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Episode: #2208 - Brigham Buhler

Author: Joe Rogan
Duration: 03:14:54

Episode Shownotes

Brigham Buhler is the founder of Ways2Well, a functional and regenerative care clinic, and a cofounder of its sister company, ReviveRx: a pharmacy focusing on health, wellness, and restorative medicine.

https://www.ways2well.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Full Transcript

00:00:01 Speaker_00
So, so tell me what it's like to testify in front of the Senate.

00:00:07 Speaker_01
What is that like?

00:00:19 Speaker_04
Man, it was pretty wild. It all transpired so fast. I got a call from Callie Means. We've become pretty good buddies. I know you're having him and his sister Casey on the podcast. Brilliant folks that are just patient advocates.

00:00:34 Speaker_04
I mean, at the end of the day, They had the same experiences I had. Callie, a little bit different walk of life. He was a lobbyist. Casey was a doctor, Stanford trained surgeon. Realized that she was in a system where they didn't really heal people.

00:00:48 Speaker_04
They just treated symptoms and profiteered off disease states. And she said, there's got to be a better way. So their voice rung so loud. after I think they did Tucker, that it led to momentum.

00:01:00 Speaker_04
And then because of you having me on the podcast, that's how I met RFK. And so Bobby's team had reached out to me maybe about a year and a half ago to come up to Dallas while he was doing a campaign there and sit down with him. And he was

00:01:14 Speaker_04
just asking a hundred questions about what's going on and what did you see on the pharmaceutical side and what did you see owning pharmacies and billing insurance companies.

00:01:22 Speaker_04
And so when they had an opportunity to put this team together to testify in front of the Senate, the goal was to create a nonpartisan group of individuals to take a new fresh approach to what is going on with chronic disease in America.

00:01:37 Speaker_04
because the chronic disease crisis is at an all-time high. I mean, we could go through all the statistics, and I know that Casey and Callie will when they're on here, so I don't want to steal their thunder, but it's staggering.

00:01:47 Speaker_04
I mean, close to anywhere between 1.7 to 1.9 million people are dying a year of chronic disease. We talk a lot about war. Since the dawn of this country, roughly estimated between 1.3 to 1.5 million people total have died in war, American lives.

00:02:06 Speaker_04
So in a year, we're losing more people to chronic disease than all the wars combined. And we're not talking about it. So to me, I was excited when they said, hey, the Senate's willing to hear. And that's the beauty of a democracy.

00:02:18 Speaker_04
They did let us come in there and candidly take a dump on the Senate floor on what's going on with this health care system and really dig into the weeds.

00:02:28 Speaker_01
Did anybody try to take the side of the pharmaceutical drug industry? Did anybody question you or try to push back?

00:02:34 Speaker_04
So prior you do a debrief, so we did do a roundtable prior to going into the communal roundtable in front of the public eye, which they had no idea what was coming. The Senate didn't expect it.

00:02:46 Speaker_04
We had assembled a grassroots effort to get the word out there, and over 2,000 people took off from work. This is a Senate hearing.

00:02:55 Speaker_04
Over 2,000 hardworking Americans took time from their busy day, flew to D.C., had to sit in an overflow room to listen to these testimonies. And the level of feedback from people, from like real humans, real world people, was staggering.

00:03:11 Speaker_04
I mean, people afterwards came up in tears sharing their story of how the system had let them down or a loved one down, misdiagnoses, like all the different issues that they've dealt with. trying to navigate this system.

00:03:25 Speaker_04
And to the senator's credit, you know, behind closed doors, they did say, you probably don't want to go ultra hard after the food industry or ultra hard after the pharmaceutical industry, because it may limit our ability to get things done.

00:03:41 Speaker_04
But they did. How do they phrase that? They just said you catch more flies with honey than you do vinegar. And, you know, me, Callie, and the other folks that sat on this panel, you know, our goal was to just share our stories and share what we saw.

00:03:57 Speaker_04
And so my testimony in particular was really more about the human side. You know, there's so many staggering data and statistics and numbers, but behind all that is a person. Like, that's all I wanted people to understand. These are human lives.

00:04:12 Speaker_04
You know, when Jelly Roll testified, I think he said this equivalent to a 747 jet worth of people die of opioids a day. And that's insane. And that all started with the lapses in the FDA and the drug regulatory market. And we know that, you know,

00:04:28 Speaker_04
There's an argument out there. I know Cali released the number of 50-plus percent of the FDA's funding comes from Big Pharma. When it comes to drugs alone, 75 percent of the drug funding comes from the pharmaceutical companies themselves.

00:04:41 Speaker_04
And so there's a big market there. And with Big Pharma spending over $8 billion a year advertising, that's more than the entire sum of the FDA's budget.

00:04:53 Speaker_01
$8 billion a year just in advertisement. Imagine how much they're making so that they can afford $8 billion just in advertising.

00:05:02 Speaker_04
Yeah, it's insane.

00:05:04 Speaker_01
And those ads are wild.

00:05:04 Speaker_04
But what I saw is, the truth is, my hope is that people listen and the American people fight. We can fight with our pocketbooks. We can fight through our choices as citizens. Do I have faith that the government's going to fix these problems overnight?

00:05:21 Speaker_04
I don't. But at least we're having the conversation. And to their credit, they let us speak freely. They didn't put a censor on us. They tried to give us some coaching to say, hey, if you go this route, just understand there's going to be blowback.

00:05:36 Speaker_04
And we're here to get progress on these topics, not burn the house down type deal.

00:05:44 Speaker_04
And then I did have some, and it was a bipartisan effort, so some of the senators in the room had mentioned, well, the American people just want a pill, you know, they don't really want a solution, that they're looking for an easy way out, and I pushed back.

00:05:58 Speaker_04
And it's funny, because one of the moms that was there was like, oh my god, I can't believe you were just dropping F-bombs in that meeting, but I'm like, I think you're fucking wrong.

00:06:05 Speaker_04
I mean, after being in health care since I was 20 years old, what I see is people struggling for answers. People are in the pit of despair. Who was saying that the American people just want a pill?

00:06:15 Speaker_04
I don't want to name any names, but one of the senators there was saying, in his experience, people are looking for the easy way out. And I don't think that's the case. I think people are looking for hope.

00:06:26 Speaker_01
Well, here's the thing. If there was a real easy way out, Like, if there really was a pill with no side effects that cured all your ails, sure, people would want that. And this is the problem.

00:06:38 Speaker_01
The advertising, that $8 billion a year, it leads you to believe that there is some sort of a solution in the bottom of a prescription bottle. And that's not real. That's the problem, is that they've been misled so long.

00:06:54 Speaker_01
so far down the line, and here they are, chronically ill, suffering, and they're hoping it's the next pill.

00:07:02 Speaker_04
And that was our hope, was to break down from the start of how do we process these foods? How do we grow, harvest, and what do we do with our soil? What do we do with our pesticides? How do we bring these products to market?

00:07:16 Speaker_04
How do we regulate our food industry? And that's all new to me. That's not my expertise. My expertise and my testimony was focused on what I saw as a drug rep, what I saw as a med device rep, what I saw billing insurance companies.

00:07:30 Speaker_04
And that was a part of the talk that we didn't even get to dive deep into. But the goal was to explain to the Senate.

00:07:36 Speaker_04
from the food processing, growing, harvesting, chemical treatments, to the packaging, to the ingredients we add into our food, to the hospital systems. Throughout the system, front to back, the American people are set up for failure.

00:07:53 Speaker_04
In the 1950s, the FDA had approved 700 different ingredients in our food products. That's it, 700. Today, there are over 10,000 chemicals and petrochemicals in our food products in the United States. In Europe, still 700. Jesus.

00:08:11 Speaker_04
And what gets crazier is when Food Babe, she's an influencer, right? And that's been crapped on by the media. Well, it's an unfortunate name, Food Babe.

00:08:23 Speaker_04
She's an advocate and she's just a voice, a mother out there saying, hey guys, what's wrong with this picture? Let me show you what's in Froot Loops in America and let me show you what's in Froot Loops in Canada.

00:08:35 Speaker_04
The same manufacturer, Kellogg's, is selling one product to the American people and a safer, less ingredient, less chemical filled product outside the United States.

00:08:46 Speaker_04
They have the ability to sell it here, but they don't because they know they can sell more addictive, more colorful, vibrant, that attract kid food sources here in the U.S. It's so dark. And so we walked through all of that.

00:09:01 Speaker_04
It blew my mind on the food front. And we know you and I have talked like in the health care system. My main message was, We're here to talk about the boom in chronic disease. We know that food and our environment has a huge impact on that.

00:09:17 Speaker_04
But so does preventative care. And so does building an ecosystem that allows clinicians to troubleshoot and diagnose and prevent chronic diseases from evolving in the first place. These are all metabolically related disease states.

00:09:31 Speaker_04
All the chronic diseases that are killing us can be traced back to diet, lifestyle, and nutrition, but none of our clinicians are trained on diet, lifestyle, and nutrition.

00:09:40 Speaker_01
That's the hard pill for people to swallow, diet, lifestyle, and nutrition.

00:09:44 Speaker_01
It's very hard for people who are addicted to shitty food, who are lazy, who don't have a history of exercise, and their lifestyle sucks, and they get home from work and they like to drink. All those things are killing you.

00:09:57 Speaker_04
Yeah, but then you and I've talked about this with some of your comedy friends that have become my friends to to watch the evolution You just got to give people momentum.

00:10:07 Speaker_04
We just got to get some wins on the board We got to give them hope and we've got to start by having the conversation and that's what I was optimistic about for the first time in my adult life

00:10:18 Speaker_04
The Senate is willing to sit down with a group of individuals and have a deep conversation about where our food comes from, how our food is being processed, what ingredients are in our food, and how that could potentially lead to chronic disease.

00:10:32 Speaker_04
And it got labeled by some of the I would say hatchet job media outlets that have come out, and we can dive into that.

00:10:41 Speaker_01
Somebody called it the woo-woo. Yeah, I saw that. Let's dive in. First of all, fuck you, whoever wrote that, because there's nothing woo-woo about anything you guys are saying. That's what's really crazy.

00:10:52 Speaker_01
To say that toxic chemicals that are illegal in other countries, but are legal in the United States, and there's a reason why they're illegal. You could find all the different things that they do to the body, all the different damage they cause.

00:11:06 Speaker_01
To say that that's woo-woo is so crazy. What did they list as an example of woo-woo?

00:11:14 Speaker_04
What's hard is they went immediately at, like, these are all entrepreneurs that have something to sell you. And I can tell you, sitting in the room with those people, all of us were scared. All of us were scared. It's scary.

00:11:27 Speaker_04
I'm not going to make money off of this. If anything, I could lose money. I have businesses that are under the FDA's guidelines, are under the FDA's oversights. I don't want to upset the apple cart, but I also want to tell the truth.

00:11:39 Speaker_04
And I wanted to share what I saw. And that was my message was, I'm not here to represent the left or the right. I'm here to represent humanity. This is not a Republican issue. This is not a Democrat issue. This is a humanity issue.

00:11:52 Speaker_04
These are people's lives.

00:11:54 Speaker_01
But it's just stunning that people are willing to whore themselves out to write a hit piece on someone trying to help human beings find healthier choices and realize the root cause of all the diseases that we're facing.

00:12:07 Speaker_04
The Woo Woo article, she alludes to how we talked about nothing but metabolic disease, and what does metabolic disease have to do with cancer? Actually, I can tell you. It is the number one risk factor.

00:12:19 Speaker_04
Obesity and metabolic disease is the number one risk factor to all forms of cancer other than smoking. So if you take smoking and age out of the equation, it's your number one risk factor. That's what it has to do with it.

00:12:32 Speaker_01
Imagine that statement. What does metabolic health have to do with these diseases?

00:12:37 Speaker_04
That is so crazy. And the people on that panel, too, to their credit, I was the least qualified of anyone to be in that room. And I was there to talk about my experiences as an industry insider.

00:12:49 Speaker_04
I am not telling you that I am an expert on metabolic disease. I can tell you that I'm an expert on fuckery. because I've been in healthcare long enough to see what they're doing, and I know their equation. I know their offense.

00:13:02 Speaker_04
But other than me, you had Casey Means, Stanford-trained surgeon. You had Dr. Palmer, a psychiatrist from Harvard, who was breaking down metabolic disease and how it's astronomically impacting the mental health crisis in America.

00:13:17 Speaker_04
One of the stats he dropped on us in his testimony was, we are at an all-time high in suicide and death of despair. greater than during the Great Depression. More Americans are dying of suicide and death of despair, more than ever.

00:13:32 Speaker_04
More children are being diagnosed with metabolic disease, diabetes. Girls are starting periods six years younger. I don't need a double-blind study to tell you something's wrong. Just look at the data.

00:13:46 Speaker_01
And that was this message. I'm hearing a lot of woo-woo from you.

00:13:49 Speaker_04
I need some data. It's like, as we get into that, in the names, they just totally breezed over and that article tried to make it sound like it's a bunch of influencers.

00:13:58 Speaker_04
And it's like, yes, there were some people who have social media presences, but there were also academics there. But also, you can't dismiss- Harvard, Stanford, and Stedman Hawkins.

00:14:06 Speaker_01
You can't dismiss someone who's giving out factual information because they're a so-called influencer. Some people get into influencing for a good cause. A hundred percent.

00:14:17 Speaker_01
And they have real valid information, and they collect that valid information and distribute it, and that's how they get a following.

00:14:24 Speaker_04
And, you know, even Vani is the food babe. Vani, her battle has helped. remove ingredients from certain states, stop chemicals in certain food sources.

00:14:36 Speaker_04
They're actually going to march to Kellogg on the 10th of next month to hand a petition signed by over 100,000 Americans coming out the tail end of that, asking them to remove dangerous chemicals that they don't put in food products in other countries and just match it.

00:14:51 Speaker_04
That's all they're asking. Hey, why don't we just match what you're doing outside the U.S. and all these other countries where they've said these products aren't safe? Why are we allowing you a mulligan on the U.S. population when it comes to food?

00:15:04 Speaker_04
And they've never been studied. That's the other wild thing. The FDA doesn't have the bandwidth to study every time a new ingredient's added to a food source.

00:15:12 Speaker_04
So you and I have gone down the rabbit hole on the FDA's attempt to try and regulate and rein in big industry like big pharma and big medical.

00:15:21 Speaker_04
And I know I've told your listeners for over 90 percent of the products in the operating room have never been through an FDA human safety trial. It's it was an entity built at a time to serve a purpose. And I just think they're drowning.

00:15:34 Speaker_04
And I think there's a lot of industry influence and spit being swapped that can skew decisions and viewpoints, and that's dangerous.

00:15:43 Speaker_01
It is dangerous. It's dangerous and it's spooky that you get pushback after that. So let's talk about the pushback, because it was immediately afterwards you started texting me like, dude, holy shit, these hit pieces are nuts.

00:15:55 Speaker_01
Because you could see the machine moving against you.

00:15:58 Speaker_01
So you could see that someone saw this Senate hearing, realized that it could potentially have an impact, and tried to do their best to mitigate those potentially positive effects for the health of American people. But it could cost them money.

00:16:12 Speaker_01
So they started pumping money into these media outlets.

00:16:16 Speaker_02
Absolutely.

00:16:17 Speaker_04
And this is what I've seen before, owning a compounding pharmacy. When I went on Jillian Michaels podcast, she is very opinionated and passionate about this. And it took me 10 minutes to explain to her that compounding pharmacies aren't bad guys.

00:16:31 Speaker_04
And because she had only heard

00:16:33 Speaker_04
the corporate media narrative of compounding pharmacies are dangerous, people are getting drugs from these compounding pharmacies that are in garages, and they're just willy-nilly making compounds and shipping them into the marketplace, and I had to methodically walk her through.

00:16:48 Speaker_04
Compounding pharmacies fall under the FDA's jurisdiction. My pharmacy's been inspected three times in 18 months. Every single ingredient we buy is an FDA-approved ingredient.

00:17:00 Speaker_04
Every single compound we compound, we send off to an independent third-party lab to verify, okay? And I say all this just to lay the groundwork. We've treated over a million patient lives at our pharmacy, over a million patient lives nationwide, and

00:17:19 Speaker_04
What they do in that environment is the media will list any recall, any mistake a compounding pharmacy makes, but sweep under the rug that big pharmaceutical companies like Eli Lilly and Pfizer have moved most of their manufacturing overseas where the FDA has to submit before they can come do an inspection and has to give them two months notice because they're coming into a foreign country and they've got to get visas and approvals and all these things to come inspect those facilities.

00:17:46 Speaker_04
They can't just walk in like they walk into my facility. And so Lilly, Eli Lilly in particular, one of the reasons they're struggling with back orders right now is their facilities have been popped for egregious action by the FDA.

00:18:00 Speaker_04
But none of that is in the public eye. You have to scour. I think Reuters is the only one that wrote an article. Little Compounding Pharmacy in Texas recalls 28 vials proactively for a mislabel.

00:18:13 Speaker_04
And the New York Post makes it national news, but you didn't cover Eli Lilly's nationwide issues on all these products or the fact that over 2,000 manufacturing facilities owned by Big Pharma haven't been inspected in five or more years.

00:18:28 Speaker_04
It's just not good journalism.

00:18:30 Speaker_01
It doesn't have integrity. Well, it just goes back to that $8 billion, that $8 billion has an effect. I'm sure these journalists aren't sitting there watching this Senate hearing going, you know what, I'm outraged.

00:18:40 Speaker_01
I feel like these people are full of shit. I'm going to help the American people and write this piece criticizing it. No, they're probably being instructed.

00:18:47 Speaker_04
Well, she sent us and said it was very vague. I get a voicemail, we want to write an article on your pharmacy. I find out at three o'clock I'm in meetings.

00:18:55 Speaker_04
We draft a response explaining all the things we do to go above and beyond and how our vision is to bring cost-effective prescription drugs to the American people for pennies on the dollar, typically less than your copay or deductible.

00:19:10 Speaker_04
what part of that, and in this article at the end, I shit you not, the girl puts, and by the way, Eli Lilly slicing prices by 50% on their weight loss drug. That's how the article ends. And I'm like, how is this not an advertisement?

00:19:24 Speaker_04
And so I looked, and now that I've seen it when I was a drug rep, I saw it when I owned pharmacies and labs, I saw it as a device rep, but I went and looked and said, okay, who owns the New York Post?

00:19:36 Speaker_04
And when you peel back the layers to that onion, the New York Post majority holders of stock are Vanguard, BlackRock, State Street. Now, let's go look at who are the majority owners into Eli Lilly. Vanguard, BlackRock, State Street.

00:19:53 Speaker_04
So the same folks who own the pharmaceutical companies, who have the most to gain by keeping the narrative the same and driving America towards the chronic disease crisis and monetizing your chronic disease with all the things you and I have discussed before, whether pharmacy benefit managers, insurance companies, hospitals, pharmaceutical companies, front to back, top to bottom,

00:20:15 Speaker_04
We've lost our way. We really have lost our way, Joe. It's all about quarterly earnings and quarterly profits. And I'm not saying that they're intentionally poisoning the American people to set them up so that they can knock them down.

00:20:28 Speaker_04
I just think it's so siloed and so compartmentalized and everybody's fighting for that extra dollar, that quarter, that day, that month, that they're just blocking and tackling and preventing the narrative from rising in their siloed bucket.

00:20:44 Speaker_04
But you have to, like in humans, we have to take a look out and go, hey, I'm not just treating your knee or your brain health or your heart health. The body is an organism that works together.

00:20:54 Speaker_04
We have to do a deeper dive to assess where the disease started, what caused it, and can we uncover the root cause and fix the root cause? We have to do the same thing in our systems and our protocols and our procedures.

00:21:08 Speaker_04
We know that corporate capture is real. We know that corporate capture has somewhat happened with the FDA, somewhat happened with Congress and the Senate. You know, everyone's scared to fight these guys, and they can wreck your lives. It's scary.

00:21:23 Speaker_04
And it's hard to fight when they control the media. They control all the funding to the advertising on the news networks. I mean, good luck getting a story out there.

00:21:33 Speaker_01
It's so weird that they've been able to do this for so long in such a shifty way. It really is, because there should be laws against that.

00:21:41 Speaker_01
If there's laws against insider trading, how's there not laws against manipulating narratives in order to profit at the expense of people's health?

00:21:49 Speaker_04
Yeah, and to even further highlight the level of corruption and corporate capture, I sent you and Jamie an article. I don't even remember the news outlet. But when you look, who owns that news outlet?

00:22:00 Speaker_04
OK, well, it says most of its funding comes from this PR firm. Then when we go to look at who owns the PR firm, it's Monsanto that owns the PR firm that got this other. And it's always layered. It's never abundantly clear. Like, it's hard.

00:22:14 Speaker_04
The other one we talked about was the Atlantic, you know, and as I peel the layers back to the Atlantic, it was owned by Bradley, who made his money being a consultant for Big Pharma and pharmacy benefit managers.

00:22:29 Speaker_04
He sold a big chunk of his company off to Optum, which is one of the dirtiest pharmacy benefit managers out there, and we broke that down on your previous podcast.

00:22:37 Speaker_04
The pharmacy benefit managers, for those listeners that don't know, were established in the 70s and 80s with the goal of driving down the cost of prescription drug care for America. But it got captured by the insurance companies.

00:22:50 Speaker_04
So Cigna, Aetna, CVS Health, all of those companies now own these middlemen that are negotiating rebates.

00:22:58 Speaker_04
So it's important to understand because those rebate dollars are held at that company and they're making billions off of chronic disease, billions.

00:23:07 Speaker_04
So if you're on a GLP-1 weight loss drug for the rest of your life and they've negotiated rebates to the pharmacy benefit plans that they own, they're oftentimes holding 40 to 50 percent of their profitability in a shell company that's not disclosed to the American public or the U.S.

00:23:23 Speaker_04
government. And when they establish a Medicare price point on a drug, they base it off of the average wholesale price in America.

00:23:30 Speaker_04
And that's important because they artificially inflated the fucking average wholesale price and they're giving themselves a rebate on the back end, but the government doesn't have line of sight into that. And they know it's happening now.

00:23:42 Speaker_04
It's been exposed. We talked about this again on your last fight, but it's like, I think it's the state of Idaho uncovered 230 million in fraud in one year. from the PBMs. One year. Now multiply that times all the states in the United States.

00:23:57 Speaker_03
Oh my God.

00:23:57 Speaker_04
And think about how much money is being made off of keeping people on prescription drugs.

00:24:03 Speaker_01
Did you see the article that I put on my Instagram that they put in The Atlantic? Is it time to torch the Constitution? I did. Did you see that? I did.

00:24:12 Speaker_03
It's scary, man.

00:24:12 Speaker_01
Same people. It's scary. Same people. They're putting a narrative out there to the general public. They're like, whoa, he makes a good point. Maybe we should just give up all our power to Satan. They're literally saying, should we torch the Constitution?

00:24:29 Speaker_04
It's crazy. It's scary.

00:24:31 Speaker_01
The only thing that protects us.

00:24:32 Speaker_04
And I say this, I feel like I woke up and became my grandpa. I remember him always bitching about politics and I'm not political.

00:24:38 Speaker_01
And he probably barely knew, right? You consider how much information was available to your grandpa. He just had a sort of a nagging suspicion that it's all corrupt and crooked.

00:24:48 Speaker_04
And I'm an idealist. I want to believe that like, I want to believe that people are looking for the truth. How cute. I want to believe that ... How sweet. I told you this, even with the DOJ and what I saw with enforcement bodies.

00:25:04 Speaker_04
When your data sets are corrupt and the only info you're receiving is from bad sources that are pushing agendas, but those sources also are your future employment when you come out of government service, it just becomes a dangerous, dangerous, slippery slope.

00:25:25 Speaker_04
there are often times where enforcement changes legislation through enforcement. Like right now, the DEA is reviewing if they're going to allow telemedicine companies to continue to prescribe testosterone.

00:25:38 Speaker_04
And that's crazy to me because it's like all these issues we have, all the chronic disease, there is not a testosterone crisis. This is not like the opioid crisis. There's not a lot of divergence.

00:25:49 Speaker_01
Or even the GLP-1 crisis.

00:25:50 Speaker_04
I mean, the amount of people that are having side effects to that in comparison to the testosterone thing. And that's where, you know, you and I disagree somewhat on the GLP-1s. Jillian and I disagree on the GLP-1s.

00:26:01 Speaker_04
Callie and Casey and I disagree on the GLP-1s. It's okay to disagree. There's nothing wrong with having differing lenses.

00:26:07 Speaker_01
Well, I think I understand your perspective. Your perspective is for chronically obese, like really morbidly obese people, we need to do something. And this is a very good step. And it does work. And it can help people. It is a very good step.

00:26:21 Speaker_01
I'm the hardcore discipline guy. I'm the like, what the fuck are you talking about? This is something that you can solve just by eating less.

00:26:28 Speaker_02
Yeah.

00:26:28 Speaker_01
Something you can solve by cutting out sugar, cutting out sodas, cutting out eating whole ingredient foods, eating fish and chicken and red meat and vegetables and cutting out all the bullshit. You're right. No, you're spot on. That's real.

00:26:43 Speaker_01
That's a real thing that you can do. However, if you're 600 pounds and if you've gone so far down the wrong road, you need a hand. You need someone to help you.

00:26:52 Speaker_04
That's where I'm like, if I was pushing an agenda, I have a ton to gain by GLP-1s going gangbusters. I'm not on that bandwagon. I literally sat there with the Senate meeting and said, this is crazy if we government fund prescribing GLP-1s to children.

00:27:07 Speaker_04
That's insanity. We need to fix our food products in schools. We need to limit soft drinks and advertising to children.

00:27:14 Speaker_04
There's a million things we could do that are way more logical and reasonable than starting to stick a kid with an injectable that they're going to take the rest of their life.

00:27:22 Speaker_01
But it's not as profitable. Yeah, that's the real problem. And the advertisements about that, they seem to me the same advertisement. It's the same feeling I get when I see advertising about giving babies COVID vaccines.

00:27:34 Speaker_01
Like, what the fuck are you talking about? Like, you're just trying to make money. You're not trying to protect babies from COVID. That's fucking nonsense. It's not a problem with them. It's just not. It's just statistically not an issue.

00:27:47 Speaker_01
It's certainly not an issue for you to be promoting this potentially dangerous, dangerous remedy.

00:27:52 Speaker_04
Yeah. Another example of that is that, you know, we were a foster family growing up. So we had up to seven foster kids at a time in my house. And I remember that the hep V vaccines that all those little kids had to get,

00:28:06 Speaker_04
And I didn't think about it at the time, but again, hearing some of my friends like Callie and Casey talk about it, the vaccine schedule's crazy because you're giving a child, a brand new baby, essentially a hep B vaccine.

00:28:19 Speaker_04
The only two ways to contract hepatitis B is basically you're injecting drugs or sexual activity. An infant's not going to have that, so why expose them to the risk factor of a potential adverse event when we know autism rates are through the roof

00:28:35 Speaker_04
All of these different health issues for children are climbing and at some point we have to assess what we're doing and say, isn't there a better way?

00:28:44 Speaker_04
But I know enough about how that system works and how things are negotiated on the back end and the lobby and now it's established and now it's hammered home.

00:28:52 Speaker_04
and then you assemble and you go have a meet with all the pediatricians nationwide and you have people as spokesperson that push that agenda and get senators and congressmen and women on the hook to go yes we need these vaccines incorporated as part of our policy to protect these children and I don't think

00:29:09 Speaker_04
It's not that it was... I don't think everyone's in on it. I think people are being duped and it's so siloed. That's one of the other things you and I have talked about historically with medicine. Medicine's so siloed.

00:29:20 Speaker_04
They don't look at the full human body. They look at, I'm a knee guy and I'm going to look at the knee. Or I'm a mental health specialist and I'm going to talk to this patient about their mental health.

00:29:28 Speaker_04
But your mental health is intertwined with your physical health.

00:29:32 Speaker_04
Your mental health, and this is what Dr. Palmer from Harvard talks about, you know, if we have metabolic disease and all these metabolic crises, it's going to lead to mental health issues.

00:29:42 Speaker_01
No question. There's been proven studies that show that SSRIs aren't as effective as exercise. by a large measurable amount. Like, exercise is more effective at curing depression and treating depression than SSRIs. That's a fact.

00:29:58 Speaker_01
But, you know, you can't make money off of someone running around this block unless you sell them sneakers. You can only sell one pair of sneakers every six months.

00:30:08 Speaker_04
What scares me, and again, not to shit on the GLP-1s, because we prescribe GLP-1s, we utilize GLP-1s, they are a tool in the tool belt, and when utilized appropriately, they can help people. but a hammer can kill someone if used inappropriately.

00:30:25 Speaker_04
And so if we make it our frontline defense, and again, we go back to the chronic disease crisis in America, and we say, okay, the food system's broke, then the people end up chronically ill, then we don't really assess people until, and our assessment tools in a primary care market are based off a sick patient population.

00:30:45 Speaker_04
If we base the demographic off the average American,

00:30:49 Speaker_04
that is dying of chronic diseases, and that is our measuring stick, then why are we shocked when we continue to have a boom in people dying of chronic diseases and being diagnosed with chronic diseases? Cancer, all-time high.

00:31:04 Speaker_04
I think there's going to be 2 million new cases of cancer diagnosed this year. Every single chronic disease is through the roof. The system is not working.

00:31:12 Speaker_01
I want to talk about you, because one of the things that's interesting about this is,

00:31:17 Speaker_01
You were unhealthy at one point in time and you were overweight and this is how you kind of started this journey And maybe a lot of people aren't aware of that Yeah, like you weren't you you had to learn all this stuff and you had to learn all this stuff to your own Personal health crisis.

00:31:31 Speaker_04
Yeah, I was What was I 29 30 years old? Early 30s, and I was 25% body fat pre-diabetic Headed towards all the same chronic diseases that we're talking about and I was your diet like My diet, I had, well, originally my diet was terrible.

00:31:50 Speaker_04
It was a traditional American diet, right? So I was a surgical rep and I had to be in the OR by 7 a.m. And so I would go do CrossFit every morning, then I'd go to the OR, I'd be in cases all day, I would eat whatever I could.

00:32:02 Speaker_04
I would drink a Starbucks Frappuccino, not realizing there's 1,800 calories of sugar and chemicals and no nutrients. I just didn't know. And I grew up in a family, again, a foster family where We were middle-class America, but maybe it was the 80s.

00:32:18 Speaker_04
Eating healthy was like eating wheat bread instead of white bread. It was eating low-fat Lay's potato chips and a Diet Coke. That's literally what my family thought was healthy. And that's a lot of Americans. They don't know.

00:32:32 Speaker_04
And you just stay with what you're indoctrinated into. So I started seeing a nutritionist in my 30s, and I did lean down, and I lost weight, and I was getting healthier, and I was headed the right direction, and I was still training.

00:32:44 Speaker_04
But he was like, if you're doing everything I'm saying, let me take a step back. I would go to a primary care, and it would take three months to get in with a primary care.

00:32:53 Speaker_04
Then they would just pull a basic lipid panel and then I would say, well, can we look at my hormones? No, no, we don't need to look at hormones. We're going to look at your lipid panel. We're going to do a wellness check.

00:33:02 Speaker_04
Well, that doesn't include hormones in this country. It's not a deep dive because they're scared to do that because the insurance companies control what they'll reimburse and not reimburse.

00:33:11 Speaker_04
And so clinicians in this country are terrified to do the deep dive and they only have six minutes with you. So they got to get you in and out of there.

00:33:17 Speaker_04
Long story short, six months later, still fat, still trying to lose weight, working out every day, seeing a nutritionist.

00:33:24 Speaker_04
Nutritionist said, I want to refer you to your urology buddy, Dr. Larry Lipschultz, who's one of the godfathers of urology and hormone optimization in the United States. And when I went and met with Larry, he was shocked after he pulled my blood work.

00:33:38 Speaker_04
We actually did it twice because he just didn't believe my readings. And my testosterone level after seeing him was 98. My god, it's it's insane.

00:33:47 Speaker_04
It's like a woman, but I know it was terrible And so he's like, of course, you're he's like, I don't know if you're fat because yeah, I told this story before I don't know if you're fat because you have low testosterone or if you have low testosterone because you're fat, but you are fat with testosterone and so that was my baseline and Through just what were you eating then when you went to the news?

00:34:08 Speaker_04
I was using the nutritionist, but then it was a question of was the hold but did I dig too big of a hole and then I was in the question is are you over training and you're crashing what little hormones you have left and your body's trying to get ramped up so we ended up treating at the time with HCG and clomiphene

00:34:24 Speaker_04
What do the nutritionists tell you to do? Oh, we prioritize protein. One gram of protein per pound of lean muscle mass. We cleaned up my diet.

00:34:32 Speaker_04
If you make protein the basis of your diet, because you need a gram of protein per pound of lean muscle mass to maintain.

00:34:39 Speaker_04
If you're trying to gain lean muscle mass, you have to up that protein intake, and then based off diet and lifestyle and activity level. And so we would prioritize my carbs through certain times of the day.

00:34:50 Speaker_04
We would keep me at a caloric deficit, and we'd prioritize protein in that caloric deficit. And what you'll find is mind-blowing. You aren't as hungry. If I don't eat

00:35:01 Speaker_04
a muffin and a Starbucks coffee loaded with sugar, I don't have that insulin response that causes the hunger cravings a few hours later where I'm back to eating another unhealthy meal choice.

00:35:12 Speaker_04
If you eat protein first, eggs, hearty, heavy foods, dense, nutrient-packed foods, your appetite is suppressed. It's a natural appetite. You can't overeat. It's really hard to overeat meat. It is.

00:35:24 Speaker_04
And so we prioritize proteins, healthy proteins, like chickens, fish, all of those sources, and then healthy carbs.

00:35:32 Speaker_04
Get away from sugars, whites, starches, prioritize healthy carbohydrate sources that are slower burning, that allow you to metabolize the protein that you're absorbing. Fruits and vegetables. Yeah. So how much weight did you lose that way?

00:35:46 Speaker_04
I literally went, well, starting on diet, I probably lost about half of the weight that I was trying to get off. So, I know body fat percentage, he got me from 25 down to about 15.

00:35:58 Speaker_04
And then when we added hormone optimization, not testosterone at the time, it was HCG and clomiphene, which boost your natural testosterone levels, being monitored by a clinician within physiological norms, right, to try and make sure that we're optimizing my health, not trying to get jacked and tanned.

00:36:17 Speaker_04
Literally helped me go from 15 to at the time. I think I dropped down to around 7% and I did not change anything I was working out the same way eating the same way.

00:36:25 Speaker_01
That's very lean.

00:36:26 Speaker_04
Yeah, and now I walk around 12 to 15 that's sustainable and I think in my 40s that's that's a level that makes sense to me but I think the way to do that is you don't wait for people to get chronically ill. I should have never been at 25% body fat.

00:36:43 Speaker_04
If we were getting proactive and predictive and we were truly doing deep dives into individuals and taking the time for our clinicians in this country to sit down and assess you at the biological level, then we can prevent these chronic diseases.

00:36:57 Speaker_04
And I'm not talking about through pharmaceutical intervention. We can prevent these through diet, lifestyle, nutrition, and helping teach the patient that there's a better way. And if we need to involve pharmaceutical intervention, it's there.

00:37:10 Speaker_04
There's options out there that can help patients kickstart their health and wellness, especially people in their 40s.

00:37:17 Speaker_01
Hmm. So when you did this, how much time did it take overall from the original nutrition intervention to hormone optimization? How much time are we talking about? It took about a year.

00:37:31 Speaker_04
And that's where it gets crazy with the insurance model. So a lot of people don't know this. Most insurance carriers in the US don't practice preventative. So testosterone would be considered a lifestyle drug.

00:37:43 Speaker_04
The challenge with an issue like the DEA, if they really do over-regulate testosterone and shut telemedicine companies down from prescribing it, it's going to limit accessibility for these patients.

00:37:54 Speaker_04
Because primary carers don't want to prescribe it, right? And so they're going to punt them off to a urologist.

00:38:00 Speaker_04
Typically, for an insurance company to cover it, you've got to have two or more fasted blood tests of a testosterone below 250 nanograms per deciliter. So that's a chronically ill man.

00:38:13 Speaker_04
To come back twice, I mean, that's going to take you six months to get in with that urologist. That's in the dream world. So just to get the insurance coverage, you're talking six months to a year.

00:38:23 Speaker_04
And by then, that patient has been chronically ill, headed towards metabolic disease, diabetes. We know that testosterone is important to insulating us from certain types of cancer.

00:38:34 Speaker_04
It's important to our metabolic health, our bone mineral density, our lean muscle mass. All of these tie into, health and longevity and healthspan in preventing chronic disease.

00:38:57 Speaker_04
I think somewhat, yes, but I also think the insurance model is an obstructionist model, right? And so I can give you a different example with the opioid crisis. There were non-addictive, non-abusive pain creams, okay?

00:39:12 Speaker_04
If somebody is going to be put on, they have an ACL surgery, they're in pain. I'm not here to say there's no need to ever have a pain pill, but in those instances, there were alternatives. that are non-abusive, non-addictive. What are the alternatives?

00:39:28 Speaker_04
There were ketamine-based pain creams that were topicals that could not be diverted or you couldn't extrapolate the ketamine out of it and abuse it.

00:39:37 Speaker_04
So nobody ever got high or stimulated from it because it's a cream that you can't extrapolate the ketamine out of. So you could not abuse it. You couldn't divert it if you wanted to.

00:39:45 Speaker_01
So it just works locally?

00:39:46 Speaker_04
It just works locally to address that knee pain. insurance within 12 months, quit covering it, because those creams cost hundreds of dollars, whereas an opioid is like, I think, $10 a month, right?

00:39:56 Speaker_04
And then the other thing you'll find is the pharmacy benefit managers, who the insurance companies own, have reimbursement deals on certain drugs. So when you get a drug, it's not because it's the best drug or the most efficacious drug.

00:40:11 Speaker_04
It's because the PBM, Pharmaceutical Benefit Manager, has negotiated a rebate and decided to place that drug on Tier 1 or Tier 2 based off their financial incentive in that drug.

00:40:23 Speaker_04
Testosterone's been on the market so long, it's compounded a million places. There is no rebate for the big pharmaceutical companies or the big insurance companies on testosterone. right? And so it's just an additional cost.

00:40:38 Speaker_04
And so the more they can obstruct things that cost money but don't pay dividends back to them, they'll put obstructions in the way.

00:40:46 Speaker_04
So another example is not only did they shut down alternatives to opioids during an opioid crisis, they also cut lab reimbursements on toxicology screenings at the same time that we're on an opioid bender as a nation

00:41:03 Speaker_04
They got rid of the last safety net, which was if you come into a pain clinic asking for opioids, they're going to make you do a toxicology screen to make sure that you're not abusing other drugs, that you're not diverting the drug, that this medication's actually in your system.

00:41:18 Speaker_04
All of those reimbursements used to be covered by insurance companies, but they got rid of that. And so as soon as they got rid of that, there was no checks and balances. And so it is layered. It's very nuanced. It's never as simple as yes or no.

00:41:30 Speaker_04
And I'm just, I'm telling you what I saw. I'm just trying to tell you what I saw. I'm not saying I have all the answers.

00:41:36 Speaker_01
I like how you hedged your bets there. But I mean, that's all highlighted in that Netflix documentary that Peter Berg made about the Sackler family, which is

00:41:46 Speaker_01
Not documentary which called docudrama series that fucking series is so enraging and after that you know that one guy that they Kept in a hotel room for like two days of the FDA who knows what they did for that guy to that guy What the fuck did they do to him where they got him to approve that they found that guy so

00:42:04 Speaker_01
Like, I was in a small town in New Hampshire, and they ostracized him. People were just... The sheriff was, like, trying to highlight how many people in the community had died of opioid overdose and how much blood was on his hands.

00:42:17 Speaker_01
Well, he took a job with the Sacklers.

00:42:19 Speaker_03
Yeah.

00:42:20 Speaker_04
He worked at the FDA, approved that, took a job with Sacklers, which... That's what we all did. I know we beat that horse dead, too, but 13 out of the 15 last... Out of the last 15 heads of the FDA, 13 have gone to work for industry.

00:42:31 Speaker_04
You know, and that's tough. That puts everyone in a tough position. If we're going to allow people to work one place one month and then go work for the bad guys the following month, how can we regulate that? It's so dirty. How is that legal?

00:42:42 Speaker_04
A lot of people don't know the Sacklers, that was their second time creating a crisis in America. In the 70s they created the Valium crisis. They got all the women. I think it was one in three housewives were addicted to Valium in the 70s. One in three?

00:42:56 Speaker_04
Congress went after the Sacklers then and they ended up taking a settlement and they paid their way out of it. Slap on the wrist, no criminal charges ever brought forward.

00:43:04 Speaker_04
And they rode off into the sunset after creating this Valium crisis of the late 70s, early 80s. Oh my God.

00:43:11 Speaker_01
Jamie, pull up that tweet that I sent you from Jay Bhattacharya. So Michael Pollan, he's highlighted the dangers of pesticides.

00:43:23 Speaker_01
The USDA funded a PR organization that worked with agricultural interests to downplay the harms of pesticides in farming and to compile defamatory dossiers on opponents of pesticide use. including food writer Michael Pollan.

00:43:39 Speaker_01
Just imagine that the USDA spends money to defame people. Using your tax dollars, spends money to defame people that are trying to tell you that there's poison in your food.

00:43:56 Speaker_01
Measurable amounts, something along the lines of 90 plus percent of Americans have roundup in their system, they have glyphosate in their system from crops?

00:44:09 Speaker_04
That was one of the things I learned, too. Five percent of the human brain mass and weight is now made of, is now plastics. We learned that in the hearing, too. Five percent? Blew my mind. Never heard that statistic.

00:44:21 Speaker_01
Oh my God. It's terrifying. Revealed, the U.S. government's funded private social network attacking pesticide critics. So what does it say about this?

00:44:31 Speaker_01
In 2017, two United Nations experts called for a treaty to strictly regulate dangerous pesticides, which they said were a global human rights concern, which, by the way, Roundup is illegal in a lot of countries, citing scientific research showing pesticides can cause cancers, Parkinson's disease, Alzheimer's, and other health problems.

00:44:49 Speaker_01
Publicly, the pesticide industry's lead trade association dubbed the recommendations unfounded and sensational assertions.

00:44:58 Speaker_04
But what's crazy is this is Monsanto, which is also Bayer, and we talked about that.

00:45:03 Speaker_04
This is the company that knowingly infected people with HIV and shipped it to third-world countries because their hemophilia drug had been contaminated, and they knew they'd get busted if they shipped it in the U.S., so they shipped it to third-world countries and knowingly infected thousands of people with HIV.

00:45:25 Speaker_01
And we're trusting these people? Look what it says here. Publicly, the pesticide industry's lead trade association dubbed the recommendations unfounded social assertions and private industry advocates have gone further.

00:45:36 Speaker_01
Derogatory profiles of the two U.N. experts, Hilal Elver and Bhaskar Tansak, are hosted on an online private portal for pesticide company employees and a range of influential allies.

00:45:53 Speaker_01
Members can access a wide range of personal information about hundreds of individuals from around the world deemed a threat to industry interests, including the U.S.

00:46:03 Speaker_01
food writers Michael Pollan and Mark Britman, the Indian environmentalist Vandana Shiva, and the Nigerian activist... You say that one. How do you say that? How do you think you say that name? Nemo Bossy. Nemo?

00:46:18 Speaker_04
Nemo Bossy.

00:46:21 Speaker_01
Nemo Bossy. Many profiles include personal details such as the names of family members, phone numbers, home addresses, even house values. The profiling is part of an effort which is financed in part by U.S.

00:46:37 Speaker_01
taxpayer dollars to downplay pesticide dangers, discredit opponents, and undermine international policymaking according to court records, emails, and other documents obtained by the nonprofit newsroom Lighthouse Reports.

00:46:52 Speaker_01
It corroborated with The Guardian, The New Lead, Le Monde, Africa Uncensored, an Australian broadcast corporation, and other international media partners on the publication of this investigation.

00:47:03 Speaker_01
The efforts were spearheaded by a reputation management firm in Missouri called V-Fluence. The company provides services that it describes as intelligence gathering, proprietary data mining, and risk communications.

00:47:18 Speaker_01
The revelations demonstrate how industry advocates have established a private social network to counter resistance to pesticides and genetically modified crops in Africa, Europe, and parts of the world, while also denigrating organic and other alternative farming methods."

00:47:35 Speaker_01
Wow. Wow.

00:47:38 Speaker_04
I mean, it doesn't, it's just, I think it was Jason during the testimony, he said, and this resonated with me,

00:47:45 Speaker_04
Do we need double-blind studies to know that chemicals we spray on pesticides and chemicals we spray on fields that cause disruption in mitochondria of insects and destroy them at the cellular level might possibly, can we at least say might possibly, create some sort of issue in other biological beings?

00:48:06 Speaker_01
No, that's unfounded. That's an unfounded assertion. More than 30 current government officials are on the membership list, most of whom are from the U.S. Department of Agriculture. This is so crazy.

00:48:19 Speaker_01
It's so crazy that this is so blatant and that your tax dollars... What gives me hope, though, is they were willing to talk.

00:48:24 Speaker_04
That does give me hope, Joe. Like, the Senate... They took a risk, man. They took a risk. They allowed us to come in. They did say, hey, we recommend you don't go too hard in the paint. And everyone said, fuck that. And they just dropped bombs. They know.

00:48:39 Speaker_01
They're insiders from their space, and they know. The only way it's going to affect people is these viral video clips have to go online, and people have to share them on Facebook and Instagram and Twitter.

00:48:48 Speaker_01
Thank God they can, because who knows if the government could clamp down on it the way they have in other countries.

00:48:55 Speaker_01
Other countries have severely clamped down, and there's been some real issues in America, but America still is the best place to distribute information. I mean, X is banned in Brazil right now, right?

00:49:07 Speaker_01
There's a lot of shenanigans going on all throughout the world where people are trying to control narratives, and it's fucking spooky. It's spooky.

00:49:15 Speaker_04
If we look at it, if we really look at it, if it wasn't for you, I would have never met RFK, and if it wasn't for coming on your show, I would have never got my message out there.

00:49:25 Speaker_04
If it wasn't for Tucker's podcast, Callie would have never got his message out there, and Casey.

00:49:30 Speaker_01
Well, if it wasn't for you, you know how banged up I'd be, dude? How many times you've helped me with stem cells?

00:49:36 Speaker_01
I talk about it all the time, but I know there's a gentleman that I'm friends with that I've just been talking to who's about to go to a disc He's getting his discs fused, and I'm like, Jesus, have you looked into other options?

00:49:48 Speaker_01
Have you looked into stem cells? I mean, you could go to Tijuana, and I know those guys at the CPI have treated many people, including my friend Shane Dorian. He had fantastic results.

00:49:58 Speaker_01
My friend Tom Land in Utah as well, he went down there and got his spine injected. Fantastic results. I tell people all the time, like,

00:50:06 Speaker_04
I love CPI. I love all these guys. All ships rise and fall with the tide. We're in this together. Our battle is not each other. Our battle is the federal government.

00:50:16 Speaker_01
You're very, very good about that. I think that's very important to say, that you're not a competitor of these people. You feel like there's more than enough for everybody, and you're more than happy that these people are around.

00:50:26 Speaker_04
I'm just glad there's a voice, because we've got to get the message out there that there are alternatives.

00:50:34 Speaker_04
It's almost like a fairy tale that they've told the American people that, hey, if it's an FDA approved product and it's in a hospital or your doctor tells you it's good as gold, it's science. And it's not. A lot of it's never been researched.

00:50:47 Speaker_01
A lot of these doctors, unfortunately, are ignorant as to all these other remedies that are effective.

00:50:53 Speaker_04
I can tell you, working with primary cares, there's some of the hardest-working, most patient-focused folks out there, and they're just tired. They're beat down. They're exhausted. They've got to see 40 people a day.

00:51:05 Speaker_04
Most of them are now employees of a hospital. And so the hospital doesn't really care about the primary market because it doesn't make money. The reason you have the primary care market is to control the referral network to the hospital system.

00:51:19 Speaker_04
And so they need those primaries, referring knees, shoulders, elbows, hearts, spine, brain, neurosurgeries. That's where their money is made. That's where they can really build insurance companies and get big reimbursements.

00:51:33 Speaker_01
But I think it's also what I was saying, that a lot of these doctors aren't aware that this stuff works. I told you about my shoulder injury. When I went to the doctor, he told me, you are going to have to have surgery.

00:51:42 Speaker_01
You're going to have to bite the bullet one day and have surgery. And I was like, shit. He goes, you could try other things, and it might help you for a little while, but you're going to have to have surgery.

00:51:52 Speaker_01
The only thing that gave him pause was when he did the strength tests with me, where he pushed down on my arm and did all that kind of shit. But I just think that's because the muscle around the damaged joint was strong.

00:52:05 Speaker_01
And so he was like, well, you're pretty functional. He goes, the MRI, you shouldn't be able to do all this stuff according to your MRI.

00:52:13 Speaker_04
We still battle that. I can tell you, GSP, he's coming in again this week, and he's talked about us, I think, on Europod. He's posted about us. He's the man. He's amazing.

00:52:21 Speaker_04
But when I met him, he was a skeptic, and he said, I know I'm talking to you because of Joe, but, like, my doctor said this is bullshit. I'm up in Canada, and he said that there's no such thing and that I have to have surgery to fix this shoulder.

00:52:33 Speaker_04
We fixed his shoulder. He's posted about it. He never had surgery. He went back in. The doctor's like, I don't know what you're doing, and there are dozens of NFL athletes we've worked with.

00:52:42 Speaker_04
I don't think any of them, other than Aaron Rodgers, has told their doctor that they're working with us. Like, big-name athletes, but they're scared of the team doctor. And I get it.

00:52:51 Speaker_01
Yeah, well, kudos to Aaron, because the team doctor was trying to tell him to avoid all that stuff, including stem cells. Yeah, it's just nuts and I think the doctors aren't doing it because they're bad people.

00:53:00 Speaker_01
I think they don't know I think they don't have time to do the deep dives most doctors How much peer-reviewed literature do you think most doctors who are in orthopedic surgeons who are in practice? How much are they absorbing?

00:53:11 Speaker_01
How much time do they have between? malpractice insurance between medical school bills that they're in debt with between the overhead that they have to run their practice I mean they have to get people in and out of the office quickly and

00:53:24 Speaker_04
Well, and you also go back to who funds studies and who funds, when I worked as a med device rep, I can tell you we funded studies, but those studies were going to be focused on and geared towards moving our products. Of course.

00:53:36 Speaker_04
And so we didn't have a stem cell or biological product because we sold hardware and we wanted ACL surgery, shoulder surgeries, knee surgeries, because that's how the company made its living.

00:53:50 Speaker_04
And so again, it wasn't that we were against it or trying to destroy it It was more of if you can trivialize it and focus on what makes you your check That's where everyone's at and everyone's so compartmentalized.

00:54:02 Speaker_04
It's easy to almost have plausible deniability. Yeah, so like somebody comes in with to a primary care and they're overweight and they're diabetic and they're anxious and they're not sleeping and

00:54:14 Speaker_04
The doctor's gonna write them five drugs and push them out the door, not because they're a bad person, but because that is how we teach clinicians to practice medicine in this country. That is the dogma of the situation we're in.

00:54:26 Speaker_04
They're taught, prescribe first, ask questions later. Rather than deep dive, understand the root cause of the disease, let's understand what is this person, like the question you asked me. What are you eating? How much sleep are you getting?

00:54:39 Speaker_04
Are you getting sunlight?

00:54:40 Speaker_01
Are you stressed? But all this takes time. This is the issue. If you want to move people in and out of the office, all this takes time. One of the things that you guys do at Wasted Well is you do comprehensive blood analysis.

00:54:51 Speaker_01
When I sit down with Denise, my eyes glaze over and it's my body. It's like, God, there's so many details to cover. There's so many things. But by following those directions, I've noticed a giant difference in my overall health. You know, it's amazing.

00:55:07 Speaker_01
It is amazing and it's just it's unfortunate that this kind of resource is not available to more people Where more people don't have access to a doctor that's going to look at them Comprehensively look at their whole body as an like if you're gonna take care of your yard if you're trying to grow plants in your yard and you know your trees are all dying your vegetables weren't growing if you had the resources you can go to a botanist and

00:55:29 Speaker_01
Or you could go to someone who understands farming, someone who's a scientist, and you could say, what's wrong? And they could do soil analysis. My friend Steve actually did this. He was trying to put a garden in his house in Brooklyn.

00:55:43 Speaker_01
And they found that leaded gasoline from all those years, from the 1960s, all those years where they used leaded gasoline in Brooklyn, because it's polluted, all that shit had gotten so deep in the soil.

00:55:58 Speaker_01
That his backyard was contaminated with leaded gasoline. And so you have to do a detox on the backyard. So there's certain plants that you can plant that can help in that process. There's certain treatments to the soil that can help in that process.

00:56:14 Speaker_01
Why aren't we doing that with the body?

00:56:20 Speaker_04
I can give you another example like one of the tests we do and I don't promote it it's expensive and it's because the lab we use is expensive but it is amazing and it's it's a cancer screening and so we in our health care system today only screen for essentially proactively five different types of cancer

00:56:37 Speaker_04
tumor-based cancers. Okay, well there's a blood test that can screen for over 200 tumor-based cancers, and it can tell you when you're at level zero, right? Undistinguishable, because usually how they're diagnosing is through

00:56:54 Speaker_04
Imaging and so the challenge with imaging is pixelation right the image can't capture the cellular level blood work can so at the cellular level We can tell you when you're at stage zero on a cancer up to seven years prior to you developing cancer on over 200 different types of cancer Why would that not be implemented into our health care system or at minimal what I argued with the senator about was?

00:57:20 Speaker_04
Okay Let's just say we can't afford this for all Americans. Why in the hell wouldn't we at minimal be doing this for our firefighters, our military veterans?

00:57:29 Speaker_04
We know that over 70% of firefighters and military veterans will develop cancer in their lifetime. It's staggering because of dealing with ballistics and weapons and guns and all those are carcinogens.

00:57:40 Speaker_04
Firefighters are dealing with smoke and smoke inhalation and all the different chemicals they come in contact with.

00:57:46 Speaker_01
I never thought about that in terms of guns, like shooting guns. Like when you shoot guns, like if you go to a range and shoot guns, like how much toxic chemicals are you absorbing?

00:57:56 Speaker_04
Yeah, well all that gets in your skin and gets absorbed through the skin, so there's carcinogens in all of those things. Especially indoors, right? Like an indoor range versus an outdoor range. And it's disproportionate.

00:58:09 Speaker_04
Our first responders and our military personnel disproportionately have higher cancer rates. Especially firefighters.

00:58:15 Speaker_01
Yeah. Think about all the things that they breathe in that are on fire. I mean, look at how many veterans have suffered because of burn pits, which is an insane thing that they did. They said, oh, we have all this garbage.

00:58:25 Speaker_01
What's the most cost-effective way to get rid of it? Let's make a massive fire that runs 24 hours a day and throw tires in it, fucking plastic, everything. Whatever the fuck you got laying around, throw it in that burn pit.

00:58:39 Speaker_01
Oh, and when the wind blows and that shit goes straight through camp, that's what everybody's breathing. And who knows how many people develop cancer because of that.

00:58:47 Speaker_01
I know multiple people that I know personally that have developed severe illnesses and even died because of that.

00:58:53 Speaker_04
Well, and you can even see when we talk about diet and food and environment, it's even happening.

00:58:58 Speaker_01
Wasn't it Biden's son? Didn't he develop, I think he developed a disease that was theorized that it came from burn pits. See if you can find that. I believe that's true. I believe he served... It wasn't meth? No, that was the other son.

00:59:15 Speaker_01
The other son was the good guy. Biden addresses possible link between son's fatal brain cancer and toxic military burn pits. Isn't that insane? His own son.

00:59:25 Speaker_04
So crazy.

00:59:26 Speaker_01
So he couldn't even protect his own son. I mean, he's a powerful politician.

00:59:29 Speaker_04
That was the message I wanted people to get.

00:59:34 Speaker_04
Yes, we were talking to senators, but the truth is we were talking to the American people and it was guys We don't have my thing to the public is I'm not here to tell you that I have the answers to the test I'm here to tell you I have the questions to the test Yeah, and I'm telling you what I saw and I'm being honest and I'm trying my best.

00:59:52 Speaker_04
I am NOT fucking political left, right different wings to the same bird.

00:59:57 Speaker_04
Like I will say right now the right is talking about this because of Bobby Kennedy and I know that Trump is wanting to meet next week as a health expo to dive in and try and understand from people in the industry what's going on behind the scenes and how we're headed towards this chronic disease crisis.

01:00:15 Speaker_04
But what gets scarier is if we don't get this under wraps, we've got a rapidly aging patient population. We have a rapid decline in the amount of primary cares. You know, I talked about this last time.

01:00:26 Speaker_04
We're going to have a 30% shortage in primary cares, and it already takes three months to get in with a primary care. We're headed over a cliff. We have got to get chronic disease under control in this nation, and we've got to do it fast.

01:00:38 Speaker_01
I want to say something, too. There's a lot of people that vehemently disagree with a lot of this stuff, and there's a lot of people online, like the people that write the articles, the woo-woo stuff. They just don't know.

01:00:49 Speaker_01
There's no way they actually knew what was going on in a comprehensive way and would still write those articles. You would have to be evil. I don't think those people that are writing those articles are evil.

01:01:01 Speaker_01
I think they're doing a job, and I think they're being directed, and I think they're being directed by people that have a vested interest in this information, just like we talked about with that USDA thing.

01:01:10 Speaker_01
They have a vested interest in this information being dismissed. And there's money behind it. There's a financial interest behind it.

01:01:17 Speaker_04
They try to say if we can't agree on one topic, that we have to disagree on all topics. And that's the most frustrating thing to me. My neighbor's amazing. She's an amazing person.

01:01:26 Speaker_04
She sent me a message and was like, you know, Bobby Kennedy sold out and blah. I'm not, I don't care about the Maha movement. And I'm like, this isn't about Maha or Trump or any, this is about people. Because she's a hardcore liberal? Yes.

01:01:38 Speaker_04
But I'm like, this is about people, though. And don't let them fool you. Don't let them fool you. I agree. I don't agree with the Republicans on half the things.

01:01:47 Speaker_01
The problem is Trump as a person. People just react to him in the most negative way. Yeah.

01:01:55 Speaker_01
And they are fully convinced that all of his negative character traits, all these negative things are unbefitting to a president and therefore he shouldn't be president. I think anybody who wants to be president is fucking insane. They're all insane.

01:02:13 Speaker_01
I think it's just like kind of everybody else that's a leader in almost every industry. I think they're insane people. I don't think you get to the top of any heap unless you're out of your fucking mind. And you could be out of your mind in a vicious

01:02:30 Speaker_01
Sort of demeaning attacking all your enemies way like Trump is and it's still the same Drive is what led that guy to deal with this shit for four years where they were trying to put him in jail So that he doesn't run again and still run again and they try to kill him twice and he's still running It's like you I think I mean, I don't know

01:02:52 Speaker_04
He's a way braver man than I am, because I would retire on an island.

01:02:56 Speaker_01
It's a different kind of human. And my point is, the only way you get someone who's not affected by that is you have to have an insane person. It's literally the best tool for the job, because everybody else...

01:03:09 Speaker_01
All the 34 counts which were not felonies, which they upgraded from a misdemeanor, which passed the statute of limitations, all of them were bookkeeping errors or mislabeling things, which is illegal.

01:03:25 Speaker_01
They're minor offenses that would not get anybody prosecuted.

01:03:29 Speaker_01
Much less put in fucking jail real potential for him being in people want him to put him in jail They want to put him in jail for a long fucking time and it's crazy you're doing it at the same time where ice admits that what are the numbers of murderers and Convicted criminals that have made it into this country.

01:03:49 Speaker_01
It's something bananas and this is just verified this is verified data and Do you know what it is, Jamie? Because I could find it. Somebody sent it to me, and I literally couldn't believe it's real.

01:04:01 Speaker_01
So I'll send it to you, and you can find out if it is real. Because if it's true, it's fucking bananas. And just the sheer numbers, they're scary. These are scary numbers, man. It's like no one thinks this is a problem.

01:04:16 Speaker_01
Look, I am the product of immigration. My grandparents came here at a time where it was very easy to come here. And I just sent you a screenshot, see if you can find out if it's true.

01:04:28 Speaker_01
It was very easy to come here, and a lot of people who came here were criminals. Look, a lot of people in my family were criminals. They were Italians in the 1920s. My grandmother went to jail.

01:04:39 Speaker_01
When I was a kid, my grandmother went to jail for bookmaking.

01:04:41 Speaker_04
Yeah, I know. When you watch The Godfather, the original Godfather, the ties to Italy and how intertwined all that is is wild, and that's somewhat based on reality.

01:04:51 Speaker_01
My grandmother's sister murdered her husband. These are wild people. These are people that came over on a fucking boat before YouTube. They didn't even know what it was like over here. They took a chance. They took a chance.

01:05:04 Speaker_01
So I am completely sympathetic to immigrants, but you can't let in fucking gang members. Okay, there got to be some kind of screening you want to make it easier to get in for people that are hard-working people That just want a better job.

01:05:15 Speaker_01
I'm with you. Yeah, I'm with you Just make it easier for them to get in make it easier for the people that have been here for 20 years to become Citizens make yes. Yeah, I know people I know a kid who was she's 28 now. She was born in America and

01:05:30 Speaker_01
But her, no, she was born in Mexico, but her parents brought her over here when she was a baby. So she doesn't speak Spanish, she has been in America her whole fucking life, and she's not an American citizen.

01:05:42 Speaker_01
So she can't vote, she's limited in the kind of jobs she can do. It's fucking weird. It's weird that we do that, but yet my grandparents just came over on a boat and fucking, they write a piece of paper and they're in. It's nuts.

01:05:54 Speaker_01
We should have a screening process to keep evil people out. That's it. Everyone else, look, you imagine if you're born in Guatemala, wouldn't you want to come over here and get a job as a landscaper?

01:06:06 Speaker_01
Fuck, you could make 600 bucks a week, 700 bucks a week. Oh my God. And then you live in a family, in a house with a bunch of people, which are used to doing anyway. And then someone branches off and makes their own business.

01:06:17 Speaker_01
And all of a sudden you're living the American dream. Right, this is what we all want for everybody.

01:06:20 Speaker_01
Yeah, that's there's there's enough for everybody, but you can't let in murderers Yeah, this is crazy and you can't like let them in and ship them to swing states and then try I mean It's just so in-your-face ship them to swing states and then there's all this talk now of amnesty for all the people that came in well

01:06:42 Speaker_01
i'm all for amnesty for the people that have been here their whole life like this this girl that i know who's 28 years old now i'm all for that yeah yeah that makes no sense she should be american she's a fucking american she pays sales tax and all this other tax

01:06:57 Speaker_01
Yeah, yeah those people, but there should be some sort of a screening process.

01:07:01 Speaker_01
You know if you're in fucking gangs that bring in fentanyl hey Maybe maybe we should let that guy in and this is the whole idea of having borders in the first place and what it's shocking is is if you try to come here legally, it's very difficult.

01:07:17 Speaker_01
I've had friends from Canada, like comedians from Canada that want to move to America. It's a long fucking process to become an American citizen. It's difficult. And you have to do homework. You gotta fucking, you gotta, you gotta answer tests.

01:07:31 Speaker_01
But if you just walk in, they'll give you money. They'll house you. They'll give you an EBT card. They'll give you food stamps. What the fuck are we doing? Well, we must be doing something. So it's either one of two things. Either we want cheap labor.

01:07:44 Speaker_01
And this is what Tim Dillon thinks. He thinks that the cheap labor market for construction and all these jobs that most people don't want to do anymore, it's falling off a cliff. And the best way to sustain those industries is to bring in cheap labor.

01:07:57 Speaker_01
And the best way to do that is to bring in migrant workers. because they're willing to do jobs that a lot of people won't. And this is the positive side of like Springfield, Ohio, where people talk about the Haitians that moved there.

01:08:06 Speaker_01
The people that employ these Haitians say these people are hard workers. They're so happy to be here. They want the American dream. That's great. That's what we want. We want more of that. That's all good. But

01:08:18 Speaker_01
You can't make it insanely difficult for a college-educated person from Norway to move here because they want to do... Literally, when Chamath was on, he explained that when he was over here going through his visa process, they had to show that he was doing something that an American couldn't do.

01:08:37 Speaker_01
You have to be someone of exceptional skill, a very difficult person to find, and then you could get a passport. You can get a green card and eventually become a U.S. citizen.

01:08:47 Speaker_01
But it's a long process and a difficult process because every year when you go to get your visa renewed, you're at the whim of this person. Who knows if they had a bad day?

01:08:57 Speaker_01
Who knows if their fucking wife just started fucking the mailman and they found out about it and she drained their bank account and he's like, fuck you, go back to Canada. They can do that to you. They can do that to you at a whim.

01:09:09 Speaker_01
But if you walk in, Nancy Pelosi wants you to get an amnesty.

01:09:12 Speaker_04
I've got a buddy who's a wildlife photographer for Cabela's. He's from somewhere over in Russia, but it literally took him years to get his citizenship.

01:09:24 Speaker_04
And he became friends with the girl who worked at the guy who approved his desk and would literally message her. And she'd be like, nope, not today. Nope, not today. And he waited for a day when the guy was having a great day.

01:09:36 Speaker_04
and went and had his meeting and he got his citizenship, but it took him years. And now he's working here for Cabela's shooting wildlife photography and living the dream.

01:09:45 Speaker_04
And he grew up reading in Russia, reading these books about the great West and like he wanted to be a cowboy. And he tells these stories, but he is an example of somebody who believes in the American dream. And that's, that's where I go back to.

01:09:59 Speaker_01
It's difficult. So, let's see what it says here. Department of Homeland Security Spokesperson Turden Newsweek. The data in this letter is being misinterpreted.

01:10:07 Speaker_01
The data goes back decades and includes individuals who entered the country over the past 40 years or more, the vast majority of whose custody determination was made long before this administration.

01:10:17 Speaker_01
Okay, so, but you are still saying that those people are here. noted that his letter that ICE is bound by statutory requirements not to release certain non-citizens from its custody during the pendency of removal proceedings.

01:10:31 Speaker_01
He added that most non-citizens who are convicted of homicide are typically not eligible for release from ICE custody.

01:10:40 Speaker_01
Like, listen, if you fucking kill people, if you're an illegal alien, you sneak across the border and you kill Americans, how about nobody's eligible for release? How about that? Let's just start with that.

01:10:52 Speaker_04
Well, I mean, if you think about it, if you're a felon in the United States, you're not allowed to vote. So wouldn't it make sense that we don't accept somebody with a criminal record into the United States?

01:11:05 Speaker_04
We have a lot of fights that we're already fighting and a lot of budgetary restraints as a society that we can't really dig ourselves out of the hole with right now.

01:11:14 Speaker_01
Bill, we have so much money for Ukraine. It may be shocking to hear the Biden-Harris administration is actively releasing tens of thousands of criminal illegal aliens into our communities, but their own numbers conclusively prove this to be the case.

01:11:26 Speaker_01
This defies all common sense, read a statement. Newsweek has contacted the Harris campaign for comment via email outside of standard working hours. What does that mean? What is standard working hours? Oh, that's why they didn't get back to him?

01:11:40 Speaker_01
It was outside of standard working hours. The email arrived at 5.15. Put that back up again. Department of Homeland Security spokesperson told Newsweek the date in this letter is, oh, this is the one that says it's being misused.

01:11:54 Speaker_01
So this is a Department of Homeland Security spokesperson says it's being misused. Scroll that down. Scroll that down a little bit further. See what it says there? Uh-huh. Congressional Republicans voted against them twice.

01:12:09 Speaker_01
Democratic presidential Kennedy added, we took executive action to reduce unlawful border crossings. See, this is the thing that gets weird.

01:12:16 Speaker_01
It's like, you know, they say that Trump, the Biden administration is trying to say that Trump blocked some sort of border wall bill because he wanted it to be something that he could campaign against.

01:12:28 Speaker_01
So he instructed the Republicans to vote against it. It's there so much that kind of fuckery. I don't know if that's true or not, but it's the possibility of that being on the table That's I'm not accusing anyone of doing that.

01:12:41 Speaker_01
But imagine a world where it's a Person could conspire and I'm not saying they did but a person could conspire to make something happen Because that would be something that they could campaign against look what you did and that's how dirty this game is that's why nobody wants to do it unless you're fucking crazy and

01:13:00 Speaker_01
Unless you're crazy like Trump. And he just weeds. He sent Mark Cuban a letter when Mark Cuban's television show failed in like 2004 or whatever the fuck it was. And someone posted it on Instagram today. See if you can find it, Jamie. But it's so petty.

01:13:19 Speaker_01
It's so petty and the fact that he signed it and sent it to him, took time out of his day to have someone draft a letter, probably didn't type it himself, have someone draft the letter and send it to Mark Cuban in the mail.

01:13:39 Speaker_01
But it takes that kind of a person to literally make their way through the system. The only way you get through all these attacks. And we've seen the full force of it. It's like we've seen all the orcs that were hiding in the forest. They all came out.

01:13:56 Speaker_01
The level of hell that those people go through. This is the letter. This is from 2004. Mr. Mark Cuban, dear Mark, I'm truly sorry to hear that your show has been canceled for lack of ratings.

01:14:08 Speaker_01
When I initially called you to congratulate you on The Benefactor, little did you or I realize how disastrous and embarrassing it would turn out for you. If you ever decide to do another show, please call me and I'll be happy to lend a helping hand.

01:14:24 Speaker_01
With best wishes, Donald Trump. But what a crazy backhanded Why I don't I mean what beef I don't they must have some kind of beef What is the beef about the guy's hilarious that is hilarious It's hilarious that he takes time out of his day.

01:14:45 Speaker_01
Yeah, not just like Say good. Fuck that guy that show got canceled takes time out of his day. Yeah to write like A conciliator- I'm sorry. Sorry this happened to you, man.

01:14:57 Speaker_02
Yeah.

01:14:58 Speaker_01
You fucking loser. Like, literally writes it in there. The whole thing is wild.

01:15:03 Speaker_04
But what's hard is people use those things to distract us and to divide us. Even with my neighbor, I know we agree on 80% of the things. It's like, hey, I'm not against or for anyone. I'm not against Kamala. I'm not against Trump. I'm for team humanity.

01:15:20 Speaker_04
I am for can we work together to solve the problem. And whoever wins, whether Trump or Kamala, I hope that we can continue the momentum and the dialogue and I hope that you know, we can truly have an open conversation that gains traction.

01:15:36 Speaker_04
And what I love about it being public is it's forever memorialized in public record.

01:15:42 Speaker_01
I think there's no hiding it. Yes. And I think it will, and especially in today's day with, I've seen so many videos sent me of your testimony and I've had them recommended to me on Instagram too from accounts that I don't even follow.

01:15:54 Speaker_01
So it's getting around. But I think, What's also interesting is that social chaos, it unveils things. It unveils things about human beings. And that is one of the benefits of having a guy that you can decide is Hitler.

01:16:13 Speaker_01
Like, even though half the country loves him. Half the country loves that dude. Maybe more than half the country now. There's a lot of silent loves that guy people.

01:16:22 Speaker_01
Because they realize, like, there's not a lot of other options out of this other than a fucking crazy person who would write Mark Cuban a letter like that.

01:16:32 Speaker_04
You you need to be insane to pull this off Yeah, and you might need to be insane in a way that you or I would find distasteful it is insanity because even at a smaller level just testifying in front of the Senate the level of hate and just Like misrepresentations of truth.

01:16:48 Speaker_04
I don't even want to call it lies, but to me it's lies the level of like misrepresentation and taking things out of context and it just It just doesn't seem genuine, and it doesn't seem like people are really fighting for truth.

01:17:04 Speaker_01
They're fighting to win a game. You were genuinely shook by it, but what I told you is the truth. Nobody cares. Don't read it. Nobody cares. Don't read anything about yourself, even good things. Nobody cares. People know what the fuck is going on.

01:17:16 Speaker_01
They get to hear you talk in forums like this. They get to hear you actually talk and lay it out. They know who the fuck you are. All this is all just noise.

01:17:26 Speaker_01
But the good thing about this kind of noise, this social chaos, is that it unveils all this corruption. It unveils the orcs that are hiding in the forest. You see it. And I am convinced

01:17:41 Speaker_01
If they know the efficacy of foreign countries using social media bots to attack people, they know that that works. They know that that shifts narratives, especially for people that are sitting on the fence. They know all that stuff works.

01:17:54 Speaker_01
If you don't think that there's companies in America that we're not aware of that organize social media campaigns and have bots attack certain individuals like yourself, for having a dangerous narrative. If you don't think that, you're crazy.

01:18:10 Speaker_01
You're naive.

01:18:11 Speaker_04
But what's insane to me, Joe, is what part of saying, hey, we need to better understand how we're growing our food, how we're processing our food, how we're preserving our food.

01:18:22 Speaker_04
Maybe leftover petrol chemicals aren't the best way to preserve our food products in America. You're not allowing that in other nations. And we're looking at the data, the statistics and the numbers, and we're saying something's not right.

01:18:35 Speaker_04
The point of that conversation was to say, today's the day we start the dialogue. You know, the journey of a thousand steps starts with one. And I look at it and say, my message was, how do we fix this?

01:18:48 Speaker_04
Well, we start by acknowledging there's a fucking problem in the first place.

01:18:51 Speaker_01
Dude, they don't care. This is just about money and just about justifying the things that you're saying, the narratives that you're pushing to try to get that money. If they came out with an article

01:19:02 Speaker_01
If someone did a peer-reviewed study that showed that if you drink exactly 13 glasses of water a day, you never get sick and you never get cancer.

01:19:10 Speaker_01
There would be articles the next day saying if everyone drinks 13 glasses of water a day, there'll be no water for black people and people of color and the indigenous people, the trans people would die of dehydration and the wells would dry up and then the crops and we're not going to have food and there's a lot of impoverished people.

01:19:28 Speaker_01
You don't need 13 glasses of water a day. There would be some sort of a justification.

01:19:34 Speaker_01
If you came up with some sort of a diet that you could follow and everyone would live to be 150, there would be an article about how dangerous it is to tell people to stay healthy.

01:19:43 Speaker_01
Because if we all live to be 150, the resources will all be gobbled up. That's what's crazy to me.

01:19:45 Speaker_04
Literally we're there saying diet, lifestyle, nutrition, getting proactive, predictive, and personalized. That's the message. It's a beautiful message. The system's waiting for you to get sick and then they're giving you drugs.

01:19:56 Speaker_04
Rather than waiting to get sick and taking a drug, let's get proactive and predictive. Let's look at you at the biological level. Let's stop the chronic disease from developing at its roots and prevent this crisis.

01:20:09 Speaker_01
And don't you think there's a way that companies can do this and make money in an ethical way?

01:20:14 Speaker_04
Absolutely. There has to be. And that's where I say, I'm not a philanthropist. We make money and we're doing it for a fraction of the cost of the system today. We really are.

01:20:26 Speaker_04
The patient's getting a deep dive into over 70 biomarkers an hour on the phone with a clinician.

01:20:31 Speaker_04
The only way I can scale this and make it better for people and more cost-effective is AI and large language models, which is what I'm rapidly running towards, which even in that Hatchet Job article, she says, and he's illegally using AI to prescribe—I'm not prescribing medicine using AI.

01:20:48 Speaker_04
claim that? She says something of that nature. We are using AI to assess blood work and then it is reviewed by a board-certified clinician that then re-asserts the AI's homework and the AI is just there as an additional tool.

01:21:08 Speaker_04
Now the vision of the future And I think this will happen is I think AI will replace a lot of primary cares in America.

01:21:15 Speaker_01
It's going to replace a lot of things. And anybody denying the efficacy of AI at this point is ignorant. You have to be ignorant willfully. You have to be willfully ignorant because They have used AI right now to diagnose diseases that people miss.

01:21:30 Speaker_01
They believe that AI is going to allow to assess breast cancer in a much more effective way because it can do something with visuals that human beings can't see with the naked eye because you're detecting things.

01:21:41 Speaker_01
AI is going to be able to have a much, much higher percentage. of a chance of catching that cancer.

01:21:48 Speaker_04
Even at a great cash pay clinic, you know, like I think Ways to Well is a phenomenal clinic. I think there's hundreds, if not thousands, of phenomenal cash pay clinics. Peter Atiyah is brilliant.

01:21:59 Speaker_04
In any of those practices, the clinician has to do a chart review before you come in. that's going to take them at least 20 minutes if they're doing a good job.

01:22:07 Speaker_04
Then they're going to spend 45 minutes to an hour with you, walking you through everything in your chart, what they saw, family history, genetics, epigenetics, cross-reference that with blood work. That's a lot of work. AI can do it instantly.

01:22:22 Speaker_04
And at your own timeline and discretion. So your blood work comes back. Joe, you're busy. You don't have time to get on the phone for 40 minutes with a provider. No problem. You log into the app, and you ask Alan.

01:22:34 Speaker_04
Alan, hey, remind me again, what was my blood work on testosterone? And then Alan's going to tell you, and then you can ask this AI anything.

01:22:43 Speaker_04
And it is backed by all the peer-reviewed journal studies, white paper studies, all the data that we've loaded in that has been cross-referenced by our clinical team. And we're guiding that.

01:22:53 Speaker_04
It's not an open architecture, but we're allowing it to essentially help practice medicine in a way that we believe is the appropriate approach to medicine. And how can that be bad? Just think in the future.

01:23:05 Speaker_04
It's gonna be the way of the future and it'll allow us to get a cost effect crazy The world is that's something that's straightforward the way you laid it out so brilliantly Someone could label that as bad or woo or woo Because you would know the AI imagine the world we're in this in again a sword cuts both ways every tool can be good or bad but what I'm envisioning is a

01:23:26 Speaker_04
AI monitoring you 24-7, tying into your wearables. We know your REM sleep, your heart rate variability. You've gone through and you've done a DEXA. I know how much lean muscle mass you have, how much visceral fat, how much subcutaneous fat.

01:23:38 Speaker_04
I have your epigenetics, your genetics all loaded in. I know your family history. We've done a cancer screening. I know that you have no forms of cancerous tumors in your body at this moment.

01:23:50 Speaker_04
From there, now we have a clean bill of health and a starting point, but we're tracking you. I know that Joe slept five hours on Saturday. I know that Joe got one hour of sleep on Saturday.

01:24:01 Speaker_04
And then we can accrue those data sets and begin to cross-reference it. Like right now, we have over 60,000 patients at Ways to Well. Imagine when it's nationwide and we have millions. How are you monitoring their sleep? We're not yet.

01:24:14 Speaker_04
This is the app that we're launching. We want to be agnostic, so we want to tie into SleepAid, we want to tie into Whoop, any of them. If you'll give us access to that data, we'll know what date you started prescription care.

01:24:28 Speaker_04
You'll be able to refill your medicine straight through the pharmacy because it's vertically integrated. Here's the challenge with traditional medicine. Every software is based on how to get paid from the fucking insurance company. That's it.

01:24:41 Speaker_04
Pharmacy software is 30 years old. It is purely based on, how do I get my money from CVS? How do I get my money from United? It's not meant to be a tool that helps drive health span and health care.

01:24:55 Speaker_04
But if we vertically integrate pharmacy software with the medical practices software, with the AI, the variables, the REM sleep, it then knows what date Joe started, glutathione or whatever, a peptide or whatever it is.

01:25:10 Speaker_04
And we're going to see if we can track a marked improvement in heart rate variability, REM sleep and all those variables. And then at the end of a year, we reassess you proactively and personalized through a DEXA and a VO2 max.

01:25:22 Speaker_04
And we say, look, Joe, you gained one pound of lean muscle mass. You didn't put on any additional body fat. Your visceral body fat is at an all time low. Your chronic disease score is an A plus.

01:25:33 Speaker_04
we do not think you're headed towards a chronic disease we are pro active not sitting back waiting for you to get cancer we're going to roll our sleeves up and go to fucking work and it's not hard this does not cost a fortune it is totally affordable i hear all the time like it this is your body this is the one this is how i ended my speech to the senate and i believe this four hundred trillion to one

01:25:58 Speaker_04
400 trillion to one are the chances you are alive in this room today. What are we going to do with it? Are we going to let these bastards at Big Pharma and Big Medical profiteer off of our family members and profiteer off chronic disease?

01:26:12 Speaker_04
Or are we going to take sovereignty and accountability? Are we going to test ourselves and drive our health span and take ourselves out of their fucking shitty life raft that's going down?

01:26:22 Speaker_04
Like, it doesn't matter if you have a first... Republican, Democrat, congratulations, you have a front row seat on the fucking Titanic. That's where we're headed if we don't get proactive. It is not a left or right issue. This is an American issue.

01:26:36 Speaker_04
That's all I keep trying to hammer home. And thank God the Republicans are talking about it, and I hope the Democrats will start talking about it.

01:26:42 Speaker_01
That's why it's so fascinating about, that's what's so fascinating about ideological capture, that the thing that you would think would be one thing we could all agree on, we should all be healthy, that that would get attacked, and that it would be more cost effective, you could use technology, and you have a much more comprehensive understanding of your health, and that gets attacked.

01:27:05 Speaker_01
That's how upside down things are. And there's people that, if they think it,

01:27:12 Speaker_01
Helps their their career or it helps them in in journalism It helps them get more kind they will be the attack dog They'll be the attack dog and go after someone with about as straightforward a message as you can get Yeah

01:27:29 Speaker_04
It's it's and it was one of the things that RFK said that I think it really did resonate with me was we have to stop we have to start loving our kids more than we hate each other and seeing like

01:27:43 Speaker_04
I won't name names, but I know a little girl who struggles with her weight, and I look at that, and this kid is doing all she can. And it's hard to tell a little kid, like, your friends can eat that candy, but you can't.

01:27:56 Speaker_04
Everyone in school is drinking their soft drinks and all these things, and it's bad for all of them. It's just some kids are metabolically showing it sooner. You know, but it isn't good for anyone who's consuming these things.

01:28:08 Speaker_01
And they're insanely addictive, too.

01:28:10 Speaker_04
And it creates an environment, yeah, that this is an addiction issue now. And then that leads to a mental health issue and low self-esteem.

01:28:18 Speaker_01
Yeah, part of the problem with the addiction of food, too, is you have to eat food. You know, it's not like anything else. Addiction to gambling is like you can stop going to the casino. Yeah. But addiction to food is like you have to eat food.

01:28:29 Speaker_01
So every day you're testing your will.

01:28:31 Speaker_02
Yeah.

01:28:31 Speaker_01
Every day in a profound way that if you stay out of the casino, you're not, you know, like he's not being tempted. But you have to imagine if you were a gambling addict, but you had to make three bets a day. Yeah. What?

01:28:44 Speaker_01
You're a food addict, but you have to eat three meals a day. That's fucking insane.

01:28:48 Speaker_04
And that's where the GLP-1s, where I do say morbidly obese, chronically ill, diabetic, pre-diabetic, patients headed over a cliff, it has been rebranded as a lifestyle drug for any girl who's trying to lose weight for spring break. That's dangerous.

01:29:04 Speaker_04
And it is dangerous to say that there is no risk-reward to prescribe that in children. We don't know the long-term ramifications.

01:29:13 Speaker_04
It's a little bit different risk analysis when we're talking about a chronically ill obese patient in their 40s headed towards Chronic disease crisis that's going to kill them. Yeah, that's a different

01:29:26 Speaker_04
risk profile and safety profile analysis than a 12-year-old little girl who's overweight. That's a totally different talk track.

01:29:34 Speaker_04
So, you know, I have some differing viewpoints from the other folks on that committee, but that's the beauty of a democracy. We can disagree on topics, but agree on the issue of we've got a lot of work to do and some things to fix.

01:29:50 Speaker_01
But it's very straightforward. You could disagree all day long, but What you're saying is so straightforward and so beneficial to everyone across the board. If there's anything that you would want in life, like, have you ever been sick? Real sick?

01:30:05 Speaker_01
And you're like, God damn it, I can't wait to be better again. It doesn't matter if you're rich, it doesn't matter if you're happily married, you love your job.

01:30:11 Speaker_01
If you're fucking dying, you're in bed and you literally can barely get up to pee, and then you're crushed and you lay back down in bed, you go, oh, what did I do to fuck this up? How did I get so sick? I am going to take care of myself.

01:30:24 Speaker_01
I am going to fucking get back on track. A lot of people don't, but some people actually do. They actually do realize at that moment, like, I can't let this happen again.

01:30:33 Speaker_01
Like whatever I did to my immune system, pulling all-nighters, working at the job fucking 16 hours a day, and then you get like a horrible flu and you're bedridden for two weeks.

01:30:44 Speaker_01
During that time, the one thing you want more than anything is to be healthy. You ask a healthy person what they want, they give you a thousand things. You ask a sick person what they want, they want to be well. They want to be well.

01:30:56 Speaker_01
If you told a person who's worth Bill Gates' money, if you said to Bill Gates, hey, you could have the flu for the rest of your life and keep all that money, or give it all up. You're going to have to start from scratch, but you'll be healthy.

01:31:07 Speaker_04
He would give it all up and start from scratch. You're spot on. You don't understand.

01:31:14 Speaker_04
I sit at dinners when I get the opportunity to be with my family and I look around the table and I really do think, Joe, ever since losing my brother, I am so present in those moments. And I just want everyone to be healthy.

01:31:27 Speaker_04
And I want the good memories to last. And I want to be able to watch people live happy lives. And all the data and numbers and statistics, they're so overwhelming that people lull over.

01:31:39 Speaker_04
And that's why in front of the Senate, I brought it back to, I'm just going to talk about people.

01:31:43 Speaker_04
I didn't even talk about statistics because there were way smarter people out there than me from Harvard, Stanford, all these academic types that are brilliant.

01:31:51 Speaker_04
And I'm like, but at the end of the day, guys, if the Senate doesn't understand, these are your children, your wives, your brothers, your sisters, your husbands, your wife. Like this is this is these are family members. This is not just a number.

01:32:05 Speaker_04
These are real lives. 1.9 million people dying a year of chronic disease. That doesn't even include deaths of despair, suicide, opioid abuse. We are a chronically ill society, and those impacts destroy families. Destroy families.

01:32:22 Speaker_04
The ramifications are so far beyond finances and numbers, but even finances and numbers, 24% of our federal budget, health care. Number one budget concern federally is health care. Number one concern for most states, health care.

01:32:37 Speaker_04
Number one reason for bankruptcy in the United States for an individual, health care. It is a huge problem, but that's the dollars and cents of it. The real cost is paid in human lives and lost loved ones.

01:32:50 Speaker_04
And that's all I wanted them to hear is, don't sweep this under the rug. These are fucking people dying.

01:32:56 Speaker_01
How much of an effort has been put forth after the whole Sackler family crisis and the opioid crisis to mitigate the amount of these things that are prescribed?

01:33:09 Speaker_04
I think a tremendous amount, but the problem is then you swing that pendulum to over-regulation and you've created a drug addict in the marketplace and all those addicts turned to fentanyl and black market products.

01:33:23 Speaker_04
Because the addiction's already there. Now we've already addicted, and more people are dying of opioids today than ever before. And so the damage is- You know they prescribe less. Yeah, the damage has been done. And that's what's hard.

01:33:37 Speaker_04
I don't know how you put that genie back in the bottle. The question becomes, what is the next opioid crisis?

01:33:42 Speaker_01
It's almost like a hoarder's house. Like, how do you even clean this up? You ever see those hoarder shows? You're like, what the fuck do you do with all this? It's almost like us.

01:33:53 Speaker_01
And the opioid crisis thing, the really scary thing is we're propping up cartels. We're propping up really vicious people that are criminals. They have to be vicious. That's how you get ahead in that world.

01:34:06 Speaker_01
There's no rules when you're in organized crime and you kill a lot of people. And that's what you prop up when you have drugs illegal. But now if you have drugs legal, If you just have, I mean, this is a dilemma as well, right?

01:34:19 Speaker_01
Because if you just had legal drugs, everything was legal. How long would it take for people to figure out to not do cocaine? How would long, you know, if you could just get cocaine the same way you can get Coca-Cola, how weird would that be?

01:34:30 Speaker_04
I would even argue that the market we live in now is a pharmaceutical insurance cartel. You know, they are glorified drug dealers monetizing people's chronic disease.

01:34:42 Speaker_04
And they have such a stranglehold over academia, the universities, they fund most of the studies, the NIH. I mean, we just systematically go down from the food system to the government regulatory bodies, to the enforcement committees, to everything.

01:34:58 Speaker_04
They control the media. Like as soon as somebody gets, you know, get a little mouthy, anything, they come and hammer you. And try to discredit you and portray it.

01:35:08 Speaker_01
Also how transparent it is, like who owns the companies.

01:35:11 Speaker_04
I know, but most people aren't going to spend the time to go like, I looked because I'm like, who is this attacking me? I want to understand their viewpoint. It wasn't, oh, haha, gotcha. I'm going to bust these people.

01:35:22 Speaker_04
It was more of, let me try and understand the other side and try and see what we could have said that would have been so inflammatory because the message is, hope. It was hope. It was unity. It was working together. It was dropped apart.

01:35:35 Speaker_01
It's become healthy. Get America healthy. Anybody would be opposed to that. That's, I think, also a real problem with liberals during this election.

01:35:44 Speaker_01
The concept of make America healthy again is so bipartisan and so universal and so clear and the fact that the Republicans are running with it. They're so mad, like that should have been something the Democrats, the Democrats used to be anti-poison.

01:36:01 Speaker_01
The left used to be anti-corporations, dumping pollution in the waters. They were against big corporation. They were pro-free speech. They were against censorship. They were pro-reasonable discourse.

01:36:17 Speaker_01
about sensory people and that everything's just gone so topsy-turvy to have the left be against a movement. What you should be saying is, yeah, fuck Trump, but This Make America Healthy Again thing is a good idea and we should probably do it too.

01:36:30 Speaker_01
We should probably just steal their idea. We should probably say, whatever you guys are going to do, we're going to do it too, but we're going to be a better president, so go with us. If they were smart, that's what they would do.

01:36:39 Speaker_01
People would say, oh, you stole that idea from Trump. She'd say, yeah, I stole it. It's a good idea. I like good ideas. I'm not dogmatic. Show me a good idea, I'll accept it.

01:36:47 Speaker_04
And that's where I go, who has the most to win by dividing us? It's not the Democrats. It's not the Republicans. the powers that be.

01:36:56 Speaker_04
And when we peel back the layers, BlackRock, Vanguard, that own the majority shares of these pharmaceutical companies, that own the majority shares of most the media outlets, that own the left and the right, they push agendas and they can control everything essentially except podcasts and free speech.

01:37:11 Speaker_04
And that's one of the things that Jordan Peterson said in a meeting the night before we testified was he implored us to stop trying to cater to the mainstream media because he said it's a lost cause. It's a lost hope.

01:37:24 Speaker_04
I hate to say that to you guys, but the world is giving up on them. Why are you guys wasting your time with them?

01:37:30 Speaker_04
Focus on podcasts, books, areas where you can truly, in a long-form format, expose the truth and ask and respond to hard-hitting questions. And we talked about you and your platform and this is

01:37:46 Speaker_04
you know, has been that people try to label it as misinformation at times. And I'm like, what part is me? Anytime I've come on, I've cited all my references on the Ways to Well website. I list reference after reference, study after study.

01:37:58 Speaker_01
Most of the things that they labeled as misinformation during COVID turned out to be true. I mean, especially, you know, what they did to Peter McCullough. Peter McCullough is the most published doctor in his field in human history. He's not quack.

01:38:12 Speaker_01
Jay Bhattacharya, he's a professor at Stanford, right? Isn't that where he is? What? These are the fucking actual experts. These are the real experts. Like, you guys are out of your fucking minds. And you're saying this is misinformation?

01:38:27 Speaker_01
But the problem is misinformation is like, you know, label it homophobe, transphobe, misogynist. Once they, racist. Once they get you, they put that on you, misinformation. You spread misinformation. You're like, what? What misinformation?

01:38:41 Speaker_01
Tell me what wasn't true.

01:38:43 Speaker_04
Yeah, and I'll even say, and again, I don't know. I don't want to be too conspiratorial. I went to bed and I was exhausted after that Senate hearing. I posted it. I'm a nobody. I didn't expect. I went to bed and I want to say I had 1.3 million views.

01:38:59 Speaker_04
And I posted a rebuttal about one of the periodicals that was misrepresentative. And I just posted, hey, Not a fair assessment of what happened today.

01:39:10 Speaker_04
2,000 American people traveled from around the country to sit and hear an open dialogue that was bipartisan, backed by some of the best and brightest minds in medicine. Harvard, Stanford, Stedman Hawkins, all were present.

01:39:24 Speaker_04
This was not a bunch of influencers, blah, blah, blah. Shame on you. That was all I posted. Didn't get in the weeds. Woke up the next day and all the momentum was gone like it.

01:39:32 Speaker_04
We only we still I think are sitting at 1.3 million I don't believe and then Casey got messaged.

01:39:39 Speaker_04
Hey, they'll D platform you be careful if you start naming specific news outlets and I still believe that somehow we got D algorithm or D prioritized after we began to push back on on the media for the stuff they were saying.

01:39:54 Speaker_01
Most certainly. I'm sure. And you probably got attacked anyway once they realized that it was gaining momentum. It's very creepy. And I wonder like at what level they can manipulate things at Google and YouTube.

01:40:06 Speaker_01
I mean there's there's a level that they can actively suppress videos and they can actively suppress social media accounts and social media posts.

01:40:15 Speaker_01
You know, when my special was going to go live on Instagram or on Netflix, rather, on Instagram, Cam Haines put a thing in his story saying that it was going to go live. And they said that he couldn't mention me. He wasn't allowed to mention me.

01:40:35 Speaker_01
He wasn't allowed to mention me. Yeah. I forget what the label was.

01:40:38 Speaker_04
Your JRE Experience. I don't know if they're affiliated with you or just a fan page. JRE Experience Instagram. He print screened and messaged me and it said this video is not suitable for repost or something.

01:40:50 Speaker_04
My video from testifying in front of the Senate.

01:40:52 Speaker_01
And they won't let you repost things.

01:40:53 Speaker_04
This was a Senate hearing. What are you talking about?

01:40:56 Speaker_01
So someone has their claws in meta that's able to suppress information. Someone has their claws in YouTube. Someone has their claws. And you could use whatever label.

01:41:06 Speaker_01
You could say the advertisers don't want to advertise on this because it's a controversial subject and that's the problem. OK, if that's all it is, but then it should still get a lot of views. So if you want to withhold advertising,

01:41:20 Speaker_01
But the views are substantial. That means that it's really being shared in a normal way with something so outrageous and something that gains that much momentum that quickly. It doesn't make sense that that peters out that quick. It was too profound.

01:41:33 Speaker_01
It resonated with too many people.

01:41:35 Speaker_04
It was going crazy, and then I would see a hundred new follow, a hundred like whatever, and then the next morning, dead. Totally dead. Like literally right after we were all trading texts about that article, and we're like,

01:41:46 Speaker_04
I just cannot believe they reacted with an article this fast, and it's a total misrepresentation of what occurred today. And it tried to make it sound like it was a left or right-wing political movement, like a right-wing political ideology.

01:42:01 Speaker_04
And it's like, everyone in that room, in fact, most of the people on the panel, were Democrat backgrounds, registered Democratic voters. There were some Republicans on there, but it was a mixture. It was a melting pot. And we're all free thinkers.

01:42:16 Speaker_04
Don't take my ability to think critically away from me. I don't give a shit which party you're part of. I am here for team people. Let's talk about the issues and stop trying to make this left or right. It's not.

01:42:28 Speaker_01
But they're smart in that all they need is one or two articles in a respected publication to cite, to point towards the fact that this is misinformation and someone from whatever organization would look at that and gloss over it real quick.

01:42:42 Speaker_01
Oh, yeah, yeah, we'll suppress that.

01:42:43 Speaker_02
Yeah.

01:42:44 Speaker_01
And that's all they need. When I even think one step further, I feel like

01:42:49 Speaker_04
I feel like, for example, the New York Post article, I honestly, the way they worded that, they tried to make it sound like I'm just a regular on your podcast and I come on here and just shit all over the FDA.

01:43:01 Speaker_04
And I'm like, I'm doing my best to be transparent and say they're at a disadvantage, they're underfunded, they didn't build this model, they were put in this model.

01:43:10 Speaker_04
And they're doing their best to navigate, but they're underfunded, understaffed, and chronically corrupted. by the environment itself, but I would tell you the same thing with academia, the same thing with hospital systems.

01:43:23 Speaker_04
It's not me picking on one person.

01:43:25 Speaker_01
Also, the people that work in the FDA, if you've been working in the FDA for four years, how much of a dent do you think you could put in the momentum of the machine that's behind you? What are you going to do? You're going to stick your neck out?

01:43:33 Speaker_01
You're going to get it chopped off. You're not going to move up the corporate ladder. It's not set up that way. And that's just the reality of being a human being and you go, hey, I do my best.

01:43:42 Speaker_01
Most of those people, like most people, they're good people. Most people in all walks of life are good people. But sometimes good people do bad things because they can or because they have to.

01:43:53 Speaker_04
The biggest thing I saw in health care was doctors were exhausted, whether orthopedic surgeons, neurosurgeons, you know, I mean, I told you this, my buddy who is, he's a prominent sports medicine surgeon. He's a team doctor for multiple teams.

01:44:07 Speaker_04
You know, he's had highest positions at hospital systems. Even he says what am I gonna do man? What am I fucking supposed to do?

01:44:15 Speaker_04
You know, I gotta I need to do surgeries I've got to do a certain amount of surgeries to make all the all of this flow and work and I've got to hold my team accountable for the amount of surgeries in their volumes and You're never supposed to make it about volumes but all of these hospital systems are incentivized off volume metrics that are based off

01:44:34 Speaker_04
cranking out the most amount of surgeries and so there is a tremendous amount of pressure from the top down and with insurance companies dwindling reimbursements and dwindling like even primary care reimbursements but also surgical reimbursements you're not going to be able to innovate

01:44:50 Speaker_04
when it's a race to the bottom, right? A total joint's paying less now. It's gonna take an 8% haircut every year, and it has for like the last 15 years.

01:44:59 Speaker_04
So nobody's gonna go out and buy some brand new state-of-the-art joint, or even innovate a brand new state-of-the-art joint, because it's all about commoditizing it and driving down the cost right now to make it affordable to even get a joint.

01:45:12 Speaker_01
So it doesn't even incentivize innovation. Correct. That's crazy, especially with something like replacement joints, which you would hope I mean, they've gotten a lot better at that. How many people do you know that have had hip replacements?

01:45:23 Speaker_01
I know a bunch. I know a bunch. And it's like they're walking around, like quick. Graham Hancock came in here six weeks after his hip replacement. And you know, he's 150,000 years old. According to his aging everything's older with him.

01:45:41 Speaker_01
No, I mean he's Graham's gotta be in the 70s, right and back then. I'm not sure how old he was This is back when we're in LA, but he was walking around six weeks later fine. No limp nothing It's extraordinary what they could do now. It's amazing.

01:45:56 Speaker_01
You would hope that they would continue to innovate in that way you know what's going on in California right now with home insurance There's a real crisis in California with home insurance. Pull up the home insurance crisis.

01:46:13 Speaker_01
Home insurance is sky high, particularly in areas where they have wildfires because they lose so much. Where I used to live in California, I was evacuated three times.

01:46:24 Speaker_02
That's crazy.

01:46:24 Speaker_01
Yeah. And the last time, my kids were real little, and we went in the middle of the night. We had to take off at 2 o'clock in the morning. The fire was coming over the hill that was maybe 200 yards from us.

01:46:37 Speaker_04
Growing up in Houston, I was used to hurricanes. A fire would be terrifying.

01:46:40 Speaker_01
Insurance keep dropping California homeowners. Changes are in the works to try to stop their cherry picking. There's a, you know, they don't want to insure houses that are likely going to burn or going to fall off of a fucking hill.

01:46:55 Speaker_01
Like, I remember I was watching this news special about Malibu and there was a mudslide in Malibu, like a landslide. So these people, they parked these fucking $5 million houses on stilts on the side of a hill.

01:47:11 Speaker_01
Like, hey, why do you think the side of the hill varies so much? Do you think maybe it moves? Do you think maybe over time, shit fucking comes down? It's not like a smooth skateboarding slope.

01:47:22 Speaker_01
No, it's an unpredictable mass of land that's affected by years and years of drought. So when you get drought, you don't have plant growth. If you have no plant growth, you get more erosion because there's no root systems.

01:47:34 Speaker_01
And then chunks of this fucking hill were falling off. And these people were in the middle of the night, they heard cracking. as their house was breaking apart in the middle of the night.

01:47:43 Speaker_01
Their house started breaking apart and falling down the hill and they got out just in time. It was crazy. The guy was like, I just heard cracking. I thought someone was breaking in. Then we got up and we didn't know what was going on. His house was

01:47:55 Speaker_01
Cracking in half. Are they having that many claims? Is that why the insurance is that? There's a lot of claims with wildfires. There's not that many claims with landslides.

01:48:04 Speaker_01
But this is one that was like, there's like, California has some real natural disaster problems. And the big one happens every 20, 30 years and hasn't happened since 93. That was the earthquake thing.

01:48:18 Speaker_01
Yeah, that fucking thing that happens over there all the time, where everything fucking shakes and houses fall down.

01:48:25 Speaker_01
like highways pancake i came the first time i ever came to hollywood i was doing this thing for mtv and i came out here right after the earthquakes in 93 and i was like this is nuts man i remember driving by a highway that had collapsed on another highway it was like right afterwards

01:48:43 Speaker_04
I've only been in one earthquake, and it was in Japan. We were at Disney in Japan, and an earthquake hit.

01:48:51 Speaker_01
This recently?

01:48:52 Speaker_04
Yeah. We were with Phillip, Frank and Lee, and Margarita, and Amanda and I were all there, and literally the earthquake hit. I get a text. And I look and all the Japanese people are looking at their phones too. And it's like, like an amber alert.

01:49:07 Speaker_04
And I look and it says, seek shelter, nine point, whatever, eight points. That was a huge one. I don't know earthquakes. I don't want to tell you the wrong. Whatever the giant one was that just happened.

01:49:17 Speaker_04
And every Japanese person just dropped to the ground and covered their heads. And we were in a cave, like a man-made cave at Disney. So Amanda looked at me and was like, fuck that, and just took off running. And we like ran out of the cave. Good move.

01:49:31 Speaker_04
But everyone was just down on the ground, and then the tsunami warnings followed. And I was just thinking like, I grew up with hurricanes and you know they're coming. You have like a week. The earthquake stuff is terrifying. Terrifying.

01:49:45 Speaker_04
Like that is scary. Japan gets some big ones. And the earth is literally throwing things and moving.

01:49:50 Speaker_01
That's way scarier to me than hurricanes. The biggest one I've ever been in was a small one. It was like a 5.5 and they said it was actually an aftershock of the Northridge earthquake. But it was right after I moved to L.A. So it was like 94.

01:50:02 Speaker_01
I was sitting in my apartment. And all of a sudden, my apartment moved like a refrigerator box. You know, if you're a kid, you'd play, like someone got a new refrigerator, your kids would play in the box and fuck around, make a little hut out of it.

01:50:16 Speaker_01
Yeah, yeah. You know, carve little windows out of it and shit. It was like that. The whole apartment moved like that. It wasn't even any noise. It was just the shaking of the building. But it seemed so flimsy. That's all I could remember.

01:50:30 Speaker_01
I remember being like, oh my God, I thought you guys were tougher than this. Like I thought the house was tougher. I thought I was in a building. I thought I was in an apartment building. It was a two-story apartment complex. And it just went like this.

01:50:43 Speaker_02
Yeah.

01:50:48 Speaker_01
And then it stopped. And I remember going, I gotta get the fuck out of here. I can't live in this place. Like, this is gonna happen again.

01:50:55 Speaker_04
When I got back to the hotel, there was a koi pond, because it's Japan, beautiful koi pond, but it was up on like the 30th floor. Oh, my God. All that water was just all over the lobby from the Hotel Swain.

01:51:08 Speaker_01
Oh, my God. Yeah. Jesus Christ. And I was just like, this is scary. Like, scary. Well, and then tsunamis, the real scary thing, man. Those videos of the Fukushima tsunami where people saw it coming and they're trying to get away. Those are all horrifying.

01:51:23 Speaker_04
All the birds came first, flying through, evacuating.

01:51:26 Speaker_01
Well, animals know. Somehow or another, animals know. When tsunamis happen, all the animals go to seek high ground. Crazy. Okay, what is that? What is that? It's crazy. Someone should fucking study that. They're getting some kind of information.

01:51:40 Speaker_01
Some message from the universe is telling them to go to high ground. How?

01:51:45 Speaker_04
Yeah, I even saw it. Well, they have senses that I think we have too that we just don't have anymore.

01:51:50 Speaker_01
You know what I'm saying?

01:51:50 Speaker_04
Like you and I talk about that when you go hunting and by like day two or three, you almost feel like you're more aware, more in tune to every noise, you feel the temperature more, everything gets enhanced.

01:52:03 Speaker_01
Dude, you're so alive. You're so alive in the mountains. I went elk hunting and I got successful on the second day, which you can't pass up. It just was a perfect scenario and I got successful, but I wanted to keep going. I wanted to stay out there.

01:52:19 Speaker_01
When you're out there, just the physical act of being in the woods is like a vitamin that you don't know you need until you get it. You're like, oh, I need this vitamin.

01:52:31 Speaker_01
That's what I was saying, like a wildlife photographer, that'd be the dopest job ever. You're just in the wilderness, photographing wildlife. Well, it's crazy.

01:52:38 Speaker_04
He's a wildlife photographer, but when you talk to him because he's been through shit, you know, living in Russia. He's worn out.

01:52:44 Speaker_04
But no, he's amazing because he's so optimistic and he'll say, and I agree with him, this is the greatest country in the world. We are the greatest country in the world, but we have to fight for that.

01:52:54 Speaker_01
No, we have to torch the Constitution. Should we torch the Constitution? The Atlantic thinks maybe we should torch the Constitution. It's like, why?

01:53:02 Speaker_01
Well, you know, it's all these interests and I think the social chaos aspect of today This is what I find interesting because I think it it forces these kind of conversations It forces people to deal with these problems It forces it instead of like this health care issue being this insidious never talked about thing that slowly crept up and just became ingrained in society to the point where everybody just accepted it instead of that I

01:53:26 Speaker_01
You have this rebellion, and you do have this Make America Healthy Again movement, which everyone should embrace, but yet it becomes ideologically captured by the right somehow, and if you are with that, if you think, hey, that's a great idea those guys have.

01:53:42 Speaker_01
I know they suck when it comes to women's right to choose, they suck when it comes to whatever, fill in the blanks, but I like what they're saying about this.

01:53:50 Speaker_01
We're so lost in this team thing that is ingrained in our fucking DNA, and they play us with it. They play us with it because we have these undeniable tribal instincts. It's just like when you roll a ball of yarn past a kitten. They can't help it.

01:54:07 Speaker_01
They gotta jump on it. They have these instincts.

01:54:09 Speaker_04
You have it in your stand-up bit. That part where you talk about politics, that's 100% how I feel, and that's how almost everybody I know feels.

01:54:20 Speaker_04
It's a lie that we all believe the Republicans or the Democrats We don't we we're all individuals and free thinkers and every topic is different and nuanced and it's not that easy It's not it's hard to find a party that represents everything you believe in and again I'm not political so I focus on health care because it's what I know and I know I can debate anyone on this on this topic I fucking know it you want to talk about the Ukraine.

01:54:44 Speaker_04
I'm a moron. I can't help you there I don't know but I know health care and I know how broken it is

01:54:49 Speaker_01
The problem is ideologies. The real problem is tribal thinking. Because everyone should just embrace this and think this is really a good idea.

01:54:58 Speaker_01
But the fact that it's been attached to one political party, it makes it a problem for the people in the other political party. And that's what's nuts about us. Even things that are universally good, that everyone should strive for. Better health.

01:55:11 Speaker_01
I've seen articles written that fucking people that go to the gym are more likely to be right wing. Like, what are you talking about? Go to yoga class!

01:55:20 Speaker_04
The example I can give you is one of the bills that they are putting in place is to cover GLP-1s for every American that wants it.

01:55:28 Speaker_04
That's $1,500 a month right now because of what the pharmaceutical and insurance companies have done to price Gallagher Market up. It shouldn't be that. It should be under a couple hundred dollars a month. But it's not, and it's not going to be.

01:55:40 Speaker_04
And so I look at that and go, okay, for $1,500 a year, You could get the DEXA, the VO2 Max. You could be monitored with AI 24-7.

01:55:49 Speaker_04
You could get, at minimal, blood work twice a year, comprehensive consult, one hour deep dive into your biologics, and we could treat the root cause of the issue. Because I said this on Jillian's podcast with GLP-1s. I am not against them.

01:56:06 Speaker_04
I'm still a believer in them when utilized appropriately. But prescribing a GLP-1, a weight loss drug, Without talking about diet, lifestyle, and nutrition, it's like brushing your teeth while eating fucking Oreos.

01:56:17 Speaker_01
All this is true. It just makes no sense.

01:56:19 Speaker_01
All this is true, but what I'm saying is that just the concept of getting all these things out of our food supply, making people healthy, getting people off of all these prescription drugs, making people more metabolically healthy,

01:56:32 Speaker_01
We're so stupid with our tribal shit that just that concept has been pushed into the realm of right-wing If you're that you're a MAGA person, you're this you're a fucking you're a loon.

01:56:44 Speaker_01
Yeah, it's it's so dumb It's so it and it's this the thing about going to gyms being right-wing. I've seen multiple articles written about going to gyms being right-wing Have you ever been in a fucking yoga class?

01:56:57 Speaker_01
Okay, yoga is one of the hardest things to do. They're some of the most left-wing motherfuckers on earth They're nice kind people who bust their ass in a 90-minute hot yoga class. That's fucking hard to do The challenge is your character.

01:57:10 Speaker_01
Okay, the idea that like the only people that exercise are right-wing That is so dumb. It's so limiting and so stupid and such a ridiculous way to think. You should want to be stronger. Everybody should want to be stronger. You know why?

01:57:24 Speaker_01
Because it's good. I like that I can pick things up. I like that if someone in my house needs something open, they give it to me and I can just open that motherfucker. I like that. I like that I can carry things.

01:57:36 Speaker_04
Well, what gives me hope is the Democrats were in that meeting and there were Democrat senators that were interested. And I don't believe that it's the Democrats. I believe it's an agenda beyond the Democrats. And it's not.

01:57:48 Speaker_04
I just think people are trying to intentionally create that strife and that separation. And I don't believe it's the Democratic Party.

01:57:55 Speaker_04
I believe it's people attempting to hijack the Democratic Party and attempting to trivialize this message by portraying it as a political agenda rather than the facts of life of where we're at as a nation.

01:58:07 Speaker_01
That's for sure the root cause of it. But it is a thing now. And that's the problem. It's been effective. It's like many other things. It's effective until people wake the fuck up. That's the thing.

01:58:16 Speaker_01
You know, there's not a lot of people going out getting COVID vaccines now. You got to be a true believer to go running out. It doesn't mean they're not still trying to sell it. I was watching the Beetlejuice movie the other day.

01:58:26 Speaker_01
So in the beginning of the Beetlejuice movie, they play all these fucking cool previews. You get to, oh, what? Oh, that's coming out. That looks fun.

01:58:33 Speaker_01
And then they have a John Legend COVID vaccine commercial where he talks about how he's, I'll protect myself from COVID while he's fucking playing the piano. and he rolls down his sleeve to show you a fucking band-aid, you're like, what did you do?

01:58:47 Speaker_04
But the insanity of it is, Joe, let's even look at COVID. If we look at the people that died of COVID, it was because of chronic disease and comorbidity.

01:58:58 Speaker_04
which goes back to when we talk about it, and one of the things that's built into the new Ways to Well AI algorithm app that monitors your blood work is a calculation on your all-cause mortality risk.

01:59:10 Speaker_04
The goal is to drive down all-cause mortality risk. What people don't understand is if you're like you, a physically fit, lean muscle mass, low body fat, healthy individual, It reduces your risk of everything that could kill you. Everything.

01:59:24 Speaker_04
A car accident, which sounds crazy, but think, your body is metabolically healthy and fit, your chances of surviving and recovering are higher. Oh, for sure. So, somebody chronically ill and sick,

01:59:36 Speaker_01
it's not you could throw a diet coke and kill them you know like it's not like they're they're already at a deficit and they we're trying to help people not be at a deficit let's get people back to normal we just have to change the way people think about things we have to change this ridiculous idea that your health care provider knows everything they fucking don't your general practitioner he doesn't there's no way and it's one of the things that um

02:00:03 Speaker_01
Casey means has talked about like how little nutrition information she got In college, which is really nuts, but that's just the fact of the matter That's just really what it is.

02:00:12 Speaker_01
And also most those people are also unhealthy themselves Yeah, we just have to stop thinking about it as a right-wing or a left-wing thing. It's dumb and it's dangerous It's bad for you.

02:00:23 Speaker_01
And I know it's hard to change your fucking people are like battleships It's hard to change course It's fucking hard.

02:00:30 Speaker_04
It's also hard even in the system when you're separate from politics when you're in there. There's local politics, right? You're in a hospital system. You're a primary care.

02:00:39 Speaker_04
Man, you start writing a lot of testosterone and treating your patients, you're going to have the urology section of your hospital pissed off. Because they're going to go, what the hell is this primary care doing this? That's my spectrum.

02:00:49 Speaker_04
Send them over to me.

02:00:50 Speaker_01
Right, I could be making money off these people.

02:00:52 Speaker_04
Everything is siloed in a way that it makes it hard for these clinicians to practice medicine the way they would want.

02:00:59 Speaker_01
Which is why they're trying to stop telemedicine. It's not for you. It's not good. And it shouldn't be legal. And that's where I believe in government oversight.

02:01:09 Speaker_01
There should be like an actual government person who can never get a job with any of these organizations, never get a job.

02:01:15 Speaker_01
It should be like, if you agree to take this job on, you'll be well compensated, but you will never be able to work for pharmaceutical drug companies ever. That should be a prerequisite.

02:01:24 Speaker_04
That's a simple, like even with food, we could overcomplicate food. Okay. Why not just say, if you don't ship it to Europe, don't ship it to Americans? Yeah. Duh. How is that hard?

02:01:35 Speaker_04
If we don't want to do the double-blind studies and the research and I get it and it's hard to do and it's confusing, but at minimal, we can follow the guidance of countries who have better health standards than the U.S.

02:01:45 Speaker_01
has today. Just think about what you said about war. Think about what you said about the American people, how many die from chronic disease every year. And think about how much money we have spent on a war that we're not even in.

02:01:58 Speaker_01
I mean, what was the overall, what's the latest? Didn't they just send another few billion? Billions. A little bit here, a little bit there?

02:02:06 Speaker_01
I mean, I wonder how much they set aside for those people in North Carolina and Tennessee from that hurricane, because those people are fucked. A lot of people are dead, man.

02:02:14 Speaker_01
I was reading this account, it was a horrific account of these people, grandparents and a child that were on a roof. And it was before the roof swept away, the building swept away, and they drowned.

02:02:26 Speaker_01
But there's a photograph, the last photograph of them on the roof, and they're terrified. And this little girl and her grandparents are on this roof. And the water is everywhere.

02:02:38 Speaker_01
I mean, there's so many washed out streets, and so many washed out bridges, and the roads are gone. Have you seen some of the aerial photographs? I have. It's terrible. It's terrible.

02:02:49 Speaker_01
Houses floating down the street in Asheville, North Carolina, just floating down the street. And how much relief are they going to get? Is it going to be like Maui, where you give them 700 bucks?

02:03:03 Speaker_01
Which is the most that's more insulting than giving them no money a one-time fee of $700 you lost your house and the most catastrophic wildfire in the history of North America You're gonna give him 700 bucks each, but you're gonna give Ukraine a hundred and seventy whatever billion yeah, and I heard Tulsi on here talking and I'm like man when you look at like

02:03:26 Speaker_04
There's a lot to gain by those people not being able to afford to stay. Like they're essentially homeless. And then they still got to pay their mortgages. They still have to pay these bills.

02:03:35 Speaker_01
They're not going to give them long term mortgage relief. That's very valuable land if everybody defaults. And not only that, but the governor was on record give a speech like right after the fire.

02:03:46 Speaker_01
And one of the things they talked about was the state taking that land, which is an insane thing to do, right? Was it the mayor? Who was it that said that? Was it the mayor or the governor?

02:03:56 Speaker_01
But it was just the fact that they said it out loud is so insane in the wake of these people suffering this catastrophic loss. They didn't even know how many people were dead at that time. People were just missing, kids missing, burnt alive.

02:04:10 Speaker_01
Who knows how many people died? I don't even think they have an accurate count right now of how many people died.

02:04:14 Speaker_04
When we live in a world where things change so fast.

02:04:17 Speaker_01
See if you can find that.

02:04:18 Speaker_04
I get how people would get overwhelming because I try to follow it all and that's why I stick to my niche in healthcare because it's so much.

02:04:25 Speaker_01
This is crazy. I know. This is crazy that they're saying. Now think about allocating that kind of money towards healthcare. 102, the death toll from the deadliest wildfire in over a century has risen to 102.

02:04:39 Speaker_01
Yeah, but what I asked you is, what did the governor say about acquiring the land? Not the death toll. I don't think, I think 102 is the current estimate, but I think there's a lot of people missing. They just haven't confirmed it.

02:04:53 Speaker_04
What do you know about the Ukraine? One of the things, and again, I don't know enough to, I'm curious, because I know you've interviewed a lot of smarter people than me.

02:05:04 Speaker_04
I was told that one of the leverage points for the Ukraine in order to get funding was to put up land as collateral through, like their farmland is put up as collateral on the loans that are being provided, and those loans are essentially being provided by these big conglomerates.

02:05:20 Speaker_01
I've heard that too. Dave Smith was explaining it to me. I don't really know. I don't know. I haven't researched it. I haven't read anything about it, but yeah, that's what I've heard as well.

02:05:27 Speaker_04
Because I always look and go, well, there's no such thing as... Everything's biased. No such thing as a free lunch. So what is the real agenda and who's funding and why? Is always my question just from seeing other sectors and what happens. Of course.

02:05:42 Speaker_04
Always.

02:05:42 Speaker_01
There's always money behind it. Yeah. But it's also Ukraine is one of the most mineral rich places on earth. Like it's worth trillions of dollars and all sorts of different like groovy shit that we need to make stuff with. Yeah.

02:05:58 Speaker_01
What is what did the governor say?

02:06:03 Speaker_00
I'll just go with what I have right now. Then why don't you put it up for me? I am. What's up? Oh, okay. So this is just a... That's the only one I've found so far.

02:06:11 Speaker_01
I'm already looking for states to acquire... Ways. Ways for states to acquire Lahaina. Put that in a search engine.

02:06:19 Speaker_00
That's why I'm on Twitter, because it wasn't coming up in a search engine.

02:06:23 Speaker_01
So he said it in a speech, but it's not coming out. And that's crazy too, how quick stuff can be suppressed and disappear. I started using Brave browser recently. I gave up on DuckDuckGo. DuckDuckGo seems to have gone the way of Google.

02:06:34 Speaker_01
It's very difficult to find things that are inconvenient. But Brave seems to be uncensored and doesn't seem to be curated. But after I say that, they'll probably get them too. I don't know who to use. I don't know what to do anymore.

02:06:48 Speaker_01
It's like the whole thing is so bonkers.

02:06:50 Speaker_04
That's where all of this gets so hard. I want to believe there's truth in that we have somewhere where we still have integrity and honesty and transparency. It doesn't mean you always get it right. But even redacting the articles doesn't happen.

02:07:07 Speaker_01
It's only in independent journalism now. You get that from Michael Schellenberger, Matt Taibbi, Glenn Greenwald. You get that from those type of people. You don't get that from anywhere else anymore.

02:07:17 Speaker_01
And it's good that we have those type of people, that they're there, and they'll hold people accountable and tell you the real numbers of things.

02:07:23 Speaker_01
you know, and give you the facts behind what caused conflicts, not just report on the conflicts, but explain to you what happened.

02:07:32 Speaker_00
A fact check I found, I think this is what he said.

02:07:33 Speaker_01
He said, I'm already thinking about ways for the state to acquire that land so we could put it into workforce housing, to put it back into families, or to make it open spaces in perpetuity as memorial to people who are lost.

02:07:45 Speaker_01
There's a crazy thing to say Because as soon as you say state to acquire that land and we'll decide the awesome things to do with it That's now you took very very very valuable in and you could say hey We're gonna sell it to a resort and the resort is gonna donate to all these wonderful funds How many people are missing from the fire Jamie?

02:08:10 Speaker_01
Because the problem with fires Is like you need like dental records and shit? You know like when it gets down to someone dying and like they're missing at this point They're gone, so I have a buddy of mine.

02:08:23 Speaker_01
That was a firefighter, and he told me some crazy shit. It's just Going into a building with burning people in it is madness Okay, so a thousand people reported missing

02:08:36 Speaker_02
Whoa.

02:08:37 Speaker_01
Yeah, so this death toll. Way off. Shut the fuck up. Yeah. 85 deaths were confirmed, but I think the problem is when they can say 102 deaths confirmed, and they don't say, but yet there's 990 people missing.

02:08:52 Speaker_01
You can say that because it's very difficult to confirm who these people are. There's not much left. It's so scary. Fire is so fucking scary. And when you've been evacuated by fire, there was one time where I was coming home from the Comedy Store.

02:09:05 Speaker_01
I got evacuated the same day. But as I was coming home from the Comedy Store, as I was driving to my house, the whole right side of the highway over the tops of the hills was in flame.

02:09:18 Speaker_01
Like all the hills, like as you get like woodland hills and shit, in flames. Just in flames. Like fire coming over hills. You're watching houses go up in flames.

02:09:28 Speaker_01
It's such a weird feeling because that that's when you realize that we all have this very naive idea and by the way people working on wildfires and and those firefighters who Work 24-7 and just fucking stayed alive on coffee and and those people are fucking heroes.

02:09:44 Speaker_01
Yep But there's not enough of them. Okay when when this cop told me this firefighter rather told me when we're doing fear factor once He goes, one day.

02:09:52 Speaker_01
He goes, one day a fire's gonna hit the right conditions with the right wind, and it's gonna burn through LA all the way to the ocean. We can't do anything to stop it. And I was like, really?

02:10:00 Speaker_01
He goes, yeah, when they get real big, there's nothing you can do. And I always thought that guy was just, that was hyperbole, until I saw what happened in my fucking neighborhood. And I was like, this is nuts, man.

02:10:11 Speaker_04
Do they, I don't know enough about, do they do control burns and all that in California now to try and stop, like, create stop gaps and all that for the fires? Or how does that, how do they even do that?

02:10:20 Speaker_01
What is this, Jeremy?

02:10:22 Speaker_00
Uh, updated, because... This isn't updated, though. From the first thing I found, which was... It says November 18th, 2023. Right, the original thing. We read that said a thousand was from September, so it's 60 days before this.

02:10:36 Speaker_01
Oh, September, but I thought it was September of this year.

02:10:38 Speaker_00
No.

02:10:38 Speaker_01
No? So is it still September 2022? So it says 100 days after the Maui fires, four names remain on the missing list. So they found a bunch of those people, is that what you're saying?

02:10:48 Speaker_00
Yeah, there's currently only two.

02:10:50 Speaker_01
Oh, there's only two missing?

02:10:51 Speaker_00
Yeah. Period? I mean, I found the website that has their names listed.

02:10:56 Speaker_01
Oh, so the death toll is 102? Yeah. So why did they say, so the death toll was elevated when they thought 1,000 people were missing? Is that what it was? And then those people had a, there's only two people missing?

02:11:10 Speaker_00
Here's what I looked up. I typed in Maui Fire people missing. When you click on the first thing that says how many people were missing in the Maui Fire, that's what I clicked on that you read. The date on that is September 20.

02:11:21 Speaker_01
So 1,000 in 2018, September 18, 2023. Yes, right after. And then in November, they had narrowed it down to four people? Yes. OK, go back. What's below that? Why are so many people still missing in Maui? That's September of 2023. What does it say?

02:11:39 Speaker_01
They have an explanation, but I'm hoping maybe New York Magazine has an explanation that makes more sense. Oh, you sons of bitches. Did Maui officials released the 388 names of people unaccounted for in the Maui fire?

02:11:58 Speaker_00
Click on that. It's down to two. It's on the website. It has two people listed.

02:12:03 Speaker_01
But what it says right here is within a day, I'm reading it, 388 names of people unaccounted for following the deadliest U.S. wildfires in more than a century, more than 100 of them or their relatives came forward to say they're safe.

02:12:18 Speaker_01
So this was in August. So 100 of the 388 people. So that number of 1,000 was just the initial number. That's still crazy, 300 people.

02:12:29 Speaker_00
Yeah, I think it's just saying over 1,000 were reported missing. There was over 3,000, according to the other thing, were initially reported missing.

02:12:35 Speaker_00
That means that they could have found them the next day, they could have found them two days later, three days later, an hour later. Right, or months later.

02:12:40 Speaker_04
But it's also an island. It can't be that hard to find these people.

02:12:43 Speaker_01
Yeah, but you probably don't report when you're staying with relatives in Honolulu because your house burnt down in Maui. You probably just go over there and stay there.

02:12:49 Speaker_00
Self-coverage problems and all sorts of stuff. They couldn't contact people, maybe.

02:12:56 Speaker_01
Possibilities I feel like so that's good that there was less people died That's for sure, but it's still fucked that they're trying to take the land the and that what they're doing Is there they're making it very difficult for these people to rebuild and most of them haven't even started yet?

02:13:09 Speaker_04
Well, and then I know too I mean it's taken forever for people to get their insurance claims and their money and that happens even here with hurricanes. It's a

02:13:17 Speaker_04
You know, if you don't have the money to pay for stuff yourself, you're stuck battling the insurance company. If you don't have the money to battle the insurance company, then you're really in a tough spot. Right. Yeah, it's dark.

02:13:30 Speaker_04
I had a, during a hurricane in Houston at our pharmacy, I had a tree damage the roof, but then it wasn't covered by flood insurance because they said it was wind-driven rain. Anyways, it was like $60,000 in damage that the insurance didn't cover.

02:13:48 Speaker_04
Because they could say it's wind-driven rain, not rising water. So water damage is very specific? Yeah, they have different ways of loopholing out of paying your coverage.

02:14:00 Speaker_04
And so for somebody who's, it's their house, you know, who maybe doesn't have the money to fight the insurance companies, they just put a tarp on the roof and live with it as long as they can until they can afford to fix it.

02:14:11 Speaker_01
Oh my god. So when you got water coverage, you thought you were getting coverage from shit like that?

02:14:16 Speaker_04
Yeah, I had flood insurance, everything, and it doesn't cover it, so I got left holding the bag.

02:14:21 Speaker_01
Is there tree insurance? Can you get insurance for a tree dropping on your house?

02:14:24 Speaker_04
Yeah, there is general insurance, but I don't know how it all works. You fucked up, should have got the tree. There's always a liability, there's always a loophole. Insurance is a racket, and then even in healthcare insurance, you know?

02:14:40 Speaker_01
What isn't a racket?

02:14:41 Speaker_04
Is there a thing out there that's not a racket? I know church, religion, everything's a racket.

02:14:45 Speaker_01
Well, some church isn't a racket. Some church is great. Some church is very beneficial for people. I think that a lot more as I'm older. I think it's like a good – I think Zuby said this. I think he called it like an immune system.

02:15:00 Speaker_01
It's a good immune system to protect you from the bullshit in society. I think I'm paraphrasing him for sure. But I think that's accurate.

02:15:08 Speaker_04
As great as we are as humans, we are tribal like he said. So we find reasons to see how we're different and where to argue and where to fight. And I think that allows corruption to creep in. Oh, yeah. It's insidious. It spreads.

02:15:24 Speaker_01
It's in every aspect of life. As soon as you let people have money doing a thing. And as soon as you can attach something to something that people are deeply opposed to, like whatever Trump is for, you're against, you know, no matter what.

02:15:37 Speaker_01
It's just it's when you could find a thing like that, that's the enemy believes it. People are so reluctant to look at real data.

02:15:46 Speaker_01
Even the people that don't want murderers and rapists and drug dealers sneaking across the border, they'll find a way to say... One of the things they like to say is, migrants statistically commit less crimes than people who live here.

02:16:03 Speaker_01
That's what they say. They love to say that one. But you know what that is? You know what that's accounting for? gang violence, people that are in prison. You're looking at everybody. Statistically, they commit less crimes.

02:16:16 Speaker_01
Yeah, there's a lot less of them. Yeah. Yeah. And also, we have a lot of crime. So what the fuck are you trying to say? It's not like the average person is out there committing all these crimes.

02:16:26 Speaker_01
No, it's a very small number of people that are career criminals. They're poor people. They grew up in terrible environments. They started doing crime when they were young. They're criminals. They're career criminals.

02:16:36 Speaker_01
There's a small percentage of those, and they fucked the numbers up. So if you want to say that migrants statistically... Okay, statistically, but statistically that's not what we're talking about.

02:16:47 Speaker_04
We're talking about there's no justification for letting in murderers. Mark Twain, there's lies, there's damn lies, and then there's statistics.

02:16:55 Speaker_01
Right. I mean, how do they find those statistics when they say that migrants are less likely? First of all, they're not even arresting them in some places. Were they treated as sanctuary cities? People are dealing with that in Aurora, Colorado.

02:17:07 Speaker_01
They're not even arresting people. They commit crimes. Cops will tell you they can't arrest them because it's a sanctuary city.

02:17:12 Speaker_04
In California, they don't arrest if it's under $1,300 or something. And they just let them walk out with TVs? They just gotta make sure it's under $1,200.

02:17:20 Speaker_01
Apparently San Francisco, according to some people that I know that are living there, is getting better because of AI. So Chamath was saying that when the super nerds are running things, everything's great.

02:17:33 Speaker_01
But as soon as like the mid-level people start taking over they get through with ideology They get through with like progressive virtue signaling and that's how they get ahead because they're mostly mediocre people And so when they start to get a grip of the city, you're kind of fucked.

02:17:48 Speaker_01
Yeah, but if the AI Becomes the dominant force in the industry again, then the super nerds will be back in control again If the super nerds are in control, they'll fix all these things.

02:17:56 Speaker_01
I'll clean all because it's logical It's logical to not have people like camping on the streets and fucking shooting up in the middle of you know parks and stuff.

02:18:05 Speaker_04
I wonder even with AI like as we get down in that like we were talking about it's a way more complex conversation than today but like what are they gonna do with the massive displacements in jobs between AI and robotics and humanoid robots I mean there's 10 companies out there that are launching robots not just Elon and those are backed by chat GPT and large language models that are rapidly approaching the level of human knowledge and intellect that

02:18:32 Speaker_04
of the average human, and like, it's there.

02:18:34 Speaker_01
I walked by the Tesla store the other day at the Domain, I was thinking of buying a robot. Oh, they have them there? They have a robot, I don't think you could buy it. Oh, they already have it?

02:18:41 Speaker_01
If they could buy it, I'd be like, I would probably buy that robot. I was talking to my kids, like, you guys think we should get a robot? It'd be awesome. Would you trust that fucker? You trust that fucker? Russia could hack your robot.

02:18:52 Speaker_04
We already have, you know, everyone has Alexa in their house and, you know, what was that one, like, I made a joke about the government, I laughed, Alexa laughed, so did the FBI or whatever it is. It's so entrenched in our world.

02:19:06 Speaker_01
I don't know. I don't know. It is entrenched, but it's mostly illegal to use. Yeah. It's like mostly illegal what they're doing.

02:19:13 Speaker_01
You know if they if the FBI is really using your Wi-Fi to follow you around your house all day long That's kind of a violation of your privacy Yeah, and that's a real technology that's available now And it should be available if there's a situation where there's a fucking terrorist and he's in a house He's got a suicide vest and you can use Wi-Fi to locate him and know exactly where he is and you protect all these other people so that's justification for having some

02:19:37 Speaker_01
kind of technology in the hands of some intelligence agents.

02:19:41 Speaker_01
But if you're using it to gather dirt on old Brigham, because Brigham's got a big old mouth when he's talking about the pharmaceutical drug, and you have a fucking group of people that are working to put together a dossier on you, it's all nuts, man.

02:19:55 Speaker_01
It's nuts, and it's right out in the open.

02:19:58 Speaker_04
Well, with the AI and the way things are headed too, though, when we talk about displacement of jobs, so many people think it's going to be like,

02:20:06 Speaker_04
trade workers, and I'm like, no, this is going to replace clinicians, this is going to replace doctors, lawyers, you know, a lot of... Dude, a lot of things.

02:20:16 Speaker_01
A lot. You're going to need universal basic income according to most people who understand economics. I don't know if they're right, but it makes sense to me. Universal basic income scares me because incentivizing people to not work scares me.

02:20:30 Speaker_01
Giving people an excuse to not, it's bad for people. It just is. It's bad for kids. If you just give your kids everything they want and they never learn how to work hard, you're fucking them up.

02:20:40 Speaker_01
And the problem with just giving people a check, they're not going to want to, if you get enough to eat,

02:20:46 Speaker_01
You have recreation money, and you have a roof over your head And you don't have to work at all like in working for like a little bit more than that And then you lose those benefits fuck that I would rather like pare down my lifestyle I say this you also need a purpose like in Viktor Frankl's a man's search for meaning He survived that Nazi concentration camp because he had a purpose a higher calling I can tell you

02:21:10 Speaker_04
When I'm just eating shit sandwiches and getting my head stomped in, right now, running these companies, over 300 employees, DEA, FDA, fighting big pharma, all the things we battle, there are a lot of days I go to bed with anxiety and stress, but I go to bed feeling like I'm really on the right side of something positive.

02:21:30 Speaker_04
I really, truly do. When I was a device rep, I made good money. But I went to bed miserable every night and I felt like I'm just kind of a pawn in a scheme and we're not really making an impact.

02:21:42 Speaker_04
So I go back to I think people, humans, we need a purpose. And so that scares me the most is a lot of people's purpose, if it's not being a mother or father or sibling, they find purpose in their trade and their craft and their job. their cause.

02:21:59 Speaker_01
So what do we do when... That's a really good question.

02:22:03 Speaker_01
If you wanted to look at it long term, if you're being objective and not taking into account human emotions and suffering and the disruption of lives that it's undeniably going to cause, if you just wanted to look at us objectively, you would say this is an inevitable transition, a very painful transition into a technological world.

02:22:21 Speaker_01
And human beings are going to have to adapt. And if this was available to them when they were babies, they would have adapted to exist in that world.

02:22:29 Speaker_01
They would have find things to do for a living that only humans can do, because they're very personal things that only humans can do. There's always going to be a market for handmade things.

02:22:39 Speaker_01
There's always going to be a market for... I like a painting that I know the guy who made it. Yeah. You know what I mean? I love that. I love that. I look at like that painting up there. You know, my friend Taylor made that. I know him. Yeah.

02:22:52 Speaker_01
I hung out with the dude. That's Mitzi, right? Great guy. That's Mitzi. Yeah. But that, there's a big thing that Taylor made that and he's my friend. I know him. That's a piece of him.

02:22:59 Speaker_04
Yeah, you have some of the coolest art in your studio and at the club. I love art. Super cool art.

02:23:05 Speaker_01
Art's amazing. I love it. It makes me feel different when I'm looking at something that someone made. It makes me feel better.

02:23:13 Speaker_04
When I see your Greg Overton stuff.

02:23:16 Speaker_01
Oh, I love that.

02:23:16 Speaker_04
It's like you're looking, it is insane, the detail and like, it's crazy.

02:23:23 Speaker_01
It's the only thing I'm allowed to have in my house. I'm not allowed to decorate my house. Because it would look like a fucking, a baby's house. It was like a man baby. It would all be like toys everywhere. I'm not allowed to decorate my house.

02:23:36 Speaker_01
But I do have three Greg Overton paintings.

02:23:40 Speaker_02
Yeah.

02:23:41 Speaker_01
Everything else, my wife figured everything else out. I was like, go ahead, just give me a little space. Give me a little something. I got an elk head in the kitchen, in the dining table, over the dining table. First elk I shot with a bow.

02:23:52 Speaker_01
But it's not like the stuffed kind, it's just a skull. Yeah, you just do your head and mouth. Yeah, that's what I like. Do you have any taxidermy? No. No, I don't. Taxidermy, that's dolls. You know, that's what that is. My friend Tyler does it.

02:24:03 Speaker_01
You know, I love Tyler from Archery Country. He makes taxidermy. Taxidermy's an art form.

02:24:07 Speaker_04
I think they look, like when you go to, you know, one of these lodges where they have like entire scenes. Like I saw one, the guy on the second story of his house like has a kudu drinking out of water and it's literally a crocodile coming up.

02:24:24 Speaker_04
I mean, it's wild.

02:24:26 Speaker_01
Yeah, especially in Texas. My friend told me that he went over to this guy's house and the guy had a stuffed chimpanzee and the chimpanzee, when you got near him, it was rigged where his eyes would light up and his dick would pop up.

02:24:43 Speaker_01
Like they had a, you know how you like walk by those haunted house things? You walk by him, his eyes light up and his dick pops up. Because of you we watched, uh, what was the Chimp? Oh, Chimp Crazy? Oh my god. Oh my god. It's insane. Insane. It's nuts.

02:24:58 Speaker_04
These people are out of their fucking mind. And it's weird because it's the same as Tiger King in a way, like, It's the same personality quirk. You know what I'm saying? It's this weird personality quirk.

02:25:11 Speaker_04
When you watch it, you'll see some of the like, I don't want to say mental health issues, but some of the traumas or whatever they are.

02:25:18 Speaker_01
They're mentally ill people. Yeah. They're mentally ill, crazy people who have giant primates that live in their house.

02:25:25 Speaker_04
And everyone's face gets ripped off.

02:25:28 Speaker_01
Oh, yeah, they all when you start take their noses off. Oh my god.

02:25:31 Speaker_01
Yeah, they rip their eyes out Yeah, it's nuts and they for the first four or five years the monkey gets to go everywhere So the chimp gets to go to the pizza place and everybody loves them chimp gets go here But then they get a little older and now they're in a cage all day Yeah, so they used to be free.

02:25:45 Speaker_01
They used to go to the town. Everybody was their friend Yeah, now sudden they're in a fucking cage and when they get out of that cage they oh Fuck people up. They're so mad.

02:25:52 Speaker_04
And then they have that hormone dump. I think they were saying the male primates are like five or six years old, so they become really hard to domesticate or keep as a pet because they get violent. I mean, that's their way of communicating.

02:26:04 Speaker_01
They castrate them. That's why that lady's 15-year-old, she can hang out with it and watch 2001. That's a castrated 15-year-old chimpanzee. That's why it's so skinny too. It looks like Michael Jackson. Skinny. The other ones look jacked, you know?

02:26:17 Speaker_01
They look like it's like Mike Tyson is prime. Have you seen the musculature they have?

02:26:22 Speaker_04
I haven't messaged Tony about it yet, but the Vince McMahon... What do you mean? They just dropped a Vince McMahon docuseries on Netflix.

02:26:31 Speaker_01
Oh, it's not about chimpanzees.

02:26:34 Speaker_04
No, no, this is a new Netflix one about Vince McMahon and the WWE. It's pretty intense.

02:26:38 Speaker_01
No, I haven't seen it, man. Speaking of muscles.

02:26:40 Speaker_04
He was doing some wild shit.

02:26:41 Speaker_01
Of course he was. I mean, when you're that jacked in your 70s, what are you on? Yeah, like what do you want to be that jacked in your 70s? Yeah You guys probably out of his fucking mind and partying. Did you really shit on someone's head? Is that really?

02:26:55 Speaker_04
I'm still I'm only on like the second episode, but they're getting into like there was a lot of There was some weird stuff like they even they were even bringing in little kids kind of like going down that Epstein path They talk about that like not kit

02:27:09 Speaker_04
Teenage boys, kids though, 15, 16 year old kids working, crews and stuff that were being utilized sexually and exploited. Yeah, there's a lot of sinister stuff in there.

02:27:21 Speaker_01
I don't know how much- These are just allegations.

02:27:22 Speaker_04
Yeah, it's all allegations and whistleblowers. I mean, who knows? You never know anymore.

02:27:29 Speaker_01
Imagine how much liberty you have to take with the truth if you make up a story about someone shitting on your head. I feel like, you know what, this, whatever happened, not bad enough. I want, I'm like, shit on my head. Let's like say shit on my head.

02:27:43 Speaker_01
But to make that up, you'd have to be, that's such an insane thing. But when you look at Vince McMahon, you go, I bet he did that. I bet he did it. He looks like he's insane. He's fucking jacked.

02:27:55 Speaker_04
But you also live in that imaginary world where you've created this character and then at what point does the character become you and when you've done it for 30, 40 years, whatever it was.

02:28:05 Speaker_01
Right.

02:28:05 Speaker_04
Because he grew up. His dad founded it and he was integral into the storylines and then became Like his character was the pompous Vince McMahon, elitist. That was his whole character. That was his shtick. So did that bleed into life?

02:28:21 Speaker_04
Does reality become fiction become reality?

02:28:23 Speaker_01
Oh, it definitely does to people. For sure. It must. It has to. I know it does with comedians. Comedians become their character. Like Andrew Dice Clay used to be Andrew Silverstein. Dice was a character that he used to do in his act.

02:28:36 Speaker_01
And then it just became him. You know and like Sam Kinison same thing like Sam Kinison became the beast because that's what everybody wanted He was like captured by it. He became that guy. Yeah.

02:28:46 Speaker_01
Yeah, if you're Vince McMahon and like your whole thing is fuck you I run this game. You're all out of your fucking mind. I'm gonna shit in your head Just pushed it to the limit plus you add in a lot of recreational substances.

02:28:58 Speaker_01
Yeah, which I'm sure there was plenty of yeah What did it say about that?

02:29:03 Speaker_04
They haven't gotten into that I'm gonna sit by the second episode they are they're talking about steroid use and they're definitely I didn't know that they indicted him for selling steroids to his athletes. I mean, a lot of crazy stuff.

02:29:14 Speaker_04
They tried to indict him and he fought it. I think he got off.

02:29:18 Speaker_01
Have you ever seen any of the More Plates More Dates videos about Tren? No, from Derek. I've watched Derek.

02:29:26 Speaker_04
I love his coverage. He's so smart. He breaks stuff down so eloquently.

02:29:29 Speaker_01
But there's so much talk about Tren. For whatever reason and sexual deviance like guys who turn gay when they're doing trend like just these guys are taking crazy Doses of this super powerful to steroid.

02:29:44 Speaker_01
Yeah, and they're just doing a wild fucking things. They get trend cough Yeah, get like a crazy cough. Mm-hmm and just fucking mind. Yeah, just just deviant. It's crazy

02:29:56 Speaker_04
It is it's such a short-term There's so many bad things that can happen there.

02:30:01 Speaker_01
I don't it's it is crazy But if you want a career in pro wrestling I know and you want to be a fucking animal and you want to get hit by a chair every night Yeah, like you're traveling across the country probably good drug.

02:30:11 Speaker_04
They are some of the most bang like god, man we've We've had the opportunity to work with several big WWE wrestlers, and they have put their bodies through hell.

02:30:22 Speaker_04
For, I mean, I would say even more than jujitsu and MMA guys and NFL guys, out of everybody we've worked with, the wrestlers are the most beat to shit. You know who's not beat to shit?

02:30:32 Speaker_01
The Rock. Yeah, crazy. I mean, he's got his little injuries and shit like that. The guy looks like a fucking superhero. Yeah, he's 50 years old He's been through like how many years of WWE also played football and look at him. He's fine.

02:30:43 Speaker_01
Yeah, it's not he's an anomaly the most anomalous of anomalies because all those other guys that I met Jake the snake I mean, Hulk Hogan's fucked, man. His back's fucked. He's got to walk with a cane. He's all banged up. And you see him shrinking.

02:30:56 Speaker_01
Well, his back's all fused. Literally, they're shorter and smaller than they were from all the back and spine surgeries. He's lost like four inches. So four inches of spine being compressed. It's so nuts. It's so crazy, man.

02:31:07 Speaker_01
And he said it was from that drop. Boom. We do that all the time. Every time he did it, he's compressing his spine.

02:31:12 Speaker_02
Yeah.

02:31:12 Speaker_01
Just ruined his back doing that. Yeah, it's scary. Speaking of someone who looks like a chimp, how about Brock Lesnar? When he flipped through the air and landed on his head? Yeah. Brock Lesnar looked like a shaved chimp.

02:31:23 Speaker_01
Like if you see a shaved chimp, like that's... Have you seen his daughter? Except he's too wide.

02:31:29 Speaker_04
She's a wrestler too? Like a collegiate wrestler?

02:31:30 Speaker_01
Yeah, she's jacked. She's jacked.

02:31:32 Speaker_04
Genes, son, they're real.

02:31:33 Speaker_01
Genetics, it's insane. That's Viking genes. When that was in a boat, come on.

02:31:38 Speaker_04
You ran for the hills. Can you imagine being back there like half starving and Brock Lesnar gets off a boat walking onto your land and you're like, oh god.

02:31:45 Speaker_01
You're barely alive anyway. And you see that guy get off a boat with a sword. Yeah. That's what the Vikings were.

02:31:50 Speaker_04
I think of that Shane Gillis joke.

02:31:52 Speaker_01
Oh yeah. That's a great joke, but I mean they you know, they did do a lot of that too. Yeah, they raped everybody Yeah, the Vikings were unbelievably brutal and they did a lot of drugs too.

02:32:03 Speaker_04
Apparently psychedelics and human sacrifices and all sorts of stuff. Yeah, they would sacrifice people Do you ever see that show Vikings? I loved it. Yeah Ragnar Lothbrok and like Yeah Yeah, great.

02:32:18 Speaker_01
My wife bailed on it after a while She could deal with everybody getting hacked to death by swords like after a while like okay, okay

02:32:24 Speaker_04
Yeah, as you got in the late I don't know how far you followed it But it went into Ivar the boneless and but all these are historical figures Oh, yeah, there's truth like it's fictional.

02:32:33 Speaker_04
What is it his fictional history or whatever it is, but it is it is based in some truth Which is fascinating.

02:32:39 Speaker_01
Oh, yeah, the the actual things that they did they really did Yeah, which is just they were so nuts man, but there's been so many instances like that in history of like

02:32:50 Speaker_01
groups of Unbelievable savages that accomplished insane things Yeah, just by pure barbarism and slaughter of innocent people. Yeah, like the Mongols I was watching something about Mongolia today.

02:33:04 Speaker_01
There was these us these guys were fitness influencers went to go experience these mong mongolian wrestlers

02:33:13 Speaker_01
And these Mongolian wrestlers, like these giants of Mongolia, these fucking tanks, these dudes are throwing each other around and they got to like eat food with them and hang out with them and experience it. Like these, that's what's left over.

02:33:24 Speaker_01
Did you ever watch Marco Polo? No, I watched a little bit of it. I watched the beginning of it.

02:33:28 Speaker_04
I don't know what happened. It didn't get, but it was really, really good at Genghis Khan. And I think you've taught us like one eighth of the world's

02:33:37 Speaker_01
Ten percent. I think he was dealing with Genghis Khan's son. That's insane. I think he was dealing with Genghis Khan's son. I think the empire was already in decline by that time.

02:33:45 Speaker_01
It's like once Genghis Khan died, his sons took over, his family took over, and then it kind of fell apart after a while because you need a fucking psycho. You need a guy who's got DNA.

02:33:56 Speaker_01
What was the number, Jamie, when we last looked at what percentage of the population in Asia has Genghis Khan's DNA? It's something nuts. Like five percent of everybody.

02:34:07 Speaker_01
This fucking guy who lived in what 1200 when did Genghis Khan live I think was 1200 So all these years later, this dude has 5%?

02:34:18 Speaker_04
Wasn't it, was it you and I were talking about, if you go back to like ancient Mesopotamia, it's only like 50 something humans ago, if you base it off people living to be 100.

02:34:28 Speaker_01
It's not, it's nothing. It's nothing. Okay. It's, it's more than that. It's 5% of the male, excuse me. 0.5% of the male population worldwide. Half percent. Right, not 5%. Worldwide. But what is it in Asia? That is still crazy.

02:34:47 Speaker_01
0.5% of the male population worldwide. But what is it in Asia? In Asia I think it's nuts. 8% maybe? Is that what it says? Okay. 8%. That's nuts.

02:35:01 Speaker_01
So 750 years of Genghis Khan's heritage, this mutation occurred in 8% of males in 16 different populations that were being studied. So one half of a percent of everyone on earth, 8% of people that live there. That is insane.

02:35:15 Speaker_01
So what was it like when he was alive? Was everybody fucking their cousin because you couldn't help it? Because Genghis Khan fucked everybody. So when they would conquer a town, he would take everyone's wife.

02:35:26 Speaker_01
He would just kill all the men, fuck all the ladies, they all became his wives.

02:35:31 Speaker_04
And he just did that everywhere he went. They did that in Ireland too. The British royalty or aristocrats would impregnate the Irishmen on the night of their wedding. They would impregnate their wives. That was what Braveheart was about.

02:35:49 Speaker_04
He came back, and I'm blanking out on his name, but fought for the Irish because they were basically raping their wives and making sure that they were raising British noble-born instead of Irish people.

02:36:00 Speaker_00
I just listened to a book on this. That's one of the myths that come from that. Not that it never happened, but they said that it didn't really happen. Jamie's a party pooper. Y'all notice that?

02:36:11 Speaker_04
There's a great courses on audible is going through all the way and if you look at like they didn't really get into in the movie, but we when we did Europe we we did a tour where they were breaking down like how bad they tortured him and Mutilated him in a public setting prior to killing him William Wallace.

02:36:28 Speaker_04
Oh my god. It's brutal.

02:36:29 Speaker_01
Yeah. Yeah What what's the myth aspect of it? Oh

02:36:34 Speaker_00
Oh, that they raped the peasants' wives or whatever on their wedding days? There might have been one king or a couple aristocratic-type people that might have been dickheads and did it, but it wasn't a thing that happened regularly.

02:36:50 Speaker_01
So it wasn't a pandemic of rape? Right. There was a lot of raping going on. If you go back long enough, it's all rape. Yeah, you know like how far do you have to go back in human history like was there any cave people that were like male feminists?

02:37:06 Speaker_01
Right just fucking it was they were barbaric. They killed each other. They stole wives.

02:37:11 Speaker_01
I remember reading this Book about Comanche where they're talking about this one Comanche warrior who wanted this other Comanche's wife so he killed the guy and ate a piece of his heart and then took his wife and Like, that was humans.

02:37:26 Speaker_01
That's what humans did.

02:37:27 Speaker_04
I will tell you, I know you had him on, but Empire of the Summer Moon, I'm so excited for that to come out as a series. Who's directing it?

02:37:37 Speaker_01
Is that Taylor Sheridan? Yeah, Taylor Sheridan. And if they do it, and Taylor's gonna do it by the book. I know Taylor. He'll do it by the book. By the way, he's got a great steakhouse he just opened up in Vegas. The four sixes four six steakhouse.

02:37:51 Speaker_01
I think it's like a pop-up right now, but we ate at it last time We're in Vegas. It's fucking great. It's all meat from his ranch. What a cool guy cool guy got his own ranch surprise makes a steakhouse supplies the meat and

02:38:04 Speaker_04
It's fucking brilliant and then he also leases the horses and the livestock and all of that to paramount.

02:38:10 Speaker_04
Oh, that's smart Yeah, and his ranch he leases to paramount which is brilliant because he is a real cowboy with real Cowboys that he and I also love that he casts real cowboys into the subsidiary roles or the supporting roles of disease He's a cowboy at a ranch a friend of mine works out in California.

02:38:27 Speaker_01
Oh Really? Yeah, he like did real cowboy work. Oh Before he ever made it in show business.

02:38:32 Speaker_04
Well, if you watch him on a horse when he's doing all his crazy horse stuff, I mean, it's wild how awesome his horses are that he's trained.

02:38:40 Speaker_01
He's a great podcast guest, too. Very interesting guy. Super fucking smart. And those shows, all the Yellowstone shows, are fucking incredible. And the new ones are the best ones.

02:38:50 Speaker_01
Like if you go to like from Yellowstone was great, and then there was 1883 was great. And then the last one, the 1923, the Harrison Ford one, that's fucking great. They're all great. They just get better.

02:39:02 Speaker_01
I think 1883 is the most recent and that's my favorite. That's the one when the family was making a cross. I love because it shows how

02:39:11 Speaker_04
It just shows the reality of how hard life was. It was brutal for everyone. For everyone there. God, it was brutal times.

02:39:18 Speaker_01
Unbelievable. And so accurate. So accurate as to how people died and what they dealt with. Fuck man, people falling off wagons, getting run over by the wheels, that kind of shit.

02:39:29 Speaker_04
That's why if you've ever played Oregon Trail in elementary school, that's what they had when I was in elementary school, I would always die of syphilis or dysentery. I would never survive.

02:39:39 Speaker_04
Dysentery, or what was it, dysentery, or you get killed by Indians or whatever it is. But you look at how statistically unlikely it is that we're all here. And I gotta believe it's for a reason. We gotta be here for something, right?

02:39:53 Speaker_04
We gotta be, and I don't want us to squander it.

02:39:56 Speaker_01
At the very least, if we're not here for something, at the very least, we can maximize our time here. You know, one of the things, the reason why this is very important to me, is everything I do, I need energy. Everything I do, I need a lot of energy.

02:40:11 Speaker_01
I need a lot of energy to do stand-up. I need a lot of energy to do jiu-jitsu. I need a lot of energy to do archery. I need a lot of energy to do podcasts. I need a lot of energy to do UFC shows.

02:40:21 Speaker_01
If you're weak and tired, you won't be as good at anything you do. Anything you do. And the one thing that you have control over

02:40:28 Speaker_01
If you're a person who takes care of your diet and exercise, the one thing that you're going to have control over is you will be able to give your vehicle more energy. That's real.

02:40:39 Speaker_01
If you really do the right things in terms of with your health, you rest accordingly, eat the right foods, take vitamins, work out,

02:40:47 Speaker_04
That's why people say so often that like eating healthy, working out, it's expensive, it takes time, but being chronically ill is way more expensive.

02:40:56 Speaker_03
Way more expensive.

02:40:56 Speaker_04
It takes way more time. And you have to choose your heart, but there is no path that's just going to be a cakewalk.

02:41:03 Speaker_01
You don't even need a fucking gym. If you have a YouTube account and a laptop, you can watch yoga videos and you can do them at home. If you get one 35 pound kettlebell, My friend Keith Weber, he's got this Extreme Kettlebell Cardio Series.

02:41:16 Speaker_01
He's got a bunch of different ones that you could do. But there's a few of them that are online. And I did one the other day. It was fucking brutal. 35-pound kettlebell. It doesn't cost anything to get one of those things.

02:41:26 Speaker_01
How much is a 35-pound kettlebell? You get it once. You never have to buy another one. And me, after all the years of using kettlebells, I still can get a fucking ass-kicking workout with one 35-pound kettlebell.

02:41:39 Speaker_01
And if you think you can't, follow that YouTube video and try.

02:41:42 Speaker_04
Just give it a try. Even walking. Casey has a stat she'll drop on you. I don't remember the numbers, so I won't even attempt.

02:41:48 Speaker_04
But just walking a few days a week, four days a week, it's insane, the difference in all-cause mortality risk and reduction in chronic disease.

02:41:57 Speaker_01
Yeah, you've got to move around. Otherwise, your body's feeble. If your body's feeble, it's not going to be able to handle diseases, not going to be able to handle injuries. How many people die by falling down because they're older?

02:42:07 Speaker_01
You know, this is something that Peter Attia talks about quite a lot, is that it's very important for older people to lift weights. You know, not for vanity, but to be able to protect yourself from falling.

02:42:16 Speaker_01
If you're falling and you're feeble, you can't do anything to stop the fall.

02:42:20 Speaker_04
You know? Yeah, after the age, I think it's after the age of 65, one of your greatest risk factors is a fracture. If you fracture a hip or vertebrae, you have between a 15 and 35 percent chance of being dead within a year. Oh my god.

02:42:33 Speaker_04
It's one of the greatest risk factors. And think about it, because your body has to recover and rebuild and you don't have all the health and youth that you had in your earlier years.

02:42:43 Speaker_04
So if you stay active and keep muscle and keep bone mineral density and get proactive and all the things we've talked about, if we start monitoring your bone mineral density in your 20s to your 30s to your 40s, We know your family history.

02:42:57 Speaker_04
You're a petite girl. You're going to experience a decline in bone mineral density. We've got to get ahead of that.

02:43:03 Speaker_04
One of the things they did that ruined that for so many women was the Women's Health Initiative, scaring them out of hormone optimization for women.

02:43:10 Speaker_04
And it terrified women, telling them that it was going to cause cancer and all these things, which ends up being the opposite. of what it does. And it did a huge disservice to women that created indirectly a rise in osteoporosis and osteopenia.

02:43:24 Speaker_04
But one of the companies that was funding that was Merck. And Merck sells an osteoporosis drug. They have a blockbuster osteoporosis drug called Fosamax that they printed money on during that time frame.

02:43:36 Speaker_04
And so it's hard because they do say trust the science, and I'm not telling people don't trust the science. Trust but verify. Let's keep honest people honest.

02:43:45 Speaker_01
But the problem is that science is very difficult to verify. Yeah.

02:43:47 Speaker_01
Especially science that's given to you by the pharmaceutical drug companies because when one of the things, was it John Abramson that was, who's litigated these cases against pharmaceutical drug companies?

02:43:57 Speaker_01
One of the things that he was saying is that he was part of the Vioxx thing. That when you get the peer-reviewed data, you don't get access to the data, you get access to the review of the data.

02:44:08 Speaker_01
And you also don't get access to all the studies they did that didn't show a positive. I'm sure you saw that Steven Crowder thing where he caught that COVID czar guy. Yes, yes. When he was talking about monkey pox, the monkey pox drug, that's nuts.

02:44:22 Speaker_04
That he was intentionally saying that he was being funded to say those things and mislead the public.

02:44:29 Speaker_01
That they were trying to sell more of those drugs and that the reality is most people aren't going to get monkey pox. It's like you have to get it from gay sex.

02:44:35 Speaker_02
Yeah.

02:44:35 Speaker_01
Sorry.

02:44:36 Speaker_04
Well, and it makes total sense because, again, not to say – when you're in it, you think you're doing right. I don't think that people are out there trying to harm humanity. I don't. I really want to hope that's not the case.

02:44:48 Speaker_04
But when I was a drug rep at 22 and you bring in a thought leader from Harvard that tells me all the ways that they're using this brilliant mental health drug off-label,

02:44:58 Speaker_04
And then you put tremendous pressure and give me an expense account and send me out to drinks with a doctor. And I'm sitting there and the doctor's like, where else can I use this drug? You're like, do I tell him what that guy from Harvard told me?

02:45:10 Speaker_04
Because I also signed a contract that said I wouldn't. But then the company taught me all that and put me in this environment. And it's like a wink, wink, nod, nod. And the pressure is to grow the patient population on a drug.

02:45:22 Speaker_04
That's why GLP-1s went from being for diabetic obese people to now let's help people lose weight for spring break? Real quick. Fast. Real quick.

02:45:31 Speaker_01
And it got accepted fast. That's what's scary. And it got called the Kardashian drug, which was brilliant, because there's no evidence they took it. Oh, really? I never heard any evidence that they took it, but it's what you heard about.

02:45:44 Speaker_01
I saw it on Twitter, the Kardashian drug. In the early days of these GLP-1s, Ozempic and Wegovy, they were talking about it and people were calling it the Kardashian drug. And they were saying all these women in Hollywood are taking it.

02:45:55 Speaker_01
I didn't even know that. I don't even know if they took it. Cause I know they have trainers, you know, so they might've just worked out. It might be bullshit. Yeah. But everybody's like, Oh, they're doing it. Oh, those bitches.

02:46:07 Speaker_01
Like, uh, one of my wife's friends sent her an image of this woman and said, Oh my God, everyone is on Ozempic these days. Just cause the woman was skinny. It's like, first of all, that lady's always been skinny.

02:46:17 Speaker_01
You can find pictures of her from 30 years ago. She was skinny. Like, what are you talking about? Like everybody wants to like, Oh, that bitch, she's on it. So we don't give anybody misinformation.

02:46:27 Speaker_01
We interrupted this podcast because Jamie found out at the end of the podcast that one of the Kardashians has her own GLP-1 daily pill. It's the latest product capitalized on weight loss drug. This is Kourtney Kardashian, who's the thinnest.

02:46:42 Speaker_01
She was always thin, which is odd. So just so people know. But the point was, at the beginning, everyone was calling it the Kardashian drug. Maybe they were right.

02:46:53 Speaker_04
Back to the show. and their schedules are crazy, and the pressure is crazy, and the stress is crazy, and they have kids and families, and they find a way. Kim's up at what, three in the morning to go run 30 miles?

02:47:27 Speaker_01
He doesn't have to do that anymore because he doesn't have a regular job anymore. Okay, well that's good. Finally I tried to talk that guy into quitting his job for like 10 fucking years From the moment. I met him like quit that job dude.

02:47:38 Speaker_04
You can make more money doing this I was like trying to convince him took forever It's just inspiring to see because you can sit on the outside and think oh that guy who's on top of the mountain He didn't he's lucky they got lucky But you don't realize is you didn't see all the steps that it took for that guy to get a girl to get to the top of the mountain

02:47:56 Speaker_01
Cam was running marathons in the morning before work when he was working eight hour days. He would get up at 3.30 in the morning, run a fucking marathon, and then take three days off of work, take his vacation time, and go run the Moab 240.

02:48:11 Speaker_01
Run 240 miles through the fucking mountains. That's a regular guy with a regular job. And if you don't get inspired by that and realize there's more in the tank than you think there is. And people like that, the benefit of people like that,

02:48:26 Speaker_01
is that through their discipline, you can learn that you could do these things too.

02:48:31 Speaker_01
You can get inspired by, not maybe, maybe you can't run the Moab 240, but you will most certainly hold yourself to a higher standard when you know there's someone out there that's really busting their ass and trying to make things happen.

02:48:41 Speaker_04
It's motivating. Like Phillip Rowe, I know we've become really good friends. Philly Fresh from UFC. Love that dude. Dude. Working as a UPS guy, raising two kids, training MMA in his spare time, and trying to get all his work in, makes it into the UFC.

02:49:00 Speaker_01
I mean, that's insane. How about Deontay Wilder? He was driving for Budweiser or Coca-Cola or something like that? Remember who he was driving for? What was it? Coca-Cola? Driving. Delivering trucks. At like 21, starts boxing.

02:49:16 Speaker_01
At 23, wins a bronze medal in the fucking Olympics. So crazy. Crazy. Budweiser. It's just so nuts. Delivering Budweiser. So the guy's just trying to take care of his family.

02:49:26 Speaker_04
The reason I'm saying this is there is hope, people. If those guys can do it, we can do it.

02:49:29 Speaker_01
He got into boxing to take care of his kid who had medical problems. That's cool. He needed money to take care of his kid, so he just said, I'll become a pro boxer.

02:49:37 Speaker_04
That is so crazy.

02:49:38 Speaker_01
Crazy. And it has the gift. This one in a fucking hundred million gift of power that he had. Yeah. It's nuts. But people like that exist to inspire you to do more. And you know, you could say, well fuck her, she's on Ozempic. Or maybe she's not.

02:49:54 Speaker_01
Maybe she's really healthy and she fucking works out every day. Maybe that. Maybe that too. Maybe instead of going, oh fuck that, she's on Ozempic. Damn, that bitch looks good. What's she doing? Yeah, what are you doing?

02:50:05 Speaker_01
And then maybe find out what she's doing? Maybe just realize you could do more yourself. And if you did, everything that you could do to make yourself healthy wouldn't even have the urge to look at someone else and say, oh, she's on Ozempic.

02:50:18 Speaker_01
You wouldn't care. Yeah, you would not give a fuck.

02:50:20 Speaker_04
What you see is people, momentum creates momentum. And even individuals I know that have taken Ozempic. A lot of those people, they just needed wins on the board and they needed to create momentum.

02:50:30 Speaker_04
And these really obese individuals, when they start seeing there's hope and the weight starts coming off, as crazy as it is, the diet, the lifestyle, the nutrition, all that starts to fall in line more and more.

02:50:41 Speaker_04
And then they get a win on the board and now they're the guy who's going to the gym three days a week.

02:50:45 Speaker_01
And that's the benefit of SSRIs too, for some people. For some people. And for Ari, that was the benefit of him. He was really depressed. It was really bad. And I think it had something to do with taking DHT blockers.

02:50:58 Speaker_01
So he was taking whatever the fuck that stuff is for your hair. What's that stuff called? Yeah, Propecia. Propecia. He was taking that. It can really fuck up your hormones. Yeah. Some people. And it wrecked him. It wrecked him. It got him very depressed.

02:51:09 Speaker_01
But the SSRIs helped him get over the hump, and he eventually got off of them. And when his life is doing better, what a shock. He feels better. He's happy. His career's doing great. He's fucking not depressed anymore. Oh, crazy. They're all related.

02:51:22 Speaker_01
People would try to tell you that your life sucking has no bearing on the level of depression that you have. Well, that's crazy. That's crazy. Because there are people whose lives are seemingly on paper amazing, and they're still depressed.

02:51:35 Speaker_01
But I guarantee you they probably have their priorities off, and I guarantee you they probably don't exercise. And if they do, it's some rare imbalance that some people do have.

02:51:44 Speaker_04
I can tell you, I mean, running businesses, of course everyone has stress and anxiety. If I didn't do an ice bath or go do Muay Thai, For if I take a week off, my anxiety is terrible.

02:51:56 Speaker_04
I mean, I would have almost crippling anxiety, but doing physical activity and doing hard things and doing the ice bath and doing the sauna and going through that method in that process, I.

02:52:07 Speaker_01
I mean, it helps me immensely. You're used to a certain level of adversity. And if you have no adversity, adversity is very difficult to handle.

02:52:15 Speaker_01
But if you give yourself voluntary adversity that far exceeds anything you're going to experience outside of that, you're way better at handling stuff. If your workouts are so fucking brutal, and I've seen you do Muay Thai, it's fucking hard, man.

02:52:29 Speaker_01
It's hard, it's exhausting, and everything else seems easy.

02:52:33 Speaker_01
Because when you're on like round five, and it's a five minute round, and you're three and a half minutes in, and he's trying to get you to, he's trying to get you to do switch kick over and over and over again, your fucking heart is beating out of your chest, you gotta finish the round strong, and when you're done, when that bell goes off, you're like,

02:52:53 Speaker_01
Oh my God. Like that feeling you don't get. You don't get that in the day.

02:52:58 Speaker_04
And you feel so much better.

02:53:00 Speaker_01
After it's over. But the feeling of being exhausted, pushing yourself, that struggle is so much more intense than anything you experience other than a life or death confrontation in your day.

02:53:13 Speaker_04
Yeah, just even conquering going there. Like there's so many days I'm driving and I go, why the fuck am I doing this? Why don't I just go to Starbucks, get one of those Frappuccinos again, go back to my old place.

02:53:22 Speaker_01
Life was fun being fat.

02:53:23 Speaker_04
It was easy. This is not, I don't want to go get the shit beat out of me and work my ass off for an hour, but every time you leave, even no matter what, I'm like, oh, thank God I did that.

02:53:32 Speaker_01
Every time I get out of that stupid ice bath, I feel like that. Every time I go in, I don't want to do it. I know I'm going to go in it, because there's two people in my head. There's the general, and there's the pussy.

02:53:42 Speaker_01
And the pussy is like, don't do it. Don't make me do that for three minutes. Don't make me get in there. And the general's like, shut the fuck up, bitch. You know you're going to do it. So stop with all these thoughts. Just put the lid up. Get in.

02:53:56 Speaker_04
That one's one I still, to this day, I do it. I hate it every time. I still have not. There's never a day where I'm like, this is going to be easy.

02:54:04 Speaker_01
That's the good thing, though. That's your win. That's your win of the day that you did that. You need those little wins, just like we were talking about with Ozempic. You need to get one on the board.

02:54:13 Speaker_01
And getting one on the board any way you can, completing a workout, write it down, complete it, you got one on the board. You got a win for the day. That's real. It seems like it's not, but it's real. That's why the belt system works in martial arts.

02:54:24 Speaker_01
You get a blue belt, you're like, oh, I got a blue belt. Holy shit, I'm not a white belt anymore. I ought to get a purple belt. And it incentivizes you. Human beings are subject to that. You're nailing it.

02:54:33 Speaker_04
This is my point with the AI. I want to gamify it, and I want health care to be fun. Yes. I want people to know that they're challenging their friends. We're rising together. Joe, you're a pussy. You only worked out 30 minutes today.

02:54:44 Speaker_04
Your deck says that this, my overall mortality risk is improving. Yours isn't. Like, how do we make it fun? And you can choose what to share. Kind of like what Whoop does.

02:54:54 Speaker_01
Well, what do you do with Tim Kennedy?

02:54:58 Speaker_04
I watch his MyZone and I watch what Tim does every day. And I'm like, if I can just get close to what Tim did, I will feel great about myself. So I try to beat his workouts or Juan from On It Gym has his on there, too.

02:55:11 Speaker_04
And I'll just try and beat those guys' workouts on those days.

02:55:13 Speaker_01
It's funny because people will say that that's an addictive thing, which is really interesting, because one of the things that people talk about with addictions that people are struggling with today, one of them is fitness apps.

02:55:24 Speaker_01
Yeah, like she's isn't that like the greatest addiction of all time like yeah, you could go off the rails You can get a little crazy, but isn't it the greatest?

02:55:32 Speaker_04
Well, how many how many I think in with addicts they have them? One is finding religion and a higher calling and giving up to a higher power. But the other thing I've seen is Candidly a lot of times they trade addiction.

02:55:44 Speaker_04
Yeah, they get really big into CrossFit or jiu-jitsu Yeah, jiu-jitsu, but it's a healthy addiction. It is.

02:55:53 Speaker_01
It's a better alternative than drowning your sorrows in a bottle Well, that's also the same pathways of the mind that lead you to negative addictions leads you to positive addictions It's just about it's about channeling that kind of energy into something positive.

02:56:06 Speaker_01
Yeah, I am a hundred percent an addict and

02:56:09 Speaker_01
But I figured out a way to be addicted to all things that are really good that I love Yeah, that's that's the way to try to live your life It's just try to funnel that whatever that focus is that leads you to want to shoot heroin and this is also works the other way too and there was a guy that I know that was a world championship caliber pool player and wouldn't drink wouldn't smoke just drank water super clean and healthy and

02:56:32 Speaker_01
And he was one of the top pool players in the world. And he was winning tournaments and gambling and winning a lot of money. And he was rock solid. He would hold down the cash. If you bet on that guy, you had a really good chance of winning.

02:56:47 Speaker_01
He would not choke, ever. He got in a car accident and he hurt his back. And the same thing that got that guy addicted to pool got him addicted to pills. He couldn't stop taking pills, man.

02:57:01 Speaker_01
That weird pathway, and my friend Tommy put it this way, it's like the same thing that got him addicted, he called it, the same thing that got him addicted to pool got him addicted to pills. It's like this obsession.

02:57:12 Speaker_01
So he found this thing that gave him relief from the pain and then he became obsessed with getting more of them. And then one day died, you know, he died young. Yeah. And this was a guy you would never have predicted that.

02:57:22 Speaker_01
And that's what's so insidious about what the Sackler family did. That's what's so insidious about the opioid crisis is you can get good people. And everybody wants to say that wouldn't happen to me. I'm mentally strong. That's nonsense.

02:57:34 Speaker_01
I'm telling you, this guy was as mentally strong as you get. Some people just get caught. It gets them, especially if you're in pain.

02:57:42 Speaker_01
Especially if you're one of those people that doesn't tolerate pain very well Some people just I don't know if they feel it different.

02:57:47 Speaker_01
I think they feel it different I think it's the only thing I think just like hot sauce tastes different to some folks. I think some people feel pain different and You know what?

02:57:56 Speaker_01
One of the reasons I thought this is my mom got an injection in her knee and she didn't even flinch they stuck this giant-ass needle in my mom's knee and plunged it in there and she didn't even flinch and the doctors like that's crazy and

02:58:09 Speaker_01
This fucking seven-year-old lady didn't flinch and I was like, that's where I get it. Yeah It has to pain threshold.

02:58:15 Speaker_04
It has to be from as I think it's a genetic thing Yeah, I think I used to think that it was when I own martial arts when I owned a toxicology I was in the toxicology lab and the non-abusive stuff After my brother passed from opioids and I was trying to educate clinicians on that.

02:58:29 Speaker_04
One of the things I did was hire an expert. Dr Bill Massey and he came in and he said on Obama's opioid abuse campaign committee and was He was helping guide me on what makes sense and how do we do this.

02:58:40 Speaker_04
But one of the things he shared with me that was wild was this study that he did for Obama with rhesus monkeys, where they gave one set of rhesus monkeys basically a cage with metal and no warmth, no interaction with other monkeys.

02:58:56 Speaker_04
They got water and food, but at erratic times, there was no consistency in that monkey's life.

02:59:02 Speaker_04
Then they took another subset of rhesus monkeys where they gave them warmth, shelter, let them stay with their family for the right amount of time until they reached maturity.

02:59:10 Speaker_04
And what they found is when they introduced drug, heroin and cocaine to these monkeys, disproportionately the monkeys that were deprived died.

02:59:19 Speaker_04
in OD whereas the monkeys that had that love and affection and warmth and comfort and essential needs met died at a much lower rate most of them actually survived and he was breaking down that if you grow up in an environment with minimal dopamine response

02:59:35 Speaker_04
when you light up that dopamine, maybe it's a boxing match, right? You're a kid who's been poor and you get in that boxing match, you knock a guy out, you're hooked. This is it. This is the best I've felt. Everyone's cheering me on.

02:59:50 Speaker_04
For some people, unfortunately, what they find first is a drug or an alcohol or a substance. But that same person could be The future Albert Einstein, the future Muhammad Ali, the future, you know, whatever it may be. Insert here.

03:00:05 Speaker_04
They have that ability. It's just, can we give them a shot? Can we buy them the time and get them out of this? Because I've seen a lot of people beat drug addiction, but I've unfortunately lost a lot of people to it, too.

03:00:16 Speaker_01
They did it with rats, too. They did a very similar thing. They did a rat park. And so they had the rats in the cage and the rats, I think it was heroin that they used. See if you can find what the rat park study was. Very similar type study.

03:00:29 Speaker_01
And they did another study where they had this enormous cage where the rats could run around, they had toys, things for them to do. And they didn't just do drugs until they died. They just went and had a party and lived like normal rats.

03:00:41 Speaker_01
Which is just like all mammals, all humans. these reward systems that are built into us. Heroin or cocaine-laced rats. Oh, here it is. Alexander's experience in the 70s had come to be called Rat Park.

03:00:53 Speaker_01
Researchers had already proved that when rats were placed in a cage all alone, with no other community of rats, and offered two water bottles, one filled with water, the other filled with heroin or cocaine, the rats would repetitively drink from the drug-laced bottles until they overdosed and died.

03:01:08 Speaker_01
like pigeons pressing a pleasure lever. They were relentless until their bodies and brains were overcome and they died. But Alexander wondered, is it about the drug or might be related to the setting that they were in?

03:01:20 Speaker_01
To test his hypothesis, he put in rat parks. Whoops. fucking pop-ups, he put in rat parks where they were among others and free to roam and play, socialize, and to have sex. And they were given the same access to two types of drug-laced bottles.

03:01:35 Speaker_01
When inhabiting a rat park, they remarkably preferred the plain water. Even when they did imbibe from the drug-filled bottle, they did so intermittently, not obsessively, and never overdosed. A social community beat the power of drugs.

03:01:49 Speaker_01
And you gotta wonder if that would be the case with human beings.

03:01:52 Speaker_01
You know, if everyone, I mean it's not possible right now in the world that we live in, but if everyone had a productive, happy, healthy life and was raised in a positive environment, how much less drug abuse and drug addiction would we have?

03:02:08 Speaker_01
It's a good question, because if it really is this horrible childhood that is causing a lot of people to seek these things out, but that's not my friend. My friend who got addicted, he wasn't from abuse like that. It was like a normal family.

03:02:25 Speaker_01
Everything was fine. It was him dealing with pain, and back pain is some of the worst pain. It's fucking debilitating. I mean, I've known multiple friends who've had back surgeries. When they're in pain, it's just like, It takes over everything.

03:02:39 Speaker_01
I've had knee surgery, and you can kind of deal with knee pain. It's like, yeah, it sucks, but it's going to get better. It'll be OK. But it's not your whole system. It's just your knee. The back feels like your whole being is hurt.

03:02:52 Speaker_01
It's a particular type of pain that people want relief from.

03:02:55 Speaker_04
My buddy's dad has been in and out of the hospital. He's in his 80s now. And he used to go on the elk hunts with us and everything. He was a coach. They had him loaded up on pain meds and everything was starting to fail.

03:03:09 Speaker_04
He had been in the hospital for months. They were about to move him to hospice. And my buddy said, we're done. I don't want any more pain meds. And he talked to his dad and he said, dad,

03:03:18 Speaker_04
can you survive without the pain meds and he didn't think he could and he battled like feeling terrible everything long story short he went from they were going to put him in hospice because his kidneys and organs and all this for failing to he drove a car last week

03:03:34 Speaker_04
He's out of the hospital, he's in his 80s, he's driving his truck again. I don't know if I want to be in the road with that guy.

03:03:40 Speaker_04
It's all those pain meds were poisoning his brain, his body, his organs were shutting down because they were just pushing more and more and more.

03:03:49 Speaker_04
And I don't want to be too sinister, but there's a lot of money in keeping somebody in a hospital and billing that insurance company during those time frames and then moving them over.

03:03:59 Speaker_04
You know, I stood in surgeries where I watched them do neurosurgeries on people they knew were going to die, but they could bill them $800,000 and collect the insurance payment. And so the hospital is going to do the surgery.

03:04:09 Speaker_01
Oh, God, that's such a horrible thing to hear. Do a surgery on someone who you know is going to die just to make the money off of it.

03:04:18 Speaker_04
It's just because our incentive systems are flawed, like what you were talking about earlier. it dopamine wins like reward systems if we build a reward system based off

03:04:32 Speaker_04
money in numbers and finances, we shouldn't be shocked when we have killer earnings and really bad health outcomes.

03:04:39 Speaker_01
It's the same with everything in the human race. Whenever it's incentivized by money, people don't go to what's best for people. They go to what's going to make them the most money.

03:04:50 Speaker_01
And that's the weird world that we find ourselves in with people defending that because their ideology opposes the opposite. Yeah. It's nuts. It's a weird, weird, weird fucking time. But listen, brother, I'm glad I met you. I'm glad you're out there.

03:05:06 Speaker_01
I'm glad you can speak about these things the way you can with so much information. You're so knowledgeable about it, and you can pull it up at any moment. And it's...

03:05:14 Speaker_01
It's a daunting task that you have, but I think your message has changed a lot of people's lives. I really do.

03:05:21 Speaker_01
I think there's a lot of people that recognize that between you and all these other people in the space, Peter Atiyah and Andrew Huberman and all these people, Dr. Rhonda Patrick, all these people talking about health and what you can do to improve and studies and all these things you can do to change the path that you're on.

03:05:40 Speaker_01
I think it's affected countless lives. It really has.

03:05:44 Speaker_04
Thank you for giving me a voice and thank you for having me on here and also thank you to the U.S. Senate for being brave enough to let us sit there and hammer the U.S.

03:05:53 Speaker_04
government and critique them for their choices and power to them for at least having the honesty and integrity to let us have an open forum.

03:06:01 Speaker_01
Yes, so yeah, let's hope they keep doing it and this make America healthy again ideas one of the most promising political ideas I've heard in a long time because it's all it's long overdue Like it was there was a long time where they were denying that cigarettes caused cancer They denied it as long as they could and then eventually they couldn't deny it anymore And I would hope that we would learn our lesson from all these other things They did all these other things that they used to push and now they realize they're dangerous And they really regret that they did it and people went along with it

03:06:31 Speaker_01
Time has come. Time has come to change the way we approach food and health. I agree. Thank you. Thank you for having me. My pleasure. Bye everybody.