talking about that, that sort of, God, writing this songs and all the right, when did you start?

00:37:52 Speaker_04
When's the moment I'm always interested when you're playing and you're learning how to play and you're going through and you're developing your skill and all that in your artistry. And then when do you start writing song?

00:38:02 Speaker_04
When do you have the audacity to write a song? Like, I wouldn't have the guts to, you know.

00:38:07 Speaker_00
I love that question. The first time I had the audacity to write a song was 11.

00:38:13 Speaker_00
And it was actually a really important moment because I had lost my grandfather and that was the first kind of big loss in my life in that way that just felt so like, whoa, I didn't know what to do with it.

00:38:26 Speaker_00
And it was the first time that I was moved to write because I felt something that was so genuine that I had to write the thing. And that was the basis of how I learned how to song write. And so that's actually my style of writing.

00:38:41 Speaker_00
I write because I feel the thing to write. And so even though it was a sad time for me, I do feel like it connected me with the idea of how do you bring out whatever that emotion is into real life.

00:38:57 Speaker_00
And so that was when I first wrote, that was my first song. My second song I wrote at 14, and that actually made it on my first album.

00:39:04 Speaker_00
And that was kind of like because it was my first love and I just had this feeling and I never felt that feeling before. And so I wrote that type of feeling down. And that song is called Butterflies. And that's on the first album.

00:39:17 Speaker_00
And that was kind of my first other one. And then from there, you know, other things kind of flew.

00:39:23 Speaker_03
Well, so that first album was Songs in A Minor?

00:39:28 Speaker_00
Yes.

00:39:29 Speaker_03
And was a big hit, massive success. And so when you walk into your second album, did you allow yourself to be great or were you playing defense?

00:39:42 Speaker_03
How early on did you start to kind of lean forward and go, okay, let's get going and let's have a long career here?

00:39:51 Speaker_00
I mean, it was definitely always the talk of the sophomore jinx. I mean, people always say like that's when you get your whole life to write your first album and then you get like two months to write the next one or whatever it is.

00:40:03 Speaker_00
But I remember feeling pretty supported to be able to go in and just start to craft and play. I had just come off my first tour. That was like a mind bender because I was just like, what are these people doing here? Why are they here?

00:40:18 Speaker_00
And when I was able to release that and be back into a quiet space back in New York, it felt really nice just to be in that universe.

00:40:27 Speaker_00
At the time, I thought I had to work every hour of every day of every minute of every second because I had to deliver this thing. So I didn't understand the balance yet of like, how do you actually enjoy and then create?

00:40:39 Speaker_00
And I didn't have that down yet. But I felt like I had time to create. And then all of a sudden, once we found the first song, then time kind of got cut short and they were like, now we're moving. Let's go.

00:40:53 Speaker_00
So that was actually a very difficult process because I was continuing to write. and promoting the record before the record was finished. And that was hard for me. I was like 22 or 21 or whatever I was at that time.

00:41:06 Speaker_00
And I remember just asking, because I was in Europe and we started in Europe, and I asked them to please sit me in a restaurant for whatever 800 hours of interviews that we were doing so I could see the Eiffel Tower. We were in Paris.

00:41:20 Speaker_00
I said, I just want to see the Eiffel Tower.

00:41:25 Speaker_04
That's hysterical. Actually, that's a really great move. I really like that. Because you're like, hey, if I'm going to be stuck here doing this... I want to look at something nice. Yeah, I want my experience to be kind of, you know, good.

00:41:38 Speaker_01
In the place, in the space.

00:41:39 Speaker_04
That's great. That's, you know what? That's a really good sign of self-care. You've got like a healthy dose of self-care on you.

00:41:45 Speaker_03
Speaking of self-care, you've got, you've got a, you've, you've branched out into, uh, is it, how would Would you qualify as skincare line? No.

00:41:55 Speaker_00
I would call it a lifestyle. I would call it a lifestyle brand, but it is based in, it's called soul care. And it is based in these offerings of skincare or body care that really give you the opportunity to connect with a deeper part of yourself.

00:42:11 Speaker_00
And so we have affirmations on every bottle and everything is kind of You know, there's crystals and ancient rituals and all these beautiful organic ingredients that really help.

00:42:23 Speaker_02
Well, yeah, let me tell you, let me tell you that the skin thing is working because your skin is like perfect. Thank you.

00:42:30 Speaker_00
Listen, I'm just happy that we're not going to use this recording because I'm like, great, I could just jump out the shower.

00:42:35 Speaker_03
That's why we don't release the video.

00:42:37 Speaker_00
Exactly.

00:42:38 Speaker_03
Yeah, they don't have to worry about what they're going to wear, what their hair is looking like. Yeah, exactly.

00:42:45 Speaker_00
So thank you, thank you.

00:42:46 Speaker_05
It's the best. And we will be right back. And now back to the show.

00:42:56 Speaker_03
Now, going back to allow yourself to be great, I would imagine the roots of that, if not verbatim, was given to you by an adult in your life when you were younger. And if that was your mom, Do you, have you had that, do you have children now?

00:43:18 Speaker_03
Are they, have you had that yet? Do you enjoy sharing that and helping, you know, these, these little birds jump out of the nest?

00:43:26 Speaker_00
I do.

00:43:26 Speaker_00
I mean, it's really, it's really incredible the conversations that we have and also just like observing them and seeing what they're feeling and what they're experiencing and also allowing them to draw their own conclusions too, which is, which is, you know, unique because I think sometimes as parents or as people who have more experience, you always want to kind of lay your whole thing on a person sometimes.

00:43:49 Speaker_03
Cut some corners for them, yeah.

00:43:51 Speaker_00
You do, you're like, if you just listen to me, I swear everything's gonna be just fine.

00:43:55 Speaker_02
But kids, home and parents are the last place kids and people, kids listen to, right? It seems like the older they get, especially in teenage years, you guys tell me, I don't have kids, but it always seems like

00:44:06 Speaker_02
their lessons and the inspiration and the motivation always come from outside sources, which is so weird, because as a parent, you're like, Jason, like you're saying, you're just like, no, but listen to what I'm telling you.

00:44:18 Speaker_03
Right, but they need to, like, make their own scars, too.

00:44:20 Speaker_02
Yeah, because it's just noise, I guess, after a while.

00:44:22 Speaker_04
But they do have, I have all boys, and my teenage boys, I'm always like, well, don't take my word for it. I mean, you know, I only got this far, and they're like, whatever.

00:44:33 Speaker_02
Yeah, they're like, sure, whatever. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, right.

00:44:36 Speaker_00
You know, I do think they definitely get a lot from outside and especially now, like all of the phones, the social medias, like crazy the amount of information that they're getting, which some of it is like, you know, incredible.

00:44:50 Speaker_00
Like they're actually leaps and bounds ahead of us in so many ways. And some of it is just like, man, there's so much to figure out what's real and what's not real. And, you know, what do you learn from that or what do you take from that?

00:45:02 Speaker_00
So I think although they are getting a lot of information from outside, they do know if you open a door, they do know that they can trust when they speak with you that they can kind of share their thoughts and it is a safe place.

00:45:15 Speaker_02
Yes, that's a good point. I'm always surprised. I'm going back on what I just said. I'm always surprised when there are kids, there are parents who've done who've done it correctly, where the kids do listen to what their parents say, and they do listen.

00:45:29 Speaker_02
And there's a respect there that the parents have taught the kids so that as they get older, they actually listen to what their parents say. I've witnessed this both sides, you know, both versions.

00:45:41 Speaker_00
I think they hear you. Sometimes they might not do exactly what you want them to do, or you're hoping they do, but they do internalize what you're saying. And it comes out in different points.

00:45:53 Speaker_03
And what I've started hearing more and more lately, and I think I'm a believer in it, is that as articulate as you can be, as profound as you can be with the shit you tell your kid, Really, the thing that penetrates and holds with them is example.

00:46:10 Speaker_03
Like, they watch you. They watch you do what you do and not what you do. Yeah, living a good example, I think, is the best thing you can give your kid.

00:46:21 Speaker_04
I think that's true, and I think that goes for kind of all relationships, too. I think just with people in general, and, you know, I have a good friend, we talk about this all the time, which is... You can't really coach people up.

00:46:33 Speaker_04
You can only model it. And, yeah, especially people you're really close with.

00:46:38 Speaker_04
It's really tough in an interpersonal relationship to coach them up, to say, like, hey, you need to be doing this, or hey, this is how... And all you can do, and certainly it goes, JB, to what you were saying, like, it goes like that for your kids.

00:46:48 Speaker_04
You just model it, and you just behave a certain way. And your kids, what I know, again, I'm no expert, but my kids, my reaction to stuff gives them a lot of information. That's me.

00:47:00 Speaker_04
So if they get a bad grade or if they get a thing like that, how I react to it is really important in informing them on how they should. Yeah, that's interesting.

00:47:10 Speaker_03
I want to talk about, we're almost out of time here, we won't let you get back in your busy life, but your passion for art and your considerable collection with your husband, Talk to me about that.

00:47:25 Speaker_03
I know that you enjoy discovering and supporting new and emerging artists, and did it start with that, your fascination with art, your passion for art, or was that just a part that became sort of the philanthropy of it all?

00:47:40 Speaker_00
Man, no, I mean, my husband really is an incredible lover of art. And he has an uncanny ability to really identify artists that are going to be, you know. the next, next, and the next. And so it's unreal. And that's because we are artists, obviously.

00:48:05 Speaker_00
He also is an artist who draws and paints. And so there's this real genuine love for the art that I think comes from being artists and connecting with artists.

00:48:17 Speaker_00
And also, you know, being in position of owning our art and being the custodians of art in a way that like is protecting it, you know, exploiting it.

00:48:29 Speaker_03
But you're displaying it too, right? Isn't your collection, a portion of it on tour right now?

00:48:35 Speaker_00
It is. It started at the Brooklyn Museum. It's called Giants. We called it Giants because it's all these oversized works. of artists, and it is also, we consider the artists in the exhibition giants of their craft, their masterpieces.

00:48:52 Speaker_03
And you hate the Jets. And what? And you hate the Jets.

00:48:56 Speaker_00
Uh, right.

00:48:57 Speaker_03
And the Dodgers.

00:48:58 Speaker_00
I was like, wait, wait, what, what, what?

00:49:00 Speaker_04
Who are the artists... Wait, Alicia, who are the artists, I'm really interested, I'm so jealous of you, who are the artists that you really, that are exciting you right now? And they don't have to be new, like, what are the things...

00:49:13 Speaker_00
There's so many incredible, unbelievable artists. I mean, in Giants, we actually just opened it at the High Museum, so it's touring now in Atlanta at the High Museum. And man, all of the artists in this exhibition are completely tremendous.

00:49:30 Speaker_00
Jordan Castile is a beautiful young artist that we adore. Amy Sherald is super incredible. And when you see these works of art, it's unbelievable. Jamel Shabazz is paired with Gordon Parks.

00:49:45 Speaker_00
So you see the photography side of the lens from the 40s and the 50s and 60s up to Jamel Shabazz starting in the 80s. And it just really shows the pass off of the inspiration.

00:49:58 Speaker_02
I'm the super, super dummy asshole who wished they understood it.

00:50:07 Speaker_04
But Sean, we talked about this this summer, which is, I'm so new to it.

00:50:11 Speaker_04
I realized about five... No, I've always known this, but I met a bunch of artists this summer, and I kept saying, I have this crazy blind spot in my life, which is I never appreciated art in a way, or I never understood it, I never spent the time, and I feel like...

00:50:28 Speaker_03
We don't go to museums.

00:50:29 Speaker_02
I felt really delinquent, or galleries, or go to shows to see... Because I'll go to a museum and there'll be a canvas, a painting, that is from the floor to the ceiling, that is massive, that takes up the whole wall, and it's just painted one color.

00:50:41 Speaker_02
It's just painted black, or it's just painted red, or whatever it is. And I'll go, I could have done that, that's dumb. And then somebody will go, no, that's brilliant because... And then I'll go, oh wow, it's kind of fascinating.

00:50:53 Speaker_04
Yeah, well, I went into, I met this, I met, and he was there the other night, I met, so this summer, I met and hung out a couple times, I went to his house, he's a friend of a friend to Rasheed Johnson's house, and he's got all this art in his, Rasheed's got all this, and a bunch of his own art, and I'm like, and he was the guy, and I said, I go, Rasheed, I gotta be honest with you,

00:51:11 Speaker_04
I don't know anything about art." And literally, he was so kind, and he goes, -"I got you."

00:51:16 Speaker_06
-"All right, I got you."

00:51:16 Speaker_04
And so we started talking, and he started kind of, like, educating me and saying, -"These are the things."

00:51:20 Speaker_02
-"I really want to learn."

00:51:21 Speaker_04
-"I actually want to learn." -"Dude." And what's really, what I found, as you know, I started reading biographies on artists. and it gives you such a sense of who they are. And then when you do that, then you start to appreciate their process.

00:51:33 Speaker_03
Kind of like how you found soccer, right, Will? Like, you start learning about kind of the players and the whole sort of drama behind the team. Yeah, just like anything. That's exactly how I got into it.

00:51:42 Speaker_02
Yeah, and when I discovered the blend of Rice Krispies and marshmallows, I was like, this is incredible.

00:51:46 Speaker_00
Oh, you were the one eating the marshmallows and the Rice Krispies treats. I was trying to figure out who.

00:51:52 Speaker_04
Oh, listen, he's a test kitchen for the Kraft Food Corporation.

00:51:58 Speaker_03
He does it while we record. Let me ask you a super dumb practical question. You say all these pieces of art, these works, are large-scale. You live in New York City. You can't have the wall space to house all these things. Where do a lot of them live?

00:52:16 Speaker_03
Do you lend them to museums? Are they always on tour? How do you go about buying large pieces?

00:52:24 Speaker_00
Well, this is the first time that they exhibition this particular version of our collection because this maybe represents about 30% of the collection.

00:52:33 Speaker_00
This particular part of the collection is touring for the first time, and it is actually the first touring exhibition of color ever in any of these museums of a private collection.

00:52:46 Speaker_00
So this is really a very, very important and special thing, and one of the things we did realize is not only Is it really giving so much exposure to so many brilliant, brilliant artists? Ebony G. Patterson, Mickalene Thomas, Titus Kaphar.

00:53:03 Speaker_00
I mean, when you see this exhibition, you do have to see it. It is stunning. There's also a book that goes along with it. The Giants book is spectacular. But otherwise it would be in storage.

00:53:14 Speaker_00
And as much as it has to be kept safe and stored properly, but how beautiful it is that people from all walks of life can go see this art and to your point, feel actually connected to it, not just like they're seeing something that they don't really connect to.

00:53:30 Speaker_00
When you see these works, you see things in your life, you're emotional, it really brings you. to beautiful spaces and for everybody, not just certain blocks of life or certain people, to be exposed is really the point.

00:53:45 Speaker_03
Yeah, and it's so generous of you guys to do that, to let the public see, because these are all one-offs. It's like someone coming over to your house or something. Yeah, exactly. It is like that, actually.

00:53:55 Speaker_03
So for you to... Otherwise, people would have no chance to see all this stuff if you did have all the wall space, you know, some big, huge... The fact that you're touring it is philanthropic in and of itself. So that's very, very cool, you guys.

00:54:10 Speaker_04
It's a public service. I'm just looking it up. It's so cool. It's right now at Atlanta's High Museum, right? Yeah, it is. Yeah, and then it was at the Brooklyn Museum. That's so cool.

00:54:21 Speaker_02
I want to go back to one question because I just want to know, do you still get nervous? I want to go to Atlanta and see it, sorry. I do too. Do you still get nervous performing at all? Because before we were talking about adrenaline versus nerves.

00:54:32 Speaker_02
So do you get like, before you perform, do you get at all nervous anymore? You're just like, no, I got this. I've done this. I know this. It's in me.

00:54:40 Speaker_00
It kind of depends. You know, it's like when I've been on tour for six months, I'm good. I'm like, okay, I know what I'm doing. I'm going to go out there. At the beginning, I think of everything. There is such a beautiful feeling of like, do I have this?

00:54:55 Speaker_00
Is this going to go right? You know, are they going to get me?

00:54:58 Speaker_03
It's a necessary fuel, yeah.

00:54:59 Speaker_00
Yeah, but I think it's really cool because you do get a chance to kind of like, you just give it a shot. So I definitely can feel nerves when I'm crafting something new. Or, you know, even just, you know, I'll start creating new music soon.

00:55:15 Speaker_00
And even that, I'm like, how do I want to start that? Like, how do I want to create this space for for that, what does it want to feel like? So I even think about like, what do I want to do?

00:55:24 Speaker_00
And there's this beautiful book called The Sage Warrior by a woman named Valerie Carr, who's this incredible, she's a lawyer, she's an activist, she's a woman who just, she's a writer, she does all this incredible stuff.

00:55:37 Speaker_00
And she paired this book with this album of music that represents the theme of the book. And I said, you know, when I start to create, I just want to sit in a room and I want to read the book and hear the music.

00:55:52 Speaker_00
And I want to like, what does that make me feel? And so just creating space for like, how do you create or what do you want to bring out of yourself? It's scary, but just to allow the space for you to do it is the first step.

00:56:09 Speaker_00
So yes, do I even get nervous, you know, so to your point, I even get nervous kind of writing songs, writing new songs. More than performing. Or performing for the first time.

00:56:20 Speaker_00
Or, you know, a lot of times when it's just me, if I'm doing a piano show only, I feel the most nervous, because I'm like, man, I don't have anything to cover up or hide behind. There's no safety nets.

00:56:29 Speaker_02
Yeah, yeah.

00:56:30 Speaker_00
Right. This is it. But I've learned that, you know, it's also okay to just make mistakes and like you're human.

00:56:36 Speaker_02
Yes, I know. And that's the thing that got me out of being a classical music pianist, like to perform live. Because I did it for like, you know, 15 years or 20 years or anything.

00:56:49 Speaker_02
And every single time I would go out, like to compete in competitions or whatever, It was so... I just wanted to shit my pants every single time. I'm like, what's the joy?

00:57:00 Speaker_02
And because if you're playing Beethoven or Chopin or Mozart, whoever it is, the notes are the notes. Like, those are the notes. And if you miss them, everybody hears it. At least the people judging you hear it, right?

00:57:12 Speaker_02
And so you can miss it and go on, but it breaks you down the second you start missing a passage. And, you know, I was performing in college once with this Mozart concerto in the orchestra behind me. And I blanked on like for half a page.

00:57:26 Speaker_02
I stopped playing. And the orchestra kept going. And I was like, oh my God, I'm sweating. I'm like, how am I? It's just me on stage with 2,000 people. And I'm like, and then you finally, I don't know how I got back in, but you just get back in.

00:57:39 Speaker_02
I'm like, you know what? I'm out. I'm not doing this. This is not a career.

00:57:42 Speaker_03
No, it's psychologically really. And then you won a Tony for playing Gershwin all by yourself on stage.

00:57:49 Speaker_02
Which was a challenge that I wanted to overcome, Jay. That's such a great point because I was like, if I'm ever going to live my life and get over this incredible nerves I have about performing the piano in front of people, I just have to tackle it.

00:58:02 Speaker_02
Yeah, go right through it.

00:58:03 Speaker_00
Did you play on stage?

00:58:04 Speaker_03
Did you play every night? Every night. All by himself with a big, grand piano. Rhapsody in Blue, start to finish. Rhapsody in Blue, start to finish? Yeah, to end the show. It was incredible.

00:58:19 Speaker_02
A section of it, yeah. It was very moving. Well, that's very nice. Not why I told this story, but thank you. No, we backed into it, though.

00:58:29 Speaker_04
Go ahead. Go ahead, Sean.

00:58:31 Speaker_02
I was gonna say, Alicia, you know, all three of us have either lived or stayed in different parts of New York City. Is there a favorite of yours?

00:58:40 Speaker_00
A favorite part?

00:58:41 Speaker_04
Yeah, because we all kind of... We all just got back from there. We all just got back from there, what, yesterday? We came back together.

00:58:47 Speaker_00
Oh, amazing.

00:58:48 Speaker_04
Was it yesterday?

00:58:49 Speaker_00
I mean, somewhere between Harlem and Hell's Kitchen is definitely my sweet spot. On the west side. Yep. I feel like I've always been a West Side girl. I really like it there. It has the energy.

00:59:00 Speaker_00
Obviously Hell's Kitchen is where I was raised and then Harlem, I did a lot of growing up in my teenage years. And obviously Harlem was also a different place then. It was just so unique and the culture was just so clearly its own universe.

00:59:15 Speaker_00
And so there was so much that I received from being able to be exposed to that. So I say it's somewhere between Harlem and Hell's Kitchen. Even now, um, you know, I spend a lot of time uptown, um, and I just really like it.

00:59:27 Speaker_00
So I'm kind of uptown-west somewhere in that universe. Midtown, Harlem, and Hell's Kitchen. That's my vibe.

00:59:36 Speaker_03
Yeah. Yeah, I'm a westside. Well, we're gonna let you get back into that incredible city and your life. And you're just an absolute delight. I'm so, so happy that you did this.

00:59:46 Speaker_04
I was gonna say, I kept wanting to say, I could listen to you, Todd. You're so... You're so unbelievably in touch with yourself and you're able to articulate so well your connection with yourself. It's so cool. Thank you guys.

01:00:02 Speaker_00
I'm really glad to be able to be a part of your crew today.

01:00:06 Speaker_01
Thank you for having me.

01:00:08 Speaker_00
We're so lucky. And I'm so excited to just build with you guys. This is awesome.

01:00:12 Speaker_01
Likewise, likewise.

01:00:13 Speaker_03
Thanks for doing it and keep putting out all this incredible stuff. I can't wait to see what you do next.

01:00:18 Speaker_02
Yes, and I'll look you up on the West Side.

01:00:20 Speaker_00
Yes. Thank you guys.

01:00:22 Speaker_03
Thanks, Alicia.

01:00:23 Speaker_00
Enjoy the rest of your day. All right, bye. Take care.

01:00:25 Speaker_03
Bye. She's just like, I mean, a listener, I wish you could have seen the sunshine on her face. I don't, she had a grin on her face the whole time.

01:00:38 Speaker_02
Yeah. She's just such a- Like that's somebody who's like, this is what I'm gonna do, this is fulfilling to me, and I'm not gonna stop for the rest of my life.

01:00:45 Speaker_04
And the way she's able to deliver how she's feeling and talk about her experience, her past experience, where she's at now, like the facility that she has- The facility? The facility. that I obviously don't have, is pretty, I found it remarkable.

01:01:05 Speaker_04
Do you find me as eloquent?

01:01:07 Speaker_03
Yeah, well, boy, I'm losing you.

01:01:09 Speaker_02
Are you going through a canyon?

01:01:10 Speaker_04
I try not to find you, put it that way.

01:01:15 Speaker_02
You know what, there is one song that I love by hers, but we're gonna get to it later, it's called Goodbye. She actually wrote a song called Goodbye, but before I say that- Are you gonna save that for your bye? Yeah.

01:01:24 Speaker_04
Oh, sorry, you're putting a stake in your bye? Thanks for previewing that for us, we're ready. What are you doing? You're a disaster. You're crashing from that Rice Krispie Treat now.

01:01:35 Speaker_03
I sure is.

01:01:36 Speaker_02
Wait, can you hear it if I play it on here or no?

01:01:39 Speaker_03
No, probably not.

01:01:40 Speaker_02
Then we'll have to pay for it.

01:01:42 Speaker_03
What's your question, caller?

01:01:45 Speaker_02
My question was, well, first of all, oh, the art thing. Like, I wish I'd give anything to be... In Atlanta right now to see that show? Yeah, well, that, yeah. And also just to like learn about art. I just don't...

01:01:58 Speaker_04
Well, you don't have to be... And there are a ton of, as she was saying that her husband is good at identifying emerging artists, there are, as you can imagine, every day tons of great young artists that you can go and you can kind of... And what you do is you... I know people who know about it, so I start asking them questions.

01:02:17 Speaker_04
And you just go, I'm gonna ask you the dumbest question. You know, who do you like? Shit like that. Help me understand what's good. But not even what's good, because the good is different for everybody. You know what I mean? Just who do you like?

01:02:31 Speaker_04
And then you start identifying with other people, and you have to be the ultimate arbiter of what's good. Developing your taste. Yeah, because... You can't rely on other people's opinion on art. I mean, that sure drives the commerce of it.

01:02:47 Speaker_03
But I think what we're all saying, too, is that, like you said earlier, we are missing that in our lives. Like, that's an entire, a modular, you know, there's a section of life that we can easily go by and we have gone by up until now.

01:03:00 Speaker_04
Put it this way, I don't know about you guys, I would look at, like, a Jackson Pollock my entire life and I'd be like, do that thing which, you know, heathens do, like me, is go, I could do that.

01:03:12 Speaker_04
I could just drop some fucking paint splat on the thing. And then you start reading about his life. And then you start reading about where he was when he was doing those particular paintings and what was going on.

01:03:22 Speaker_04
And you have a different appreciation for what he did. And when you start to factor that in, it changes the way you look at it and appreciate it.

01:03:29 Speaker_02
Yeah, totally. Did you see this yesterday? This story came out yesterday where this kid, this guy found a Picasso painting in a basement somewhere. And this is years and years and years and years and years ago.

01:03:42 Speaker_02
And the mom, you know, didn't know it was a Picasso, brought it over to the kitchen sink, used just soap and water to clean it off, and then hung it up on their wall. Look, it's in the background there. See in the background? No way.

01:03:54 Speaker_02
Yeah, of their house, and they didn't know it was a Picasso. She's like, well, I'll just put this painting up. And they just found out, like, this week that it's a real Picasso. This week?

01:04:03 Speaker_03
Yes, the whole fucking time their family... Because it's in the background of their family photo.

01:04:06 Speaker_02
No, no. Yeah, and then they did the... You know, the people looked at it. Isn't that wild?

01:04:11 Speaker_04
Well, there's all sorts of stories. There's the guy in... There was that guy who lived in Munich, and he was kept... taking the train to Switzerland, and they're like, what's up with this dude? And then he had a bunch of dough on him.

01:04:21 Speaker_04
And they go back to his apartment, and they bust through the wall, and they realize he's got billions of dollars worth of art behind drywall in his house, in this apartment. Stolen from World War II? Probably. You know, a bunch of it unaccounted for.

01:04:34 Speaker_04
quite literally billions of dollars worth of art. So there's all sorts of things about the art world that's kind of dubious when you start to get into the commerce of it, too. Like, you go, like, where do you store the art?

01:04:43 Speaker_04
Do you know about the whole system of duty-free sort of art storage that exists at airports in the world? A few different places? Wow. Yeah, so they have these big... Lockers?

01:04:56 Speaker_04
Warehouses that are like the utmost security, and they stay there, and because they're not technically in that particular country, they can store them there tax-free. Is this art? Is this art?

01:05:08 Speaker_03
Oh, it is. Look at Sean and Scotty.

01:05:11 Speaker_04
Can I say this? And this is gonna seem like a cheap joke, but when it looks like that, it's not art, it's fart. That is fart. Because it looks like you're both farting.

01:05:22 Speaker_02
What's your favorite Alicia Keys song?

01:05:25 Speaker_03
I'm not sure, Sean. What's yours? Goodbye. Goodbye.

01:05:42 Speaker_04
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